A discussion about Invisibility

[panaikhan]

Hello :)

My character will, in a couple of levels, be acquiring a familiar that has standard Invisibility 'at will'.

I'd like to discuss the ramifications of this, from both sides of the fence.

First of all, as a player, am I right that 'at will' powers are still only once per round as a free action?
Also, as a player, is "Attack, Invisible, Move, (repeat)" the best way to use this ability? It means the familiar will only be visible for the fraction of a round that it attacks, and will be somewhere else before attacking again.

As a GM, I can see this getting very old, very quickly. Am I justified in thinking this, and by inference, is my GM? Would it be acceptable if this tactic was used sparingly? Or not at all?

Thank you in advance for your input.

[Kesnit]

First of all, as a player, am I right that 'at will' powers are still only once per round as a free action?
Also, as a player, is "Attack, Invisible, Move, (repeat)" the best way to use this ability? It means the familiar will only be visible for the fraction of a round that it attacks, and will be somewhere else before attacking again.

Unless the familiar's Invisibility can be used as a swift action, becoming invisible is a standard action. So no, what you are talking about would not work. It can attack and move, or become invisible and move, but it cannot attack and become invisible in the same around. (Unless the familiar can use 2 standard actions in a round. There are, of course, ways to do this.)

[panaikhan]

Thank you for your swift response.
Yes, I was under the misconception that 'at will' was somehow related to swift or free actions.
I know there is a feat that can quicken spell-like abilities. I will look into other possibilities.

OK, what about attacks of opportunity? An invisible creature is far more likely to draw them from opponents.
And will something that is semi-permanently invisible irk my GM?

[Psyren]

OK, what about attacks of opportunity? An invisible creature is far more likely to draw them from opponents.

If they can't see your minion, it has total concealment and therefore can't be attacked directly. They have to guess which square it's in and attack that, and even then, they will suffer 50% miss chance. Certain abilities can mitigate this (like blindsense or Blind-Fight) while blindsight or see invisibility negates it.

But I strongly advise you do not use your familiar in combat. Most GMs won't target them, but if you make them participate in the fight then all bets are off, and losing one can be a real pain.

[Abd al-Azrad]

But I strongly advise you do not use your familiar in combat. Most GMs won't target them, but if you make them participate in the fight then all bets are off, and losing one can be a real pain.

I agree with this, conditionally. A familiar, flying above the battlefield and dropping Caltrops and Tanglefoot Bags, can annoy and debilitate enemies without quite crossing the threshold into being worth attacking. If you're careful with your positioning, you can make it quite costly (in terms of wasted actions) for enemies to engage your familiar.

But yes, in terms of the cost / benefit, bringing your familiar into a fight has a moderate risk of a very high cost (replacing your familiar) and the benefits are less than spectacular barring significant investment. I prefer to perch my familiar on my shoulder and have it wand-cast buff spells for the party.

[panaikhan]

I was thinking more of my invisible minion getting attacks of opportunity on others as they went past it.

Thanks for the suggestions on the 'battlefield control' aspect (caltrops and stuff).

Does using a wand break the invisibility, or does it depend on the spell? an invisible minion with a wand of CLW or something might be VERY useful, as its only a party of 4.

[Psyren]

It depends on the spell, and even on how you use the spell. A CLW wand for instance will not break invis if used to heal, but if you use it to zap an undead it will.

[Venger]

I was thinking more of my invisible minion getting attacks of opportunity on others as they went past it.

Thanks for the suggestions on the 'battlefield control' aspect (caltrops and stuff).

Does using a wand break the invisibility, or does it depend on the spell? an invisible minion with a wand of CLW or something might be VERY useful, as its only a party of 4.

it depends on the spell.

fortunately, invisibility is very clear on what breaks it:


For purposes of this spell, an attack includes any spell targeting a foe or whose area or effect includes a foe. (Exactly who is a foe depends on the invisible character’s perceptions.) Actions directed at unattended objects do not break the spell. Causing harm indirectly is not an attack. Thus, an invisible being can open doors, talk, eat, climb stairs, summon monsters and have them attack, cut the ropes holding a rope bridge while enemies are on the bridge, remotely trigger traps, open a portcullis to release attack dogs, and so forth. If the subject attacks directly, however, it immediately becomes visible along with all its gear. Spells such as bless that specifically affect allies but not foes are not attacks for this purpose, even when they include foes in their area.

so CLW is fine (mandatory suggestion to use lesser vigor instead)