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Anium
2015-03-27, 02:22 PM
Going with the standard beguiler/wizard build lvl 8, i'm starting as a human(with +2 int for rp reasons)
Also getting an extra familiar and an extra rank on spellcraft.
Final stats are:
Str 9
Dex 18
Con 14
Int 20
Wis 9
Cha 12.

Im getting, focused specialist conjurer banned enchantment, ilusion and necro.
Now i get to the difficult choices. Should i start beguiler for the extra skill points or start wizard and double trade the familiar?(abrupt jaunt and

I can get UM at lvl 5 thanks to that extra rank on spellcraft, should i go human paragon for that +2 int and extra feat?
Able learner worth it?
Master specialist or direct UM?
Feats? My initial choice is able learner , practiced spellcaster(beguiler) extend, sculp.
Any item i should be looking at?

Flickerdart
2015-03-27, 02:33 PM
Abrupt Jaunt is way better than any skill points you could get.

Starmage21
2015-03-27, 02:37 PM
Wiz 3/Beg 1/UM 10 at level 14 all the way.

Take the Piercing Cold and Lord of the Uttercold metamagics. Also Energy Substitution: Cold. If you see any higher levels than that, you might start getting interested in Persist Spell for day-long buffs .

Rebel7284
2015-03-27, 02:41 PM
Ban Evocation instead of Necromancy. Necromancy gets more and more powerful as you level. Evocation can be replaced by a single feat: Craft Contingent Spell.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2015-03-27, 02:44 PM
If you can go Beguiler 1/ Wizard 3/ UM, you can put all ten levels of UM toward Wizard with Practiced Spellcaster: Beguiler.

Definitely get Beguiler at 1st level with Able Learner, you'll have amazing skill ranks starting out and you can keep up your ranks in all your favorite skills quite easily. You can still get Abrupt Jaunt at 2nd level when you take your first level of Wizard.

Human Paragon is not worth it.

If you can take two flaws, you can get Able Learner, Versatile Spellcaster, and Spell Focus at 1st level with Beguiler, then at Beguiler 1/ Wizard 1 as long as you learn a 2nd level or higher spell before you reach 3rd level you'll be able to spend two 1st level Beguiler slots to cast that with Versatile Spellcaster, qualifying you to take Master Specialist at 3rd level. So you could go Beguiler 1/ Wizard 1/ Master Specialist 2/ UM. You'll need to spend your remaining two feats at 1st and 3rd on Practiced Spellcaster: Beguiler and any metamagic feat.

Don't go Focused Specialist, you don't want to lose the school of Illusion. Enchantment is largely replaced by Beguiler spells, but Illusion gives you Shadow Evocation/Conjuration, which your Beguiler casting doesn't get, as well as Greater/Superior Invisibility.

Use this Wizard variant (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizard) from UA to get Improved Initiative instead of Scribe Scroll. Abrupt Jaunt is amazing, Rapid Summoning isn't all that great at all if you don't plan on doing it a lot. You could pick up Obtain Familiar and Improved Familiar or Planar Familiar for an Imp or Quasit or Pseudodragon or Mephit.

Anium
2015-03-27, 06:24 PM
No flaws i'm afraid, and that master specialist is too feat intensive. :(

I'd rather be blasty than save or suck, so i'll stick with evocation for now. I'm getting for free a Feat that gives spells from the complete arcane(born in necropolis, soul of the north, etc...) but i don't think any of them are usefull.

With advice so different i'm not gettin to a decision still :P

elonin
2015-03-27, 07:26 PM
Not sure about human paragon as you are loosing a caster level. Able learner is ok but may not be worth a feat. You are spending fewer skill points for cross class skills but still have the 1/2 max ranks.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2015-03-27, 07:34 PM
Not sure about human paragon as you are loosing a caster level. Able learner is ok but may not be worth a feat. You are spending fewer skill points for cross class skills but still have the 1/2 max ranks.

Not exactly. If a skill was ever a class skill for you, then your max ranks are always class-skill ranks, even if you're paying cross-class cost for those ranks. Able Learner basically gives him the Beguiler class skill list for every class he takes for the rest of his career.

elonin
2015-03-27, 07:59 PM
Not exactly. If a skill was ever a class skill for you, then your max ranks are always class-skill ranks, even if you're paying cross-class cost for those ranks. Able Learner basically gives him the Beguiler class skill list for every class he takes for the rest of his career.

Here is the feat http://www.realmshelps.net/cgi-bin/featbox.pl?feat=Able_Learner I've played with groups that play both ways about multi classing and in class skills. There is no rule stating once a class skill always a class skill.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2015-03-27, 08:28 PM
Here is the feat http://www.realmshelps.net/cgi-bin/featbox.pl?feat=Able_Learner I've played with groups that play both ways about multi classing and in class skills. There is no rule stating once a class skill always a class skill.

It does, actually:
If a skill is a class skill for any of a multiclass character’s classes, then character level determines a skill’s maximum rank. (The maximum rank for a class skill is 3 + character level.) (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/multiclass.htm)

ben-zayb
2015-03-28, 12:51 AM
Abrupt Jaunt is way better than any skill points you could get.At level 1, how so? In how many more situations could a very specific Immediate Action, 10ft teleportation ability usable Int times per day, could surpass getting (6+Int) x4 skill points from a wealthy class skill list (from a high Int class)?

Anium
2015-03-28, 12:42 PM
I'm getting abrupt jaunt, the question was if there is something else i could trade familiar for(i'm getting one for free at lvl 1)

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2015-03-28, 01:01 PM
I'm getting abrupt jaunt, the question was if there is something else i could trade familiar for(i'm getting one for free at lvl 1)

Does that level 1 familiar count all of your spellcasting levels, or just your levels in a particular class? If it counts all your spellcasting levels, then it's actually worth keeping, especially if you take Improved Familiar (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#improvedFamiliar) or an Imp or Quasit or Pseudodragon.

You could trade it for a 1/2 progression Animal Companion (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererWizard).

Anium
2015-03-28, 02:55 PM
He's lettin me add it to a class that doesn't have familiar or the improved familiar feat, still, i think i will swap it.