Portable Puzzle and Dragons 12: Extreme Puzzle Rush (Legend+) [Archive]

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obryn

2015-05-06, 12:12 PM

Welcome to the Playground's Eleventth(!) TWELFTH(!!) iteration thread for the popular mobile app game, Puzzle & Dragons!
(Previous thread is here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?403346-Puzzle-and-Dragons-11-Romancing-the-Stone).)

Here we gather to discuss, praise, complain about, and generally just natter on for this fun and addictive app game.

The first step is to point all new players to one of the beginners' guides.

The Beginner's Guide on the padWiki (http://padwiki.net/wiki/New_Players%27_Guide") is one; I operate there, so give me a heads up if you're finding errors! It can lag behind the news at times, but it's nice, friendly, honest, and clear.
There is also the very comprehensive Padherder New Player Guide], which is usually more current. (http://guide.padherder.com/New_Player_Guide)

We also have a linked guide to using row enhancement awoken skills! (http://puzzleanddragonsforum.com/showthread.php?tid=21741)

What is Puzzle & Dragons?

A Free-to-Play match-three game with surprising depth! The puzzle occupies the lower half of the screen, and the combinations you form power your team on the upper half of the screen in battle. Part pokemon, part bejeweled, part M:tG, all crack, this game is easy to learn, difficult to master and very well put together. Unlike many games of this kind, it defies genre by going for both depth and complexity while maintaining ease of pick up.

What, seriously?

Yup! While at it's surface, the game is basically any other puzzle game ever, the math behind damage output, the dungeon design, the team composition component and metagame, and the uniquely free-wheeling capacity of the puzzle make Puzzle and Dragons a stand-out despite it's terrible app graphic. It has surprisingly deep and fulfilling long-term play (at the moment, I've been playing for over 600 days), and new content comes out regularly.

So what do I need to know to get started?

First, the game itself! PAD, P&D or puzzle and dragons should all be sufficient searches to download it. It operates on Android and iOS devices, with mixed results on running it elsewhere.
Second, the beginner's guides will help a lot. You start out with one fast freebie pull on the game's real lure, the Rare Egg Machine, and a good pull here can save you a lot of frustration and also make the game much more fun. It's suggested that after you run the game a bit and get comfortable playing it, you "reroll" by uninstalling and reinstalling the application. Then you run through the tutorial again and do the free pull again, repeating until you snag a keeper (http://guide.padherder.com/Reroll_Tier_List). This is not half as bad as it sounds; it's pretty brainless, and goes by pretty quickly. If you can time your re-rolling to line up with a biweekly Godfest, you can save yourself even more frustration!
Third, friends. Good friends with compatible Leader skills are critical. When you enter a dungeon, you can bring a friend's leader with you as a member of your team; their leader skill operates alongside your own. We have a lot of great, experienced players here, with a lot of solid leaders. We can carry you when your own leader can't. Managing your leader and picking the right friend's leader is a critical part of the metagame. The GitP list is at the bottom of this thread; feel free to send any of us requests. If you have something like "@GitP" in your username, we'll know you're from this forum, and will accept your friend requests more readily!
Fourth, be stingy with stones! Magic stones are the in-app-purchase (IAP) resource, and while you get them for free pretty quickly early on, and even more on a regular basis, you'll regret being too free with their use early on. The four rules of magic stones are (1) Never pull the gold dragon Rare Egg Machine outside of a godfest; (2) You should have two monster boxes for every rank you have, and spending stones to Increase Capacity is almost never a bad idea; (3) It's generally not worth a stone to continue in a dungeon or refill your stamina until you have at least 100 stamina, and (4) No, really, don't pull the REM outside of a godfest, seriously.

As a closing note, Puzzle & Dragons is an immensely popular game, and there are a ton of fan-run sites for information. Most of them stay fairly up-to-date, so just go with what you prefer.

The PAD Wiki (http://www.padwiki.net) is volunteer-run, and can get out-of-date, but I think it has the friendliest format for finding information. It also has a ton of great guides and advice.
PuzzleDragonX (http://www.puzzledragonx.com) is generally the best-updated site out there, with the most current news and most complete data. It's the community's go-to resource for data, but doesn't have much in the way of advice.
PADHerder (https://www.padherder.com/) is a tool to track and manage your monster box, with some neat automated ways to update. It also has some good information pages.
PADGuide (Android (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.dnt7.padguide&hl=en) / iPhone (https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/padguide-all-about-puzzle/id651949209?mt=8)) is an awesome app which keeps very current with all data and can even alert you to Urgent! dungeons. (HIGHLY recommended; I can't live without it.)
The Puzzle and Dragons Forum (http://www.puzzleanddragonsforum.com/) is dedicated to PAD and has some pretty good (and some very old) guides.
The PAD Global (https://www.facebook.com/groups/PADGlobal/) Facebook group is for talking about PAD stuff on ... well, Facebook. It's a solid way to get more compatible friends, too, but it's not always nice to newbies.

If you want to be updated/added, post your leads (up to two each) that you use for descends and for farming. A PadHerder can be included as well.

User
In-Game ID
Descended! Leads
Farming Leads

Obryn
dwarfSA@PG
357,549,260
http://i57.tinypic.com/eq8j5x.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Pure_Light_Sun_Deity_Ra)
http://oi62.tinypic.com/2uufa.jpg (pad.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian_of_the_Sacred_City,_Athena)

Diego Havoc
Diego@GitP
376,879,256
http://i60.tinypic.com/axy8ie.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flying_General%2C_Lu_Bu)
http://oi62.tinypic.com/2uufa.jpg (pad.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian_of_the_Sacred_City,_Athena)

Starwulf (https://www.padherder.com/user/starwulf99/monsters/)
Starwulf
319,762,282
http://i60.tinypic.com/34h7xpi.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Keeper_of_the_Sacred_Texts%2C_Metatron)
http://i60.tinypic.com/34h7xpi.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Keeper_of_the_Sacred_Texts%2C_Metatron)

SiuiS
SiuiS@GitP
307,676,270
http://i60.tinypic.com/34h7xpi.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Keeper_of_the_Sacred_Texts%2C_Metatron)
http://i60.tinypic.com/34h7xpi.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Keeper_of_the_Sacred_Texts%2C_Metatron)

Jasmine (https://www.padherder.com/user/Jasmine/monsters/)
Jasmine
301,790,222
http://i61.tinypic.com/157budc.png (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Blazing_Deity_Falcon%2C_Horus)http://i59.tinypic.com/2uyhwcx.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Kirin_of_the_Sacred_Gleam%2C_Sakuya)

http://i60.tinypic.com/o7m81c.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Goemon%2C_the_Thief)http://oi62.tinypic.com/2uufa.jpg (pad.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian_of_the_Sacred_City,_Athena)

Academia (https://www.padherder.com/user/Academia/monsters/)
Aca@GitP
350,076,269
http://i59.tinypic.com/2uyhwcx.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Kirin_of_the_Sacred_Gleam%2C_Sakuya)http://i59.tinypic.com/14v7i1h.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Norn_of_the_Present%2C_Verdandi)
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)http://i60.tinypic.com/33a5s07.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Goddess_of_the_Bleak_Night%2C_Pandora)

Aramul
Aram@GitP
314,795,270
http://i57.tinypic.com/9u4y0y.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flowers%2C_Da_Qiao_%26_Xiao_Qiao)
http://i57.tinypic.com/9u4y0y.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flowers%2C_Da_Qiao_%26_Xiao_Qiao)

Leviticus (https://www.padherder.com/user/Levictus/monsters/)
Levi@GitP
367,459,299
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)
http://oi62.tinypic.com/2uufa.jpg (pad.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian_of_the_Sacred_City,_Athena)

Erloas (https://www.padherder.com/user/erloas/monsters/)
ErloasGitP
325,699,229

LoraesGitP
395,991,230
http://i61.tinypic.com/157budc.png (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Blazing_Deity_Falcon%2C_Horus)
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)http://oi62.tinypic.com/2uufa.jpg (pad.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian_of_the_Sacred_City,_Athena)

Kauai (https://www.padherder.com/user/kauai/monsters/)
Kauai@gitp
364,995,253
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)
http://oi62.tinypic.com/2uufa.jpg (pad.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian_of_the_Sacred_City,_Athena)

Tyckspoon
Tyck@GitP
305,397,237
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)

Blade7
Blade@GitP
387,372,268
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)

Klaatu B. Nikto
KBN@GitP
336,576,284
http://i59.tinypic.com/jp9b45.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Banishing_Claw_Byakko%2C_Haku)
http://i59.tinypic.com/jp9b45.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Banishing_Claw_Byakko%2C_Haku)

137ben
Snes4@GitP
336,616,397
http://i57.tinypic.com/9u4y0y.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flowers%2C_Da_Qiao_%26_Xiao_Qiao)
http://i57.tinypic.com/9u4y0y.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flowers%2C_Da_Qiao_%26_Xiao_Qiao)

Otravyat (https://www.padherder.com/user/Otravyat/monsters/)
Otra@GitP
329,820,344
http://i60.tinypic.com/2dh7fp4.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Wardens%2C_Umisachi%26Yamasachi)
http://oi62.tinypic.com/2uufa.jpg (pad.wikia.com/wiki/Guardian_of_the_Sacred_City,_Athena)

Fax Celestis (https://www.padherder.com/user/faxcelestis/monsters/)
Fax@GitP
372,092,294
http://i62.tinypic.com/107nsyc.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flower_Suzaku%2C_Leilan)
http://i62.tinypic.com/23r0cn8.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Endless_Blue_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)

Soepvork (https://www.padherder.com/user/soepvork/monsters/)
Soepv@GitP
333,581,245
http://i61.tinypic.com/157budc.png (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Blazing_Deity_Falcon%2C_Horus)
http://i60.tinypic.com/axy8ie.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flying_General%2C_Lu_Bu)http://i57.tinypic.com/9u4y0y.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flowers%2C_Da_Qiao_%26_Xiao_Qiao)

Sallera (https://www.padherder.com/user/Sallera/monsters/)
Sallera
307,636,315

Kiminosei
373,137,360
http://i57.tinypic.com/289vrj9.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Genius_Sleeping_Dragon%2C_Zhuge_Liang)http://i60.tinypic.com/2dh7fp4.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Wardens%2C_Umisachi%26Yamasachi)
http://i59.tinypic.com/2i064n6.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Iwato%27s_Dancing_Goddess%2C_Amenouzume)http://i57.tinypic.com/9u4y0y.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flowers%2C_Da_Qiao_%26_Xiao_Qiao)

Quietus (https://www.padherder.com/user/Quietus/monsters/)
Quietus
392,538,393
http://i62.tinypic.com/nxnuky.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Shining_Goddess_of_Secrets,_Kali)http://i57.tinypic.com/289vrj9.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Genius_Sleeping_Dragon%2C_Zhuge_Liang)
http://i60.tinypic.com/axy8ie.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Divine_Flying_General%2C_Lu_Bu)http://i62.tinypic.com/23r0cn8.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Endless_Blue_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)

Baka Nikujaga
Baka
346,216,306
http://i62.tinypic.com/35k3ogg.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Devoted_Miko_Goddess%2C_Kushinadahime)
http://i62.tinypic.com/35k3ogg.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Devoted_Miko_Goddess%2C_Kushinadahime)

Flare'90
Flare@Gitp
325,249,325
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)
http://i61.tinypic.com/2v33fvr.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Marvelous_Red_Dragon_Caller%2C_Sonia)

Anarion (http://www.padherder.com/user/Anarion/monsters/)
Anar@gitp
365,764,335
http://s16.postimg.org/8soipzjgx/1335i.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Creator_God,_Vishnu)
http://s16.postimg.org/8soipzjgx/1335i.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Creator_God,_Vishnu)

firedaemon33
Firedaemon
380,663,332
http://i60.tinypic.com/34h7xpi.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Keeper_of_the_Sacred_Texts%2C_Metatron)
http://i60.tinypic.com/34h7xpi.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Keeper_of_the_Sacred_Texts%2C_Metatron)

Meta
iNuzzle@/r
388,412,339
http://i59.tinypic.com/14v7i1h.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Norn_of_the_Present%2C_Verdandi)
http://i59.tinypic.com/14v7i1h.jpg (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Norn_of_the_Present%2C_Verdandi)

Credits to everyone who's ever contributed to the OP. :smallbiggrin:

obryn

2015-05-06, 12:14 PM

So man... I forgot how much of a grind Zeus Vulcan can be. Echidna came out to play three times - Meteor Volcanic Dragon, Hera-Ur, and the boss man himself. Susano saved my bacon once, DKali twice... Nothing is worse than 10% jammer drops when you're running LL Ra, guys.

But. Victory. Woot.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-06, 01:44 PM

I'm trying to push through Zeus Dios myself. That first wave is brutal.

Quietus

2015-05-06, 01:48 PM

I'm trying to push through Zeus Dios myself. That first wave is brutal.

It really is. And it doesn't help that there's an 11k damage preemptive on the following floor.. I think the first time I did Zeus-Dios it was with my devils, but I had to blow a Haku active and wipe the first floor immediately, then do all my stalling on Archangel.

The thing occupying my thoughts right now is what to aim for on my tablet, for quick KoG running. The REM gave me GZL and Avalon Drake, I'm thinking of mixing them with Athena. Not sure whether to lead with GZL or Athena though... leaning GZL for power, but that takes away some of the mindlessness that Athena provides. I also need more Green or Light Attackers to make GZL more worthwhile.

Klaatu B. Nikto

2015-05-06, 02:28 PM

Otravyat

2015-05-06, 02:39 PM

It really is. And it doesn't help that there's an 11k damage preemptive on the following floor.. I think the first time I did Zeus-Dios it was with my devils, but I had to blow a Haku active and wipe the first floor immediately, then do all my stalling on Archangel.

The thing occupying my thoughts right now is what to aim for on my tablet, for quick KoG running. The REM gave me GZL and Avalon Drake, I'm thinking of mixing them with Athena. Not sure whether to lead with GZL or Athena though... leaning GZL for power, but that takes away some of the mindlessness that Athena provides. I also need more Green or Light Attackers to make GZL more worthwhile.

I view GZL as a better Athena sub than the other way around, but that is just me. Athena has plenty of power and the eventual HP boost is nice. Avalon drake is a nice pickup for either team, although with rows instead of TPA.

Dios is full of preemptives, I always find that to the toughest part of it. Luckily it is substantially easier than Vulcan or Mercury overall. I have the first three down, and will take down Mercury sometime soon (in theory). Not sure I can handle the Rush though.

obryn

2015-05-06, 02:50 PM

So I'm trying Burning God, Set as a lead. Suggestions on the rest of his entourage?
Speaking generally rather than specifically... Your first goal is to cover Blue, Light, and Dark at least in a subtype. You don't want to be locked out of any color to activate his leader skill. Your second goal is to have as many monsters with Red in their attributes as possible.

Desirable active skills are similar to what you'd want for DQXQ, since they're very similar gods. I like to focus on Actives that work well for Defense (Delay, Damage reduction) and maximizing leader skills (Orb shuffles). Heartbreakers, Riders, and other orb-shifters are fine; just be aware that they might neutralize your Leader skill if you aren't careful.

As for awoken skills, it's the same list as usual. You want some Extend Time and Skill Boosts. Prongs are nice, too, and not too hard with such an easy leader skill. With 3 more fire +orbs awoken skills, every red orb will get a + and it's effectively like having an extra prong on every sub.

Erloas

2015-05-06, 03:00 PM

I tried Zeus Vulcan again and once again got hick-kicked to death by Hera-Ur. Not sure what I would want to try to slot in there to fix that. I almost got past her though, hit one smaller combo and stayed above 70% then tried to do one big hit to take the charge up turn but left her closer to 30% than 25% so she got me.
Only good options I have are Kush and a golem. I don't think Kush is long enough, still will be hard to get past, but the golems don't do much else for me other than that. Also no idea who I would switch either of them for. I really wish I had Indra (instead of 2 Vitras), or Susano (only JP1 god I have is Yomi, which I have 2 of).

Did Medjedra again today too and once again she (I think?) didn't drop.

Jasmine

2015-05-06, 03:20 PM

So I'm trying Burning God, Set as a lead. Suggestions on the rest of his entourage?

I could see about gathering his nephew's entourage from PAD wikia and I think Jasmine went quite a ways with Uber Chicken and a rainbow of dubs. Trying to get out of my comfort zone (Grodin) and work on my orbing skills.

My PAD Herder is more or less up to date.
I was going to suggest working toward Echi/GigasOrRedGolemOrChristmas Hera/Herais/Heraur, but after looking at your box (wow!) you can go Echi/RedValk/Blodin/DinoRiderOrAwokenHino instead.

Of course, Echi, GreenDub, Bluedub, RK is usable up to Ocean of Heaven, but I think you're past that stage.

PS: Obryn, take the friends list from the 2nd post in the last thread - Aca wasn't really updating it very often.

Meta

2015-05-06, 04:24 PM

If you'd like to add me to the list, I'm iNuzzle@/r and my ID is 388,412,339. I&I and Verdandi are the usual two up, but I can swap in different things if requested.

Jasmine

2015-05-06, 04:38 PM

If you'd like to add me to the list, I'm iNuzzle@/r and my ID is 388,412,339. I&I and Verdandi are the usual two up, but I can swap in different things if requested.
You're actually in the updated version, although I only have you down for Verdandi. I'm too lazy to configure an I&I image link so I'll let Obryn do it :smalltongue:

Huh, fantastic drops in God rush - picked Gaia, Dios, Beelz, and Zeus. Pretty easy run considering I have an extra +297 compared to last time, though it still took a while cause they keep doing dark->jammers.

Otravyat

2015-05-06, 06:16 PM

You're actually in the updated version, although I only have you down for Verdandi. I'm too lazy to configure an I&I image link so I'll let Obryn do it :smalltongue:

Huh, fantastic drops in God rush - picked Gaia, Dios, Beelz, and Zeus. Pretty easy run considering I have an extra +297 compared to last time, though it still took a while cause they keep doing dark->jammers.

Running AHades, right?

Jasmine

2015-05-06, 06:35 PM

Running AHades, right?
Yeah, AHades(hyper), Beelz(MS, +213), Herais (hyper), Haku (SL2, +0), Rodin (unskilled, +0). Rodin is for fatty invade.

Anarion

2015-05-06, 06:56 PM

Grotteschi

2015-05-06, 08:56 PM

I accidentally medjedra and now will have TAMadRA.

Speaking generally rather than specifically... Your first goal is to cover Blue, Light, and Dark at least in a subtype. You don't want to be locked out of any color to activate his leader skill. Your second goal is to have as many monsters with Red in their attributes as possible.

Desirable active skills are similar to what you'd want for DQXQ, since they're very similar gods. I like to focus on Actives that work well for Defense (Delay, Damage reduction) and maximizing leader skills (Orb shuffles). Heartbreakers, Riders, and other orb-shifters are fine; just be aware that they might neutralize your Leader skill if you aren't careful.

As for awoken skills, it's the same list as usual. You want some Extend Time and Skill Boosts. Prongs are nice, too, and not too hard with such an easy leader skill. With 3 more fire +orbs awoken skills, every red orb will get a + and it's effectively like having an extra prong on every sub.

This is the sort of breakdown Anarion should have gotten for Ronia.

Meta

2015-05-06, 09:05 PM

My I&I isn't as impressive as my Verdandi (8... more... plus eggs...) so it's not such a loss.

Do you still need help with ronia? I have a little experience. Before I got tired of being unable to read the text, and my lady friend played out all of PADW, I rolled 4 ronias in about 20 REM rolls on a JP account.

Kauai

2015-05-06, 09:56 PM

Feeling like I hit a wall fairly hard at the moment. Can't advance in technicals because I have no water guys of any note, can't clear Mechdragons, Starlight Sanctuary or Sleepless castle, so I'm basically just running daily stuff for materials and technicals for penguins. I'm hoping my current fire team is enough once I level everything to start making a run at some of these things because I don't see a reasonable way to get anything more without buying stones to pull the REM again (though I do have several challenges left, so at least 3-4 REM pulls if I get that all done).

Sorry, had to dig around to find the link to your PADHerder. I agree with Aca's previous advice re: building an Urd team. I'm a major Ronia player, but unfortunately you're just a bit short on subs for her right now. Tough part is the team cost though. Cost considerations aside and going purely with what you have in your PADHerder, a team to try would be Urd bookends with Ronia/Cao Cao/Uriel/Phoenix Knight. Echidna would be a great sub but you don't have her yet (or at least it's not listed). The major strength of Urd is her fire multiplier (I'm not even looking at the water multipliers; might be worth considering), and each of these subs are orb changers. If you can get these monsters skilled, I think it would make a pretty decent team. Gigas can fit in there as a heartbreaker, probably replacing Phoenix Knight. I'm thinking replacing PK because Ronia is full board shift (though relatively high cooldown; on second thought she might be one to consider replacing given that PK when fully skilled has a 5 turn CD), Cao Cao gives you a delay plus blue>red conversion (9 turn CD at max skill), and Uriel serves as light>red conversion plus heartmaker (8 turn CD at max skill). Uriel also adds some badly-needed RCV for this lineup (pretty much all of your RCV will come from the Urd leaders and Uriel; echidna as well once you get her). If you left both PK and Gigas in, they are 5 turn CD orbchangers which is nice.

So all things considered... for the short term I guess I'd go Urd bookends with Cao Cao/Uriel/Gigas/PK, which is a team cost of 124 and is a team you can field if you still are at the rank indicated in your PADHerder. (Sticking Ronia in there will blow your team cost out of the water.) You definitely will need skillups though before this team can tackle the hard stuff, and getting the awakenings currently available to you will help as well. The beauty of Urd is that you have a lot of flexibility for her subs. Pretty much anything red is a go. For Ronia, you need row enhances which you currently lack with the devils you have.

That's what kind of stands out to me when looking at what you've got listed. I'm far from being the smartest person here though, so I'd listen to the others before listening to me. :)

obryn

2015-05-06, 11:36 PM

So with nothing else to spend my stamina on tonight...

http://i.imgur.com/GE3HBnL.jpg

Huh. I have avoided these dungeons because I'm not nearly 297'd enough on these teams.

Otravyat

2015-05-07, 12:41 AM

So with nothing else to spend my stamina on tonight...

http://i.imgur.com/GE3HBnL.jpg

Huh. I have avoided these dungeons because I'm not nearly 297'd enough on these teams.

You say as you clear it. Turns out 49x is a lot of damage. :smallsmile:

Re. Team advice for Anarion. Can you post your Padherder? I don't seem to have you on my friends list there. I can try to give you a bit more advice as well if I see it. I don't really know anything about Urd except stack red and blue subattribute is nice.

Seems like we've lost a couple people. Where's Siuis been?

Anarion

2015-05-07, 04:08 AM

Sorry, had to dig around to find the link to your PADHerder. I agree with Aca's previous advice re: building an Urd team. I'm a major Ronia player, but unfortunately you're just a bit short on subs for her right now. Tough part is the team cost though. Cost considerations aside and going purely with what you have in your PADHerder, a team to try would be Urd bookends with Ronia/Cao Cao/Uriel/Phoenix Knight. Echidna would be a great sub but you don't have her yet (or at least it's not listed). The major strength of Urd is her fire multiplier (I'm not even looking at the water multipliers; might be worth considering), and each of these subs are orb changers. If you can get these monsters skilled, I think it would make a pretty decent team. Gigas can fit in there as a heartbreaker, probably replacing Phoenix Knight. I'm thinking replacing PK because Ronia is full board shift (though relatively high cooldown; on second thought she might be one to consider replacing given that PK when fully skilled has a 5 turn CD), Cao Cao gives you a delay plus blue>red conversion (9 turn CD at max skill), and Uriel serves as light>red conversion plus heartmaker (8 turn CD at max skill). Uriel also adds some badly-needed RCV for this lineup (pretty much all of your RCV will come from the Urd leaders and Uriel; echidna as well once you get her). If you left both PK and Gigas in, they are 5 turn CD orbchangers which is nice.

So all things considered... for the short term I guess I'd go Urd bookends with Cao Cao/Uriel/Gigas/PK, which is a team cost of 124 and is a team you can field if you still are at the rank indicated in your PADHerder. (Sticking Ronia in there will blow your team cost out of the water.) You definitely will need skillups though before this team can tackle the hard stuff, and getting the awakenings currently available to you will help as well. The beauty of Urd is that you have a lot of flexibility for her subs. Pretty much anything red is a go. For Ronia, you need row enhances which you currently lack with the devils you have.

That's what kind of stands out to me when looking at what you've got listed. I'm far from being the smartest person here though, so I'd listen to the others before listening to me. :)

Thanks, that does help. I am working primarily on the Urd team, though I guess I"m surprised to hear that Ronia isn't really good at this point. A lot of the beginner guides floating around talk about her as one of the best pulls to get, only then I couldn't find any info on her.

I haven't updated my padherder, but I finally got an echidna drop today, so I'm starting to work her up. I'm not really sure how to skill up most of my guys though. The only ones I could reasonably do are phoenix knight and echidna, since I can run the Skydragon and Dragon's footprints dungeons consistently enough to try and farm mystic knights and healer girls there, but the drop chance seems pretty low still. I have no clue how to get dragon fruits to skill Urd, minotaurs to skill Uriel (he's at skill level 2 because the single minotaur I got from the pal machine lucked out and skilled him up), or whatever it is that skills Cao Cao.

I'm also still putting some experience into the green team because I like Vishnu and want to eventually use him long-term. And I still want to start working on dark guys for Ronia because I just enjoy making different teams. It feels more rewarding than looking at where I'm at now and doing nothing but grinding penguins, evo mats, and extremely low drop chances.

Re. Team advice for Anarion. Can you post your Padherder? I don't seem to have you on my friends list there. I can try to give you a bit more advice as well if I see it. I don't really know anything about Urd except stack red and blue subattribute is nice.

Seems like we've lost a couple people. Where's Siuis been?

padherder link, not updated to include echidna. (https://www.padherder.com/user/Anarion/monsters/#31,0,31,2047,268435455,0,,0,0,0,eq,0,0,0,0;defaul t,0)

Kauai

2015-05-07, 06:11 AM

Thanks, that does help. I am working primarily on the Urd team, though I guess I"m surprised to hear that Ronia isn't really good at this point. A lot of the beginner guides floating around talk about her as one of the best pulls to get, only then I couldn't find any info on her.

Don't get me wrong, Ronia is awesome (she's my main). She doesn't really shine until you have proper subs for her though, especially when trying the more difficult content. Again, the key to her effectiveness is having row enhance awakenings on the team. Without those, you really lose a lot of her punch.

Glad to hear that you managed to snag an Echidna. She'll come in very handy. That's another one that you'll have to skill up. So going back to the original lineup I described, I'd add her in place of Cao Cao (she delays for 3 rounds instead of Cao Cao's 1). That will give you some badly needed RCV as well. The major challenge for you here without skillups is you'll need to stall. Fully awaken Uriel when you can, as you'll get a skill boost plus the autoheal (useful while stalling). Get at least one more awakening on Urd for another skill boost (tho ideally try and fully awaken her as well). Level up and evo PK when you can, as he has a 2prong which will help you with damage (I think you'll be able to handle the added team cost due to using Echidna instead of CaoCao). With Gigas, I'd keep him in this form for awhile as once you evo him he gets negative RCV. He'll give you 3K HP at max level, which is decent.

Gigas is relatively easy to skill up so try and max him out. Echidna and PK should be within reach too (hopefully their skillup dungeons return soon). Uriel is tough (I still haven't maxed mine), and I think right now trifruits might be a little out of your reach. But these are some short-term goals that should help you progress a bit, at least with what you have in your box right now. Again though, I'm not the smartest person when it comes to this game; it's just what I'm thinking based on what sticks out to me. Otra may have some other opinions once he gets to see your PADHerder.

Feel free to add me if you haven't already, especially if/when you start running Ronia as my hypermaxxed Ronia is almost always up. And if she isn't, I can always put her up for you. (Have my Urd as well, actually. Not max skilled yet, but she's at lvl 90, fully awoken, skill level 4.)

Meta

2015-05-07, 06:14 AM

I think swapping PK for Ronia when you can, assuming no other good monsters obtained between, is a solid idea so I wouldn't put as much effort into skilling him up, as mystic knights can be a bit of a drag on your stamina.

Gigas is very easy to skill up, red samurai goblins have his skill. Uriel is a touch harder, but minotaurs seem to love dropping from PEM and are in a fair few harder dungeons. Cao Cao's skill up fodder is in the Flame Dragon Knight's dungeon and probably the most troublesome of these. But the cutest so there's that.

If you enjoy the Urd team, you could set beating grimoire on legend as a reasonable goal. Theurgia is R/B and will pump your damage and survivability a pretty good amount for a farmable.

Edit: Echidna is probably more stable, and if a boss has no shield, it's non-technical, etc, I'd use Cao Cao and Echidna as long as you can survive one attack.

obryn

2015-05-07, 08:18 AM

You say as you clear it. Turns out 49x is a lot of damage. :smallsmile:
I don't run Ra on Super Legends. (Yet?) :smallsmile:

PS: Obryn, take the friends list from the 2nd post in the last thread - Aca wasn't really updating it very often.
Sounds good - I'll plug it in.

e: And yeah, I miss SiuiS. :smallfrown: Hope she shows back up sometime.

Feel free to add me if you haven't already, especially if/when you start running Ronia as my hypermaxxed Ronia is almost always up. And if she isn't, I can always put her up for you. (Have my Urd as well, actually. Not max skilled yet, but she's at lvl 90, fully awoken, skill level 4.)
Yeah, I use your Ronia a lot when I'm running a Beelzebonia team.

I pulled an Urd last godfest. Leveling her up, but not 100% sure what to do with her yet.

Quietus

2015-05-07, 08:31 AM

I view GZL as a better Athena sub than the other way around, but that is just me. Athena has plenty of power and the eventual HP boost is nice. Avalon drake is a nice pickup for either team, although with rows instead of TPA.

Dios is full of preemptives, I always find that to the toughest part of it. Luckily it is substantially easier than Vulcan or Mercury overall. I have the first three down, and will take down Mercury sometime soon (in theory). Not sure I can handle the Rush though.

Yeah, Avalon Drake's awakenings aren't ideal for a TPA team, and he doesn't benefit from GZL's slime. But he provides an ideal active for a Light/Green heavy team, so he'll keep that spot. I'm going to have to look into what TPA God/Attacker options are out there that are farmable, if I'm going to run Athena main; that's really going to be the rough part. It's something to toy with, I have to be able to get an Athena before I worry about this.

On the Zeus challenge, part of me wants to push and try to complete more of it - I've never managed to beat Mercury or Vulcan, but I know I can take Dios. And the Rush... well. In theory, in a perfect play, GZL could do it. But no plan survives contact with the enemy, so I don't know if I want to bother sinking enough stamina in to do that.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-07, 10:38 AM

Yeah, Avalon Drake's awakenings aren't ideal for a TPA team, and he doesn't benefit from GZL's slime. But he provides an ideal active for a Light/Green heavy team, so he'll keep that spot. I'm going to have to look into what TPA God/Attacker options are out there that are farmable, if I'm going to run Athena main; that's really going to be the rough part. It's something to toy with, I have to be able to get an Athena before I worry about this.

On the Zeus challenge, part of me wants to push and try to complete more of it - I've never managed to beat Mercury or Vulcan, but I know I can take Dios. And the Rush... well. In theory, in a perfect play, GZL could do it. But no plan survives contact with the enemy, so I don't know if I want to bother sinking enough stamina in to do that.

Well, Athena//Valk/Valk/Verche/Verche//Athena is functional, albeit boring. Quick glance at your box though and you could do something like Athena//GZL/Rei Sirius/LKali/Valkyrie//Athena. Or pull GZL (blasphemy!) for Arcline. Arcline's slime won't hit your Athenas, but it'll boost all your subs. Or or you could level and uvo your Izanagi and run Athena//Izanagi/Rei Sirius/LKali/Valkyrie//Athena and have your slime hit everyone.

Also, I have an Athena. You should definitely be able to get one.

Quietus

2015-05-07, 10:42 AM

Well, Athena//Valk/Valk/Verche/Verche//Athena is functional, albeit boring. Quick glance at your box though and you could do something like Athena//GZL/Rei Sirius/LKali/Valkyrie//Athena. Or pull GZL (blasphemy!) for Arcline. Arcline's slime won't hit your Athenas, but it'll boost all your subs. Or or you could level and uvo your Izanagi and run Athena//Izanagi/Rei Sirius/LKali/Valkyrie//Athena and have your slime hit everyone.

Also, I have an Athena. You should definitely be able to get one.

That's my phone account. My tablet's Padherder is here : https://www.padherder.com/user/GameOutLoud/monsters/#31,0,31,2047,268435455,0,,0,0,0,eq,0,0,0,0;defaul t,0 and is not NEARLY so interesting. I already have Athena on the phone, final form, fully awoken, slvl3. Not high level yet though, haven't intended to use her. If I wanted to run Athena on my phone, I'm swimming in options.

::Edit:: I've updated my signature to reflect those. :smalltongue:

Fax Celestis

2015-05-07, 10:50 AM

Ah, yeah, that is a different story.

GZL is a bad lead choice for Athena because everyone has a preemptive 100% player heal.

Academia

2015-05-07, 11:12 AM

So with nothing else to spend my stamina on tonight...

http://i.imgur.com/GE3HBnL.jpg

Huh. I have avoided these dungeons because I'm not nearly 297'd enough on these teams.

Nice... Ra? xD

Finally Awoken evolved my A.Hades. Now it's max skilled too. Surprisingly, it haven't been awokened yet -.-

Quietus

2015-05-07, 12:38 PM

Ah, yeah, that is a different story.

GZL is a bad lead choice for Athena because everyone has a preemptive 100% player heal.

That's not so bad, actually. Only Siegfried follows that up with an attack that could OHKO you. I don't mind those situations so much, actually, because it lends a certain amount of stability to the fight - you KNOW you can take the next attack. It also means that you have a free turn to eliminate some unneeded orbs, I'm often using those turns to get rid of extra heals, lights, reds that show up. It means I've got a bigger attack a turn later, when they knock me back into range.

Anarion

2015-05-07, 01:07 PM

Quietus

2015-05-07, 01:11 PM

I'm also on a bit of a diversion to try and put together a team that can do the technical water only dungeon. Since I could easily clear the fire only dungeon if I could just get to it, and I can do everything with two blue/green ogres except the flame guys (which I could probably grind if nothing else).

Also worth considering, if you have any, is bringing orb changers. That's what I did for the fire dungeons, brought a team with Gigas (same skill as Samurai Goblin).

Anarion

2015-05-07, 01:19 PM

Also worth considering, if you have any, is bringing orb changers. That's what I did for the fire dungeons, brought a team with Gigas (same skill as Samurai Goblin).

Several, but I don't have any water lead besides Plessie that can give a water attack multiplier. So I'm actually struggling to come up with a way to deal more than 54,000 damage even with a type advantage to take out the fire things on floors 4 and 5.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-07, 01:19 PM

Also worth considering, if you have any, is bringing orb changers. That's what I did for the fire dungeons, brought a team with Gigas (same skill as Samurai Goblin).

Me too. I did Only/No Fire with my Leilan team, using subattributes for trash floors, and packed Gigas/Leilan actives for bosses.

Several, but I don't have any water lead besides Plessie that can give a water attack multiplier. So I'm actually struggling to come up with a way to deal more than 54,000 damage even with a type advantage to take out the fire things on floors 4 and 5.

http://puzzledragonx.com/en/monster.asp?n=313 is 70k damage to water-types. Pack two.

obryn

2015-05-07, 02:25 PM

I'm also on a bit of a diversion to try and put together a team that can do the technical water only dungeon. Since I could easily clear the fire only dungeon if I could just get to it, and I can do everything with two blue/green ogres except the flame guys (which I could probably grind if nothing else).
These dungeons are super easy. All the monsters are nerf versions of themselves.

Anarion

2015-05-07, 02:31 PM

http://puzzledragonx.com/en/monster.asp?n=313 is 70k damage to water-types. Pack two.

Oh, yeah that part I'm totally clear on. The question I've got is what do I do about the Fire type? My strongest water monster is Isis (not evo'ed yet, just regular old Isis) who's level 50. She's got 812 attack. I have absolutely no way to lead her though because I don't have any water sub elements besides wood. Maybe I could make the water/fire ogre too, I guess. So, assume I lead Isis/ogre/ogre/ogre/hatsume no tsubone to make water orbs. I'm not entirely confident, even with a 2x type advantage bonus, that I can beat the 54k defense on the will-o-wisp with that setup. I'd need a friend that also has a 3x multiplier for water (which I lack, though I'm sure I could find something. A second Isis if nothing else) and then at least 6 dark orbs on the field along with 3 fire and 3 wood to kill the will-o-wisp. It's possible, I suppose if I can find a friend to do it, but that's what has me worried.

Quietus

2015-05-07, 02:48 PM

Oh, yeah that part I'm totally clear on. The question I've got is what do I do about the Fire type? My strongest water monster is Isis (not evo'ed yet, just regular old Isis) who's level 50. She's got 812 attack. I have absolutely no way to lead her though because I don't have any water sub elements besides wood. Maybe I could make the water/fire ogre too, I guess. So, assume I lead Isis/ogre/ogre/ogre/hatsume no tsubone to make water orbs. I'm not entirely confident, even with a 2x type advantage bonus, that I can beat the 54k defense on the will-o-wisp with that setup. I'd need a friend that also has a 3x multiplier for water (which I lack, though I'm sure I could find something. A second Isis if nothing else) and then at least 6 dark orbs on the field along with 3 fire and 3 wood to kill the will-o-wisp. It's possible, I suppose if I can find a friend to do it, but that's what has me worried.

If you can find someone with a Skuld, that would give you 3x or more for Water types, and I believe an RCV boost for any Wood sub-attritubes on the team? Actually, there's also the other option - someone with Siegfried, for a 3x Physical boost. Max skilled, it'll give you another 5-turn orbchange, heart to water. Plays nicely with the Ogres, and I think you'd be fine running that even with Hatsume not getting his buff.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-07, 02:57 PM

Oh, yeah that part I'm totally clear on. The question I've got is what do I do about the Fire type? My strongest water monster is Isis (not evo'ed yet, just regular old Isis) who's level 50. She's got 812 attack. I have absolutely no way to lead her though because I don't have any water sub elements besides wood. Maybe I could make the water/fire ogre too, I guess. So, assume I lead Isis/ogre/ogre/ogre/hatsume no tsubone to make water orbs. I'm not entirely confident, even with a 2x type advantage bonus, that I can beat the 54k defense on the will-o-wisp with that setup. I'd need a friend that also has a 3x multiplier for water (which I lack, though I'm sure I could find something. A second Isis if nothing else) and then at least 6 dark orbs on the field along with 3 fire and 3 wood to kill the will-o-wisp. It's possible, I suppose if I can find a friend to do it, but that's what has me worried.

Too bad you don't have a Kelpie, that'd solve that issue. I'm not sure why you'd lead Isis if you can't trigger her leader skill, though.

Anarion

2015-05-07, 03:07 PM

Too bad you don't have a Kelpie, that'd solve that issue. I'm not sure why you'd lead Isis if you can't trigger her leader skill, though.

Because I have no other water type with any kind of multiplier (Hatsume's boost to healer types notwithstanding). I could trigger Isis with all the ogres. Alternately, I could just try to get a Kelpie, I've got PAL points saved up.

Thanks for the advice, everyone.

Jasmine

2015-05-07, 04:13 PM

Feeling like I hit a wall fairly hard at the moment. // because I don't see a reasonable way to get anything more without buying stones to pull the REM again (though I do have several challenges left, so at least 3-4 REM pulls if I get that all done).
The wall you see is the transition between easily clearing everything without much investment of the early game to the mega-grind of the rest of the game. If you don't want to spend money, you'll have to either spend some time leveling up your monsters or leveling up your orbing skill :smallbiggrin:

This is the sort of breakdown Anarion should have gotten for Ronia.
DQXQ can use almost any sub in the game (outside tricolor/bicolor/monocolor fullboard changes) to reasonable effect. Ronia has dark and red (2/5) devils (1/7). That's 6% as many monsters to choose from. While picking the 4 best out of 200 monsters is going to be terribly difficult, picking 4 out of 12 is much less so. Anyways, Ronia's style is tank'n'spank. Look at the dungeon to see how many consecutive waves you cannot stall on, and pack the same number of orbchange/slimes/enhancers to take out those waves. Fill up the rest with either defensive monsters like DJJD, or bring more orbchangers/skillboosts/rows to speed up the dungeon, depending on whether you think the dungeon is easy enough to speed through.

Thanks, that does help. I am working primarily on the Urd team, though I guess I"m surprised to hear that Ronia isn't really good at this point. A lot of the beginner guides floating around talk about her as one of the best pulls to get, only then I couldn't find any info on her.
She isn't 'really good' as much as 'really safe' or 'idiot-proof'. She's like GrOdin (but faster!) in the sense that her defense (healing) make it difficult for a new player to screw up, not matter how bad he is, in addition to her orb change fixing the problem of new players not being able to remove off color orbs while comboing. It gives you a much easier start with the game and allows you to handle harder dungeons much earlier, but it also does not provide as much incentive to improve as other leads do, leading you to eventually getting stuck and having to either pay2progress, or heaven forbid, spend a ton of time learning a new lead.

She's pretty useful if you average 6 combos or less. Vampire/DJJD/Wicked Lady/Chaos devil dragon with Lubu friend should take you through a surprising amount of the game. Starlight zeus is a special case with 2 back to back oneshotting bosses, so you'll have to go more glass cannon and do something like King baddie/King baddie/Heraur/Hera with Ronia friend. I think the Heraur can be a second Hera, but I'm not sure. You can get easy Heras with your DJJD with a Green Odin friend. Or just smash her with damage.

That's not so bad, actually. Only Siegfried follows that up with an attack that could OHKO you.
Goodluck clearing a single wave. :smallamused:

The question I've got is what do I do about the Fire type?
Take friend neptune or AB Bluebird blues.

Quietus

2015-05-07, 04:45 PM

She isn't 'really good' as much as 'really safe' or 'idiot-proof'. She's like GrOdin (but faster!) in the sense that her defense (healing) make it difficult for a new player to screw up, not matter how bad he is, in addition to her orb change fixing the problem of new players not being able to remove off color orbs while comboing. It gives you a much easier start with the game and allows you to handle harder dungeons much earlier, but it also does not provide as much incentive to improve as other leads do, leading you to eventually getting stuck and having to either pay2progress, or heaven forbid, spend a ton of time learning a new lead.

She's pretty useful if you average 6 combos or less. Vampire/DJJD/Wicked Lady/Chaos devil dragon with Lubu friend should take you through a surprising amount of the game. Starlight zeus is a special case with 2 back to back oneshotting bosses, so you'll have to go more glass cannon and do something like King baddie/King baddie/Heraur/Hera with Ronia friend. I think the Heraur can be a second Hera, but I'm not sure. You can get easy Heras with your DJJD with a Green Odin friend. Or just smash her with damage.

For comparison, I both paid to progress, and spent a lot of time learning to use the Kali I ended up pulling. I love that team now, but it did cost me a few hundred dollars to get to where I'm at now, after having only played a few months. A Lu Bu/Ronia devil team (and, in my case, Gronia) was absolutely useful to me for a very long time, and allowed me to reach the point that I could decently cycle the board (3-4 combos) and rely on actives the rest of the time. Then I saw the wall that was preventing me from reaching the higher tier content, and ended up opening my wallet long enough that I kind of regret it. Learning to use Kali has been a struggle, but has been valuable - and then recently I picked up a tablet specifically to play harder-to-pilot teams on a secondary account, and running primarily Bastet has absolutely been a difficult, but rewarding, experience. Ronia and teams based around her can take you a long way, but that wall you hit is a pretty hard stop.

Goodluck clearing a single wave. :smallamused:

With GZL on my phone? I'm certain I could take the entirety of Athena's dungeon. On my tablet? Not a damn chance... yet. :smalltongue:

Jasmine

2015-05-07, 05:00 PM

With GZL on my phone? I'm certain I could take the entirety of Athena's dungeon. On my tablet? Not a damn chance... yet. :smalltongue:
I would bet you a pack of stones that you can't.

...if I had a pack of stones, that is.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-07, 05:01 PM

AUGH FREAKING ZEUS DIOS

I just cannot for the life of me get to Zeus with all my guns up. I can pretty consistently get through the first wave (the big speed bump), no issues on Griffin or Angel, and then Hera just jacks me up so bad that I have to burn actives to get through. This last run, I made it through without using any of my actives but Echidna, but then realized I had healed 50 HP short of his preemptive and died. -_-

Sallera

2015-05-07, 05:59 PM

Otravyat

2015-05-07, 06:24 PM

Yeah, Z-D's a bish. Really straightforward, but if you don't have the numbers... The only time I've beaten it with less than a x25 was with GZL, and that required Berserk to spawn on a 1-turn timer. (Not to mention GZL's one of the most damaging x16s.)

Staring dubiously at the God Rush, myself. It does seem to be the easiest of the four rushes, but, well, still pretty hard. Can stall indefinitely on Gaia easily, but killing her and Dios with U&Y is pretty tricky-looking. I'd almost certainly need SQ for Stratios, so I wouldn't be able to use him on Dios, and I'm already reducing my damage by bringing a golem to survive the preemptive.

I'm not even trying it, if that is any reference for you.

With GZL on my phone? I'm certain I could take the entirety of Athena's dungeon. On my tablet? Not a damn chance... yet. :smalltongue:

How would you plan on getting yourself into the damage zone for either gigas or seigfried when either would one shot you? I'm on Jasmine's side.

obryn

2015-05-07, 06:47 PM

I would bet you a pack of stones that you can't.

...if I had a pack of stones, that is.
I'm with Jasmine. GZL is way out of his element in that dungeon. You won't get past Gigas.

Athena was released when Luci and Goemon were at their peak popularity. And it screws over GZL because it was built to screw over Goemon.

Quietus

2015-05-07, 07:15 PM

I would bet you a pack of stones that you can't.

...if I had a pack of stones, that is.

How would you plan on getting yourself into the damage zone for either gigas or seigfried when either would one shot you? I'm on Jasmine's side.

I'm with Jasmine. GZL is way out of his element in that dungeon. You won't get past Gigas.

Athena was released when Luci and Goemon were at their peak popularity. And it screws over GZL because it was built to screw over Goemon.

The trick, then, is to not take a hit from Gigas, isn't it? He's only got 600k HP, that's no problem. My solution is simple : bring Lu Bu. I'd have to max skill him for it to work, but here's what I'm seeing :

Round 1 : Lu Bu takes 3 turns to charge his active, at max skill. Gigas gives you a three turn countdown. Use that time to set up the board, and on turn three, pop Lu Bu, drop to 1 HP, and nuke.
Round 2 : Get healed to full. Cu Chu swings for less than half your HP. Spend two turns setting up the board, then nuke. Use GZL active if needed.
Round 3 : Get healed to full. Abuse his "Imposing Stance" to set up the board a little and recharge actives. Once a skyfall breaks his imposing stance, let him take one swing (I can survive Splash Blade with triple-digit HP left), then proceed to crush him mercilessly.
Round 4 : Get healed to full. Spend a couple turns eliminating all Red and Light orbs on the board while she puts up her shield and attacks you, turning one color to Light. Pop Liu Bei or Sasuke, plus GZL, and make three green prongs with a couple extra combos. Win.

Admittedly, I forgot just how much damage Gigas did when I claimed I could do it with GZL earlier, which is why I have Lu Bu of all things in there. But it's possible. I'd rather do it with Lu Bu and some devils, though.

In other news... I just almost beat Zeus Challenge god rush. I got Zeus Stratios himself to 3% HP, he god-bound me, and I think I could have finished him with TPA's from GZL... but I forgot that Stratios soaks combos less than three, and failed to block off my Dark orbs from my Green. Dammit. Well, I'll try again over the next couple days, but if regular God Rush comes along before I succeed, I'm going to just get Gaia from there. So pissed, Gaia had even dropped that run. :smallfurious:

Otravyat

2015-05-07, 07:24 PM

The trick, then, is to not take a hit from Gigas, isn't it? He's only got 600k HP, that's no problem. My solution is simple : bring Lu Bu. I'd have to max skill him for it to work, but here's what I'm seeing :

Round 1 : Lu Bu takes 3 turns to charge his active, at max skill. Gigas gives you a three turn countdown. Use that time to set up the board, and on turn three, pop Lu Bu, drop to 1 HP, and nuke.
Round 2 : Get healed to full. Cu Chu swings for less than half your HP. Spend two turns setting up the board, then nuke. Use GZL active if needed.
Round 3 : Get healed to full. Abuse his "Imposing Stance" to set up the board a little and recharge actives. Once a skyfall breaks his imposing stance, let him take one swing (I can survive Splash Blade with triple-digit HP left), then proceed to crush him mercilessly.
Round 4 : Get healed to full. Spend a couple turns eliminating all Red and Light orbs on the board while she puts up her shield and attacks you, turning one color to Light. Pop Liu Bei or Sasuke, plus GZL, and make three green prongs with a couple extra combos. Win.

Admittedly, I forgot just how much damage Gigas did when I claimed I could do it with GZL earlier, which is why I have Lu Bu of all things in there. But it's possible. I'd rather do it with Lu Bu and some devils, though.

In other news... I just almost beat Zeus Challenge god rush. I got Zeus Stratios himself to 3% HP, he god-bound me, and I think I could have finished him with TPA's from GZL... but I forgot that Stratios soaks combos less than three, and failed to block off my Dark orbs from my Green. Dammit. Well, I'll try again over the next couple days, but if regular God Rush comes along before I succeed, I'm going to just get Gaia from there. So pissed, Gaia had even dropped that run. :smallfurious:

You also forgot that Siegfried casts a move to triple his attack before he hits you. Not surviving that. So you would have to use Lu Bu on floor 1 and again on floor 3. Sure, it is POSSIBLE to match orbs on Sieg without hitting him and so not set him off regain skills. But the likelihood of a green or a red or a dark skyfall for the 6 turns you need (plus 3 on Cu Chu and 3 once you hurt Sieg).....

It is also a moot point since we all protested your original claim that your GZL team could breeze through it, not that you could get 4 skill ups on Lu Bu and THEN breeze through it. But I still don't think it would work.

Quietus

2015-05-07, 07:30 PM

You also forgot that Siegfried casts a move to triple his attack before he hits you. Not surviving that. So you would have to use Lu Bu on floor 1 and again on floor 3. Sure, it is POSSIBLE to match orbs on Sieg without hitting him and so not set him off regain skills. But the likelihood of a green or a red or a dark skyfall for the 6 turns you need (plus 3 on Cu Chu and 3 once you hurt Sieg).....

It is also a moot point since we all protested your original claim that your GZL team could breeze through it, not that you could get 4 skill ups on Lu Bu and THEN breeze through it. But I still don't think it would work.

That's fair. With what I have right now, because of Gigas, no. I don't think I could do it. With work, sure.

Quietus

2015-05-07, 10:56 PM

Have you guys seen this dude yet? He seems neat, I'm not sure what to make of him, except HOLY WOW TEN COST? Okay now I want.

::Edit:: Oops, link : http://www.puzzledragonx.com/en/monster.asp?n=1924

Anarion

2015-05-08, 10:39 AM

Wow echidna is amazing. I mean, I knew this already and pretty much everyone has said something like "put echidna on your fire team! Or two!" But I'm finally using her and it's crazy stupid how easy she makes bosses. I just cleared Sleepless Castle and Two Heroes yesterday. Entirely on her back.

Edit: 90% on her back. I also did a one turn 1.5m damage spike to Hera using Urd's field swap and quite a bit of luck to get a 13 combo with 5 separate fire triples, one of which was a quad for TPA.

obryn

2015-05-08, 10:46 AM

The trick, then, is to not take a hit from Gigas, isn't it? He's only got 600k HP, that's no problem. My solution is simple : bring Lu Bu.
I will posit that if your GZL strategy necessitates your bringing Lu Bu along for the ride, you'd be far better off with another team. :smallwink:

Wow echidna is amazing. I mean, I knew this already and pretty much everyone has said something like "put echidna on your fire team! Or two!" But I'm finally using her and it's crazy stupid how easy she makes bosses. I just cleared Sleepless Castle and Two Heroes yesterday. Entirely on her back.
Yeah. She is, by far, one of the top subs in the game. A max skill Echidna trivializes most of the Normal and Technical dungeons. She's the reason so many Descends have Status Shields.

She's still a main component of my Ra team, though Sun Quan is slowly edging her out as I skill him up. (With L/L Ra getting the Healer subtype, it just makes sense.) Even if the boss is status shielded, she's 3 free rounds of stalling/panic earlier in the dungeon.

Quietus

2015-05-08, 10:57 AM

I will posit that if your GZL strategy necessitates your bringing Lu Bu along for the ride, you'd be far better off with another team. :smallwink:

Yes, yes. I've already conceded that point. I could do it with Lu Bu, but there are definitely better options. Like Lu Bu devils, which is how I've farmed Athena previously. :smalltongue:

Wow echidna is amazing. I mean, I knew this already and pretty much everyone has said something like "put echidna on your fire team! Or two!" But I'm finally using her and it's crazy stupid how easy she makes bosses. I just cleared Sleepless Castle and Two Heroes yesterday. Entirely on her back.

Edit: 90% on her back. I also did a one turn 1.5m damage spike to Hera using Urd's field swap and quite a bit of luck to get a 13 combo with 5 separate fire triples, one of which was a quad for TPA.

Congratulations! I love those times when it just feels like the skyfalls last forever. Echidna is incredible, I can't wait to skill up the one on my tablet. Not looking forward to that slog, though.

Sallera

2015-05-08, 12:50 PM

Grotteschi

2015-05-08, 12:52 PM

DQXQ can use almost any sub in the game (outside tricolor/bicolor/monocolor fullboard changes) to reasonable effect. Ronia has dark and red (2/5) devils (1/7). That's 6% as many monsters to choose from.

/shakes head

Don't give a team. Give ideas. Explain theory. Like this;

She isn't 'really good' as much as 'really safe' or 'idiot-proof'. She's like GrOdin (but faster!) in the sense that her defense (healing) make it difficult for a new player to screw up, not matter how bad he is, in addition to her orb change fixing the problem of new players not being able to remove off color orbs while comboing. It gives you a much easier start with the game and allows you to handle harder dungeons much earlier, but it also does not provide as much incentive to improve as other leads do, leading you to eventually getting stuck and having to either pay2progress, or heaven forbid, spend a ton of time learning a new lead.

She's pretty useful if you average 6 combos or less. Vampire/DJJD/Wicked Lady/Chaos devil dragon with Lubu friend should take you through a surprising amount of the game. Starlight zeus is a special case with 2 back to back oneshotting bosses, so you'll have to go more glass cannon and do something like King baddie/King baddie/Heraur/Hera with Ronia friend. I think the Heraur can be a second Hera, but I'm not sure. You can get easy Heras with your DJJD with a Green Odin friend. Or just smash her with damage.

Take friend neptune or AB Bluebird blues.

That's what to do about the lack of a red sub element I think.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-08, 01:22 PM

Sallera

2015-05-08, 01:50 PM

I'll work on LKali when Abroken Ra gets here, but I don't know how worthwhile it would be to bring her just to guarantee a x16 activation. I suppose the time extend and skill boost are nice, but DQXQ's got those too, with +190-something worth of extra stats... well, maybe worth considering.

And healer type or not, there's no way I'm pulling DKali. :smalltongue: Two time extends on top of the only active in the game to guarantee a x49-capable board?

obryn

2015-05-08, 02:50 PM

Congrats, Anarion. Hera and Two Heroes are a pretty good milestone to pass - they're easier than the other descends, but not by so much that you can't start planning for some of the less nasty ones (Valkyrie and Hera-Ur might be a couple to look at.)

Speaking of L/L Ra, now that I've snowglobed mine, I've been looking at teams. DKali and mini-SQ seem obvious, and I'll probably take my U&Y just for the stats, it being my only +297 and all. That leaves a flex slot; Athena would get me blind immunity, Echidna for a second delay... my Mastering's not leveled or uvo'd yet, but it could be worked on. Ariel wouldn't be useless, but I can already bait fire binds with DKali. Any obvious options I'm missing? (https://www.padherder.com/user/Kiminosei/monsters/) (Or farmable ones?)
DKali is the #1 top LL Ra sub in the game. Apart from being unbindable and filling 2 colors, her other 4 awoken skills are exactly what LL Ra wants, and her Active skill is a somewhat-guaranteed 6-color activation. (You can still get nearly-impossible boards with her, mind you, but it's always an improvement over missing a color.) Her cooldown is pretty fast at max skill, too, and max skilling her is a matter of devilits. She's incredible.

After that, my general advice for LL Ra teams is this - every monster should contribute towards a x49 activation either by giving you a better chance at a good board, or by letting you survive until you can get a good board. Don't worry about adding bursts or slimes (unless the slime boost is a bonus); worry about...

(0) Filling all your colors, duh. DKali means you need a blue and a green sub.
(1) defense/delay actives (echidna, sun quan, green/blue golems, Susano, Kushi maybe; I usually have 2-3 of these)
(2) extend time awoken skills (though your +2s is substantial already). CTW and move-extenders like A.Hades work, too.
(3) board-fixers or board-screw-preventers (Top Droidragon, DKali, Mastering, etc. Jammers and poison hose you hard.)
(4) skill boosts because stalling is hard
(5) bind fixers (LMeta, A.Ceres, etc.), conditionally based on the dungeon

My bog-standard LL Ra team has DKali, Echidna, Susano, and a blue wildcard - currently most often Sun Quan, but sometimes LMeta, B/R Orochi, TDD, or Hera-Is.

Jasmine

2015-05-08, 03:13 PM

That's fair. With what I have right now, because of Gigas, no. I don't think I could do it. With work, sure.
Does that mean I get stones? :smallbiggrin:

/shakes head

Don't give a team. Give ideas. Explain theory. Like this;
The reason theory is not as important for limited teams is that as long as you stay within the color/typing, your team isn't going to be much worse than one that is constructed with theory in mind. You're given a lot less room to screw up when you're playing rock-paper-scissors than when you're playing checkers.

I mean, I suppose you could have a heavy REM roster and run around with 4 R/G ogres as subs, but then again if you do that, you deserve what you get :smallcool:

Probably going to be busy tomorrow, so posting this a day early.

#Personal Efficiency Log - Day 500
I've used a total of ~161303 stamina. That's a combination of regen (99360 = 61.6%), rankups (47243 = 29.3%), and refreshes (14700 = 9.1%). In the past 100 days, I've been using 453 stam/day (322 lifetime average - includes 310 days at 10min/stam), mostly from stoning + egg dungeons.

My rank exp is 47.09 million at rank 403. My recent rank/day has been 109k (94k) and a rank/stamina of 240 (291) Combination of no goemon friends and running plus.

I have a total of 332.2 million monster exp. Recent exp/day is 890k (664k) and exp/stam is 1962 (2059). Exp spread is 66.3 mil red, 51.1 blue, 62.8 green, 67.9 yellow, and 84.1 purple. Most went up 10-15 mil, though dark went up 40 mil thanks to fatty metals.

I have 2770 +eggs. Recent +/day is 10.5 (5.5) and stam/+ is 43.3 (58.2). Big jump in totals from spamming FT4.

50 stones in friends, 316 in box, 147 in refreshes, 30 in continues, 300+25 (so 60/5 rolls) REM/DC rolls. That's 878 total stones!

Last progress report I had 43 maxed and 6 monsters at 70. I now have 60 maxed and 10 monsters at 70.
New rolls - Grimrock, Genie, Ronia, Arthur, Radious, Strawberry, Apoc, Ronia, Fuma, Godin, Lumiel, Michael, Thanatos. Also two Kamuis that didn't give a skillup.

Horus/Kirin teams hypermax (8 total), working on AHades team now.

Pee count:7/8/3(+5 used)/7/3(+8)
Wishlist monsters: Durga, Persephone, Anymeta, Dvalk

Fax Celestis

2015-05-08, 03:29 PM

0/1 Pandora, 0/2 Mitsuki, 0/2 Zeus, 1/3 Hermes today. :smallsigh:

Quietus

2015-05-08, 04:25 PM

0/1 Pandora, 0/2 Mitsuki, 0/2 Zeus, 1/3 Hermes today. :smallsigh:

Think I'm 2/13 on Shining Dragon Knight, 1/11 on Flame Dragon Knight, 0/2 Gronia, 2/12 assorted Late Bloomers, 1/11 Hobgoblin, and the big winner of the day was 2/7 Gigas. Not too terrible, really, though I pouted a little at Gronia. I really want those last two skill ups so I can have my second hypermax. It'd be nice to have zero stalling in KoG for Fagan.

Otravyat

2015-05-08, 04:29 PM

0/1 Pandora, 0/2 Mitsuki, 0/2 Zeus, 1/3 Hermes today. :smallsigh:

Yeah I'm farming up dark fairies and not seeing any drop thus far, but it will speed up. I can do Fuma at the same time with the gold pirates so that is nice at least.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-08, 04:33 PM

Yeah I'm farming up dark fairies and not seeing any drop thus far, but it will speed up. I can do Fuma at the same time with the gold pirates so that is nice at least.

I'm actually skilling up a pirate for low-cost/S-rank purposes.

Quietus

2015-05-08, 05:02 PM

Welp. Just remembered I had some blue dragon fruits, too. 0/6 on Blonia.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-08, 10:59 PM

Achievement unlocked:
http://i.imgur.com/EHQOmZ8.jpg

No cheese either.

Grotteschi

2015-05-08, 11:51 PM

The reason theory is not as important for limited teams is that as long as you stay within the color/typing, your team isn't going to be much worse than one that is constructed with theory in mind. You're given a lot less room to screw up when you're playing rock-paper-scissors than when you're playing checkers.

And then nothing is learned. Teach a man to fish, don't give fish.

Compare;
Obryn: lists what you need, why, what he suggests in readable manner.
Academia: says don't bother 'ale this exact team and then practice, GG.

One of those is long term helpful when the question is "how" and not "spoon feed me".

*

What days do you use Goemon?

Starwulf

2015-05-09, 12:11 AM

Anarion

2015-05-09, 12:24 AM

Thing is, for the most part the people who post on this thread are all veterans of the game, and can usually infer why a certain team is suggested. If not, they'll ask. The few newer people we have know all they have to do is ask and we'll explain anything they are confused about. Jasmine is just keeping post clutter to a minimum.

This isn't really accurate. I sort of feel like I'm bothering people here every time I'm asked a question, to be honest.

Starwulf

2015-05-09, 12:46 AM

This isn't really accurate. I sort of feel like I'm bothering people here every time I'm asked a question, to be honest.

Hmm, is it just because you don't like to bother people, or have you gotten the feeling that people just don't want to answer your question? If I was more active and was better with the mathy stuff I'd be happy to help the newer peeps, but the math is beyond me, and I've all but quit the game at this point(I've logged in once in the last 3 days).

Jasmine

2015-05-09, 01:03 AM

And then nothing is learned. Teach a man to fish, don't give fish.
Compare;
Obryn: lists what you need, why, what he suggests in readable manner.
Academia: says don't bother 'ale this exact team and then practice, GG.
*
What days do you use Goemon?
How much more can you learn about how to win at rock-paper-scissors after you've figure out the rules? Playing Ronia(GrOdin) is the game equivalent of being handed a fish, which is why I discourage it, but if you have someone asking for fish for someone else, who am I to deny them? And if the wannabe fisherman needs to feed a family, would you not give him free fish until he actually learned how? (in this game, some people with over a year of experience still run teams with mediocre synergy - is that a fate you would prefer instead?)

Remember that in this game, unless you roll REM, your fish lasts forever. My main team has changed by 1 sub since my first month. Sometimes all you need is that first nudge.

Goemon is used in non-tricolors whenever you need tons of damage and there are no screwy preemptives and you have some time to stall.

Sallera

2015-05-09, 03:48 AM

This isn't really accurate. I sort of feel like I'm bothering people here every time I'm asked a question, to be honest.

Nah, 'course not. We like talking about this game, that's why we've got twelve threads of it. If we didn't have each others' questions to answer, there'd not be near as much content around here. Besides, a lot of questions give a chance for math, science, or theorycrafting, and there's always someone around interested in one or the other. :3

Thanks for the list, obryn. TDD is definitely someone I should work on. Might have to buy my first Tama Village after all.

Academia

2015-05-09, 04:38 AM

And then nothing is learned. Teach a man to fish, don't give fish.

Compare;
Obryn: lists what you need, why, what he suggests in readable manner.
Academia: says don't bother 'ale this exact team and then practice, GG.

One of those is long term helpful when the question is "how" and not "spoon feed me".

*

What days do you use Goemon?

Well if you're talking about team building theory then everyone kinda have their own style. And the theory also depends on your skill level....

Veteran players make do with a lot of teams and adjust based on the dungeon, such as bind clears, skill lock resists, jammer resists, damage reduction instead of delay... It's not always nuke nuke nuke. But notice it's based on the enemy and not really based on your team.

I can only really go into the "Base" team.

Principle:

1. Is it a Nuke team based on Actives? If yes, then you need board shifts, orb changers, and some sort of slime to maximize your output in 1 or 2 turns before the enemy kills you. (Healers...)

2. Is it a grindy team? If yes, then you need recovery and slowly grind the enemy to death - WARNING: You're mind might slip into the abyss as you're grinding down the enemy's HP. (Luci, GrOdin...)

3. Is it a Nuke team based on Leadership skills? If yes, then you need to mix in utility subs that guarantee the activation of these Leadership Skills or preventing the board from disabling your Leadership Skill. And since it's still considered a "Nuke" team, you'll have to kill the enemy before it kills you, hence we use defensive subs and very little or no orb changers. Because more turns of surviving = more turns of activating the leadership skill = more nukes = more damage. You can think of it as each turn = having an active skill. (Anubis, Egyptians, Kirin, U&Y.... You get the idea).

4. Is it a team that rely on awakening for damage? If yes, then you need to find the awakening skill the team uses to maximize damage. This is usually a NORMAL nuke team on steroids due to the awakenings. So basically build just like a normal nuke team with a slime and baord shifts (Norns, RSonia....)

I never seen you around this forum before Grotteschi. But I give specific teams that is usually optimized as a "Base" team. Once he see's the team I suggested, he should see the synergy between the subs or at least figure them out after he plays the team for a while and he will develop a sense of team building on what works together.

I remember starting our using Kirin and loading the whole team with orb changers because they help with the activation, but I died a lot because sometimes you just cant burst enough in one turn. So I took a page from Obyrn's book and went with defensive subs. Now I go mostly defensive and match the awakenings so the chances of the dungeon gimmicks can't own me. But I never woulda tried pure defensive subs unless Obyrn actually gave me the team - I looked at it the first time and was like "This **** gimps my damage" but in the end it gave me more turns to do damage and heal up - ENDURANCE! We suggested the teams then it's all up to your orbing skills.

And also, I find that most people want the easy way out and go at their own pace and ask more questions. If I posted explanations like the above all day, I'd be wasting my own time and people probably wont spend the time to read the whole thing.

But that isn't to say you can't/shouldn't ask me a "Why". Oh and btw, it is IMPOSSIBLE to spoon feed in this game simply because it's a solo puzzle game. If you cant orb, you won't make it far regardless of your team composition. And if you get the orbing down, your team matters less and less....

P.S. Jasmine's brutal, don't mess with her. Shhhh she's the one with the Billion and One +Eggs that allow her to cheat and full heal each turn! LOL

Aca

Grotteschi

2015-05-09, 10:38 AM

Thing is, for the most part the people who post on this thread are all veterans of the game, and can usually infer why a certain team is suggested. If not, they'll ask. The few newer people we have know all they have to do is ask and we'll explain anything they are confused about. Jasmine is just keeping post clutter to a minimum.

That's not what happened in reality though. Just explanations why half answers are good enough, instead of corrections to full answers.

Seriously go compare Obryn's explanation for his Ra team, to the suggestions to Anarion. That is very different.

Jasmine

2015-05-09, 11:09 AM

That's not what happened in reality though. Just explanations why half answers are good enough, instead of corrections to full answers.

Seriously go compare Obryn's explanation for his Ra team, to the suggestions to Anarion. That is very different.

Ronia's style is tank'n'spank. Look at the dungeon to see how many consecutive waves you cannot stall on, and pack the same number of orbchange/slimes/enhancers to take out those waves. Fill up the rest with either defensive monsters like DJJD, or bring more orbchangers/skillboosts/rows to speed up the dungeon, depending on whether you think the dungeon is easy enough to speed through.

She isn't 'really good' as much as 'really safe' or 'idiot-proof'. She's like GrOdin (but faster!) in the sense that her defense (healing) make it difficult for a new player to screw up, not matter how bad he is, in addition to her orb change fixing the problem of new players not being able to remove off color orbs while comboing. It gives you a much easier start with the game and allows you to handle harder dungeons much earlier, but it also does not provide as much incentive to improve as other leads do, leading you to eventually getting stuck and having to either pay2progress, or heaven forbid, spend a ton of time learning a new lead.

She's pretty useful if you average 6 combos or less. Vampire/DJJD/Wicked Lady/Chaos devil dragon with Lubu friend should take you through a surprising amount of the game. Starlight zeus is a special case with 2 back to back oneshotting bosses, so you'll have to go more glass cannon and do something like King baddie/King baddie/Heraur/Hera with Ronia friend. I think the Heraur can be a second Hera, but I'm not sure. You can get easy Heras with your DJJD with a Green Odin friend. Or just smash her with damage.

Don't give a team. Give ideas. Explain theory. Like this;
Can we stay consistent here? Unless you want every other veteran to repeat something similar. Seriously, not that much strategy when playing Rock Paper Scissors. Ronia (and maybe Norns) are the only teams where six of the same monster is more viable than most other builds. Like Aca said, everything else is dungeon specific, and you can ask for help when you meet those. (eg. How to deal with 54k defense willowisps). There is objectively much less to be said about 12 pick 4 than 200 pick 4 - there's only 16000 times less combinations to choose from. It only gets worse if one player's box is much older and filled out while the other can barely scrounge up four devil types.

Kauai even explicitly said ronia should build with row enhancements in mind, which is what ronia needs to actually be useful past mid game, but notices that Anarion doesn't have any relevant subs for that, and recommended a norn that is possibly less sub reliant. Everyone contributed a little, and bashing on one person for not giving a comprehensive answer seems to make it sound like you just want to find something to complain about.

Also, everyone and their grandma can play ronia and she's been brought up dozens if not hundreds of times in this thread. Obryns is the only one here skilled enough to play ra, so when someone finally asks for advice, he's not only happy to give out a lot, he's also the only one qualified to do so, almost necessitating that it be more complete since he knows that's all that you're getting. Pretty hypocritical of you to claim you want to understand, and then wave away all the explanations to why something happens.

Anarion

2015-05-09, 11:51 AM

Hmm, is it just because you don't like to bother people, or have you gotten the feeling that people just don't want to answer your question? If I was more active and was better with the mathy stuff I'd be happy to help the newer peeps, but the math is beyond me, and I've all but quit the game at this point(I've logged in once in the last 3 days).

Ignoring the current back and forth, let me see if I can answer this. It's actually a hard question to answer because it comes down to stuff like tone and word choice.

I think, the issue might be that I'm not playing the game for the same reason other people are right now. I don't particularly enjoy farming penguins outside of a "this is optimal on Mondays" efficiency feeling. Tuesday-Sunday I want things to aim for because I'm mostly fine on evo mats except for a continual lack of dub mythlits. So, like, when I asked about Ronia, it wasn't because I wanted a better team than Urd, it was because the idea of starting to farm up a third team appealed to me. Being told that actually I just couldn't do that made me kinda sad because a goal that had caught my attention was dismissed.

I was also somewhat disappointed about the frequent and repeat advice to build teams with Echidna. I mean, woo, lucky me she actually dropped within two days of my asking for help and was enough to push my team from having trouble to smashing Hera and Two Heroes. But that was a low percentage scenario. When I got it, it mostly sounded like I was being told I just had to wait a few weeks until her special dungeon rotated back around.

Basically, stepping back a level of abstraction, most of the conversation here is on interesting strategy, team comps, cool dungeon specific plans. But the reaction to the point of the game I'm at seems to keep being a variation of "there's nothing interesting for you, just go farm." Which I think is what makes me feel that I'm being a distraction here. There's simply nothing interesting to talk about until I can start trying to poke around the daily descends.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-09, 12:10 PM

Once your average level on your Urd team is in the sixties, you can probably start in on some of the easier descends. So honestly yeah, you do need to grind it out a little, but not much more. Hera-Is, Hera-Ur, Valkyrie, Takeminakata, Goemon, Guan Yinping would be good places to start.

Otravyat

2015-05-09, 12:16 PM

Basically, stepping back a level of abstraction, most of the conversation here is on interesting strategy, team comps, cool dungeon specific plans. But the reaction to the point of the game I'm at seems to keep being a variation of "there's nothing interesting for you, just go farm." Which I think is what makes me feel that I'm being a distraction here. There's simply nothing interesting to talk about until I can start trying to poke around the daily descends.

Trimming your quote for size purposes, but I'll respond to the whole thing (and a few other posts).

I'm sorry that you didn't get the response that you were looking for with Ronia. I know that I just missed you asking in the first place. Among all this bickering have you found the response you needed?

I know that I play this game mostly for building new fun teams at this point, so I definitely understand where you are coming from with wanting to have multiple options. But until right now, with this post, I assumed that as a new player you were trying to get advice for progression and not farming up another team. And the unfortunate truth is that for progression this is a very long term game, so unfortunately a lot of advice re. progression just becomes, "well you could do this or this and then move forward in a few weeks". I spent three weeks at low rank farming nothing but low tier normals looking for naga and siren. And you are right that you are in the heart of that right now. It isn't that we can't give you advice for the way that you play the game, we are more than happy to, but at least in my case I just didn't realize the difference until you clarified here.

Grotteschi

2015-05-09, 12:39 PM

Can we stay consistent here?

There is no inconsistency.

Third quote is me demonstrating how second quote is a better format. You also saying second quote is better format means you agree. Why antagonism?

Otravyat

2015-05-09, 01:15 PM

/shakes head

Don't give a team. Give ideas. Explain theory. Like this;

There is no inconsistency.

Third quote is me demonstrating how second quote is a better format. You also saying second quote is better format means you agree. Why antagonism?

In that top quote, you took one of Jasmine's posts. You said shakes head at the first half of it, and that she should be explaining theory "like this" and then you quote the second half of the same post by the same person. So yes, you are being inconsistent and antagonistic towards 2/3 of the people on the forum.

I'm all for being a bit more open to beginning players, I asked a billion questions when I first joined here, as did Quietus (we are two of the newer members) and everyone else. And in that vein I'm really happy that Anarion posted earlier explaining exactly what was a frustrating and (in my mind) clearing up some of the problems so that we can try to be better at helping in the future. Now, you've brought something to our attention, and I appreciate that, but you don't need to speak for Anarion at this point and you haven't asked any questions yourself. So lets try to take the tone down several notches, please.

Meta

2015-05-09, 01:31 PM

I wish I had a Ra to be not as good as Obryns with.

Academia

2015-05-09, 01:55 PM

I almost just fed 10 gold keepers to my Apocalypse for the skill up but noticed that the skill for the gold keepers weren't for Apoc at the last min! Phew... Don't want to do the same thing as what I did for my RSonia once lol.

And damn it, we're simple people. Ask a question, we answer directly. If you need something explained, ask for the explanation. If our explanation is bad, other people will tell us to our faces and we'll try explaining again. This threads on #12 now? I joined at #4. There's been many times we went multiple pages of people just pitching in and adding advice to a single question.

We've broken down dungeons piece by piece before as well. SiuS (Speaking of which, where the hell did she go?), finds ways of beating dungeon without the optimal team. It's Obyrn (Correctly if I'm wrong) that told us to use A.Hades to beat Challenge 9. I think I was one of the first few for Legendary Seaway and Jasmine was for Legendary Earth. Jasmine first for the Extreme Rushes - God/Devil....

Ways of playing the game's also different. Obyrn picked a top tier leader that's the 2nd hardest to use (Next to Anubis) in the game and stuck with it through pure skills. I rarely see him post new teams. Jasmine farms like a beast and now her team's have max stats and allow her the edge to beat pretty much 99% if not 100% of the game. Oytra and I have many similarities in that we have branched off teams but have a specific team we like to go back to when **** gets really hard - His U&Y and my Kirin. But as far as team familiarization goes, I definitely have the MOST teams that I can use here on this forum (Kauai can give me a run, but not sure). That's because my box is "jacked" up with REM because the gold dragon bit my wallet (lol). And I too like collecting and having variety. A bunch of my teams are fully skilled too. My teams might not be strong as Jasmine and Obyrns and maybe not even Oytra's, but the variety I have lets me keep up and my orbing is pretty decent, so outside of the extreme rushes, I have teams for pretty much everything. Extreme rushes I just don't got the skills yet I think.

Quietus

2015-05-09, 01:55 PM

Ignoring the current back and forth, let me see if I can answer this. It's actually a hard question to answer because it comes down to stuff like tone and word choice.

I think, the issue might be that I'm not playing the game for the same reason other people are right now. I don't particularly enjoy farming penguins outside of a "this is optimal on Mondays" efficiency feeling. Tuesday-Sunday I want things to aim for because I'm mostly fine on evo mats except for a continual lack of dub mythlits. So, like, when I asked about Ronia, it wasn't because I wanted a better team than Urd, it was because the idea of starting to farm up a third team appealed to me. Being told that actually I just couldn't do that made me kinda sad because a goal that had caught my attention was dismissed.

I was also somewhat disappointed about the frequent and repeat advice to build teams with Echidna. I mean, woo, lucky me she actually dropped within two days of my asking for help and was enough to push my team from having trouble to smashing Hera and Two Heroes. But that was a low percentage scenario. When I got it, it mostly sounded like I was being told I just had to wait a few weeks until her special dungeon rotated back around.

Basically, stepping back a level of abstraction, most of the conversation here is on interesting strategy, team comps, cool dungeon specific plans. But the reaction to the point of the game I'm at seems to keep being a variation of "there's nothing interesting for you, just go farm." Which I think is what makes me feel that I'm being a distraction here. There's simply nothing interesting to talk about until I can start trying to poke around the daily descends.

I hate to put it this way, but this entire game is a grind. If you want a specific farmable monster, you need to do one of the following :

1) Go to a normal/technical dungeon it drops in, possibly at a 2% rate (healer girls, Gigas, etc)
2) Wait for their survey dungeon comes around (No guaranteed rotation, could be weeks/months)
3) Run a descend, for more rare creatures

For descends, you want a high level team to have the stats to handle them. That means grinding, either for Pengdra or in the urgent jewel dragon dungeons.

Beyond all this, there's what is (to me) possibly the most satisfying part of team building, and that's skilling things up. The difference between a team that takes 9-13 turns to get skills up, and one that takes 5-9, is tremendous. That, of course, requires repeated farming in the methods listed above, plus luck and patience.

As far as generic advice, I would offer this : If you have one very solid team, work on raising that. If you're looking for that feeling of efficiency, farm the dungeons that you can run quickly that give the best exp/stamina. On my phone I spent a lot of time farming Legendary Dragon's Footprints (you can get some rare monsters there, and 440 exp/stamina). Ocean of Heaven is also good, and gives you lots of mystic masks. If you can handle it, then you can do King of Gods for the highest exp/stamina, but it's a rough dungeon to run sometimes. But when you start hitting those stamina milestones (multiples of 50, in my experience, for additional runs of high stamina dungeons), there is definitely a very pleasant feeling of having earned something.

In that top quote, you took one of Jasmine's posts. You said shakes head at the first half of it, and that she should be explaining theory "like this" and then you quote the second half of the same post by the same person. So yes, you are being inconsistent and antagonistic towards 2/3 of the people on the forum.

I'm all for being a bit more open to beginning players, I asked a billion questions when I first joined here, as did Quietus (we are two of the newer members) and everyone else. And in that vein I'm really happy that Anarion posted earlier explaining exactly what was a frustrating and (in my mind) clearing up some of the problems so that we can try to be better at helping in the future. Now, you've brought something to our attention, and I appreciate that, but you don't need to speak for Anarion at this point and you haven't asked any questions yourself. So lets try to take the tone down several notches, please.

Am I still considered new? :smalltongue: In seriousness, yes. I have no doubt that some of the questions I've asked have been spectacularly stupid, I remember asking something about what "recover x turns of bind" meant at one point. I haven't always gotten answers to my questions the first time I asked, but when that's come up I've just asked a second time. And where more detail was needed, asking solved that too.

And a slight aside : I wish I had Ra, so I could see how I handle it. I also want Sonia Gran when we get her, but honestly I don't see how a team with her would outdo what Kali can manage right now.

But as far as team familiarization goes, I definitely have the MOST teams that I can use here on this forum (Kauai can give me a run, but not sure). That's because my box is "jacked" up with REM because the gold dragon bit my wallet (lol). And I too like collecting and having variety. A bunch of my teams are fully skilled too. My teams might not be strong as Jasmine and Obyrns and maybe not even Oytra's, but the variety I have lets me keep up and my orbing is pretty decent, so outside of the extreme rushes, I have teams for pretty much everything. Extreme rushes I just don't got the skills yet I think.

How many teams do you have? I'm curious how far behind I am. :smalltongue:

Otravyat

2015-05-09, 02:02 PM

Am I still considered new? :smalltongue: In seriousness, yes. I have no doubt that some of the questions I've asked have been spectacularly stupid, I remember asking something about what "recover x turns of bind" meant at one point. I haven't always gotten answers to my questions the first time I asked, but when that's come up I've just asked a second time. And where more detail was needed, asking solved that too.

I just mean new on the timeline. We will ALWAYS be new compared to Siuis, Obyrn, Jasmine, etc. Not new to the game, just newer than them on the forum. :smallsmile:

Fax Celestis

2015-05-09, 02:06 PM

For those of you asking, SiuiS got banned a week or two back. Idk what about, but it's there.

137beth

2015-05-09, 02:20 PM

Today is my 350th day of PAD:smile:

Still no sign of the game becoming repetitive/boring, I can probably keep it up for at least another year.

Quietus

2015-05-09, 03:02 PM

Welp! Decided to try something I wasn't sure of. It appears that I can manage my way through Legendary Dragon's Footprints, at least... I definitely won't be capable of King of Gods yet, need more levels for that. But farming Succubus may have just become far, far easier!

Kauai

2015-05-09, 03:24 PM

Ignoring the current back and forth, let me see if I can answer this. It's actually a hard question to answer because it comes down to stuff like tone and word choice.

I think, the issue might be that I'm not playing the game for the same reason other people are right now. I don't particularly enjoy farming penguins outside of a "this is optimal on Mondays" efficiency feeling. Tuesday-Sunday I want things to aim for because I'm mostly fine on evo mats except for a continual lack of dub mythlits. So, like, when I asked about Ronia, it wasn't because I wanted a better team than Urd, it was because the idea of starting to farm up a third team appealed to me. Being told that actually I just couldn't do that made me kinda sad because a goal that had caught my attention was dismissed.

Apologies if I contributed at all to how you're feeling at this point. I know I've come off the wrong way in the forum a few times and got some folks miffed. When it comes to Ronia, I think I probably run her the most out of everyone here. That's primarily because I'm lazy, as I'm used to her playstyle and end up just swapping out utility subs as needed to clear certain dungeons. But again, the reason why I can use her for the harder content is because I have the subs. My box is utterly ridiculous (for various reasons I've described in the past; basically I chased the REM for specific monsters and ended up with all kinds of others along the way), so I have a very large stable to choose from. Example: the default team I use that clears a surprisingly large number of things for me is Ronia bookends with subs Ronia/Ronia/ADQ Hera Ur/Lu Bu. Occasionally I'll swap out one Ronia with Awoken Ceres. For Wednesday mask runs where there's skill binding, my team is Ronia bookends with Dark Chester/Red Chester/Persephone/Lu Bu. The Chesters give me full skill bind resist and Persephone is an orb change for use in the early floors. If there's a dungeon where I'm not sure if I can punch through a floor's high defense, I might bring Shiva. Sometimes I bring Haku who is skilled up so is a decent orb changer as well.

But notice that those teams I listed are VERY REM heavy, and most people might be able to build some but not all of those teams. That's why I tend to not bring those up. It works for me because I have the pieces, but for someone who doesn't have them? It either will irritate them because it might seem like I'm bragging about what I have, or might make a person feel like they should chase the REM. I don't want to lead anyone into that trap, so I tried to make suggestions based on what you have.

My early Ronia teams were actually a struggle to use because they weren't leveled and skilled enough to provide me enough power. It took time (and stones for stamina because I'm impatient) to get them to where they are now. My skill has also improved (surprisingly, since I use Ronia). Levictus was the one who first gave me Ronia guidance, and I took that and ran with it. I can come up with suggestions for you for Ronia, but the reality is that you'll have to obtain other subs for her than what you've currently got in your PADHerder.

I was also somewhat disappointed about the frequent and repeat advice to build teams with Echidna. I mean, woo, lucky me she actually dropped within two days of my asking for help and was enough to push my team from having trouble to smashing Hera and Two Heroes. But that was a low percentage scenario. When I got it, it mostly sounded like I was being told I just had to wait a few weeks until her special dungeon rotated back around.

OK that's probably my fault for this one. But honestly, when a team is suboptimal or underleveled Echidna makes a world of difference. The delay provides time to do additional damage as well as heal back up. She was critical for me in my early days when I struggled to take down Rainbow Keeper within 5 rounds. I had a relatively weak Haku team, and needed Echidna to buy me more time as I used to struggle to activate her. Jasmine was the one who kept drumming into my head the need to effectively stall as I had a bad habit of trying to hit as hard as I could on every turn. So I had to learn how to stall long enough in the earlier floors so she would be up in time for the Rainbow Keeper.

Anyway, Echidna is an amazingly useful sub which is why everyone emphasizes trying to get one as soon as possible and then leveling her up. She really helps a LOT in clearing the earlier, more difficult content.

Basically, stepping back a level of abstraction, most of the conversation here is on interesting strategy, team comps, cool dungeon specific plans. But the reaction to the point of the game I'm at seems to keep being a variation of "there's nothing interesting for you, just go farm." Which I think is what makes me feel that I'm being a distraction here. There's simply nothing interesting to talk about until I can start trying to poke around the daily descends.

I felt that way when I first stumbled onto this forum as I didn't understand a lot of the terminology and strategies that were being discussed. So in retrospect, I can see why you were asking for the "glossary" to be added to the front of the thread as I know exactly what you mean. But in all honesty, I've found the folks here to be very helpful and friendly. Extremely more so than places like puzzleanddragonsforum, where I struggled to get any kind of advice. Sorry that you feel like you're being a distraction; that certainly is not the case. I'll try to be more responsive (though again, I'm far from being the smartest person here so I usually wait for the better players to chime in).

But as far as team familiarization goes, I definitely have the MOST teams that I can use here on this forum (Kauai can give me a run, but not sure).

I can probably build the most teams (out of well, probably anybody lol. Not a good thing, as it shows how much I've REM-ed). But I lack the familiarity and the know-how to use them properly. I can build Obryn's Ra team but I don't have the skill to use it. Can build Anubis teams as well but can't handle him either. lol I did toy with LKali and it was fun (and actually I should probably use that team more often; very powerful). I've got a bunch of subs to make a solid non-Blonia blue team (skilled and all, except for SQ which I know I need to work on :P), but need some levels on them. Missing Verdandi which is now on my wish/want list. That's a team you can build that I surely can't, and I want to try it. lol (And after all this time I STILL don't have Venus.)

Academia

2015-05-09, 04:01 PM

And a slight aside : I wish I had Ra, so I could see how I handle it. I also want Sonia Gran when we get her, but honestly I don't see how a team with her would outdo what Kali can manage right now.

How many teams do you have? I'm curious how far behind I am. :smalltongue:

23... without counting the ones that are similar.

Quietus

2015-05-09, 04:22 PM

23... without counting the ones that are similar.

Oof. Yeah, I'm not quite that deep yet. I'm assuming we're only counting teams that are, at least, near max level. My stuff contains...

Two low cost teams (D/D bats, meager fire team that needs a new leader)
One primary Devil team (Lu Bu dark rows)
One Dragons (Gronia-led)
One color combo (Kali TPA)
Two general green (G/R Verdandi, and Parvati TPA when we get Awoken Parvati)
Two HP conditional TPA (GZL, Fagan)
One extreme HP conditional (Goemon, I haven't skilled him up though, waiting for Uvo)

Stuff I'm not using yet, but would love to : Bastet, Anubis, Athena, Sun Wukong (x2), Healers (Valk etc, I have the pieces but haven't leveled them), RGY, Andromeda (Have the pieces, but want them max skilled before I use them), Blonia, Kirin

So as it stands right now, I have ten teams I would feel comfortable fielding either now, or immediately after their Uvo are released. And lots of other neat stuff I've been playing with.

Sallera

2015-05-09, 04:32 PM

Why antagonism?
I try to maintain a general principle of not engaging people of your particular persuasion, but really, mate? Like begets like, aye?

Ignoring the current back and forth, let me see if I can answer this. It's actually a hard question to answer because it comes down to stuff like tone and word choice.

I think, the issue might be that I'm not playing the game for the same reason other people are right now. I don't particularly enjoy farming penguins outside of a "this is optimal on Mondays" efficiency feeling. Tuesday-Sunday I want things to aim for because I'm mostly fine on evo mats except for a continual lack of dub mythlits. So, like, when I asked about Ronia, it wasn't because I wanted a better team than Urd, it was because the idea of starting to farm up a third team appealed to me. Being told that actually I just couldn't do that made me kinda sad because a goal that had caught my attention was dismissed.

I was also somewhat disappointed about the frequent and repeat advice to build teams with Echidna. I mean, woo, lucky me she actually dropped within two days of my asking for help and was enough to push my team from having trouble to smashing Hera and Two Heroes. But that was a low percentage scenario. When I got it, it mostly sounded like I was being told I just had to wait a few weeks until her special dungeon rotated back around.

Basically, stepping back a level of abstraction, most of the conversation here is on interesting strategy, team comps, cool dungeon specific plans. But the reaction to the point of the game I'm at seems to keep being a variation of "there's nothing interesting for you, just go farm." Which I think is what makes me feel that I'm being a distraction here. There's simply nothing interesting to talk about until I can start trying to poke around the daily descends.
Okay, that's quite understandable. I certainly remember the feeling of wanting to progress and try new things with my first account, especially when being told to focus on getting Hera (whom I never once actually used :smalltongue:). Others have addressed the grinding part already, but I do want to clarify a few things. (I've had the experience of starting over with a second account after learning a fair bit about team-building and how to focus, and the difference was very clear.) Basically, mon levels count for a lot. Building new teams frequently (as I did myself the first time around) really can give you a false sense of weakness compared to maxing one team and then using it to build up your others. But yes, maxing your first couple mons takes quite a while, and I can see it being frustrating if you don't have something powerful built up to fall back on for a break.

A lot of it comes down to the grinding forming a chain. You can build a Ronia team, absolutely - it won't be as powerful as an Urd team without REM subs, that's just the nature of their leader skills, but of course you can do it if you want to. But some of the stuff you'd want for that, like Hera-Ur, you'll need a strong team already to get, which requires some grinding to raise levels, and then more grinding to level and skill up the subs you get from those dungeons, and so on... You can just get simple, cheap subs for any lead, and build up a team organically. It'll probably go a lot faster, though, if you pick one team to focus on, decide which mons you'll be keeping on that team for a long time (generally starting with your leader, and moving down to essentials like Echidna for Urd, Highlander for Vishnu, and so on), and raise them to high enough levels that the team becomes capable of clearing whatever you need to in order to acquire and build up everything else you want. (I like at least a ~70-ish average level for a new team before I take it into descends, but ~50-60 will get you through almost all the normals and technicals, and it sounds like you're nearing or around that point already.) If penguins aren't your thing, consider catching Super jewel/metal dragons when they're available. You just need one mon with a strong poison or armour break, or simply a large damage burst, which Urd might be able to do on her own depending on your level. (A Red Odin or Shiva friend lead is good if you don't have any of your own.) It's less stamina efficient, if I recall correctly, but much more time efficient.

I do apologize if I made it sound like Echidna was a necessity for you to progress, or something like that. Certainly, she's incredibly useful, but I only mentioned her because her survey dungeon was coming up in a few days at the time, so it was a good opportunity to get one. (Personally, I'm not a fan of grinding for 2% drop rate stuff in normals. I feel it's more efficient, and more fun, to spend that stamina leveling your team to the point where you can run dungeons with better drop rates, unless there really is no way to go without a particular sub - and that's rarely the case.)

Quietus

2015-05-09, 05:00 PM

I do apologize if I made it sound like Echidna was a necessity for you to progress, or something like that. Certainly, she's incredibly useful, but I only mentioned her because her survey dungeon was coming up in a few days at the time, so it was a good opportunity to get one. (Personally, I'm not a fan of grinding for 2% drop rate stuff in normals. I feel it's more efficient, and more fun, to spend that stamina leveling your team to the point where you can run dungeons with better drop rates, unless there really is no way to go without a particular sub - and that's rarely the case.)

2% dungeons are absolutely a waste. I got my Naga out of one, purely by luck, and I've used it to blow through material - but I've also spent a tremendous amount of time and stamina trying to get Succubus from her equivalent, and nothing. I should have spent that stamina improving my teams until I could do what I'm doing now, pushing through until I can farm it from Legendary Dragons' Footprints. As an added benefit, when leveling lower level cards, the fodder from these dungeons is tremendous. Probably good to keep feeding off until level 40+, which is fantastic. I usually feed low level fodder until the exp:stamina is 1:1.

The only reason I stuck to the 2% was because I could avoid stamina waste, and primarily because I'm stubborn as crap. :smalltongue:

Jasmine

2015-05-09, 05:06 PM

I think, the issue might be that I'm not playing the game for the same reason other people are right now. I don't particularly enjoy farming penguins outside of a "this is optimal on Mondays" efficiency feeling. Tuesday-Sunday I want things to aim for because I'm mostly fine on evo mats except for a continual lack of dub mythlits. So, like, when I asked about Ronia, it wasn't because I wanted a better team than Urd, it was because the idea of starting to farm up a third team appealed to me. Being told that actually I just couldn't do that made me kinda sad because a goal that had caught my attention was dismissed.

I was also somewhat disappointed about the frequent and repeat advice to build teams with Echidna. I mean, woo, lucky me she actually dropped within two days of my asking for help and was enough to push my team from having trouble to smashing Hera and Two Heroes. But that was a low percentage scenario. When I got it, it mostly sounded like I was being told I just had to wait a few weeks until her special dungeon rotated back around.

Basically, stepping back a level of abstraction, most of the conversation here is on interesting strategy, team comps, cool dungeon specific plans. But the reaction to the point of the game I'm at seems to keep being a variation of "there's nothing interesting for you, just go farm." Which I think is what makes me feel that I'm being a distraction here. There's simply nothing interesting to talk about until I can start trying to poke around the daily descends.
I don't think that anyone actually enjoys farming penguins for farming penguins - they either do it because they like seeing Lv. Max, or they need the additional firepower to beat dungeons with. It's actually a lot easier now after the removal of needing jewel dragons to evo, which makes it about 50% faster :smallsmile:

Just to clarify, when someone says you should build a team with Xmonster, it doesn't mean the team is useless without said monster, just that you should keep an eye out and perhaps try to farm one when you have spare stamina. As a personal example, I started with a Horus planning to not IAP and not roll REM at all (which is what I did for 6 months). I looked through the farmable monsters, saw Echidna and immediately saw the power of 3 free turns. I spent ranks 31-63 trying to farm a Naga from Caste of Satan-Witches ball. She didn't drop. When mondays/thursdays/jewels came, I farmed penguins. On other days, I played special dungeons if they seemed interesting to me, or progressed in normals/techs if they didn't. Two months later (equivalent to 1 month now at 5 min stam), when I finally obtained Echidna at rank 160, I had already cleared Hera/2 Heroes/Herais Legend+Mythical/Valk Legend/Goemon Legend/Zeus, and immediately after obtaining her, I slotted her in and beat Friday Mythical, SS- King of Gods, and Endless Corridors. This is with a grand total of 1 REM monster - my starter Horus. Just because you don't have the "best" subs doesn't mean you're helpless :smallamused:

If you'd like to join in more on the conversation, I think a good idea is to be more clear with your goals. If you say you want to clear a specific dungeon, it'll be a lot easier to give relevant advice - like Kauai said, sometimes you need high damage mega spike, sometimes you need bind resist, sometimes you need poison, sometimes you just need extra stalling power. I showed you a farmable all-purpose team that functions reasonably well, but if you want more, you'll have to be clear with what you're looking for. You're not finding dungeons for your team to tackle, you're building teams to tackle dungeons :smallsmile:

But until right now, with this post, I assumed that as a new player you were trying to get advice for progression and not farming up another team. And the unfortunate truth is that for progression this is a very long term game, so unfortunately a lot of advice re. progression just becomes, "well you could do this or this and then move forward in a few weeks". I spent three weeks at low rank farming nothing but low tier normals looking for naga and siren. And you are right that you are in the heart of that right now. It isn't that we can't give you advice for the way that you play the game, we are more than happy to, but at least in my case I just didn't realize the difference until you clarified here.
This is a pretty good summation. You have limited resources, you can either focus on one team to get out of the rut ASAP, or you can amuse yourself with 'side quests' but also making the rut longer. Either way is fine, but personally I don't think you need advice to play around with your teams - figuring things out yourself is half the fun!

I think half the reason there's this jump in difficulty is that the game thinks you're invested enough and figures it can get you to start paying :P

There is no inconsistency.

Third quote is me demonstrating how second quote is a better format. You also saying second quote is better format means you agree. Why antagonism?
You say there are only excuses and no full answers, after quoting a full explanation and saying that it was good. That's inconsistent.

You claim you want the theory and to understand, to learn to fish. When given explanations to why something occurs, you say no I don't want that, just give me the fish. That's hypocritical.

You say to compare Ra tips to Ronia tips. Have you actually been reading anything past your initial post? The target you're bashing on even posted a teambuilding tutorial in the post immediately prior to yours, six hours ahead of your post. That makes you sound like the kid who screams the whole class and then goes home to tell his parents that his teacher didn't teach him anything.

I wish I had a Ra to be not as good as Obryns with.
Ya know, you don't need a Ra to learn to play Ra. Obryn is on most of our friend's lists, yeah? I use him all the time when playing No-Dupe dungeons, and damn is it stressful. Given my team isn't set up defensively like it should be, but still - 6 colors is a lot harder than it sounds.

For descends, you want a high level team to have the stats to handle them. That means grinding, either for Pengdra or in the urgent jewel dragon dungeons.

As far as generic advice, I would offer this : If you have one very solid team, work on raising that. If you're looking for that feeling of efficiency, farm the dungeons that you can run quickly that give the best exp/stamina. On my phone I spent a lot of time farming Legendary Dragon's Footprints (you can get some rare monsters there, and 440 exp/stamina). Ocean of Heaven is also good, and gives you lots of mystic masks. If you can handle it, then you can do King of Gods for the highest exp/stamina, but it's a rough dungeon to run sometimes. But when you start hitting those stamina milestones (multiples of 50, in my experience, for additional runs of high stamina dungeons), there is definitely a very pleasant feeling of having earned something.

And a slight aside : I wish I had Ra, so I could see how I handle it. I also want Sonia Gran when we get her, but honestly I don't see how a team with her would outdo what Kali can manage right now.
Or get better at the game :smallwink:

And yeah, focus is efficient. Just depends on how much you value efficiency and how much you value experimentation. That's not really something we can help you with.

See above for "wish I had a Ra".

I just mean new on the timeline. We will ALWAYS be new compared to Siuis, Obyrn, Jasmine, etc. Not new to the game, just newer than them on the forum. :smallsmile:
In my mind I think of Obryn/Diego/Siuis/Starwulf as Gen1, Me/Erloas/Levi/Soep as Gen2, Kauai/Aca/Fax as Gen3, Otra/Sallera/Quietus as Gen4 and the new guys as Gen5.

Progress wise there's going to be massive flunctuations depending on dedication to efficiency and amount of IAP, and it's kinda hard to objectively measure. Some people are better at comboing, some at farming, some at math, some at mechanics, and some are WAY better at pulling dragon arms :smallbiggrin:

For those of you asking, SiuiS got banned a week or two back. Idk what about, but it's there.
Hm, do you know if it's permanent? Maybe the new guy is just SiuiS trying to troll me.:smallyuk:

ADQ Hera
KAUAI HOW DARE YOU USE A FARMABLE MONSTER I'M DISAPPOINTED IN YOU.
You will need to swap her for devil Horus ASAP.

And yes that's all I got from that blob of yours >:)

Anarion

2015-05-09, 05:25 PM

I'm sorry that you didn't get the response that you were looking for with Ronia. I know that I just missed you asking in the first place. Among all this bickering have you found the response you needed?

Yes, and quite a few more today. Thanks everyone. :smallsmile:

I probably am going to stick with Urd and just raise Ronia stuff on the side for variety. The big challenge I'm seeing with Urd right now is hp. I think I do need to just get 30-40 levels on a bunch of my guys. Mechdragon trash one-shots me if I do one turn without a fire combo, for example.

trying to get advice for progression and not farming up another team. And the unfortunate truth is that for progression this is a very long term game, so unfortunately a lot of advice re. progression just becomes, "well you could do this or this and then move forward in a few weeks". I spent three weeks at low rank farming nothing but low tier normals looking for naga and siren. And you are right that you are in the heart of that right now. It isn't that we can't give you advice for the way that you play the game, we are more than happy to, but at least in my case I just didn't realize the difference until you clarified here.

The funny thing is that progression actually seems relatively clear. Stuck on Starlight Sanctuary because the numbers are too large until I get enough HP to survive at least one hit from stuff, stuck on water only dungeon until Tuesday because I need stuff to evolve ogres, and I don't have the stats for descends quite yet.

So it's more, like, what do I do to stay interested, right now? And, at least for me, spicing up my high stam dungeon farming with 10-20 stam worth of picking up random stuff for new teams or to skill up stuff I already have fills that for me. Next thing is probably to try and get a vampire, for example.

23... without counting the ones that are similar.

*Whistles*

I try to maintain a general principle of not engaging people of your particular persuasion, but really, mate? Like begets like, aye?

That entire line of conversation is kind of a hilarious dead end, I think. Though it prompted me to express my thoughts somewhat more eloquently than I had up to that point, so I'm somewhat grateful.

~50-60 will get you through almost all the normals and technicals, and it sounds like you're nearing or around that point already.) If penguins aren't your thing, consider catching Super jewel/metal dragons when they're available. You just need one mon with a strong poison or armour break, or simply a large damage burst, which Urd might be able to do on her own depending on your level. (A Red Odin or Shiva friend lead is good if you don't have any of your own.) It's less stamina efficient, if I recall correctly, but much more time efficient.

I can burst all colors of super king dragons now. Urd can do everything but water, and for water my subpar Vishnu team has a max rank hellwind taur demon, so he just defense breaks them and it's like a free 4x multiplier to everyone cuz of type advantage. They make me sad though since 50 stam on a low xp dungeon right now means I'm done playing after that for several hours.

In general, my current skill level is such that a perfect Urd skill activation usually results in either 3 fire combos with some TPA or 4 fire combos with an average total of 7-10 combos overall depending on skyfall. I've got a couple enhanced fire orb awakenings on the team, so each of those combos gets maybe an extra 12% on average from that. Best case was my absurd combo to kill Hera, where the overall team did 1.5m burst in one turn without any kind of slime effect using 13 total combos, 5 of which were fire and two of which were TPA. Realistically, though, 100-200k from Urd specifically is consistently achievable, which bursts all the high defense things except the end of Starlight Sanctuary first stage.

At any rate, thanks for all the advice everyone, appreciate the support.

Quietus

2015-05-09, 05:31 PM

Kudos on taking the right message there Anarion, it's always good to see cooler heads prevail. On the subject of Super Kings and being done playing for a while, be careful with that. That's how I ended up with a nasty magic stone habit for a while there. And once you start with spending stones on stamina, it's really easy to keep doing so. What I recommend is that on days with super kings, set yourself up to do the maximum number of runs available to you based on your stamina bar, with enough experience to level on doing the last run. Then burn the second bar too. It does leave you without playing for a few hours, but it also produces a large amount of focused experience, which it sounds like you need. Once you can do KoG reliably, you'll have plenty more stamina than you require to level, so you can probably sneak a run of pengdras into each bar of stamina, which will help with leveling things.

Otravyat

2015-05-09, 05:36 PM

2% dungeons are absolutely a waste. I got my Naga out of one, purely by luck, and I've used it to blow through material - but I've also spent a tremendous amount of time and stamina trying to get Succubus from her equivalent, and nothing. I should have spent that stamina improving my teams until I could do what I'm doing now, pushing through until I can farm it from Legendary Dragons' Footprints. As an added benefit, when leveling lower level cards, the fodder from these dungeons is tremendous. Probably good to keep feeding off until level 40+, which is fantastic. I usually feed low level fodder until the exp:stamina is 1:1.

The only reason I stuck to the 2% was because I could avoid stamina waste, and primarily because I'm stubborn as crap. :smalltongue:

Legendary Dragons are still kinda new though. My first naga the ONLY options were machines, normals, or wait months for her survey. Made normals seems more appealing.

Jasmine

2015-05-09, 05:39 PM

So it's more, like, what do I do to stay interested, right now? And, at least for me, spicing up my high stam dungeon farming with 10-20 stam worth of picking up random stuff for new teams or to skill up stuff I already have fills that for me. Next thing is probably to try and get a vampire, for example.

In general, my current skill level is such that a perfect Urd skill activation
What's interesting to you? What I did a lot of the time was run through the T5 normals (Hyperion to Ocean of Heaven). They give great exp, and you can reasonably expect to rank up 3+ times a day, giving you lots of playtime, while giving you lots of opportunity to practice. With the advent of the dragon dungeons, those are a good option too, for more color concentrated exp drops and the chance for useful healer girls/knights/dragons at the expense of a bit of rank up exp.

If interesting means a brand new dungeon every day, I'm afraid I think this is the wrong game for you :P When you see veterans discussing these cool new dungeons, you don't see all the preparation behind the scenes. I think most of the vets here are clearing 4 new dungeons a month (2 biweekly dragons, 1 new descend, one old descend that you can finally clear).

By skill level, that typically refers to how many combos you can make without orb changing. I think 5-6 per turn is a decent place to aim for a early/mid game player. Combo count after a full board chance is mostly dependent on your luck with the spawned orbs and relatively little to do with skill.

PS: Techs Pengs are 4500xp/stam, Pengvill is 6000 mixed color, Kings are 5300, King Carnival is 5800 mixed color, Fatty is 8400 mixed color with >50% black. (those racists)

PPS: Anarion I know this sounds dumb but try starlight using your vishnu team with a green odin friend (ult evo). You should be able to get through the first 3 stages reasonably easily, Hera and Zeus take some firepower.

Anarion

2015-05-09, 06:01 PM

What's interesting to you? What I did a lot of the time was run through the T5 normals (Hyperion to Ocean of Heaven). They give great exp, and you can reasonably expect to rank up 3+ times a day, giving you lots of playtime, while giving you lots of opportunity to practice. With the advent of the dragon dungeons, those are a good option too, for more color concentrated exp drops and the chance for useful healer girls/knights/dragons at the expense of a bit of rank up exp.

If interesting means a brand new dungeon every day, I'm afraid I think this is the wrong game for you :P When you see veterans discussing these cool new dungeons, you don't see all the preparation behind the scenes. I think most of the vets here are clearing 4 new dungeons a month (2 biweekly dragons, 1 new descend, one old descend that you can finally clear).

I think it's having something to get out of the dungeon. Skydragons and two heroes feel good to me right now because the drop rate for echidna is less horrific than all the earlier ones and getting highlander/berserk are both useful (especially highlander for the Vishnu team I still want to make). Mechdragons feels just out of my reach, though I actually cleared Betelgeuse by stoning twice.

By skill level, that typically refers to how many combos you can make without orb changing. I think 5-6 per turn is a decent place to aim for a early/mid game player. Combo count after a full board chance is mostly dependent on your luck with the spawned orbs and relatively little to do with skill.

I was discussing that in context of burst. I think it's possible with a field swap to get 8-9 or even a full 10 combos before skyfalls if you're quick enough. I just can't.

My average on random fields is a fairly consistent 4. I get 5 sometimes, especially if I'm only focusing on combos and don't need to worry about a particular color. On bad fields or when I'm trying to get, say a fire combo that's 3 really separated orbs, I'll only get 3, sometimes only 2 though I feel really bad if I do only 2. I find 6 a turn almost completely out of my reach, though I will say that on challenge runs where I've grabbed friends with a +time awakening or two, my average goes up to a pretty consistent 5.

PS: Techs Pengs are 4500xp/stam, Pengvill is 6000 mixed color, Kings are 5300, King Carnival is 5800 mixed color, Fatty is 8400 mixed color with >50% black. (those racists)

Interesting.

Academia

2015-05-09, 06:01 PM

My Teams:

Kirin, Pandora, Andromeda, Yamato cheese team, WuKong, Karin, Leilan, Haku, Genbu, RSonia, BSonia, Verdandi, Izanagi/Athena, Saravarti, A.Hades, A.Merniva, Rodin/Shiva, GZL, Nut, Bastet, Isis, Kushi, Ama, CaoCao, LKali, Apoc/Indra, Healers (Water and Light), Red chasers and DD Bats.

Urd is in progress.... DMeta can wait as its pretty much like GZL.

Imma exclude GrOdin and Asteroth devil grind team.... Hate using the.... Don't go into mono color teams with me LOL...

From my experience, a lot of these teams are similiar but diff attributes.

Damn team Developement Is why I still don't have a fully maxed +egg team.

Jasmine

2015-05-09, 06:25 PM

I think it's having something to get out of the dungeon. Skydragons and two heroes feel good to me right now because the drop rate for echidna is less horrific than all the earlier ones and getting highlander/berserk are both useful (especially highlander for the Vishnu team I still want to make). Mechdragons feels just out of my reach, though I actually cleared Betelgeuse by stoning twice.

I was discussing that in context of burst. I think it's possible with a field swap to get 8-9 or even a full 10 combos before skyfalls if you're quick enough. I just can't.

My average on random fields is a fairly consistent 4. I get 5 sometimes, especially if I'm only focusing on combos and don't need to worry about a particular color. On bad fields or when I'm trying to get, say a fire combo that's 3 really separated orbs, I'll only get 3, sometimes only 2 though I feel really bad if I do only 2. I find 6 a turn almost completely out of my reach, though I will say that on challenge runs where I've grabbed friends with a +time awakening or two, my average goes up to a pretty consistent 5.
Might have missed this since I probably edited it in while you were replying.
"PPS: Anarion I know this sounds dumb but try starlight using your vishnu team with a green odin friend (ult evo). You should be able to get through the first 3 stages reasonably easily, Hera and Zeus take some (more) firepower."

So your concept of 'getting something' more specifically involves monster drops, right? Since you do get lots of monster exp/rank exp/plus eggs out of farming other dungeons. In that case, you can take some time in the fire and dark dragons - max skilled Echi and Lilith are pretty useful. Hera is a royal ass to skill up so I don't know if you'll want to go down that path, and for 2 Heroes it depends a bit on how impatient you are - it's more efficient to skill them up when the Poring tower comes around, but that's unpredictable so if you have immediate use for them, might as well. That can take up your stamina for a good few weeks, and by that time you might have some new goals!

I would argue against continues unless the drop is really really useful.

8-9-10 combos is possible sometimes, but more common in bicolor boards, and even then most people don't get that high. Mediocre skill could be involved, but trust me when I say it's often just not possible to get above 8, especially when you throw TPA into the mix.

Don't worry too much about skill, although practice is good. I played my friends account briefly before I started, and I thought I was a genius because I would spend 3 turns setting up the board to do a 6 combo to activate his Okuninushi. I thought he was lying when he said you were supposed to activate every turn, and I didn't believe him until he showed me 10 turns in a row. Pretty humbling to see just how bad I was. Keep playing and you'll get better!

Quietus

2015-05-09, 07:58 PM

PS: Techs Pengs are 4500xp/stam, Pengvill is 6000 mixed color, Kings are 5300, King Carnival is 5800 mixed color, Fatty is 8400 mixed color with >50% black. (those racists)

I'm assuming Pengville 6000 xp/stam is after evolution? Does that take into account the stamina to gather dragon plants?

My Teams:

Kirin, Pandora, Andromeda, Yamato cheese team, WuKong, Karin, Leilan, Haku, Genbu, RSonia, BSonia, Verdandi, Izanagi/Athena, Saravarti, A.Hades, A.Merniva, Rodin/Shiva, GZL, Nut, Bastet, Isis, Kushi, Ama, CaoCao, LKali, Apoc/Indra, Healers (Water and Light), Red chasers and DD Bats.

Urd is in progress.... DMeta can wait as its pretty much like GZL.

Imma exclude GrOdin and Asteroth devil grind team.... Hate using the.... Don't go into mono color teams with me LOL...

From my experience, a lot of these teams are similiar but diff attributes.

Damn team Developement Is why I still don't have a fully maxed +egg team.

Hmmm.. I have a Nut, as well, but I don't really have any real desire to use her. And I suppose I could also run a Haku team, though I didn't count that because it would mostly just be a flip of my Devil team. Swap the positions of Lu Bu and Haku, swap something out for Vampire. I don't have a Pandora though, which is why I've never really worried about Haku teams.

So your concept of 'getting something' more specifically involves monster drops, right? Since you do get lots of monster exp/rank exp/plus eggs out of farming other dungeons. In that case, you can take some time in the fire and dark dragons - max skilled Echi and Lilith are pretty useful. Hera is a royal ass to skill up so I don't know if you'll want to go down that path, and for 2 Heroes it depends a bit on how impatient you are - it's more efficient to skill them up when the Poring tower comes around, but that's unpredictable so if you have immediate use for them, might as well. That can take up your stamina for a good few weeks, and by that time you might have some new goals!

I will echo this sentiment. My intention on my tablet, now that I can do Dragon dungeons, is going to be going and collecting a Lilith. I don't really want to spend my time trying to max skill either of them out of those dungeons, what I may end up doing is farming the water dungeon to raise my Andromeda team while I rank up. At the very least, I want to get everyone on that team to the last form I can manage, and up to level 50. Then I'll burn some Pengdra and jewel dragons to get Amberjack up to 70 for evolution. As it stands now, I have Hatsume in her uvo, need to level Karin and then I can farm her uvo materials, and I need blue masks for Andromeda and Marine Rider. Hoping to get one more of those next time the evo material pal machine comes around, I'll be nearing 100% skill lock resist if I do that.

In other news, I finally got a max skill Flammesickle! Decided to farm a few Oneton preemptively before RGY's skill gets the one turn buff, fed off the extra insect dragons into the one I'd been building. Now I have to decide whether I want to farm a second one, or try and find other people who've made max skill fire insect dragons to pair him with for low cost dungeons. Also fed off the green chimeras I collected, I'm now slvl 18 on Brachys, out of 22. Four more to go, and I can get 1.3x damage for 2 turns every 8 turns!

Kauai

2015-05-09, 08:26 PM

KAUAI HOW DARE YOU USE A FARMABLE MONSTER I'M DISAPPOINTED IN YOU.
You will need to swap her for devil Horus ASAP.

And yes that's all I got from that blob of yours >:)

Ha ha ha. :P lol

I've got a crapton of dupes of other gods but Horus is not one of them. Makes me very sad to think of doing the devil uvo due to suffering in trying to skill him up. He is only at skill level 5 out of 12 though, so I GUESS I could live with doing it. He would be great for my Ronia team tho.

though I actually cleared Betelgeuse by stoning twice.

Just a word of caution, be careful when doing this. I did it more times than I care to admit when I was being impatient to clear things and it can quickly become a bad habit (Jasmine scolded me for that; I kept wanting to clear anything and everything as soon as it was available). Not judging or condemning you for it, just sharing my experience. :)

My Teams:

OK I need to reword what I said earlier. I have all the PIECES to make a ton of different teams, but the various cards aren't necessarily ready for action (i.e., unskilled, underleveled, or whatever). So yeah, you probably have more viable teams available right now. I need to catch up! lol

Quietus

2015-05-09, 08:43 PM

137beth

2015-05-09, 10:07 PM

OK I need to reword what I said earlier. I have all the PIECES to make a ton of different teams, but the various cards aren't necessarily ready for action (i.e., unskilled, underleveled, or whatever). So yeah, you probably have more viable teams available right now. I need to catch up! lol

Yea, that's where I am. My Ronia team is the closest to being ready: Two Ronias are max level and awoken (and one is UVOd and +297), and I have Hades, Hera, Hera Ur, Lilith, Baddie, Shiva, and Persephone all leveled and awoken. Hades and Hera are mostly skilled up.
But Persephone is not skilled up due to consistently terrible luck, which has stopped me from clearing a number of dungeons (I can't consistently survive the first floor of Zeus Vulcan with my Ronia team due to not having a low cooldown orb changer compatible with Ronia's leader skill). I also don't have a Drawn Joker, so any dungeon which calls for a low cooldown heartmaker is out of my Ronia team's reach. And, of course, my recently aquired third Ronia is not even evo'd yet, let alone a decent level.
Still though, I've gotten through mythical level dungeons with my Ronia team, so it's in decent shape.
I'm just ignoring the fact that there are certain Ronia teams I won't be able to make without further REM luck--I have no FAL or Lu Bu
My U&Y team basically just needs skillups (except Light and Blue Valk, who are both max skill).

My other teams, though, aren't anywhere close. I have a ton of REM water gods, about half of which are high level, but none (save blue valk) are skilled up, and a lot of them aren't awoken.
I also have a bunch of Balanced-type REM wood gods, but they are mostly mid-level, unawoken, unskilled.
And then I have most of what I need for a GZL team (GZL plus mini versions of his needed subs), but none of those monsters, including GZL himself, are leveled very much.
Light monsters are in a similar position--LMeta, LKali, and DQXQ are both high level, but the rest are either mid or low level and unskilled. Also, my King Shynee is not skilled up, and I have no light orb-enhancer, so I can't readily hit for enough to deal with bosses.

Grotteschi

2015-05-09, 10:31 PM

In that top quote, you took one of Jasmine's posts. You said shakes head at the first half of it, and that she should be explaining theory "like this" and then you quote the second half of the same post by the same person. So yes, you are being inconsistent and antagonistic towards 2/3 of the people on the forum.

There is no inconsistency in saying your past responses didn't work, this current response does work, more like this please. It is clear demarcation; before, not helpful. After, helpful. :smallconfused:

You say there are only excuses and no full answers, after quoting a full explanation and saying that it was good. That's inconsistent.

Not so. Those are separate, yes? Responses to academia, starwulf, You, et cetera. I understand your confusion. You are having three conversations as one conversation. Easy to misunderstand.

Academia talks past a question. I say, that wasn't a good answer. You say, it was good. I say, no, try more like Obryn's description. You say, game is more Rock Paper Scissors, but okay, here is a better answer. Starwulf says thread always answers questions, I say it didn't work this time. You and Otravyat says, we did answer the question, the academia says if answer isn't good enough ask again, then you say you did answer and I am just being inconsistent.

It is a tangle. If I explain reason for past statement and someone responds like it is a new statement, we go in circles. That is why keeping sequence together is important. It makes talk on forums coherent. I am sorry if I did not keep it in sequence well enough. I will try to be clearer when conversations mix, and say so. Will that be good?

Academia

2015-05-09, 11:09 PM

There is no inconsistency in saying your past responses didn't work, this current response does work, more like this please. It is clear demarcation; before, not helpful. After, helpful. :smallconfused:

Not so. Those are separate, yes? Responses to academia, starwulf, You, et cetera. I understand your confusion. You are having three conversations as one conversation. Easy to misunderstand.

Academia talks past a question. I say, that wasn't a good answer. You say, it was good. I say, no, try more like Obryn's description. You say, game is more Rock Paper Scissors, but okay, here is a better answer. Starwulf says thread always answers questions, I say it didn't work this time. You and Otravyat says, we did answer the question, the academia says if answer isn't good enough ask again, then you say you did answer and I am just being inconsistent.

It is a tangle. If I explain reason for past statement and someone responds like it is a new statement, we go in circles. That is why keeping sequence together is important. It makes talk on forums coherent. I am sorry if I did not keep it in sequence well enough. I will try to be clearer when conversations mix, and say so. Will that be good?

I miss SiuS now.... Are we gonna ever move on? This is no longer constructive.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-09, 11:22 PM

Quietus

2015-05-09, 11:41 PM

Today I bombed three stones into Tama Village. Three awakenings on Lu Bu, two on Athena, two on Claire, two on Ronia, six on Drake. Plus a fully awoken Grodintama and a fully awoken Rodintama from self-feedings.

Only had five actual tamadra, three Grodintama, and one Rodintama, which means six runs at five drops per run is 30 drops, less 9 non-babies gives me 21 babies, which I went 10/21 on. Go me.

Awesome, congrats! My experience with those babies is that I hit maybe 1/3 of them, so averaging about half is very cool.

::Edit:: Just looked at the challenge dungeons coming up. I want that woodpy, and to get it I have to beat level 8. I have NO idea how I'm going to do that without stoning it, the Michael/Noah/Sowilo/Vulcan quad at the end is disgusting. I'll have to make matches on each of those stages that would normally require an active. And some of them will still not go down from that.

Otravyat

2015-05-09, 11:47 PM

I miss SiuS now.... Are we gonna ever move on? This is no longer constructive.

This. I admitted that we hadn't fully answered (I didn't claim that I had answered it), I tried to drop the hostility, specifically posting about it, and this is going nowhere.

Quietus

2015-05-09, 11:48 PM

This. I admitted that we hadn't fully answered (I didn't claim that I had answered it), I tried to drop the hostility, specifically posting about it, and this is going nowhere.

Well, then I propose a new topic of conversation : The upcoming challenge dungeons. Anyone have ideas on how to handle the top tiers of these ones?

I might be able to do level 9 with Kali; Defoud will absolutely be a pain in the neck, unless I get lucky and his Heavenly Lightning gives me more fuel to smash him with. Karin shouldn't be too tough, she gives me a free turn to act. I just need to make sure I'm healed for Haku's preemptive. Two Kali shots will take down Leilan (or a double TPA, but...), and then I hit the parts where things get tough. I'll have to either end up stalling several turns on Meimei, or if he's up, drop Arcline on her to break through her defense. The trick is going to be either doing that and still having both Kali up and ready afterward, or making matches through Kirin's darkness. Fagan himself is Dark this time around, so I won't need Arcline for him; a double TPA from Kali ought to be enough to drop him.

Jasmine

2015-05-10, 02:57 AM

I'm assuming Pengville 6000 xp/stam is after evolution? Does that take into account the stamina to gather dragon plants
Yes and yes.

Just a word of caution, be careful when doing this. I did it more times than I care to admit when I was being impatient to clear things and it can quickly become a bad habit (Jasmine scolded me for that; I kept wanting to clear anything and everything as soon as it was available). Not judging or condemning you for it, just sharing my experience. :)
You got kicked off the throne after Quietus spent 14 stones on Draggie. I actually ran Draggie Legend today because I had full stam and no Goemon friends, took in Flash/Rowdy/Rowdy/Rowdy/Rowdy/Friend Asuka (level 5, lolol), was actually pretty easy.

(I can't consistently survive the first floor of Zeus Vulcan with my Ronia team due to not having a low cooldown orb changer compatible with Ronia's leader skill). I also don't have a Drawn Joker, so any dungeon which calls for a low cooldown heartmaker is out of my Ronia team's reach.
I'm just ignoring the fact that there are certain Ronia teams I won't be able to make without further REM luck--I have no FAL or Lu Bu
There's something called vampire :smallsmile: Also Hadar/Corpse Wyrm for FAL and run with Lubu friend. You can't blame everything on REM. Wasn't DJ in a recent dungeon rotation?

I miss SiuS now.... Are we gonna ever move on? This is no longer constructive.
Yeah at least with Siuis it's her saying something, I say no the math proves otherwise, Siuis says not everyone understands math, I say that doesn't mean the math isn't right, and she says ok it was just an opinion and I help her build new teams.

Got a good start going 2/3 on Fuma, then 0/5 twice, yuck. I don't think I'm gonna ever use this guy. Can we have some rider skillups please.

Anarion

2015-05-10, 03:25 AM

Wasn't DJ in a recent dungeon rotation?

Yes. I even managed to get one.

Sallera

2015-05-10, 05:19 AM

8 runs of Tama Village, 0 adults, 10/34 on babies. I don't know why I even bother hoping for average luck on those things any more. 'Least I got Ra and ADQ finished, but TDD's going to take a while at this rate.

137beth

2015-05-10, 07:29 AM

Whelp, I finally beat Medjedra. It took 99 turns stalling with Ronia, but wasn't particularly hard.

I'm hoping to get a light orb tomorrow for Valk....

Quietus

2015-05-10, 07:42 AM

You got kicked off the throne after Quietus spent 14 stones on Draggie.

:smallredface:

Got a good start going 2/3 on Fuma, then 0/5 twice, yuck. I don't think I'm gonna ever use this guy. Can we have some rider skillups please.

Oh god please yes, I don't want to have to use Shynpy to skill up Arthur. I've got one more skill level to max Arcline, then I'm going to save up five Shynpy. If we haven't gotten wind of the FF collab in NA by that point, they'll be used to max skill Arthur in one go.

Academia

2015-05-10, 10:00 AM

:smallredface:

Oh god please yes, I don't want to have to use Shynpy to skill up Arthur. I've got one more skill level to max Arcline, then I'm going to save up five Shynpy. If we haven't gotten wind of the FF collab in NA by that point, they'll be used to max skill Arthur in one go.

Mine all got swallowed by my Indra... the guy was a beast.... being the dragon god and all...

Speaking of which, is vritra good at anything? He just looks awesome... looks like a decent rsonia dark team sub?

Quietus

2015-05-10, 11:23 AM

Mine all got swallowed by my Indra... the guy was a beast.... being the dragon god and all...

Speaking of which, is vritra good at anything? He just looks awesome... looks like a decent rsonia dark team sub?

I have a dozen Cuaton waiting for the day I pull Indra. If that doesn't do the job for him, I'll farm more from Insect Dragon, since I have a second Rei Sirius I haven't touched.

Vritra seems great, his awakenings are fantastic for a devil team, but his active is straight up terrible. The only thing I can imagine using him for is Ronia-cheesing Hera-Sowilo. Get to Athena, drop her to 20% HP or below, then pop Ronia/Lu Bu/FA Luci or Hera-Ur/Vritra for 400k damage to Athena. Actually, I forgot that Vritra also gives a 1.5x slime.. well. With a dark row heavy team, I'm sure a Ronia board, dark orbs enhanced, with a 1.5x slime from Vritra, will do just fine. Sowilo is a Light monster with 3 million HP, I can take that just with a decent Ronia board on its own.

Academia

2015-05-10, 11:29 AM

I have a dozen Cuaton waiting for the day I pull Indra. If that doesn't do the job for him, I'll farm more from Insect Dragon, since I have a second Rei Sirius I haven't touched.

Vritra seems great, his awakenings are fantastic for a devil team, but his active is straight up terrible. The only thing I can imagine using him for is Ronia-cheesing Hera-Sowilo. Get to Athena, drop her to 20% HP or below, then pop Ronia/Lu Bu/FA Luci or Hera-Ur/Vritra for 400k damage to Athena. Actually, I forgot that Vritra also gives a 1.5x slime.. well. With a dark row heavy team, I'm sure a Ronia board, dark orbs enhanced, with a 1.5x slime from Vritra, will do just fine. Sowilo is a Light monster with 3 million HP, I can take that just with a decent Ronia board on its own.

How can a Dark Dragon God holding two blackholes have such a terrible active.... /shake head...

QQ

Btw, I tried farming Sirius skill ups but I have no idea what I would use Sirius for, so I stopped. I seen those low cost dungeon clears though. Pretty impressive, but meh, not a priority LOL. Indra is jUST amazing for those skill lock resists and active. Save so much ass!

Quietus

2015-05-10, 11:34 AM

How can a Dark Dragon God holding two blackholes have such a terrible active.... /shake head...

QQ

Well, if you aren't trying to make the direct damage part of it important, you could use it as a lead (same leader skill as Lu Bu, but opens up Dark dragons as options), and have a weak slime effect, with two skill boosts and two dark rows. Lu Bu is strictly superior for everything but dark dragon subs, though, since his uvo will arrive soon, and that also has those awakenings, plus unbindable and a dark enhance. But if you don't have Lu Bu, Vritra is still pretty damn cool. And if you skill him up, he's a 7 turn cooldown, which is nifty.

Jasmine

2015-05-10, 01:55 PM

Speaking of which, is vritra good at anything? He just looks awesome... looks like a decent rsonia dark team sub?
He's discount Rodin for speed farmers. Press buttons to win, no time wasted on combos and skyfalls.

Grotteschi

2015-05-10, 02:21 PM

What are odds of basilisk drop from dragon zombie compared to pal machine?

Jasmine

2015-05-10, 03:12 PM

What are odds of basilisk drop from dragon zombie compared to pal machine?
~2% vs 0%.

Quietus

2015-05-10, 03:19 PM

What are odds of basilisk drop from dragon zombie compared to pal machine?

I've only picked it up once from there, and I've farmed for a max skill dragon zombie. But Basilisk/Tiamat isn't in PAL, it's in REM.

Grotteschi

2015-05-10, 03:41 PM

That explains a lot.

Academia

2015-05-10, 05:19 PM

He's discount Rodin for speed farmers. Press buttons to win, no time wasted on combos and skyfalls.

What do you mean... His active is affected by enemy defense... and ROdin cheese team is usually for high defense low hp dungeons...

Quietus

2015-05-10, 05:30 PM

Otravyat

2015-05-10, 05:32 PM

What do you mean... His active is affected by enemy defense... and ROdin cheese team is usually for high defense low hp dungeons...

He's also for that technical dungeon where you get no leader skill, and everything has low defense. If you get six of these together, you could even just blow through it over and over popping actives.

Yeah the Rodin speed farming is for Challenge Mode speed runs, generally for technicals on 5x plus egg drops. Make one total move and clear the dungeon after just going down the line of actives.

Jasmine

2015-05-10, 05:40 PM

What do you mean... His active is affected by enemy defense... and ROdin cheese team is usually for high defense low hp dungeons...
Mechdragon dungeon in 1 min 15 seconds. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rdCUdraPy8)
Star vault in 35 seconds (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-wjZE_OT8c)

Unrelated but I wish I could be as low rem as this person (http://imgur.com/a/2xDrZ). Too bad LIza refused to drop for me.

Quietus

2015-05-10, 05:53 PM

Mechdragon dungeon in 1 min 15 seconds. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rdCUdraPy8)
Star vault in 35 seconds (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-wjZE_OT8c)

Unrelated but I wish I could be as low rem as this person (http://imgur.com/a/2xDrZ). Too bad LIza refused to drop for me.

Those speed runs are pretty ideal, though. Either you have to have the exact right mix of friends to pull off that in challenge mode, or have those exact subs, and you have to have enough orbs on the board to never need to blow through anything else. It's rare for me to be able to do exactly that.

Jasmine

2015-05-10, 08:49 PM

Those speed runs are pretty ideal, though. Either you have to have the exact right mix of friends to pull off that in challenge mode, or have those exact subs, and you have to have enough orbs on the board to never need to blow through anything else. It's rare for me to be able to do exactly that.
A real whale easily has those subs, and you just need to learn orb management :p

Fax Celestis

2015-05-10, 10:04 PM

Different game but:

http://i.imgur.com/dBFCFwn.jpgI am the par on which all others are measured. That's my Elo rating at the top.

Quietus

2015-05-10, 10:06 PM

A real whale easily has those subs, and you just need to learn orb management :p

Pshaw. I'm just not the biggest of whales! I think Kauai still has that on me. And orb management orb schmanagement, they're making one dark match a turn when they aren't using actives to kill everything. That relies on having enough luck to have those orbs there, otherwise you're slowed by making matches of other colors.

Different game but:

http://i.imgur.com/dBFCFwn.jpgI am the par on which all others are measured. That's my Elo rating at the top.

Congrats! I remember being in that place on Maplestory, years ago. I was kind of nostalgic for that earlier, actually.

::Edit:: Succubus get!

Anarion

2015-05-10, 10:56 PM

Mechdragon dungeon in 1 min 15 seconds. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rdCUdraPy8)
Star vault in 35 seconds (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-wjZE_OT8c)

Unrelated but I wish I could be as low rem as this person (http://imgur.com/a/2xDrZ). Too bad LIza refused to drop for me.

Can you explain how they killed the midboss chimera with just the 4 dark orbs? That's ~800,000 damage without any combos or skill activation and I am confused how that happened.

Quietus

2015-05-10, 11:14 PM

Can you explain how they killed the midboss chimera with just the 4 dark orbs? That's ~800,000 damage without any combos or skill activation and I am confused how that happened.

He actually had one full dark row (six orbs) plus a skyfall of another 3. I can't remember if Pandora has any dark rows, but every other card on that team has two, so he's multiplying his damage by 9 (leader skill), then again by 2 (10% per rowhance, 10 rowhances, = 100% increase or 2x damage), and then the.. three? combos, which is another 50%, 25% per combo. The row gets a further increase of 75%, because there's 25% per orb beyond 3, so the math works out as follows :

Row : Attack x 9 x 2 x 1.75 x 1.5 = Attack x 47.5
Match : Attack x 9 x 2 x 1.5 = Attack x 27

I'm not going to take it any further than that, but I will point out that of the subs on his team... Off the top of my head, the Vritra I think have 1600ish attack. Lucifer is 1700ish. And Lu Bu is in excess of 2000. This is assuming everyone is max level, no plus eggs. Those numbers add up pretty fast. Even if we assume that's an average of 1600 attack (no idea what Pandora has, I bet the average is higher than that), that's 456,000 damage, from the row alone, doubled because the chimera is weak to dark. That makes that damage over 900,000.

Jasmine

2015-05-10, 11:50 PM

That relies on having enough luck to have those orbs there, otherwise you're slowed by making matches of other colors.
He manually spends 3 on R2, 3 on R3, 3 on R4, 6 on R5, 3 on R6. That's 18 orbs total. You start on average with 5 dark orbs (1/6 *30). After using them, you have a Persephone active that makes you 12 more (2/5 * 30). That's 17 total. Out of the elimination of 15 orbs, the chance that at least one of them will be dark is pretty high. Orb management involves not accidentally wasting any of those to skyfall. Saying this is relying on luck is like saying Isis relies on luck to have a board to activate - technically true, but if it's happening to you often, problem probably exists between phone and chair.

Also realize that I regularly make 1 match a turn running KoG, and that's with zero nuke actives. That is mechanics - something you can be bad at even when you're fantastic at comboing.

http://i.imgur.com/5YNlH71.png

Anarion

2015-05-11, 12:13 AM

He actually had one full dark row (six orbs) plus a skyfall of another 3. I can't remember if Pandora has any dark rows, but every other card on that team has two, so he's multiplying his damage by 9 (leader skill), then again by 2 (10% per rowhance, 10 rowhances, = 100% increase or 2x damage), and then the.. three? combos, which is another 50%, 25% per combo. The row gets a further increase of 75%, because there's 25% per orb beyond 3, so the math works out as follows :

Row : Attack x 9 x 2 x 1.75 x 1.5 = Attack x 47.5
Match : Attack x 9 x 2 x 1.5 = Attack x 27

I'm not going to take it any further than that, but I will point out that of the subs on his team... Off the top of my head, the Vritra I think have 1600ish attack. Lucifer is 1700ish. And Lu Bu is in excess of 2000. This is assuming everyone is max level, no plus eggs. Those numbers add up pretty fast. Even if we assume that's an average of 1600 attack (no idea what Pandora has, I bet the average is higher than that), that's 456,000 damage, from the row alone, doubled because the chimera is weak to dark. That makes that damage over 900,000.

Okay, yeah that does explain it. Makes me sad considering how hard I have to work to deal 800k damage right now. I wiped on one of those chimeras a couple days ago. T_T

http://i.imgur.com/5YNlH71.png

I have the terrifying thought that isn't entirely a joke.

Jasmine

2015-05-11, 12:59 AM

I have the terrifying thought that isn't entirely a joke.
While the scale is kind of bad (it really should be somewhat logarithmic), I personally have two friends that spent $1500 and $2000 USD. I believe there are also at least 5 people on this very forum that have spent over $500. Nothing wrong with that, but PAD is VERY good at getting the heavy spenders to pay up.

Academia

2015-05-11, 01:30 AM

While the scale is kind of bad (it really should be somewhat logarithmic), I personally have two friends that spent $1500 and $2000 USD. I believe there are also at least 5 people on this very forum that have spent over $500. Nothing wrong with that, but PAD is VERY good at getting the heavy spenders to pay up.

Er... /Dolphine Song

Hehehe

Sallera

2015-05-11, 05:31 AM

Bleh. Blazing Wings is usually better than 30 stam/+, isn't it? Feel like I'm wasting stones.

Quietus

2015-05-11, 06:19 AM

He manually spends 3 on R2, 3 on R3, 3 on R4, 6 on R5, 3 on R6. That's 18 orbs total. You start on average with 5 dark orbs (1/6 *30). After using them, you have a Persephone active that makes you 12 more (2/5 * 30). That's 17 total. Out of the elimination of 15 orbs, the chance that at least one of them will be dark is pretty high. Orb management involves not accidentally wasting any of those to skyfall. Saying this is relying on luck is like saying Isis relies on luck to have a board to activate - technically true, but if it's happening to you often, problem probably exists between phone and chair.

Also realize that I regularly make 1 match a turn running KoG, and that's with zero nuke actives. That is mechanics - something you can be bad at even when you're fantastic at comboing.

http://i.imgur.com/5YNlH71.png

Huh. I didn't break it down that way, interesting. And I'm assuming you're referring to using Goemon to speed run KoG? I know I've asked you about your team comp before, but I can't remember - how many orb changers do you carry on that team? And I'm going to assume that you do in fact use a spike on Zeus, is that anything more than just Goemon himself?

On the IAP chart, I'd probably put myself around turtle. Sad, given that I haven't played for a year yet.

Klaatu B. Nikto

2015-05-11, 09:16 AM

http://i.imgur.com/5YNlH71.png

http://www.viralspell.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/gr-4.jpg
Do I look funny? Am I somehow amusing to you?

;)

Seriously tho, at least 2 questions:

1) Does feeding a max level (99) ult evo form to another ult evo of the same type still result in a max skilled ult evo critter?
2) Is there a more efficient method to farm RGB xp than the tech dungeons + dragon plants? Where and when?
3) How about yellow and purple xp?

My reasoning may be out there / somewhat insane but if you've seen my PAD stash, I've got at least doubles of most farmable critters. Echidna for example. So as tedious as it may be to max and ult evo an echidna for example, it'd be a sure thing to max her skill. What's a few million XP + the necessary gold to get there? I'm still considering it tho.

Thus, part 2 and 3. Yellow seems to be the scarcest of the xp types but that might've changed recently.

I need to improve my orbing skills if I expect to get further into the game. I'm sitting on / grinding out Frozen Soil (SS Iceberg. Hehe) or Hill of Iris' Rainbow (3rd stage). If I've gotta improve my skills, I'd need practice and honestly when I farm pigeons or dragon plants, it's lazy burst damage until the boss.

Quietus

2015-05-11, 09:43 AM

http://www.viralspell.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/gr-4.jpg
Do I look funny? Am I somehow amusing to you?

;)

Seriously tho, at least 2 questions:

1) Does feeding a max level (99) ult evo form to another ult evo of the same type still result in a max skilled ult evo critter?
2) Is there a more efficient method to farm RGB xp than the tech dungeons + dragon plants? Where and when?
3) How about yellow and purple xp?

My reasoning may be out there / somewhat insane but if you've seen my PAD stash, I've got at least doubles of most farmable critters. Echidna for example. So as tedious as it may be to max and ult evo an echidna for example, it'd be a sure thing to max her skill. What's a few million XP + the necessary gold to get there? I'm still considering it tho.

Thus, part 2 and 3. Yellow seems to be the scarcest of the xp types but that might've changed recently.

I need to improve my orbing skills if I expect to get further into the game. I'm sitting on / grinding out Frozen Soil (SS Iceberg. Hehe) or Hill of Iris' Rainbow (3rd stage). If I've gotta improve my skills, I'd need practice and honestly when I farm pigeons or dragon plants, it's lazy burst damage until the boss.

I think feeding a max level uvo etc doesn't give max skill, it guarantees exactly one skill up. That may be worthwhile for certain things - I'm doing it with Apex Starling, for example - but not for stuff like Echidna. As to XP farming efficiency, I believe someone earlier in the thread gave a breakdown of expected exp/stamina in the main zones, I'd find it for you but I'm at work and shouldn't even be posting. :smalltongue:

obryn

2015-05-11, 10:11 AM

Man, I am doing the worst at Challenge Dungeons this time around.

Quietus

2015-05-11, 10:13 AM

Man, I am doing the worst at Challenge Dungeons this time around.

Can`t be worse than me, I haven`t started!

obryn

2015-05-11, 10:24 AM

Ignoring the current back and forth, let me see if I can answer this. It's actually a hard question to answer because it comes down to stuff like tone and word choice.
Hey, Anarion!

I wanted to apologize for not being able to provide more help. Despite all my ...'efforts'... at the REM, I still haven't obtained a Ronia to this day. :smallsmile: I have been running Beelzebub (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Crazed_King_of_Purgatory,_Beelzebub) more and more, but team building is quite different for Beelz-primary vs. Ronia-primary. (It's a prong team instead of a row team, if that isn't too jargon-y.)

Anyway, if you haven't added me yet, feel free - 357,549,260. I have a pretty big stable of gods I can put up, including Urd. (I haven't used her yet; just ask if you need her).

Fax Celestis

2015-05-11, 10:46 AM

Ding! Day 450.

flare'90

2015-05-11, 02:15 PM

I have a Padherder now. Here (https://www.padherder.com/user/flare90/monsters/#31,0,31,2047,268435455,0,,0,0,0,eq,0,0,0,0,;boxfa v,0).

Obryn, can you add it to the OP? Thanks.

Jasmine

2015-05-11, 02:43 PM

And I'm assuming you're referring to using Goemon to speed run KoG? I know I've asked you about your team comp before, but I can't remember - how many orb changers do you carry on that team? And I'm going to assume that you do in fact use a spike on Zeus, is that anything more than just Goemon himself?
Horus/Rodin/Gigas/Gigas. Rodin is just there for 3 skill boosts. I use a goemon on CDD for speed, but if needed two sets of red orbs and 2 combos kills him too. Zeus would take a skyfall to kill, so I use Horus to guarantee 9 mil damage.

2) Is there a more efficient method to farm RGB xp than the tech dungeons + dragon plants? Where and when?
3) How about yellow and purple xp?

My reasoning may be out there / somewhat insane but if you've seen my PAD stash, I've got at least doubles of most farmable critters. Echidna for example. So as tedious as it may be to max and ult evo an echidna for example, it'd be a sure thing to max her skill. What's a few million XP + the necessary gold to get there? I'm still considering it tho.
If you want 1-2 colors, Fatty>Supers>Tech(RGB only)>Pengdra vill>King Carnival. If you want 3+ colors, Fatty>Pengvill>King Carnival>Supers>Tech. Fatty is especially efficient for purple xp. Keep your expectations in check though - the fastest method is less than twice as good as the worst method, so it won't suddenly make your life super easy.

4.5 million exp + evo mats is worth a tad less than 1000 stamina. Anything that takes 200 stamina or less to obtain (since you expect to use 5 for skillup, 5*200 = 1000) is probably worth skilling up the old way - you can on average grab an Echidna from Scarlet Snake Princess every 60 stamina, so in her case it probably isn't worth it.

Kauai

2015-05-11, 04:15 PM

You got kicked off the throne after Quietus spent 14 stones on Draggie.

Forgot about that. lol I've gone on rage-stone continues before, but I think I maxed at maybe 6. Nowadays I just quit and figure I can (or hope to) probably do better if I tried it again.

Yes. I even managed to get one.

That's great! For me, I was aching for a DJ in the early game and never got him till a lot later. At the time I only had Shardran so that's who I used for a long time. I rarely use heartmakers anymore, but IMHO they're critical in the early game.

Btw, I tried farming Sirius skill ups but I have no idea what I would use Sirius for, so I stopped. I seen those low cost dungeon clears though. Pretty impressive, but meh, not a priority LOL. Indra is jUST amazing for those skill lock resists and active. Save so much ass!

Dumb question (and I'm sure you probably went over this previously), but what team do you use Indra on? I know you've been wanting that uvo for awhile now, but I've been trying to figure out what makes that card so great. Haven't done the uvo yet (was too busy this past Friday to farm for angelits), but plan to do so eventually.

Pshaw. I'm just not the biggest of whales! I think Kauai still has that on me.

I don't think I'm the biggest whale, but I'm 99% certain I'm the biggest in this forum. Sad but true. lol

While the scale is kind of bad (it really should be somewhat logarithmic), I personally have two friends that spent $1500 and $2000 USD. I believe there are also at least 5 people on this very forum that have spent over $500. Nothing wrong with that, but PAD is VERY good at getting the heavy spenders to pay up.

Yep, I'm definitely in that category. Scared to think where I'm actually at on the graphic you posted.

I didn't spend as much as it would seem to have this happen, but I do have enough Rodins in my box to field the speed run team that Jasmine shared for Forbidden Tower Door of Light and Shadow. (Kind of sad and frightening, I know.) Bought Tamadra Village once this past weekend and ran it hard in an attempt to skill them up, and got reasonably lucky with the red Tama drops. Not quite where I need to be to be able to sprint through yet, but am very close. Seems silly to do for a very niche team, but variations of that lineup work for speed runs of Tamadra Village, Tamadra Retreat, Forbidden Tower - Door of Light and Shadow, Starry Vault, and fatty dragon. Been focusing on getting pluses lately, so I think I'll be spending pretty much the whole day today doing the x5 technical.

Speaking of pluses, for whatever reason a lot of +RCV eggs have been dropping for me lately. I've been debating if I should bother trying to max out RCV on one of the Ama uvos (maybe attacker?). Is there any value in doing so at this point? Not sure if I should use them on trying to hyper another card instead. (Finally finished Persephone, so I now have 2 hypered cards. lol So sad compared to Jasmine. Next target is Awoken Hades, who sits at +105 right now. After him, not sure. I'm guessing Lu Bu since I use him a lot, though I haven't even started egging him yet.)

Anarion

2015-05-11, 05:06 PM

Hey, Anarion!

I wanted to apologize for not being able to provide more help. Despite all my ...'efforts'... at the REM, I still haven't obtained a Ronia to this day. :smallsmile: I have been running Beelzebub (http://pad.wikia.com/wiki/Crazed_King_of_Purgatory,_Beelzebub) more and more, but team building is quite different for Beelz-primary vs. Ronia-primary. (It's a prong team instead of a row team, if that isn't too jargon-y.)

Anyway, if you haven't added me yet, feel free - 357,549,260. I have a pretty big stable of gods I can put up, including Urd. (I haven't used her yet; just ask if you need her).

I've got you on there (I actually messaged you through the PAD client at one point, in fact).

And I'm enjoying myself more now than I was just a few days ago. The amount of difference that Echidna has made to my overall gameplay really can't be overstated. I cleared Hera, twice now, and two heroes a couple times to get both berserk and highlander. I'm also done with the first three stages of Starlight Sanctuary, though the 3.5m hp version of Hera has thus far intimidated me away from trying any further. I finished Goemon twice today as well and have two copies of him (though I have no idea what to do with him). I'm also done with challenge 4 and thinking about whether I can tackle challenge 5. It looks like it's just on the edge of what my team can handle.

Quietus

2015-05-11, 05:20 PM

Horus/Rodin/Gigas/Gigas. Rodin is just there for 3 skill boosts. I use a goemon on CDD for speed, but if needed two sets of red orbs and 2 combos kills him too. Zeus would take a skyfall to kill, so I use Horus to guarantee 9 mil damage.

I'm planning something similar, though I don't have Horus or Rodin. I haven't skilled my Goemon yet, so I'm waiting for his ult to come out, but once it does I'm planning Goemon//Hera-Ur/Gigas/Gigas/Something(Echidna? Ronia?)//Goemon. Probably need more skill boosts in there, so I'll probably go Ronia. With ult Goemons, that's 5 skill boosts. Plenty to have the Goemen ready to go.

I don't think I'm the biggest whale, but I'm 99% certain I'm the biggest in this forum. Sad but true. lol

Well, you stopped, I'm assuming - or at least, slowed down. So there's that. :smalltongue:

Fax Celestis

2015-05-11, 05:56 PM

I finished Goemon twice today as well and have two copies of him (though I have no idea what to do with him).

You want to do something like (*quick glance at your box*) Goemon//Ronia/Gigas/Echidna/Cao Cao//Goemon (http://www.puzzledragonx.com/en/simulator.asp?q=565.35.1.0.0.0.0..107.35.1.0.0.0.0 ..911.35.1.0.0.0.0..89.35.1.0.0.0.0..1232.35.1.0.0 .0.0..566.99.1.0.0.0.3) (or Flame Knight instead of Ronia if you can't handle that team cost). Let yourself get smacked a few times, then open fire.

Otravyat

2015-05-11, 06:32 PM

You want to do something like (*quick glance at your box*) Goemon//Ronia/Gigas/Echidna/Cao Cao//Goemon (http://www.puzzledragonx.com/en/simulator.asp?q=565.35.1.0.0.0.0..107.35.1.0.0.0.0 ..911.35.1.0.0.0.0..89.35.1.0.0.0.0..1232.35.1.0.0 .0.0..566.99.1.0.0.0.3) (or Flame Knight instead of Ronia if you can't handle that team cost). Let yourself get smacked a few times, then open fire.

Basically, Goemon does insane damage if below 20% HP. So you are looking for a team that can generate a steady supply of red orbs while avoiding accidentally healing up out of that 0-20% zone. You don't need huge combos to kill anything because 25x monocolored does silly damage, and you have to manage the board so that hearts are unlikely to skyfall down and ruin your run (I stock my hearts in the bottom corners and then orb shift them away).

Gigas is a must, because you can consume your hearts every five turns while generating firepower. My Goemon farming team runs Hera-Ur (orb enhance), Gigas (uvo, -100 RCV), Gigas (not uvo, for -500 RCV), and Phoenix Knight, Homura for another five turn orb change. That is a very quick and completely farmable team. I have also plugged in echidna at times.

As Fax says, ronia echidna and cao cao are all viable options. The thing that you want to avoid is having your RCV so high that a single hearts skyfall is going to ruin your damage output. You are often still sitting on only 5k health after healing, and it is completely possible that you will just die instead of being able to get back into the boosted region.

Anarion

2015-05-11, 08:01 PM

Basically, Goemon does insane damage if below 20% HP. So you are looking for a team that can generate a steady supply of red orbs while avoiding accidentally healing up out of that 0-20% zone. You don't need huge combos to kill anything because 25x monocolored does silly damage, and you have to manage the board so that hearts are unlikely to skyfall down and ruin your run (I stock my hearts in the bottom corners and then orb shift them away).

Gigas is a must, because you can consume your hearts every five turns while generating firepower. My Goemon farming team runs Hera-Ur (orb enhance), Gigas (uvo, -100 RCV), Gigas (not uvo, for -500 RCV), and Phoenix Knight, Homura for another five turn orb change. That is a very quick and completely farmable team. I have also plugged in echidna at times.

As Fax says, ronia echidna and cao cao are all viable options. The thing that you want to avoid is having your RCV so high that a single hearts skyfall is going to ruin your damage output. You are often still sitting on only 5k health after healing, and it is completely possible that you will just die instead of being able to get back into the boosted region.

Well, I'm close to evolving but not ulting my one gigas and he's skill level 6 right now, so cool, something viable and sort of fun as an alternative. I'll have to go hunt down some goemon buddies, or ask for it when I want to try it (I'm starting to realize everyone here has everything if needed :smalltongue:)

Fax Celestis

2015-05-11, 08:26 PM

AFAIR, Jasmine has one hell of a Goemon.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-11, 09:22 PM

Quietus

2015-05-11, 10:09 PM

Riders 2.0?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExJofJVIAMEIPJ.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExMlwJVEAAOAFI.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExMw9zVEAAAvbW.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExM8S3UkAAex9n.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExNLaFVAAAWGfh.jpg

Huh. Neat. I'm holding off on excitement for now, but they do look very cool.

obryn

2015-05-11, 10:17 PM

Wow, existing riders are getting huffed, too.

Who else remembers when Riders were the terrible troll gold eggs nobody wanted?

Quietus

2015-05-11, 10:22 PM

Wow, existing riders are getting huffed, too.

Who else remembers when Riders were the terrible troll gold eggs nobody wanted?

I assume you mean buffed - where are you seeing that? I know they all recently got +500 HP.. and I came in after the Riders got their ultimates, so I always thought they were neat at the very least.

::Edit:: Found it, a one-line mention about buffs. Well, Arthur won't object!

Fjolnir

2015-05-11, 10:34 PM

I pulled an osiris as my starter after several rerolls, what should I be looking for for my team?

Academia

2015-05-11, 10:56 PM

Dumb question (and I'm sure you probably went over this previously), but what team do you use Indra on? I know you've been wanting that uvo for awhile now, but I've been trying to figure out what makes that card so great. Haven't done the uvo yet (was too busy this past Friday to farm for angelits), but plan to do so eventually.

I don't think I'm the biggest whale, but I'm 99% certain I'm the biggest in this forum. Sad but true. lol

Yep, I'm definitely in that category. Scared to think where I'm actually at on the graphic you posted.

Let's sing the whale song Kauai! One of the attractions in Hawaii xD.

Indra is a shorter but more powerful version of Susan IMO.

Active Skill advantage: He's also the only relevant LIGHT monster with damage reduction to save ass. -75% damage for 3 turns > Kushi's -80% damage for 1 turn. In 3 turns, you can pretty much full heal with my healer LKali or Kirin team if ever needed. 3 turns of survival basically for damage for those hard hitters without gimmicks. Or simply used to chain delays if possible. So think... My full defensive Kirin/LKali team = 2 SunQuan, Echidna, Indra = 10 turn CD, 14 turn CD, 15 turn CD respectively. So If I delay with Echidna, +3 turns, Damage reduction with Indra, +3 turns, Delay with SunQuan, +2 turns, Tank one hit, Delay with SunQuan, +2 turns. Guess what, Echidna is back up, and 1st active for SunQuan is up in like another 3 turns. It cycles through the actives well enough to survive or lengthen a dungeon to a point where you can actually stall (Assuming it actually exists). And since the team is basically mostly healers, you can count on full heals with each active. Indra's HP pool is also much needed. Also, if the boss cannot be delayed, you save your SunQuans and just use them as slimes. So at least 4 turns of 50x is guaranteed if you have the skills (I do!). I do this to sub bosses to get my SunQuans up again if I used them earlier.

Awoken Skill Advantage: He's got 2x Skill Lock Resists on his own. So I can go LKali,Yomi, Indra, SunQuan, SunQuan, LKali for a very balanced Attacker + Healer team. Also notice that every member of this team gives time extend, which adds up to 3.5s of extra time to organize orbs EACH TURN!

CTW + 2 Boardshifts on short CD (If you use the cylcing a bit, you can proc the LKali actives Twice EACH), + 2x Slime affect (4 turns of 50x) + 2 Delays + 1 Damage Reduction... Not to mention there's TPAs on that team... Same thing goes for Kirin, it makes the Kirin team 100% skill lock resist very easily. Even the defensive team I mentioned above have 80% lock resist...

Any more questions? xD ENOUGH SAID INDRA OP!

It's sad that LKali is just better than Kirin unless there's a shiz ton of gimmicks in the dungeons that Kirin's Awakenings takes advantages of...

Academia

2015-05-11, 11:21 PM

Riders 2.0?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExJofJVIAMEIPJ.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExMlwJVEAAOAFI.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExMw9zVEAAAvbW.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExM8S3UkAAex9n.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExNLaFVAAAWGfh.jpg

Awoken Riders with Mystic Animals... *Drools*... Damn I just realized that I actually fed away a bunch of mystic animals the other day as well as 2 Riders a while back -.-... Lets see how well they stack up...

Grotteschi

2015-05-11, 11:50 PM

Riders 2.0?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExJofJVIAMEIPJ.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExMlwJVEAAOAFI.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExMw9zVEAAAvbW.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExM8S3UkAAex9n.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CExNLaFVAAAWGfh.jpg

As nice as this is, Amir means they will probably be awoken ultimate evolution forms which need both the rider and the mystic animal to evolve a dragon knight or something.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-11, 11:55 PM

As nice as this is, Amir means they will probably be awoken ultimate evolution forms which need both the rider and the mystic animal to evolve a dragon knight or something.
They're not ults, they're new cards. There's basic forms as well, I just linked the evos.

obryn

2015-05-12, 12:01 AM

I assume you mean buffed - where are you seeing that? I know they all recently got +500 HP.. and I came in after the Riders got their ultimates, so I always thought they were neat at the very least.

::Edit:: Found it, a one-line mention about buffs. Well, Arthur won't object!
They were, for a while, the only dual-color monsters in the game. I think. :smallsmile: They were certainly the first ones I saw, myself. But their godawful stats, weird active, and useless leader skill made them basically useless.

I pulled an osiris as my starter after several rerolls, what should I be looking for for my team?
Osiris is going to be a challenging starter, but 6 combos is do-able. You will want to focus on green subs, and probably prongs for extra damage. Get the green mystic knight; it'll be a top sub. Get Highlander as soon as you can, too. Those together should do the trick. If you're lucky enough for the BatREM to come around again, Robin could be another top tier sub.

Get as many +time awoken skills as you can, btw. 6 combos is hard.

Academia

2015-05-12, 01:03 AM

They were, for a while, the only dual-color monsters in the game. I think. :smallsmile: They were certainly the first ones I saw, myself. But their godawful stats, weird active, and useless leader skill made them basically useless.

Osiris is going to be a challenging starter, but 6 combos is do-able. You will want to focus on green subs, and probably prongs for extra damage. Get the green mystic knight; it'll be a top sub. Get Highlander as soon as you can, too. Those together should do the trick. If you're lucky enough for the BatREM to come around again, Robin could be another top tier sub.

Get as many +time awoken skills as you can, btw. 6 combos is hard.

Riders.... My MOST hated series... I have yet to find a single use for them in my team. Only Glyph Rider has a shot in the Anubis team for glass cannon and skill resist, but those stats are HORRIBLE. They are like a weird heartbreaker series...

Anarion

2015-05-12, 01:40 AM

Osiris is going to be a challenging starter, but 6 combos is do-able. You will want to focus on green subs, and probably prongs for extra damage. Get the green mystic knight; it'll be a top sub. Get Highlander as soon as you can, too. Those together should do the trick. If you're lucky enough for the BatREM to come around again, Robin could be another top tier sub.

Get as many +time awoken skills as you can, btw. 6 combos is hard.

Fair warning, since starting to repeat run skydragons and Hera, I've gotten 4 echidna (!) without ever seeing a single green mystic knight.

Jasmine

2015-05-12, 03:09 AM

So sad compared to Jasmine
http://scontent.fsjc1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t34.0-12/11074538_2848097555651_596470549_n.jpg?oh=05af3c3d 122d5cfbe570ffa4c9b6542d&oe=555345DB

And I'm enjoying myself more now than I was just a few days ago. The amount of difference that Echidna has made to my overall gameplay really can't be overstated.

though the 3.5m hp version of Hera has thus far intimidated me away from trying any further. I finished Goemon twice today as well and have two copies of him (though I have no idea what to do with him)
Team comp is extremely important - if a vet gives you advice, it's probably a good idea to follow it, even if you don't understand how it helps you just yet...

Goemon (and Satan) are among the fastest AND lowest level requirement AND REM free leads to clear Starlight Zeus. Goemon is getting a buff too, so if you learn how to play him well, you can likely beat most of the game with him without paying a cent, and without too much grinding, either, since Gigas has such an easy skillup.

gooddragon1

2015-05-12, 05:26 AM

Making that fire control team suggested in the previous thread.
So far, liu bei is maxed but not evoed (the mini-liu bei)/Found out the hard way that skill ups do not carry over from big flamie to king flamie (also maxed) but no awakenings/2 Samurai Goblins maxed (1 max skill, the other 4 out of 7)/1 Rowdy Samurai Goblin max skilled and level 55/A whole lot of cao cao friends and a few liu bei's and one sucubus who gives x3 to attackers

Been farming coaxing snake trying to coax sucubus into joining my team (while also using the goblins for skill ups). Going to get 2 more red keepers when I can.

So, if you had a team of:

Liu Bei (mini, max, but not evo 2)
3 Rowdy Samurai Goblin maxed and max skill
1 King flamie max but skill 1
1 Cao Cao friend

How far through the normal dungeons could you get?

(I think I'd need a leader with x1000000 to defeat zeus' 5m hp...)

Jasmine

2015-05-12, 05:36 AM

How far through the normal dungeons could you get?
With 5 combos a turn, I'd say partially into starlight sanctuary, although the water levels might be kind of tough. A decent spike match should be doing about a million damage total, if your monsters are leveled up. (6200 base attack * 9x multiplier * 3 sets of fire after orb change *2 five combo multiplier * 3 king flamie). Really sad that you don't have your own cowcow, or you'd add another 30% to the base damage as well as bringing another orbchange + delay. Don't feed away REM stuff!

137beth

2015-05-12, 05:40 AM

I tried Noah descended with a LMeta team...
it probably would have been easier with an LKali or even U&Y team.

I beat it on legend and got the drop, though:smallsmile:

obryn

2015-05-12, 08:14 AM

Riders.... My MOST hated series... I have yet to find a single use for them in my team. Only Glyph Rider has a shot in the Anubis team for glass cannon and skill resist, but those stats are HORRIBLE. They are like a weird heartbreaker series...
Seriously? I've found numerous uses for them. Dino Rider is a standby on several of my teams.

Their stats keep improving, but yeah, admittedly they're still catching up. However, they have a number of things going for them, making them extremely desirable for a number of teams. Most importantly, they're an offensive orb-changer with high ATK, a row awoken skill, and two prongs. That's unusual; there aren't many orb-melters with rows, and none of them have as much offensive burst potential.

gooddragon1

2015-05-12, 08:34 AM

With 5 combos a turn, I'd say partially into starlight sanctuary, although the water levels might be kind of tough. A decent spike match should be doing about a million damage total, if your monsters are leveled up. (6200 base attack * 9x multiplier * 3 sets of fire after orb change *2 five combo multiplier * 3 king flamie). Really sad that you don't have your own cowcow, or you'd add another 30% to the base damage as well as bringing another orbchange + delay. Don't feed away REM stuff!

To be fair, my cao cao was a PEM thing... I didn't know :(. I thought all green was pro with my super tsumagoi cabages and I just wanted to clear out my box.

I have to wonder. An insane question. What if multipliers were additive rather than multiplicative? EX: 2 3x atk leaders grant 6x rather than 9x

obryn

2015-05-12, 09:15 AM

I have to wonder. An insane question. What if multipliers were additive rather than multiplicative? EX: 2 3x atk leaders grant 6x rather than 9x
The entire game would collapse at that point. :smallsmile:

It may have once been possible - way back in the mists of ancient history - but not anymore.

Quietus

2015-05-12, 09:42 AM

To be fair, my cao cao was a PEM thing... I didn't know :(. I thought all green was pro with my super tsumagoi cabages and I just wanted to clear out my box.

I have to wonder. An insane question. What if multipliers were additive rather than multiplicative? EX: 2 3x atk leaders grant 6x rather than 9x

The entire game would collapse at that point. :smallsmile:

It may have once been possible - way back in the mists of ancient history - but not anymore.

The way the numbers are currently balanced, yeah. That just straight up wouldn't work. But if they were to rebalance things - shrink the numbers in dungeons considerably, etc - then we might see more use for something like that. The major problem with that, in my opinion, is that it would severely reduce the usefulness of the higher multipliers; Kali would be only twice as good as Sonia, for FAR more difficulty. On the other hand, it would make the monsters that hit all stats much more valuable, like Archangels 1.. their 2/1.35/2 uvo stats would be a little more useful.

Today's news : I am cleaning out a lot of evo materials in my box. I've evolved Gaia, then Hades. Evolved then uvo'ed Flame Guardian. Evolved Hatsume. Evolved Nut. Evolved Strawberry Dragon. Uvo'ed Dino Rider. Uvo'ed one of my Lilith. Uvo'ed something else I can't remember right now Princess Valk, need an Extreme Fatty and keeper of Rainbow to have a second Valk Rose. I've burned myself out of Keepers of Green, Keepers of Red, Keepers of Rainbow, Mythlits, Dub-Mythlits, Dragon Fruit, Dragon Flowers... and after I get rid of random exp fodder monsters, I'll be sitting at almost 200 empty box space, until I restock. :smalltongue:

obryn

2015-05-12, 09:49 AM

The major problem with that, in my opinion, is that it would severely reduce the usefulness of the higher multipliers; Kali would be only twice as good as Sonia, for FAR more difficulty.
Yeah.

Take LL Ra. For 6-color, I get x49 now. Under additive math, I'd get x14. Compare to Athena. For 'being a god' I get x9. Under additive math, I'd get x6. And extra HP. No contest, frankly.

It would also be incredibly weird given all the x1.5 multipliers and whatnot.

You mention Archangels. Should paired Archangels get x4/x2.7/x4? What about gods without multipliers - would adding Horus to this give you x6/x1.35/x2 or would it give you x6/x2.35/x3 ?

Erloas

2015-05-12, 09:50 AM

I just hit 500 days.

Trying for dark orbs today, it sucks that they removed invades from the Legend versions, but at least Noah is one of the Mythicals I can run pretty reliably.

Although all of my Isis friends seem to have disappeared. I assume they're just running farming leads right now because my friend list is still almost full.

Also for any other new players that tried to send me an invite, I've deleted a few inactive friends so I have space again. (tablet is still dead, no idea when it is getting replaced at this point*)
(*edit: anyone tried any of these off-brand $35-40 Android tablets? Wondering if it would even be worth looking at, would be just for PAD and kids)

Anarion

2015-05-12, 09:58 AM

Seriously? I've found numerous uses for them. Dino Rider is a standby on several of my teams.

Their stats keep improving, but yeah, admittedly they're still catching up. However, they have a number of things going for them, making them extremely desirable for a number of teams. Most importantly, they're an offensive orb-changer with high ATK, a row awoken skill, and two prongs. That's unusual; there aren't many orb-melters with rows, and none of them have as much offensive burst potential.

I want a Merlin so badly, he'd be such a good sub for Urd because of typing. Ah well *wistful sigh*

The team gooddragon is using will have trouble with the first level of Starlight sanctuary. That isn't enough per monster given bad typing to kill the dragon at the end. Get a red Odin friend. Edit: also Neptune, but I think he'll have just enough if he hits everything.

I'd also worry a little about dealing with the golem levels in Kronos Forest et al because they effectively have two boss waves that might require skill use. He can probably get enough orbs for them though.

Otravyat

2015-05-12, 10:31 AM

This is everyone's monthly reminder not to pad descends while half asleep. 140 stamina thrown away on challenge 7.

Grotteschi

2015-05-12, 11:34 AM

I tried Noah descended with a LMeta team...
it probably would have been easier with an LKali or even U&Y team.

I beat it on legend and got the drop, though:smallsmile:

Matatron? What was your team? :smallconfused:

Quietus

2015-05-12, 11:34 AM

This is everyone's monthly reminder not to pad descends while half asleep. 140 stamina thrown away on challenge 7.

I think that one took me two or three tries. That's as far as I got, though, I believe. Anyone have suggestions on how to handle Challenge 8 on my phone account? I'm going back and forth between Kali (hard to muster that much consecutive firepower) and GZL (5 mill HP Fire boss is not fun). I really want that Woodpy for Awoken Parvati...

Fax Celestis

2015-05-12, 11:41 AM

Fax Celestis

2015-05-12, 12:00 PM

Yeah.

Take LL Ra. For 6-color, I get x49 now. Under additive math, I'd get x14. Compare to Athena. For 'being a god' I get x9. Under additive math, I'd get x6. And extra HP. No contest, frankly.

It would also be incredibly weird given all the x1.5 multipliers and whatnot.

You mention Archangels. Should paired Archangels get x4/x2.7/x4? What about gods without multipliers - would adding Horus to this give you x6/x1.35/x2 or would it give you x6/x2.35/x3 ?

As an aside, I hope you know that LL Ra is going to go from 4x-7x to 4x-8x.

obryn

2015-05-12, 12:38 PM

I want a Merlin so badly, he'd be such a good sub for Urd because of typing. Ah well *wistful sigh*
I would expect a Riders Godfest of some sort down the road. So sit tight!

As an aside, I hope you know that LL Ra is going to go from 4x-7x to 4x-8x.
I do indeed! Combined with being unbindable, it will make it rough indeed to decide whether my +297 is going to Awoken Ra or staying on LL Ra. :smallbiggrin:

I mean, I have DKali and no LKali, so that's really a question right there.

e: And Challenges 1-9 are beaten. Once again, Challenge 9 was easier than it looked, once I got past Stage 1. Of course, I ended up using both my Delay actives and DKali a few times, but eh. That's how it works!

gooddragon1

2015-05-12, 12:58 PM

Another question, but related to mechanics:

Would activating Curved Blade Brave, Kopis (http://puzzledragonx.com/en/monster.asp?n=1884) and King Flamie (http://puzzledragonx.com/en/monster.asp?n=684) stack attack multipliers? I know that 2 King Flamies don't stack, but I'm wondering if it's because skill boost attacks don't stack or the same exact monster boosts don't stack.

Quietus

2015-05-12, 01:15 PM

flare'90

2015-05-12, 01:17 PM

Anarion

2015-05-12, 02:10 PM

Oh god, I missed gold dragons again (due to lack of stamina). I've cleared supers and dragon hunts for every color, but I've somehow either had no stam or hope of leveling or missed the event entirely every single time golds come around. I haven't even done the 20 stam version (stoning for a guaranteed chance to get two stones that comes back every week seems utterly stupid though). T_T

Otravyat

2015-05-12, 06:10 PM

Random complaint, but on Challenge 10 why would they edit Satan in such a way to just randomly add 1000 health? He had such a nice round 6,666,666 before. Now hes at 6,667,787.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-12, 08:21 PM

A thing, it has been done.

http://i.imgur.com/IrkKB90.jpg

Stoning is for suckers. #teamNoStone

Quietus

2015-05-12, 10:24 PM

A thing, it has been done.

http://i.imgur.com/IrkKB90.jpg

Stoning is for suckers. #teamNoStone

Congrats! Be warned, this is addictive. Once you know you can do it, 50 stamina for 6 keepers is really, really tempting.

I've just finished restocking almost all the keepers I'll need. I'll end up needing to farm more Rainbow eventually, but I have enough of every other version to take care of everything I care about. And probably a few things I don't. Tomorrow I'll see if I need any masks, and may just end up trashing Wednesday Mythical just because I haven't yet. I'm fairly certain that I can do it with GZL, paired off with Verdandis or whatever else I've got with skill lock resist. I think my cycle has come back around to evolving everything I've got sitting in my box, so I can focus purely on things I actually care about.

obryn

2015-05-12, 10:35 PM

Congrats! Be warned, this is addictive. Once you know you can do it, 50 stamina for 6 keepers is really, really tempting.

It's by far the best way to get Keepers. Especially of the Light and Dark varieties.

It's doubly good if you are skilling up Light Zhuge Liang. :smallsmile:

Quietus

2015-05-12, 10:50 PM

It's by far the best way to get Keepers. Especially of the Light and Dark varieties.

It's doubly good if you are skilling up Light Zhuge Liang. :smallsmile:

Is that what Keeper of Gold skills right now? I'm saving any extras I get for the day they cycle him back to Apocalypse. They've had two cycles where he hit Angelious so far, I'm hoping next time we get it back to that crazy looking space station dragon.

::Edit:: Oh, I got that backwards. His alt skill up target is LZL, Angelious is the base. I don't care enough about Angelious to bother with that. I suppose that you could lead a team with Angelious and do a Light Dragon theme, with him, Apocalypse, and Indra.. very defensive. Maybe throw Divinegon in there, and something to orb change on a shorter timer...

Fax Celestis

2015-05-12, 11:14 PM

Well, I do have three golems, Satan, and Belial to ult...

Academia

2015-05-13, 12:22 AM

Damn you Obyrn for clearing Challenge 9! Lol Jasmine's probably soon to follow... I feel so lagged behind. I been just going up to challenge 8 and then stopping -.-.

Got Awoken Hades for Challenge 9! But now A.Hades can't do the new ones lol.... Guess I'll have to go with Anubis practice... Or +egging my Kirin team... Not sure if I can average 8 combos each turn since I been dividing time between PAD and Terra Battle... GIMME ADVISE! I'll update my PAD Herder...

I just made it to the final stage in Terra Battle and now it's a grind "Sorta". Not as hardcore as PAD.

P.S. Next thread is going to be called "PAD 13: The Search for SiuS continues" if her ass doesn't get back here ASAP!

I need ECO Collab to come back ASAP too >.< Damn em Yomi Skill Ups.

Aca

obryn

2015-05-13, 12:48 AM

Got Awoken Hades for Challenge 9! But now A.Hades can't do the new ones lol.... Guess I'll have to go with Anubis practice... Or +egging my Kirin team... Not sure if I can average 8 combos each turn since I been dividing time between PAD and Terra Battle... GIMME ADVISE! I'll update my PAD Herder...

For real, Challenge 9 isn't anywhere near as bad as it looks at first glance. Take a good look at how much of actual time you have on most of the enemies. And how none of them have status shields.

Defoud is the hardest part, by far. If you can drop him you can beat it.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 08:44 AM

Riders 2 stars and skills: http://puzzledragonx.com/en/news.asp?nid=302

Otravyat

2015-05-13, 09:45 AM

Riders 2 stars and skills: http://puzzledragonx.com/en/news.asp?nid=302

Wow that 2000 attack on Cerberus Rider.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 09:59 AM

Wow that 2000 attack on Cerberus Rider.

I know, right? And with two TPA? And Unicorn Rider has a fantastic active.

Erloas

2015-05-13, 10:14 AM

I was going to say how bad the Cerebus rider's active was, but then I noticed a 2 turn cooldown, which makes it a lot more useful since most high defenses only need a very small hit. And being a devil, he should pair very well with Horus/Ra's new ultimates.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 10:24 AM

Erloas

2015-05-13, 10:49 AM

Well, and it triggers his leader skill. So basically he self-slimes.

I think the unicorn rider is the only one likely to be used as a leader, and even then it doesn't seem that great. The others might see more use when they get more of the split color monsters out (we've seen it a lot more recently). Right now they all look like subs.

They just don't have the umph to be leaders on their own. If you have 2x leaders they are 9x on a turn a skill is used but only 4x the rest of the time, which is rather mediocre. Sure they have the HP or RCV boost, but you get similar (but smaller) from all the 3Kingdom gods without the very selective limitations. When paired with another god like a 3x leader you go to 6x, 9x on active use. Still not great.

So my thought it amazing subs, mediocre leads.

Godfest was announced, starting Friday with Heroes/JP2 and Saturday with Egyptian1/3Kingdom. I'm really hoping this falls with a gala of tides, which is likely, with Light also being very likely. Sun Quan and Isis are the ones I really want, pretty much everything else will be dups.

obryn

2015-05-13, 10:53 AM

GODFEST ANNOUNCEMENT!

Day 1: Heroes + JP 2.0 (Odin x1 rates)
Day 2: 3 Kingdoms + Egypt 1.0 (Guan Yu x1 rates)

In other words, save your stones for Day 2. I'd love an Awoken Horus as an A.Ra team sub. Liu Bei would be nice, too. Mostly I want more Kalis of any variety.

Also!

It was a nail biter, but Ultimate Dragon Rush is done. I've been avoiding the 99-stamina dungeons due to a lack of confidence in my Ra team (and waiting for Awoken Ra), but I'm working through them now. This one was rough - I managed to get both a Kirin invade and Fatty - but some luck (and a ton of defensive subs on my Ra team) won the day.

Fatty, btw, is really tough with Ra. (Awoken Ra can one-zap him, mind you, but regular Ra has no such luck.) I got lucky, though, and got a x49 with an extra skyfall light combo, but ended up burning both of my delays and my DKali active. Fortunately, I still had Susano ready for Zaerog... But it turned out I didn't need him. Zaerog absorbed Dark instead of Light, so I crushed him in 2 shots. It worked out, is what I'm saying. Oh, and the Kirin invade was like a nice relaxing break in-between; I just needed to keep my healing up.

As a final note - holy cow do I love it when enemies amp up the drop rate of a certain color of orb by 25%. It pretty well guarantees some skyfalls. I one-shotted both Beyzuul and Threedia thanks to that.

So my thought it amazing subs, mediocre leads.
I want Cerberus Rider bad for my upcoming Awoken Ra team.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 11:04 AM

I have Lu Bu, DQXQ, Isis, and Bastet already.

I have none of JP2 and only Pandora out of the Heroes, but I don't really want any of the other Heroes (except possibly Andromeda).

My Bonia team is dying for a Blodin.

I'll have 15 stones by the time godfest rolls around.

When do I roll?

Quietus

2015-05-13, 01:00 PM

I think the unicorn rider is the only one likely to be used as a leader, and even then it doesn't seem that great. The others might see more use when they get more of the split color monsters out (we've seen it a lot more recently). Right now they all look like subs.

They just don't have the umph to be leaders on their own. If you have 2x leaders they are 9x on a turn a skill is used but only 4x the rest of the time, which is rather mediocre. Sure they have the HP or RCV boost, but you get similar (but smaller) from all the 3Kingdom gods without the very selective limitations. When paired with another god like a 3x leader you go to 6x, 9x on active use. Still not great.

So my thought it amazing subs, mediocre leads.

Godfest was announced, starting Friday with Heroes/JP2 and Saturday with Egyptian1/3Kingdom. I'm really hoping this falls with a gala of tides, which is likely, with Light also being very likely. Sun Quan and Isis are the ones I really want, pretty much everything else will be dups.

Do keep in mind, they're only 13 cost. Maybe good leaders for Gaia?

I have Lu Bu, DQXQ, Isis, and Bastet already.

I have none of JP2 and only Pandora out of the Heroes, but I don't really want any of the other Heroes (except possibly Andromeda).

My Bonia team is dying for a Blodin.

I'll have 15 stones by the time godfest rolls around.

When do I roll?

If you don't need anything from either Godfest, then skip and wait for the next one. Save those stones! I won't be rolling at all on either account, nothing that thrills me. However, note that Odins are x1 chance on day 1. If you do roll, it should be day 2, despite the chance for dupes.

Anarion

2015-05-13, 01:06 PM

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 01:20 PM

The sunk cost fallacy is the worst fallacy! :smallfurious:

I managed to finish grimoires today and got myself a Theurgia, which is amazing on every team I'm putting together right now, but I spent 4 stones to do it. :smallsigh: My team just was not ready for that, just across the board didn't have enough stats to really handle it properly. But, hey, now I know that if I had about 5k more hp and 1k more attack across the board, I'd crush it, so that's cool.

Jasmine (I think it was Jasmine? I can't find the quote) put it this way (paraphrased) once: "If you wouldn't mind getting it from the REM, anything less than 5 stones is a bargain."

That means he's sometimes a 3x attack and 1.5x hp leader if your team has perfect sub-elements. That doesn't floor me considering how many things seem to be floating around with 3x attack or more all the time, but I guess if that particular combo of boosts gives a team the right convergence of just enough hp and just enough attack to pull something off it could work.

Something like Astaroth//Cerberus Rider would be 1.5x/7x/1.5x, jumping to 1.5x/10.5x/1.5x when using a skill. And there are a lot of GD devils: Cauchemar, Bastet, Ruel, GD Meimei, Hera Beorc, Aamir, Corpse Wyrm, AHades, off the top of my head. More, if you don't mind missing out on the HP bonus on one or two. Astaroth//Cauchemar/Beorc/Meimei/Corpse Wyrm//Cerberus Rider has 5 rows, three boardshift spikes, a slime, and is almost completely farmable, for example, and Beorc > Corpse Wyrm is an enhanced board.

I'm not saying its amazing or invincible or The New Juggler™. It's not. But you can still work with it if you're within limited means.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 02:21 PM

Do any of you have baby tama success records? Are any of you as compulsive about record-keeping as I am?

obryn

2015-05-13, 02:27 PM

Erloas

2015-05-13, 02:27 PM

Jasmine (I think it was Jasmine? I can't find the quote) put it this way (paraphrased) once: "If you wouldn't mind getting it from the REM, anything less than 5 stones is a bargain."
Well maybe, but I assume he was doing the 40% drop one and then you're never guaranteed to get it. There is also a good chance some of those 4 stones would be used before the boss stage so in that case you don't even know which boss is showing up. It would be more true for something like the Zeuses or other mythical only dungeons where you know the boss and know it will drop.

Something like Astaroth//Cerberus Rider would be 1.5x/7x/1.5x, jumping to 1.5x/10.5x/1.5x when using a skill. And there are a lot of GD devils: Cauchemar, Bastet, Ruel, GD Meimei, Hera Beorc, Aamir, Corpse Wyrm, AHades, off the top of my head. More, if you don't mind missing out on the HP bonus on one or two. Astaroth//Cauchemar/Beorc/Meimei/Corpse Wyrm//Cerberus Rider has 5 rows, three boardshift spikes, a slime, and is almost completely farmable, for example, and Beorc > Corpse Wyrm is an enhanced board.

I'm not saying its amazing or invincible or The New Juggler™. It's not. But you can still work with it if you're within limited means.
Well I didn't realize it was 13 cost, which makes them much better options for limited cost dungeons. Though finding subs then would be harder but still probably worth fitting.

The thing about most of those subs though is that many of them make better leaders than the rider does. Then you run into the fact that many of those descends are decently hard, to the point where you have to have a strong team to get them. The rest are REM only.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 02:40 PM

Honestly, it usually seems pretty good. Certainly much better than skill up chances.

It's not really worth evolving baby tamas, unless you have spare evo mats laying around.

Yeah, I know. I just like data and spreadsheets. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uLNyXN8oxjcnLLT5y-vQoZP9xuT01uDDEcep04YiQkM/edit?usp=sharing I pulled a little data out of the threads from what I could find with some passive googling.

obryn

2015-05-13, 02:50 PM

So more and more, I'm thinking we won't get Awoken Egyptians any time too soon. Oh, they might get downloaded to the client before too long, but ... dungeons.

We are months behind on Descends. We would still need Diagoldos, Sonia Gran, Zeus+Hera, and Kaguya Hime before we can expect Sphinx unless they go out of order. That's a lot.

It's possible they'll tease us with a Sphinx Gift dungeon, but man...

Anarion

2015-05-13, 03:01 PM

Do any of you have baby tama success records? Are any of you as compulsive about record-keeping as I am?

I'm 1 for 3. :smallfrown:

Erloas

2015-05-13, 03:10 PM

Do any of you have baby tama success records? Are any of you as compulsive about record-keeping as I am?

Honestly, it usually seems pretty good. Certainly much better than skill up chances.

It's not really worth evolving baby tamas, unless you have spare evo mats laying around.

I don't remember the first time, but the second I went 5/15, so well below 50%. With that, I think it is worth evo'ing them first. Of course since I've got all of my primary subs and leaders fully awoken and I'm working mostly on long term plans it doesn't hurt me much to save them until more dublits fall into my hands.

Of course it probably depends what else you need. Since I haven't needed any angel or devil 'lits, and haven't needed tri-fruit lately I really haven't been getting babies very much. If you're picking them up a lot from running things like that then they are easier to "waste" with potentially not getting an awakening out of them.

Otravyat

2015-05-13, 03:27 PM

Yeah, I know. I just like data and spreadsheets. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uLNyXN8oxjcnLLT5y-vQoZP9xuT01uDDEcep04YiQkM/edit?usp=sharing I pulled a little data out of the threads from what I could find with some passive googling.

I havent kept track in the past, I'd guess around 45 - 50% with a 60+ sample size but I can't confirm. I'll throw the numbers up for you next time I do a big baby feeding though.

Jasmine

2015-05-13, 03:51 PM

Well, I do have three golems, Satan, and Belial to ult...
Funny Cuchu and Sieg too, if you want them. I've actually used 26 (9 golems, 1 Cuchu, 1 Sieg, 15 Angelious) and have another 24 on hand waiting for Apoc. Soo too many normal keepers that I've been using them as fodder...

Damn you Obyrn for clearing Challenge 9! Lol Jasmine's probably soon to follow... I feel so lagged behind. I been just going up to challenge 8 and then stopping -.-.
I don't think I can take Defoud either, unless I pull an Otra and start off with good boards. My second U&Y isn't skilled yet though.

Jasmine (I think it was Jasmine? I can't find the quote) put it this way (paraphrased) once: "If you wouldn't mind getting it from the REM, anything less than 5 stones is a bargain."
Yeap, rolling is on average one of the worst investments of stones for progress - but also the most painless and most exciting.
Consider that 8 rolls (around the amount you need for a 'good' god) is the equivalent of enough exp to max out 10 gods, or a +297, or almost enough to take your friends list from basic to max...Or even stone through a dozen dungeons.

Do any of you have baby tama success records? Are any of you as compulsive about record-keeping as I am?
I think I went 6/61 back when I was clearing out my box. Might want to wait until Otra coughs up some records for that one or your average is going to hell.

Well maybe, but I assume he was doing the 40% drop one and then you're never guaranteed to get it. There is also a good chance some of those 4 stones would be used before the boss stage so in that case you don't even know which boss is showing up. It would be more true for something like the Zeuses or other mythical only dungeons where you know the boss and know it will drop.
That's a very good point too. Anarion lucked out with that 13% success rate!

It's possible they'll tease us with a Sphinx Gift dungeon, but man...
In before gift dungeon with 30k preemptive.

it doesn't hurt me much to save them until more dublits fall into my hands.
http://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/v/t34.0-12/11262225_2849155902109_806389252_n.jpg?oh=3f5c8e5d f5d1ccb97526b06177b8b6b6&oe=55560F15

Sallera

2015-05-13, 03:52 PM

My baby tama success rates have been fairly consistently 25-35%. I haven't kept track of the long-term results, but every time I feed off a larger number that's where I end up.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 03:54 PM

Funny Cuchu and Sieg too, if you want them. I've actually used 26 (9 golems, 1 Cuchu, 1 Sieg, 15 Angelious) and have another 24 on hand waiting for Apoc. Soo too many normal keepers that I've been using them as fodder...I've actually already got those, thanks to the PEM. Ult Raph too.

Quietus

2015-05-13, 03:59 PM

Do any of you have baby tama success records? Are any of you as compulsive about record-keeping as I am?

I don't keep strict records, I can tell you my average is below 50%. I'd estimate in the neighbourhood of 40%. However, with my recent massive push to evolve... well, everything... I'm anticipating a lot of stones being spent on King Carnival (skill ups for Dragon Knights, plus leveling to evolve things), and then a further 5-10 stones being spent on Tamadra Village, as many as I can put in before I run out of time. I'll let you know how that goes.

So more and more, I'm thinking we won't get Awoken Egyptians any time too soon. Oh, they might get downloaded to the client before too long, but ... dungeons.

We are months behind on Descends. We would still need Diagoldos, Sonia Gran, Zeus+Hera, and Kaguya Hime before we can expect Sphinx unless they go out of order. That's a lot.

It's possible they'll tease us with a Sphinx Gift dungeon, but man...

You have a good point. A sad, but good point. I want to Awaken my phone's Bastet! It wouldn't surprise me if they go out of order, though, since Sphinx is needed for those new Awoken uvo's.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 04:06 PM

I dunno, them putting 3k and Egypt into day 2 of this godfest makes me think that they're making people want and/or get those gods just before the ults go live. Day 1 is all stuff that very recently got ults.

Anarion

2015-05-13, 04:07 PM

That's a very good point too. Anarion lucked out with that 13% success rate!

Oh it was utterly stupid. Only one stone was for the boss and that one was totally worth. Actually, and somewhat ironically, I'd have cleared the boss herself with no stones at all if I hadn't very slightly messed up my damage and taken her to just under 30% one turn earlier than intended. I have no justification for what I did other than "it worked" :smallbiggrin:

edit: Also, seriously, what is up with that Grimoire dungeon getting progressively easier? Round 2 is the hardest part for me because two elements becoming jammers followed by 50% odds that the cyclops one-shots me in two turns when I have no skills up at all is just too much. After that, everything gets easier and easier. I can take undine fine if I'm full hp when I get there, the double evolved demons are only a problem if I pull water (in which case I have to focus one and heal) and I had no problem with Michael. Boss itself might vary I suppose, though mostly the damage seemed very low as long as you don't hit the 30% threshold.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-13, 06:32 PM

If it's stupid and it works, it ain't stupid.

Quietus

2015-05-13, 11:07 PM

Well, I finally cludged my way through Wednesday Mythical with a heavily altered GZL team. Beating the final masks was hilariously easy, but I had to 1-damage my way through most of it, as I had to put a pair of Verdandi on the team to get 100% skill lock resist. Still, I got the stone, and that's something.

I'm looking forward to when we get Awoken Parvati, she'll make that dungeon hilariously easy.

::Edit:: Holy crap. I just looked at the Thursday Dungeon materials I need... nine green dragon fruits required to evolve everything I've got waiting in my box. Yes, that will help me to get Gronia and Verdandi skilled up...

Sallera

2015-05-14, 06:42 AM

Hm. On the one hand, 'every ninja becomes a devil' is kind of lazy. On the other, Sasuke fits on Ruel now, so it's hard to complain.

Also, ult Sara. That leg looks really strange, and I kind of miss the water from the evo version, but it looks pretty nice aside from that.

Starwulf

2015-05-14, 06:47 AM

obryn

2015-05-14, 08:14 AM

So, I don't know if anyone else has noticed it, but along with SiuiS being banned from here, it appears as though she's quit PAD. That or she renamed herself, because I just went through my friends list and there was no SiuiS listed anywhere.
I don't think that's true. Look more closely; we were just PMing on the client. You won't find her if you just look for LMeta though, I think.

Accounts don't get deleted - they just go dormant.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-14, 08:53 AM

http://i.imgur.com/JMevvvo.jpg Man I'm really settin' 'em up and knockin' 'em down this week, aren't I?

Quietus

2015-05-14, 09:49 AM

http://i.imgur.com/JMevvvo.jpg Man I'm really settin' 'em up and knockin' 'em down this week, aren't I?

Congrats again! That's always an awesome feeling.

obryn

2015-05-14, 10:22 AM

http://i.imgur.com/JMevvvo.jpg Man I'm really settin' 'em up and knockin' 'em down this week, aren't I?
Nice!!

I need tons of Dragon Flowers, of all things. Fortunately, that's a near-guarantee today ... and if it's not, I get a fruit, which I also need.

Fax Celestis

2015-05-14, 10:36 AM

So, btw: the results so far of the baby tama tracker (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uLNyXN8oxjcnLLT5y-vQoZP9xuT01uDDEcep04YiQkM/edit?usp=sharing) show 635 successes for 1609 attempts, or a 39.47% success rate, which is actually probably a 40% success rate because round numbers. Still gathering more info, but the sample is large enough at this time that it should be normalizing.

EDIT: Zhou Yu!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CE-QwFIVAAALwKp.png
Healer/Dragon
Active: Randomly spawn 3 water orbs
Leader: 3x ATK to Healer types. 1.5x HP to all cards when Xiao Qiao is in team

...which means XQ//ZY (let's just use all the hard scrabble letters at once, shall we?) on a team of healers is 1.875x/3x-12x/1x, and has three colors covered already. DValk as a sub covers the other two and you can fill in the rest however you like.

Academia

2015-05-14, 11:20 AM

Phew Firon is surveyed! Now my Cao Caos can skill up without such a painful grind - #EVENTUALLY...

And Jasmine, MORE TUNABOWLS FOR EVERYONE!

Zhou Yu... One of my favorite 3K characters in the actual story arc.... As far as Gods go, a very good non-REM healer lead paired with Xiao Qiao.... SiuS would be going crazy for that blue healer with HP mod, TPA, and ROW.. right about now...

And lastly, Genbu buffs?! Woah... Chinese Celestial GO GO GO! Sara ult inc~

Anarion

2015-05-14, 12:22 PM

Accounts don't get deleted - they just go dormant.

There's been active play, but it hasn't been Lmeta for a while, no. I think it's been switching between demon teams and random stuff. I grabbed her AB bluebird a few days ago via request. Lmeta did pop up once or twice though.

http://i.imgur.com/JMevvvo.jpg Man I'm really settin' 'em up and knockin' 'em down this week, aren't I?

Nice, congrats! Can I haz red dragon fruits? I just need like 200 or so to skill up my Norn, okay?

Nice!!

I need tons of Dragon Flowers, of all things. Fortunately, that's a near-guarantee today ... and if it's not, I get a fruit, which I also need.

How does that happen? I can't seem to get rid of dragon flowers. I'm wasting 3 rows worth of box space on the off chance that I'll need them right now.

So, btw: the results so far of the baby tama tracker (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uLNyXN8oxjcnLLT5y-vQoZP9xuT01uDDEcep04YiQkM/edit?usp=sharing) show 635 successes for 1609 attempts, or a 39.47% success rate, which is actually probably a 40% success rate because round numbers. Still gathering more info, but the sample is large enough at this time that it should be normalizing.

EDIT: Zhou Yu!

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CE-QwFIVAAALwKp.png
Healer/Dragon
Active: Randomly spawn 3 water orbs
Leader: 3x ATK to Healer types. 1.5x HP to all cards when Xiao Qiao is in team

...which means XQ//ZY (let's just use all the hard scrabble letters at once, shall we?) on a team of healers is 1.875x/3x-12x/1x, and has three colors covered already. DValk as a sub covers the other two and you can fill in the rest however you like.

That looks really cool. I want him. Even though I don't have DQXQ and I'm bad at scrabble. :smalltongue:

Phew Firon is surveyed! Now my Cao Caos can skill up without such a painful grind - #EVENTUALLY...

Can you translate this into English for me? I have no idea what it means, but skilling Cao Cao is relevant to me.

obryn

2015-05-14, 12:29 PM

How does that happen? I can't seem to get rid of dragon flowers. I'm wasting 3 rows worth of box space on the off chance that I'll need them right now.
I'm evo'ing Dark Fairies and some baby tamas. (I'm swimming in light dublits because I actually needed to farm for some dubmyths a few weeks back.)

Anarion

2015-05-14, 12:34 PM

some baby tamas.

Good call, now that we're learning they're actually 40%. :smallwink:

Also, Cleared legendary Heracles first try no stone and he dropped. I got really nervous on Fafnir because I had no skills yet and he woke up and increased his attack leaving me to do 1/3 of his hp with only 3 fire orbs on the field, but managed to get those comboed along with an overall 5 combo. Lucky he's wood type or I'd have been screwed. I also got a bit lucky in that my 40% skill bind resist blocked 1st labor, which made Heracles himself a huge pushover. I think I would have been fine anyway because I had enough healing on board to recover more than 10k hp if I had been hit with his first attack, but not having to ever see him do anything sure made it a lot easier.

obryn

2015-05-14, 12:39 PM

Good call, now that we're learning they're actually 40%. :smallwink:
If I have the extra mats, I go ahead and do it, but when Tama Village (or whatever it's called) rolls around, my monsters feast on the babies. :smallbiggrin: No way I'm holding onto 20 baby tamas that long!

obryn

2015-05-14, 01:53 PM

Good call, now that we're learning they're actually 40%. :smallwink:
Expanding more, it's a matter of stamina efficiency, still.

Tamadra Retreat costs 50 stamina. A pretty normal haul is 3-4 baby tamas, 0-1 tamas, and 0-2 chibidra. So we can call it 17 stamina per baby tamadra. Fair?

Let's look at the evo mat cost... A dragon flower is easy - 10 stamina, but you need 2, so it's 20. Gold dragons are cheap; we'll say 5 per, but you need to hit the dungeon. Maybe call them 5 each. Without the Hera Noel dungeon, Dub-Topalits are pretty rough to get, but at worst its 75 stamina per; I think it'd be fair to consider them 65 stamina each, since they can drop from early floors. Dragon Fruits drop slightly more than 1 out of 3 runs of the 10 stamina Thursday dungeon, but you're doubling up with the flowers, so we can call them - say - 10 per, to represent the extra run needed? (In practice, I think they drop like 20% of the time from the final stage instead of 33%, but...)

Anyway, all together, if you're farming materials specifically to evo up baby tamadras, it costs something like 110 stamina to evolve them, each. (Much less with the Noel dungeon, but that's neither here nor there.)

If baby tamadra cost 17 stamina each, you could feed between 6 and 7 more baby tamadra to a monster for the same cost. It is possible feeding 7 baby tamadras will end up in 0 awakenings - it happens 8% of the time with a 30% rate, or <1% with a 40% rate. But it's much more likely that you'll get more than 1 awakening out of that many baby tamadra for an equivalent stamina cost.

But! Like I said, you lose nothing if you acquire the evo mats when you were looking for other stuff anyway. Or if you just need something easy for them - like flowers. If you're farming dragon fruits or dub-topalits specifically to evo them, though, you're getting a raw deal.

Grotteschi

2015-05-14, 01:56 PM

Unicorn rider, Zhou Yuo(?), Phoenix rider. She is spinning in her forum grave, haha.

Anarion, Firons are baby dragons. They are in the dragon knight girls(?) series and have skills for the three kingdoms heroes. Scorched earth dragon knight Himiko has Firons in her dungeon.

Are there any suggestions for how to beat Gaia with Ra TAMadra? Copying Obryn's team is not applicable. Although will probably do that too.

Obryn, do you use double water or water/fire Orochi? Wood/light or double wood susano? Why?

obryn

2015-05-14, 01:59 PM

Are there any suggestions for how to beat Gaia with Ra TAMadra? Copying Obryn's team is not applicable. Although will probably do that too.
Like I said, I just ran Robin/Robin and threw a few stones. :smallbiggrin:

Obryn, do you use double water or water/fire Orochi? Wood/light or double wood susano? Why?
For Orochi, Water/Fire both for the better awoken skills and the extra color coverage.

Susano... I have several of each. :smallsmile: I generally bring along Wood/Light for the skill boost awakening. The awesome green ATK is a nice perk, too.

Jasmine

2015-05-14, 03:05 PM

So, I don't know if anyone else has noticed it, but along with SiuiS being banned from here, it appears as though she's quit PAD. That or she renamed herself, because I just went through my friends list and there was no SiuiS listed anywhere.
She's named Solace now, still seems to be running LMeta at the moment.

And Jasmine, MORE TUNABOWLS FOR EVERYONE!
Doesn't matter to me since I still don't have muse...waste of 50 rocks...mumble mumble...

Starwulf

2015-05-14, 07:31 PM

She's named Solace now, still seems to be running LMeta at the moment.

Doesn't matter to me since I still don't have muse...waste of 50 rocks...mumble mumble...

Thank you, I knew there was no SiuiS on my list, I went through my list 5 times before I made my post this morning, reading every single name.

Academia

2015-05-14, 08:59 PM

Can you translate this into English for me? I have no idea what it means, but skilling Cao Cao is relevant to me.

In the FUTURE (Maybe a while), you can get Firon from his own dungeon to skill up cao cao easily. Survey dungeons are dungeons with 2 specific drops for skill ups and usually picked by players demand.

Aca

Quietus

2015-05-14, 09:25 PM

For a start on Tamadra count, I just fed off 11 that I'd had sitting around - needed to empty a bunch of space, before tomorrow's major evo material collection. Got 5 awakenings (1 Levi, 2 Odin, 2 Uvo Tyrranos, finishing all three off).

I'm kind of thinking about buying Pengdra Village to level things up before tomorrow, so I can just evolve stuff that's available as I go.

Anarion

2015-05-14, 11:22 PM

Is there any trick to mythic stone dragon cave? Vishnu can't do it despite the type advantage because the round 3 Carbuncles 1-shot my best hp grass team, and Urd can't seem to do it because of the type disadvantage (and because I can't judge my damage and accidentally pushed the keeper to too low hp and got 1-shot...twice). I haven't even taken a real shot at the boss yet either and he looks kinda scary with those frequent 9k hits and no ability to delay him. I'm worried this is another step up in the "you need better numbers, sorry" game.

Academia

2015-05-15, 01:31 AM

She's named Solace now, still seems to be running LMeta at the moment.

Doesn't matter to me since I still don't have muse...waste of 50 rocks...mumble mumble...

Did you really grind that dungeon and used 50 stones.... -__________________-"" ?!

This why I never grind for "Invade" drops/skill ups...

I don't know... I think GunHo adapted to people all using non-IAP and decided to waste all the efforts put in via non-IAP. But I think you're on that point where you should just save stones to roll all the time....

Sallera

2015-05-15, 03:14 AM

Think Jasmine rolled REM ten times trying to get Muse, hence the fifty stones.

Well, after Aca's Indra plugging, I realized it would probably be a good idea to level mine for LKali, since it's SL4 from skilling up Rei, and conveniently I had a relevant snowglobe sitting around. (Although I ended up using the old uvo, since I need God typing more than a light row.) On a related note, Fax, if you're still collecting tama data, latest batch went 3/14.

Jasmine

2015-05-15, 03:34 AM

Is there any trick to mythic stone dragon cave?

I'm worried this is another step up in the "you need better numbers, sorry" game.
Well there's a few things you can improve when you're stuck. 1. Team comp (both synergy, and how well it counters the dungeon - Echidna is of little use here unless you desperately need those few turns of stall, or you can't take the keeper in 3 turns, since boss has status shield). 2. Team Stats (Levels/Skillups/Awakenings/Plus) - What you don't want to hear, but more makes things a lot easier. 3. Orb skill - something else you don't want to hear, but just as essential for high level play. and 4. Strategy. I can't say conclusively since I haven't watched you play, but you may not be stalling effectively - Like Kauai mentioned learning before, often you will want to waste a bunch of turns on weaker waves (especially if you can kill all but the least damaging enemy) so that all your skills are available when you need them, instead of just trying to whip through the dungeon. In addition to stalling for skills, those turns can be used to hoard orbs and set up the board. Once you get really good, it's quite possible to stall 10-20 turns on the first wave of a dungeon. Since there is a gap between the beginning and the carbuncles, and another between the carbuncles and the bosses, you have the opportunity to go into both challenges with all your actives up, and that should make things a lot easier.

Did you really grind that dungeon and used 50 stones.... -__________________-"" ?!
I rolled 10 times during the 3x slime knights carnival and got one of each color assguard, 3 Leezas, 1 Verche/2 Kamuis, and a Chester.

I've used chester once for zombie dragon, because dark resist + 2.5x dark damage makes that dungeon a joke. It's like double DJJD teams but 6.25x faster. Already had set of Uvo golems/knights, and no GZL for leeza use...Maybe with AParvati or ABastet...Pretty much the worst decision I've made on my account :smallfurious:

Quietus

2015-05-15, 06:58 AM

Welp, today is going to be a grind for me - First up is obtaining four Angelit and seven Devilit (have 0 and 1 respectively), and then powering through the 25 stamina Friday dungeon for the tremendous amounts of dublits I need. Worst will be the dub-mythlits, of course, which I require 47 of (and have 0). But when all is said and done, I should end up with enough evo materials to push through almost everything in my box, except for Hera (need super dark dragons), and Valk/Beelzebub (Jewels). This promises to be delightfully mind numbing, considering 90% of what I'm working to evolve won't actually get used. It's just bothering me that it shows up on my Padherder as stuff I need.

Sallera

2015-05-15, 07:49 AM

That's what priority zero is for. <<;;

Quietus

2015-05-15, 08:31 AM

That's what priority zero is for. <<;;

I know. This is one of those things where I am well aware that I am pissing away time and resources at something stupid. It's purely an attempt to satisfy my own neurotic nature. :smalltongue:

The worst part is going to be the day that I decide to get all the awoken skills for everything. *Shudder*

Fax Celestis

2015-05-15, 09:00 AM

Four pulls for today's GF.

Melon Dragon (evo'd)
Kushinada (evo'd).
Basilisk.
Kirin.

None of which I had, and at least two of which I have significant and immediate use for.

obryn

2015-05-15, 09:29 AM

Oh hey! Sun Wukong. Not bad for a whim-pull.

137beth

2015-05-15, 11:29 AM

One pull:

Red Sonia

for the fourth time. Okay this isn't even funny anymore. I haven't even finished awakening my third one!

Lifetime (normal) REM pulls: 78
Farmable monsters pulled during a godfest: 29