Shugenja Help

[Chilxius]

I have an NPC Shugenja assisting my players as the healer. She chose water as her elemental focus. I have two questions:

1. Can Shugenja cast spells of their prohibited element? Like, from scrolls and wands? Because the description in Complete Divine is pretty concise:


As the cost of specializing in one element, a shugenja is prohibited from learning spells associated with a different element.

That's all it says. Maybe they meant to imply the same restrictions that wizards have to prohibited schools, but it's unlike D&D to be concise when wordiness would be clearer.

2. Can Shugenja use the Extra Spell feat to add prohibited element spells to their list? I've found a lot of discussion online about that feat, but not much of it was conclusive.

On turns where she doesn't need to heal, there's really nothing for my Shugenja to do.

[Afgncaap5]

1. Can Shugenja cast spells of their prohibited element? Like, from scrolls and wands? Because the description in Complete Divine is pretty concise

That's... a good question, actually. I'd never thought about that wording before. I've also not done much with Shugenja, so I may be out of my depth here, but I think that if all it says is that they can't learn spells, then that's all it would mean.

The only thing I can think of (and, again, not a big Shugenja player) that might get in the way of that would be something like a provision that says that prohibited spells aren't "on their spell list" for some weird reason.

[LentilNinja]

I have an NPC Shugenja assisting my players as the healer. She chose water as her elemental focus. I have two questions:

1. Can Shugenja cast spells of their prohibited element? Like, from scrolls and wands? Because the description in Complete Divine is pretty concise:

That's all it says. Maybe they meant to imply the same restrictions that wizards have to prohibited schools, but it's unlike D&D to be concise when wordiness would be clearer.

2. Can Shugenja use the Extra Spell feat to add prohibited element spells to their list? I've found a lot of discussion online about that feat, but not much of it was conclusive.

1. Unsure by RAW but fluff wise the answer should be no.

2. It depends how you interpret:

For classes such as wizard that have more options for learning spells, Extra Spell is generally used to learn a specific spell that the character lacks access to and would be unable to research.
If you read this as "learn a spell the character doesn't have on their spell list" then yes. However, I'm sure the interpretation means "learn a spell the character could cast, but doesn't have access to right now." in which the answer would be no.


On turns where she doesn't need to heal, there's really nothing for my Shugenja to do.

As a DM, I find this to be a good thing. An NPC ally is just another player that nobody at the table is playing, and another turn the actual players have to wait for. If she can't do anything, its more beneficial for the players playing.

[Chilxius]

As a DM, I find this to be a good thing. An NPC ally is just another player that nobody at the table is playing, and another turn the actual players have to wait for. If she can't do anything, its more beneficial for the players playing.

Normally I'd agree, but this is only a 3-person group. They kinda need a little help every turn, and just a simple Produce Flame would at least provide something to the fight.

[Marlowe]

Why do people go for Water Shugenja? Its the worst possible element to choose and yet every time I see the class mentioned its just assumed to be the default.:smallannoyed:

You don't have any good Air or Earth spells? What's your order?

[Grod_The_Giant]

On turns where she doesn't need to heal, there's really nothing for my Shugenja to do.
So, um, take buff spells from the Air and Earth elements? Only half your spells known need to be Water.

[Extra Anchovies]

Why do people go for Water Shugenja? Its the worst possible element to choose and yet every time I see the class mentioned its just assumed to be the default.:smallannoyed:

They're a divine spellcaster, obviously they gotta focus on healing.

[Chilxius]

So, um, take buff spells from the Air and Earth elements? Only half your spells known need to be Water.

Do you know how many spells Shugenja know? It's not a lot.
She does have Silent Image, which has been helpful.


Why do people go for Water Shugenja? Its the worst possible element to choose and yet every time I see the class mentioned its just assumed to be the default.

If I played my own Shugenja some day, I'd definitely try a different element. But this is an NPC, and an aquatic character in an aquatic campaign.

Seems like the best way to build a Shugenja would be Order of the Gentle Rain, but take fire as your chosen element. It really seems like an under-developed class, which is unfortunate because the concept is really neat.

[Marlowe]

Don't don't don't don't.

Your Order spells are still barred to you if they are of the opposing element. Taking Fire and Order of the Rain simply means you can't use most of your Order spells.

My advice would be Earth Shugenja w/ Order of the Chalice or Order of the Flame, and go Sacred Exorcist at 8th level.

Yes, the class is criminally underwritten.

[BWR]

Since you seem to be the DM I suggest looking at the source material for 3.x shugenja - L5R - and house ruling in some changes based on that.
the R&K shuggie has an elemental affinity and deficiency. In d20 terms, their caster level, including spells known and spell level available, counts as 2-4 higher for their affinity and 2-4 lower for their deficient element; they are not barred from any element except Void (which requires a special Advantage and special training). What you could easily do to emulate this is say that spells belonging to their deficient element (or barred, in d20 terms) must be learned as though they were one or two levels higher. "Way of the Shugenja" (or was it "Magic of Rokugan"?), a d20/R&K sourcebook for L5R has a feat that allows you to learn barred elemental spells as something like 4 levels higher, but I felt that was a bit excessive. In any case, the aforementioned books have lots of cool shugenja stuff like spells, feats, PrCs, etc.

[Evan Epis]

On turns where she doesn't need to heal, there's really nothing for my Shugenja to do.

The first thing that comes to mind when someone talks about Shugenja, is the Hexer PrC. If you can enter it, it gives you all the things this character wants. Extra spells from the Sorc/Wiz list and some Fear/Charm/Sleep effects etc. to do, instead of going inactive.

It's a 3.0 PrC and you have to be a "savage" humanoid IIRC.