How would you make a bronze dragon pirate?

[LoyalPaladin]

Hello playground,
I was recently inspired by two different threads to make a (very young) bronze dragon pirate! I originally thought a Rogue/Scarlet Corsair would be a good choice, but it fell flat.

I am missing a key ingredient: the stats for a very young bronze dragon as a PC.

I'd really like to fit the swashbuckling rogue theme. Swashbuckler/Duelist looks promising as well, but not perfect. How would you make an effective one handed fighter that relies on cunning and panache to fight his foes?

I might play this some day, so I should probably insert some of my DM's house rules...
One Prestige before 20. Maximum of two base classes. 34 Point-Buy. Remove all racial hit die. No cheese.

[WhamBamSam]

A Very Young Bronze Dragon has stat adjustments of Str +4, Con +4, Int +4, Wis +4, Cha +4 and a LA of +4.

When you say one prestige class, do you mean exactly one, or no more than one?

How about something like this?

Wyrm of War Very Young Bronze Dragon Binder 4/Warblade 12
1. Flyby Attack
3. Flyby Breath
4. Improved Binding (Binder), Martial Study (Crusader's Strike) (Wyrm of War)
6. Strafing Breath
8. Martial Study (Defensive Rebuke) (Wyrm of War)
9. Clinging Breath, Ironheart Aura (Warblade)
12. Lingering Breath, Some Wyrm of War Feat
13. Combat Reflexes (Warblade)
15. Stormguard Warrior
16. Some Wyrm of War Feat

"Venture into the waters beyond the edge of the map at your own peril, for upon those stormy seas it is said that pirates prowl and dragons dance."

The idea, essentially, is to open with a Lingering (as long as you can make it) Strafing Breath, covering a good portion of your enemies' boat with either repulsion gas or electricity (his pirate crew/allies will be prepared for these effects and so have the advantage) then make a pass with Paimon's Dance of Death boosted by either Defensive Rebuke (he won't actually be there to make the AoOs, but they'll charge up Stormguard Warrior's Channel the Storm when they try swinging at his allies) or Covering Strike. From there, he'll generally make Flyby Attacks with martial strikes, perhaps throwing in a White Raven Tactics or the like here or there. At high levels he should be able to access maneuvers like Order Forged From Chaos (usable alongside Dance of Death, which is a standard action), and perhaps Pouncing Charge (he won't be very Tiger Claw oriented, so the prereqs might be difficult, but it'd be nice to give him a way to unload that dragon full-attack routine on someone who asks for it by feeding Channel the Storm too much).

It's a bit different than the direction you've been going, but if you look at it, I think the MO here is pretty stylish, more or less in the way you're looking for, while remaining pretty dragony. If you absolutely need to have one PrC, put in a few levels of Knight of the Sacred Seal (Paimon). You can pick up Weapon Focus with a Wyrm of War feat and bump Combat Reflexes onto a later Wyrm of War feat or get a suit of Serpent Armor if need be.

There's also the old Iaijutsu Factotum standby. Pretty much the whole idea there is to kill people with your cunning and look just oh-so-stylish while doing it. Wyrm of War's feat heaviness would help there too.

Swordsage/Master of Nine doesn't seem piratey on its face, but mechanically it does what you want as well as anything.

Swashbuckler 3 into Rogue with Daring Outlaw is simple and relatively functional.

[Zaydos]

Dragon Magazine had a Monster Class for metallic dragons in one of their anniversary issues (want to say #312 but it is currently missing so not sure).

But assuming you're high enough level to start with to start with the full LA (which is substantially lower than the usual 13 ECL for a Very Young Bronze) then it's just your standard monster as PC race conversion.

Str +4 (15 - 11), Dex +0 (10 - 10), Con +4 (15 - 11), Int +4 (14 - 10), Wis +4 (15 - 11), Cha +4 (14 - 10).
Size: M; 5-ft space and reach.
Speed: 40-ft, fly 150-ft (poor), swim 60-ft. Improved overland speed (20 mph flight, 40 mph hustle instead of the normal 10-ft = 1 mph).
Natural Armor: +8.
Breath Weapon: 4d6 electricity (60-ft line) or repulsion for 1d6+2 rounds (30-ft Cone, Will or forced to move away and do nothing else for duration); must wait 1d4 rounds before using again. I'm trying to remember whether by RAW DC is 10 + 1/2 Racial Hit Dice + Con modifier or 10 + 1/2 Hit Dice + Con modifier; I've always played with the latter but can't remember where the rule is expounded upon. Actually checking the general Breath Weapon entry in the MM it says racial, but the dragon section just says dragon's HD, I think RAW it is RHD only and written that way in the dragon section due to them advancing via RHD but you might still check with your DM especially with the no RHD house rule.
Immunity to Electricity
Water Breathing
Speak with Animals CL 2, At-Will.
Natural Weapons: Bite (primary, 1d8+Str), 2 Claws (secondary, 1d6+1/2 Str), 2 Wings (secondary, 1d4+1/2 Str).
Immune to Sleep and Paralysis effects.
Blindsense 60-ft.
Keen Senses (x4 sight in shadowy illumination, x2 in full daylight; darkvision 120-ft).
Languages known: As written just Draconic. Ask DM if you get Common for free/what your bonus language options for high Int are.

As for optimization advice, not my alley I prefer relatively low optimization.

[LoyalPaladin]

A Very Young Bronze Dragon has stat adjustments of Str +4, Con +4, Int +4, Wis +4, Cha +4 and a LA of +4.
Awesome. Thanks!


When you say one prestige class, do you mean exactly one, or no more than one?
Basically, you can take one prestige class pre-20 and one prestige class post-20.


How about something like this?

Wyrm of War Very Young Bronze Dragon Binder 4/Warblade 12
1. Flyby Attack
3. Flyby Breath
4. Improved Binding (Binder), Martial Study (Crusader's Strike) (Wyrm of War)
6. Strafing Breath
8. Martial Study (Defensive Rebuke) (Wyrm of War)
9. Clinging Breath, Ironheart Aura (Warblade)
12. Lingering Breath, Some Wyrm of War Feat
13. Combat Reflexes (Warblade)
15. Stormguard Warrior
16. Some Wyrm of War Feat

"Venture into the waters beyond the edge of the map at your own peril, for upon those stormy seas it is said that pirates prowl and dragons dance."
Oh this is spectacular! I am poorly versed in binder though, so I might need education. Also, I can't seem to find the Wyrm of War feat.


There's also the old Iaijutsu Factotum standby. Pretty much the whole idea there is to kill people with your cunning and look just oh-so-stylish while doing it. Wyrm of War's feat heaviness would help there too.
I love Iaijutsu focus, but it is hard to justify to my DM, since it's 3.0.


Swordsage/Master of Nine doesn't seem piratey on its face, but mechanically it does what you want as well as anything.
I really like Master of Nine. But I have a small dislike of Swordsage. Probably because I like Warblade so much. Haha. You were speaking to my soul when you suggested it.


Swashbuckler 3 into Rogue with Daring Outlaw is simple and relatively functional.
This is also a good work around. Too bad it can't be Swashbuckler/Scout!


Dragon Magazine had a Monster Class for metallic dragons in one of their anniversary issues (want to say #312 but it is currently missing so not sure).
I'll pick that up if I get a chance.


But assuming you're high enough level to start with to start with the full LA (which is substantially lower than the usual 13 ECL for a Very Young Bronze) then it's just your standard monster as PC race conversion.
Oh wow. I didn't know there was a standard conversion. Thanks!

[WhamBamSam]

Awesome. Thanks!Happy to help.



Basically, you can take one prestige class pre-20 and one prestige class post-20.Okay cool.



Oh this is spectacular! I am poorly versed in binder though, so I might need education. Also, I can't seem to find the Wyrm of War feat.All you'd really be doing with Binder most of the time is binding Paimon, mostly for his Dance of Death ability, though the +4 Dex, and Tumble bonus are nice, and Weapon Finesse while wielding a Rapier or Shortsword might be more in line with the flavor you want.

Wyrm of War is one of the Sovereign Archetypes from pg. 30-31 of Dragons of Eberron. Basically, you get a fighter feat (or a "combat feat tied to draconic abilities" whatever that means) every 4 HD. You may recognize them as the primary reason why people care whether Dragonwrought Kobolds are True Dragons.


I love Iaijutsu focus, but it is hard to justify to my DM, since it's 3.0.Ah, I see. There is an OA update in Dragon Magazine 318. I don't think it mentions doing anything to change Iaijutsu Focus.


I really like Master of Nine. But I have a small dislike of Swordsage. Probably because I like Warblade so much. Haha. You were speaking to my soul when you suggested it.Warblade/Crusader/Mo9 or Warblade/Mo9 with Martial Study feats are also fine. I just say Swordsage because it's the easiest


This is also a good work around. Too bad it can't be Swashbuckler/Scout!You could try asking your DM if he'll sign off on modifying it to a "Swift Outlaw" version or whatever you want to call it. It's not really any more powerful than a regular Daring Outlaw (though I guess you could say it synergizes with Flyby Attacks a bit better), and certainly less so than the initiator suggestions.

[LoyalPaladin]

All you'd really be doing with Binder most of the time is binding Paimon, mostly for his Dance of Death ability, though the +4 Dex, and Tumble bonus are nice, and Weapon Finesse while wielding a Rapier or Shortsword might be more in line with the flavor you want.
Oh, I can manage that.


Wyrm of War is one of the Sovereign Archetypes from pg. 30-31 of Dragons of Eberron. Basically, you get a fighter feat (or a "combat feat tied to draconic abilities" whatever that means) every 4 HD. You may recognize them as the primary reason why people care whether Dragonwrought Kobolds are True Dragons.
That definitely rings a bell. I'll look into that.


Warblade/Crusader/Mo9 or Warblade/Mo9 with Martial Study feats are also fine. I just say Swordsage because it's the easiest
Yeah. I know, I'm just bitter. :smalltongue:


You could try asking your DM if he'll sign off on modifying it to a "Swift Outlaw" version or whatever you want to call it. It's not really any more powerful than a regular Daring Outlaw (though I guess you could say it synergizes with Flyby Attacks a bit better), and certainly less so than the initiator suggestions.
I really like that! I'll run that by him.

[Jergmo]

I would have him go "ARRRRRRGH!!!" when using his breath weapon.

[Heikold]

Seeing as Bronze Dragons are innately Lawful and honourable, wouldn't a Copper Dragon make more sense?

[LoyalPaladin]

I would have him go "ARRRRRRGH!!!" when using his breath weapon.
Hahaha. I can arrange that.


Seeing as Bronze Dragons are innately Lawful and honourable, wouldn't a Copper Dragon make more sense?
But Bronze Dragons are adventurers and water lovers! Which makes them perfect. I was going to be NG leaning chaotic.

[Jergmo]

"Always X" creatures have 95% of their members with that alignment. Presumably this dragon is part of the 5%.

[hamishspence]

In some books (Savage Species for example) the "Exceptions" figure is 1 in a million rather than 1 in 20.

That said, a privateer, who preys only on "the enemy" might be the kind of pirate that even LGs can be.

[LoyalPaladin]

"Always X" creatures have 95% of their members with that alignment. Presumably this dragon is part of the 5%.
Absotively posolutely.


That said, a privateer, who preys only on "the enemy" might be the kind of pirate that even LGs can be.
Yeah, he'll definitely fall on the "good row". I'm just trying to fit him in. Probably a very young dragon who was set lose on the world by his elders to fill his need for adventure. I'll be low level to start, so I'd make him out to be an aspiring privateer or pirate.