Beguiler into Sublime Chord?

[Tvtyrant]

Does a Beguiler/its siblings get access to the wizard/bard lists if they prc into Sublime Chord? For that matter what hsppens when you advance a Wizard with it?

[Sian]

you must be misremembering / mixing together prestige classes.

You don't select a class to advance with Sublime chord, but get a seperate casting 'table' (4th-9th) which can pull from Wiz/Soc and Bard lists.

[darksolitaire]

Does a Beguiler/its siblings get access to the wizard/bard lists if they prc into Sublime Chord? For that matter what hsppens when you advance a Wizard with it?

Sub Chord has it's own spellcasting with Bard and Sorcerer/Wizard spell, so you would get the access to class spell list for Use Magic Device but you wouldn't add these to your Beguiler spell list.

Prestige Bard on the other hand, gets you few hundred spells known to your Beguiler spell list. If you get some way to prepare spells, you could get Beguiler into Mage of Arcane Order and sort of loan wizardly spells.

[sleepyphoenixx]

Prestige Bard on the other hand, gets you few hundred spells known to your Beguiler spell list. If you get some way to prepare spells, you could get Beguiler into Mage of Arcane Order and sort of loan wizardly spells.

That's not entirely true. What you definitely get is the bard-unique spells from the PHB. Anything beyond that is up to DM adjudication.

[darksolitaire]

That's not entirely true. What you definitely get is the bard-unique spells from the PHB. Anything beyond that is up to DM adjudication.

Yeah, upon reading the entry again, you're correct. Damn. :smalltongue:

[Crake]

That's not entirely true. What you definitely get is the bard-unique spells from the PHB. Anything beyond that is up to DM adjudication.

Still, even then, some of those spells are pretty good

[darksolitaire]

There's 10 spells in Core unique to Bards.

0: Lullaby, Summon Instrument
1: Lesser Confusion
3: Glibness, Good Hope, Sculpt Sound
4: Modify Memory, Zone of Silence
5: Song of Discord
6: Sympathetic Vibration

Not much meat in there. For comparison, Sandshaper gets total of 14 spells known to level 1 and 2.

[sleepyphoenixx]

There's 10 spells in Core unique to Bards.

0: Lullaby, Summon Instrument
1: Lesser Confusion
3: Glibness, Good Hope, Sculpt Sound
4: Modify Memory, Zone of Silence
5: Song of Discord
6: Sympathetic Vibration

Not much meat in there. For comparison, Sandshaper gets total of 14 spells known to level 1 and 2.

Well that's what you definitely get. A reasonable DM would probably extend that to the bard-unique spells from other books that are allowed in his game, and there are quite a few good ones.
I'd take a pretty lenient DM to allow all spells on the bard list though, like those that also appear on the sorc/wiz list. If yours does it's pretty much a must-have dip for beguilers and similar full list access casters.

[Evolved Shrimp]

That's not entirely true. What you definitely get is the bard-unique spells from the PHB. Anything beyond that is up to DM adjudication.

The relevant passage from Complete Arcane (p61) is “A sublime chord can choose spells from the sorcerer/wizard or the bard spell list; if a spell appears on both lists at different levels, she uses the bard version of the spell.”

I find it difficult to read this other than that a sublime chord can choose, for her spells known, from all spells that a sorcerer or bard can cast. (These spells known are kept separate from lists of spells known from other classes, though, so they could not be cast from a beguiler slot.)

[sleepyphoenixx]

The relevant passage from Complete Arcane (p61) is “A sublime chord can choose spells from the sorcerer/wizard or the bard spell list; if a spell appears on both lists at different levels, she uses the bard version of the spell.”

I find it difficult to read this other than that a sublime chord can choose, for her spells known, from all spells that a sorcerer or bard can cast. (These spells known are kept separate from lists of spells known from other classes, though, so they could not be cast from a beguiler slot.)

I was talking about Prestige Bard. Sublime Chord casting has nothing to do with Beguiler casting.

[Evolved Shrimp]

I was talking about Prestige Bard. Sublime Chord casting has nothing to do with Beguiler casting.

Yeah, so you did… Sorry, I got a bit confused there.

[Hiro Quester]

The relevant passage from Complete Arcane (p61) is “A sublime chord can choose spells from the sorcerer/wizard or the bard spell list; if a spell appears on both lists at different levels, she uses the bard version of the spell.”

I find it difficult to read this other than that a sublime chord can choose, for her spells known, from all spells that a sorcerer or bard can cast. (These spells known are kept separate from lists of spells known from other classes, though, so they could not be cast from a beguiler slot.)

Yup. The list has all the sorc spells, plus bard spells. So you get irresistible dance as a 6th level spell, which is awesome. Also a few others are sorc 8 spells but bard6 spells that you get at 6th. Like hindsight.