Help Optimize: Eldritch Sniper

[Naanomi]

I have been looking at, and played some version of, a 'eldrich sniper' type character. The concept is simple: I want to play like a Champion... the choices in combat is always going to be to Eldritch Blast someone; the only question is who to blast and how many limited resources to use in the process.

My primary design goal is:
1) Any advantage I can get for my Eldritch Blast I will take

My secondary design goals are (in order of preference):
2) Have stealth capabilities (to be a real 'spell sniper')
3) Increase general combat effectiveness (saves, HP, AC, mobility)
4) Increase general out-of-combat versatility

Now, things that I feel I need to best support my primary goal of Eldritch Blasting:
Stats:
~Charisma at 20 at quickly as possible

Feats:
~Spell Sniper: Range increase, help with cover, potentially pick up slightly early
~Warcaster: Help Concentration, to keep Hex going. Also potential for more E.Bs with reaction abilities, though I don't plan on being in range to take advantage of it terribly often

Class Abilities:
~Warlock 5+: to collect all three Eldritch Blast invocations
~Sorcerer 3+: Quicken Spell is a huge increase in damage potential
~Fighter 2: Action Surge is another free blast to nova with once per short rest; Medium Armor and Shield proficiency is also nice. Defensive Combat Style is the only that helps at all, so it is a no-brainer
~Rogue 3: Assassinate is crits (which is nice) and Advantage (which is huge); Expertise and Cunning Action are a big boost to secondary design goals

Now, lets look at what supports secondary design goals:
Races:
~Variant Human: The charisma boost is necessary, the feat outweighs most other choices for me
~Lightfoot Halfling: Charisma plus stealth booster has potential
~Half-Elf: Most of it isn't too valuable to me but there is undeniable benefits in Darkvision for a stealthy character

Stats:
~Dexterity 14: Maxes AC with Medium Armor; also helps initiative and Stealth for secondary goals
~Constitution: As high as possible, HP and Concentration (for Hex) are my friends
~Everything else: WIS>INT>STR but really all pretty dumpable

Skills:
~Perception is the general 'useful' skill if you can get it
~Intimidation: while not formally a design goal, I like the idea of semi-optimizing this as well

Backgrounds:
~Nothing stands out. I like the Pirate feature, and those skills are useful if one is not allowed to use custom backgrounds.

Feats:
I doubt I will have many to spare but...
~Alertness helps the assassinate schtick
~Lucky, Skulker, Medium Armor Master all have promise
*NOTE: I am using a conservative view of feat interaction, meaning that I am not taking Polearm Master (that might work with Warcaster) or Crossbow Expert (which migh help point-blank spells)

Class Features:
~Warlock, Patron: Spells are essentially worthless, so only features really matter. Since I'll be killing things regularly, Fiend's temporary HP battery should be a useful buffer throughout my career
~Warlock, Boon: The invisible pet from Pact of Chains can 'help' most anything I want them to, including one E.B. a round. Tome is in the running as well, especially if I decide I want more than 5 levels in Warlock
~Rogue, Expertise: Stealth is a shoe-in, Perception is the obvious second choice but somehow I want to put it in Intimidation to better threaten folks with a good Eldritch Blasting
~Fighter, Combat Style: Defensive is the only that gives any benefit
~Sorcerer, Origin: Here is a tough choice... Draconic gives more HP, but Tides of Chaos is also useful in a variety of situations

Spells:
~Hex: Should always be up and ready to go so... no other concentration spells need apply
~Eldritch Blast: this should always be my combat roster, so other spells should be non-combat utility (or sorcery point fodder)

Future Levels:
~Warlock: 6+: Pact Magic leveling up gives more things to cash in for Sorcery Points on the short rest. Invocations and Patron features also have some good points
~Sorcerer 4+: Inherently gives more sorcery points than other options, which frankly may be the most important thing
~Bard: More expertise and a few other skill-monkey benefits
~Fighter 3: One level into Eldritch Knight is theoretically possible but doesn't offer much besides the caster level I can get elsewhere anyways
~Other Casters: Although they offer some good features and would give yummy spell-levels; probably not worth the stats I'd have to give up to further multiclass

Metamagic:
~Quicken: Absolutely vital to my damage output
~Extend: 48 Hour Hex has some fun, but probably not worth it
~Twin: Now two 24 hour Hexes... that could be more fun
~Subtle: Eldritch Blast has no material componants, so subtle means I can cast it anywhere! Shoot of those manacles and so on.
~Distant: Between Spell Sniper and Eldritch Blast, I already shoot far but... there is something to be said for having the absolute maximum functional combat range; especially when surprise attacks are part of your plans
~Empower: Hey, damage boosts are damage boosts

So, all that wordiness being said, here is what I need help with:
1) I have 7 levels to play with after all my 'necessary' levels; where do I go from there?
2) What order should I level up to keep most effective throughout my career?
3) Which sorcererous origin wins out, HP from Draconic or Tides of Chaos from Wild?
4) Metamagic options, which look the best (especially if I get a third?)
5) TO DO LATER: Spell lists advice once classes are chosen?
6) Anything else I missed, overlooked, or analyzed wrong?

And finally...
Variant Human/Pirate
Sorcerer 1/Warlock 4/Sorcerer +3/Warlock 1/Fighter 2/Rogue 3/Sorcerer +6

STR 8
DEX 14
CON 16
INT 8
WIS 10
CHA 16

1) Spell Sniper, Draconic Origin
2) Fiendish Patron
3) Agonizing Blast, Eldritch Spear
4) Pact of Chains
5) +2 Charisma
7) Quicken Spell, Distant Spell
8) +2 Charisma
9) Repelling Blast
10) Defensive Combat Style
12) Expertise: Stealth, Intimidation; New Skill: Intuition
18) Warcaster
20) Subtle Spell

Skills:
Intimidation
Stealth
Perception
Deception
Acrobatics
<Probably some languages>

[Mandragola]

Interesting build, though I wonder if you're trying to do too much.

Have you thought about bard levels, instead of rogue/fighter? I mention this because you'd get a bunch of extra spell slots, which you could convert into sorcery points to do more quickened EBs. You could pick up skills, expertise and medium armour proficiency + shields eventually that way.

That said, quickened EB is obviously not as good as action surge because you'll so often want to move hex for your bonus action. But you could do it way more.

Concentrating on hex actually isn't a huge deal. Not saying you can ignore it of course, but this build will have a hell of a lot more spell slots than a normal warlock would, so using one to reapply hex actually might not hurt too badly. It's nowhere near as serious as losing concentration on a buff/debuff, or something like spiritual guardians. Casting it again is no more hassle than moving it from one target to another (except for the slot of course) and you'll very often be moving it.

Taking all of that into consideration, I wonder if perhaps you'd be just as well off with a much simpler valour bard 3 warlock X build - maybe taking 2 fighter levels for action surge. I suppose fighter levels would be the way to go since then you could be a lore bard, which is clearly better for you.

That would mean not having con save proficiency, but as I've said I don't think that's a huge deal for this character. You may well disagree!

Final thought: don't ignore spells other than EB. Spells are good! Direct damage is of course great, but sometimes it's not the best answer to the problem. If you're against a real meatbag of a monster then messing with its head can be a very useful opener.

Variant Human urchin/criminal Warlock 1 (fiend pact)

8 (0)
13+1 (5)
14 (7)
10 (2)
12 (4)
15+1 (9)

Skills:
Stealth
Sleight of hand/deception
Perception (V. human bonus skill)
Intimidate
Deception if an urchin, or some other thing if a criminal - probably investigation.

Levelling scheme: Warlock 2, fighter 1-2, warlock 3-5, bard X. This is very flexible though. You might want to go to warlock 3 before switching, to power up spells and get your book or familiar (either of which would be good).

Invocations you want are agonising blast, devil's sight (taken at level 2) and repelling blast at whatever point you hit warlock 5. You really don't need eldritch spear - especially not with spell sniper.

Probably take persuade as your bonus bard skill, so you can be the party face.

Hope this gives you some ideas, and that you don't mind that it's quite unlike your original suggestion. I'm actually not sure which is better to be honest. Yours is great for killing dragons I'd say, but less so for their minions.

[coredump]

Keep it simpler. Your 'must haves' leave you at lvl 13 with no feats and Cha 18 only.

[Grimstaff]

Are you starting this character at 20th level? If not, it seems like you're going to have a long haul of lagging behind the single class characters in the campaign until you reach that point.

Or is this more of a theory exercise?

[Naanomi]

Part of the post is to figure how to turn it into a real build. Note the example character starts as a sorcerer (for con saves) but has Eldritch Blast from spell sniper; goes right into warlock for 4 levels for a Charisma boost and invocations... Then back to sorcerer until 8 for the second charisma boost.

Only past 8 is it anything but a Warlock/Sorcerer build, at least in my example (which was just thrown together really)

[coredump]

Part of the post is to figure how to turn it into a real build. Note the example character starts as a sorcerer (for con saves) but has Eldritch Blast from spell sniper; goes right into warlock for 4 levels for a Charisma boost and invocations... Then back to sorcerer until 8 for the second charisma boost.

Only past 8 is it anything but a Warlock/Sorcerer build, at least in my example (which was just thrown together really)

Stat boosts (feats) are a class ability, *not* per character level.
So to get 2 boosts, you will need to be Sorc 4+ and War 4+. So using your above it will go
Sorc
War
war
war
war Cha 18
war
sorc
sorc
sorc Cha 20 (At level 9) War5/Sorc4



Don't take EB via spell sniper if you are going to pick it up at lvl 2 anyway. Grab something you can't otherwise get, like Druid, Cleric, Bard..... maybe even Wizard.

I would probably skip the figher 2. Rogue gives Expertise for stealth and perception, plus the assassinate ability (but no SA...)

[Naanomi]

Well the plan is actually
Sorc 1/Warlock 4/Sorc +3/Warlock 1... So level 8 for 20 charisma, as quick as a single class build

[numerek]

6 level of bard for spiritual guardians, if your at long range use hex, if you are in close quarters use spiritual guardians, in close quarters it will easily out damage hex and not use up your bonus action. getting it from bard obviously has more synergy than getting it from cleric. Giving out 5 bardic inspirations will help your group a lot or you can use them with cutting words subtracting d8 from damage you take.

another thing supporting the pact of the chain is if he gets killed then he is usually soaking up 20+ damage.

Acrobatics skill to oppose shove/grapple attempts

Their are buff spells that help in combat that are not concentration
longstrider, mirror image, aid, fire shield, mage armor, phantom steed, there are probably others

One thing to consider is that twined firebolt could be better than eldritch blast,
<5th level
2d10 = 11
d10 + 3 or 4 = 8.5 to 9.5
hex adds 3.5 to either
<11th level
4d10 ( + 10 if draconic and 6 levels of sorcerer) = 22 or 32
2d10 + 8 or 10 = 19 or 21
possibly an extra 3.5 from maximal hex
<17th level
6d10 ( + 10 ) = 33 or 43
3d10 + 15 = 31.5
possibly an extra 7 from maximal hex
17th+
8d10 ( + 10 ) = 44 or 54
4d10 + 20 = 42
possibly an extra 10.5 from maximal hex

[Easy_Lee]

I would advocate for keeping this simple. Pick a few very good options that fill a certain role, and go all the way with them.

You want to be a spell sniper, killing targets at range with spells and not being noticed. If you are noticed, you want to have good means of escape. Here's what I think you should do:

Levels 1-9: Draconic Sorcerer (fire)
Levels 10-12: Fiend Patron Pact of Chain Warlock
Levels 13-20: Draconic Sorcerer

Chosen feats and features:

Feats: Spell Sniper and +2 CHA
Metamagics: Twin spell and
Invocations: Voice of the Chain Master and Agonizing Blast
Metamagics: Subtle, Twin, Quicken, and Distant

There is some overlap between fiend spells and draconic sorcerer (fire) spells. Fortunately, taking more levels of sorcerer lets us swap out any redundant spells, and we can cast warlock spells out of our spell slots (we can cast any spell we know out of any spell slot).

The warlock levels give you short rest spell slots that you can either use or consume for more sorcery points, and also make it so that we get temporary HP every time we kill something. They also give you a familiar (imp) who has devil's sight. Via Voice of the Chain Master, we can perceive through the imp's senses. He can find our targets for us if it's dark. Via subtle spell, we can fire a wide variety of crap at our targets without them even being aware of our presence. The imp is invisible, and thus is unlikely to be noticed.

And you'll note that some of the spells on your list, such as command which we got from fiend warlock, specify that you can cast them on targets you can see within range. That means that we don't need direct line of sight; we just need our imp to be able to see the target. Combined with subtle spell, that can create some very interesting situations just with the command spell alone.

At later levels, we gain free flight and quicken spell (when we have enough sorcery points to use it often). This makes us even harder to pin down, as we can use our action to dash or disengage and will still be able to fire a spell. We've also had twin this whole time for when we need it, since it's an extremely useful metamagic.

We eventually get distant spell, just in case we want to fire our spells from very far away.

[Naanomi]

I appreciate everyone's comments and I do fully understand there are ways to be much more overall effective without jumping classes so much. But on the strange idea that I might still make it work... lets do a level by level analysis perhaps?
Base: Varient Human, Pirate
STR 8, DEX 14, CON 16, INT 8, WIS 10, CHA 16
Intimidation, Deception, Stealth, Perception, Acrobatics (Athletics if custom backgrounds not allowed)
Dragon Origin (Red Dragon); Spell Sniper
*Eldritch Blast, Light, Mage Hand, Minor Illusion, Shocking Grasp
Shield, Expeditious Retreat

A pretty basic level 1 sorcerer build. Survivable for a first level caster (AC 15, 10 HP) with Shield and Retreat to help keep alive. This one level I don't have Hex so the concentration on Retreat isn't hurting but I need to trade it out when I get a chance. Note my damage potential is ever-so-slightly higher than normal with Eldritch Blast; though the crossbow may be seeing some use as well still.)
Fiend Patron
Chill Touch, Friends
Hex, Armor of Agathys

Probably stronger than a straight single class sorcerer, but not the damage potential of a pure warlock yet. Still focus on staying alive with multiple sources of Temporary HP, some of which can be faded out later.)
Eldritch Spear, Agonizing Blast
Command

Other builds are pulling into 2nd level spells here, but I get Agonizing Blast so I don't feel too bad; the crossbow can be retired for good. Range has really become an advantage now; and even though I lose some raw spell power my schtick has come online well.)
Mirror Image

Our second level spell isn't flashy but it is useful, and the Imp/Quasit comes around for scouting and to 'help' aim my Eldritch Blast (and skills), making my damage very reliable for this level.)
Magic Stone
Misty Step
+2 Charisma

Competing against 3rd level spells is tough, but this level really stands out. An extra ray on the Eldritch Blast, a charisma boost, Proficiency bonus increases... impressive. Magic Stone is a fringe case, but handing some to the familiar can lead to some interesting suprise maneuvers.)
Disguise Self, Feather Fall, -Expedious Retreat

And a low point... while damage is still strong, this level gives me basically nothing of value. Still acceptable damage but not stellar. Without metamagic and no higher level spells, sorcery points have little value to me.)
Invisibility

I'm competing against 4th level spells, but now is the point when it doesn't matter. Quicken turns every spell into another chance to Quicken. I'm taking Distant spell as well, although I recognize it is rarely useful the incomprable range has conceptual and corner case benefits.)
Suggestion

My second charisma boost comes into play, another potental 4 damage a round; but not much else stellar happening here.)
Repelling Blast
Dispel Magic, Fly, -Armor of Agathys
NOTE: This is the first level I really struggle with... does repelling blast and another quicken compare to a big armor boost?

Third level spells is another Quicken every short rest, proficiency bonus is never rejected. Repelling Blast at extreme range is a way to be very frustrating for opponants, especially potentially going off as often as it can (four times now, only to go up). Of course, it isn't fifth-level spells but I think I need to start comparing this to an archer build at this point, I'm a 1/3 caster at best but a capable, reliable damage dealer.)
Defensive Combat Style

A bit of a strange level... no spellcasting, no big flashy gains. However, my AC jump from Dragon Scales (15) to Breastplate, Shield, and Defensive Combat Style (19). From acceptable to damn good for what is still a long-range spellcaster.)
And more boom! Another ray for my Eldritch Blast, Action Surge for another blast if needed. A nova round can look like 9d10+9d6+45; push someone back 90 feet; and do so at 1200ft range if needed. Overall a satisfying level.)
Expertise: Stealth, Intimidation
Bonus Skill: Intuition

Another weak level; while my stealth and scaryness take a big boost (which I like) but overall nothing too exciting here.)
The proficiency boost is never turned down, my 'to hit' is +10, my Stealth is +12, my intimidation is a frightening +15. Cunning Action is an interesting addition... in the best world, my Bonus Action is a Quickened spell, but I don't always live in the best world. Bonus Dash with my range makes impressive kiting potential (or chasing potential for fleeing opponants), Disengage and Hide both have potential when things are going poorly.)
While late in fruition, assassinate opens up the possability for an absolutely devestating opening round. Critical hits are nice, but to me advantage is even better... and surprise rounds are not hard at 600-1200 ft.)

Note that at this point I have 4 Sorcery Points, and 10 spell levels to cash in on a long rest, 6 to cash in on a Short rest.

And thus we move forward. What else do I want? More sorcery points are the obvious choice. Sorcerer inherently gives the most; though any caster (Bard) will give just one less per level. More sorcerer levels eventually will probably be necessary, just to increase my Sorcery Point pool maximum (refilling all the time eats up bonus action times I could be Quickened Blasting)... so some balance between Sorcerer, Warlock, and Bard is likely.

I need to gather another feat (either through 3 more Warlock levels or 4 more Sorcerer levels). Fifth level spell slot(s) are also nice, so I can 24-hour a Hex; which come with either Warlock or Sorcerer 9... really leaving only two options and a spare 1-2 levels left.

So lets look at some scenarios:
+6 Levels of Sorcerer: Ends up with 10 point Sorcery Point Pool; and 41 spell levels to cash in; some utility spells but no appreciable class features I care about otherwise

+6 Levels of Warlock: Ends up with 4 Sorcery Point Pool; and 15 spell levels to cash in on a short rest... but I can't take advantage of it because of the low Sorcery Point Pool

+4 Levels of Warlock, +2 Sorcerer: 6 Sorcery Point Pool, two useful Invocation (Devil's Sight, One with Shadows?) and Patron Boon... I like the potential here. The question is: 6 Sorcery Points, is it enough to last a fight?

[XmonkTad]

I can't imagine taking more than 3 levels of Warlock. Yes, I know that you lose out on that ASI, but higher level spell slots are king.
There are 3 invocations that effect Eldrich Blast are Eldrich Spear, Agonizing Blast, and Repelling Blast. The first two are pretty essential to your character concept. The last one not as much. While sniping someone off a battlement 1200 feet away sounds awesome, a 9th level spell is even better.

What level are you running this at? The lowest level that this really works out is level 5 with Warlock 2/Sorcerer 3 (using variant human's feat for spell sniper). This gives you your two main invocations, your cantrip of choice, and your maximum range. Variant human lets you take sorcerer at level 1 because you pick up eldritch blast thanks to the spell sniper feat. This is advantageous because you get proficiency in con saves, which makes warcaster less important.

At level 20 though, for a fully optimized (in my mind) build you want Warlock 2/Sorcerer 18 (wild magic). Spell bombardment certainly is worth repelling blast. The ability to explode d10s means that 40% of the time you're rolling an extra d10. It's not as much damage on average as hex, but it works in your extreme-range sniper scenario.

I would personally drop fighter/rogue and not think twice about it. If you were really serious about doing this one, very specific thing, all the time and wanted it to come online asap, then your build might look something like this:
Human Variant Sorcerer 1
Sorc 1/ Warlock 2
Sorc 3/Warlock 2 (Any Sorc variant, we're not going to get that spell bombardment)
Sorc 3/ Warlock 2/ Rogue 3 (Assassin rogue. you have the ability to cast invisibility. You can cannibalize warlock spells to help you recharge second level spells)
Sorc 3/Warlock 2/Rogue 3/Fighter 3 (spellcasting is pretty much forever dead to you. But going into champion lets you crit more often. Since you have hit 3 beams since getting lvl 11, you can now have a ~1/3 chance that you'll land a crit. If you're going to sneak a lot and get insta-crit from rogue, then this is unnecessary)
And finally round the build out with the 4th or even 5th levels of the classes here. The extra feats/ASIs will be a breath of fresh air. You are now a level 20 character that does 4d10 worth of damage from 600 feet away all day, every day.

[RulesJD]

Drop Repelling Blast, pick up Devil's Sight instead.

Congrats, you just added advantage to ALL your to-hit rolls with EB, significantly upping your damage.

[Flashy]

Drop Repelling Blast, pick up Devil's Sight instead.

Congrats, you just added advantage to ALL your to-hit rolls with EB, significantly upping your damage.

How does darkvision grant you permanent advantage on ranged spell attacks?

[RulesJD]

How does darkvision grant you permanent advantage on ranged spell attacks?

Cast Darkness on a piece of equipment you are carrying. Magical Darkness = Enemies can't see you, but you can still see them perfectly fine. Magical Darkness blocks Darkvision, but not the Devil's Sight invocation (blindsense also works but that's typically limited to 60ft). Because you are now an "Unseen Attacker", but you can see your enemy, you have Advantage on your attack rolls that continue until the enemy can see you. It's like Greater Invisibility, just much earlier and it only takes a 2nd level spell slot.

Normally this combo isn't used because Darkness is fairly large and it interferes with the rest of your party. But if your plan is to constantly be 150ft+ away from your enemy, that's not a problem.

[Flashy]

Cast Darkness on a piece of equipment you are carrying. Magical Darkness = Enemies can't see you, but you can still see them perfectly fine. Magical Darkness blocks Darkvision, but not the Devil's Sight invocation (blindsense also works but that's typically limited to 60ft). Because you are now an "Unseen Attacker", but you can see your enemy, you have Advantage on your attack rolls that continue until the enemy can see you. It's like Greater Invisibility, just much earlier and it only takes a 2nd level spell slot.

Normally this combo isn't used because Darkness is fairly large and it interferes with the rest of your party. But if your plan is to constantly be 150ft+ away from your enemy, that's not a problem.

This seems really DM dependent. Pretty much anyone I play with would rule that knowing that big blob of darkness is shooting at you eliminates the unseen attacker bonus, especially since if you're carrying the item you're always firing out of the exact center.

[XmonkTad]

Cast Darkness on a piece of equipment you are carrying. Magical Darkness = Enemies can't see you, but you can still see them perfectly fine. Magical Darkness blocks Darkvision, but not the Devil's Sight invocation (blindsense also works but that's typically limited to 60ft). Because you are now an "Unseen Attacker", but you can see your enemy, you have Advantage on your attack rolls that continue until the enemy can see you. It's like Greater Invisibility, just much earlier and it only takes a 2nd level spell slot.

Normally this combo isn't used because Darkness is fairly large and it interferes with the rest of your party. But if your plan is to constantly be 150ft+ away from your enemy, that's not a problem.

I like this idea, but taking up an invocation means adding on more warlock, which is probably the weakest class in the build. You could always do the poor man's version of this with the minor image cantrip.


This seems really DM dependent. Pretty much anyone I play with would rule that knowing that big blob of darkness is shooting at you eliminates the unseen attacker bonus, especially since if you're carrying the item you're always firing out of the exact center.


It's 100% RAW, and considering the investment it seems very balanced with things like reckless attack. From a fluff perspective, cast it on a sling, wave the sling around your head. Now they see an undulating ball of pure darkness that randomly shoots beams of pure force from somewhere near the center without warning.
The way I figure the unseen attacker advantage works is not just that you know where the attack is coming from, but also you have an idea of when it is coming. You can see an archer notch and draw his bow; you can see a wizard wiggle his fingers and point at you. But just a big ball of blackness? You're just getting shot 1-4 times every 6 seconds without any warning.
Personally I don't know any DM who would say no to this (especially considering how I've had DMs use darkness against me as a player).

[Blyte]

I would go human for sniper straight off.

Sor 1
War 2-3
Sor 4-5

So at 5th you have cha to dmg, push, and meta magic.

[Yagyujubei]

This seems really DM dependent. Pretty much anyone I play with would rule that knowing that big blob of darkness is shooting at you eliminates the unseen attacker bonus, especially since if you're carrying the item you're always firing out of the exact center.

then your DM doesn't follow the rules, which is kinda lame.


as for on topic. I would finish up the rest of the way as a warlock. you would be able to get to 11, which would let you finish off your patron features, get a third spell slot, a bunch more invocations, and a mystic arcanum use, which can be the coveted and broken as balls conjure fey spell. or mass suggestion which is also amazing.

[Naanomi]

People keep trying to offer other things to do in combat; I am a spell-Barbarian with a eldritch-Greatsword, I'm not looking for options I'm looking for power :smallbiggrin:


Sorc 3/Warlock 2/Rogue 3/Fighter 3 (spellcasting is pretty much forever dead to you. But going into champion lets you crit more often. Since you have hit 3 beams since getting lvl 11, you can now have a ~1/3 chance that you'll land a crit. If you're going to sneak a lot and get insta-crit from rogue, then this is unnecessary)
Sadly Champion only lets you Crit better with Weapon Attacks, not spells


I would finish up the rest of the way as a warlock. you would be able to get to 11, which would let you finish off your patron features, get a third spell slot, a bunch more invocations, and a mystic arcanum use, which can be the coveted and broken as balls conjure fey spell. or mass suggestion which is also amazing.
As much as I'd like this, I feel like I need at least one more Sorcerer level about the 4... the Sorcery Point Pool is capped, so 5th level Spell Slots would only convert to 4 Points if I didn't take at least one more Sorcerer level

[Easy_Lee]

People keep trying to offer other things to do in combat; I am a spell-Barbarian with a eldritch-Greatsword, I'm not looking for options I'm looking for power :smallbiggrin:

Pardon me if this has already been said, but barbarians can neither cast nor concentrate on spells while raging. It's a silly limitation, but is RAW. So assuming you meant barbarian as in the class, rather than just the term, then it's not going to work so well without a (reasonable) houserule.

[Naanomi]

Pardon me if this has already been said, but barbarians can neither cast nor concentrate on spells while raging. It's a silly limitation, but is RAW. So assuming you meant barbarian as in the class, rather than just the term, then it's not going to work so well without a (reasonable) houserule.
No sorry, bad analogy I guess.

I meant 'people keep reminding me how awesome spell levels are, and I know that but... I am looking for a character that doesn't really utilize them even though they are technically available, so I see less value in focusing on that part of the build; and overall raw power of my chosen 'attack' is of more value, in this case, than overall increased versatility'

[Yagyujubei]

People keep trying to offer other things to do in combat; I am a spell-Barbarian with a eldritch-Greatsword, I'm not looking for options I'm looking for power :smallbiggrin:


Sadly Champion only lets you Crit better with Weapon Attacks, not spells


As much as I'd like this, I feel like I need at least one more Sorcerer level about the 4... the Sorcery Point Pool is capped, so 5th level Spell Slots would only convert to 4 Points if I didn't take at least one more Sorcerer level

honestly in this case I would drop the fighter levels. Action surge is overrated in my opinion and you already have twin spell to nova when you need too. your AC wont actually even drop if you take an additional sorc level (4) and one more warlock (12) to get two more ASI's. pump your dex to 18 and grab some bracers of defense and you'll still be able to hit 19AC even if it will take you longer. this will also get you a 6th invocation as well.

EDIT: oh you were already taking 4 levels in sorc and wanted a 5th, well then you could grab that 5th and still get the 12th level in warlock for another ASI, and still be at 18AC at least.

[numerek]

People keep trying to offer other things to do in combat; I am a spell-Barbarian with a eldritch-Greatsword, I'm not looking for options I'm looking for power :smallbiggrin:


I'm not sure exact what it is your looking for, but other ways to increase eldritch blast damage are bestow curse which when cast as a 5th level spell doesn't require concentration, even when not if you only need to hit one creature it would deal more damage than hex but the target can save against it. Contagion can give you advantage on your attacks as long as the creature is blindable, or vulnerability to all damage, or you can add the stun effect. you can also give them disadvantage to the saving throws of each other. you can get these from bard levels which gives the benefits mentioned in my last post.

A familiar can help you deliver these spells at quasi range. - pact of chain

does vulnerability counteract immunity? if so could help against your arch nemesis the animated armor or whatever it is that is immune to force, all the things immune to necrotic, also if it counteracts resistance then it would help against things resistance to necrotic and the bearbarian npc.

[RulesJD]

People keep trying to offer other things to do in combat; I am a spell-Barbarian with a eldritch-Greatsword, I'm not looking for options I'm looking for power :smallbiggrin:


Then all you want is Warlock 3/Sorc X. Use Warlock for EB + Ranged one. Each turn open with Hex + EB. Turn two, open with quickened Scorching Ray + EB. Hex triggers a bajillion times and each hit adds your Cha mod. Done.

[Submortimer]

~Sorcerer, Origin: Here is a tough choice... Draconic gives more HP, but Tides of Chaos is also useful in a variety of situations


Don't even question it: Favored Soul. Medium Armor + Shields, Extra Attack, Domain Spells...it has lots of what you want and little of what you don't. Light, War, and Trickery all give you lots of fun spells to work with.

Point to make: This makes several of your class decisions easier. You've not waiting till level 9 to get a good AC and you'll get 4 free spells known out of your domain by the time you hit Sorc 5. In fact, I'd do your progression like this instead:


Sorc 1 (Favored Soul)
Sorc 1/War 1
Sorc 1/War 2
Sorc 1/War 3 (Chain)
Sorc 1/War 3/Fighter 1
Sorc 2/War 3/Fighter 1
Sorc 3/War 3/Fighter 1
Sorc 4/War 3/Fighter 1
Sorc 4/War 3/Fighter 2
Sorc 5/War 3/Fighter 2
Sorc 5/War 3/Fighter 2/Rogue 1
Sorc 5/War 3/Fighter 2/Rogue 2
Sorc 5/War 3/Fighter 2/Rogue 3 (assassin)
Sorc 5/War 4/Fighter 2/Rogue 3
Sorc 5/War 5/Fighter 2/Rogue 3
Sorc 6/War 5/Fighter 2/Rogue 3
Sorc 7/War 5/Fighter 2/Rogue 3
Sorc 8/War 5/Fighter 2/Rogue 3
Sorc 9/War 5/Fighter 2/Rogue 3
Sorc 10/War 5/Fighter 2/Rogue 3

[MaxWilson]

6 level of bard for spiritual guardians, if your at long range use hex, if you are in close quarters use spiritual guardians, in close quarters it will easily out damage hex and not use up your bonus action.

Hex doesn't work at long range. It only goes 90 feet, which is medium-short range.

[numerek]

Hex doesn't work at long range. It only goes 90 feet, which is medium-short range.

He is planning on taking the distant metamagic which can make that range 180 which by most accounts in long range, it is longer than the range of most spells, and it is long range for every ranged weapon.

As to what I said earlier about bard you can go favored soul war domain and pick up spiritual guardians.