Detect Magic and... constructs, familiars, psicrystals, golems...

[JyP]

Hello all,

I am stuck on a relatively obscure point : detect magic spell detects auras, which include active spells and magic items.

=> would golems be detected using guidelines from Golem Manuals for aura ? Or we consider that after the manual is used, magic lingers during one hour at most, as original spells have a strong aura ?

=> if an artificer builds a construct or homonculus, will these be detected through detect magic ? even through they are not magic items stricto sensu ?

=> what about familiars, or at large magical beasts ?

=> per psionic - magic transparency, are psicrystals detected ?

On the one hand, I see detecting all these as opening a can of worms... But I wonder if there are some parts I missed somewhere.

[Bullet06320]

golems are constucts, nothing in the srd says they are detectable by detectmagic
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#constructType
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/animatedObject.htm
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/golem.htm
then there's the whole immunity magic thing anyways for golems

[Der_DWSage]

As written, Detect Magic can detect none of those things. It can detect exactly two things-a spell effect currently in place, (Including the ones on magic items) and a spell that was recently cast. Things with the potential to cast spells, or things that had spells cast on them a long time ago, are out of the question. The Magic Immunity of golems isn't the issue, since Detect Magic is SR:No (Which...is odd now that I think of it, but oh well.) but more the fact that they, as creatures, don't have an aura. If you want to fluff it a certain way, the sheer bulk of nonmagical flesh/clay/stone/metal stops it from detecting the bindings on the elemental trapped inside.

What can detect most of those things is Arcane Sight. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/arcaneSight.htm) If a creature has magical ability, it can pick it up. That said, Familiars don't actually register unless a)Their master is having them deliver a touch spell right this moment, or b)They hit 13th level, when they get the spell-like ability to be scryed upon. Same with a Psicrystal.

(Magical beasts don't quite live up to their name-in many cases, it's simply there for animals that have more than 2 Intelligence and don't exist in the real world, but are still no more magical than the average Elf.)

[JyP]

What can detect most of those things is Arcane Sight. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/arcaneSight.htm) If a creature has magical ability, it can pick it up.
Thanks for your help with this spell :smallsmile:

The wording is a little ambiguous : The effect is similar to that of a detect magic spell [...] You know the location and power of all magical auras within your sight. [...] If the items or creatures bearing the auras are in line of sight, you can make Spellcraft skill checks to determine the school of magic involved in each.

and then the specific part of this spell, about a standard action to analyze if a creature has spells or spell-like abilities, and much more.

=> So we have a part about "creatures bearing the auras". Does it mean it detects by sight all surnatural creatures, and then you need to concentrate with a standard action to detect what type of power a creature has ?

=> difference with detect magic, at first glance, is that you can concentrate on creatures to get more data.

It's not so easy to see that another difference is that this spell also allows to detect "magic" creatures, unlike detect magic - the specific part is the standard action to concentrate on creatures, and the fact that this spell is quicker than detect magic.

One can argue that detecting magic items, even if those are not active, like a scroll or potion , is detecting things with magic potential - so creatures with potential is not so far fetched...

For other spells :

- Magic Aura works on items only, to obfuscate their magic aura

Psionic powers :

- Detect Psionics : You detect psionic auras. A psionic aura is given off by any active or permanent power, or during the use of any psionic feat. Characters who have levels in a psionic class, creatures with the psionic subtype, and creatures with the Wild Talent feat possess psionic auras [...] items or creatures bearing the auras [...] But afterwards, there's the same table than detect magic for items or functioning powers, nothing about assessing creatures.

- Psionics-Magic Transparency : The spell detect magic detects powers, their number, and their strength and location within 3 rounds

[Duke of Urrel]

I once assumed that the Detect Magic spell, as its name suggests, must detect magic of all kinds. Now I have come around to the view that we should not be led astray by the word "magic" in the spell's name. According to the spell's own description, it detects functioning spells, magic items, and the residual magic that lingers for a little while after a spell expires or a magic item becomes useless. Strictly by the rules, the Detect Magic spell doesn't detect any other kind of magic.

Moreover, if you choose to empower the Detect Magic spell to detect other kinds of magic, you raise questions that are hard to answer. For example, if you use the Detect Magic spell and you make a Spellcraft check, you are supposed to discover the school of magic that you detect. But to what school of magic does the effect of a supernatural ability belong? There is no answer to be found in the description of the Detect Magic spell, or anywhere else. I think this should indicate to us that the spell was never intended to detect all kinds of magic, only those that the spell's description mentions specifically.

Remember, this is only a cantrip we're talking about.

[atemu1234]

I once assumed that the Detect Magic spell, as its name suggests, must detect magic of all kinds. Now I have come around to the view that we should not be led astray by the word "magic" in the spell's name. According to the spell's own description, it detects functioning spells, magic items, and the residual magic that lingers for a little while after a spell expires or a magic item becomes useless. Strictly by the rules, the Detect Magic spell doesn't detect any other kind of magic.

Moreover, if you choose to empower the Detect Magic spell to detect other kinds of magic, you raise questions that are hard to answer. For example, if you use the Detect Magic spell and you make a Spellcraft check, you are supposed to discover the school of magic that you detect. But to what school of magic does the effect of a supernatural ability belong? There is no answer to be found in the description of the Detect Magic spell, or anywhere else. I think this should indicate to us that the spell was never intended to detect all kinds of magic, only those that the spell's description mentions specifically.

Remember, this is only a cantrip we're talking about.

A supernatural ability doesn't belong to a school. Spellcraft is for spells.

[Duke of Urrel]

A supernatural ability doesn't belong to a school. Spellcraft is for spells.

I believe the Detect Magic spell, despite the name, is even more limited than Spellcraft, despite the name. With Spellcraft (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/spellcraft.htm), you can, by making a check at DC 30:


Understand a strange or unique magical effect, such as the effects of a magic stream. Time required varies. No retry.

I believe this includes effects other than spells.