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View Full Version : 3rd Ed Can you explain illusions and figments?



Oryan77
2015-05-31, 12:19 PM
Is there a more detailed (official) explanation about how illusions/figments work for spells that create images (silent, major, persistent, etc) in any of the WotC books? Here are some questions that I have:

1. What exactly does "interacts with" mean? Do you need to physically touch it, or does firing an arrow or a spell at it count as "interacting with"? What if you just spoke to it?

2. Figments have an AC = 10 + size mod. Does that mean that you would feel a solid mass and need to attempt an overrun to move past one if you believed it was real?

3. What happens if you actually hit it with a weapon? Do you believe that you struck something because it feels like hitting a solid object? If you hit it, and still believe it is real, does it look wounded in order to keep up the ruse (is that part of making the image "react appropriately" as Major Image describes?

4. For spells that have a duration of "Concentration +3 rounds" like Major Image, or duration 1min/level like Persistent Image, can an illusion react on its own if it is attacked during those rounds that don't need concentration to maintain the spell?

5. I think I may have been ruling Silent Image as being an image that does not animate (it is like a cardboard cutout) but can be moved around the available area. Was I wrong about that? For some reason I thought only higher level image spells could animate.

Story
2015-05-31, 12:35 PM
1. I don't think that's ever defined. It's something you need to rule on a case by case basis, though there are examples of what counts as interaction and what doesn't.

2. No, only Shadow spells have a physical presence.

3. No. Depending on the circumstances and the DM, that would either be interacting with the illusion, triggering a save, or proof that the illusion isn't real, meaning automatic disbelief.

4. No idea

5. It's not clear. Major Image includes a line about causing the illusion to react appropriately, so I assume this is something you can do.

Doc_Maynot
2015-05-31, 12:38 PM
1. What exactly does "interacts with" mean? Do you need to physically touch it, or does firing an arrow or a spell at it count as "interacting with"? What if you just spoke to it?
To summarize this article here (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20060221a). Anything that invests some time and effort. It states that taking a move action to pause and study it could entitle a save, or even attacking it. However when it comes to speaking it'd have to be more than just a few words back and forth.


2. Figments have an AC = 10 + size mod. Does that mean that you would feel a solid mass and need to attempt an overrun to move past one if you believed it was real?
Think of that AC as the illusion's ability to dodge. As with overrun, it'd be them dodging. Regardless of a hit or miss though, they'd receive a saving throw.


3. What happens if you actually hit it with a weapon? Do you believe that you struck something because it feels like hitting a solid object? If you hit it, and still believe it is real, does it look wounded in order to keep up the ruse (is that part of making the image "react appropriately" as Major Image describes?
As I mentioned above, you'd get a save. Either way success or no, the illusion would look injured accordingly. As illusions are not tailored to an individual.


4. For spells that have a duration of "Concentration +3 rounds" like Major Image, or duration 1min/level like Persistent Image, can an illusion react on its own if it is attacked during those rounds that don't need concentration to maintain the spell?
Yes, but it is still within the caster's control.



5. I think I may have been ruling Silent Image as being an image that does not animate (it is like a cardboard cutout) but can be moved around the available area. Was I wrong about that? For some reason I thought only higher level image spells could animate.
Silent image should be able to move just as any illusion. It's only quandary is that it only produces a visual figment.

jiriku
2015-05-31, 12:47 PM
The Rules of the Game Archive (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/arch/rg) includes "All About Illusions", a four-part series examining how to adjudicate illusions. Skip's column doesn't carry the force of game rules, but can be considered expert advice by an experienced DM with an insider's perspective on the game. I don't agree with 100% of what he suggests in that column, but it's a useful place to start and provides an informed perspective.

1. This is DM adjudication, but for me the watermark is that you have to invest an action into dealing with the illusion in order to be considered interacting with it. For example, you have to attack it, try to move through it or pick it up, spend a meaningful amount of time talking to it, etc. You can't interact with an illusion as a free action.

2. Figments do not have mass and thus cannot block your progress. However, you might *believe* that you needed to invest an Overrun action to move past one if you believed the illusion. Overrunning an illusion would probably count as interacting with it.

3. The answer to this question varies depending on the illusion. Specific spells may state this explicitly, but my general rule of thumb is if the caster is actively concentrating on an illusion he can probably make it react appropriately to an attack, and if the illusion is running without concentration it probably cannot react to attacks. Hitting a figment does not feel like hitting a solid object. However, while that is suspicious and certainly grounds for a saving throw, it doesn't mean the illusion is given away. After all, if you poke your sword through a guy without resistance, perhaps that merely means he has an ironguard spell cast upon himself.

4. DM adjudication, but my interpretation is no.

5. Silent image does not require that the image remain static. However, a moving silent image creates no sound, which might be grounds for a saving throw if the image looks like something that ought to make a lot of noise as it moves.