Armor for monks

[thecrimsondawn]

I know there are armor enchantments scattered all over the place. That with relics, special materials, unique items, and all sorts of magic items, I just want to make sure I am not missing anything.

What is the best "armor" bonus items for monk besides bracer of armor?

I have room for deflection bonus too, but that slot is going to be taken up by a persistent sirens grace spell later on.

[Karl Aegis]

The best armor for monks is not being a monk and having real armor.

[Blackhawk748]

I know there are armor enchantments scattered all over the place. That with relics, special materials, unique items, and all sorts of magic items, I just want to make sure I am not missing anything.

What is the best "armor" bonus items for monk besides bracer of armor?

I have room for deflection bonus too, but that slot is going to be taken up by a persistent sirens grace spell later on.

Well Bracers of Armor are standard, a Monks Belt will increase your own AC bonus, Ring of Protection gives a Deflection bonus, Amulet of Natural Armor does what it says on the tin. Personally i would try to become a Mineral Warrior, besides giving DR and some nice stat bonuses it gives a couple of points of Nat Armor, it also synergizes beautifully with Fist of the Forest.

[Thurbane]

I think the usual "armor that isn't armor" for Monks (aside from Bracers) is the Dastana from OA (?).

[thecrimsondawn]

I think the usual "armor that isn't armor" for Monks (aside from Bracers) is the Dastana from OA (?).

Ok that is one I did not know about, however I have to wear armor to make that work.

Someone told me once about some kinda floating shield enchant that gives you a shield AC bonus without taking up your hand to use a shield. I may be able to use it with that.

@Karl Aegis
Its a 2 level dip for the feats and wis to ac, its fine.

[Blackhawk748]

Ok that is one I did not know about, however I have to wear armor to make that work.

Someone told me once about some kinda floating shield enchant that gives you a shield AC bonus without taking up your hand to use a shield. I may be able to use it with that.

@Karl Aegis
Its a 2 level dip for the feats and wis to ac, its fine.

Animated Shield, they are quite nice if you need the AC.

[thecrimsondawn]

Animated Shield, they are quite nice if you need the AC.

Ahh dam, it would still count as using a shield, so I cant get my monk bonus with that one, but I am so using that on a power attack build later on:P

Thanks for that

[Darrin]

In Lost Empires of Faerun, there is a Harness of Armor. This works just like Bracers of Armor, except there's a +50% cost increase. If your bracers slot was already taken by something else, you could wear the harness. Or if you didn't have enough room on your bracers for a particular enhancement, you could wear both.

The Dwarven Buckler Axe (A&EG, Races of Stone) offers a +1 shield bonus, but isn't listed as a shield. It can be enchanted as a shield or a weapon, so you can put both weapon and shield properties on it, as well as both types of augment crystals.

Manople (Sandstorm) also offers a +1 shield bonus. As with the buckler axe, it can be enchanted as either a shield or a weapon. Unlike the buckler axe, it encloses the hand, so you can't use that hand for anything else.

Gnome Tortoise Blade (Complete Warrior, Races of Stone) works the same as the manople, including the enclosed hand.

Many DMs allow robes or other clothing to be enchanted with an armor bonus, based on the idea that you can cast magic vestment on clothing.

According to the MIC, any arm or body slot item can be enchanted with an armor bonus. If it's a natural armor bonus, then any body or torso item will work. For a deflection bonus, any body, ring, or shoulder item. Dex items can be arms, feet, or hands, and Wis items can be head or throat.

[Telonius]

Your best source of AC is probably going to be a Cleric. Get a friendly one (or be one, if you go Sacred Fist) who can cast Greater Luminous Armor (Book of Exalted Deeds). It gives you the same AC as full plate, and you don't have to buy Bracers. (There are various ways to mitigate the Strength damage: Lesser Restoration, Strongheart Vest, etc).

Recitation (from Spell Compendium) gives a Luck bonus to AC, higher if you worship the same deity as the Cleric.

Bane and Prayer aren't obvious spells, but they work. They debuff the enemy, giving them penalties on attacks - which is effectively an increase to your AC.

Reduce Person, while it's a Wizard spell, can increase your AC in a pinch (assuming you're a humanoid). +2 Dex, +1 Size AC.

Other fairly obvious stuff: Periapt of Wisdom, Gloves of Dexterity, Ring of Protection, Amulet of Natural Armor.

[Red Fel]

Your best source of AC is probably going to be a Cleric.

... I now have an image of a Monk picking up a Cleric, and wrapping the shocked caster around his shoulders like a mink stole.

[Hiro Quester]

An item (ring?) of shield spell should work. An invisible tower shield of force that hovers in front of you, gives a shield bonus of +4 to AC, but should not count as you using a shield.

How does a monk get to persist Sirine's grace? It's an awesomely good spell if you have a good charisma bonus; my previous character was a bard doing that. But it requires some way of reducing Metamagic cost by one (since it's a 4th level bard spell; persisted version would be 10th level.)

I'm guessing you might be a druid with a few levels of Monk? That makes SG a 5th level spell; those are even more expensive to persist. You need some kind of DMM or spell dancer shenanigans to work that.

There's an ion stone that grants an insight bonus of +1 to AC. Dusty rose, as I recall.

Then again, if you can cast 9th level druid spells, there's always Foresight. Gives you warnings about incoming attacks, etc, and a +2 insight bonus to AC and Saves.

There is an Necklace of Natural Weapons (Savage Species) that enables you to place weapon enhancements on natural weapons. I wonder if it's possible to create an amulet of Natural Armor, that can also carry armor enhancements? Being able to get enhancements like greater fortification etc, on a non-armor wearing PC would help defensively, too.

Of course, boosting your Dex (tomes or wish spells for inherent bonuses and well as enhancement bonuses from items) is a very effective way to invest in AC, with side benefits of improving reflex saves. Or wildshape/polymorph into a form with high dex.

[Flickerdart]

At the very early levels, consider wearing actual armor - your WIS bonus is likely not better than a chain shirt, and no useful abilities turn off in armor (until your AB is better, Flurry is pointless). Non-proficiency doesn't matter if the armor has an ACP of 0.

At higher levels, unless you're cheesing out unarmed damage dice or wanting to grapple for some insane reason, reducing your size is an effective way of jacking up AC sky-high. Consider acquiring items such as a Minor Cloak of Displacement to make AC less important in general.

[Dysart]

Has nobody mentioned Monks Robe(PF)/Monks Belt(3.5)?

I believe they work the same or similar in both systems. Robe (PF) allows you to act as if 5 levels higher for AC, Unarmed damage and addes 1/Day to your Stunning fist.

[thecrimsondawn]

At the very early levels, consider wearing actual armor - your WIS bonus is likely not better than a chain shirt, and no useful abilities turn off in armor (until your AB is better, Flurry is pointless). Non-proficiency doesn't matter if the armor has an ACP of 0.

At higher levels, unless you're cheesing out unarmed damage dice or wanting to grapple for some insane reason, reducing your size is an effective way of jacking up AC sky-high. Consider acquiring items such as a Minor Cloak of Displacement to make AC less important in general.

Starting level for this is going to be like 13+, whenever I am done playing this infiltrator for the current plot.

Attack bonus is not an issue. This is a bard mixed with monk and paladin, so I have slippers of battledancing, some buffed up inspire, and the 3rd level of arcane duelist prc, giving me no reason to miss on anything other then a 1 ever. Flury of blows is just icing and not even a part of this build, its just there if I need it.


How does a monk get to persist Sirine's grace?
I am both arcane and divine caster, with more focus on arcane. I will be taking either Incantrix or Spell Dancer to persist Bards awesome buffs.
I was planing to do Paladins too, but after reviewing the spell list, most of the awesome paladin spells are range of touch, and not personal or fixed, so thats a no go :(
Good news is that some of the best ones are lv1 tho! :D

[Telonius]

Starting level for this is going to be like 13+, whenever I am done playing this infiltrator for the current plot.

Attack bonus is not an issue. This is a bard mixed with monk and paladin, so I have slippers of battledancing, some buffed up inspire, and the 3rd level of arcane duelist prc, giving me no reason to miss on anything other then a 1 ever. Flury of blows is just icing and not even a part of this build, its just there if I need it.


I am both arcane and divine caster, with more focus on arcane. I will be taking either Incantrix or Spell Dancer to persist Bards awesome buffs.
I was planing to do Paladins too, but after reviewing the spell list, most of the awesome paladin spells are range of touch, and not personal or fixed, so thats a no go :(
Good news is that some of the best ones are lv1 tho! :D

What weapon are you planning to use for your Dextrous Attack? Typically that class is best if you're either doing some sort of crit-fisher, or have a source of bonus damage (like Sneak Attack/Craven, or a Wounding weapon) that doesn't care too much about the base damage. Otherwise, yeah, you're going to hit a lot; for a very small amount of damage.

EDIT: Probably better check this - you mean the WotC version (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20030224a) of Arcane Duelist, not Pathfinder, right?

[thecrimsondawn]

What weapon are you planning to use for your Dextrous Attack? Typically that class is best if you're either doing some sort of crit-fisher, or have a source of bonus damage (like Sneak Attack/Craven, or a Wounding weapon) that doesn't care too much about the base damage. Otherwise, yeah, you're going to hit a lot; for a very small amount of damage.

Highly focused CHA build
Gauntlet of Heartfelt blows:chat to damage as fire damage
Slippers of battle dancing: cha to hit and damage so long as I move 10 feet
inspire courage, boosted with feats allowing me to do d6's in fire damage instead of hit bonuses.

My weapon of choice is a Scimitar as I need to focus in one thanks to Pious Templar, and I found a dragon god that fits my backstory and personality well.


It would be better to say that immunity to fire is my week point, but I would still be doing cha+cha damage, chax3 damage if I smite

Not as strong as a barbarian focused on power attack and pounce, but more then enough to be tanky as hell and be a threat

[dascarletm]

UMD a wand (or similar) of mage armor and shield. +8 AC that doesn't hinder you.

[Curmudgeon]

Many DMs allow robes or other clothing to be enchanted with an armor bonus, based on the idea that you can cast magic vestment on clothing.

According to the MIC, any arm or body slot item can be enchanted with an armor bonus.
That's not just DM allowance; it's an ordinary part of the rules. A core magic item, Robe of the Archmagi (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#robeoftheArchmagi), includes an armor bonus. Magic Item Compendium just regularizes the rules so you can add an armor bonus to other Arms and Body slot items, not just Bracers of Armor (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bracersofArmor) and Robe of the Archmagi (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#robeoftheArchmagi). The part where Magic Vestment comes in is that if you start with an ordinary robe (part of a Scholar’s Outfit, likely) and give it an armor bonus per MIC page 234, your friendly local Cleric can then give it an enhancement bonus to armor via Magic Vestment.

You still won't do as well as the party's tank with magical full plate and shield, but you'll do OK given that you can't use any actual armor.

[Telonius]

Sounds good as far as it goes, but ... why have levels in Monk on that kind of a build? You're really Cha-focused, so Wis to AC probably isn't giving you all that much. Scimitar isn't a Monk weapon, so you can't flurry with it. The only mechanical reason I could think of would be a Sparring Dummy of the Master to go along with your Slippers of Battledancing, but even that would be kind of a stretch. Is it a fluff consideration?

[Flickerdart]

Sounds good as far as it goes, but ... why have levels in Monk on that kind of a build? You're really Cha-focused, so Wis to AC probably isn't giving you all that much. Scimitar isn't a Monk weapon, so you can't flurry with it. The only mechanical reason I could think of would be a Sparring Dummy of the Master to go along with your Slippers of Battledancing, but even that would be kind of a stretch. Is it a fluff consideration?
He could be using Ascetic Mage to switch WIS to AC to CHA to AC.

[Telonius]

He could be using Ascetic Mage to switch WIS to AC to CHA to AC.

Hm, that's Sorcerer-specific, but having a Sorc level might make some of the Dragonfire stuff easier.

[thecrimsondawn]

He could be using Ascetic Mage to switch WIS to AC to CHA to AC.

^
Yep, but that alone is not why I took 2 levels of monk
With the variant fighting styles, a 2 level dip nets me evasion, imp unarmed strike, dodge, mobility, flury of blows, and wis to ac (changed to cha to ac)

Monk is a good dip class for that reason alone. Evasion is just something dam nice to have, but when you have saves in the 30s evasion and mettle, the only real things you need to worry about is direct damage with no save - aka magic missile mages, ect

[Alikat]

Would the animal trainers outfit from the commoner guide work?

[Thurbane]

Hmm, always thought Dastana worked without other armor, and didn't count as armor by itself - seen a lot of charop threads that assume this is the case...

[Hiro Quester]

I used to play a similar style bard/SC/Heartfire Fanner.

Get a belt of battle and or tempo blood spikes. They grant an extra move action to take advantage of the slippers.

If you really want to take advantage of the dragonfire inspiration, get yourself a wand of Heroics (temp use of fighter bonus feats) and take TWF and ITWF, with a dagger in your offhand. Your to-hit bonus is buffed enough to take the small penalties. Always cast Haste.

A level of Abjurant champion gets you a free extend on all your Abjurations. Plus full casting and full BAB advance. Adds your abj champ levels to the armor and shield bonus of Abjurations like shield spell and Mage armor too.

Get a custom rune staff with good spells to buff yourself with in the morning. Dragonskin is excellent for providing natural armor bonus and also fire resistance. Also shield spell.

[Telonius]

Okay, gotcha. [EDIT] Are you dead set on Scimitar? Because a Crystal Echoblade (from Magic Item Compendium) would be ideal for the character. The critical threat range is 19-20, but the damage die is bigger (meaning bigger bonuses to hit, from Dextrous Attack). It also gives a nice bonus of Sonic damage equal to half your Bard level whenever you're using Bardic Music (which should be just about all the time).

[thecrimsondawn]

Okay, gotcha. [EDITS coming...]

Very few levels in bard, just enough to get lv2 spells in bard levels by itself.
the weapon itself only matters as far as the god I worship due to Pious Templar

[Telonius]

Ah, so there you go; Bard 4. You'd gain +2 to attack for no decrease in overall damage - basically changing two of those damage over to Sonic, which practically nothing is immune to.

[shaikujin]

There are 2 things that might be of interest to the OP,

1) Dyrr's Impervious Vestment. AC 9. Better than Bracers 8. But quite a bit more expensive. From Complete Arcane.

You can wear the Vestment, a Harness of Armor and Bracers at the same time. So use the Vestment for AC, and the other 2 for armor special abilities.



2) Since you mentioned having paladin levels, take a look at Argent Fist Prc from Eberron. Allows paladin and monk levels to stack for certain things. Allows a monk to wear armor and keep monk's AC bonus. But you'll lose Flurry and fast movement.

Flurry you can get back by taking Shou Disciple (which at later levels also allows flurry with martial weapons if you don't have another way to get that already). Unapproachable East.

Fast movement can be gained by magic items like boots of speed. (Monk's fast movement is an enhancement bonus, similar to magic items or spells.)



Hope that helps.

[Hiro Quester]

Very few levels in bard, just enough to get lv2 spells in bard levels by itself.
the weapon itself only matters as far as the god I worship due to Pious Templar

You won't get Sirine's grace for the sweet CHA as deflection bonus to AC until level 4 bard spells. That requires 10 levels of bard casting.

[Platymus Pus]

There are 2 things that might be of interest to the OP,

1) Dyrr's Impervious Vestment. AC 9. Better than Bracers 8. But quite a bit more expensive. From Complete Arcane.

You can wear the Vestment, a Harness of Armor and Bracers at the same time. So use the Vestment for AC, and the other 2 for armor special abilities.


You could buy armor bracers of + 11 at that price

[animewatcha]

That's not just DM allowance; it's an ordinary part of the rules. A core magic item, Robe of the Archmagi (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#robeoftheArchmagi), includes an armor bonus. Magic Item Compendium just regularizes the rules so you can add an armor bonus to other Arms and Body slot items, not just Bracers of Armor (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bracersofArmor) and Robe of the Archmagi (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#robeoftheArchmagi). The part where Magic Vestment comes in is that if you start with an ordinary robe (part of a Scholar’s Outfit, likely) and give it an armor bonus per MIC page 234, your friendly local Cleric can then give it an enhancement bonus to armor via Magic Vestment.

You still won't do as well as the party's tank with magical full plate and shield, but you'll do OK given that you can't use any actual armor.

So a robe can have an armor bonus up to +8 then cleric can do the sacred vestment so it can get up to +13 AC? I thought the armor bonus via robe was enhancement since you can't add the chart's ac bonus to something that already has a nonmagical bonus armor or shield bonus to ac.

[thecrimsondawn]

You won't get Sirine's grace for the sweet CHA as deflection bonus to AC until level 4 bard spells. That requires 10 levels of bard casting.

Right, but thanks to the wording on knowstones, I can take up one of the very fast spellcasting progression PrC's and use the knowstone for that.

OR
I could pick up a few levels of Chameleon
I have 7 levels to spare or more, so I am in no hurry :P

[Curmudgeon]

So a robe can have an armor bonus up to +8 then cleric can do the sacred vestment so it can get up to +13 AC? I thought the armor bonus via robe was enhancement since you can't add the chart's ac bonus to something that already has a nonmagical bonus armor or shield bonus to ac.
Nope, it's an armor bonus, not an enhancement bonus. A robe has no nonmagical armor bonus, which is why it'll cost more than for nonmagical armor. Full plate and a shield give +10 AC for 1,807 gp, and that's masterwork only (completely nonmagical); then each of them can have up to +5 in magical enhancement. The very first point of armor bonus for your robe will cost 1,000 gp, and +2 armor bonus will cost 3,000 gp; that's because you're paying (through the nose) for all-magical armor bonus.