To Crab or not to Crab

[LastOblivion]

Would it be wrong of me as a DM to have my party come across That Damn Crab wearing a chest overflowing with gold on its head?
I do understand that That Damn Crab is a terror and should be avoided, but i enjoy baiting by players to their deaths with promises of loot. And sometimes they trick me and get away with all the treasure I baited them with.

Currently this is a new campaign and the party is made of 6 lv 3 players and 1 pet owlbear. My King Crab (That Damn Crab with 7 more hit die to rise its size to large) is technically CR 5, which should leave its true CR around 8. The upper limit of CR this party can face is 9, (the upper party limit being 50% chance of TPK.)

I was planning on having the party run into as they cross a river they are coming up on. The King Crab will show no hostility until attack or someone tries to take from its chest. I'm allowing the players a chance to walk on by and ignore the crab. Once hostile the crab will kill anything it sees as a threat. If the party retreats the crab will stop chasing.

The party has 3 skilled players, two of which know about That Damn Crab, 2 foolish players and one new player.

Is it wrong of me to want release the Crab?

For those that don't know - http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20040221a 2nd monster down.

[Troacctid]

I believe the crab was updated in Stormwrack to have more appropriate stats for its CR. Or more appropriate CR for its stats? Same thing, I guess. Anyway, I'd use that version.

[Necroticplague]

If you're clever, it's not that hard. Just make sure you slow it down as much as possible. If the skilled players can recognize it, it should be easy enough for them to warn the others 'watch out, that thing is vicious in a grapple, stay at range'.

[Flickerdart]

The Crab is most dangerous in its standard MO as an ambusher, since it has no meaningful contributions to make at range beyond "run very fast at the thing." If it's just hanging around, the PCs will probably realize that it's dangerous (especially if you mention a couple of well-armed skeletons around the crab).

[Know(Nothing)]

Also you could, y'know, run it like an animal(or vermin in this case) and have it try to run away after it takes some damage. It might be hungry enough to try to snag someone and scuttle off with them, but it won't stand its ground and fight to the death. That right there makes things less likely to end in player death.

Then, if they really want to kill it, they have to track it, plan for it, set up an ambush, etc. It becomes a memorable, recurring villain almost. Have local towns tell tales about it, and revere anyone who ends the wicked reign of That Damn King Crab.

[BWR]

That Damned Crab? (http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/l5r/images/3/3b/Hida_Kozan.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20110904161842)

Anyway, there's nothing at all wrong with throwing unfair or even impossible encounters at your players so long as they are given plenty of hints it is dangerous (though this may cause a misunderstanding; "going there is certain death" can mean either "intended plot hook for PCs" or "GM's telling you to back off") and they choose to venture into danger rather than having no chance to avoid it.

[Zaq]

Don't forget that part of what makes That Damn Crab so lethal is the fact that its tactics section explicitly says that it grabs two people and then retreats underwater, isolating itself from the main party and usually drowning its grabbed victims in the process. That Damn Crab isn't likely to result in a TPK, but it IS likely to take down two PCs. If you're significantly altering that aspect of its tactics, that might make it more or less lethal.

It's still pretty damn lethal from the numbers alone, but it's the tactics that really put it completely over the top.

[Firechanter]

Of course you can use That Damn Crab, just not as CR3 Encounter. If I remember correctly, the numbers add up quite precisely to CR7 (according to that CR calculation formula that circulates on the net).

[Coidzor]

That Damned Crab? (http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/l5r/images/3/3b/Hida_Kozan.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20110904161842)

Anyway, there's nothing at all wrong with throwing unfair or even impossible encounters at your players so long as they are given plenty of hints it is dangerous (though this may cause a misunderstanding; "going there is certain death" can mean either "intended plot hook for PCs" or "GM's telling you to back off") and they choose to venture into danger rather than having no chance to avoid it.

I mean, a GM could be using it incorrectly to tell the party to back off by saying it IC instead of OOC, but just because people make an error with some amount of regularity doesn't suddenly make "teh" an acceptable alternative spelling of "the" after all.

[Doctor Awkward]

The biggest problems with that thing are a) it can outrun a typical 3rd level party, so once it sees you someone is dead, b) it's AC is somewhat higher than you would expect, c) it's immune to mind-affecting, which at level 3 is the go-to solution for a walking bloat of hit points with good AC, and d) it only needs to hit you once to kill you, and can do so at the end of a 90 foot charge. I'm not even talking about the drowning, I mean the raw damage from claw and constrict.

As a DM, I'd never sic that on a 3rd level party in a normal game.
However, if your table is sufficiently power-gamey, likes to play borderline TO concepts, enjoys the mechanical aspect of the game more than the storytelling, and wants something to really sink their teeth into it might be worth a shot. Just coming up with a solution and rolling the dice to see if it works could be an evening well spent.

[Sith_Happens]

Would it be wrong of me as a DM to have my party come across That Damn Crab wearing a chest overflowing with gold on its head?
I do understand that That Damn Crab is a terror and should be avoided, but i enjoy baiting by players to their deaths with promises of loot. And sometimes they trick me and get away with all the treasure I baited them with.

DO IT. And tell us how it turns out.:smallwink:

[Afgncaap5]

Any chance that this suggested crab might be pining for a crown (http://zork.wikia.com/wiki/Discipline_Crab)?

[Metahuman1]

If it's in a River, chasing it for a round or two should at least be possible after it submerges on grounds of "Well, that caught it by surprise.". Also, consider that if it's taking damage, while it MIGHT keep the 1-2 players it get's it's hooks into, it's entirely viable that it will just ditch the rest of the party having gotten a meal and not wanting to risk further injury.

[Blackhawk748]

I sicked a Half Troll That Damned Crab on a party of 3 5th lvl characters, one died right before the crab did. Honestly it was a great boss fight and they could have killed it before it got them, just luck wasnt on the beatstick's side. They also went in buffed to the Nine Hells, so that may have helped.

6 lvl 3s on the other hand dont have as great of odds, though if you have a prepared caster who has glitterdust its not as awful. A druid with entangle can let you GTFO too.

Basically if the party knows its there they could probably prep for it, everyone gets a potion of blur, the beatsticks chug some bulls strength things like that.

[Metahuman1]

Actually, that's something I hadn't through of. If they can go back to town, buy some potions, rest and prepare spells, this should be a totally doable fight if they think it through and you don't just tell them when they get back that the Crabs gone now.



Edit: Though yes, I would advise having a skeleton in +1 Plate Armor with a +1 Greatsword right there with it to give the hint.

[Maglubiyet]

I would fight that thing just to eat it! Crab meat is the best.