Who could play Shinji Ikari in a live action Evangelion movie?

[Starwulf]

So, me and a buddy of mine were discussing who could play Shinji in a theoretical Evangelion versus Godzilla movie(apparently the creator of Evangelion is making the newest JAPANESE godzilla movie, hence the idea of a versus). He suggested Michael Cera who I immediately shot down because he screams "I'm a goofball and absolutely hilarious" to me with his looks, while Shinji screams "I'm completely insecure and just want acknowledgement". He then suggested the kid who played McLoving from Superbad and yeah...I could see that, but I feel there is probably someone better out there.

Unfortunately, I'm awful with actor names and faces(I'm the least knowledgeable person I know when it comes to celebrities, I just don't care who they are at all, to me they are just normal people that happen to have a talent in acting). So, I figured I'd come here and ask you all who you think could play Shinji?

[Nerd-o-rama]

Shia LaBoeuf.

...no, I have no idea, really. Hollywood is rather lacking in decent actors who can pull off an insecure ninth-grader and while a Japanese actor would also make sense, I watch very little if any Japanese live action.

[Sith_Happens]

Shia LaBoeuf.

This was the first thing I thought of too.:smallconfused::smallredface:

[pkoi]

Why not someone Japanese? Or heck, any asian really.

[Lord Raziere]

uuhh.....the guy who played the first movie Spiderman and Frodo? whats his name? he really seemed to pull off pathetic nerd well....

[Closet_Skeleton]

Everyone you'd name would be too old. You might as well name 'teenage Steve Buscemi' as 'teenage Shia le Bouf' (you know he's 28 right?).


uuhh.....the guy who played the first movie Spiderman and Frodo? whats his name? he really seemed to pull off pathetic nerd well....

Toby Mcguire wasn't in Lord of the Rings.

[Lord Raziere]

Toby Mcguire wasn't in Lord of the Rings.

oh, they're separate people huh, now I remember the guy who played Frodo: Elijah Woods, think he'd pull it off?

[Berserk Mecha]

Shia LeBeouf, Toby Maguire, Elijah Wood, Daniel Radcliffe, they're all too old for the role. If Shinji, Asuka, and Rei are going to be cast as teenagers, then they'll be played by some no-name teen actors. Kind of like what they did with the Harry Potter movies and Game of Thrones. Actually, going off GoT, you could probably cast Issac Hempstead-Wright as Shinji but better move fast, that kid's growing up quickly.

It'd be more fun to speculate who'll play the adult roles in a live-action adaptation. Off the top of my head:

Gendou: Laurence Fishburne
Kaji: Robert Downy Jr.
Misato: Tina Fey
Ritsuko: Scarlett Johansson
Fuyutsuki: Christopher Walken

Assorted mecha mo-cap to be performed by Andy Serkis.

[Terraoblivion]

Shinji wouldn't work as a character if aged up, so any well known actor you could name would have to be one of those cases where they're playing someone half their age. Which is always awful. Finding an unknown, but talented kid the right age would be the only way to go.

[Starwulf]

Shia LeBeouf, Toby Maguire, Elijah Wood, Daniel Radcliffe, they're all too old for the role. If Shinji, Asuka, and Rei are going to be cast as teenagers, then they'll be played by some no-name teen actors. Kind of like what they did with the Harry Potter movies and Game of Thrones. Actually, going off GoT, you could probably cast Issac Hempstead-Wright as Shinji but better move fast, that kid's growing up quickly.

It'd be more fun to speculate who'll play the adult roles in a live-action adaptation. Off the top of my head:

Gendou: Laurence Fishburne
Kaji: Robert Downy Jr.
Misato: Tina Fey
Ritsuko: Scarlett Johansson
Fuyutsuki: Christopher Walken

Assorted mecha mo-cap to be performed by Andy Serkis.

For me, I thought Jennifer Lawrence would make an excellent Misato ^^ Tina Fey would be good to though, since Misato is a bit of a lush and Tina Fey seems like she could play that kind of role very well.

[pkoi]

The manga and anime are in-universe in Tokyo, the characters have Japanese names. Shouldn't everyone be Japanese, or at the least asian, (excepting characters like Asuka who can ostensibly be caucasian)? I find the whitewashing to be very odd. Would it be unusual if I suggested Daniel Kim instead of Christian Bale to be Batman?

[Starwulf]

The manga and anime are in-universe in Tokyo, the characters have Japanese names. Shouldn't everyone be Japanese, or at the least asian, (excepting characters like Asuka who can ostensibly be caucasian)? I find the whitewashing to be very odd. Would it be unusual if I suggested Daniel Kim instead of Christian Bale to be Batman?

I would imagine the reason no-one is suggesting Asian actors is because none of us are Asian and don't know any Asian actors ^^(or at the least, if some of the posters here are Asian, they are also American, so the first actors we think of are also American).

[pkoi]

I would imagine the reason no-one is suggesting Asian actors is because none of us are Asian and don't know any Asian actors ^^(or at the least, if some of the posters here are Asian, they are also American, so the first actors we think of are also American).

There is whitewashing of Asian roles in Hollywood; that we don't know of any Asian actors is exactly the problem. When roles that should have Asians playing them pops up, shouldn't there be Asians playing them? Instead they are played by caucasian actors which perpetuates this attitude. Would it be unusual if I suggested Daniel Kim to play Batman? What exactly is the difference?

[Eldan]

The manga and anime are in-universe in Tokyo, the characters have Japanese names. Shouldn't everyone be Japanese, or at the least asian, (excepting characters like Asuka who can ostensibly be caucasian)? I find the whitewashing to be very odd. Would it be unusual if I suggested Daniel Kim instead of Christian Bale to be Batman?

*shrug*

Batman's American. I'd rather think an American character can be pretty much any ethnicity, since pretty much all of them are in America somewhere. If Batman was Icelandic, I'd raise an eyebrow, but not for an American character played by an Asian.

[Nerd-o-rama]

It's a little more awkward with Evangelion since it's very specifically social commentary about Japan of the mid-90's, or at least the more nasty audience-punchy parts are.

[Mauve Shirt]

This was the first thing I thought of too.:smallconfused::smallredface:

Me too, what the hell? :smalltongue:

[GloatingSwine]

I'm pretty sure the concept of a live action Eva is basically heresy and anyone who seriously suggests making it should be fired into the sun along with the people who actually did make the live action Dragonbollocks.

[Aotrs Commander]

I'm pretty sure the concept of a live action Eva is basically heresy and anyone who seriously suggests making it should be fired into the sun along with the people who actually did make the live action Dragonbollocks.

I dunno, I think it'd be worth it for the mainstream audience reaction to the ending, especially when the trailers wil inevitably mkae it look like the next Pacific Rim. (If you showed in in America, they'd hear the screams in Japan.) Or they'd be forced to give an intelligable ending, which would sort of be a win....Ish? Maybe? Probably not.

(Note: was not at all a fan of NGE, especially of the ending even when forwarned. Would be hard-pressed to say whether NGE or ME3 ended worst though, so there's that...)



Actually, I'mma going to go ahead and say either BRIAN BLESSED or Samual L Jackson (orsomeone voiced by Jennifer Hale), on the basis that it wouldn't matter how bad it turned out, it'd be bloody gilariously awesome anyway. (*is firmly convinced that the aformentioned could be cast in any role ANY ROLE - and would be entertaining.*)

[Mauve Shirt]

See the good thing about child actors is they come pre-built with parental issues, and whether they be mommy or daddy issues they work super well for Shinji.

... You know, I don't think mainstream audiences would be big on a live-action wombsplosion.

[Alent]

Shia LaBoeuf.


This was the first thing I thought of too.:smallconfused::smallredface:


Me too, what the hell? :smalltongue:

You were tasked to find an actor as brain damaged as Shinji and you came up with the guy typecast for playing teenagers that act as brain damaged? This doesn't seem strange to me. I thought about him first, too.

After some thought, tho, I would suggest Will Smith's son. He's the right age, and if you've ever seen some of his more stupid tweets, he's already trying to be Shinji.


I'm pretty sure the concept of a live action Eva is basically heresy and anyone who seriously suggests making it should be fired into the sun along with the people who actually did make the live action Dragonbollocks.

This. Eva was bad enough the first time around.

[Dragonus45]

The manga and anime are in-universe in Tokyo, the characters have Japanese names. Shouldn't everyone be Japanese, or at the least asian, (excepting characters like Asuka who can ostensibly be caucasian)? I find the whitewashing to be very odd. Would it be unusual if I suggested Daniel Kim instead of Christian Bale to be Batman?

Well, the best thing about fantasy casting is that who gives a crap about race.

[GloatingSwine]

I dunno, I think it'd be worth it for the mainstream audience reaction to the ending, especially when the trailers wil inevitably mkae it look like the next Pacific Rim. (If you showed in in America, they'd hear the screams in Japan.) Or they'd be forced to give an intelligable ending, which would sort of be a win....Ish? Maybe? Probably not.

Which ending though? The original or End of Eva?

Because the latter isn't coming from the same mental place as the former. The original series ending is a generally positive (if highly symbolically presented due to budget constraint) acceptance of humanity and human relations by Shinji. The endpoint of real emotional development as a person. EoE is more intended as a giant middle finger to the people who reacted negatively to the original series ending (and when I say "negatively" I mean piles death threats and graffiti all over the Gainax offices), and scenes in it like Shinji wanking over Asuna's comatose body are a direct intentional condemnation of the audience (specifically their inability to engage with female characters as anything other than passive objects of desire, typified by the fetishisation of Rei by the fanbase).

The original ending is "grow and accept humanity" EoE is "otaku are disgusting".

[Drascin]

You were tasked to find an actor as brain damaged as Shinji and you came up with the guy typecast for playing teenagers that act as brain damaged? This doesn't seem strange to me. I thought about him first, too.

After some thought, tho, I would suggest Will Smith's son. He's the right age, and if you've ever seen some of his more stupid tweets, he's already trying to be Shinji.

Shinji isn't stupid. Or a bad kid, really. He's just overwhelmed to hell and dealing with severe issues that he can't get any help with because every time he makes progress something, usually his dad, screws everything up (he was actually improving until his dad used his mom-robot to kill his best and near-only friend in front of him gruesomely, you know).


Which ending though? The original or End of Eva?

Because the latter isn't coming from the same mental place as the former. The original series ending is a generally positive (if highly symbolically presented due to budget constraint) acceptance of humanity and human relations by Shinji. The endpoint of real emotional development as a person. EoE is more intended as a giant middle finger to the people who reacted negatively to the original series ending (and when I say "negatively" I mean piles death threats and graffiti all over the Gainax offices), and scenes in it like Shinji wanking over Asuna's comatose body are a direct intentional condemnation of the audience (specifically their inability to engage with female characters as anything other than passive objects of desire, typified by the fetishisation of Rei by the fanbase).

The original ending is "grow and accept humanity" EoE is "otaku are disgusting".

That was a serious cluster****. The fans were positively revolting - the death threats have to be seen to be believed. And of course Anno expected everyone to be of course squicked out by and set against Rei despite making her into another archetype damaged child because, I don't know, she's not fully human or something, I never got his reasoning? So I'm not exactly putting him very high in the scale either, here.

(Anime scifi already has a huge, annoying trend of dehumanizing people for the stupidest of reasons. "Oh, you're a clone/cyborg/tube baby/whatever, that means you're not a real person, just a fake doll". It really annoys me)

[Aotrs Commander]

Which ending though? The original or End of Eva?

Because the latter isn't coming from the same mental place as the former. The original series ending is a generally positive (if highly symbolically presented due to budget constraint) acceptance of humanity and human relations by Shinji. The endpoint of real emotional development as a person. EoE is more intended as a giant middle finger to the people who reacted negatively to the original series ending (and when I say "negatively" I mean piles death threats and graffiti all over the Gainax offices), and scenes in it like Shinji wanking over Asuna's comatose body are a direct intentional condemnation of the audience (specifically their inability to engage with female characters as anything other than passive objects of desire, typified by the fetishisation of Rei by the fanbase).

The original ending is "grow and accept humanity" EoE is "otaku are disgusting".

Now, I have only seen the original, and have read synopses of the latter, but from inferrance from the latter, I think they're both equally naff.

(And I suspect the modern mainstream (sic) audience would "get" the endings rather less that even I did...)

[Dragonus45]

You know the more I think about the idea the more I like Jaden Smith in the roll, mainly because I would die to see Will do Gendo.

[pkoi]

Well, the best thing about fantasy casting is that who gives a crap about race.

{scrubbed} Incidentally, what did you think of the Sci-Fi version of Earthsea? Do you think no one "gives a crap about race" because it's fantasy?

With movies like 21 and The Last Airbender being made blatantly whitewashing Asians, and the chances for strong Asian male characters so disastrously small, it boggles my mind that in a society where "racism" is a dirty word that people turn a blind eye to this. And not just people, but the vast majority of people.

{scrubbed}

[Starwulf]

{scrubbed} Incidentally, what did you think of the Sci-Fi version of Earthsea? Do you think no one "gives a crap about race" because it's fantasy?

With movies like 21 and The Last Airbender being made blatantly whitewashing Asians, and the chances for strong Asian male characters so disastrously small, it boggles my mind that in a society where "racism" is a dirty word that people turn a blind eye to this. And not just people, but the vast majority of people.

{scrubbed}

Is there a reason you're derailing this thread and deliberately trying to turn it into a race conflict? There is no reason to do so and it is highly irritating ><

[pkoi]

Is there a reason you're derailing this thread and deliberately trying to turn it into a race conflict? There is no reason to do so and it is highly irritating ><

And I'm quite a bit more irritated. Shinji seems like a rather clear casting call to me.

[Dragonus45]

{scrubbed} Incidentally, what did you think of the Sci-Fi version of Earthsea? Do you think no one "gives a crap about race" because it's fantasy?

With movies like 21 and The Last Airbender being made blatantly whitewashing Asians, and the chances for strong Asian male characters so disastrously small, it boggles my mind that in a society where "racism" is a dirty word that people turn a blind eye to this. And not just people, but the vast majority of people.

{scrubbed}

Yea listen, 9 times out of ten I'm convicned Will Smith has the acting chops to do just about anything and I'm excited about the casting of the new Johny Storm I think the black Kingpin was the best version of him in any meduim, and I liked that movie to so eat me, and Sam L Jackson owned Nick Fury so thoroughly I still feel like white Nick is the knockoff version. Race doesn't matter, acting talent does. I watched Earthsea when I was rather young and after I got older and read the books I found that the casting was just the crap cherry on a **** Sunday with diarrhea for whipped cream. Same for avatar really, if the actors involved had been able to pull their weight I wouldn't have cared but they were awful and so was that movie. This reminds me of all the people who were going after Big Hero 6 saying it was whitewashing the comic it was barely based on. The movie itself was good, and even managed to be "multicultural" and "inclusive" by literally any metric you want to count by but yet some people still had to write 50 tumblr posts a day on it.

Also before you go much farther here remember that anime often deliberately designs its characters to seem like something of a blank slate. Also toss in a study (http://scienceblogs.com/cognitivedaily/2009/11/03/anime-film-characters-do-we-pe/) that shows that when watching the animations people are more likely to answer their own race when asked the race of a character, clearly counting out darker skinned folks the study only looked at Asians and Caucasians. Is it any wonder that people from america think of the characters in american terms?

[Eldan]

You know the more I think about the idea the more I like Jaden Smith in the roll, mainly because I would die to see Will do Gendo.

Hasn't it been ages since Will Smith did anything good?

[Dragonus45]

Hasn't it been ages since Will Smith did anything good?

Everything he does is good. Joke aside though I feel its more its been ages since he got anything good given to him. The man can act anything. Plus I feel that getting an actual father and son into the roles would help them a great deal.

[GloatingSwine]

Everything he does is good. Joke aside though I feel its more its been ages since he got anything good given to him. The man can act anything. Plus I feel that getting an actual father and son into the roles would help them a great deal.

I'm not sure Will Smith has to wait for good things to be given to him. I'm p. sure someone with his audience pull has quite a lot of freedom in what projects he chooses.

He just chooses things like After Earth.

Which was not helped at all by being an actual father/son duo.

[Dragonus45]

I'm not sure Will Smith has to wait for good things to be given to him. I'm p. sure someone with his audience pull has quite a lot of freedom in what projects he chooses.

He just chooses things like After Earth.

Which was not helped at all by being an actual father/son duo.

Well, not everything is a win.

[Terraoblivion]

Also before you go much farther here remember that anime often deliberately designs its characters to seem like something of a blank slate. Also toss in a study (http://scienceblogs.com/cognitivedaily/2009/11/03/anime-film-characters-do-we-pe/) that shows that when watching the animations people are more likely to answer their own race when asked the race of a character, clearly counting out darker skinned folks the study only looked at Asians and Caucasians. Is it any wonder that people from america think of the characters in american terms?

Not only is Shinji clearly Japanese narratively, that's not a product of trying to make characters look white. What happens is that the Japanese think they look like baseline humans and white people think they look like baseline humans. So whenever somebody is drawn without ethnic markers other than skin color people think they look like themselves because you don't really notice your own ethnic markers. So white people see the like of epidural folds, different skin tone and, for some, more explicitly racist caricatures and think the character looks white. The Japanese see a lack of square jaws, large noses and pronounced facial bone structure and see that the characters clearly look Japanese. The latter have a more solid basis for their judgement since they're the ones doing the designs and whose intentions are applied to them.

[Eldan]

Everything he does is good. Joke aside though I feel its more its been ages since he got anything good given to him. The man can act anything. Plus I feel that getting an actual father and son into the roles would help them a great deal.

He just did some kind of gangster movie that I forgot the name of. My brother dragged me to go watch it. It felt as if he was yawning his way through that movie. Not acting at all, just bored.

[Dragonus45]

Not only is Shinji clearly Japanese narratively, that's not a product of trying to make characters look white. What happens is that the Japanese think they look like baseline humans and white people think they look like baseline humans. So whenever somebody is drawn without ethnic markers other than skin color people think they look like themselves because you don't really notice your own ethnic markers. So white people see the like of epidural folds, different skin tone and, for some, more explicitly racist caricatures and think the character looks white. The Japanese see a lack of square jaws, large noses and pronounced facial bone structure and see that the characters clearly look Japanese. The latter have a more solid basis for their judgement since they're the ones doing the designs and whose intentions are applied to them.

We aren't talking about narratives we are talking about looks, when people go to mentally cast an actor they cast based on what they might think that character looks like and that its not white washing to do so when Mukokuseki is a thing, and often a deliberate one. My point is not that they deliberatly make them look white its that anime characters often have no or conflicting racial markers. You have characters in anime that run the gamut from Naoki Urasawa's 20th Century Boys, where they are detailed and clearly visually representative of race to Sailor Moon where half the defining features for the characters literally don't occur in nature.

Also as a side note if your adapting something from another culture to yours its not whitewashing to change the races, just look at Death at a Funeral. That movie has been made remade and remade again and every time has had a cast of predominantly different race. Was it brownwashing that the Bollywood remake had Indian actors?

[pkoi]

Also before you go much farther here remember that anime often deliberately designs its characters to seem like something of a blank slate. Also toss in a study (http://scienceblogs.com/cognitivedaily/2009/11/03/anime-film-characters-do-we-pe/) that shows that when watching the animations people are more likely to answer their own race when asked the race of a character, clearly counting out darker skinned folks the study only looked at Asians and Caucasians. Is it any wonder that people from america think of the characters in american terms?

I understand that casual viewers will imprint what they are used to onto a blank slate. At the moment, when simply understanding is difficult to come by, I'd like to think that us as fans of a series would consider a show a little more deeply than a casual viewer. I'd like to think that we can recognize that Shinji Akari is Japanese. Is this really a stretch?


We aren't talking about narratives we are talking about looks, when people go to mentally cast an actor they cast based on what they might think that character looks like and that its not white washing to do so when Mukokuseki is a thing, and often a deliberate one. My point is not that they deliberatly make them look white its that anime characters often have no or conflicting racial markers. You have characters in anime that run the gamut from Naoki Urasawa's 20th Century Boys, where they are detailed and clearly visually representative of race to Sailor Moon where half the defining features for the characters literally don't occur in nature.

Also as a side note if your adapting something from another culture to yours its not whitewashing to change the races, just look at Death at a Funeral. That movie has been made remade and remade again and every time has had a cast of predominantly different race. Was it brownwashing that the Bollywood remake had Indian actors?

{scrubbed}

So I'd like to know where the reciprocity is. If we are to be comfortable with an English American actor playing a Japanese character, then we first ought to be comfortable with a Japanese American actor playing an English character. There are a multitude of egregious examples of the other direction, I won't bore anyone by listing them. Until then, I don't think it's strange to say that when there's a character that is ostensibly Asian, they should be played by an Asian. Quite frankly, we are a very, very long ways away from actual color blind casting. Why are people irritated that I want an Asian character played by an Asian?

[Starwulf]

I understand that casual viewers will imprint what they are used to onto a blank slate. At the moment, when simply understanding is difficult to come by, I'd like to think that us as fans of a series would consider a show a little more deeply than a casual viewer. I'd like to think that we can recognize that Shinji Akari is Japanese. Is this really a stretch?

You're telling me THIS: http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FShinji_ Ikari&ei=7oMgVfeSGIm3sAX5uoDgDQ&bvm=bv.89947451,d.b2w&psig=AFQjCNGqIMQVAeM23PcTw0ihxpfmJ6FJvQ&ust=1428280678794303 Clearly looks Japanese? And iirc, Asuka was from Germany, which is definitely about as "whitebread" as you can get. Hell, Rei didn't particularly look all that Japanese either. Honestly though, I just don't understand the need for some people to see racial injustice everywhere they look. This was meant to be a simple conversation about who could possibly play Shinji in a live action movie. There was absolutely no need, no reason, and certainly no SJW cause to drag race into the mix. If you wanted to bring up Japanese actors, you should have just done so, without getting all righteous over it. Pick appropriate topics to spread your "racial injustice" message, please.

[Terraoblivion]

I dunno, Hollywood's dislike of casting leads who aren't straight, white, brown-haired men seems like a pretty valid place to comment on poor representation of other ethic groups in the media and the barriers for Asian actors to get into the industry. I mean, what topics would be more appropriate for that than one about casting where everybody rushes to cast a group of Japanese characters with white actors short of one dedicated to restating that The Last Airbender sucks? I honestly have a hard time seeing what would be a more appropriate place to bring up the issue.

As for Shinji looking Japanese, well, he's got soft, delicate features, and a pretty small (or at least narrow) nose, pale skin and brown hair. Those are all quite typical of Japanese teenagers, with brown hair being less common than black but by no means a rarity. He looks more Japanese than white. White people tend to have larger noses and more pronounced facial bone structures and skin and hair color is about equally common for the two ethnic groups. It's not clear either way, but overall he looks more Japanese than white but either could be the way to go. But he's written as a Japanese character with a Japanese name and grounding in Japanese culture, these are kind of more important than physical appearance in determining what ethnicity he belongs to. It's not like there aren't people who look like they could be both white and Asian despite having no significant ancestry from one of the two.

[Starwulf]

I dunno, Hollywood's dislike of casting leads who aren't straight, white, brown-haired men seems like a pretty valid place to comment on poor representation of other ethic groups in the media and the barriers for Asian actors to get into the industry. I mean, what topics would be more appropriate for that than one about casting where everybody rushes to cast a group of Japanese characters with white actors short of one dedicated to restating that The Last Airbender sucks? I honestly have a hard time seeing what would be a more appropriate place to bring up the issue.

I'd be slightly more understanding if he was complaining about HOLLYWOOD, but his complaint started off with why are we all suggesting white actors for what he thought was clearly an Asian role. Going all SJW over people on a thread giving suggestions based on their ethnicity is ridiculous. I mean, if I posted this thread on a British forum, I would be more then willing to bet that I'd get mostly British actors for suggestions, if I posted on a French forum, I'd get mostly French actors, so on and so forth, and I honestly do not see any sort of issue with people automatically giving suggestions based off of what they know. I mean, most normal people(ie: non-film buffs) aren't going to know actors outside of their own country.

Even then, it still feels supremely irritating to have an innocent thread debate derailed into a commentary on racial injustice in films. If he wants to discuss it, MAKE A SPECIFIC THREAD instead of derailing another one. I mean, it seems to me that such a topic would be enough of a hot button issue for some that it would get plenty of attention, why deliberately derail someone elses thread besides the need to irritate others?

[Terraoblivion]

{scrubbed}

[Starwulf]

{scrubbed}

And with that, I'm done. I don't care what happens to this topic from here on out. The moment people start making ANY kind of assumptions about me, without even knowing me, is the moment I step out the door. I hate that kind of attitude. You don't know me, you don't know the crap I've been through, you in essence don't know **** about me and shouldn't pretend that you do. Plus, even if every one of your assumptions was right, the idea/attitude that I don't know or understand what the hell is going on, or can't sympathize is so beyond stupid and offensive, that I am literally seeing red now. My blocklist just got it's third person added to it.

[Cheesegear]

Asa Butterfield, the kid from Ender's Game is pretty much the only person I can think of. He's 18 as of a couple of days ago, but he still looks the part...For now.

[Dragonus45]

{scrubbed}

Could you not break people down to things like their race and gender. Its insulting racist sexist and does nothing but sour the moods of everyone in the room when you then start telling them how their life has been lived and are patently wrong.

[pkoi]

You're telling me THIS: http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FShinji_ Ikari&ei=7oMgVfeSGIm3sAX5uoDgDQ&bvm=bv.89947451,d.b2w&psig=AFQjCNGqIMQVAeM23PcTw0ihxpfmJ6FJvQ&ust=1428280678794303 Clearly looks Japanese? And iirc, Asuka was from Germany, which is definitely about as "whitebread" as you can get. Hell, Rei didn't particularly look all that Japanese either. Honestly though, I just don't understand the need for some people to see racial injustice everywhere they look. This was meant to be a simple conversation about who could possibly play Shinji in a live action movie. There was absolutely no need, no reason, and certainly no SJW cause to drag race into the mix. If you wanted to bring up Japanese actors, you should have just done so, without getting all righteous over it. Pick appropriate topics to spread your "racial injustice" message, please.

I've already responded to mukokuseki previously, but I'll say it again. This is a cartoon. It clearly looks like a cartoon. A casual observer will imprint whatever race is most comfortable with them onto it. But we are not casual observers, we are fans. We have seen the show. We know that he's Shinji Ikari, we know that he's Japanese and lives in Tokyo-3. So yes, I say again, he is clearly Japanese.

If you think "stateless" characters are all "whitebread", then that's your issue. I'd like to think then that I have a little more nuance.

I don't think this is a case of seeing racial injustice everywhere I look. I think this is very specific, in fact. I'm honestly confused at your lack of understanding. I don't know what "SJW" is, but as I've been called many epithets before, I'll take it as yet another badge of honor (along with geek, nerd, loser, etc). I will say again, Shinji Ikari should be played by an Asian. How much more on topic can I get? Can you explain how I'm being inappropriate? I admit I do not post very often, so I am not as well versed at this as you are.


I'd be slightly more understanding if he was complaining about HOLLYWOOD, but his complaint started off with why are we all suggesting white actors for what he thought was clearly an Asian role. Going all SJW over people on a thread giving suggestions based on their ethnicity is ridiculous. I mean, if I posted this thread on a British forum, I would be more then willing to bet that I'd get mostly British actors for suggestions, if I posted on a French forum, I'd get mostly French actors, so on and so forth, and I honestly do not see any sort of issue with people automatically giving suggestions based off of what they know. I mean, most normal people(ie: non-film buffs) aren't going to know actors outside of their own country.

Even then, it still feels supremely irritating to have an innocent thread debate derailed into a commentary on racial injustice in films. If he wants to discuss it, MAKE A SPECIFIC THREAD instead of derailing another one. I mean, it seems to me that such a topic would be enough of a hot button issue for some that it would get plenty of attention, why deliberately derail someone elses thread besides the need to irritate others?

I will once again claim your "SJW" as a badge of honor.
Is it too much to ask you to examine your assumptions? Why do you think someone named "Shinji Ikari" is white? Why are you irritated that I assume he isn't?


And with that, I'm done. I don't care what happens to this topic from here on out. The moment people start making ANY kind of assumptions about me, without even knowing me, is the moment I step out the door. I hate that kind of attitude. You don't know me, you don't know the crap I've been through, you in essence don't know **** about me and shouldn't pretend that you do. Plus, even if every one of your assumptions was right, the idea/attitude that I don't know or understand what the hell is going on, or can't sympathize is so beyond stupid and offensive, that I am literally seeing red now. My blocklist just got it's third person added to it.

Wow, this really upsets you. I'd like to gently suggest that you don't know the same things about others, either. You have shown a startling lack of sympathy of me, to be fair to Terraoblivion.

[Starwulf]

Wow, this really upsets you. I'd like to gently suggest that you don't know the same things about others, either. You have shown a startling lack of sympathy of me, to be fair to Terraoblivion.

SJW = Social Justice Warriors. Sometimes a good thing, sometimes a bad thing. Why should I show you any sympathy when you come into my topic and start yelling at everyone for not considering Asian actors to play Asian roles? I mean, you literally came into this topic and started acting like we were all the scum of the earth because we all were naming off English actors instead of Japanese ones, which I again respond with "I imagine no-one in here even knows the name of an Asian actor, and if we were to go off and randomly look them up, we certainly wouldn't know enough about them to say whether or not they would be an effective in actor in said role". You went off on semi-rants about how terrible it is that people won't consider Asians for asian roles, and I find the topic wholly inappropriate for said discussion. If you want to name off Asian actors to play Shinji, then please, by all means, go ahead and do so, but do not turn my thread into a commentary on societies inability as a whole to not give certain roles to their appropriate roles.

Also, as I also mentioned, Asuka is clearly NOT Japanese, hence the "Whitebread" comment. She came from Germany in the anime, they snagged her and her Evangelion off of a german ship and transferred them to a Japanese ship. I was not referencing any other character as "Whitebread" just Asuka. And while I may be a fan, no, I don't "clearly realize they are Japanese". Have you seen a picture of Rei? That girl is as pale as an Albino, and last time I checked, Japanese people are clearly tannish in skin color. There isn't even a HINT of tan to that girls body. Just because they have Japanese names does not necessarily indicate that they are in fact Japanese. I named my daughter an Asian name, but she's clearly not an Asian. It's not to hard to consider that the characters in Evangelion are not in fact Japanese, especially when you consider that the original Tokyo was destroyed due to the "Second Impact"(If you'll recall, the story takes place in Tokyo-3, a city which can retract underground). It's not to hard to consider that quite a few of the inhabitants are actually immigrants from other countries.

Honestly though, all that being said, I wouldn't have had such an issue if you hadn't, in your first few posts, come in with an attitude that all of us here were just like the bigwigs in Hollywood and only were naming off English actors because that's all we cared about, instead of the simple fact that we don't know Asian ones.

[Haruki-kun]

The Winged Mod: Thread closed for review.

EDIT: Thread re-opened upon review. Please get back on topic, guys.

[Nerd-o-rama]

But yeah it's pretty important for Shinji to be an adolescent, given that that's what the whole show's about, and I don't know what actors are out there who could 1) pull the age off convincingly and 2) actually act. Ethnic background aside, which I also consider important to maintaining the original themes of the show. (I mean, remember when they were going to remake Akira in America? How would that even work?)

[Dragonus45]

But yeah it's pretty important for Shinji to be an adolescent, given that that's what the whole show's about, and I don't know what actors are out there who could 1) pull the age off convincingly and 2) actually act. Ethnic background aside, which I also consider important to maintaining the original themes of the show. (I mean, remember when they were going to remake Akira in America? How would that even work?)

Have you seen chronicle?


Really the problem here feels like a lack of strong young actors for Shinji. I have ideas for Asuka and Rei but for Shinji I'm just drawing a blank, all the child actors I can thin of are to old now.

[Cheesegear]

Pretty sure it was lost in the...Discussion.


Asa Butterfield, the kid from Ender's Game is pretty much the only person I can think of. He's 18 as of a couple of days ago, but he still looks the part...For now.

Like the Ender's Game movie, you can always just age-up all the characters two or three years, and if there are problems with Ender's Game, it's not because of the characters' ages compared to the book.

The ultimate problem is that there are no child actors until someone first casts them. Who could have predicted Haley Joel Osment? Nobody. Then suddenly he was in three highly rated movies in two years, since he was the only child actor around who could actually do anything. Ditto for Freddie Highmore. Ditto for Asa Butterfield.

The only way somebody in this thread will be able to come up with a reasonable answer for a child actor that exists currently, is if they wants to scour the current crop of Disney Channel shows (where Shia LeBouf, and a whole bunch of others came from), but I have no intention of doing that anytime soon, so, if somebody else wants to...

I did think of Lance Lim (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm4584531/), but he's of Korean descent. But, the same goes for child actors. If you want Western audiences to be able to rattle off Asian actors, those actors need to be in movies that Western audiences will see, and really, that doesn't even happen that often, like...Jet Li, Jackie Chan, Chow Yun-Fat...And I'm done. Oh, that one guy from FF3: Tokyo Drift who managed to transfer over into the main Furious storyline for one movie, and I don't know his name without looking it up. Jay Chou was meant to take off, but he never quite did after Green Hornet. I also can't even tell you the actor's name from The Raid movies without looking it up - and I should know that guy's name, so that's disappointing.

Ultimately, it comes down to exposure. I'm not exposed to child actors, and the ones I am exposed to are bad. I'm also not exposed to Asian cinema/TV, so I don't really know any Asian actors, and certainly not any child ones at that. That doesn't make me - or anyone else, for that matter - a bad person.

[Alent]

I was going to post this around the time this one got locked, but if you really want to find Japanese kids, just go look at the kids starring in recent Kamen Rider series. The actors from Kamen Rider typically are the ones hired after their series ends to star in anime to live action adaptations.

I don't watch the series myself, but a friend who does pointed out that one of the actors in Kamen Rider Gaim, Mahiro Takasugi (age 18), could pull off a convincing 14 year old Shinji as his role in Gaim required all of the same character traits, and it would be a natural career direction for him.

[Cheesegear]

just go look at the kids starring in recent Kamen Rider series.

That never would have occured to me. Well played.

[Kitten Champion]

If, and I really wouldn't want this to be the case since it would most likely be awful beyond imagining, but if they actually did make a live-action NGE movie -- it would have to be split into three movies just to prevent eviscerating the plot, diluting the characters, or greatly trivializing the threat of the Angels.

So, it would mean a project which would take the lion's share of a decade to complete. Thus starting with somewhat known actors in their late teens who could pull off maybe one movie wouldn't be optimal for a franchise that will stop shooting when they're all in their mid-twenties.

Thus, I'd just do what they did with the Harry Potter franchise did to get its main cast. Large casting call of unknowns that generally fit the description of the characters, and would be willing to be defined by their role.

[Dragonus45]

Yea but then you run into the problems of the harry potter series where none of the main cast could act. Still your right that it would be the only real option.

[Kitten Champion]

Yea but then you run into the problems of the harry potter series where none of the main cast could act. Still your right that it would be the only real option.

Oh, most likely, the idea of a young actor playing live-action Asuka in particularly is cringe-worthy. One of several dozen reasons why a live-action NGE is not the best of ideas.

[Dragonus45]

Oh, most likely, the idea of a young actor playing live-action Asuka in particularly is cringe-worthy. One of several dozen reasons why a live-action NGE is not the best of ideas.

Hmmmm, your right just the thought makes my eye twitchy. Still, now that I'm thinking about it I do wonder if a younger Kirsten Dunst might not be able to pull it off. I suppose one more benefit of fantasy casting is the ability to cast people from years ago.

[Traab]

As someone who hasnt watched evangelion, how important is it that the actors play the roles of high school students instead of college? That would give the actors a few more years worth of range to work with, could relatively easily cover any high school type antics, since school is school, and should change a minimum of canon that way.

[Eldan]

Essential, I'd say. Apart from robots fighting aliens, it's also about abused, depressed and otherwise broken orphans and half-orphans being forced to fight an overpowering enemy.

There's very few antics. The few school scenes are usually over quickly.

[Dragonus45]

As someone who hasnt watched evangelion, how important is it that the actors play the roles of high school students instead of college? That would give the actors a few more years worth of range to work with, could relatively easily cover any high school type antics, since school is school, and should change a minimum of canon that way.

The growing pains of adolescence, specifically the problems involving anxiety and the fear facing social rejection alongside difficulty and pain that comes with exposing yourself to the outside world are all important themes that wouldn't work as well if the protagonists were already college aged.

[Traab]

Ah damn, I was hoping for at least that much give. It would add so much more potential range if they were university level. Well then it looks like you have either a small handful of known actors still capable of pulling off a kid age, or mostly unknowns to gamble with. And with how it sounds like you will need to make a trilogy to cover everything decently, the small handful of actors will shrink even more.

[Nerd-o-rama]

On the other hand, some of the greatest performances in the world (especially in adaptations for some reason) have come from casting an unknown who really understood this one particular part in his heart. Look at Christopher Reeve, who was no one before Superman (1978). Not a child actor, but the principle applies. Haley Joel Osment is half an example and an actual child actor, since he was in one great movie and one execrable one very close together, but the latter wasn't really his fault.

Basically I don't think we're going to get anything good out of an established name for any of the kid characters in this show for a hypothetical live action adaptation. Looking at the adults might be more interesting.

[Cheesegear]

important themes that wouldn't work as well if the protagonists were already college aged.

The character doesn't need to be 20 or so. But he needn't be 14 either - how has Game of Thrones changed by ageing all the Stark children up a few years? Not very. Ageing up the characters to ~16-17 still works perfectly fine, since 'social rejection' anxiety can last well into University years and even longer. For some, high school never ends. Thinking that depression/anxiety is only reserved for 14 year-olds is very, very wrong. You may have to change some dialogue, but that's already guaranteed to happen anyway, and it's not like changing the entire end of Watchmen hurt the film in any way.

The upside to ageing up the characters, gives better possibility for a better range of actors, which means that you can potentially cast 18 year old actors who are actually out of high school and who can be reasonably expected to know what they're doing, especially if they've taken drama classes in high school. Whereas child actors are just generally terrible unless they've already been previously cast in roles before and have had the necessary 'coaching' before from a director before them, and already know what's expected of them. I've read, that as long as they aren't crying all the time, a toddler (3-5) is actually easier to work with than a teenager, and I wish I could recall the director who said that.

The upside to casting actual child actors, can be seen perfectly in Harry Potter, where if you're going to make more than one film, seeing the actors age in relatively real time actually helps the story along. The opposite, infamously, is 90210, where after a few seasons, you had actors in their mid-late 20s trying to play teenagers and it didn't quite work out. The downside to casting child actors - especially the male ones - is if they're going through puberty while filming. Voice cracks might give an air of realism to the age bracket, but 'realism' doesn't necessarily translate into being filmable, especially if the character is prone to heavy-handed dialogue and monologues.

Google tells me the 'timeline' of NGE is only about a year, maybe 18 months. If you're going to make 3/4 films (because the last part has to be split into two, because that's how movies are made, now), if you're lucky, you might be able to crank out a movie per year, depending on your budget and whether or not your SFX team can get it done - The Hobbit managed it. If you're not lucky with a sweet budget and a real SFX team, you might get pushed to a two year schedule, and that might break a child actor...Or, like I said, a lot of things can happen during puberty. I don't know how they did it, but Harry Potter managed to get all of its child cast through filming without any of them going off the rails.

But now I'm off-topic talking about the realities of film-making.

Who could Bryan Singer cast as Jubilee for the next X-Men movie? No actress currently working is going to make fans happy. So hire somebody no-one knows (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm7093076/), based on the fact that they look the part (casting calls are a thing) and presumably have an audition tape, and hope the newcomer works out.
It's basically the same thing for Shinji. Hire someone who looks the part, and hope they turn out.

[Sith_Happens]

The Hobbit managed it

The way Peter Jackson puts out an entry per year is by filming the entire trilogy in one go. Which is how an Eva trilogy would necessarily have to do it to avoid actor aging.

[Nerd-o-rama]

No see, if you're making Evangelion movies, you make two good ones, a complete audience troll, and then just continuously lie about when the fourth is coming out until your audience gets bored...

[Dragonus45]

No see, if you're making Evangelion movies, you make two good ones, a complete audience troll, and then just continuously lie about when the fourth is coming out until your audience gets bored...

For some reason I can't find the like button for this comment.... I liked the troll one though.

[Cheesegear]

No see, if you're making Evangelion movies, you make two good ones, a complete audience troll, and then just continuously lie about when the fourth is coming out until your audience gets bored...

Perfect modern 'trilogy' then.

Movies 1 & 2 actually work.
Movie 3 is actually a Part 1 of a two-part film, and therefore there's no pay-off to anything it sets up, because everything actually good that happens at this point in the story is saved for the final movie...
Movie 4 never gets made.

[Nerd-o-rama]

Perfect modern 'trilogy' then.

Movies 1 & 2 actually work.
Movie 3 is actually a Part 1 of a two-part film, and therefore there's no pay-off to anything it sets up, because everything actually good that happens at this point in the story is saved for the final movie...
Movie 4 never gets made.

In my experience, trilogies tend to go like you say for 1, 2 is like 3, and 3 just ends up being hugely disappointing.

I haven't watched any two-part finales other than the (terrible) Deathly Hallows movies, though.

[GloatingSwine]

No see, if you're making Evangelion movies, you make two good ones, a complete audience troll, and then just continuously lie about when the fourth is coming out until your audience gets bored...

How could it be anything else? I mean this is basically what Eva stands for.


On the other hand doing that in live action would mean making a good live action anime adaptation to start with, and the laws of moviemaking physics appear to prevent that.

[Cheesegear]

I haven't watched any two-part finales other than the (terrible) Deathly Hallows movies, though.

Hunger Games and Twilight give a wave.

[Nerd-o-rama]

How could it be anything else? I mean this is basically what Eva stands for.


On the other hand doing that in live action would mean making a good live action anime adaptation to start with, and the laws of moviemaking physics appear to prevent that.

Speed Racer.

...other than that I got nothing.


Hunger Games and Twilight give a wave.

Yes, but I didn't watch those. And the end of Twilight actually came out, didn't it?

[GloatingSwine]

Speed Racer.

...other than that I got nothing.


That's stretching the definition of "good movie" so hard it squeaks.

I mean so far the best we can do is "Attack on Titan isn't definitely crap yet", but that's only because it isn't out yet and there's still time for it to be horribly disappointing.

I'm not even really sure a live action Eva would work, I mean just even work as a thing on screen. People's expectations for a supposedly "real" thing in a live action context are not going to extend to "80m tall robot runs like olympic sprinter", because their suspension of disbelief isn't calibrated appropriately for that to happen, so in order to make it work on screen it would basically turn into Pacific Rim with relatively big slow clompy robots.

(Also there simply isn't the cultural context for what the show is about in western media to examine the psychological effects of the standard super robot boy hero transposed into a universe where things like "psychological effects" actually happen. So actually a live action western version of Eva would be about a teenage superhero's sidekick suffering mental anguish and breakdown due to demands of fighting crime because that cultural context does exist, albeit reduced from what it was.)

[Sith_Happens]

That's stretching the definition of "good movie" so hard it squeaks.

Depends on what you mean by a "good" movie. I definitely wouldn't call Speed Racer good in the critical sense, but I liked it a lot and most everything about it was surprisingly competently done in a hard-to-describe sort of way.

[Kitten Champion]

No one's seen Cutie Honey?

Actually there are quite a number of decent live-action adaptations of anime and manga, particularly in the area of ideas that could work in live-action to begin with - like most romantic comedies or mystery series.

[Dragonus45]

Yea there have been some good Kamen Rider stuff as well, and while I have not seen them I have heard good things about the live action Case Closed stuff.

[Nerd-o-rama]

And I've heard nothing but either good things or indifference about Pretty Guardian Sailor Moon, but that's not a movie or movies.

Not sure if KR counts since that's been primarily live-action TV since the first series (which was, admittedly, based on a manga), though.

[BayardSPSR]

Oh, most likely, the idea of a young actor playing live-action Asuka in particularly is cringe-worthy. One of several dozen reasons why a live-action NGE is not the best of ideas.

Live-action film with a sexually aggressive age-blind 13-year-old? Yeah...