Advanced Aboleths

[Tvtyrant]

Start off:

I love Aboleths, and I want my next campaign to include some.

However I need to be able to increase their abilities as my party levels, so I was wondering if anyone had any good ideas for making an advanced Aboleth which retains its feeling of almost infinite indirect power? An Aboleth which is great at melee kind of defeats the mastermind approach, and I don't like the Psionic Aboleth very much. One of them will be a Psionic Aboleth Thrallherd, although the lack of a manifesting class makes this a little weaker than normal.

[Troacctid]

There's some special Aboleth content in Lords of Madness, if you haven't looked at that yet.

[Tvtyrant]

There's some special Aboleth content in Lords of Madness, if you haven't looked at that yet.

I've got it. The Glyphs are cool, but the whole "gets bigger, gets a bite attack, goes berserk" thing the feats do seems silly and backwards to me. Also the Savant requires terribad feats to access :/

[Aegis013]

You could just advance their Aberration HD, give them magic items, or the like.

You could also homebrew Aboleth-only feats, spells, or similar.

Edit: Really though, they're fairly well equipped to play that role as long as they continue to advance their Dominate DC. They just need to take over increasingly important people who can influence others for them. Eventually they can do things like secretly be running the town government because they've got the key players dominated. So if you want to go after the Aboleth, you have to deal with the entire town's resources being put forward to stop you.

[jiriku]

Aboleth just begs for levels in beguiler or an illusion/charm-focused sorcerer. I especially like sorcerer as a base for caster monsters because it lets you create just what you want in a quick, simple kind of way. An aboleth sorcerer/abjurant champion makes a solid boss monster because it can use sorcerer-friendly spells like arcane fusion and arcane spellsurge and the abjurant champion swift abjuration and arcane boost for defense with its swift action. This, combined with the minions that every aboleth should have, allows it to compete against the action disparity a boss monster usually faces when pitted against a whole party of PCs.Prestige levels in fatespinner, nightmare spinner, oracle, or archmage also suit it well.

[Gwendol]

Agreed. Add Wiz/Sor/Beg class levels to the regular aboleth and don't forget feats, skills, and ability score increases as it gains HD. You should be able to tailor the difficulty quite fine. Also, the lair and its minions offer more opportunities to fine-tune the experience/horror.

[atemu1234]

Agreed. Add Wiz/Sor/Beg class levels to the regular aboleth and don't forget feats, skills, and ability score increases as it gains HD. You should be able to tailor the difficulty quite fine. Also, the lair and its minions offer more opportunities to fine-tune the experience/horror.

Also, remember that Aboleths are nothing without their minions.

Make an Aboleth Fleshwarper, who has a couple mind flayers working for him. These Mind Flayers are his "nurses" who help him both collect and graft things onto living beings, and of course you absolutely MUST include Skum.

[ShurikVch]

Dragon #313 have Unholy Abomination PrC
It's only 3 levels long. First level give +1 innate bonus to all attacks, checks, and saves;
2nd gives you ray which inflict 2 negative levels (60', 3/day);
3rd gives you Blasphemous Visage - everybody in 60' around you must make Will save or get -2 to all attacks and saves, and those who directly adjusted to you must make another Fort save or take d4 Str damage per turn
Requirements: Aberration, Knowledge (religion) 8, and Power Surge (feat from the same magazine, which take (su) ability 3/day+, and add it +1 DC, or +1 damage/die, or +50% duration)

[ExLibrisMortis]

An aboleth sorcerer/abjurant champion makes a solid boss monster
This is a good idea. You can even say that aboleth have sorcerer casting from their HD*, allowing them to qualify for abjurant champion without any actual sorcerer levels (they even have combat casting as default feat choice).

A dip in mindbender, for telepathy, is pretty standard and recommended. Mindsight, naturally.


*Default aboleth have 8 HD and CL 16, with 8 spell-like abilities known (0/0/1/0/1/2/2/1), including at least a 7th-level sorcerer spell. If you give them two levels of sorcerer casting per HD, it's a bit OP, but it does seem to be what the Monster Manual is going for.

Bard casting might be a better fit: at 16th level, bards just about get their 6th-level spells, which includes the 7th-level sorcerer spell. Also, giving someone double-level bard casting is less game-breaking.

[Flickerdart]

I don't have anything useful to add, but the concept of Advanced Aboleths made me think of the opposite - Basic Aboleths, who spend their days instagramming their Starbucks.

[ShurikVch]

Another suggestions:
Warlock - because why not?
Swordsage - because nobody expect it! :smallamused:
Druid - because water is nature too, and not all druids are good (take Aberration Wild Shape)

PrCs:
Divine Crusader
Dungeon Lord
Thrall of Demogorgon
Thrall of Dagon

[Tvtyrant]

Aboleth Beguiler 5/Shadowcrafter 2/Shadowcraft Mage 3

8d8+5d6+2d4+3d4+90 (197)
Str 26, Dex 12, Con 20, Int 30, Wis 17, Cha 17

feats: Spell Focus (Illusion), Greater Spell Focus (Illusion), Versatile Spellcaster, Heighten Spell, Invisible Spell, Sanctum Spell (Silent Image), Rapid Metamagic

Speed 10, swim 60ft.
Melee
Single Attack Tentacle +14 (1d6+8)
Full Attack
4 Tentacle +14 (1d6+8)
Space 15ft.; Reach 15

Special Attacks
Enslave DC(22) 3 x day dominate CL 16 freed by remove curse,
Slime DC(27) after hit by tentacle, skin becomes clear slimy membrane
Spell-like Abilities
Psionics CL 16th
Psionics 2nd DC(15) At will Hypnotic pattern
Psionics 4th DC(17) At will Illusionary wall
Psionics 5th DC(18) At will Persistent image, Mirage arcana
Psionics 6th DC(19) Veil, Programmed Image
Psionics 7th DC(20) Project Image

Items
Circlet of Mages
Mask of Lies
Ring of Counterspells
Drow House Insignia of Heart of Water
Drow House Insiginia of Fly
Hand of the Mage
Third Eye Clarity
13 Shalanthra's Delicate Disks

Otiluke's Resilient Sphere
Mage Armor, Greater
Servant Horde
Wind Wall
Evard's Black Tentacles
Ice Web
Wall of Salt
Wall of Force
Summon Undead V
Greater Mirror Image
Invisibility
Glibness
Displacement



Skills Concentration 33, Know Nature 31, Listen 26, Spot 26, Swim 29
Languages Aboleth, Aquan, Undercommon

I cheated a little and let it qualify for a gnome PRC. Should be around CR 12-13.

[Flickerdart]

Aboleth Beguiler 5/Shadowcrafter 2/Shadowcraft Mage 3
I cheated a little and let it qualify for a gnome PRC. Should be around CR 12-13.
Aboleths eat gnomes, so it works out.

[Eskil]

Aboleth Beguiler 5/Shadowcrafter 2/Shadowcraft Mage 3

8d8+5d6+2d4+3d4+90 (197)
Str 26, Dex 12, Con 20, Int 30, Wis 17, Cha 17

feats: Spell Focus (Illusion), Greater Spell Focus (Illusion), Versatile Spellcaster, Heighten Spell, Invisible Spell, Sanctum Spell (Silent Image), Rapid Metamagic

Speed 10, swim 60ft.
Melee
Single Attack Tentacle +14 (1d6+8)
Full Attack
4 Tentacle +14 (1d6+8)
Space 15ft.; Reach 15

Special Attacks
Enslave DC(22) 3 x day dominate CL 16 freed by remove curse,
Slime DC(27) after hit by tentacle, skin becomes clear slimy membrane
Spell-like Abilities
Psionics CL 16th
Psionics 2nd DC(15) At will Hypnotic pattern
Psionics 4th DC(17) At will Illusionary wall
Psionics 5th DC(18) At will Persistent image, Mirage arcana
Psionics 6th DC(19) Veil, Programmed Image
Psionics 7th DC(20) Project Image

Items
Circlet of Mages
Mask of Lies
Ring of Counterspells
Drow House Insignia of Heart of Water
Drow House Insiginia of Fly
Hand of the Mage
Third Eye Clarity
13 Shalanthra's Delicate Disks

Otiluke's Resilient Sphere
Mage Armor, Greater
Servant Horde
Wind Wall
Evard's Black Tentacles
Ice Web
Wall of Salt
Wall of Force
Summon Undead V
Greater Mirror Image
Invisibility
Glibness
Displacement



Skills Concentration 33, Know Nature 31, Listen 26, Spot 26, Swim 29
Languages Aboleth, Aquan, Undercommon

I cheated a little and let it qualify for a gnome PRC. Should be around CR 12-13.

If I may ask; why Shadowcrafter 2/Shadowcraft Mage 3 rather than straight Shadowcraft Mage 5?

The Shadowcrafter I'm reading only gives a plus 10% reality increase to shadow conjurations versus the Shadowcraft Mage's capstone Powerful Shadow Magic, which boosts shadow conjuration and shadow evocation.

[Tvtyrant]

If I may ask; why Shadowcrafter 2/Shadowcraft Mage 3 rather than straight Shadowcraft Mage 5?

The Shadowcrafter I'm reading only gives a plus 10% reality increase to shadow conjurations versus the Shadowcraft Mage's capstone Powerful Shadow Magic, which boosts shadow conjuration and shadow evocation.

It needs 4th level spells for shadowcrafter, it can only cast second level spells at level 5. It needs at least 2 more levels to get to fourths, might as well be shadowcrafter. You could get a 4th level of Shadowcraft Mage in, but auto extend isn't that great.

[Eskil]

It needs 4th level spells for shadowcrafter, it can only cast second level spells at level 5. It needs at least 2 more levels to get to fourths, might as well be shadowcrafter.

Shadowcraft Mage requires "at least three illusion spells, including at least one shadow spell of 4th level or higher."

A basic aboleth (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/aboleth.htm) has seven illusion spell-like abilities, including Project Image (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/programmedImage.htm), a 7th level shadow spell, and need only a single level of Beguiler (or Bard or Rogue) to meet the skill and feat prerequisites for Shadowcraft Mage.

Edit: Doesn't the auto-extend apply to all the shadow conjurations/evocations as well?

[Tvtyrant]

Shadowcraft Mage requires "at least three illusion spells, including at least one shadow spell of 4th level or higher."

A basic aboleth (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/aboleth.htm) has seven illusion spell-like abilities, including Project Image (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/programmedImage.htm), a 7th level shadow spell, and need only a single level of Beguiler (or Bard or Rogue) to meet the skill and feat prerequisites for Shadowcraft Mage.

Edit: Doesn't the auto-extend apply to all the shadow conjurations/evocations as well?

Good point on the Aboleth already meeting the requirements.

[Sayt]

Pathfinder has a 'super-aboleth', the Veiled Master (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/aberrations/veiled-master)

[meschlum]

Well, if Pathfinder is on the table, you could do worse than the Nightmare Creature template. Regeneration, a solid DC boost to your Shadow and Phantasm illusion spells (at 10+ HD), very good attribute bonuses (+6 Dex and Cha, +4 Int at 10+ HD), some nice spell-like abilities, and the ability to kill or dominate people anywhere in the same plane - though it takes a little time.

[WhamBamSam]

Another suggestions:
Warlock - because why not?
Swordsage - because nobody expect it! :smallamused:
Druid - because water is nature too, and not all druids are good (take Aberration Wild Shape)

PrCs:
Divine Crusader
Dungeon Lord
Thrall of Demogorgon
Thrall of DagonI'll second all these suggestions, especially Swordsage. If you're willing to cheese it a bit, monster initiators can be nasty. Most subsystems scale favorably or at least interestingly on monsters, because later books made an effort to base more things off of character level to more freely allow multiclassing. The base Aboleth isn't a great example of this at work, because it's CR7 with 8 HD, but adding 4 Aberration HD only increases CR by 1, so advancing Aboleths that way lets you take advantage of monster HD bloat. They do also (I think) gain CR for the size increases that come with it, but when you consider how nasty and under-CRed even a vanilla Aboleth is... Yeah, things can get fun.

ToB is the most dramatic in this regard, because for Aberrations you can increase Initiator Level faster than CR. An Advanced (24 HD (Gargantuan)) Aboleth Swordsage 2 is CR 15 and has an IL of 14.

Incarnum is also a little screwy because the feat prereqs are based on character level. An Advanced (12 HD (Huge)) Aboleth Totemist 2 is a decent melee monster for CR11 when cornered, and can take Open Lesser Chakra. Consider an Aboleth who uses the Phase Cloak to phase in and out through walls, making it harder for the party guess at which walls are real and which ones are illusions, and as a last resort fleeing the scene while the chamber drains of water, leaving the party to contend with the prospect of drowning from the slime.

Truenaming (or at least Truespeak checks) can sort of take advantage of high monster stats and HD as well (higher Int, more ranks, Epic Skill Focus on pre-Epic CRs, etc.) and its possible that there are some cool things you can do with the interaction between Truename abilities and Aboleth SLAs, but I'm not the best person to ask about such things.

Also, Slime Lord might be a sort of cool PrC, since Aboleths are implied to be among Ghaunadar's worshipers, and at-will indefinite duration Alter Self is a way of getting the Aboleth up on dry land.

Also Bard, because Steve the Aboleth is best Aboleth.


Good point on the Aboleth already meeting the requirements.I don't think they do. SLAs only meet prerequisites for the specific spells, not for spells of a certain level.

[ExLibrisMortis]

I just thought of this Junkyard competition (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?395791-Junkyard-Wars-IX-Earth-Dreamer-Ordained-Champion-Cleric&highlight=junkyard), and I thought that Earth Dreamer would be nice for an Aboleth who was interested in moving through things other than water. Bonus points if you can somehow persist Earth Glide, and have an entire cabal of aboleth living deep below a mountain range. Of course, if you really want that, you can just DMF:Persist it (that's DM fiat).

[Tvtyrant]

Would a huge Aboleth Totemist 2/Soul Eater X be too vicious? Seems like a good way to make a melee Aboleth.

[atemu1234]

Would a huge Aboleth Totemist 2/Soul Eater X be too vicious? Seems like a good way to make a melee Aboleth.

And a remarkably dead party of adventurers.

[nedz]

I just thought of this Junkyard competition (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?395791-Junkyard-Wars-IX-Earth-Dreamer-Ordained-Champion-Cleric&highlight=junkyard), and I thought that Earth Dreamer would be nice for an Aboleth who was interested in moving through things other than water. Bonus points if you can somehow persist Earth Glide, and have an entire cabal of aboleth living deep below a mountain range. Of course, if you really want that, you can just DMF:Persist it (that's DM fiat).

Just add the Earth Elemental Creature Template (MotP p192) a bargain at +2 CR — gets you Xorn movement. Air, Magma or Smoke might be more fun though.

[ExLibrisMortis]

Just add the Earth Elemental Creature Template (MotP p192) a bargain at +2 CR — gets you Xorn movement. Air, Magma or Smoke might be more fun though.
Now that would be something: a cabal of aboleth making their lair in the magma chamber underneath a most assuredly dormant volcano, which turns out to be somewhat less dormant than might be hoped for given the number of inhabitants of the surrounding land.

An unfortunate intersection between a magic-assisted eruption and a large number of visiting non-fire immune surface dwellers might even attract the attention of Atropus.

[nedz]

Now that would be something: a cabal of aboleth making their lair in the magma chamber underneath a most assuredly dormant volcano, which turns out to be somewhat less dormant than might be hoped for given the number of inhabitants of the surrounding land.

An unfortunate intersection between a magic-assisted eruption and a large number of visiting non-fire immune surface dwellers might even attract the attention of Atropus.

Yes yes, but the smoke one would be fun too. Just add in some levels in a Firestarter class (Sorcerer, Spontaneous Cleric with the Fire domain (for less limited use of domain spells) or even Warlock or DFI) and the party would have hours of fun working out just what is going on let alone working out how to fight the damm thing. It could even hide out in the factory quarter of a city, or above a volcanic vent.

[Keld Denar]

I'm gonna be making some advanced aboleth for my Night Below game in the next couple weeks. Dunno what your timeline is. I'll make some by advancing them with Aberration HD and others by just adding Wizard levels. I can post the stat blocks here when I get them done. I'm aiming at about CR 13-14 for the more advanced ones and maybe about CR10 for some not so advanced ones. I have a whole aboleth city to stat out...

[Tvtyrant]

I have some time on most of them. I am running an Aboleth cabal which is attempting to attract Ragnorra to the planet.