Rope Trick hack?

[1Forge]

Hey so I was playing with our wizard in DnD and we realized something
Heres the stats
EDIT:Never mind I got the wrong stats go to 272 in the PHB

(note this is not a quote but for one go to page 272 in the PHB)

What this says is no attacks can pass through the entrance, that means it's pretty much an impenetrable forcefield right? If something attacked from above (lets pretend an ancient red dragon) and breathed fire at them and they threw a rope wouldn't that save them?

[Totema]

Methinks you're on the wrong board. That's Rope Trick for 3.5.

[1Forge]

Nope I meant to copy in the rules for 5e but could'nt find a digital copy go to the PHB page and you'll find it.

[Chronos]

First of all, it takes an action to cast, too long to "throw up a shield". Second, the entrance is from the material plane to the demiplane you create: If you and the dragon are both on the material plane, then its flames aren't passing through the entrance, they're just bypassing it.

Now, if you're already inside the demiplane, then you're safe from the dragon... for an hour. But the dragon is going to just wait right outside the entrance, and will munch you as soon as you emerge.

[JNAProductions]

Also, even if this did work, it'd get Rule 0'd hard. A utility resting spell is not meant to be used as a mid-combat shield.

Another point-it forms the demiplane some 60' about you, at the top of the rope. That's not exactly a super useful shield.

[1Forge]

I see your point... well our wizards gonna be upset, any other ideas for uses for it?:smallannoyed:

[JNAProductions]

Tie the bottom of the rope to someone's neck. Cast Rope Trick. Hilarity ensues. Just like how old Uncle Gary went. Hung by a wizard over a chicken pot pie.

[Easy_Lee]

I see your point... well our wizards gonna be upset, any other ideas for uses for it?:smallannoyed:

Hold the action to cast the spell, toss a portable hole 60 feet in the air right as the dragon flies by overhead, then release the spell.

[1Forge]

Hold the action to cast the spell, toss a portable hole 60 feet in the air right as the dragon flies by overhead, then release the spell.

I dont get it? any living creature in the plane falls out when the spell is dispelled.

[JNAProductions]

Putting a portal in a Portable Hole results in fun*.

*Dwarf Fortress definition

[1Forge]

ah yes extra dimensional spaces converging dosent that suck everyone into the astral plane?

[Chronos]

Does it, or is that just half-remembered rules from three editions ago?

[Slipperychicken]

Tie the bottom of the rope to someone's neck. Cast Rope Trick. Hilarity ensues. Just like how old Uncle Gary went. Hung by a wizard over a chicken pot pie.

This raises an interesting point. The rope "rises into the air until the whole rope hangs perpendicular to the ground". But what if part of the rope is tied up such that the whole rope cannot be made perpendicular to the ground by lifting it? Would it just sail infinitely into space within the span of 6 seconds? Did I just break 5e by inventing FTL space travel with a knotted rope and a 2nd level spell?

[Person_Man]

I hate Rope Trick. (And Arcane Recovery, Ritual spells, etc).

If resource management is something you care about, then resources need to be limited in accordance with your design goals.

If resource management is something you don't care about, then resources shouldn't be limited.

But I hate it when game designers implement a resource management system, and then proceed to have all sorts of odd workarounds to get around it. It basically just adds a bunch of annoying book keeping to your game without adding much of a benefit.

For example, ever wonder why modern roleplaying video games rarely use healing/mana potions any more? Because they're a constant annoyance to manage. The important caveat to this is roguelike (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Roguelike) games, where careful resource management is the whole point of the game.

So I would actually be happy to let players use Rope Trick as an escape hatch or shield or whatever. For 3 rounds. After that, spell ends. That would make it fun and interesting, without making it a "auto Short Rest" button.

[Fwiffo86]

But I hate it when game designers implement a resource management system, and then proceed to have all sorts of odd workarounds to get around it. It basically just adds a bunch of annoying book keeping to your game without adding much of a benefit.


How is using abilities to enable resource management "not" resource management? I can see the thought that rendering resting as uninterruptible sort of, maybe, working around it, but I rings more to "allowing the party to rest" where they are to me. Either case, the rest itself is the management, not the rope trick or any other ability similar in nature.

As for additional uses? Doesn't that provide more power to the caster they are otherwise not entitled to? Allowing spells to function (even temporarily) as effects of higher powered spells (energy resistance, conjuring walls, etc) enables unbalance in my opinion.

[Vogonjeltz]

So I would actually be happy to let players use Rope Trick as an escape hatch or shield or whatever. For 3 rounds. After that, spell ends. That would make it fun and interesting, without making it a "auto Short Rest" button.

Fear not! Rope trick's extradimensional entrance blocks things entering or exiting it. If you're shooting from above (like a dragon might) you don't even see it, you just hit your target because there's no entrance to the space from above.

A clever use might be for hiding after having made a smoke cloud or using an illusion. It's a decent escape hatch if you can manage to sneak into it.

[ruy343]

I hate Rope Trick. (And Arcane Recovery, Ritual spells, etc).

If resource management is something you care about, then resources need to be limited in accordance with your design goals.

[...]

So I would actually be happy to let players use Rope Trick as an escape hatch or shield or whatever. For 3 rounds. After that, spell ends. That would make it fun and interesting, without making it a "auto Short Rest" button.

Wait, are you complaining about it allowing a caster to cast a ritual inside in safety? Complaining about the caster's ability to use the spell to get arcane recovery and cast it again? I'm not clear on your hatred of this spell.

That aside, while playing a transmuter (which are seriously underrated, by the way), I found several perfectly valid uses for the spell that have saved our necks. Once, we picked a fight with some dragon-cultists, and needed to make a quick escape when they retreated to find their dragon buddy. I cast rope trick before they showed back up, and we were all safely hidden inside when they arrived. They didn't know where we had gone, so they left to look for us. Perfectly logical. Saved our skins.

Similarly, when running from several enemies, you could have someone stall the advancing enemies at a choke point, turn a corner and hide inside a rope trick while they couldn't see where we were. They charge past you, and then you scurry back out and lay an ambush for them. Perfectly valid use of the spell. It's like stationary group invisibility or something!

While climbing a circular slope that went straight up, I once tied several ropes together and cast it on the end, allowing us to climb up the rope instead of pass the array of traps on the long slope. (DM's fault for not creating any realistic angling of the walls...)

Rope trick, itself, isn't broken by any stretch. could you hypothetically hide inside and shoot passerby? Yeah, I suppose, if your DM lets you (I wouldn't). However, a wise enemy would just sit out of range and watch for you to come out (or at the very least, run away from the place that hurts it). Besides, in order to shoot, you should be required to duck out of the hidey-hole, in which case enemies with readied actions should be totally able to nuke you.

As for its use in combat: how exactly do you plan to climb up a rope sufficiently high to give you a good view of the battlefield while archers are shooting and monsters are swinging? Let monsters get the opportunity to climb up the rope too, or have archers shoot the people climbing the rope. At the very least, enemies should get an opportunity attack for monsters leaving their threatened area (with advantage because their opponent isn't dodging: they're climbing!)

The way I see the spell: it's not intended for combat. It's intended to give you a safe place to hide, and maybe a way to suspend a rope when there's nowhere to hang it (which could mean that you could use it as an anchor or swing, or all sorts of things). But you know, sometimes hiding is the right course of action! The fact that attacks cannot go through the opening isn't really a problem because very few monsters would ever sit underneath the extraplanar window for a long time; play your monsters intelligently.

[D.U.P.A.]

This spell is weird, especially the name, which suggests some trick with a rope, like throwing it as a lasso, animating it like a snake... but it makes an extradimensional pocket, I fail to see why the rope is needed. IMO the spell should have a different more clear name and use of a rope makes little sense.

[Easy_Lee]

This spell is weird, especially the name, which suggests some trick with a rope, like throwing it as a lasso, animating it like a snake... but it makes an extradimensional pocket, I fail to see why the rope is needed. IMO the spell should have a different more clear name and use of a rope makes little sense.

It's one of those tradition things. The original was based on a magic trick where someone climbs a rope and seemingly disappears. There are a couple different versions of the trick and tales of it.

Honestly, I'm fine with the spell aside from one thing. As Person_man said, this spell can really mess with resource management. A few wizards may recast the spell repeatedly to take long rests. A monk and warlock with a wizard friend can hide in the hole to fully replenish their resources. Do it in a clever way (read: not very clever, but fairly obvious), and your opponents will not even know where the "window" is.

So, simple house rule: you cannot rest while in the extra-dimensional space created by this spell. That way it can be used for reconnaissance and similar without being overpowered.

[Shaofoo]

It's one of those tradition things. The original was based on a magic trick where someone climbs a rope and seemingly disappears. There are a couple different versions of the trick and tales of it.

Honestly, I'm fine with the spell aside from one thing. As Person_man said, this spell can really mess with resource management. A few wizards may recast the spell repeatedly to take long rests. A monk and warlock with a wizard friend can hide in the hole to fully replenish their resources. Do it in a clever way (read: not very clever, but fairly obvious), and your opponents will not even know where the "window" is.

So, simple house rule: you cannot rest while in the extra-dimensional space created by this spell. That way it can be used for reconnaissance and similar without being overpowered.

How can you recast this spell again while inside the Trick? The spell only lasts for an hour. It is impossible to get a long rest through Rope Trick unless you play with the variant where a long rest is only an hour (and even then that can be easily solved by making Rope Trick last 5 minutes).

Also one thing that people seem to forget is that after the hour is done you fall from the Trick. I don't think it is much fun falling from 50 feet after resting up. Better hope your wizard friend has Feather Fall or you preplanned cutting up your rope into ten foot long lengths.

[ruy343]

So, simple house rule: you cannot rest while in the extra-dimensional space created by this spell. That way it can be used for reconnaissance and similar without being overpowered.

An easier house rule is that a character that casts a spell ends their long rest, meaning they'd have to start over. After all, the rules state that nothing strenuous should take place during the rest, and one could argue that spellcasting is fairly strenuous. Casting continual rope tricks to take a long rest doesn't make sense, especially if you're doing it as a ritual, which would be even more strenuous.

However, a lot of useful long-rest related spells have a duration for 8 hours (like Leomund's Tiny Hut), precisely for this reason: you don't have to concentrate on the spell while resting, therefore you can actually rest.

Also, the spell doesn't state that you have to climb 50 feet of rope :smallwink:

[Easy_Lee]

An easier house rule is that a character that casts a spell ends their long rest, meaning they'd have to start over. After all, the rules state that nothing strenuous should take place during the rest, and one could argue that spellcasting is fairly strenuous. Casting continual rope tricks to take a long rest doesn't make sense, especially if you're doing it as a ritual, which would be even more strenuous.

However, a lot of useful long-rest related spells have a duration for 8 hours (like Leomund's Tiny Hut), precisely for this reason: you don't have to concentrate on the spell while resting, therefore you can actually rest.

Also, the spell doesn't state that you have to climb 50 feet of rope :smallwink:

That doesn't fix warlocks or monks hiding out in the wizard's rope trick, though, which is arguably a bigger concern.

[Fwiffo86]

I'm pretty sure the present incarnation of rope trick is to accommodate short rests in dangerous zones where you normally might not get a chance too. At least, that's my interpretation of it.

Rule 0'ing that away feels counter to my perceived intention of the spell regardless of what else you could do with it.

I'm away from book, but does the extra dimensional space even allow you to see out of it without actually exiting it? If not, I can see it as a place to hide, but I think it takes a minute to cast doesn't it? I may be thinking of a different spell.

[SharkForce]

That doesn't fix warlocks or monks hiding out in the wizard's rope trick, though, which is arguably a bigger concern.

what, you mean the fact that classes that are designed around being able to get short rests will be able to get short rests counts as a problem to you?

quick, let's go solve some other problems, like fighters having a bigger hit die than wizards, and specialist wizards being able to cast from more than one school of spells!

[Easy_Lee]

what, you mean the fact that classes that are designed around being able to get short rests will be able to get short rests counts as a problem to you?

quick, let's go solve some other problems, like fighters having a bigger hit die than wizards, and specialist wizards being able to cast from more than one school of spells!

I don't have a problem with that. What bothers me is that it can happen in the middle of a fight, and that little can be done about it short of an enemy finding the window and dispelling it. It negates the need for resource management, as others have said.

It's kind of like if a boxer could freeze time and take a breather in the middle of a match.

[Shaofoo]

Also, the spell doesn't state that you have to climb 50 feet of rope :smallwink:

You have to climb the rope to reach the hidden area, there is no way to get in otherwise. Which means that it could be funny seeing the wizard who dumped Str be unable to climb up his own rope to safety


I'm pretty sure the present incarnation of rope trick is to accommodate short rests in dangerous zones where you normally might not get a chance too. At least, that's my interpretation of it.

Rule 0'ing that away feels counter to my perceived intention of the spell regardless of what else you could do with it.

I'm away from book, but does the extra dimensional space even allow you to see out of it without actually exiting it? If not, I can see it as a place to hide, but I think it takes a minute to cast doesn't it? I may be thinking of a different spell.

You only need an action to cast the spell but you also need an action to climb up the rope since the rope is the only way to enter the Trick so you can't just emergency button Rope Trick to escape suddenly, especially if you used a long rope and you dumped Strength.


I don't have a problem with that. What bothers me is that it can happen in the middle of a fight, and that little can be done about it short of an enemy finding the window and dispelling it. It negates the need for resource management, as others have said.

It's kind of like if a boxer could freeze time and take a breather in the middle of a match.

You can cast the rope but you still have to climb the rope to get in. If it happens in the middle of the fight the enemy can interrupt the climbing of the rope by pulling the person down (which if it is the Strengthless Wizard should be easy) or even by destroying the rope itself. And potentially you can only enter the rope single file so you can only enter the area one at a time either.

It can be used as an escape spell but you will need some time to actually get in the safety zone, if the enemy is next to you I doubt you'll be able to use Rope Trick to escape.

Worst case scenario if the party rests up then the enemy also rests up and will be just as refreshed as the party is.

[Kryx]

You have to climb the rope to reach the hidden area, there is no way to get in otherwise. Which means that it could be funny seeing the wizard who dumped Str be unable to climb up his own rope to safety
This is correct:


You touch a length of rope that is up to 60 feet long. One end of the rope then rises into the air until the whole rope hangs perpendicular to the ground. At the upper end of the rope, an invisible entrance opens to an extradimensional space that lasts until the spell ends.
The extradimensional space can be reached by climbing to the top of the rope. The space can hold as many as eight Medium or smaller creatures. The rope can be pulled into the space, making the rope disappear from view outside the space.



And yes, spamming rope trick from inside is very silly/doesn't work.

[SharkForce]

I don't have a problem with that. What bothers me is that it can happen in the middle of a fight, and that little can be done about it short of an enemy finding the window and dispelling it. It negates the need for resource management, as others have said.

It's kind of like if a boxer could freeze time and take a breather in the middle of a match.

the spell creates a place to rest. at the top of a rope. and the door only prevents attacks from getting through, not people.

so:

each person must climb the rope.
your enemies can also climb the rope.
the location is obvious. it's at the top of the rope.
the rope can be cut while you are trying to climb it.
the rope can be weighed down to prevent you from pulling it up assuming you all manage to get into it without the enemy, thus allowing the enemy to follow you.
while climbing the rope, you are particularly vulnerable to attacks unless you have a climb speed.
you're giving up actions to cast the spell, and to climb the rope.
if you're casting the spell in combat, you're giving up resources (a spell known/prepared and a spell slot), which means it only grants resources to others at the expense of your own (even with arcane recovery, you could have used it for something else that would be more useful to win the fight in the first place, like a web spell).
if someone dispels the spell while you're in it, you're going to not get your rest, you will have burned your spell slot trying to get up there, and everyone falls some distance in the middle of a group of prepared enemies, probably landing prone, and probably taking some amount of damage from the fall.

the spell is garbage in combat. there are tons of ways to counter it, and the only way to prevent those counters is to be so massively superior that you didn't need the spell during combat.

it is useful for running away from an enemy, getting out of sight for a couple of rounds, casting the spell, and hiding so that the enemy will not find you. but then again, that isn't combat, and it still requires you to disengage so thoroughly that none of the enemy are around to prevent you from using the rope trick in a variety of ways.

[Hawkstar]

That doesn't fix warlocks or monks hiding out in the wizard's rope trick, though, which is arguably a bigger concern.
I don't see it as a problem at all - they still need a wizard. Yes, it's a way to force a short rest - but it costs a 2nd-level spell slot AND spell known to do it - if you're in an area with monsters, that short rest is also a short rest for enemies that need it, and time to prep an overwhelmingly difficult-to-overcome defense for enemies that don't. If there AREN'T enemies around... congratulations, you burned a spell slot on an effect largely replicable by a deck of cards (To pass the time and help mentally recuperate).

To say it 'negates the need for resource management' is incredibly disingenuous - it merely gives another tool for managing resources.

[Person_Man]

I'm not clear on your hatred of this spell.

Its more of a general hatred against pointless convoluted resource management. I could write a very long post about this, but my basic point is that if you care about resource management, you shouldn't have spells/abilities/etc that allow "resource juggling." In this case, a Wizard can let everyone in the party take a free Short Rest whenever they want, without the threat of being interrupted. As Easy_Lee points out, this is a big deal when you have a Warlock and/or Monk in the party.

[SharkForce]

if by "whenever you want", you mean "until their spell slots run out", then I suppose that's true.

of course, even then, you're ignoring the fact that the spell slot and spell prepared/known could instead have been web (until you start burning level 3 slots on it at which point it could have been hypnotic pattern or fear, and so on) and made the next fight simply not require a major expenditure of resources in the first place. you're trading resources for resources. there is no free lunch.

[SharkForce]

Except it's a ritual spell. So it's only a spell known that's wasted, not spell slots.

rope trick is not a ritual, afaict.

[JNAProductions]

To the PHB!

...

Yup, you're right. Deleting my old post.

[Kryx]

rope trick is not a ritual, afaict.
It is not. Tiny Hut is. Maybe he got the two similar spells/threads confused.

[JNAProductions]

I just derped up. I really need to double check these kinds of things.

[KorvinStarmast]

Its more of a general hatred against pointless convoluted resource management. I could write a very long post about this, but my basic point is that if you care about resource management, you shouldn't have spells/abilities/etc that allow "resource juggling." In this case, a Wizard can let everyone in the party take a free Short Rest whenever they want,
No, not whenever they want. Whenever the Wizard will burn a 3rd level spell slot. So no, it's not free.

There is also the opportunity cost of the Wizard preparing that spell rather than another one that might be a significant multiplier in combat. Haste. Slow. Fireball. Lightning bolt.

The party, if they operate as a team, eats a Wizard spell slot for the benefit of the party. That isn't a bad idea, and I am another who disagrees with your dislike for this use of a spell.

[ruy343]

No, not whenever they want. Whenever the Wizard will burn a 3rd level spell slot. So no, it's not free.

It's actually a second level spell, making it possible to be one of a wizard's "signature spells" at 17th level, allowing it to be cast far more often. However, few players would ever put a utility spell in that slot instead of a spell that does outright damage (like scorching ray, acid arrow, etc.).

[thereaper]

No, not whenever they want. Whenever the Wizard will burn a 3rd level spell slot. So no, it's not free.

There is also the opportunity cost of the Wizard preparing that spell rather than another one that might be a significant multiplier in combat. Haste. Slow. Fireball. Lightning bolt.

The party, if they operate as a team, eats a Wizard spell slot for the benefit of the party. That isn't a bad idea, and I am another who disagrees with your dislike for this use of a spell.

A lot of things are balanced around short rests, so giving parties a way to get them for the cost of a single spell slot (when they wouldn't otherwise have been able to do so safely) throws the whole balance of the game off. Either this is unintended (in which case the spell shouldn't be allowed, because it's overpowered), or the effect is intended, which means the spell also shouldn't be allowed because then they should have just made the short rest abilities recharge after each encounter (just for the sake of simplicity). Either way, the spell shouldn't exist in its current form.

[Shaofoo]

A lot of things are balanced around short rests, so giving parties a way to get them for the cost of a single spell slot (when they wouldn't otherwise have been able to do so safely) throws the whole balance of the game off. Either this is unintended (in which case the spell shouldn't be allowed, because it's overpowered), or the effect is intended, which means the spell also shouldn't be allowed because then they should have just made the short rest abilities recharge after each encounter (just for the sake of simplicity). Either way, the spell shouldn't exist in its current form.

Parties can try to force short rests if they are crafty and clever enough, even in dangerous situations.

Also note that only a wizard can cast this at all, besides a bard, Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster choosing this as his extra spells from anywhere. Warlocks and Sorcerers cannot learn this at all unless they multiclass into Wizard.

And like it is said before you can't just cast the spell and you are whisked away immediately into a safe zone, you actually have to climb up the rope to get into the safe zone so you can't cast this mid combat either.

Wizards will at most have 3 2nd level slots no matter the level and at most they'll have 18 slots to use rope trick at 20th level (22 minus 4 for 1st level slots). At the lower levels the cost becomes quite prohibitive.

If your party is taking a short rest every fight for the next 6-9 fights you can do a day, at the lower levels you will run out of slots before the day is done and you won't be able to cast Rope Trick, at the higher levels you will run out of 2nd level slots and be forced to use higher slots. You can use Arcane Recovery but at lower levels you might get 1 or 2 more uses which isn't enough to last you through the day.

A Wizard will only use this himself to recover HP and recovering HP is limited since you can run out of Hit Dice (and even a long rest won't get all of those back if you do run out).

As a DM, you will have to plan accordingly since you will know from the get go what kind of spells. If the party chooses to rest every time after a fight maybe things will change and get harder because you gave the enemy a chance to also recover and reposition. Maybe after a while the enemy has a spell caster of their own and can sense the magic and dispel the Trick away.

[1Forge]

What if they cast rope trick into a rope trick wouldnt that create a vortex into the astral plane?

[Ganybyte]

A lot of things are balanced around short rests, so giving parties a way to get them for the cost of a single spell slot (when they wouldn't otherwise have been able to do so safely) throws the whole balance of the game off. Either this is unintended (in which case the spell shouldn't be allowed, because it's overpowered), or the effect is intended, which means the spell also shouldn't be allowed because then they should have just made the short rest abilities recharge after each encounter (just for the sake of simplicity). Either way, the spell shouldn't exist in its current form.

I can't disagree with this more. Rope Trick is only 'overpowered' if the DM is actively trying to restrict short rests. The best way to kill off Rope Trick, if you hate it so much, is just to allow players relatively easy access to a short rest every two to four encounters.

The quickest way to frustrate players and ruin the fun in D&D is to take a carefully created character and negate everything that makes them special. Drastically restricting short rests should be used only sparingly by a DM, especially if your players rolled up classes who are built around short rests.

A DM has literally infinite tools to challenge players, and restricting short rests is one of the more boring of them. Resource management is a big part of the game and taking away short rest is akin to taking away a group's ability to heal. Rope Trick is just one way for players to get that short rest. Clerics with a healing focus can make for much tougher parties, but that doesn't make healing overpowered. And DMs shouldn't be restricting a groups healing more than rarely either.

Rope Trick is not overpowered at all, it works exactly as intended. And abuse is balanced by the many many ways DMs have to mess with it and the fact that it is not a ritual and not on a Warlock's spell list.

[Grod_The_Giant]

It's also not FORCING a short rest, it's just making it harder to interrupt. All the other hazards still apply, ranging from "lost element of surprise" to "I finished the ritual thirty minutes ago."

[tieren]

I note the spell only limits the max length of rope, not the minimum. In theory you could use a 1 foot length and the party could dive in pretty quickly without having to climb anything.

[Citan]

That doesn't fix warlocks or monks hiding out in the wizard's rope trick, though, which is arguably a bigger concern.
This really shouldn't be a problem though.
Usually, either you are in a place safe enough to be able to take a breat anyways, or you are in an unsafe place meaning you probably don't want to stay put one full hour or split the party.

If though such case would arise when the party wants to use this to take a short-rest in a hostile place, you as a DM can always allow it or break it depending on whether you feel it's just lazyness from your players or this would break up really hard what you planned. You are the one telling the story after all, so it is always easy to slip something or explain why it would be unfeasible or just the worst idea ever.

But I would certainly refrain to do so most cases unless my party players abuse it to try and take a short rest after every fight. Even in the case them taking a rest would probably mess my encounter up, good chances are it's because I didn't take enough attention into describing such a situation that using Rope Trick would be just bad. So blocking the trick "after the fact" would feel like punishing the players for a miss that is on me.

[Joe the Rat]

2nd level spell, non-ritual, safe short rest on a rope for the low, low cost of a 2nd level spell slot. Spending a resource to get a safe short rest seems perfectly reasonable.
3rd level spell, ritual, safe long rest in an nigh-impenetrable but obvious Hobitat8. 1 (11) minute setup. Having it as a ritual, because you'll get everything back anyway, cuts down on fiddly bookkeeping.
As you go further, you stop having to track rations as well, but your cleric's had that option (with spell slot usage) for a while now.

You want a hack? Tiny hut scroll. One action, perfect cover.

[Hawkstar]

It's actually a second level spell, making it possible to be one of a wizard's "signature spells" at 17th level, allowing it to be cast far more often. However, few players would ever put a utility spell in that slot instead of a spell that does outright damage (like scorching ray, acid arrow, etc.).

Actually, I think most wizards put Shield in that slot.

[RickAllison]

Actually, I think most wizards put Shield in that slot.

The second level spell (Shield is first) is usually more like Mirror Image or Misty Step.

[SethoMarkus]

If used out of combat: "No wandering monsters eat you while you rest."

If used in combat (somehow): "You descend from yhe rope shortly before the spell ends. The ogres are still there waiting for you, and they brought friends."

[Telok]

I note the spell only limits the max length of rope, not the minimum. In theory you could use a 1 foot length and the party could dive in pretty quickly without having to climb anything.

I've always wondered about that. Since it can only be entered from below you can put it under a table, which is nice but... What happens when something moves into the space of the entrance from the side?

Use a short rope and a tall chest, cast the spell, tie the end to the handle of a chest. Pulling in the rope drags the chest over into the space but since the chest is taller than the altitude of the entrance it can't come into the Rope Trick. Now there's a solid object covering the entrance?

[xyianth]

It's actually a second level spell, making it possible to be one of a wizard's "signature spells" at 17th level, allowing it to be cast far more often. However, few players would ever put a utility spell in that slot instead of a spell that does outright damage (like scorching ray, acid arrow, etc.).

Why on Earth would anyone ever put a damage spell in that slot? mirror image, misty step, blindness/deafness, invisibility, knock, phantasmal force, blur, web, and suggestion are all far better uses of that slot than any damage spell would be. Scorching ray gives you 3x 2d6 fire rays at-will, which is an average of 21 fire damage if all three hit. Fire bolt is 4d10, or an average of 22 fire damage on a hit. On top of that, we are talking about a wizard here; if you are trying to blast as a wizard you are doing it wrong. Leave blasting to the sorclocks; wizarding is about controlling the battlefield, which is why the best wizard traditions are divination (the ability to say 'no, you failed that save') and illusion. (suddenly fully real walls everywhere) Note: I'm purposely not including the theurge tradition from UA as it is stupidly powerful and lazy design and should not be used.

[SharkForce]

Why on Earth would anyone ever put a damage spell in that slot? mirror image, misty step, blindness/deafness, invisibility, knock, phantasmal force, blur, web, and suggestion are all far better uses of that slot than any damage spell would be. Scorching ray gives you 3x 2d6 fire rays at-will, which is an average of 21 fire damage if all three hit. Fire bolt is 4d10, or an average of 22 fire damage on a hit. On top of that, we are talking about a wizard here; if you are trying to blast as a wizard you are doing it wrong. Leave blasting to the sorclocks; wizarding is about controlling the battlefield, which is why the best wizard traditions are divination (the ability to say 'no, you failed that save') and illusion. (suddenly fully real walls everywhere) Note: I'm purposely not including the theurge tradition from UA as it is stupidly powerful and lazy design and should not be used.

there isn't really a cantrip equivalent to shatter :P

[Citan]

Why on Earth would anyone ever put a damage spell in that slot? mirror image, misty step, blindness/deafness, invisibility, knock, phantasmal force, blur, web, and suggestion are all far better uses of that slot than any damage spell would be. Scorching ray gives you 3x 2d6 fire rays at-will, which is an average of 21 fire damage if all three hit. Fire bolt is 4d10, or an average of 22 fire damage on a hit. On top of that, we are talking about a wizard here; if you are trying to blast as a wizard you are doing it wrong. Leave blasting to the sorclocks; wizarding is about controlling the battlefield, which is why the best wizard traditions are divination (the ability to say 'no, you failed that save') and illusion. (suddenly fully real walls everywhere) Note: I'm purposely not including the theurge tradition from UA as it is stupidly powerful and lazy design and should not be used.
Why on Earth do 80% of the people on these forums try to impose their own playstyle as "the only right way to play"?:smallfrown:

Shatter, Aganazzar's Scorcher and Snilloc's Snowball Swarm all deal decent AOE damage for their level, with possibly added rider.

Decent case could also be made about spells that you usually cast once or two because they are concentration spells, whether they deal damage or apply a condition...
Thinking about Hold Person or Ray of Enfeeblement in particular: since those spells allow a save each round, you usually take much care on when and who target, and you are always frustrated when your concentration is broken much earlier than you expected.
As a free spell, it means you can spam without regret, making some fights much easier than its should, even if your enemies have high saves. Even Crown of Madness can be now considered in spite of its blatant drawbacks.
Even Dust Devil or Flaming Sphere could be considered, if you use them pretty regularly and tend to drop Concentration often.
Or spells such as Enlarge/Reduce or Levitate if you use them both as utility and offensive spells.

By the way, on the non-concentration non-damage side, don't forget Pyrotechnics! Versatile utility, requires an existing fire indeed, but one of the absolute best if you have a friend with Create Bonfire: AOE Blindness or non-concentration 1st level Fog Cloud. ;)

For me, it's most logical, if you don't have personal preferences, to usually choose "free spells" that synergize with your choice of School: so for Evoker Wizards, Magic Missile and any of those aforementioned makes a pretty solid choice, since damage roll gets +5 bonus.
For an Abjurer, Shield recharges (although very weakly) the Ward, so it's two hits with one stone.
For a Conjurer, since casting any conjuration spell recharges the teleport feature, you could either choose Misty Step to get 60 feet teleport per turn (although it uses action and bonus action), or choose Fog Cloud and Flaming Sphere...
For an Enchanter, Hold Person would be one obvious choice since you get free "twin" as an archetype feature...
For a Bladesinger that wades into melee, Shield and Blur or Mirror Image are perfect.
Etc etc...
But even that is only a suggestion "by default". As long as a player is contributing to my party and not making blatantly irrelevant choices (such as See Invisibility when we know we will fight only zombies and skeletons), I don't care about the spell he is choosing. It's his character.
Especially since you can choose those two spells as often as you want for just an 8-hour study.

[Shaofoo]

Why on Earth do 99% of the people on these forums try to impose their own playstyle as "the only right way to play"?:smallfrown:



FTFY

A lot of arguments can be easily distilled to "I don't like how this is and therefore it is the wrong way to go about it and if you like it then you are wrong and I feel sorry for you just how stupid and wrong you are".

This is why we have things like "Sorcerer spell lists invalidate choosing Sorcerer over Wizard" and "Beserker... I mean FRENZY Barbarians are bad characters because they kill themselves and don't have the awesome Bearbarian resistances".

All bets are off once the excel sheets are out.

As to why... **** measuring competition pure and simple. Nothing like telling someone how wrong they are and slapping them with your large e-**** after all.