Help! Save my game!

[ewoods]

I'm having some serious issues with my game lately and am hoping for some advice. I've been DMing a campaign for about a year and a half now. There are six people in the party, all level 15. Up until a few sessions ago the goal of the party throughout the campaign has been to find this extremely powerful artifact that (without getting into too much detail) was used to plunge the world into chaos. Well they found it and now the obvious thing (to me) is to use it to restore the world. But somehow over the past month or two the party has started to fall apart. In-game, the Wizard wants to use the artifact for research, the cleric wants to seal it away in the church, and the paladin is about the only one who wants to take it and use it. Out of game, three players have told me that they don't really know what they're supposed to be doing, and two players (including the paladin) feel like the rest of the party isn't listening to them.

I've never had a group break down like this, especially after playing very well together since we started last January. Do I say something out of game? Like do I just tell them, "This is what I think you guys should do next, and by the way, you need to start working together better." I keep throwing what I think are some pretty big plot hooks at them, but maybe I'm just not doing enough? I've been thinking about some kind of in-game event. They're approaching 16th level and have attracted quite a bit of attention throughout the world, so I had this idea where they find this clearing that has statues of each of them carved with some kind of shrine to their group, as sort of a way of saying, "Hey, lots of people in this world know you're here and they're depending on you to save them." I don't know, I'm pretty lost. Any help or advice is welcome!

[Tvtyrant]

I feel your pain. My suggestion is to ask everyone ooc what they want to do now. Worst case scenario throw an Elder Evil at the world, they are high enough level to deal with the signs.

[Flickerdart]

What are their motivations? Why does the wizard want to study it, and what does he hope to gain? Why does the cleric want to seal it away, and how does he plan to save the world without it?

[jiriku]

I keep throwing what I think are some pretty big plot hooks at them, but maybe I'm just not doing enough? I've been thinking about some kind of in-game event. They're approaching 16th level and have attracted quite a bit of attention throughout the world, so I had this idea where they find this clearing that has statues of each of them carved with some kind of shrine to their group, as sort of a way of saying, "Hey, lots of people in this world know you're here and they're depending on you to save them."

That is very indirect. It's a huge logical leap from "people are making shrines to you" all the way to "you should use that artifact to restore the world now". I'd suggest you be very direct. Have a coalition of the the most powerful, respected, and influential NPCs in the world come en masse to the player's doorsteps, with their entourages, and ask them, very directly, to take care of business. Have them pull out all the stops -- elegant speeches, vivid descriptions of the calamities that people suffer around the world, dire predictions of the war, famine, and death that will come when the greedy and ambitious inevitably mobilize armies try to take the artifact away from the PCs, calling in favors and "leaning" on the PCs if they are unwilling, and end with heartfelt appeals "only you can save us!"

If that doesn't work, their former allies retreat, hold a council, and regretfully decide that if the PCs won't save the world out of the goodness of their hearts, no course remains except to gather armies, besiege them, and take the artifact by force. After all, they reason, if the forces of Good don't get ahold of the artifact first, the forces of Evil will inevitably attempt to do so.

[ewoods]

You're exactly right. I think I need to just be extremely direct with them because they haven't picked up any of the plot hooks I've thrown at them lately. They've all gotten really into their characters so I think maybe they're just being a bit stubborn. Like they all set out on this mission with their own individual goals and were sort of forced to work together. And now that they've achieved the initial goal, they're still stuck on what their original motivations were, when I really expected them to evolve and feel like they had a higher purpose. Seems like they're still thinking like 1st level characters.

[Geddy2112]

In-game, the Wizard wants to use the artifact for research, the cleric wants to seal it away in the church, and the paladin is about the only one who wants to take it and use it. Out of game, three players have told me that they don't really know what they're supposed to be doing, and two players (including the paladin) feel like the rest of the party isn't listening to them...since we started last January...

Why can't the cleric, wizard and paladin all do the same thing? Study it while using it to save the world, then seal it away after so this never happens again? I understand why 3 of the players don't know what to do, because they have solved the major plot point. The story is more or less over, the great fight to recover this artifact was the crux of the campaign, and with that over, maybe it IS time to wrap it up? Not saying it needs to die or end badly, but that the story has ended on a high note, and other than the falling action and resolution as far as what to do, its basically over. Better to end when its still interesting before dragging on.


Have a coalition of the the most powerful, respected, and influential NPCs in the world come en masse to the player's doorsteps, with their entourages, and ask them, very directly, to take care of business. Have them pull out all the stops -- elegant speeches, vivid descriptions of the calamities that people suffer around the world, dire predictions of the war, famine, and death that will come when the greedy and ambitious inevitably mobilize armies try to take the artifact away from the PCs, calling in favors and "leaning" on the PCs if they are unwilling, and end with heartfelt appeals "only you can save us!"

If that doesn't work, their former allies retreat, hold a council, and regretfully decide that if the PCs won't save the world out of the goodness of their hearts, no course remains except to gather armies, besiege them, and take the artifact by force. After all, they reason, if the forces of Good don't get ahold of the artifact first, the forces of Evil will inevitably attempt to do so.

I second this idea. It gives one major last chance for things to happen, combat or not. You could always have some bigger boss fight rigged if they use the artifact, if they don't, the NPC's can be said boss fight.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Important question: is the party (ie, the characters) starting to fall apart, or is the group (the players themselves)? You'll need a different solution if the actual people are starting to get on each other's nerves.

[AnonMD]

Have the world destroying artifact gain intelligence and explain what it does. But only after it makes everything worse. As in, awakening an Elder Evil.

[Hiro Quester]

Have three different chaotic Gods, who want the party to fail (because increased chaos means increased power for them) give each player the same dream.

In the dream, these terrifying Gods threaten them each with rather dire consequences (each tailored to the party member's values and concerns), if the party tries to use the artifact to fix the world.

The dream will make clear the path the world is taking, which these Gods want to happen (and the party presumably want NOT to happen).

And (if necessary) give the party cleric a bit of extra guidance from his deity: These gods are threatening you because they sense that you could be a threat to their power. But if you did do this, you would undermine their power to carry out their threats. And remind him that these Gods might do what they threatened anyway, out of retribution.

So the best way to avoid the threat is to undermine these gods' power by doing what they warned the party members not to do, and use the artifact to fix the world.

I think you will find that being threatened like that, and being told not to do this particular thing, will unite the party in collective hate and spite and defiance.

A similar tactic worked pretty well in the game I was playing in a couple of years ago, to tell us where the story needed to go and motivate us to go there.

[goto124]

Important question: is the party (ie, the characters) starting to fall apart, or is the group (the players themselves)? You'll need a different solution if the actual people are starting to get on each other's nerves.

Emphasis on this. Are the OOC group dynamics getting bad?

[Drork]

The answer to so many of questions of plot understand can be solved by Dragons.
Good dragons come with the answers they seek on how to solve the problems.
Bad dragons come (who are very vocal) to kill them to stop them from doing X which would solve the problem.
Good and bad dragons come and the PCs can get involved in a dragon three way battle.

A cleric is also open to nudging from their gods. Wizards are prone to being crazy but if the paladin and the cleric are on the same page that should help convince the wizard.
You could let them know that things are going to wrap up soon and just let the players have at it winner takes all and solves the problem.
The other thing the players may need is reminder that they defeated An evil of the world. There is always a bigger fish, maybe they just need more of a gimps are the horrors on the other side of solving this problem to motivate them.