Most unfare and strongest monster in your opinion.

[boriss283]

Hello. I want to find most strongest and most unfare monsters in pathfinder. At this moment i am serching monsters with low CR. 9 Or below. And what do u think about vampire lycanthrope?

[Studoku]

Why?

And does CR matter if you intend on being unfair anyway?

[atemu1234]

Meh.

Strongest monster? Wizard 20, using Greater Consumptive Field to Shapechange into a Tarrasque.

[boriss283]

Why?

And does CR matter if you intend on being unfair anyway?

We have Encounter Design in paizo gamemastering. So...i do not want to give players CR>APL+3

[Lorddenorstrus]

I feel trolled just reading that. The spelling errors on top of the almost intentionally poorly worded question. The examples we were given to.. CR 9? Be more specific if you're legit asking a question.. What it sounds like is you want a boss like creature to challenge a party. Well what level is the party? Whats the composition. Optimization level. Etc. That's all important when picking a boss. Also because players have 4 actions (4 people) per round. Having a 4 vs 1 boss generally ends out to be save or die from the boss or the boss is crapped on. You need to give the boss minions that eat up the players action economy and require them to kill the minions. Which gives the boss time to actually threaten the players.

What worries me is your statement of "Unfair." The correct word you're looking for is challenging. You want to CHALLENGE the players. Not brutally off them with a spell or something they only had a 20% or less chance of passing the save on.

[boriss283]

I feel trolled just reading that. The spelling errors on top of the almost intentionally poorly worded question. The examples we were given to.. CR 9? Be more specific if you're legit asking a question.. What it sounds like is you want a boss like creature to challenge a party. Well what level is the party? Whats the composition. Optimization level. Etc. That's all important when picking a boss. Also because players have 4 actions (4 people) per round. Having a 4 vs 1 boss generally ends out to be save or die from the boss or the boss is crapped on. You need to give the boss minions that eat up the players action economy and require them to kill the minions. Which gives the boss time to actually threaten the players.

What worries me is your statement of "Unfair." The correct word you're looking for is challenging. You want to CHALLENGE the players. Not brutally off them with a spell or something they only had a 20% or less chance of passing the save on.

Yes. You are right. I want to challenge players. Party is 6 lvl. There is 4 players in party. One goblin bow man, One paladin, one magus and one rogue with alchemist fires.
Boss fight is not obligat. I want some thing interesting. Not just stupid battle. May be some monsters with interesting abilitys. May be monsters with special death condition and so on.

[jiriku]

A vampire lycanthrope is a great choice for a boss monster. It has many good defenses, and it is fast and can escape quickly. Great boss. I would suggest a boss that is Large size, maybe something that can climb or fly. Large makes it more impressive, and harder to grapple with. The ability to climb or fly creates a more interesting battle because the boss moves up and downd.

[Seerow]

Hello. I want to find most strongest and most unfare monsters in pathfinder. At this moment i am serching monsters with low CR. 9 Or below. And what do u think about vampire lycanthrope?

Right at the cutoff of your CR9: Night Hag (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/nightHag.htm).

Always on Etherealness, leaving a typical level 9 party with nothing they can do to affect it. Meanwhile every night one person in the party takes 1 con drain with no save. If it attacks far enough out from civilization, you can kill a party member through con drain if they do not have full casters in the party (for either Teleport to get back to civilization to grab some scrolls of higher level spells to deal with it, or Restoration so the constant con drain is an annoyance rather than looming death).

My group hit one at level 7 while we were weeks out into the woods, and the only reason it didn't kill half the party was plain and simple GM fiat to nerf the thing once he realized we had literally nothing we could do to affect it.

[Red Fel]

Right at the cutoff of your CR9: Night Hag (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/nightHag.htm).

PF version here (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/monstrous-humanoids/hag/hag-night). No Change Shape ability, but still just as nasty.

Keep in mind that, even when she's not ethereal, she's got DR 10/cold iron and magic, several immunities, and SR 24. You're not going to hit her, and you're going to die. Slowly.

[bekeleven]

This party is either low-op enough to get wiped by a hag or high enough op for it not to care. This party won't hit the middle ground where a night hag is a challenging encounter.

How many sneak attack dice is the rogue dealing in a typical combat round?

[boriss283]

He dont doing that much sneak attacks in combat, may be 1-3, but fire dmg 1d6 every round is enought for him. Enemy need to spent 1 combat turn to extinguish fire and this is anought for other team mates to kill this enemy. otherwise enemy will die in fire.
In battle on open location party will kill night hang. Just because they have 2 ratlings in party and 1 goblin with darvision. And Goblin with bow will make most damage in fight, because he has enchanted bow, so hes attack doing magic damage and ignore night hag's DR.
Dream Haunting (Su) doing 1 con drane per night ? Or every round when they sleep ?

[IZ42]

Well, the night hag is immune to fire, so your rogue pretty much is screwed if that's his only method of attack. The con drain is only afflicted when they wake up. However, your Goblin archer doesn't appear to have cold iron arrows, so that DR 10 still applies, since it needs both Cold Iron and Magic to pass. Also, unless they have something to bypass at will etherealness, they literally cannot touch the Night Hag unless they have Ghost Touch weapons or something similar. Frankly, I think CR 9 is low for that monstrosity, even with that weakness of theirs.

[boriss283]

May be you know some monsters with special death condition ? Some thing like you need to destroy some item, before you could kill this monster or something like this ?

[Extra Anchovies]

That's the sort of stuff best left to individual DMs to determine. It seems you want a monster that is more of a story challenge than a combat-numbers challenge, so the best option is one that fits seamlessly into your campaign.

[bekeleven]

Well, the night hag is immune to fire, so your rogue pretty much is screwed if that's his only method of attack.
Remember how I said this party is either really low or really high op?

Splash weapons can't deal sneak attack damage (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat#TOC-Throw-Splash-Weapon) in pathfinder.

So yeah, you could indeed say the rogue is screwed if that's his only method of attack.

[IZ42]

Remember how I said this party is either really low or really high op?

Splash weapons can't deal sneak attack damage (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/combat#TOC-Throw-Splash-Weapon) in pathfinder.

So yeah, you could indeed say the rogue is screwed if that's his only method of attack.

I wasn't even assuming that he could, but OK, that's a thing. However, it is possible to have Sneak attack and Alchemist Bombs apply to the same attack, by attaching the bomb to an arrow and sneak attacking with that bow. I find this to be amusing.

[Spacewolf]

Isn't there that Crab that famous for being completely OP compared to the party at that level? I remember seeing a quote about it somewhere awhile back although it might be abit low CR.

[Doctor Awkward]

http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20040221a

Monstrous Crab

They put it at a CR 3, when it is easily a CR 5. Minimum.

A template could take it up another few notches.

note that it's aquatic, and will drag targets it grapples into the water.

[Spacewolf]

Yea i found one of the topics I saw it in as well, although still not the quote which is a shame because it was pretty funny.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-48890.html

[boriss283]

Yea i found one of the topics I saw it in as well, although still not the quote which is a shame because it was pretty funny.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-48890.html

Can you say book with this monster ? Or this is home made monster ?

[Doctor Awkward]

Can you say book with this monster ? Or this is home made monster ?

...

...uhhh.


http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20040221a

Monstrous Crab

They put it at a CR 3, when it is easily a CR 5. Minimum.

A template could take it up another few notches.

note that it's aquatic, and will drag targets it grapples into the water.

[Story]

As long as you're talking about broken 3.5 monsters*, Adamantine Horror is way more appropriate since it's CR9, not CR3. But the question asked for Pathfinder.


* I think the Adamantine Horror is technically 3.0