Homebrewed Race: Making This Balanced?

[Wolfiee]

Hey there everyone!

Currently I'm in the process of making a race. It's a kind of demon/devil runt (Known as a Gorebrood) that has a nice set of skills, languages, and utility-type features. Just wondering if I could have some input as to how to balance this out/make it more to my liking. I'm thinking combat disadvantages (maybe?) and perhaps maybe some additional bonuses... Let me know what you guys think of it.

Ability Score Increase. Your Charisma score increases by 2, and both your Intelligence and Wisdom scores increase by 1.
Age. Gorebrood reach maturity around 10 and live to around 50.
Alignment. Gorebrood have an innate tendency towards Chaotic Evil.
Size. Your size is medium.
Speed. Your base walking speed is 30 feet.
Terrifying Image. You gain proficiency in Intimidation.
Strange Inheritance. You know the Thaumaturgy cantrip.
Tormented Mind. Many of your thoughts are distressing and intrusive. As a result, a creature attempting to read your thoughts, unless you willingly allow it to, must make a wisdom check. The DC for this check is 8+Cha+Prof.
Languages. You can speak, read and write Common and Abyssal.

[eastmabl]

Hey there everyone!

Currently I'm in the process of making a race. It's a kind of demon/devil runt (Known as a Gorebrood) that has a nice set of skills, languages, and utility-type features. Just wondering if I could have some input as to how to balance this out/make it more to my liking. I'm thinking combat disadvantages (maybe?) and perhaps maybe some additional bonuses... Let me know what you guys think of it.

Ability Score Increase. Your Charisma score increases by 2 and two other ability scores of your choice increase by 1.
Age. Gorebrood reach maturity around 10 and live to around 50.
Alignment. Gorebrood have an innate tendency towards Chaotic Evil.
Size. Your size is medium.
Speed. Your base walking speed is 30 feet.
Skill Versatility. You gain proficiency in two skills of your choice.
Superior Darkvision. You have superior darkvision up to 120ft.
Sunlight Sensitivity. You have disadvantage on attack rolls and on Wisdom (Perception) checks that rely on sight when you, the target of your attack, or whatever you are trying to perceive is in direct sunlight.
Languages. You can speak, read and write Common, Infernal and Abyssal.

I would suggest settling on Infernal or Abyssal for two reasons - first, no other race gets more than two languages, and second, infernal and abyssal derive from different planes entirely (devils: hell, demons: the abyss).

From their innate tendency toward CE, it would seem that they are more likely demonic.

[calebrus]

So it's an Half-elf with sunlight sensitivity and increased darkvision.
Why is it, exactly, that this needs to be a different race? It is quite literally a refluffed Half-elf with the tiniest miniscule change beyond that. I don't want to sound mean here, but I honestly don't see the point.

[Wolfiee]

I would suggest settling on Infernal or Abyssal for two reasons - first, no other race gets more than two languages, and second, infernal and abyssal derive from different planes entirely (devils: hell, demons: the abyss).

From their innate tendency toward CE, it would seem that they are more likely demonic.

What of the Half-Elves? I suppose they get to choose their third one. I guess I was looking at both because of their Demon/Devil parentage, but I must agree with you that they do feel more demonic. Thanks for the feedback.

[Wolfiee]

So it's an Half-elf with sunlight sensitivity and increased darkvision.
Why is it, exactly, that this needs to be a different race? It is quite literally a refluffed Half-elf with the tiniest miniscule change beyond that. I don't want to sound mean here, but I honestly don't see the point.

Oh goodness, thankyou for picking me up on that, bit silly of me, I copied across the old description without looking over it, I'll fix up the original post.

[burninatortrog]

Using an existing race as a starting point for homebrew is perfectly acceptable and even recommended. It seems perfectly balanced as-is, I wouldn't recommend adding anything unless you have a flavor-based reason to do so.

[Wolfiee]

Updated the original post with the more recent information, aswell as a few additions. Let me know what you guys think.

[calebrus]

Let me know what you guys think.

I think it went from a slightly underpowered pseudo-half-elf clone, to being Way OP. With the possibility of raising that Way OP to an impressive Ridiculously OP depending on what mutations exist.

Assign specific stats for the +1s.
Drop the mutations completely.
Change the DC of Tormented Mind to something more reasonable than "impossible to succeed by 16th level." Except for a bard, for whom it becomes impossible at 19th level. It's not unlikely at those levels mind you, but quite literally impossible.
If you do something similar to these things, it will look decent.

[Wolfiee]

I think it went from a slightly underpowered pseudo-half-elf clone, to being Way OP. With the possibility of rising that Way OP to an impressive Ridiculously OP depending on what mutations exist.
Drop the mutations completely, and change the DC of Tormented Mind to something more reasonable than "nearly impossible as you get higher level" and it will look decent.

It is true that the DC would become 30 by level 20, making it as you say, nearly impossible as you get to a higher level. What would you consider to be a better DC for this? As is, most of the mutations seem to be fairly niche (Although Devil's Sight is well known for abuse, making it less nice). I'm still trying to figure out some disadvantages to balance things out, outright removing the mutations might make it less stand-out than the other races, would you suggest anything in replacement of this? Thanks for your thoughts on it so far :smallsmile:

[calebrus]

It is true that the DC would become 30 by level 20, making it as you say, nearly impossible as you get to a higher level. What would you consider to be a better DC for this? As is, most of the mutations seem to be fairly niche (Although Devil's Sight is well known for abuse, making it less nice). I'm still trying to figure out some disadvantages to balance things out, outright removing the mutations might make it less stand-out than the other races, would you suggest anything in replacement of this? Thanks for your thoughts on it so far :smallsmile:

Less stand out than other races?
As is, even dropping the DC to 8+Cha+Prof (like practically every other save in the game) it's still the best race available.
+2 to a great stat,
+1 to two stats of choice,
Two extra skill proficiencies,
Two extra languages,
A cantrip,
What basically amounts to immunity to mind reading,
And FIVE MORE undetermined abilities of some sort.

You may as well name this race God. It need to be cut down, and I mean a LOT.

Here's what I see as being needed:
+2 to a great stat, Cha, fine
+1 to two stats of choice, these need to be specific, and it really should only be one
Two extra skill proficiencies, fine
Two extra languages, Pick one
A cantrip, Meh, fine
What basically amounts to immunity to mind reading, DC 8+Cha+Prof, and make it a specific Wisdom (whatever) check so that proficiency applies to the attacker rather than a strict Wis check.
And FIVE MORE undetermined abilities of some sort. Drop this completely

[Wolfiee]

Less stand out than other races?
As is, even dropping the DC to 8+Cha+Prof (like practically every other save in the game) it's still the best race available.
+2 to a great stat,
+1 to two stats of choice,
Two extra skill proficiencies,
Two extra languages,
A cantrip,
What basically amounts to immunity to mind reading,
And FIVE MORE undetermined abilities of some sort.

You may as well name this race God. It need to be cut down, and I mean a LOT.

Here's what I see as being needed:
+2 to a great stat, Cha, fine
+1 to two stats of choice, these need to be specific, and it really should only be one
Two extra skill proficiencies, fine
Two extra languages, Pick one
A cantrip, Meh, fine
What basically amounts to immunity to mind reading, DC 8+Cha+Prof, and make it a specific Wisdom (whatever) check so that proficiency applies to the attacker rather than a strict Wis check.
And FIVE MORE undetermined abilities of some sort. Drop this completely

As suggested, things have been toned down, perhaps mutations will just become some cosmetic fluff. Something still really seems to be missing though, hmm.

[Ghost Nappa]

Hey there everyone!

Currently I'm in the process of making a race. It's a kind of demon/devil runt (Known as a Gorebrood) that has a nice set of skills, languages, and utility-type features. Just wondering if I could have some input as to how to balance this out/make it more to my liking. I'm thinking combat disadvantages (maybe?) and perhaps maybe some additional bonuses... Let me know what you guys think of it.

Ability Score Increase. Your Charisma score increases by 2, and both your Intelligence and Wisdom scores increase by 1.
Age. Gorebrood reach maturity around 10 and live to around 50.
Alignment. Gorebrood have an innate tendency towards Chaotic Evil.
Size. Your size is medium.
Speed. Your base walking speed is 30 feet.
Terrifying Image. You gain proficiency in Intimidation.
Strange Inheritance. You know the Thaumaturgy cantrip.
Tormented Mind. Many of your thoughts are distressing and intrusive. As a result, a creature attempting to read your thoughts, unless you willingly allow it to, must make a wisdom check. The DC for this check is 8+Cha+Prof.
Languages. You can speak, read and write Common and Abyssal.

ASI: A bit stronger than most other races but most people don't want +Cha AND +Int so fine.
Age: Sure
Alignment: Demonic Heritage, fine. I would specify how hard it is for Gorebloods to break away from CE.
Size: No problems.
Speed: No problems.
Terrifying Image: Comparable to Half-Orc
Strange Inheritance: Sure.
Tormented Mind. Okay. This needs to be fixed. "...a creature attempting to read your thoughts....must make a wisdom check." ....Or else...what? They die? Explode? Get set on fire? Require aspirin? I would also specify that you cannot willingly allow someone to bypass this check while you're unconscious.
Languages: Fine.

I think it's fine as is, but you need to nail down what Tormented Mind means and what it does. It's unclear why the check is there and what it means if you fail.

If you can, I would try seeing if you can re-work this to be a "Tiefling sub-race" somehow.

[noce]

Tormented Mind. Okay. This needs to be fixed. "...a creature attempting to read your thoughts....must make a wisdom check." ....Or else...what? They die? Explode? Get set on fire? Require aspirin?

I think he means you have to make a wisdom check in order to be able to read his mind, otherwise you simply fail.
This could better be a wisdom(insight) check, so guys proficient with the skill can succeed more esily.

[eleazzaar]

Ability Score Increase. Your Charisma score increases by 2, and both your Intelligence and Wisdom scores increase by 1.
Age. Gorebrood reach maturity around 10 and live to around 50.
Alignment. Gorebrood have an innate tendency towards Chaotic Evil.
Size. Your size is medium.
Speed. Your base walking speed is 30 feet.
Terrifying Image. You gain proficiency in Intimidation.
Strange Inheritance. You know the Thaumaturgy cantrip.
Tormented Mind. Many of your thoughts are distressing and intrusive. As a result, a creature attempting to read your thoughts, unless you willingly allow it to, must make a wisdom check. The DC for this check is 8+Cha+Prof.
Languages. You can speak, read and write Common and Abyssal.

As it is now, i think it is weaker than average.

It is true few races get a +2 and two +1s to attributes, but very few builds (that i can think of) will need high scores in all 3 mental stats. Tormented mind is highly situational, and a cantrip and a proficiency are nice but not major.

More to the point, features it gets seem rather random. I'm not getting a clear idea of what sort of creature would have this collection of features.

[ImSAMazing]

I think that +1 wis and +1 intelligence is to much. Maybe make 2 subraces, devilchild and demonchild, one gives you the language Infernal, the other one Abbyssal(coming back on 1 of the first feedback replies) and one gives +1 int, one +1 wisdom. Both is just to OP,

[Gritmonger]

I think that +1 wis and +1 intelligence is to much. Maybe make 2 subraces, devilchild and demonchild, one gives you the language Infernal, the other one Abbyssal(coming back on 1 of the first feedback replies) and one gives +1 int, one +1 wisdom. Both is just to OP,

This seems like a viable option, and might allow further customization

Maybe it would make sense thematically to consider the disposition of each:

If both get Cha, then if one gets Wis, it should probably get Thaumaturgy, while if one gets Int it could get Prestidigitation.

Consider "Devil" ancestry at Int + 1, "Demon" ancestry at Wis + 1
"Devil" could get "Beguiling Grin" - Proficiency in Persuasion, "Demon" could get "Menacing Grin" - Proficiency in Intimidation

Random thoughts at 5 am.

[Wolfiee]

I think that +1 wis and +1 intelligence is to much. Maybe make 2 subraces, devilchild and demonchild, one gives you the language Infernal, the other one Abbyssal(coming back on 1 of the first feedback replies) and one gives +1 int, one +1 wisdom. Both is just to OP,


This seems like a viable option, and might allow further customization

Maybe it would make sense thematically to consider the disposition of each:

If both get Cha, then if one gets Wis, it should probably get Thaumaturgy, while if one gets Int it could get Prestidigitation.

Consider "Devil" ancestry at Int + 1, "Demon" ancestry at Wis + 1
"Devil" could get "Beguiling Grin" - Proficiency in Persuasion, "Demon" could get "Menacing Grin" - Proficiency in Intimidation

Random thoughts at 5 am.

Now this, this sounds brilliant. I really like do quite like this, thankyou both, I really appreciate it :smallsmile:

[ImSAMazing]

Now this, this sounds brilliant. I really like do quite like this, thankyou both, I really appreciate it :smallsmile:

No problem! If we all help each other, we all get better. I really like the idea of the race, and if you add in the features me and that other guy mentioned, I will play that race a few times! I also made a race, can you provide feedback on that one? LINK (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?412743-Custom-DnD-5th-Edition-Race-The-Wightling&p=19191192#post19191192)