Blood Bowl ITP III: Where You Either Win or Blame Nuffle... Sometimes Both

[Brother Oni]

Blood Bowl in the Playground III: Where You Either Win or Blame Nuffle... Sometimes Both

Welcome to the Giant in the Playground thread for Cyanide Studio's version of Blood Bowl on Steam.

For those not familiar with Blood Bowl, it's best described as a fantasy war game simulator masquerading as a ball sport - you take the role of a coach, managing a team of hardened psychopaths. You then set up your team of eleven degenerates against another team of eleven equally crazed headcases on a pitch and they do their best to kill each other. And maybe score touchdowns.
It's set in an alternate universe of Games Workshop's Warhammer Fantasy world, so all the standard (and some non-standard) fantasy races are there, humans, elves, dwarves, orcs, undead, Chaos, etc. The tone is generally satirical with many American football references, ably aided and abetted by the commentators Jim Johnson the vampire and Bob Bifford the ogre.

As benefits its board game roots, the game's RNG can be very unforgiving and many an expletive can be heard as Nuffle, Blood Bowl's sick, twisted and utterly, utterly sadistic counterpart of Lady Fortune, curses or blesses your rolls. As well as match reports, maintaining and arranging games for the leagues, we can answer rules questions, offer advice or trade stories of the torments of Nuffle as he kicks you (or your opponent) in the soft painful parts.

This is an Chaos edition thread, so either the Chaos or Legendary version is required to play in the leagues; Original and Dark Elves editions are not compatible.

There are currently four league types ongoing: Rookie, Standard, Legacy and Open.

The Rookie League consists of new teams started especially for it (cap of 1000TV, no previous games played), with the intention that this league gives teams a chance to get some SPP and money before being thrown into the sharkpit of the Standard League.
The league has started its second season and the scheduling and results can be found here: link (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19350022&postcount=4). Wraith and Silfir are the Commissioners for this league.
The cup is called 'GitP - The Rookie League', password 'Please' (Closed for applicants).

The Standard League is the main and longest running league for the board. Teams are generally more experienced and while new teams are not prohibited, it is recommended that they start with the Rookie League so they don't become SPP fodder for the bigger teams.
The league has just finished its fifth season and the last season's results can be found here: link (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19349548&postcount=2). Gnoman, Thufir and Shishnarfne are the Commissioners for this league.
The cup is called 'Gitp', password 'Giant' (Inter-season hiatus).

The Legacy League is the old league for the board consisting of fairly developed teams who have been booted promoted out of the Standard League, thus is not recommended for starting teams.
It has just finished its second season (congratulations to the Meddling Insects) and is currently on an inter-season break. The current scheduling and results can be found here: link (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19349780&postcount=3). Tasroth is the sole Commissioner for this league.
The cup is called 'GitP - Legacy League', password 'Levelled' (Open for applicants).

Open Leagues; there are two general free-for-all leagues and teams can join up or drop out whenever. They're intended to be a testing ground for coaches trying out new teams against other human players.
It's best to contact people directly to arrange games for this league (typically via Steam) as there's no scheduling.
The official cup is called GitP Blood Bowl Open League, password 'Belkar'.
The unofficial cup is called MumbleChaos, password 'gitp'.

There may also be intermittent knock out tournaments with special rules, such as all Stunty. Details of any ongoing tournaments will be updated here.

Living Rulebook 6 (http://www.bloodbowlgamers.com/downloads/LRB6.pdf): rules for the board game which the game is based off and has more detailed explanation of the mechanics

Blood Bowl Chaos Edition Players manual (http://cdn.akamai.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/216890/manuals/BBCE_Manual_INT.pdf?t=1407400637): also accessible through the Steam launcher (right click on the game in your Library, View player manual). Useful page of hotkeys at the very back.

Wraith's Q&A session (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOG6F04h5Oo&index=6&list=PLpLWOWTafQ0zIoIbkRCBeOAThNIT3GuKf): video by our own Wraith explaining some mechanics in more detail, with suggestions for interface and skills setup.

Blood Bowl Tactics (http://bbtactics.com/strategy/articles/all-purpose/): good site for general Blood Bowl tactics and team advice. Also has probability calculations and all other sorts of advanced number crunching if you want to disappear down that rabbit hole.


Blood Bowl Chaos Edition (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?298545-Blood-Bowl-Chaos-Edition)
Blood Bowl in the Playground II: It's Going To Be Elves Again, Isn't It? (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?379752-Blood-Bowl-in-the-Playground-II-It-s-Going-To-Be-Elves-Again-Isn-t-It)

Standard League
Season 1: The Dokkalfar Daggers, Luzahn
Season 2: Poets Society, Shishnarfne
Season 3: Abandoned
Season 4: Measured Response, Silfir
Season 5: Team Hippy, Qwaz

Legacy League
Season 1: The Dokkalfar Daggers, Luzahn
Season 2: Meddling Insects, Shishnarfne

Rookie League
Season 1: Ms. Dot's Nurse Academy, Manticoran

[Brother Oni]

GitP Blood Bowl Standard League



Season 5, Final


Finals


Euphonic Cadence Thufir (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198024973681):3 - 4
:Team Hippy Qwaz (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198027147955)



Semi Finals


The Suns Children SaruSama (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198021849232):1 - 2
:Team Hippy Qwaz (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198027147955)

Euphonic Cadence Thufir (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198024973681):3 - 0
:Barovia World Tour Shishnarfne (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198076697742)










Position
Team Name
Coach's GitP Name
Played
Win
Draw
Loss
TD For
TD Against
Points
Neustadtl Score


1
Team Hippy
Qwaz (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198027147955)
13
10
2
1
29
10
32
180.5


2
Euphonic Cadence
Thufir (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198024973681)
13
10
2
1
40
11
32
173.5


3
Barovia World Tour
Shishnarfne (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198076697742)
13
8
3
2
20
9
27
157


4
The Suns Children
SaruSama (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198021849232)
13
8
1
4
24
20
25
118


5
BlackHearse BoneHeads
Unpronounceable (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198007635705)
13
6
3
4
16
10
21
103


6
The Stabbery
Devmaar (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197972772607)
13
5
5
3
22
19
20
126


7
The Bloody-Handed Angels
Tasroth (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197970380093)
13
6
1
6
23
22
19
98


8
The Ruinous Rampagers
LCP (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197996136471)
13
5
4
4
14
12
19
96


9
Hammersjurg Destroyers
Wraith (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198037504652)
13
5
3
5
12
13
18
93.5


10
Leapers of Loren
Maethirion (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198039239953)
13
4
2
7
28
28
14
49.5


11
Imperial Space Corps
Luzahn (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198017939440)
13
3
1
9
14
22
10
55.5


12
Spartak's Blud Bowl Klub
Brother Oni (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198026689712)
13
3
0
10
12
31
9
22


13
99 Ways to Die
Neon Knight (http://steamcommunity.com/id/red_ivan)
13
2
1
10
6
25
7
28.5


14
Destroyer of Worlds
Gnoman (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198042932178/)
13
1
2
10
3
31
5
39.5

[Tasroth]

GitP Blood Bowl Legacy League


Season 2
Current Week's Deadline: 28 July 15
Final

Tasroth's Dark Stars (Tasroth): 2 - 3 :Meddling Insects (Shishnarfne)

Semi-Finals

The Murderhobos (SaruSama): 2 - 3 :Tasroth's Dark Stars (Tasroth)
Dokkalfar Daggers (Luzahn): 1 - 2 :Meddling Insects (Shishnarfne)



PositionTeam NameForum Name/Steam ProfilePlayedWinDrawLossTD forTD AgainstPointsNeustadtl Score
01Tasroth's Dark StarsTasroth (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197970380093)76011791848
02Dokkalfar DaggersLuzahn (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198017939440)75111451638
03Meddling InsectsShishnarfne (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198076697742)73311651244.5
04The MurderhobosSaruSama (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198021849232)73041112918
05The IronbeardsWraith (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198037504652)7223810822
06The AdrasteiaThufir (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198024973681)7133712616.5
07Dwarf AdjectivesQwaz (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198027147955)7124413518
08Blood Bowl Club MirkaBrother Oni (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198026689712)711561749

[Wraith]

GitP Blood Bowl Rookie League Season 03

Season 03 - Day 03
Naggarothian Nightmares (Maethirion) vs. Playboy Plaguemates (Deadline)
The Unsightly Jellyfishes (Lyrakien) vs. Have Some Popkhorne (Silfir)
Isla Sauria (LCP) vs. The Orctodads (legoshrimp)
Goblinization Nation (DarthMario) vs. The Shameful Dead (KingOfFeed)
Unsidhe De Cuirte Dorsche (Manticoran) vs. The Expendables 97 (Unpronounceable)
Rules Rules Rules (TFT) vs. Team Named Spoon (Grytorm)
Those Who Eat Brunch (DSop) vs. Super Furry Wild Animals (Wraith)

Games to be completed by: Monday 18th April



PositionTeam NameForum Name/Steam ProfilePlayedWinDrawLossTD forTD AgainstPoints
01Isla Sauria (Liz)LCP (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197996136471)2200516
02Unsidhe De Cuirte Dorche (WoE)Manticoran (http://steamcommunity.com/id/Manticoran)2200563
03Have Some Popkhorne (KhD)Silfir (http://steamcommunity.com/id/silfir)2110214
04The Unsightly Jellyfishes (Nec)Lyrakien2110324
05Goblinization Nation (PrE)DarthMario (http://steamcommunity.com/id/darth_mario)2101333
06Super Furry Wild Animals (Unw)Wraith (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198037504652/)2101433
07The Shameful Dead (Und)Mister Quiv2011011
08The Expendables 97 (Gob)Unpronounceable (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198007635705)2020112
09Naggarothian Nightmares (DEl)Maethirion (hhttp://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198039239953)2020222
10The Orctodads (Orc)legoshrimp2011141
11Rules Rules Rules (Dwa)TFT2011021
12Those Who Eat Brunch (ChD)Dsop (http://steamcommunity.com/id/dsopNA)2011121
13Playboy Plaguemates (Nur)Deadline (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198030424132/)2011131
14Team Named Spoon (Ogr)Grytorm (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198088883611/)2002150





Rookie League Season 02 Champions
1st Place: Cheesy Comestibuls Club (Silfir)
2nd Place: The Grateful Dead (Manticoran)

DIVISION ONE


PositionTeam NameForum Name/Steam ProfilePlayedWinDrawLossTD forTD AgainstPoints
01The Phanci Phoenixs (High Elves)Unpronounceable (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198007635705)752013417
02Peexar Reanimation Studio (Necromantic)Deadline (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198030424132/)751114616
03Liber Diabolica (Chaos)Wraith (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198037504652/)741211713
04Dwarfcraft Reign of Chaos (Chaos Dwarfs)CareemSoda (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198055537237/)73137810
05Corrupting Vices (Dark Elves)nhbdy (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198002871603/)73047613
06Certainly Not Hobbits (Not Hobbits)Shishnarfne (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198076697742)7223568
07Big Reds Bubblegum Brawlers (Khorne Daemons)Grytorm (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198088883611/)7214687
08Reg'Lar Hoomanz ('Ummiez)Zinc70070140


DIVISION TWO


PositionTeam NameForum Name/Steam ProfilePlayedWinDrawLossTD forTD AgainstPoints
01Cheesy Comestibles Club (Skaven)Silfir (http://steamcommunity.com/id/silfir)770017521
02Grateful Dead (Khemri)Manticoran (http://steamcommunity.com/id/Manticoran)742110614
03Passers and Pushovers (High Elves)Maethirion (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198039239953)7322131311
04Final-Fantasy (Pro Elves)Qwaz (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198027147955)723214149
05Hellborn Hooligans Reborn (Chaos)ShadowFighter (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197994613030/)72147127
06Aristocracy of ze Night (Vampires)LCP (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197996136471)72059106
07Thunder And Fury (Norse)Devmaar (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197972772607)71336116
08Enter team nam here (Lizardmen)Qwertystop (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198028418514)71157144




Rookie League Season 01 Champions
1st Place: Ms. Dot's Nurse Academy (Manticoran)
2nd Place: Grimnir's Grudgebringers (Pippington)


PositionTeam NameForum Name/Steam ProfilePlayedWinDrawLossTD forTD AgainstPoints
01Ms. Dot's Nurse AcademyManticoran (http://steamcommunity.com/id/Manticoran)15114022337
02Grimnir's GrudgebringersLCP (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197996136471)151122281235
03Okami Ye FaithfulSilfir (http://steamcommunity.com/id/silfir)15933271430
04Smashers of SotekMaethirion (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198039239953)15924211229
05The Scaretoon NetworkWraith (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198037504652)15843291328
06Champions of DreadDevmaar (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197972772607)15825171926
07A Communist PartyCareem Soda (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198055537237/)15744171225
08Black RibbonsLuzahn (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198017939440)15735251224
09Wymbildon WarpstonersUnpronounceable (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198007635705)15726212123
10Something Ratten in Den.Neon Knight (http://steamcommunity.com/id/red_ivan)15636292121
11Throwaways & ThrowersShishnarfne (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198076697742)15546112016
12Spartans of KhorneBrother Oni (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198026689712)15339162012
13California SkullsLeSwordfish (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198010698558)15311172410
14KleptoquarterbacksFroish (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198021849232)1522118298
15Wheeeeeeeeee!Qwertystop (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198028418514)1521135297
16Papa N's Storytime CrewIvellius (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198079183520)1505102195

[Brother Oni]

Spartak's Blud Bowl Klub 2 : Destroyer of Worlds 0

With a 730TV difference, the DoW coach went on a spending spree, Zara the Slayer being an excellent pick as she later became a major thorn in the orcs' side.

SBK elected to receive and things immediately went wrong for the Amazons, their best regular player being killed outright on pretty much the first block of the game. Thankfully their Apothecary managed to save her life, although she would be the target of many a pirate joke in the future.

Zara immediately started stabbing everything in sight, although her stakes bounced off the superior orc armour. The Amazon coach waited until the orc thrower recovered the ball deep in the ork backfield before ambushing him with a lightning bolt, but a linesorc managed to recover it while the rest of the team held back the ferocious women. Slowly but surely, the orks pushed through and the injuries started mounting up, both sides dropping to 8 players each, just before a double back through orc lines managed to find a way through the tenacious Amazon defence, scoring a turn later.

None of the unconscious Amazons woke up and their attacks crashed harmless against the solid orc defences until the half time whistle blew.

Setting up with a 10-11 deficit, the Lustrian war women found their attack floundering again and with a surprising turn of speed, a pair of orc blitzers pounced on the ball carrier and sent it scattering. The orcish jubiliation was short lived as an enemy blitzer returned the favour, sending the ball off on a massive pickup chain through the entire orc pack who had suddenly developed a collective case of butter fingers. Eventually the ball came to a stop and the orcs were finally able to grab hold of it properly, consolidating their position as more Amazons went off unconscious or injured.
Setting off upfield again, this time the Amazons were unable to mount as strong a defence and the orcs scored again shortly after.

A riot kicked off and the referee let the clock run a turn before the teams set up again and tired of having their line of scrimmage victimised, the orcs set up as a whole on the LOS, with only 2 turns left on the clock.
Unfortunately SBK's goblin mascot got ideas above his station and also set up on the LOS, at which point Zara stabbed him, sending him off injured. :smallfrown:

A quick vanity throw left the Amazon catcher out of position and an orc blitzer crunched her, but there was too little time left to take advantage and the game ended with some inconsequential rough housing.


Well played by Gnoman - his Amazons put up a much better fight than I was expecting and the extra Apothecaries he bought weren't needed in the end after the first averted death.

I've never been so glad of AV9 before, both due to Zara's Stakes and Gnoman's fouling attempts - a +6 Foul on my troll only resulted in a Stun, although the ref was clearly staring at the Destroyers' cheerleaders rather than all the players, considering all the -1 fouling attempts and not a single player sent off.
To be fair, Oiyou seemed to be doing the same, considering he failed a Really Stupid roll while on the ground surrounded by Amazons...

[LCP]

To continue the discussion with Silfir from the last thread (mainly so I'll have posted in this one and can recognise it by the tick next to the title...)


As long as the scores are level, I'm not dominating diddly squat. And I play accordingly. It would baffle me to think that anyone could consider that unsporting.

I agree and I wasn't saying that. To reiterate the key point of my previous post:


Outside those parameters (I feel like my roster is in danger, I feel confident I can keep the TD balance in my favour) sure, there are plenty of cases where gang-fouling won't induce me to score any faster

If, as in the scenario you paint, it's my receiving drive, the score is 0-0, and my opponent chose to kick, then the answer to "am I confident I can keep the TD balance in my favour" is almost always "no", and scoring early because of foul pressure would be poor play. What I was saying there are scenarios outside that chain of "ifs" where foul pressure will encourage me to score faster, since you stated categorically that fouling can't induce a good coach to score - the implication I read was that you were stating that was true in any circumstances whatsoever.


If I were to assume or, through my actions, suggest to my opponent that I am expecting to score on defense, and I'm not playing a vastly superior team, that's more or less like saying "You are not good enough for me to consider you my equal".

That's again making a few assumptions. Playing murderchaos in the main league, it's quite possible for my opponent to play excellent Blood Bowl but still be looking at starting the second half with half their team in hospital. I don't think it's at all 'insulting' to expect to score a defensive TD in those circumstances; it's purely a function of their armour and injury rolls.

I think you have to be looking pretty hard for implied slights to find someone's failure to run the clock against you insulting - but I've personally felt the frustration of being helpless to stop the opponent's clock-running many times. Given the luxury of choice from a safe position (and as you say that's rare and I wouldn't advocate it outside that position), I think it's more sporting to score quickly and let your opponent have a few more turns where they actually get to play the game.

[Silfir]

I think you have to be looking pretty hard for implied slights to find someone's failure to run the clock against you insulting - but I've personally felt the frustration of being helpless to stop the opponent's clock-running many times. Given the luxury of choice from a safe position (and as you say that's rare and I wouldn't advocate it outside that position), I think it's more sporting to score quickly and let your opponent have a few more turns where they actually get to play the game.

I'm really only talking about situations where a) the scores are level and you have to decide the timing of your one-touchdown lead, or b) you're behind by one and you have to decide the timing of your equalizer. I. e. when clock-running can easily mean the difference between a loss, a draw or a win. In 99% of cases where these situations apply, the assumption that you're in a "safe position" would be severely misjudged.

When clock-running isn't necessary to ensure the result of the game (though clock-running even with a one-touchdown lead in hand is still perfectly justified against elves, since they only really need one lucky break to score twice in quick succession) I don't run the clock either.



In-game, when my opponents don't run the clock, I tend to attribute that to them having made a risk analysis and deciding that they would rather have the safe score, which I think 99% of cases is probably the truth of it.

There was really only one match where I felt "disrespected", and that wasn't on GitP; that was when I was playing another elf coach with my own elves who was completely outclassing me in terms of positioning etc. and was away with the ball on course for a defensive TD and already 1-0 in the lead - and instead of running in the 2-0, or stalling for an utterly safe victory, decided to score with a pass into the endzone, essentially saying "this game is over, might as well farm some SPP". That stung. (I won the game 1-2, after the ball tumbled out, I scored in return, and then scored again as a result of a Blitz. That lessened the sting. You can't count on it going that way every time, though.)

I certainly would never expect an opponent who has a safe 2-1 victory in hand, by stalling and keeping my players contained, to let me back into the game. No sportsman has an obligation to their opponent to "let" them do anything that would affect the outcome of the match. Losing may be frustrating, but accepting a loss gracefully is an integral element of sportsmanship.

[Devmaar]

Repost from old thread:


The Stabbery 1-3 Sun's Children


The elves kicked off and ended the first half 3-0 down after a blitz ruined the 2 turn td attempt and led to a turn 7 lizard score. I scored more casualties but suffered enough kos that The children had a numbers advantage a lot of the time. I honestly think I could have managed a result were it not for snake eyes on some particularly key pass and dodge rolls...


So anyway, this was the week when my Dwarves couldn't take a punch and my Elves couldn't throw a pass :smallsigh:

[Thufir]

I think you have to be looking pretty hard for implied slights to find someone's failure to run the clock against you insulting

Well, perhaps not insulting, but indicative of confidence in their superiority. Of course, if someone is that sure of themselves and their ability to win while making riskier plays, you should then feel encouraged to try and prove them wrong by capitalising on the chances they're unnecessarily giving you and making them pay for their hubris - and I fully encourage people to attempt this against me. Because I am talking here about my own approach with Euphonic Cadence - I don't run the clock because I'm confident enough of my ability to win with that team regardless, and it's more fun to try and rack up huge scorelines. Since EC have so far conceded 4 draws and 1 overtime loss, it seems reasonable. I will still run the clock in playoffs though, because that's serious time and if I lose I don't get to try again against ~10 other teams.
Actually, a secondary reason why I don't clock-run with my Elves is that they're just not as good at it as other teams. Delaying tactics against a strong onslaught can be somewhat sketchy with Elves, whereas I'm more comfortable defending and threatening to take the ball away. But getting back to where this debate started, that's why you should attempt to make said onslaught - if you come over to threaten the security of my touchdown I'll probably struggle to hold you off for more than a turn, but if you expend your actions on hitting or fouling my players out of movement range of the ball I'll just ignore it. The odds of causing serious damage to my team are generally not great, and if you do then in some ways that may be more incentive for me to continue running the clock as with less players on the pitch I will be less confident in my ability to defend once I score, so I should try to minimise how long I'll need to do so.

Oh, and IIRC LCP suggested the tactical question-marks over gang-fouling were just a ruse to discourage people from fouling our teams? It's true, I don't like my players getting fouled, and I'd prefer people didn't do it. But in the circumstances we're talking about, it is also tactically a bad move, because while I don't like getting fouled, I still don't dislike it enough to let it influence my tactical decision-making. If I am determined to kill the clock, fouling won't stop me. I would rather avoid the potential injuries fouling causes, but I would also rather my opponent made tactically sound plays to keep the game interesting, because as noted - burning the clock is kind of a boring option, as effective as it is.


On a mostly unrelated note, three videos:
S4M1 Euphonic Cadence vs. Sun's Chidlren (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqKLdc9SGUw)
S4M3 Euphonic Cadence vs. Spartak's Blood Bowl Klub (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kA3BBmJ1y3M)
S4M4 Euphonic Cadence vs. Team Hippy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5B6c9Wd_eO0)

[Brother Oni]

S4M3 Euphonic Cadence vs. Spartak's Blood Bowl Klub (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kA3BBmJ1y3M)

Watching the video again and I'm wondering myself what the hell I was thinking on some of those plays. I definitely should have blitzed Orpheus with the Black Orc and then followed up with more support (I forget whether I was trying to do something else and wanted a better roll on the player behind the ball carrier). Your left wide zone was because I didn't pay attention to your Guard Blitzer (I'm not entirely sure I knew what Guard was at that point as I'd just played barely enough to have a gist of the rules).

I can explain the turn 16 foul though - under the system I was familiar with, injuries from fouling did give you SPP; I think you mentioned it in the Season 3 Humans/Vampires game, but I probably forgot. While I agree my early defence was particularly weak, you did make a noticeably large number of successful dodges, plus your block rolls were better than mine, although I concede a large part of that due to your better play causing the odds to be in your favour.

[SaruSama]

Dokkalfar Daggers 2 versus Murderhobos 1
Despite the loss probably the best games I've played with this team. A really swingy game, early in the game he managed to shatter my cage and have a bunch of elves surrounding the ball. Most of the early first half was us scrounging around for it but I eventually managed to steal it and score. He got the equalizer on the last turn of the half but Id managed to knock out enough of his team I had a big numbers advantage starting the second half. To top that off he used both of his rerolls left from the halfling chef to pick up the ball and basically played the half with no rerolls. Than he proceeded to play a fantastic game and use the fact that his players had so many more skills than me to get the ball pretty safely down field. I still managed to make it a game and have an elf touchdown lined up if he failed any rolls. With all that it came down to the last turn where he managed to clear a space and dodge out for the win.

[LCP]

Oh, and IIRC LCP suggested the tactical question-marks over gang-fouling were just a ruse to discourage people from fouling our teams? It's true

I knew it

tricksssssssssss

Nice to see more video reports going up, I enjoy those.

[Tasroth]

Dokkalfar Daggers 2 versus Murderhobos 1

Match validated, day advanced.

Week 6 Fixtures

Meddling Insects (Shishnarfne) vs. The Murderhobos (SaruSama)
The Ironbeards (Wraith) vs. The Adrasteia (Thufir)
Dwarf Adjectives (Qwaz) vs. Dokkalfar Daggers (Luzahn)
Blood Bowl Club Mirka (Brother Oni) vs. Tasroth's Dark Stars (Tasroth)

[Brother Oni]

Tasroth's Dark Stars 2 : BC Mirka 0

The game didn't start well, with a disappearing Ogre causing a less than 11 players bug, but I was unable to place another player instead, thus I had a badly out of position no skill linesman instead of a Guard/Stand Firm Ogre, which would have really helped.
Morg quickly proved his weight in gold and dispatched at least three players off the pitch, including the enemy minotaur on an Attacker Down with a -AG broken neck (which had no effect on his stats anyway).

A couple of silly misplays on my part, cost me a turn 8 touch down (I had definitely counted that I could move my blitzer to grab the ball and score, did some safer moves then forgot about the route I plotted and let the wayfinding AI fool me into thinking I was 1 square short of scoring) and a subsequent touchdown (one blitzer failed on a 3+ dodge after a -1 handoff, while another fell over on a GFI), which might have made the scoreline a lot closer.

Tasroth meanwhile elfed his way through the critical junctures, letting him grab the ball from under the noses of my players twice and passing it down the pitch.


I expected a brutal beating which the Chaos team didn't disappoint, but I wasn't expecting how elf-like they were. My team put up a surprisingly good fight, Morg coming to the rescue many a time.

I've spotted a weakness with my gameplay in that I typically run the ball up the pitch with well supported blocking, remembering to leave players in potential scoring positions only as an afterthought (or rather, I half arse it and leave the breakthrough players just out of supporting reach but also not within a scoring position). Unfortunately the best way for me to do teach myself that is to play elves *spit* and I'm not sure I'm willing to let my dignity drop that low yet. :smalltongue:

[Neon Knight]

99 Ways to Die 0-5 Leapers of Loren. Not much to say about the match itself; the elves elfed even in Disturbing Presence and despite some pieces succumbing to the hugs of the Beast of Nurgle, my lack of Tackle and Sure Hands made the double Strip Ball Wardancers a nightmare, the Wood Elves kick worked well all but one drive were I got a touchback (and worked beautifully when the Elves got a Blitz)... I wasn't really getting nuffled until the end, when a Pestigor failed a 3+ to pick up the ball 3 times (twice in one turn with reroll) only to watch an elf make the same 3+, dodge out effortlessly, and score. I suppose there are also the armor rolls to consider; barely any KO's, all of which came back rapidly, and no injuries whatsoever. In fact, the elves did a pretty good job on my armour; most drives featured a KO on my side, including a KO'ed Nurgle Warrior in the first drive. They came back just as readily thanks to Bloodweiser Babes, so both teams had nearly all their players every drive.

I knew facing Blodge Strip Ball pieces would be tough, so I'm not too surprised at the result. The story of the game is pretty much the elf's game plan working and mine not working.

[Qwaz]

Team Hippy 1-0 BlackHearse BoneHeads

Unpronouncable and I chatted through the game and it kept what was otherwise quite a scrappy game pleasent & lighthearted. The rain was getting in everyone's way all game and after scoring quickly I spent 13 or 14 turns defending as hard as I could. No perma-injuries to either side thankfully.

Thanks for the game!

[Unpronounceable]

Team Hippy 1-0 BlackHearse BoneHeads

Unpronouncable and I chatted through the game and it kept what was otherwise quite a scrappy game pleasent & lighthearted. The rain was getting in everyone's way all game and after scoring quickly I spent 13 or 14 turns defending as hard as I could. No perma-injuries to either side thankfully.

Thanks for the game!

To borrow the earliest post I remember from these threads:

"The Head coach of the Boneheads blamed the defeat on an insufficient quantity of dead elves"

Scrappy is definitely the word for that game, due to some silly "getting key pieces isolated" on my part and the sheer amount of blodge (and my lack of block/tackle) meant the blocking game rarely went my way, as such I was very happy to only lose 1-0, I was never really in a position to threaten an equalizer save a last minute desperate sprint up the pitch.

Thanks for the gam Qwaz, I'm filing it under "learning experiences"

[Wraith]

I'm hoping that LeSwordfish and I are looking to play our Rookie League game at some point on Monday/Tuesday, whenever he's available. Very much looking forward to that, his Khemri are terrifying but the first bunch of bonebags that I've played in a long time so it will be unique. :smallsmile:

I believe that in the other Leagues I have another couple of kickings from the Dark Powers, via the medium of LCP's Rampagers and Thufir's Adrasteia. If you gentlemen would care to let me know when is suitable for you I'll do my best to make the matches, circumstances, new baby and tired out girlfriend willing. :smalltongue:

[LCP]

I just got home from the airport - should be available any time this week (although if you're looking to catch me today I've probably got about an hour before the jetlag catches up with me). Congratulations on the new baby!

[Qwaz]

Definetly. Congratulations to you both. As a gift I shall avoid fouling your norse if at all possible. Unless I get bribes, then i can't be held accountable for my bloodlust!



Blood Bowl in the Playground II: Where You Either Win or Blame Nuffle... Sometimes Both

*Cough*III*Cough*

(Completely not trying to be a D. I really appreciate the work You, Wraith & Tasroth put into keeping the assorted league posts updated. It's often thankless work that definetly keeps the league going smoothly. Cheers)

[Wraith]

Definetly. Congratulations to you both. As a gift I shall avoid fouling your norse if at all possible.

Thank you both. We've only been home a few hours, but I should be more or less back on schedule as o tomorrow. That is especially kind of you....


Unless I get bribes, then i can't be held accountable for my bloodlust!

....Kinda. :smalltongue:


*Cough*III*Cough*

I blame Nuffle. :smallwink:

[Brother Oni]

Thank you both. We've only been home a few hours, but I should be more or less back on schedule as o tomorrow.

While congratulations are in order on the new mini-Wraith, you don't know much about babies, do you? :smalltongue:

If you're lucky, you'll get a few day's grace as the baby spends most of its time sleeping to recover from the birth, after that it's the stereotypical sleep deprived newborn baby parents mode until it learns to sleep for longer stretches.

[Wraith]

I'm aware of all of this, Brother Oni. You just had to shatter my happy little delusions though, didn't you? :smallannoyed::smallwink:

[Brother Oni]

I'm aware of all of this, Brother Oni. You just had to shatter my happy little delusions though, didn't you? :smallannoyed::smallwink:

From personal experience, given that you're still joking about it and haven't unleashed a torrent of abuse at me, I'm guessing you're still in the grace period. :smalltongue:

[Tasroth]

Bloody-Handed Angels - 2; Imperial Space Corps - 1

A pretty close game. The first half went really well for me, taking the ball twice and scoring. The second half, not so much, and a turn 16 equalizer was only prevented by a lucky interception.

Also I've noticed a problem with the in-thread table. The result of the Team Hippy vs. BlackHearse BoneHeads match is the wrong way round. It was 1-0 to Team Hippy, not to the BoneHeads.

[LCP]

The Rumble in the Tundra is kicking off soon - Rampagers vs. Destroyers. One way or another, it's going to be bloody!

[LCP]

Ruinous Rampagers 0 - 0 Hammersjurg Destroyers. A very strange game in which rerolls wouldn't take, GFIs were a death sentence, and both sides lost sight of the ball in the name of claiming skulls for Khorne. By the second half we were almost playing five-a-side Blood Bowl, and the Rampagers had put both the Destroyers' Yhetee and their old nemesis Sveinn the star thrower in the morgue; in my receiving drive Khorak the minotaur was only saved from the same fate by the Rampagers' far more competent apothecary.

Thanks for the game, Wraith! Of course this leaves the Rampagers and Destroyers STILL TIED so Khorne demands a rematch.

[Luzahn]

Bloody-Handed Angels - 2; Imperial Space Corps - 1

A pretty close game. The first half went really well for me, taking the ball twice and scoring. The second half, not so much, and a turn 16 equalizer was only prevented by a lucky interception.


Well, to be fair the other stuff that happened in that turn was also quite lucky. The interception was just chance correcting itself in the most dramatic way possible. :smallbiggrin:

[Wraith]

It's been a tough old season for the Destroyers so far. They're spent the last half dozen games harried by all sorts of weird and wonderful teams that they've never seen before, so today was going to be a comforting change back to normality - getting beaten snotless by Chaos.

First time around the Rampagers won convincingly, taking the newbie Destroyers to the proverbial cleaners with a 2-0 victory, but then everything went wrong/right when, in the Legacy League Season 1 Playoffs, a surprising interception by Morg'n'Thorg and some.... *ahem*..... 'highly advanced, technicaly defensive plays' allowed the Norsemen to steal their way through to the finals 2 touchdowns to 1.
Today, the deadlock was going to be broken. Along, quite probably, with a few spines.

The Rampagers spun the coin and chose poorly, allowing the Destroyers the opportunity to Receive. Everything immediately fell into place for them as Star Thrower Sveinn Audanarson (appearing in no less than 4 of the Halls of Fame!) Kick Off Return'd into place and caught the ball before it hit the ground, while his team mates immediately Badly Hurt a Beastman on the LoS and the team's Yhetee Blitz'd another into unconsciousness all at once. The Chaos team retaliated despite being down 2 players already; they sent a Chaos Warrior hurtling at Unr Frost, the Yhetee, and he came away with a brand new set of Yhetee-fur mittens and hat. Dead, apothecaried into Dead. Of course. :smallmad:

And that was the end of turn 1.

"At least you didn't kill my Thrower," I said. "If you had done that, I would have been really upset." :smallbiggrin::smallsmile:

Crowding around the Destroyers' gently cooling Big Guy, the Chaos team found itself spread thin enough to allow the Norsemen an opportunity to break though. Knocking a Chaos Warrior down, there became enough room for a Lineman to run through and Blitz another Beastman, which would have allowed the Norse to cage up in the very middle of the pitch with no players ahead of them and a whole bunch more tied up in tackle zones at either side. After that, a bit of careful planning would have allowed a reasonably clear run to the End Zone two turns later.
The lineman failed his GFI and Stunned himself. :smallannoyed: Fortunately he was only the first link of the cage to move, and from a position that meant the ball carrier was still safe... for now.

The Chaos then buried themselves in the cage, knocking Sveinn down and threatening the ball with three tackle zones. To everyone's surprise (my own included) the Destroyers cleared two of them away and Sveinn dodged away from the Warrior that was breathing down his neck and then dived right back in to grab the ball!
He was, however, out of movement and I was too low on rerolls to want to try and Dodge out again, but Nuffle smiled on the plucky viking. Manhandled by two Warriors and a Minotaur, he took everything that they threw at him and stayed upright... and found himself on the opposite side of the Chaos LoS from where had started! Just one Dodge between him and the freedom to run to the End Zone!

With a couple of friends nearby acting as body guards, it looked as though he might get his next TD after all.
Now missing several players, however, the Norsemen had only real one option to score before Sveinn was brought down; my AG4 Berserker broke away from his new friendly Beastman buddy and waited to receive the Pass in the End Zone.
Sveinn snake eye'd his GFI to make it a 3+ throw, 3 squares from the End Zone. "ARGGKN:BPI@OUI", I said. :smallfurious:

The ball was scooped up by a Beastman who handed it straight over to a nearby Warrior. They would very possibly have time to make it to the End Zone, since both teams were now down to about 7 players a piece and half of my pieces were tied up by a Minotaur.
Undaunted, I managed to arrange a 1 dice block on the Chaos Warrior, pinning the nearby Beastman in place with the Berserker who had abandonned the End Zone. Nuffle was with me again as a Runner made it from the LoS to Blitz, passing his GFI (the first in 5 rolls) and getting Defender Stumbles on the Warrior. Having provided the assist, Sveinn once again leapt in and grabbed the ball, ending his turn once more within spitting distance of a touchdown.

I thought I was safe. I really did. As turn Chaos 8/Norse 7 dawned it looked like Sveinn would get away, safe behind his screen of Linemen and the previously mentioned Chaos Warrior marked up and preventing a Blitz on my ball carrier. The Berserker's Beastman buddy was still there, though. He risked a Dodge and a GFI to do it, but he put his head down, ran at full tilt and managed to Blitz Svein square in the face.
Defender Down.
Serious Injury.
Dead.
:smalleek:
"ARGGKN:BPI@OUI", I said again. Thus ends the saga of the greatest Norse Thrower ever to walk the pitch.

The Rampagers were unable to capitalise on that little success; down the pitch a Chaos Warrior hit a Both Down on a Runner and KO'd himself, leaving me with the faint chance of Frenzy-ing the Beastman away and collecting the ball with the Runner who had previously relieved the Chaos Warrior of the ball, but without rerolls he couldn't get a grip on it and the half ended.

The Destroyers were down to 9 players; the Rampagers down to 6, and ready to receive.

Despite the disadvantage in numbers, the Rampagers still had all the strength in the world, and without a Yhetee to oppose them they made good use of it, the Minotaur smashing his way through the LoS in turn 10 and allowing the Chaos Cage to be rebuilt on entirely the wrong side of the Norse team.... at least, 'wrong' as far as the Norse were concerned.
A few heroic attempts were made to screen against the cage and then attack it directly, but a few more KOs had started to pile up and the Norsemen were struggling to keep ahead of the Dark Powers they were facing, until in turn 12 the Chaos Beastman ball carrier made the crucial mistake of standing one square too close to a Lineman. He ran around the cage and attacked from the bottom left, leaving him dangerously close to the touchline but successful in his attempt to dislodge the ball.
Riding high on his team's success (a Dodge, a GFI and a 1 dice blitz all succeeded without needing a reroll) Huran, the Norse Werewolf struck; with the ball loose and the Chaos team tied up by a couple of determined Linesmen, he took a hopeful gamble and ran headlong into the Chaos Minotaur, only one assist making it a 1 dice block against a Stand Firm player who, if he wasn't knocked down, would probably surf the Werewolf next turn.
Push; no effect.
Frenzy.
Defender Down.
Serious Injury.
DEAD.
HAHAHAHAHA!!!! :smallbiggrin:

Luckily for the Rampagers they also had a vet on hand, and the cow was stitched back together and will be fine in time for his next game. With a couple of players now free to act, the rumble around the ball quickly became a melee of shoving, attempted dodges, failed pickups and another failed GFI until finally - finally - in the last turn of the game the Norse managed to grab the ball and run for it, finally getting the damn thing away from their End Zone as the gong closed play.

Final Score: The Ruinous Rampagers 0-0 Hammersjurg Destroyers.
Between two dead Big Guys (one permanantly), one dead upcoming superstar (who also won the Norse MVP for the match... :smallfurious: ) there were barely 10 bodies left on the pitch, including the referee. Despite a(n im)moral victory, the highly experienced Ruinous Rampagers failed to break the deadlock between them and their old rivals, whereas the Hammersjurg Destroyers now face the rest of the season with a big gap where their SPP total used to be. Maybe the two teams will meet again, but both have a severe uphill struggle if they're going to make it as far as the playoffs of Season 05....

TL;DR - @nuffleplz

Thanks again for the game LCP. I was laughing from the end of turn 1 until the end of the game, it was just one of those matches where I couldn't have hoped to take it seriously :smalltongue:

[LCP]

It was definitely an insane game. A pity it was 0-0 - I reckon if the dice had been letting anything that wasn't bloodshed succeed it would've ended 1-1.

Gnoman, whenever the week rolls round - I'm free all weekdays bar Thursday this week (including this evening) but I'll be away at the weekend.

[Wraith]

California Skulls 1 - 3 The Scaretoon Network.

Despite what the scoreline implies, it was a fun game that I had to fight for every step of the way.
After a prolonged but eventually successful fight to try and get the ball out of a Tomb Guardian cage, the weather changed to Sweltering Heat - at 2-0 up and both teams missing 3 players I got cocky and messed up my move order. LeSwordfish punished me for it immediately by scoring a touchdown, and suddenly I was down 5 players to his 3 and right near the beginning of the second half.

That.... wasn't a whole bunch of 'fun'. Especially not when I managed to scrape through a touchdown and start a new drive in turn 15, only for the Tomb Guardians on the LoS to straight up murder the guy who had just scored. Alas, poor Aliens vs. Predator vs. Teletubbies; we hardly knew ye.

Welcome to the team his replacement, Army of Darkwing Duck. And thanks again for the game LeSwordfish; keep that Thro-Ra alive, that guy knows what's up! :smallsmile:

[Maethirion]

The Sun's Children 3:2 Leapers of Loren

I have no words for this game. I really don't. While Sarusama did play very well, there's no denying that, seven times over the course of the game I rolled a one for a dodge or a leap roll, and rerolled it into another one. When that happens, there's really just nothing you can do. Two of my scoring opportunities were wrecked by this, and I was left in a terrible position by it happening early in a few turns, including once which directly lead to the Children's third touchdown, due to a skink being too close to my thrower. I know the rng has been proven fair, but sometimes you really do have to wonder.

Sorry, I'm just a little bitter.

As was pointed out after the game, it really is a testament to the ridiculousness of elf gameplay, that even with all of that, I still scored twice.

[Qwaz]

Luzahn and I play our legacy league game tonight at 2300 BST for anyone interested.

Neon Knight/Crooked Vulture - Ive messaged you on steam some suggestion on times for our standard league game. Let me know what you're thinking :smallsmile:

[Brother Oni]

Thufir - when would be a good time for more of your elfy shenanigans?

[Neon Knight]

Luzahn and I play our legacy league game tonight at 2300 BST for anyone interested.

Neon Knight/Crooked Vulture - Ive messaged you on steam some suggestion on times for our standard league game. Let me know what you're thinking :smallsmile:

I lost/missed your message, but I'm available pretty much anytime.

[Devmaar]

Luzahn and I play our legacy league game tonight at 2300 BST for anyone interested.

Neon Knight/Crooked Vulture - Ive messaged you on steam some suggestion on times for our standard league game. Let me know what you're thinking :smallsmile:

Luzahn, would you be able to get our standard league game in shortly before/after this match?

[Luzahn]

Luzahn, would you be able to get our standard league game in shortly before/after this match?

Sorry, I was occupied up to the match itself - any other times this week you're free?

[Devmaar]

Sorry, I was occupied up to the match itself - any other times this week you're free?

All day tomorrow, beyond that we'd have to lay it by ear

[Unpronounceable]

Wymbildon Warpstoners 3-0 Kleptoquarterbacks

Goblins + some rats and a troll vs goblins + some trolls and a chainsaw. A rather comedic match but unfortunately not a single successful TTMTD.

I've just realised the week has rolled on. Shishnarfne, when do your wannabe undead posers fancy playing a REAL undead team? :P

It'll have to be next week though as I'm away until monday, you are BST right?

[Wraith]

And to make matter worse, you can finally afford to replace your long-dead Blitzer. :smallbiggrin: One more game to go and the Rookie League can roll on to a new day.

Clarson vs. Ivellius - How are you guys getting on? Have you been able to set a date for your game? Anything else that I can help you with? :smallsmile:

[EDIT] In Blood Bowl 2 related news! Cyanide have definitively confirmed a release date of September 22nd. Further more, as an apology for the belated release (previous rumours said June 15th or so), they're thanking preorders with a choice of a ninth team - Lizardmen or Wood Elves, complete with their race-appropriate Star Players!

It sounds a lot like if you preorder you get your first DLC for free, as they're also working on "other offers" so we're not talking exclusive content or anything. Undoubtedly we'll be able to buy the other team separately, if not immediately then very soon afterwards, which if we do make that assumption seems to answer the question about how Cyanide were intending on introducing new teams and Star Players in the future.

Normally I'm against preordering video games on the basis that it's giving away money and getting nothing in return, but in this case I was always going to buy BB2 anyway so spending the same money a week or too earlier and then getting a free upgrade doesn't seem so bad. And they're both good teams worth having too, it's not as though Cyanide are thanking us for our patience and support with Halflings or something.... :smalltongue:

[Qwaz]

Last night was bloodbowl heavy for me & 3-0 is a common scoreline it seems.

Dwarf Adjectives 0 - 3 Dokkalfar Daggers

Team Hippy 3 - 0 99 Ways to Die

Only 1 perma-injury to the daggers and only a -MV at that. I can only apologise to the remainder of the legacy league :smallwink:

The regular league game came close to ending 2-0 but for a long shot length of the field recovery play with no team re-rolls available....cheffed! Highlights for me included having 0/4 re-rolls left from turn 2. It's amazing how much you can long for half time or for even a new drive just for the shot at getting an extra re-roll.

[Neon Knight]

Team Hippy 3 - 0 99 Ways to Die. With a massive TV gulf, I bought a Halfling Chef that paid off, as Qwaz noted. The Eleves scored twice in the first half, once with their drive and then on a blitz when i got the return. The second half stalled out as the "thin green line" of Blodge pieces proved too much for the unskilled Nurgle team to handle. It would have ended 2-0, but I goofed on my last turn and broke up my cage before I realized I had miscounted and the piece I thought could score was one space short, even with both going for its. I tried to pass to him anyway, failed, and the Elves did their elf things. The Beast of Nurgle was extraordinary this game, though, never failing a Really Stupid and frequently tying up pieces with hugs. I also had 2-3 pieces level.

Well played to Qwaz; I just hope I can take break from elves with 800+ TV value differences soon.

[Wraith]

The Bloody-Handed Angels: 0 - 1 :The Hammersjurg Destroyers.

The Dark Elves won their coin toss and chose to kick, then from there, everything went almost entirely for their Norse opponents.

It was a scrappy advance up the pitch and the ball carrier was forced to drop it once or twice, but each time he immediately jumped up and grabbed it again. The Elves suffered a horrible casualty very early on when their star Witch Elf Mazikeen tripped over her own feet and rolled Dead into Smashed Collar Bone with the apothecary, ending the turn as well as her career.
In Norse 7/DElf 7 the Elves went all out, mobbing the Norse cage with bodies and shoving the Runner back and forth but he refused to go down, ending up slightly closer to the End Zone with only a s4 Elf Runner between him and glory.

In Norse 8/DElf 7, the rest of the Norse team tried some clever ruses to try and get the ball carrier free without the ball carrier needing to Dodge or Blitz himself but it was no use - he was going to have to make a 1 dice Blitz if he wanted to score, and then a Dodge if the target didn't get knocked down.
Not only did he get Defender Down and free follow up out of the tackle zone belonging to a Diving Tackle Lineman, but he also Badly Hurt the s4 Runner into the bargain. The Angels were missing two of their highest SPP players, but they still had 11 players at the start of the next half so there was everything to play for - especially since they had just Badly Hurt the Yhetee Star Player, Icepelt Hammerblow, leaving the Norse a Level 1 Werewolf as substitute.

Unfortunately, Nuffle was not kind. As the Norse kicked off the second half, the Elves managed to get a Blitzer through the line and into scoring position - he was immediately knocked down by the same Norse Runner that had taken down his comrade and then fouled into a Badly Injured, leaving the Dark Elves stuck in a melee on the LoS for the next 4 turns where they continued to take KO's.
They eventually managed to get out and away all at once - the team's other Runner made a break into the Norse half of the pitch while flanked by two Blitzers, either of whom were in a position to score when the inevitable Dump-Off handed them the ball.
The Norse instead Blitz'd one of the Blitzers, using their positioning to screen all three of the Elves and then push the Elf Runner back up the pitch, marking all three Elves in multiple TZ's and pushing two of them out of scoring position.
The Blitzers were stuck, but the Runner ran on anyway, heading to the right of the pitch with his eyes on the prize - he was a Blodge Elf, there was every chance that he would survive a Blitz and then Dodge into the End Zone next turn.

The Norse Runner from before once again struck, flattening the Elf and dropping the ball where it could be recovered by a Lineman and thrown back to the LoS. The Destroyers' new Thrower, Hrolf Sveinnson, caught the ball and sprinted up the pitch - it was very possible that he would score in the closing turn of the game, and in his debut match, no less.
Finally Nuffle chose to cut the Elves a break. 1-0 with only 5 players left on the pitch, they managed all 4 of the Dodges and 3 GFI's needed to knock over the Thrower and prevent him from scoring, but even the wildest Elf nonsense play couldn't put anyone in a position to score and the game ended with a few token Blitzes on everyone who was left upright.

Thanks again Tasroth. I still don't think you made a mistake at all, but you may just have been out-Elf'd a little. :smallfrown:


Well played to Qwaz; I just hope I can take break from elves with 800+ TV value differences soon.

According to the calender for the next game.... How does 340k/difference worth of Norse strike you instead, sir? :smallsmile:

[Tasroth]

Bloody-Handed Angels - 0; Hammersjurg Destroyers - 1

The main thing I can say is ouch. A failed dodge early in the first half pushed Mazikeen's luck once too often. After receiving the attentions of my apothecary for the fifth time in her career, and the fourth from death, she was left with -ST. So no more Block/Tackle/Mighty Blow witch elf. And with no apothecary available, my thrower (alright, he's a runner, he's built to be a thrower) suffered a second -AV. So yeah, now I have an AV5 thrower. So that's a thing.

Most of all I'm kicking myself for even trying the dodge that cost me Mazikeen. I wasn't sure about trying the play anyway, but went ahead and it cost me. The major consolation came towards the end of the first half with star player Icepelt Hammerblow trying to eliminate one of my Blodge players. 3 dice, no defender downs. Pushed, frenzy. 3 dice. All both downs. Icepelt doesn't have Block. Knocked Down. Armour Breaks. Injured. Regeneration fails. Turnover.

[Brother Oni]

Well played to Qwaz; I just hope I can take break from elves with 800+ TV value differences soon.

Look on the bright side - you're not facing orcs with a 500+ TV difference until your very last game. :smalltongue:

[Unpronounceable]

Highlights for me included having 0/4 re-rolls left from turn 2. It's amazing how much you can long for half time or for even a new drive just for the shot at getting an extra re-roll.

Seeing as i don't recall you using one in our game i don't imagine that was too much of a problem ;)

[Qwaz]

So yeah, now I have an AV5 thrower. So that's a thing.

Yum. Come shake my treeman's hand :smallwink:


Seeing as i don't recall you using one in our game i don't imagine that was too much of a problem ;)

Not in the first half but in the 2nd i definetly did, can't remember on what. Plus there's risky stuff I just don't want to try without a re-roll in the bank - Leaping for example!

[Neon Knight]

According to the calender for the next game.... How does 340k/difference worth of Norse strike you instead, sir? :smallsmile:

Sure, bring on the mead.

[LCP]

Just got back to London. Gnoman, I'll be free Monday, Wednesday and Friday this week (British summer time) and probably busy both days of the weekend again. Let me know when's best for you.

[Wraith]

The last Rookie League game has been auto-resolved, and the fuxtures for week 7 are ready to go.

Calender for Day 7:
Wheeeeeeeeee! (Qwertystop) vs. California Skulls (LeSwordfish)
Smashers of Sotek (Maethirion) vs. Throwers and Throwaways (Shishnarfne)
Wymbildon Warpstoners (Unpronounceable) vs. Okami Ye Faithful (Silfir)
Papa N's Storytime Crew (Ivellius) vs. Something Ratten in Den. (Neon Knight)
Champions of Dread (Devmaar) vs. Spartans of Khorne (Brother Oni)
Ms. Dot's Nurse Academy (Manticoran) vs. Grimnir's Grudgebringers (LCP)
Bear's Children (Clarkson) vs. The Scaretoon Network (Wraith)
Kleptoquarterbacks (Froish) vs. Black Ribbons (Luzahn)

Games to be completed by: Monday 29th June

It looks like we're starting to get some of the more vital matches underway now. Games like the Academy vs. the Grudgebringers or the Smashers vs. the Throwaways could very well decide who makes it into the playoffs and who doesn't, not to mention teams like Something Ratten and their meteoric riseup the ranks possibly sneaking their way in. Good luck, boys and girls!

Clarkson - I remember that your internets have been unreliable lately, but I expect that I can accomodate you whenever you're free. Shoot me a message and I'm sure we can work something out. :smallsmile:

[Qwertystop]

LeSwordfish, I'm free mornings and evenings EST on weekdays, whenever on weekends.

[Brother Oni]

Champions of Dread (Devmaar) vs. Spartans of Khorne (Brother Oni)


Devamaar, when would be a good time for our game? I'm available evenings BST on weekdays and most times on weekends.

[Manticoran]

Heya LCP. I'm usually free after 5-6PM on weekdays, except this week only Wednesday and Friday. And then usually very free on weekends.

[Devmaar]

Devamaar, when would be a good time for our game? I'm available evenings BST on weekdays and most times on weekends.

Wednesday or Thursday evening would be best for me.

Same goes for our main league game Luzahn, I've just been too tired or too busy when I've seen you on steam in the past few days

[Neon Knight]

It looks like we're starting to get some of the more vital matches underway now. Games like the Academy vs. the Grudgebringers or the Smashers vs. the Throwaways could very well decide who makes it into the playoffs and who doesn't, not to mention teams like Something Ratten and their meteoric riseup the ranks possibly sneaking their way in. Good luck, boys and girls!


Don't hype them up too much, they're still coached by me, after all. :smalltongue:

Ivellius, I'm available most of the time this week, except for Tuesday when I have an IRL Bloodbowl game, and on Saturday I'm headed to New Mexico for a few days.

[LCP]

Hi Manticoran - have added you on Steam. You can see when I'm available this week in my message to Gnoman above, but 5pm your time is 10pm my time, which is about the latest I can start a game of BB on a weekday.

I'm pretty busy this weekend; if I can catch you this Weds/Fri that'd be great, but I'll have to give priority to the game with Gnoman if I can as the deadline for that one is coming up at the end of the week. Otherwise catch you next week?

[Manticoran]

I can do 5pm Wednesday then, if you want.

[LCP]

Just spoken to Gnoman and unfortunately that's the day that he's most likely to be able to do. Friday or next week?

[Brother Oni]

Wednesday or Thursday evening would be best for me.

I'll try and catch you on Wednesday evening then.


In separate news, the SBK versus Euphonic Cadence game is scheduled for this Saturday evening if people want to see the elves reach the top of the table again.

[Manticoran]

Might be able to do Friday. Let me get back to you later.

[LeSwordfish]

LeSwordfish, I'm free mornings and evenings EST on weekdays, whenever on weekends.

Define "Evenings" - like LCP, I can't really start after 10pm BST. I'm away friday-monday, but should be around any other evening.

[Qwertystop]

Define "Evenings" - like LCP, I can't really start after 10pm BST. I'm away friday-monday, but should be around any other evening.

After about 5:30 EST most days, so pretty much exactly after your valid range...
I've got all day on weekends but you're away...
I've also got a two-hour window starting in about fifteen minutes, would that possibly work?

[LeSwordfish]

Nope, sorry - i'm at work until five-sixish BST every weekday.

We might have to wait until the next weekend then.

[Luzahn]

If I recall correctly, I owe some people some games - sorry I missed this weekend, I was visiting family.

I'm pretty free this week, just let me know when you can play. :smallsmile:

[Devmaar]

If I recall correctly, I owe some people some games - sorry I missed this weekend, I was visiting family.

I'm pretty free this week, just let me know when you can play.


Wednesday or Thursday evening would be best for me.

Same goes for our main league game Luzahn, I've just been too tired or too busy when I've seen you on steam in the past few days

:smallsmile:

[Luzahn]

:smallsmile:

Sounds good to me; What's your time zone again?

[Devmaar]

I'm BST but I tend to be up late. That said, I have an early start at work on Friday, so I'd ready be up late tonight than tomorrow

[Brother Oni]

In a quick Open League Game, SBK's junior team, Spartak's Speshul Wepuns, beat the eldritch Colours From Outer Space 2:1.

Receiving the ball, an early SSW touchdown was scored when the Colours coach forgot about Throw Teammate, which put a goblin well out of reach of any harm, although a mass gang up took the Fanatic off.

The counter touchdown was just as easily scored when the Bombardier caused a double turnover (the second after an interception and returned bomb) however.

The second half started in SSW's favour with 8-11 players and the Looney got stuck in with his chainsaw, rapidly taking it down to 6 Colours players and a stolen ball for a defensive touchdown with copious clock running as the Colours found themselves isolated and stomped on repeatedly, with the Zebedee the Pogoer managing to knock over a Vampire on a 2 dice block.

An entertaining and very silly game, helped by no permanent injuries on either side.

[LCP]

Destroyers of Worlds vs. Ruinous Rampagers is kicking off now.

[Brother Oni]

Champions of Dread 1 : Spartans of Khorne 0

I do so enjoy the way that Nuffle gives you little snippets of hope, only for Him to dash them cruelly.

My favourite was a simply ridiculous chain of planning and luck to recover a buried ball from the Spartans back half after the Champions threw it forwards to avoid conceding possession, get it into a potential scoring position and then a failed 3+ dodge to completely muck it up the turn after. Another example was the chancey 2 red dice block by a CD blocker on my Bloodthirster only for both results to come up favourable for him.

After that, I started failing pretty much every armour roll, helped by the higher amount of Block on the Champion's team leaving me with pretty much only one safe block a turn with Juggernaut and the Champions easily ran in their touchdown while outnumbering the Spartans about 2 to 1.

As the cherry on the cake, I rolled a 1 for my winnings leaving me 10k short of my third reroll I've been saving up for 4 games now. With 1 journeyman against Manti's orcs next, I don't think there's going to be anything left of the team to put up more than a speed bump for the next game against Wraith.

[LCP]

Ruinous Rampagers 3 - 0 Destroyers of Worlds. Seeing a team of under-dressed humans called the "Destroyers" with Zara the Slayer on their side clearly brought back rage-inducing memories for the Rampagers, who started dismembering Amazons left right and centre. Zara was removed from play by an early foul and the induced halfling chef was clearly asleep at his ladle, as in the first half he managed to steal a measly one reroll, and in the second half none at all. The game ended on Turn 13 with Gnoman quite fairly deciding that two dead players was enough.

Thanks for the game Gnoman.

EDIT: Brother Oni, you seem to have put the result into the table the wrong way round.

[Wraith]

Open League! The Ziggurats 3 - 0 Nordson's Nords

A violent game that didn't deserve to have such a lop-sided scoreline. It began with the Norse team choosing to kick and immediately a thrown rock MNG'd the only Hobgoblin with the Sure Hands skill. Despite a couple more KO's however, the Chaos Dwarf team managed to force their way through the line, stall for a turn and then get their first touchdown in turn 5 as various linemen and Werewolves bore down on the victorious Bull Centaur.

The next drive went much the same, though for the other side. More Hobgoblins and even a Blocker or two were taken off the pitch, and the Ziggurats struggled to stop the onslaught as the Norse Thrower slipped through the LoS. On turn 8 the Nords were forced to try a 2 dice against blitz with no rerolls as their only way to get their ball carrier free, and in a big upset they got exactly what they needed.... Only for the ball carrier to fail his GFI into the End Zone and Badly Injure himself! :smalleek:

The second half started very badly for the Norse as, facing odds of seven players against the Chaos Dwarf 10, the kicking team got a Blitz! and immediately set about mauling the LoS and sending Bull Centaurs after the Runner that was to be the new ball retriever.
Devmaar made the next 6 turns extremely hard work though, succeeding 8 of his 9 dodges and managing at least four successful 1 dice blitzes to knock the ball free every turn until 13. By then, having run out of Hobgoblins (again...) the Chaos Dwarfs managed to inflict yet more injuries and KO's, taking the Norse team down to 3 players who were unable to stop another Bull Centaur from grabbing the ball and scoring in 14.

The last drive of the game was just insult to injury. Only 2 of the Norse team's KO'd/surfed players returned leaving them with 5 players against 10, and not only did the aspiring ball carrier fail to catch from the High Kick that started the drive, but he failed his GFI to get back to the ball after being Blitz'd over by a Bull Centaur. This left the mutant player the daunting prospect of picking up the ball unaided on AG2 and then making two GFI's to the End Zone to score in the very last turn.... and he did; 4+/2+/2+ passed with flying colours, despite both teams' previous failures at both for the prior 31 turns.

Thanks for the game, Devmaar. If there were any justice it deserved to have ended 2-1 to someone, but I'm not sure what you could have done when you were down to just a lineman and a werewolf. :smallconfused:

Legacy League: Thufir and I have scheduled our game for around lunchtime on Saturday. Thank you to you other players who have been waiting patiently for us to catch up.

[Brother Oni]

EDIT: Brother Oni, you seem to have put the result into the table the wrong way round.

Argh. Fixed.

[Devmaar]

For the record, that 2-against blitz at the end of the first half would have been 2-for if dauntless had worked...

I'll also mention that the Imperial Space Corps punched their way to a2-1 win over The Stabbery yesterday, killing a guard lineman and leaving a guard blitzer with -AV, the dark elf touchdown was a beautiful example of an AG 5 play though, Annassys skipped through the human ranks before throwing a medium pass to finally reach 16 spp

[LCP]

Argh. Fixed.


Excellent - thanks.

And so, like a wild-eyed stalker poorly concealing a meat cleaver under a bloodstained raincoat, the Ruinous Rampagers quietly shadow the Hammersjurg Destroyers up the league table.

NO ESCAPE WRAITH. NO ESCAPE.

[Wraith]

If by which you mean they have terrible dress sense and smell kinda funky.... :smallwink:

[LCP]

Hey, at least the Rampagers wear clothes!

*looks at team*

Hey, at least four of the Rampagers wear clothes!

[Wraith]

....The Destroyers wear enough clothes for four people.... kinda? :smalltongue:

[LCP]

One person who wears clothes stitched together out of seal-skin underpants, maybe.

[Wraith]

That's us - bringing gender equality on behalf of the Amazons and Cheerleaders of the Blood Bowl world, one semi-naked burly Norseman at a time :smallbiggrin:

On a separate note, last night I watched the Rookie league game of Throwers and Throwaways versus the Smashers of Sotek. Holy crap, that was a lot of ones!
In fact, in the second half, i'm pretty sure that at one point Shishnarfne was completely out of Snotlings and down to just his Ogres.... All of whom Bone Head'd at the same time, then the Smashers' Kroxigor Bone Head'd as well, and then two more Ogres did it again! :smallconfused:

Frankly, how the Ogres managed to fight off half a Lizardman team with only 2 players left me amazed. Well done, to everyone involved!

[Shishnarfne]

On a separate note, last night I watched the Rookie league game of Throwers and Throwaways versus the Smashers of Sotek. Holy crap, that was a lot of ones!
In fact, in the second half, i'm pretty sure that at one point Shishnarfne was completely out of Snotlings and down to just his Ogres.... All of whom Bone Head'd at the same time, then the Smashers' Kroxigor Bone Head'd as well, and then two more Ogres did it again! :smallconfused:

Frankly, how the Ogres managed to fight off half a Lizardman team with only 2 players left me amazed. Well done, to everyone involved!

I'll attribute the Bone Head-edness to the Ogres not knowing what to do since they'd run out of Skinks to punch. At least the only permanent damage was a Niggling Injury to a Snotling. It just means he'll die faster.

[LCP]

Manticoran, if you want to fit our game in today I'll be around for the whole evening.

[LCP]

Grimnir's Grudgebringers 0 - 2 Ms. Dot's Nurse Academy. A kinda predictable results as the dwarfs faced off against a wall of ST4/5 with one of their Guard pieces sitting out the match. Matters weren't helped by the ST4 blocker Thrain Copperhand taking a KO early on (despite his Thick Skull) and then sleeping through two kickoffs (despite the attention of the Bloodweiser Babes).

Thanks for the game Manticoran. Guess that's a new grudge for the book.

[Manticoran]

Good game! The dice were kind of just with me, with your armor breaking in all the right places and mine never being touched, I kind of just hit you until I had a numerical advantage enough to win. I do question your choice to Kick rather than Receive though, in this kind of smashy matchup I almost always prefer to Receive, as I find the side with the ball has a pretty clear advantage in forcing poor combat positioning on your opponent.

[LCP]

I thought hard about receiving, but seeing that I was probably going to be on the losing side of the bash war I wanted the opportunity to defend against your receiving drive with an untouched team. Kicking also meant that if you scored, I'd get two chances to recover my first-half KOs instead of one.

Kicking is my usual strategy with bashy teams - it lets you dedicate all eleven players to smashing face in the first drive, and then control the pace of the game in the second half, which is really valuable to a slow team like Dwarfs. If I'd known at the start how the game was going to go I might have chosen to receive, but only to try to make it a draw rather than a loss - when I chose to kick I was still thinking about the possibility of a win!

[Wraith]

It's always hard to call a match up between Dwarves and Orcs, as both have such strong bashy games but in different ways; Dwarves tend to ignore getting punched via Block and AV9 all over the place, whereas Orcs bring all the S4 and S5 pieces. Arguably, they mostly balance out.
Everything else being equal, that sort of game usually comes down to the whims of the dice - whoever gets a few good rolls first, gains the advantage that might result in a touchdown. If no one gets those rolls, or not quite enough of them, you get to spend a lot of time basking in slow, thoughtful 0-0 scorelines. :smalltongue:

For what it's worth, I don't think that Luzahn was wrong to Kick - against a fast Elfy team it would often be suicide, but since Orcs probably won't be scoring a 2 turn touchdown without some tremendous serendipity it's not necessarily a bad play to rely on your skills to soak up the first turn of punches and from there let your opponent be the one to worry about keeping an eye on the clock.
I, however, prefer to Receive against Bashy teams if given the choice because sometimes that first turn can result in carnage that turns the entire game. The dice don't remember the last result, and they certainly don't care how many players they have or haven't killed so far - they will roll boxcars just as often in the first turn of the game as they will in the last of the game.
In which case, it's better to hope that they will show up for me before they do for my opponent. Why give Nuffle the chance to strike you down four times (3 Blocks on the LoS and a Blitz) when, worst case scenario, you Dub-Skulls on your first roll and have only one player fall over? You haven't lost anything, but you have so much more to gain by being the aggressor, not the victim. Hell, if nothing else and I get no POW's then I probably still Push back the three guys on the LoS so that they're not in base contact - that's three Blocks that I'm not going to get coming back in my opponents' turn

I certainly appreciate why you enjoy having the turn advantage in the second half, but I still believe that the dice are fiercely independent of such things and even Dwarves won't get far into the opposing team's half of the pitch if they've been mauled badly enough by fate and chance.
Getting that first touchdown while you are DEFINITELY starting with 11 players makes it easier for you, and it forces your opponent to have to work extra hard - THEY have to score 2 touchdowns to win, and they have to do so after you 'got the jump on them' by attacking first in the first half, hopefully having injured them in the process. And if you didn't.... Well, now you're a touchdown ahead anyway, so you can still afford to play the long game.

As I said, I'm certainly not trying to explain "why you did it wrong" or anything so arrogant. I just wants to share my observations, which roughly boil down to "It's much easier to succeed when actively doing something, than it is to let your opponent do it and hope s/he fails". When you're the active team you have rerolls to help you do better, for example - there's no equivalent way to make it harder for your opponent, so while they're active then success and failure are (at least mostly, ignoring things like Side Step and Pass Block just for the moment) out of your hands until it's your turn again.
As with all things in Blood Bowl, it's playing the percentages; do all the easy things first and accomplish as much as you can per turn before you do something difficult and potentially turnover. Trying to stop a Black Orc cage when several of your guys have been Knocked Down/Stunned/KO'd/Maimed is more difficult than having a go at stopping them from forming a cage in the first place, kinda thing. :smallsmile:

[Maethirion]

On a separate note, last night I watched the Rookie league game of Throwers and Throwaways versus the Smashers of Sotek. Holy crap, that was a lot of ones!
In fact, in the second half, i'm pretty sure that at one point Shishnarfne was completely out of Snotlings and down to just his Ogres.... All of whom Bone Head'd at the same time, then the Smashers' Kroxigor Bone Head'd as well, and then two more Ogres did it again! :smallconfused:

Frankly, how the Ogres managed to fight off half a Lizardman team with only 2 players left me amazed. Well done, to everyone involved!

That did indeed happen. We were both a bit incredulous by that point. We reached a point in the second half where neither of us could actually pick up the ball, given that it was raining, I had more players, but they were all ag1, so could only pick it up on a six. Was a bit clowny, but a lot of fun. Shishnarfe played extremely well, especially considering the deficit of snotlings.

[Wraith]

Thufir, I'm going to be around for the rest of the day - feel free to grab me for our Legacy League match when you're ready.

[Tasroth]

And since that game has now been played and validated, the week has been advanced.

Legacy League Week 7 Fixtures

Blood Bowl Club Mirka (Brother Oni) vs. Meddling Insects (Shishnarfne)
Dwarf Adjectives (Qwaz) vs. Tasroth's Dark Stars (Tasroth)
The Ironbeards (Wraith) vs. Dokkalfar Daggers (Luzahn)
The Murderhobos (SaruSama) vs. The Adrasteia (Thufir)

[Thufir]

Frustrating. In retrospect, had I on turn 12 (when fairly clear away from the Dwarfs) left tackle zones on the two Dwarfs closest to my ball-carrier, he probably wouldn't have gotten blitzed, and I could've just kept running away to score happily on turn 14. Now a 3-turn TD to equalise certainly isn't out of the question for Dwarfs, but against Nurgle, while outnumbered, I wouldn't put money on it. I didn't need to worry about freeing up additional players to support further clock-running.

[Wraith]

I have to admit, while I enjoyed the challenge of such a good coach behind a team that at least matches mine in stubborn, refuse-to-leave-the-pitch players, I'm very disappointed with how I played.

Your touchdown felt like amateur hour on my part. I simply didn't expect your Beastman to make the Dodge into a Blitz, freeing up the guy who went on to score. I could certainly have done more to inconvenience your Thrower too, rather than just looking at him funny and hoping for AG3 to do it's not-AG4 thing. That's what I get for type-casting Nurgle as the slow team, despite their Beastmen and AG3 Rotters....
Not to mention kicking myself when the second half began - I was so intent on keeping your Beast occupied with a tough roadblock, I moved a crucial Guard-Blocker in front of him and replaced him with my Runner, thus leaving a crucial weakness on the LoS that meant you still had 2 dice blocks on everyone, instead of 1 dice or 2-dice against.
Had I done that properly, it might have changed the whole outcome of the half instead of giving you a bunch of free targets to beat on....

Oh, well. As the saying goes, "I'll get you next time, Gadget!" :smallwink: Thanks for the game.

[Unpronounceable]

Pair of matches played:

Main League:

Boneheads 1-1 Barovia World Tour: The definition of a hard fought draw, Vampires won the toss and kicked, got a blitz and judicious use of hypnotic gaze gave them an easy turn 2 touchdown. The boneheads recovered and ran in a turn 8 equalizer.

Second half descended into a violent brawl in the center of the pitch. The vampires, after being abstemious for the first half, were ravenous in the second which slowed them down and allowed the undead to get stuck in. A Ghoul managed to get the ball and make a last minute run for the touchline to give the undead the win but was brought down by Count S von Z
Rookie League:

Okami ye Faithful 2-0 Wymblidon Warpstoners.

The undead won the toss and decided to kick, things looked promising for the underworld at first and their cage made it most of the way down the pitch before getting bogged down and the poor goblin ball carrier getting stamped on by a flesh golem. A Ghoul picked up the ball and made a break for it and then had a free run as the mercenary goblin fell over GFI'd to provide an assist giving the undead a 1-0 lead at half time.

Second half was quite grim for the Warpstoners as they were down 4 players which soon became 6. There was a brief glimmer of hope when a goblin took down the wight ball carrier with a 2-dAgainst block and recovered the ball but he was soon taken down and the undead made it 2-0.

Any chance for a consolation touch down was dashed when the troll, after concentrating admirably all game, decided to stare off into space instead of throwing his team mate.

Thanks for the games both of you.

[Brother Oni]

Thufir, I'm not sure where you disappeared to after your game with Wraith (or why you didn't reply to my messages), but I can't wait around any longer for you tonight.

[Thufir]

Thufir, I'm not sure where you disappeared to after your game with Wraith (or why you didn't reply to my messages), but I can't wait around any longer for you tonight.

... :smallconfused:
We agreed to play in the evening. I went afk for a bit after the match, but in any case I didn't have enough time to play another match before going out for my final performance of Pirates (which was earlier than the weekday ones) - that being why we agreed to play in the evening.

[Brother Oni]

... :smallconfused:
We agreed to play in the evening. I went afk for a bit after the match, but in any case I didn't have enough time to play another match before going out for my final performance of Pirates (which was earlier than the weekday ones) - that being why we agreed to play in the evening.

Unless my clock is broken, 7:30pm is in the evening. Perhaps it might have been more fruitful for both of us for you to mention what times you would have been available this evening?

[Qwaz]

Well, why don't you both agree a time you can make tomorrow?

[Brother Oni]

Euphonic Cadence 4 : Spartak's Blud Bowl Klub 1

Nuffle took an instant dislike to me from turn 1, from my troll failing a 2+ Really Stupid roll, to the riot that gave me a turn less to beat up his players (not that it mattered as in standard form for this season, the orcs suffered the only injuries of the match), to the goblin bombardier star player mis-throwing his bomb, injuring himself and stunning a Black Orc while he was at it,

After that it was simple elfbowl, from one dice blocks going Thufir's way, to my two dice blocks failing to achieve anything, and a thrown rock adding to the orc misery.

Only two pieces of luck went the orcs' way - a KO'd elf went off and stayed off the whole game and a pitch invasion that knocked over only elves (although it was rather pointless on turn 14 and 4:1 down). However a chance to score another orc touchdown went pearshaped as I discovered Throw Teammate counts as a throw, so the troll and gobbo with the ball sat in the middle of a bunch of stunned elves looking rather sheepish until the elves stood up next turn and only a lucky ball scatter to a stood up elf stopped the scoreline being 5:1.

I'm finding elves to be incredibly frustrating to play against. I've read all the guides I can find, but I need (and want) to practice more - is the only option to play hotseat against myself?

[Qwaz]

I'd advise open league. I got dark elves there.

[Brother Oni]

I'd advise open league. I got dark elves there.

Cool. Is it all right if I bug you for a game the next time I see you on?

[Wraith]

I've been thinking of looking more closely at High Elves lately, I might drop them into the Open League soon. You're welcome to take a crack at them, when I do.

I have reasonably new-ish Wood Elves in Auld World also - if you don't mind rolling up a new team or signing one up in there for a while, I'm happy to play with them too.

[Silfir]

I've got some high elves in the Open League, too.

[Qwaz]

Cool. Is it all right if I bug you for a game the next time I see you on?

Yeah. Not a problem. If im free im all yours.

EDIT
Oh and super speedy rate of match play continues...Team Hippy 2 - 0 Imperial Space Corps

The first half was a mess. After finally recovering the ball from Luzahn's cage; I attempt to pass to a catcher to run it out of reach only to be intercepted and the whole mess to start back up again!
Both big guys scored casualties late on in the second half but nothing permanent stuck on either side.

[LCP]

Wow, new round already?

Tasroth, let me know when you're available for our match

[Tasroth]

Wow, new round already?

Tasroth, let me know when you're available for our match

I'm free most afternoons/evening, so I can try to catch you on steam. Sometime this evening would be possible if you're available. Otherwise, whatever day works for you this coming week, I can be pretty flexible.

[LCP]

Might be around this evening - will see if I can catch you.

[Brother Oni]

Shishnarfne, I'm playing you in the Legacy League and Devmarr, you in the Rookie League. When would be a good time for both of you?

I'm available evenings BST and most times on the weekends.

[Unpronounceable]

Gnoman, I've added you on steam, when is good for our game?

I'm not sure what time zone you're on but I'm off work all week so can stay up late/get up early as needed, I'll be around mon-thursday but away fri-sunday

[Devmaar]

Shishnarfne, I'm playing you in the Legacy League and Devmarr, you in the Rookie League. When would be a good time for both of you?

I'm available evenings BST and most times on the weekends.

This post made me think I'd dreamed an entire Blood Bowl match including reaction posts in this thread :smalltongue:

I can do our Standard League match around 11.30 tonight, if that's too late for you, we'll probably have to wait until Thursday evening

[Brother Oni]

This post made me think I'd dreamed an entire Blood Bowl match including reaction posts in this thread :smalltongue:

I can do our Standard League match around 11.30 tonight, if that's too late for you, we'll probably have to wait until Thursday evening

Let's try for tonight then.

[Neon Knight]

Ivellius, we've still got our game in the Rookie League. When are you available?

Wraith, it is time for the Norse to take on Nurgle. When are you available?

[LCP]

Rampagers vs. Angels is kicking off now.

[LCP]

Ruinous Rampagers 1 - 3 Bloody-Handed Angels. A string of bad rolls in the first half (repeated double skulls and failed Sure Hands/rerolled pickups) let the Angels pick up a 2-0 lead, and so the Rampagers were well and truly elfed. The only consolation was that in the second half the lads pulled their collective finger out and started steadily sending elves to the hospital/morgue, with a little assistance from the crowd.

Thanks for the game, Tasroth.

[Brother Oni]

The Meddling Insects vs BC Mirka is set for Monday evening BST. Yay, more elves. :smallsigh:

[Tasroth]

Yeah, it was a bloody affair. First half felt fine, one of my players Badly Hurting himself by failing a dodge (it happens, move on), and Elrael (technically Elrael Mk. 2, purchased for this game after the original died last season) getting killed (not even worth the apothecary that early).

Then the second half. Or more accurately, the last 3 turns. The final drive began with a thrown rock at Taraniel. My apothecary proved himself useless again, so I left it at dead (-ST might as well be dead). This was immediately followed by a -ST on Kalriel (again, Mk. 2). So another player who needs to be fired (which I have done, and he got the MVP for his first SPPs dang it). This was followed by 2 MNG results before the match ended.

So yeah, I had a 14 player roster (granted with 2 players missing that game). Now I have an 11 player roster with 2 players missing the next game, and exactly 10k too little to replace my departed blitzer. And I have Euphonic Cadence next. Things just got... interesting.

[Devmaar]

The Stabbery vs Spartak's Blood Bowl Klub about to go, the number Luzahn did on my team leaves us with equal tv and 1 mercenary Elf...

3-1
The match could be adequately summarised as "The Stabbery have 2 AG 5 Witch Elves" with the footnote that Cyanide forced Brother Oni to use a goblin on every drive, despite having subs available

[Brother Oni]

The Stabbery vs Spartak's Blood Bowl Klub about to go, the number Luzahn did on my team leaves us with equal tv and 1 mercenary Elf...

Which didn't matter at all, with the appalling dice and the interface which refused to let me substitute my goblin off the pitch for every set up.

Stabbery 3: SBK 1

With the absolutely insane dodging the elves did (triple dodges in a row, -2, -1, 0), tackle zones were pretty much pointless, letting a witch elf get hold of the gobbo (which should have been a linesorc) which forced an equally silly push->throw->hand off chain for a touchdown.

The final drive was 7-11 in favour of the orcs and still the elves managed to get through and score. If anybody watched that match, any advice for me, aside from uninstalling the game?


The match could be adequately summarised as "The Stabbery have 2 AG 5 Witch Elves" with the footnote that Cyanide forced Brother Oni to use a goblin on every drive, despite having subs available

The goblin very nearly came in useful, if he had hit the witch elf either time he got thrown. :smalltongue:
Edit: Huh. Throw Team Mate apparently can't cause turnovers unless the throwee has the ball and doesn't land properly. That would have been useful to know - I could have thrown him at the cage earlier and blitzed the witch elf if he nailed a corner. You learn something new every day.

Edit 2: Forgot to report on Wraith's Ex-Men vs The 8 Handed Slayers in the Open League. 1:0 to the Ex-Men (should have been at least 3) and well, yeah. Rookie no skill Khorne vs Amazons went as well as you'd expect.

[Wraith]

Wraith, it is time for the Norse to take on Nurgle. When are you available?

I expect that I will be free all of Monday afternoon and early evening (until 9pm) GMT, and then again Thursday and Friday afternoon/evening. After that I will have to make a specific appointment to get up for next week, so just let me know what suites you.

Same to you Luzahn - the Daggers have a date with the Ironbeards for, if I remember correctly, the first time. :smallsmile:

I would also like to ask the Playground about my impending game in the Rookie League against Clarkson, who I know has had problems with his internet as of late.
I won't beat about the bush; Steam says that he hasn't been online for about a week now, and I want to make sure that I am acting appropriately if his absence continues. By the rules that I've laid down so far, him missing the game without in some way confirming that he has technical difficulties would constitute a forfeit: 2-0 in my favour.

I am, I hope understandably, feeling awkward about being the League Commissioner and at the same time potentially ruling games in my own favour - especially since I ruled his last game as a 0-0 draw, due to having not been contacted by either coach.
It might not happen. He might pop back in tomorrow, throw down the gauntlet and proceed to feed my Witch Elf directly to my own Blitzers with fries and a tasteful tray of coffee and chocolates for afters in horrendous display of curbstompetry. But if not, I would like to hear the opinions of my fellow "Rookies" to make sure that no one feels I am taking unfair advantage of the situation.

[Manticoran]

Since all previous ones have been ruled as 0-0 draws, I'd prefer this one follow the same rule. I made multiple attempts to try to get ahold of him, and was unable to, and it was set as a 0-0.

[Neon Knight]

I expect that I will be free all of Monday afternoon and early evening (until 9pm) GMT, and then again Thursday and Friday afternoon/evening. After that I will have to make a specific appointment to get up for next week, so just let me know what suites you.



I should be around on Monday, so if you see me online on Steam, just give me a poke and I can play our game.

___

As for the other situation, I think it should be scored as a 0-0.

[LCP]

We've always done the 2-0 thing in the past - it makes sense to me that if one player doesn't attempt to make contact, they should forfeit the game.

[Qwaz]

Since all previous ones have been ruled as 0-0 draws, I'd prefer this one follow the same rule. I made multiple attempts to try to get ahold of him, and was unable to, and it was set as a 0-0.


We've always done the 2-0 thing in the past - it makes sense to me that if one player doesn't attempt to make contact, they should forfeit the game.

Agree with LCP.

This was discussed in detail in the last thread. 0-0 if both parties can't make it to the game but both are trying. Full 2-0 forfeit, with both mvps & winnings if only one is trying or able to make the game.
I know it's a bit rough if someone's got internet problems...etc but if I was in the position of having the problems I would expect to be forfeiting my games. Honestly the loss of a BB game is likely the least of my worries if Im having such problems that I cant find time for a game in two weeks.

To do any less encourages people to runn and hide from potentially difficult/dangerous games.

As far as I can remmeber the previous 0-0 draws in the rookie league have been from time expiring with no word from either party on the state of play????
I don't think there have been any no shows in the others so far have there?

[LCP]

Manticoran's case is a little exceptional IIRC, in that they were both posting in the thread trying to get hold of their opponents, but Clarkson thought he was playing someone else.

[Silfir]

Clarkson's had two 0-0s in a row, though as far as the match against Ivellius goes both sides were MIA (or was the match actually played? Neither player posted anything), and in the case of his match against Manticoran he did post in the thread, as LCP said, stating he had confused Manticoran with Maethirion. (Which is not completely implausible.) The match didn't seem to come to pass after that - certainly Manticoran didn't post again before the deadline. (We can really only go by what goes on in the forum.) So I don't think it was unfair, from Wraith's perspective, to give him the benefit of doubt for that one. Part of the point of giving people the benefit of doubt is that you don't have to keep giving it, though.

That result would be mildly unfair for Manticoran, but no one appears to have cried any amount of tears for the two amazons who died in my hard-fought 1-0 against the Darkworlders last season (in which I only walked away with the MVP), who then proceeded to grant 2-0 forfeits (with two touchdowns and two MVPs worth of SPP) to two thirds of the league, so I think it's within limits. There are no truly fair solutions to a coach's absence - the only fair result is if all matches are actually played out. The thankless task of the league commissioner (or his deputy) is to choose the least worst option.

With all that said, this would be an opportune time to hear from Clarkson again. Or Ivellius.

[Manticoran]

Barring that, we could also consider looking for a replacement, which is usually not that hard.

[Brother Oni]

Barring that, we could also consider looking for a replacement, which is usually not that hard.

I don't think the Cyanide interface will let you swap a team out during an already running league - you'll have to abort the league first.

[Wraith]

I made multiple attempts to try to get ahold of him, and was unable to, and it was set as a 0-0.

I wish to make the process of running the league as transparent as possible, so firstly I apologise if you feel that you feel hard done to, if that is the case.
However, as a couple of people have pointed out, whatever troubles you had getting in touch with your opponent you didn't directly tell me that was the case. Had I known then I could have mediated or, if necessary, ruled a forfeit. As it stands.... I just update the tables and occasionally click the "Validate" button, I'm not in a position to constantly monitor the Steam and Forum traffic of everyone involve in the League, y'know?

With that in mind,this is a formal reminder to everyone in the Rookie League - if you're having trouble tracking down an opponent, then please just let myself or Silfir know through Steam or Forum PM's. We don't bite, and we're happy to help out as best we can. Otherwise, we kinda have to make a guess and hope for the best! :smallsmile:


As for the other situation, I think it should be scored as a 0-0.

Noted.


As far as I can remmeber the previous 0-0 draws in the rookie league have been from time expiring with no word from either party on the state of play????
I don't think there have been any no shows in the others so far have there?

Correct. And this is why I am asking now - I'm definitely here, able to play and respond, but I don't know what Clarkson's situation is. Don't get me wrong, if he can let me know his Internet is crapped out then we all know it's definitely not his fault and 0-0 is appropriate. If not, I kinda need to work out where to draw the line between "absent for a game" and "probably not coming back" not just for me but for the games that he might be missing thereafter.


I don't think the Cyanide interface will let you swap a team out during an already running league - you'll have to abort the league first.

Sadly, correct.

======

Okay, so there's opposition on both sides - I genuinely appreciate the input from everyone so far, so thank you very much.

As it stands, I'm inclined to follow the course of action that I wait until the end-of-day deadline and hope to play Clarkson before that occurs.
If that proves impossible I will rule my game as a draw because, though I don't want to sound arrogant, I think that my team is in strong enough position to come back from a draw and it would would also leave both teams in roughly the same position that they are now (currently vying for 'about' 3rd place) without giving either of us any particular advantage over those other teams that are creeping up in 4th and 5th.
After that though... Well, missing two games in a row would be very unfortunate, but a third would have to count as a forfeit, if that's what it came to.

Am I approaching a reasonable resolution? Is there anything else that should be taken into account? Again, please talk to either Commissioner if there's something you'd like to see happen and we'll do our best to work it out. :smallsmile:

[Manticoran]

I don't think the Cyanide interface will let you swap a team out during an already running league - you'll have to abort the league first.

99.99% this is wrong, considering that we do it in the Big Crunch on a fairly regular basis. Now, that's not to say I know HOW they do it, but they do.

[Qwertystop]

So, LeSwordfish: Weekdays will presumably still not work. Does this Sunday work?
Alternately, Friday I'm available a few hours sooner.

[Silfir]

Well, this would be already Clarkson's third missing game in a row - if indeed the 0-0 you put for him against Ivellius was one with both players absent.

I think it's right to file this under "conflict of interest", which means you're only a player in this context, and as a player you absolutely have the right not to insist on the 2-0 forfeit and accept a 0-0 draw instead. (Provided Clarkson doesn't show up and offer a reasonable playing time for a match.)



Also, one of the commissioners of the Big Crunch just got back to me on the site chat, and it looks like we haven't been looking closely enough:



Silfir: I have a quick question about the Cyanide client
Silfir: Is it possible to replace a team mid-season?
TravelScrabble: Yes
TravelScrabble: You just boot the team and accept the replacement the rest is automatic
TravelScrabble: However, don't try to replace two teams at once that gets messy
TravelScrabble: Best way is usually to wait until the new team applies so that you can boot the old one and accept the new one right away

EDIT: Addendum:

TravelScrabble: No problem, I forgot to mention the reason its best to wait until the new team has applied is this: if you boot one team and have nobody to replace them for a couple of days and then another team also leaves the league (accidentally or on purpose) the league will become a mess



Which means we could totally have replaced the Darkworlders midway through last season. It's an option on the table - but obviously it's still much preferable to have Clarkson finish the league properly, if he can at all make it happen!

It's an important thing to consider for any lurkers that might still be hanging about the place - if you wouldn't mind filling in for a coach who has to drop out (or goes MIA), make yourselves known so we know who to turn to!

[LeSwordfish]

So, LeSwordfish: Weekdays will presumably still not work. Does this Sunday work?
Alternately, Friday I'm available a few hours sooner.

Friday sounds great for me. I'll add you on steam - just drop me a line as soon as you're around.

[Neon Knight]

Hammersjurg Destroyers 1 - 0 99 Ways to Die.

Wraith to chose to receive, and started moving the ball forward in a fairly standard fashion. I managed to sneak in a blitz from the rear with a Pestigor and knocked it lose, and from there the drive descended into a fair amount of chaos, with both sides picking up the ball and then losing it again and again. The ball meandered over to the left side of the pitch where it was eventually knocked off the sideline and throw onto the other-side of the pitch, where both sides had few pieces. A Pestigor and Berserker started struggling for the ball, ending in the Norse's favor when the Pestigor double skulled on a blitz to get the Zerker away from the ball. The Norse got the ball down the pitch a bit further before it came loose once more. With one Norse turn left to score ahead of them, a Nurgle Warrior tried to blitz a norseman off the ball and bring his Disturbing Presence into play; he failed the GFI, and then the Norse made the handoff despite Disturbing Presence and ran it in to score in their last turn. The Nurgle's last turn of the half was uneventful save for a failed vanity pass.

On the Nurgle's offensive drive, the weight of Kick was felt by a deep landing for the ball. The Nurgle began blocking and taking up positions as a Pestigor trundled into the backfield for the pickup, killing a lineman who is now a Nurgle Rotter and the team's latest addition. From there, though, the half went poorly as a Pestigor and Nurgle Warrior ended up surfed off the right side of the pitch as the cage formed up on the left side. Now outnumbered by the Norse, the cage was flattened against the sideline and further casualties including KO'ed Nurgle Warriors made the Nurgle situation desperate. Eventually the ball carrier was also surfed as he was horribly outnumbered, and the ball scattered to the Norse goal line. Although they got the ball up the pitch thanks to some pass play from their resident Elfzerker, a handoff failed and set the score at 0-1 while what felt like the entire Norse team barely succeeded in pushing over Old Age, Beast of Nurgle, by pouring all their blocks on him.

Well played to Wraith. That first half was really close and tense. The second half really went south for me after you committed to the right with assists and your blitz to get the surf, but the deep kick combined with slow Nurgle vs. speedy Norse movement made it work and then I was outnumbered, outGuard'ed, and eventually outblocked.

[Brother Oni]

Meddling Insects 5 : BC Mirka 0

Scoreline says it all, I think.

[Qwaz]

5/7 Games played in the standard league already and the week was only advanced a couple of days ago....no messing around for you guys! :smallbiggrin:

[Qwaz]

If anybody watched that match, any advice for me, aside from uninstalling the game?

I wasnt watching the game but i've heard you voice problems with elves quite a bit and apart from playing against them more which we talked about before It might be worth rolling an elf team (pick your favourite flavour) and put it in the the Open league (advantage that it's us you're playing against) or the Naggaroth open league (Advantage of nearly always being able to find a match).
Finding what you like to do as an elf team , or what you find frustrating as an elf team should help you play against one :smallsmile:

[Brother Oni]

I wasnt watching the game but i've heard you voice problems with elves quite a bit and apart from playing against them more which we talked about before It might be worth rolling an elf team (pick your favourite flavour) and put it in the the Open league (advantage that it's us you're playing against) or the Naggaroth open league (Advantage of nearly always being able to find a match).
Finding what you like to do as an elf team , or what you find frustrating as an elf team should help you play against one :smallsmile:

I think the 5-0 pasting has pretty much sealed my fate of being forced to play elves to figure out how they work (Shishnarfne managed to steal the ball off my player while in a cage and return it 24 squares for a touchdown on his final turn :smallsigh:).

On the plus side, it was my first game in 3 matches where the interface didn't screw up on me. On the down side, I was 2-0 down on turn 3, despite receiving at the start of the match (Shishnarfne mentioned that a Blitz was a free touchdown for Wood Elves and I'm inclined to agree).

Edit: Periodic Players has now applied for the Open League.

[Silfir]

How do you usually set up against elves?

[Brother Oni]

How do you usually set up against elves?

Typical staggered zig zag:



O


O



X
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O



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X

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X




That said, I don't usually set up like this if I'm receiving, hence that technical 1 turn TD off a Blitz being my fault.

Shishnarfne also suggested a wide spread for the three LOS players against an opposing Big Guy (ie with space inbetween them), with my own Big Guy with Guard in the middle.

Part of the reason I'm having trouble is the conflicting advice I'm getting - if I put pressure on the enemy team, they sneak through, steal the ball and score (Thufir and Devmaar demonstrated that). However if I cage up and don't put pressure on them, they out manoeuvre and shut my cage down, knock the ball loose, steal it and score then (Shishnarfne).

I've been watching cknoor's videos on various people's suggestions and his style of play is so alien to me. I can see why he plays the way he does (and it obviously works), but I'm still working on translating that to an anti-elf defence.

[Silfir]

That setup seems... not exactly optimal. The outermost players can be blitzed inward to create free space for receivers to run through, but it's close to the sideline, may necessitate a 1-d block, and doesn't offer that much free movement into your backfield. But it looks like it wouldn't be terribly hard to block the leftmost or rightmost player on your LOS, blitz another, and run players through the middle.

How about this instead?

http://bbtactics.com/images/defense.jpg

This is lifted straight from How to Beat Elves (http://bbtactics.com/how-to-beat-elves/). Which I think you might want to read again, even if you have already, and talk about specific parts that you have trouble with - whether the article doesn't go deep enough or, in your opinion, is plain mistaken, or in what ways it doesn't cover the issues you've been having. I felt that the article managed to more or less prepare me for the abject horror that is playing against elves, but of course every coach is different.

That said, I wouldn't necessarily use anti-agility defense setups on offense just because of Blitz. Every time Blitz isn't rolled, you want to be in position to punch those puny line elves in the face with enough players to make three knockdowns (hopefully leading to KOs or casualties) happen. The rest of your players should still cover the halfway line such that a blitz or dodges are needed for a Blitz to work. (Note that a Blitz really only works out to become a "100%" touchdown if not just one, but five elves run around your lines to form a cage around the one elf who is set to catch the ball. A singular Wardancer should not be able to win the defensive TD outright.)

Note that if the elves kick short against a slow, grindy bash team, in hopes of rolling Blitz!, they're typically shooting themselves in the foot in the 10/11(?) cases they don't roll it. The purpose of the early-taken Kick skill on an elven team against the bash sides is to kick deep to pull the play apart, to force the bash team to rush backwards to protect the ballcarrier and make their path to the endzone so long that a stall might keep them from getting there at all. Kicking short is the YOLO approach - suitable for if the elves have decided on an "everyone against the cage, all the time" strategy for their defense anyway. Which is technically not a bad thing for you.

The trouble, as you've noticed, is that that approach is hell to defend against. In theory, if you position well, the "get that ball" approach should make it more likely for the elves to get their heads smashed in with failed dodges or getting punched in the face by the players they're marking or trying to trip up. But in practice, if you leave the slightest (and I mean the slightest) opening, an elven coach will pounce on it and your chances of winning are basically extinguished. The second slip-up loses the match. It's not even that the elf coach has the easier task; it's that he gets a couple of chances to cause you problems and you only have to slip up on your positioning once, and the slip-ups very rarely even look like they are slip-ups. And sometimes, you don't make a slip-up at all and succumb to straight-up elf hax. That's what makes playing against elves so supremely frustrating - you can't make a mistake, but the elves can. And mistakes in positioning are easy to make and hard to find and stamp out.





One thing I have noticed in the Spartans of Khorne v Okami Ye Faithful match is that you often put players in contact for no apparent purpose but to have a player in contact. (I.e. not to provide an assist.) This is generally a bad idea. It can be a good idea, too, but not for the simple reason "I'm the bashy team, so I'm looking for a fight". You do, but you want a fight on your terms, whenever you can get it. If the elven team is dead-set on getting the ball broken out of your cage, they need to get in contact themselves, and you can exploit that ruthlessly. If they play a disciplined elf stall, you do want to get some players into contact, but never the cage corners, and you should try to do it in such a way that the amount of 2d-for blocks you allow is minimized. ("How to Advance" in the article I linked above can explain this better than I can.) (If you give an elf team - or any team - a lot of beneficial blocks for free, they can overpower you even if you're playing the big bad orcs.)

Lastly, it might help if you provide some of the replays of recent anti-elf failures.

[Ivellius]

I'm actually here! Played CrookedVulture (not sure if that's his name on here or not) and his exquisitely named rats.

Just kinda forgot, honestly, and haven't been around for the new thread. But whoever I was supposed to play last week never contacted me, either, so...I dunno. I'm around, though.

And it has been answered, but you can absolutely replace teams mid-season. The League might initially look wonky but it'll eventually sort itself out (I found this out a few months ago).

[Brother Oni]

Yay, found another bug. Multiple Block and Stab on the ball carrier is not a good idea as the game locks up after determining the ball scatter. :smallsigh:


That setup seems... not exactly optimal. The outermost players can be blitzed inward to create free space for receivers to run through, but it's close to the sideline, may necessitate a 1-d block, and doesn't offer that much free movement into your backfield. But it looks like it wouldn't be terribly hard to block the leftmost or rightmost player on your LOS, blitz another, and run players through the middle.

How about this instead?


http://bbtactics.com/images/defense.jpg



While I acknowledge the weakness in the centre, it's why I usually put a big guy with Guard front and centre. Your perceived weakness of the outermost players being blitzed in also exists in your proposed remedy (which I recognise from the BB Tactics anti-elf page), hence why he's usually a ST4 piece or the player in front of him has Guard.

Can I ask your opinion on this set up which I've seen occasionally? I'm not 100% sure I've got it right though:



O

O
O
O
O
O
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The trouble, as you've noticed, is that that approach is hell to defend against. In theory, if you position well, the "get that ball" approach should make it more likely for the elves to get their heads smashed in with failed dodges or getting punched in the face by the players they're marking or trying to trip up.

In my experience, punching elves requires luck with the dice, something that I've had very little of this season.



One thing I have noticed in the Spartans of Khorne v Okami Ye Faithful match is that you often put players in contact for no apparent purpose but to have a player in contact. (I.e. not to provide an assist.) This is generally a bad idea.

I thought this was called marking? If it's not, then how do I mark players?


Lastly, it might help if you provide some of the replays of recent anti-elf failures.

If you like (Dropbox links):

SBK versus Euphonic Cadence (https://www.dropbox.com/s/zy1rfrgpjm9lzmp/SBK%20VS%20EC.db?dl=0)
SBK versus Leapers of Loren (https://www.dropbox.com/s/bz2jaayhk49kkt6/SBK%20VS%20Leapers.db?dl=0)
SBK versus Team Stabbery (https://www.dropbox.com/s/uhaxx966n6bxhau/SBK%20VS%20Team%20Stab.db?dl=0)
SBK versus Team Hippy (https://www.dropbox.com/s/hbu47mi6lywf45w/SBK%20VS%20THI.db?dl=0)

I can't vouch for quality of play as the game goes on due to frustration issues or just plain giving up.

[Neon Knight]

Something Ratten in Denmark 1 - 1 Papa N's Storytime Crew.

The first drive started with the Nurgle team choosing to receive. A deep kick put the ball near the sideline, and the Nurgle team, after some blocking (including Badly Hurting a Linerat on the LoS,) the pickup failed and the ball bounced off the sideline. The Nurgle team got a break, though, when it was thrown in on their goal line. The Rats rushed down the pitch and set up a screen; 8 turns of screening and back and attempted breakthroughs followed. Numerous times the ball carrier was blitzed by Rat pieces (admittedly often by a Wrestle Gutter Runner throwing 2 die against) and emerged unscathed. While the Nurgle team did advance the ball down the pitch, the half ended with the score at 0-0.

In the second half, the Rats snatched the ball with their thrower after it landed deep on their goal line and Blitzed down the left side. The Nurgle collapsed onto the left side and almost pinned the Rats against the sideline, but the Rats broke out the rear and ran like hell for the right side. Only a lone Pestigor could keep up with the Gutter Runner, and his Blitz didn't manage to knock the Side-Stepping Gutter Runner down. The Runner dodged in a touchdown the next turn, roughly 3-4 turns into the half.

5-4 turns is somewhat tight timing for a non-agility team touchdown, but the Nurgle pressed forward as the Rats screened. First a push on the left side of the field was fended off, but a quick handoff saw the ball switch to the center of the pitch. The ballcarrier was open, however, and the Guard Gutter Runner helped my Blodge Gutter Runner get a 1 die block against the no skills ballcarrier. Push rerolled into Push. Nuts. Next turn, a pair of Pow results knocking down both the Blodge and the Dodge Gutter Runners, and a single GFI made to run in and score the tie.

My opponent commented on turn 15 that Nuffle really seemed to want a tie, which I certainly agree with. Well played to Ivellius.

[Silfir]

Can I ask your opinion on this set up which I've seen occasionally? I'm not 100% sure I've got it right though:



O

O
O
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Since that setup is only one pushback away from a clear path into the backfield, you probably meant this one:



......XXX......
.X..X.....X..X.
.X..X.....X..X.



In my experience, punching elves requires luck with the dice, something that I've had very little of this season.

Blaming the luck of the dice is an easy thing to jump to - but not helpful if indeed your goal is to learn.

At any rate, the goal isn't even to injure the elves; just to fend them off or push them aside so they can't stop you from scoring on turn 8 (and no turn sooner). Any injuries you do get are the bonus, not the goal.




I thought this was called marking? If it's not, then how do I mark players?

You do it so you get more out of the marking, tactically, than the opponent does - when you can't be easily pushed away or knocked over. Every player you leave in contact at the end of your turn is a player your opponent gets to hit on their own terms. Elves have ST3 and AG4 - if they have the space, it's trivial for them to get 2d-for blocks via assists and fight, and fairly easy to dodge away.

The point I was getting at is that putting players in contact is a bad idea unless you have a specific reason why it isn't.


If you like (Dropbox links):

SBK versus Euphonic Cadence (https://www.dropbox.com/s/zy1rfrgpjm9lzmp/SBK%20VS%20EC.db?dl=0)
SBK versus Leapers of Loren (https://www.dropbox.com/s/bz2jaayhk49kkt6/SBK%20VS%20Leapers.db?dl=0)
SBK versus Team Stabbery (https://www.dropbox.com/s/uhaxx966n6bxhau/SBK%20VS%20Team%20Stab.db?dl=0)
SBK versus Team Hippy (https://www.dropbox.com/s/hbu47mi6lywf45w/SBK%20VS%20THI.db?dl=0)

I can't vouch for quality of play as the game goes on due to frustration issues or just plain giving up.

Which of these games do you feel are closest to your best play against elves?

I've started watching the replay vs. Euphonic Cadence. I'm assuming that's the match where you kept having to field a goblin?

- As tempting as it is when the elves line up super-spreat out as Thufir's do, don't commit so many of your orcs to the LOS that the elves can just run around them. Not just because of a Blitz, but because your dedicated ball carrier - the Thrower - has a fairly big risk of failing a pick-up - 11%.
- If you do line up a lot of orcs, the only point in that would be to pummel the lineelves about horizontally so eventually one of your players succeeds at knocking him down - but on the first block, you chose to push the elf away from the next orc who might have punched him.
- Bomber Dribblesnot has no business being in the lineup when you receive. He has a rather narrow purpose - on defense against the bashier sides that form especially sturdy cages, but are rubbish at handling balls (and by extension, bombs), which might allow you break open one of these cages. (Dwarves, basically.) On defense against elves, he functionally performs like a rookie goblin - actually using his skill has good odds of making it worse.
- There was also no earthly reason I can think of to use Bomber before at least picking up the ball first.
- Instead of pulling back the black orcs so they could help your Thrower form a cage to secure the ball, you deliberately sent them into the fray against elves who outnumbered them; they promptly got knocked over, and you're left without sufficient protection for your ballcarrier, fighting Thufir's monster catchers.
- The last possible salvation was on turn 4, where you might possibly have recovered into a proper cage by dodging away the ballcarrier (and not moving the last mobile black orc into contact); but he was left wide open, and once the ball was scattered and recovered by an elf, you were basically dead in the water.

Second defensive TD followed a similar pattern; you left open space to the sides, left the ball recovery for last, and didn't protect the ballcarrier. (The range on those Catchers is insane - so I do understand they're extremely hard to deal with. But there's nothing else but to do it anyway.) At that point the game was lost.

As for your offence following Thufir's quick score, Thufir's play was pretty generous; you had wide open space to advance on the left, then one turn later one pushback against Phrygian (the bottom one of the lineelves on the right) could have opened up a caging opportunity even further downfield. You went for a direct score instead - which is understandable since you were behind by a lot at that point, so it didn't really matter if Thufir got a fourth touchdown or not.



The main issue in this game was ballcarrier security. There was none. Thufir and Euphonic Cadence are absolutely lethal about exploiting that fact. And it's not that you didn't have an opportunity to secure the ball; you apparently didn't even make it a priority. Lots of players lined up to punch the lineselves, not all of them even got that far.

Another issue is the one I mentioned - your black orcs moved into contact without a clear purpose, when often they would have done a much better job by helping you cage. It's hopeless to chase after elves with black orcs; if they don't want to be caught, they run, and if they outnumber you, they can knock you down. You have to get the ball in the midst, or at least close to the black orcs, where they can perform as cage corners or help the cage advance. If you run them into contact while the ball is not secured, you're just doing the elves' work for them.

Taking a look at Spartak's Blud Bowl Klub's roster, an immediate question jumps to mind: Who carries the ball on your team? If it's the +MA Thrower, why doesn't he have Block?

There are other issues I would have with the roster (five rerolls, an early +AV on a black orc, mostly), but since they're not immediately related to anti-elf playing performance, they're probably outside the scope of what we're talking about. But the lack of a dedicated Block/Sure Hands ballcarrier is a bad sign.

[Brother Oni]

......XXX......
.X..X.....X..X.
.X..X.....X..X.


That's the one.




Blaming the luck of the dice is an easy thing to jump to - but not helpful if indeed your goal is to learn.


If I were solely blaming the luck of the dice, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.



Which of these games do you feel are closest to your best play against elves?

I've started watching the replay vs. Euphonic Cadence. I'm assuming that's the match where you kept having to field a goblin?


I think the Leapers game was my best play - I'll have to watch them again.
It was the Stabbery one where I couldn't sub my goblin off and the AG5 Witch Elves just punished me generally.



- Bomber Dribblesnot has no business being in the lineup when you receive. He has a rather narrow purpose - on defense against the bashier sides that form especially sturdy cages, but are rubbish at handling balls (and by extension, bombs), which might allow you break open one of these cages. (Dwarves, basically.) On defense against elves, he functionally performs like a rookie goblin - actually using his skill has good odds of making it worse.
- There was also no earthly reason I can think of to use Bomber before at least picking up the ball first.


Since I received, I set him up in anticipation of an 8 turn drive up field with him picking off concentrations of elves. I wasn't planning to throw bombs at the elves, but to an empty square next to them, thus they can't intercept it. You've said that I shouldn't blame luck of the dice but it's hard to view the mis-throw and subsequent injury as anything else (even Thufir thought I was a bit Nuffle'd), unless your recommendation was to not to hire him in the first place.

The reason why I tried to throw the bomb first was to see what openings it would create so form my cage up accordingly then move the ball carrier into position. With regard to later on in the match, bear in mind that I basically gave up and didn't bother making ball handler security a priority - it's not as if my TD difference is going to decide any tie breaks this season.

Summary of points:


Be more careful how I mark. Don't give up easy blocks with assists rather than just easy blocks - this includes the ST4 Black Orcs (although I thought Guard would have helped).
Improve ball carrier security - I tried doing that against Shishnarfne (as Humans, game not linked as BC Mirka are a SPP pinata solely so they could run the Legacy League with all the people who wanted to play) and he just enveloped and picked off the cage. Playing as Elves in single player has made me understand how they can sneak through though and how better to force a 2 red dice block or force more dodges.
Need Block on my Thrower - I figured Leader was a better option, but I see that's an error. I guess I should fire both the AV+ Black Orc and thrower and start again with rookies, only this time, build them properly. Hopefully they'll both be in a usable state for the next season.
Always assume an elf will make the dodge. Put a body in the way rather than be in a more aggressive position and only adding a mere -1 to the dodge roll.

[Silfir]

Bomber Dribblesnot is not expected, on average, to have a positive impact on most games, because he's unreliable. He's a decent pick, at best, if you're facing a superior bashing side (of which orcs should not be facing many) and want to crack open their cages to cause havoc, but even that comes at the cost of having an 11th guy on your pitch who can actually fight, like the Block lineorcs, or even a rookie lineorc. If your goal wasn't to crack open cages with him - which is a high-risk, high-reward strategy because it can lead to defensive TDs - but cause injuries, you've shot yourself (literally, in this case) in the foot - having a ST2 guy without Block on the pitch instead of a ST3 Block lineorc doesn't help with that at all, Bombardier or not. He's also worse at protecting your cage, etc. (which is why I was wondering what the goblin was doing on the pitch later - his one job on an Orc team, as far as I can tell, is to get flung into the air for 1TTDs and occasionally eaten.)

(I meant to say outright that he has no place on the pitch at all against elves, yeah. It got lost in a revision.)

I'm not sure if the +AV blorc or the Thrower need outright firing - +AV guy has a useful skill to go with it (and rookies take forever to train), and as long as you put him on the LOS each drive you do get something out of the +AV, too. The +MA Thrower is more or less salvaged once he gets block, and it's not like Leader is necessarily a bad pick - it's just a bad pick in combination with having four regular team rerolls. You could reduce the bloat by cutting two of those instead. (Or one, if you're sure that you have enough use for the fourth reroll. I think very few teams do and orcs are not one of them, but I'm frequently in the minority on this one.)

[Wraith]

(I meant to say outright that he has no place on the pitch at all against elves, yeah. It got lost in a revision.)

I'd say that there's a good argument that he has no place against any team, unless you're playing only for comedic value. Elves outrun him and/or throw his bombs back, whereas high AV teams just murder him or tend to shrug off the hits. Or, just as likely in my experience, catch the bomb and throw it back on AG2 anyway.... :smalltongue:

The art of winning Blood Bowl matches - and it is an art, as science is seldom so irresponsible - comes from minimizing your risks, making as few rolls as statistically safe as possible and letting your opponent work much, much harder than you. Bomber Dribblesnot and, frankly, all Bombardiers are the walking antithesis of these concepts. Save your inducements on something that will help you, like a reroll or perhaps a Looney, instead of something that might help if the moon is full and the stars are correctly aligned.


I'm not sure if the +AV blorc or the Thrower need outright firing - +AV guy has a useful skill to go with it (and rookies take forever to train), and as long as you put him on the LOS each drive you do get something out of the +AV, too.

Keep the Black Orc. He's only 3SPP away from his next level, he'll certainly get that a lot faster than getting a rookie from level 1 to 2, and while not optimal AV10 isn't in anyway bad. Especially since he already has Block - his odds of scoring an injury increase dramatically every time he enters a fight and probably isn't going to hit the floor.


(Or one, if you're sure that you have enough use for the fourth reroll. I think very few teams do and orcs are not one of them, but I'm frequently in the minority on this one.)

Keep the reroll until your Thrower has Block, and then consider dropping it. The last thing you want is to lose one reroll and then immediately have your vulnerable Leader player get maimed or deaded so that you lose another.
Normally I'd agree with Silfir that 3 rerolls is usually sufficient fo an Orc team, but personally I'd want 1 more 'spare' while some of your important pieces - Thrower, Black Orcs - lack Block, and especially if you're going to try to use the Goblin for throwing around in an emergency. It's a bit of a luxury most of the time, but I'd be very glad of it in a tight game.

I have a lot more to say about playing against Elves in general, and a few thoughts about playing as Khorne Daemons in particular (I've been mulling over our Open League game in my downtime at work, it's really proven stimulating from a theoretical coaching standpoint) but broadly speaking I'd just repeat our previous conversation over Steam - the key to beating Elves comes from having a very deliberate plan about how you build your team. Players with Tackle are invaluable, especially at this point in a League with so many well developed Elf teams about, and a scattering of Diving Tackle probably isn't a bad idea too.

It can be dull, but it kinda works.
As much as we make jokes about killing each others' players being the 'real' way to play the game, it only works when the dice are specifically going in your favour. Elves, however, have an abundance of AG4 - which is the most important stat a player can have which wins games directly in the 'traditional' manner - and as such don't need 'lucky' dice to succeed, just 'reasonable' ones. Kill them, and another just-as-agile player takes their place - make them 'worse', not 'fresh', and you stand a better chance.

[Brother Oni]

(which is why I was wondering what the goblin was doing on the pitch later - his one job on an Orc team, as far as I can tell, is to get flung into the air for 1TTDs and occasionally eaten.)

(I meant to say outright that he has no place on the pitch at all against elves, yeah. It got lost in a revision.)


I think my thrower was injured by that point, so I decided to go for a throw with the troll.

He's also useful for just throwing at cages, since anybody he lands on is automatically knocked down and potentially losing a 40TV player is worth the risk for cracking open the cage and a chance to blitz the ball carrier (injuring one of theirs at the same time is just the cherry on the cake). I understand it's risky, but I might as well get some use out of him, especially if he won't sub off again (I definitely didn't want him against Devmaar given my experiences with Thufir the match before but I didn't have much choice).


[Various player advice from Silfir and Wraith]

Yeah, I kinda figured that as much Blackle would be the way to go (plus I don't need doubles to get the skills). I'll see if the team is salvagable by the end of this season.
One question though - at what point do you draw the line between building your team against a play style and building your team to promote your own play style? Khorne Daemons for example - you need as much Guard as possible for the STR3 Frenzy to work, but that means you have to skimp on Tackle at low TVs.



I have a lot more to say about playing against Elves in general, and a few thoughts about playing as Khorne Daemons in particular (I've been mulling over our Open League game in my downtime at work, it's really proven stimulating from a theoretical coaching standpoint) but broadly speaking I'd just repeat our previous conversation over Steam - the key to beating Elves comes from having a very deliberate plan about how you build your team.


I think I found a campaign with Khorne Daemons on Youtube last night (I want to say cknoor, but I looked at a lot of games over the past few days), but any further suggestions would be appreciated.
The general concensus is that Khorne Daemons are not a good team (about par with Vampires and other teams listed as difficult in the LRB), only just above the joke teams like Goblins and Halflings, so as much as I enjoy hitting things, I guess I'll have to put them to one side until my skills improve. :smallfrown:

[Silfir]

There's another thing I noticed while I was thinking this over - I don't think one MA6 guy is enough to pick up the ball with. You don't have to get a second Thrower, but at least one Blitzer (probably the MA7 one) should stay take over the other half of the pitch. This way one of the two (preferably the Thrower) will be able to reach the ball faster and the other can help protect the pick-up or provice a screen.

It's also worth pointing out that I think Thufir's LOS set-up, which is pretty hard on his line-elves because they can be pushed around horizontally with little trouble (as opposed to a tight formation), might be squarely aimed at you doing exactly what you did: Commit a lot of orcs to the LOS and neglect the coverage of the sides and having more than one guy to pick up the ball, who will then get in trouble because Thufir also kicks deep and has his Catchers run around, through or jump over the mass of orcs at the LOS.

So while it's tempting to punch elves in the face on the LOS if they're offered up like that, you should use no more than seven guys, if that. (Use the guys with Tackle ond or Mighty Blow as appropriate to maximize your odds of getting a knockdown) Two others should cover the sides so the fast elves have to make dodge rolls (or blitz) to get past into the backfield (this is where Stand Firm/Side Step comes in handy), and two others should be set up deep to pick up, as mentioned.



Re: goblins being useful for throwing at cages - that's true as far as it goes, but elves built for long-range passing (which pro elves almost invariably are) won't be caging up. This is another example of the high-risk stuff (fielding a ST2 player being high risk) Wraith mentioned that's best to reserve for very specific scenarios, or forget about entirely. (While I think the Bombardier does have a place on a Goblin team, though admittedly mostly to see if you can get Hail Mary Pass for him on a level-up so he is actually useful, I agree orcs should never be desperate enough that Bomber Dribblesnot is the best option left.)

Re: Khorne - With only two team rerolls and almost no one on the team having Block, a 2-2-3 record is nothing to sneeze at in my book.

As for Tackle on Khorne - that's actually not that much of an issue because everyone has Frenzy, which helps you getting Defender Downs or Both Downs instead of Stumbles. All the more reason why a Khorne team's competence goes up massively once you have lots of Block on the Frenzy players.

Re: Building teams - You do want stuff that's universally useful and is part of the team plan. You want a ball carrier with Block, Sure Hands and ideally Dodge, because that's important and useful to have against pretty much everyone, especially later in the game, when almost every team has picked up Strip Ball on someone. That's why I jumped on that as the central issue I saw in your team roster. (I played two matches back-to-back against Imperial Space Corps with Measured Response. I almost lost the first 2-1 and I won the second 1-0 with relatively little difficulty. Only skill-up inbetween the two? Block for my Dodge/Sure Hands Thrower.)

I like the rest of your roster just fine. You do want Block and Guard and Mighty Blow on your orcs because they need that against everyone. Skills like Stand Firm (for your cage corners, or blitzers forming a screen or protecting a lane) are more universally applicable, and also helpful against elves. Diving Tackle is worth a double or two on Stand Firm Blitzers, though Dodge should probably take priority. If there's one thing your team is missing so far, it's Piling On, which would be the skill of choice for your Tackle/Mighty Blow Blitzer.

Tackle and Dodge depend on the makeup of your league. And even if your league has several elf teams, you don't want to overcommit on Tackle; it's 20 TV every time you take it, but there are diminishing returns, and it all is worthless if your opponent has no Dodge at all. Certainly Block is more important.

[LCP]

The goblin on an Orc team is useful as a foul-monkey as well as TTM 1-turn touchdowns. Particularly against elves, when you put a valuable player down you want him to stay down. A very cheap player with Stunty and access to Sneaky Git is very useful for making sure that happens. SBBK have got 1 ST5 and 4 ST4 players, so I think they can afford to keep one ST2 on the roster.

It's also worth pointing out that as a bash side you have to be careful how much TV you sink into anti-elf measures, as a lot of the time Tackle etc. does very little against other bash sides. The Rampagers have just about rounded out their 'elf-proofing' now with 4 Tackle players + a Tentacled big guy; any more anti-elf measures I invest in will be injury-causing skills that work just as well against other teams.

[Thufir]

Be more careful how I mark. Don't give up easy blocks with assists rather than just easy blocks - this includes the ST4 Black Orcs (although I thought Guard would have helped).
Improve ball carrier security - I tried doing that against Shishnarfne (as Humans, game not linked as BC Mirka are a SPP pinata solely so they could run the Legacy League with all the people who wanted to play) and he just enveloped and picked off the cage. Playing as Elves in single player has made me understand how they can sneak through though and how better to force a 2 red dice block or force more dodges.
Always assume an elf will make the dodge. Put a body in the way rather than be in a more aggressive position and only adding a mere -1 to the dodge roll.


These seem like the really key ones to me - having Block on your Thrower, while a good idea, is not necessarily as big a deal if he's going to be standing in the middle of a cage where he can't be blitzed anyway (Admittedly, players with Leap exist for that purpose, but that's something you generally need to be wary of, and Guard on cage corners can help counter them.
More careful marking was definitely an issue the first time we played, last season - you walked players up to my guys, but I could easily get assists and in at least one instance you were walking up to the guy with Guard so I didn't even need more guys to have favourable blocks on them.
As far as securing a ball-carrier goes, there are two ways of doing it - you can put defences around the ball-carrier himself, or you can put them around the players who could blitz him. The latter can work pretty well against stronger teams that don't dodge as well, but against elves you should, as you say, always assume they'll make the dodges and so your defences should be around the ball-carrier so the blitzing elf can't just avoid them entirely.


I'd say that there's a good argument that he has no place against any team, unless you're playing only for comedic value. Elves outrun him and/or throw his bombs back, whereas high AV teams just murder him or tend to shrug off the hits. Or, just as likely in my experience, catch the bomb and throw it back on AG2 anyway.... :smalltongue:

The art of winning Blood Bowl matches - and it is an art, as science is seldom so irresponsible - comes from minimizing your risks, making as few rolls as statistically safe as possible and letting your opponent work much, much harder than you. Bomber Dribblesnot and, frankly, all Bombardiers are the walking antithesis of these concepts. Save your inducements on something that will help you, like a reroll or perhaps a Looney, instead of something that might help if the moon is full and the stars are correctly aligned.

If I were playing a Goblin team I'd definitely take a Bombardier. Playing Goblins is already inherently very risky, so you may as well have something which will give you rewards for all the risks you're taking.


It's also worth pointing out that I think Thufir's LOS set-up, which is pretty hard on his line-elves because they can be pushed around horizontally with little trouble (as opposed to a tight formation), might be squarely aimed at you doing exactly what you did: Commit a lot of orcs to the LOS and neglect the coverage of the sides and having more than one guy to pick up the ball, who will then get in trouble because Thufir also kicks deep and has his Catchers run around, through or jump over the mass of orcs at the LOS.

It's quite a while since I actually thought through why I bunch up or space out my players, but yes, I'm pretty sure that was the original reasoning, to goad my opponent into committing a load of players to the front line, so those players couldn't then be doing anything more useful with the ball.

[LCP]

If anyone's looking for an open league game tonight, hit me up on Steam.

[Brother Oni]

A quick question - who are the Commissioners for the Open League?


Quick Open League match report:

Bordeleaux Brawlers 1 : The 8 Handed Slayers 1

A much better showing by the Khornates this game, although mostly in part to a decimated Human team missing their ogre. Lots and lots of brawling (at least three times, the entirety of both teams ended up squeezed into a 5x5 area), with the humans and their Block getting the edge over the Khornates who were forced to be more cautious due to Frenzy.

Some spots of bad luck (failing a GFI on a blitz to stop the human td) and some good (a pickup chain getting the ball into Khornate hands, letting them score the following turn), so I'm very happy with the dice this game.

Picked up some tips for using a Bloodthirster via LCP's minotaur experience and earned some SPP for the cost of a dead pit fighter, a quite reasonable bargain in my opinion.

[Qwaz]

Well i know shishnarfne is one. I don't know if there are others...

[Unpronounceable]

Hi Gnoman

Still not heard from you, can you let me know when would be a good time for our league game? Will probably be around Saturday morning and Sunday night now (BST), maybe late friday too and will be around tonight.

Would like to get it in before next week as will be back at work (no late nights) and will probably be away on the weekend.

Wraith said you were on the west coast? I am willing to get up early my time to play the game if that'd help providing we've agreed a time.

Thanks! :smallbiggrin:

[Thufir]

Match report from last night: Euphonic Cadence 4-1 Leapers of Loren.
Not as entirely one-sided as the scoreline makes it appear. My third touchdown came after the ball got surrounded by tackle zones, bounced off the pitch, run halfway through Maethirion's half, retrieved and sent back most of the way to my end zone and then all the way back again for the score. And touchdown number 4 came from an interception but still could've gone wrong after the curse of the elves hit Mercury as he tried to dodge out with the ball. The dice went pretty crazy in both directions at different points tbh.

[Maethirion]

Mm. Last night's game was certainly an interesting one. I realise now that I have never played a team before that's actually capable of making those long pass plays, and I really have no idea how to deal with it aside from put some high AG people in the way and hope for an interception. Any advice from the playground?

The game itself was fun, if frustrating. Highlights for me include a quick turn two touchdown, followed by a fantastic pitch invasion for me, and a missed pass from Euphonic Cadence, giving me a chance for a turn 4 second touchdown.... only for my AG5 linesman to fail his 2+ roll to pick up the ball. Twice. This was very bad luck on both of our parts to get there, but it was frustrating nonetheless. Thufir is right about the dice being all over the place. I rolled snake eyes for dodges at least three times, and Thufir's two or three dice blocks against my wardancers just didn't seem to want to send them down.

All in all, I had a lot of fun, and learned a lot about putting pressure on ball carriers while trying to remain safe enough to do so. And my Treeman levelled up, which is really nice.

Thanks for the game Thufir.

[Gnoman]

Hi Gnoman

Still not heard from you, can you let me know when would be a good time for our league game? Will probably be around Saturday morning and Sunday night now (BST), maybe late friday too and will be around tonight.

Would like to get it in before next week as will be back at work (no late nights) and will probably be away on the weekend.

Wraith said you were on the west coast? I am willing to get up early my time to play the game if that'd help providing we've agreed a time.

Thanks! :smallbiggrin:

East coast. It's 19:00 right now here. I won't be available until next week - I start work soon.

[Silfir]

Mm. Last night's game was certainly an interesting one. I realise now that I have never played a team before that's actually capable of making those long pass plays, and I really have no idea how to deal with it aside from put some high AG people in the way and hope for an interception. Any advice from the playground?

The basic rule is never to expect to stop a developed elven team from executing a passing play. Especially pro elves. (Though wood elves should also be pretty good at long passing, and if you aren't, it might be part of the problem.)

Put them under pressure and hope for the best. Do set up interceptions; they're frequently more likely to succeed (even with Safe Throw) than an AGI4 player with Dodge, Catch and Nerves of Steel is likely to fail at whatever he's doing. Just try to keep up with your own scoring. Matches between equally passing-minded elven teams frequently devolve into elf-offs, where one side scores and the other scores back, and the final result depends on who manages to cram more touchdowns in, be it by way of being the last team to score in each half (stalling a score until turn 8 exactly remaining an important strategic objective) or by way of defensive touchdowns. Double skulls (including failed 2+ rolls) frequently cause the latter.

You can also try to play a 2-1 grind, if you think of your elf team as sufficiently superior in the bashing game, such as when playing Dark Elves. It can backfire, though, since you need a good cage to hold the ball for long against other elves, and elves don't often make for good cage corners. (Need at least 2 elves with Guard to provide guaranteed assists against a Leaper, to start with.)

[Maethirion]

The basic rule is never to expect to stop a developed elven team from executing a passing play. Especially pro elves. (Though wood elves should also be pretty good at long passing, and if you aren't, it might be part of the problem.)

Put them under pressure and hope for the best. Do set up interceptions; they're frequently more likely to succeed (even with Safe Throw) than an AGI4 player with Dodge, Catch and Nerves of Steel is likely to fail at whatever he's doing. Just try to keep up with your own scoring. Matches between equally passing-minded elven teams frequently devolve into elf-offs, where one side scores and the other scores back, and the final result depends on who manages to cram more touchdowns in, be it by way of being the last team to score in each half (stalling a score until turn 8 exactly remaining an important strategic objective) or by way of defensive touchdowns. Double skulls (including failed 2+ rolls) frequently cause the latter.

You can also try to play a 2-1 grind, if you think of your elf team as sufficiently superior in the bashing game, such as when playing Dark Elves. It can backfire, though, since you need a good cage to hold the ball for long against other elves, and elves don't often make for good cage corners. (Need at least 2 elves with Guard to provide guaranteed assists against a Leaper, to start with.)

Thank you for the advice. As the Wood Elves, I can long pass, although if I can get it shorter, of course I do.
That was pretty much what I had figured. Trying to keep the scoring as level as possible while I have the ball. Bit of a shame that didn't work out, but I guess that's the way it goes.

[Wraith]

If anyone has nothing much to do this evening, I'm available for 'friendly' matches to play. I have newbie High Elves in the Open League and 1100TV Humans in Naggaroth that I'd like to work on :smallsmile:

[LeSwordfish]

California Skulls 1 - Wheeeeeeee! 0

What a grind of a game. I recieved in the first half and tried to form a cage, but Qwertystop's fanatic and loony tore through me like paper. I gave as good as I got though, and though a skilled application of force stopped me from scoring, after halftime the goblins had four players on the field, including a troll, and the Skulls almost at full strength, save for a trio of Tomb Guardians. Despite that, the goblins managed to slow me down immensely, and so many pickups and dodges were failed that I don't think a single turn didn't end in a turnover, with the numbers of the Skulls slowly working out to force the ball down the field, until I was able to score in the very final turn of the game.

[Wraith]

I was watching the game - the only word to describe a game in which two Tomb Guardians and a Troll have all been Badly Injured by game turn 3 is 'carnage'..... Though it was very entertaining all the same! :smallbiggrin:

[careem soda]

It's an important thing to consider for any lurkers that might still be hanging about the place - if you wouldn't mind filling in for a coach who has to drop out (or goes MIA), make yourselves known so we know who to turn to!

Did somebody say lurkers? I would be happy to fill in if you need an additional coach.

[Wraith]

Well, that might not be a terrible idea. I've seen Clarkson online in the last couple of days, he's not answered me when I've left a message and has gone so far as changing his Steam name to boot.

If he's not in touch when I get home tomorrow, it'll be very hard to see how he's not just deliberately ignoring me. I'll keep you will appraised, but frankly I'm feeling beyond the point where it's unfortunate timing problems and more like wilful ignorance, draw or forfeit.
I'll chat with Silfir when I next get chance, as one commissioner to another to make sure that I'm not overstepping myself, but without further input I will consider replacing Bear's Children if you're willing to make an formal application, careen soda. :smallsmile^

[careem soda]

Well, that might not be a terrible idea. I've seen Clarkson online in the last couple of days, he's not answered me when I've left a message and has gone so far as changing his Steam name to boot.

If he's not in touch when I get home tomorrow, it'll be very hard to see how he's not just deliberately ignoring me. I'll keep you will appraised, but frankly I'm feeling beyond the point where it's unfortunate timing problems and more like wilful ignorance, draw or forfeit.
I'll chat with Silfir when I next get chance, as one commissioner to another to make sure that I'm not overstepping myself, but without further input I will consider replacing Bear's Children if you're willing to make an formal application, careen soda. :smallsmile^


I would love to, but i'm not sure what you mean by formal application.

[Wraith]

As In, create a team and enrol it to the GitP Rookie League. The information to do so, is in the first post of this thread. :smallsmile:

Of course, I'm not yet ruling out Clarkson altogether, but I'm glad to know that someone else is interested in our little coterie of teams.

[careem soda]

As In, create a team and enrol it to the GitP Rookie League. The information to do so, is in the first post of this thread. :smallsmile:

Of course, I'm not yet ruling out Clarkson altogether, but I'm glad to know that someone else is interested in our little coterie of teams.

Ah gotcha. Is it possible for me to do while the league is full? I can make a team, but I'm not sure I can apply until Clarkson is removed, if he is.

[Wraith]

I honestly have no idea. If you would be so kind as to give it a try, I'll do my very best to find out for sure (I was only made aware 2 days ago that teams could be swapped out ar all...)

[Silfir]

(Wraith, I don't see you on Steam - if you join me on there we can chat directly :) )

The correct procedure would be to drop the team to be replaced first, then accept the application of the new team. I'd say careem soda should make the application as soon as he's decided on his final roster. I think he should be able to apply to the Rookie League even while it's full; if not, you should make sure to be in communication through Steam so you can both go through the necessary step in a pretty short time. It should always be possible to consult the live chat on The bbtactics forum (http://bbtactics.com/forum/) for help on the exact specifics; I've never done it but the guys there have.

Clarkson did accept my friend request on Steam, though I haven't tried to message him so far (we were never concurrently online). I think the most likely explanation for his lack of communication are either IRL issues that prevent him from paying less than full attention to his weighty responsibilities as a Blood Bowl coach on an online forum, or a lack of motivation similar to what firedaemon33 had last season. In either of those two cases, I can't see how he'd mind getting replaced. Sometimes you just have other things to worry about, sometimes there's a technical failure of some kind, and sometimes it's hard to admit outright you dropped the ball on something... I like to assume the best in people.

Be that as it may, since we have a replacement coach ready and willing who was willing to cease his lurking in the shadows to heed my call, but we also have reason to believe at this point that Clarkson doesn't enjoy Blood Bowl quite as much as we'd like him to, I think it's fair to go ahead with replacing him if he doesn't post at all within something like the next twenty-four hours. It would be especially awesome if you can actually play with careem soda on this match day (on Sunday afternoon or evening, perhaps), thereby avoiding another forfeit match.

[Brother Oni]

... but we also have reason to believe at this point that Clarkson doesn't enjoy Blood Bowl quite as much as we'd like him to...

I know that feeling. :smallsigh:

Nuffle, thou are a fickle and heartless [redacted].

[careem soda]

I have applied, a Communist Party is ready for action!

[Wraith]

So I'm back from my little AFK excursion and I still haven't heard from Clarkson, who Steam says was online yesterday evening. I'm going ahead with the plan to remove Clarkson from the League and install careem soda as his replacement.

Careem, is this your Steam profile (http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198055537237)? If so, I've sent you a friend request as the game has automagically paired you and I up for the remaining match. Forgive the suddenly fast pace of everything, but I'm probably going to be around for most of the everyone and the majority of tomorrow, so perhaps we can play? :smallsmile:

[careem soda]

That is indeed me! I have added you. I should be available to play in about 2.5 hours (1:30PM CDT).

[careem soda]

Welp, played the first game against Wraith, cost me a Ghoul (-1 armor sucks ) but we got a leveled werewolf and tied 1-1, and got enough money to guarantee i can get another ghoul after one more game. I'd say that's a good result.

[Wraith]

Ladies, Gentlemen and Gobins of all ages, a standing ovation please for Careem Soda who stepped into Clarkson's shoes and took up his place in the League at very short notice.

The process isn't entirely mastered - for all intents and purposes, A Communist Party has supplanted Bear's Children in every way; they have the same number of matches played, against the same opponents, with the same results, so as not to make the game have to reassign a bunch of wins/losses/draws and thus entirely rewrite the rankings. Although I've been wrong before about this sort of thing, this time I'm fairly certain that this can't be changed. No matter - we have a full Rookie League again.

As for the game, it was frustrating in all of the most fun ways :smalltongue: Both teams continually rolls a slew of 1's, allowing the other to gain an advantage before being 1'd back down again. The Scaretoon Network failed to pick up the ball 3 turns in a row, and then failed a 2+ catch in turn 8 that would have put them 1-0 ahead. The Party then failed a handful of Dodges and GFI's that would have prevented the Dark Elves' touchdown, only to immediately cage up, dodge out of a Tackle Zone and then watch in hilarity as the only Blitzer that could offer even token resistance to the impending retaliation touchdown failed a dodge on yet another 1.

I think a draw was well deserved. The Halfling Chef did all the work in the world, he lost a Ghoul to -1AV, I lost a Wrestle Lineman to -1ST and we were both 'diced' equally as often. :smallbiggrin: Thank you again, Careem Soda!

Anyways.... Day's over! Have another day!

Calender for Day 8:
Wheeeeeeeeee! (Qwertstop) vs. Black Ribbons (Luzahn)
The Scaretoon Network (Wraith) vs. Kleptoquarterbacks (Froish)
Grimnir's Grudgebringers (Pippington) vs. A Communist Party (Careem Soda)
Spartans of Khorne (Brother Oni) vs. Ms. Dot's Nurse Academy (Manticoran)
Something Ratten in Den. (Neon Knight) vs. Champions of Dread (Devmaar)
Okami Ye Faithful (Silfir) vs. Papa N's Storytime Crew (Ivellius)
Throwaways and Throwers (Shishnarfne) vs. Wymbildon Warpstoners (Unpronounceable)
California Skulls (LeSwordfish) vs. Smashers of Sotek (Maethirion)

Games to be completed by: Monday 13th July

[LeSwordfish]

Maithrion, it looks like you're... almost exactly on the other side of the world to me! I think a 10pm game for me would be 9am your time - does that work for a weekday? Alternatively I could go for a 5am game before work, though that would have to wait until next week - once again, i'm away over the weekend.

[LCP]

Careem, I have no idea what timezone you're in but I'm on BST and free for most of thus week - let me know when you're available. And welcome to the league!

[Manticoran]

Yo Brother Oni. I'm free for the rest of today, and then from about 2100 to 0100 GMT on weekdays, and then free on weekends. Although I'll be free most of Friday because it's a holiday.

[careem soda]

Careem, I have no idea what timezone you're in but I'm on BST and free for most of thus week - let me know when you're available. And welcome to the league!

Hey LCP, I'm in CDT (should be GMT -5 unless i'm crazy) I'm free from 23:00 GMT to 05:00 GMT on weekdays, and almost all of the weekend, and thanks for the welcome!

[Maethirion]

Maithrion, it looks like you're... almost exactly on the other side of the world to me! I think a 10pm game for me would be 9am your time - does that work for a weekday? Alternatively I could go for a 5am game before work, though that would have to wait until next week - once again, i'm away over the weekend.

I know, I'm in one of those tricky time zones that doesn't really work with anyone else :smalltongue:
9am my time works just fine for me. I'm not going to be free tomorrow morning, but any other morning should be fine, just let me know which one works best for you

[Neon Knight]

Devmaar, what's the word? I should be relatively open to play any day this week, and I'm on CDT.

[Brother Oni]

Yo Brother Oni. I'm free for the rest of today, and then from about 2100 to 0100 GMT on weekdays, and then free on weekends. Although I'll be free most of Friday because it's a holiday.

I'll try and catch you tonight (29th) then.

[Devmaar]

Devmaar, what's the word? I should be relatively open to play any day this week, and I'm on CDT.

I should have time to play this week but can't really predict when, best plan is probably hope to see each other online at some point. Otherwise next week should be more orderly

[LeSwordfish]

I know, I'm in one of those tricky time zones that doesn't really work with anyone else :smalltongue:
9am my time works just fine for me. I'm not going to be free tomorrow morning, but any other morning should be fine, just let me know which one works best for you

I'm not sure which "tomorrow" you're talking about - how does ~11 hours from the time of posting this work for you? Or ~35hrs?

[Manticoran]

I'll try and catch you tonight (29th) then.

We're having an emergency at work right now with a bioreactor contamination, so it's likely I might not be home in order to play tonight. Does Tues/Wed/Friday work?

[LCP]

Hey LCP, I'm in CDT (should be GMT -5 unless i'm crazy) I'm free from 23:00 GMT to 05:00 GMT on weekdays, and almost all of the weekend, and thanks for the welcome!

23:00 GMT is midnight on summer time - I'm afraid that's too late for me to start a blood bowl game. I am available this weekend though so I'll try to catch you then? Have added you on Steam.

[Qwertystop]

Hey, Luzahn - My schedule is a bit shaky as something's still being worked out, but hopefully that sorts out quickly. When works for you?

[Brother Oni]

We're having an emergency at work right now with a bioreactor contamination, so it's likely I might not be home in order to play tonight. Does Tues/Wed/Friday work?

Wednesday should work and it gives you tomorrow to de-stress.

[Manticoran]

Cool, let's do Wednesday then. :)

[Silfir]

We're having an emergency at work right now with a bioreactor contamination, so it's likely I might not be home in order to play tonight. Does Tues/Wed/Friday work?

You know, even supposing this is an invented excuse, it's so impressively invented I would have to allow it anyway!

"I'm sorry, Ivellius, I can't play Tuesday evening, I just got called in to defuse a bomb in the Reichstag."

(I don't have a day off until the weekend after this one, and even on that weekend I won't be available on Saturday. But I can play pretty much on any GMT+1 late afternoon to evening into the night. Also, Sunday the 12th is free. My suggestion to you, Ivellius, is that you hit me up anytime you can catch me on Steam and have some hours free to play, I'll do the same, and eventually we should be able to rock this joint!)

[careem soda]

23:00 GMT is midnight on summer time - I'm afraid that's too late for me to start a blood bowl game. I am available this weekend though so I'll try to catch you then? Have added you on Steam.

Alright let's plan on Saturday then. Does 18:00 GMT sound good for you?

[Manticoran]

You know, even supposing this is an invented excuse, it's so impressively invented I would have to allow it anyway!

"I'm sorry, Ivellius, I can't play Tuesday evening, I just got called in to defuse a bomb in the Reichstag."

....Wut. That's all. Just.... What.

[Qwertystop]

You know, even supposing this is an invented excuse, it's so impressively invented I would have to allow it anyway!

"I'm sorry, Ivellius, I can't play Tuesday evening, I just got called in to defuse a bomb in the Reichstag."

(I don't have a day off until the weekend after this one, and even on that weekend I won't be available on Saturday. But I can play pretty much on any GMT+1 late afternoon to evening into the night. Also, Sunday the 12th is free. My suggestion to you, Ivellius, is that you hit me up anytime you can catch me on Steam and have some hours free to play, I'll do the same, and eventually we should be able to rock this joint!)

Are you aware of what a bioreactor is? It's really not on that level. At least, at minimum - I suppose you could theoretically make something apocalyptic in a bioreactor, but that's not the norm.

[Maethirion]

I'm not sure which "tomorrow" you're talking about - how does ~11 hours from the time of posting this work for you? Or ~35hrs?

Sorry for the confusion, should have made that more clear. ~17 hours from this post, or any of the +24 hours after that works just fine for me.

[Silfir]

Are you aware of what a bioreactor is? It's really not on that level. At least, at minimum - I suppose you could theoretically make something apocalyptic in a bioreactor, but that's not the norm.

I don't really know what a bioreactor is, but it sounds metal, doesn't it? I'm not completely alone on this one...?

I rolled a 1 in "Be funny". I didn't mean anything else by it.

[Wraith]

I must admit, while I have utter confidance that Manticoran is quite straight-faced in his reason for being unable to play, the phrase "there's an emergency at the reactor which I have to be there to solve" does conjure up all sorts of heroic and impressive images. :smallsmile:

[Brother Oni]

I must admit, while I have utter confidance that Manticoran is quite straight-faced in his reason for being unable to play, the phrase "there's an emergency at the reactor which I have to be there to solve" does conjure up all sorts of heroic and impressive images. :smallsmile:

Bioreactor. There's a difference. :smalltongue:

What Manticoran makes in his bioreactor is probably proprietory, hence why I didn't ask.

The reason why it's a work emergency, is that the conditions inside a bioreactor which are perfect for the microorganisms they want, are also generally perfect for microorganisms they don't want, thus you end up with a microbial war of genocide inside the reactor with the engineered critters (which are generally innocuous) versus wild-type critters which have defences.
Given that bioreactors can be tens of litres in size, having that much growth media teeming with something like C.botulinum or S.aureus is going to be a major health hazard. If it were infected with something like anthrax, the CDC and Homeland Security are going to take a sudden and extreme interest in Manticoran and his company.

Even if it weren't something hazardous, it's a significant chunk of time and money for the company to flush and clean the reactor vessel then restart the batch.

[Unpronounceable]

Hi Gnoman, we're down to the last 3 days* when I'll be available for the game:

Tonight, not sure when I'll be on but probably from 9pm (BST) onwards

Tomorrow I am not in the office and so can play anytime

Thursday 4:30 (BST) onwards

Any chance you can tell me a specific time which would be good for you and I'll make it?

*there is a chance I'll be on sunday night but it depends when I get back as I'm away this weekend. It's likely to be late.

[LeSwordfish]

Sorry for the confusion, should have made that more clear. ~17 hours from this post, or any of the +24 hours after that works just fine for me.

Sounds good to me - looks like this evening for me/tomorrow morning for you.

[Wraith]

Bioreactor. There's a difference. :smalltongue:

So we won't be facing Fallout, but instead this weekend might just be sunny with a chance of Rage Virus.

Well, that's all right then. :smallbiggrin:

Umm, anyways.... Bloody-Bowly-stuff..... Luzahn! I don't think we often have trouble finding reasonable times for us both, come at me whenever you're able and willing, sir. :smallsmile:

Froish! I am on the same time zone as Unpronounceable, and if I recall correctly you two struggled to get together for various reasons. I can be free at any time between 9am Thursday and 3pm Sunday, GMT, with sporadic appearances in the late afternoon/early evening by specific appointment. I'm sure we can work something out.

[Brother Oni]

So we won't be facing Fallout, but instead this weekend might just be sunny with a chance of Rage Virus.

Well, that's all right then. :smallbiggrin:

From what I hear about motorists in Massachusetts, they all appear to be infected with Rage Virus already. :smalltongue:

[Manticoran]

As a quick reference... We found a particulate of bioburden in something that had the same lot used in the bioreactor, which meant we thought there MIGHT BE contamination, and so have to get rid of everything that might have touched regardless of whether we actually detect contamination. No alien rage viruses or anthrax, sorry. PROBABLY not even a contamination at all, but you gotta be safe.

EDIT: Also, heh, tens of litres.... Try couple thousand.

[LCP]

Sounds like a tough day at the yoghurt factory :smalltongue::smallbiggrin:

I'm about for open league games this evening if anyone's interested.

[Gnoman]

Hi Gnoman, we're down to the last 3 days* when I'll be available for the game:

Tonight, not sure when I'll be on but probably from 9pm (BST) onwards

Tomorrow I am not in the office and so can play anytime

Thursday 4:30 (BST) onwards

Any chance you can tell me a specific time which would be good for you and I'll make it?

*there is a chance I'll be on sunday night but it depends when I get back as I'm away this weekend. It's likely to be late.

I'll be on in the next couple of hours today, can't speak to more than that.

[Silfir]

Angry Joe did an interview (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHPXBN0KD6M) about Blood Bowl II. It confirms for instance that additional sides in Blood Bowl II will be added via patch for everyone, and players only have to buy the DLC if they want to actually play with that side. Seems a more sensible solution by quite a bit than the Dark Elf/Legendary/Chaos Edition stuff with the incompatibilities involved.

I might actually preorder just to get the Wood Elves in and to support development so that they at least get as far as adding Amazons.

Something else I hadn't yet heard - and I hope I actually understood the developer correctly - is that they're considering quite a few rules changes inside the existing ruleset, including adding another Troll to the Goblins roster. Ignoring for a moment that changing the LRB is borderline blasphemous and that the tabletop community probably wouldn't take kindly to Cyanide attempting to supplant it unilaterally without offering the option of "Classic" mode (and they already rowed back on the aging rules, so I'm assuming they're aware of the risks), it's an interesting idea, but I'm not sure if it's the right one, since it pushes the goblin team towards being a "Trolls" team rather than improving on the strengths peculiar to goblins. I would have gone for allowing goblins to buy a permanent bribe or even all three; they wouldn't have to tank their TV anymore to get bribes and could play around more with their secret weapons and fouling.

[Gnoman]

I'll be on in the next couple of hours today, can't speak to more than that.

Turns out I won't be.

[Wraith]

I am under the impression that Cyanide intend to make several changes to their games' teams. cKnoor_ was discussing it in one of his streams a week or two ago, that Human Catchers will have a slightly different statline - I think he said +1MA, but I won't swear to it - and appropriately adjusted cost to match.

I'm not inherently against the idea of such changes, otherwise we wouldn't be getting the Bretonnian team and would never have had the Khorne Daemons, and so on. The LRB and video game have always had differences, as things do in mixed media, and I for one am hoping that this reflects Cyanides' experiences with balance issues and bugfixing in BB1 and are attempting to correct them in BB2, rather than just tinkering for the sake of doing so.
For example, Games Workshop have never that great at collecting team/tournament data with which to adjust their rulebooks by, and I imagine that the LRB guys struggle to do so for a 'defunct' game. Blood Bowl Cyanide, however, has got over 2million matches on record to compare, and see what works well and what doesn't - if anyone can make a pattern out of their results, Cyanide hopefully can.

Having said that, I can remember a time when the 'official' Snotling team allowing you to take Trolls instead of Ogres as their Big Guys - maybe this is intended to be a 'classic' Goblin team setup?

[Unpronounceable]

European Night-owls and American... well 'Normals' I guess, Wymbildon Warpstoners vs Throwers and Throw-aways will be kicking off a approximately midnight BST!

[Qwaz]

Games Workshop have never that great at collecting team/tournament data with which to adjust their rulebooks by, and I imagine that the LRB guys struggle to do so for a 'defunct' game. Blood Bowl Cyanide, however, has got over 2million matches on record to compare, and see what works well and what doesn't - if anyone can make a pattern out of their results, Cyanide hopefully can

I was under the impression that the BBRC developed the LRB versions after using data gather from many thousands (not sure how many but it's always growing) of games on FUMBBL? I trust them more than Cyanide and don't see how this can be so difficult.
Take Blood Bowl. Implement it faithfully. Done. Anything else and you lose your audience.
I don't want to play something like blood bowl. I want to play actual blood bowl but in the absense of a tabletop league i'd like the best virtual blood bowl they have with the best interface and the prettiest graphics. Everything else should be an optional add on.

[Brother Oni]

As a quick reference... We found a particulate of bioburden in something that had the same lot used in the bioreactor, which meant we thought there MIGHT BE contamination, and so have to get rid of everything that might have touched regardless of whether we actually detect contamination. No alien rage viruses or anthrax, sorry. PROBABLY not even a contamination at all, but you gotta be safe.

Ah, I recognise that unique paranoid smell of GMP from anywhere...


EDIT: Also, heh, tens of litres.... Try couple thousand.

Is that your standard pick up line at conventions? "Hey there, would you like to see the size of my bioreactor?" :smalltongue:


I don't want to play something like blood bowl. I want to play actual blood bowl but in the absense of a tabletop league i'd like the best virtual blood bowl they have with the best interface and the prettiest graphics. Everything else should be an optional add on.

At this point in time, I'd settle for a bug free interface. You can work around an awkward one, not so much with a randomly buggy/glitchy one.

[Unpronounceable]

Throwers and Throwaways 2-1 Wymbildon Warpstoners

A violent game, by turn 15 there were only 2 skaven throwers, 4 ogres and one snotling on the pitch. The warpstoners took the lead initially with a zig zagging mini cage using the superior speed to stay away from the ogres. scoring in turn 5. The ogres then equalised with a succesful throw team mate i turn 7. The warpstoners set up for a TTM touch down but an ogre bltz stopped them

Then the second half bloodbath began, with the ogres receiving the skaven got a blitz result and a bloody fight began over the ball deep in the ogre half. Eventually though there just weren't enough rats or goblins left and the ogres propelled the remaining snotling downfield to score in turn 16.

With a troll and goblin coming back on for the last turn of the match there was a chance of a last minute equalizer but ANOTHER ogre blitz took down the goblin and troll and so all the skaven could do was get a SPP completion.

Really fun game thanks Shishnarfne!

I'm beginning to think my team has narcolepsy, seriously I don't think the warpstoners have had a game without a blitz against them!

[Unpronounceable]

Turns out I won't be.

Rightyo

BTW if I'm in a game please do message me as It's never something I can't drop out of in a few minutes notice.

I was talking to Qwaz last night and he pointed out the week doesn't roll over till tuesday so that's a couple more days, and as I've said before, if you can give me a time I'll make it.

[Wraith]

I'm beginning to think my team has narcolepsy, seriously I don't think the warpstoners have had a game without a blitz against them!

Blitz! only happens if you roll a 10 on 2d6 at Kick Off (+/-1 depending on your FAME score, which is determined by your Fan Factor and the number of spectators who attend the match) and therefore is a 1/9 occurrence. This is exactly the same chance as Perfect Defense, which doesn't seem to occur anything like as often.

I think I've witnessed a Blitz! in something like 5 of my last 6 games, and I know that some people have seen it happen 2 or even 3 times in a single match. I don't think it's just your team! :smalltongue:

[Qwaz]

Blitz! only happens if you roll a 10 on 2d6 at Kick Off (+/-1 depending on your FAME score, which is determined by your Fan Factor and the number of spectators who attend the match) and therefore is a 1/9 occurrence. This is exactly the same chance as Perfect Defense, which doesn't seem to occur anything like as often.

I think I've witnessed a Blitz! in something like 5 of my last 6 games, and I know that some people have seen it happen 2 or even 3 times in a single match. I don't think it's just your team! :smalltongue:

Nearly right but not quite. Fame doesn't affect WHAT the kick off table result is but MAY affect some of how the results get played out.

All the following is summarised from the LRB 6 page 19....



2d6 ResultOddsNameEffect
21/36Get The Ref!Each team gets a bribe
32/36RiotClock moves forward or back one turn for both players. 50/50 unless one direction is the only possible.
43/36Perfect DefenceKicking side can change to another legal formation
54/36High KickBall scatter normally but the recieving coach can move any player (Not in a tackle zone) under the ball for free.
65/36Cheering FansCoaches roll D3+FAME+Cheerleaders. Winner gets 1 re-roll. Tie gives both re-roll
76/36Changing WeatherRe-roll on the weather table - Nice leads one square extra scatter
85/36Brilliant CoachingCoaches roll D3+FAME+Asst. Coaches. Winner gets 1 re-roll. Tie gives both re-roll
94/36Quick SnapReceiving team can move each player one square in any direction, ignoring tackle zones.
103/36Blitz!Defending team get an extra turn before the ball lands but only players not in an enemy tackle zone can make use of it.
112/36Throw a Rock!Each coach rolls a d6+FAME. Random player on losers team is hit by a rock. Straight injury roll is made. No Armour roll needed.
121/36Pitch Invasion!Each coach rolls a d6+FAME for each opposing player. A 6 or more and that player is "Stunned"



So...blitz is always a 1/12 chance of happening on any kick off.

FAME, Which lies somewhere bewteen 0 & +2 (depending on how many fans of your/your opponents turn up) affects how 4 results (not the blitz though) work but not the odds on getting the results.


FAME = Fan Affected ModifiEr

This is a modifier based around how many of your and your opponents fans turn up. This is a roll made before the game but the results are not surfaced properly to the players even after the game (as far as i've seen) and that's annoying as it's interesting infomation, all be it one you have no control on. It works like this...

Before the match each coach sees how many of their fans turn up. That number is (2d6+fan factor)*1000

(The multiplier of 1000 is just there to make it seem more like a stadium of supporters and not your mates turnig up to say hi but otherwise has no real bearing)

If you have less than you opponent or are equal to them then your FAME = 0
If you have more than your opponent then your FAME = +1
If you have twice as many or more fans attend than your opponent then your FAME = +2

eg:

Coach A is playing Coach B

Coach A won lots of matches and gotten lucky with rolling so has a fan factor of 18
Coach B hasn't ever even drawn a match so has a fan factor of 0

Coach A Rolls 2d6 and gets 1+1, then adds his fan factor of 18 for a total of 20....20000 fans
Coach B Rolls 2d6 and gets 6+6 then adds his fan factor of 0 for a total of 12...12000 fans

Therefore Coach A has a FAME of +1 and Coach B has a FAME of 0. 32000 fans total attended the game.

The first you see of any of this maths though is the FAME added on if one of the kick off results is rolled and then the total fans at the end.

Now unless there is a large disparity in fan factor the 2d6 roll is far more important in determining FAME and even when it is as big as possible (as in the example above) the rolls could keep it as a +1 rather than a +2


The PRNG in this game has been proved fair many times So i'm going to say the feeling that Blitz happens more than Perfect Defense is confirmation bias cos Blitz is so much more punishing.

That said those games where you Recieve 3 times and are blitzed on ALL of them (Devmaar I'm looking at you!) does make me wonder :smallwink:

[Manticoran]

I'm just gonna say, I vastly prefer a Perfect Defense over a Blitz personally. A well set up Perfect Defense can almost entirely nullify, if not actually nullify, your opponent's advantage in going first, resulting in an easily staled game.

[Thufir]

I'm just gonna say, I vastly prefer a Perfect Defense over a Blitz personally. A well set up Perfect Defense can almost entirely nullify, if not actually nullify, your opponent's advantage in going first, resulting in an easily stalled game.

It kind of depends on what team you're playing I suppose. With a team that expects to stall out their opponents effectively a Perfect Defence can be pretty great, but with a team like Elves I'd much rather take the Blitz and just retrieve my own kick. It's also worth noting that the free Blitz turn does allow you a chance to alter your formation as well, since all your unmarked players can move.
In any case, if I'm receiving as any team I'd much rather see a Perfect Defence for my opponent than a Blitz. And the one result I never want to see is Pitch Invasion...

[Manticoran]

*Shrug* My primary team is Vampires, and usually my plan is to stall out with constant pressure on cages due to hypnotic gaze. Or just injure elves a lot. Against Elves, I'd prefer to have a Blitz so I can make their dodging out of my tackle zones harder, but against beaty teams I'd basically always prefer to get the Perfect Defense.

[Qwertystop]

Luzahn, when are you able to play our match?

[Wraith]

3/36 (Blitz!)

You wouldn't believe how often I forget that 5+5 is actually the same as 5+5 :smalltongue:


The PRNG in this game has been proved fair many times So i'm going to say the feeling that Blitz happens more than Perfect Defense is confirmation bias cos Blitz is so much more punishing.

I know the dice roller is accurate, but while perhaps anecdotal I don't think I'm exaggerating. Certainly in the Rookie League, I have had perhaps one Perfect Defence to half a dozen Blitz!, and in the games I've watched the pattern seems to be the same.

Honestly, I'm not arguing that it's unfair or unbalanced or anything, just perhaps that the table could be better prioritized. A Blitz! is a VERY good result, but that it statistically happens more often then a Get The Ref! result - which is still good, but far more situational and requires more tactical awareness of behalf of both players - does not seem wise. :smallsmile:

And while I think about it, the Changing Weather table could use a bit of a change - I'm very sure that the most common result by a long shot is Perfect Weather changing into Perfect Weather, which kind of defeats the point. It's a fairly easy caveat to state that the weather MUST change, so reroll it if it stays the same, surely?


And the one result I never want to see is Pitch Invasion...

I broadly agree, but there has been more than one occasion where I've been in a very tight game, looking down the barrel of a 1 or 2 Turn Touchdown from my opponent, only for the crowd to make the save for me. I want to see it rarely, certainly, but never? Perhaps not. :smallsmile:

[Manticoran]

"Brother Oni: Sorry, can we reschedule?
Brother Oni: It's too damn hot here to concentrate and I'm too sleepy to wait any longer for you."

Got home at 6pm to this. Not blaming you, just putting out our full communication. Feeling a little burned by Clarkson. :(

When works for you? I can probably do... Sunday would be best for me at this point, I think?

[Brother Oni]

"Brother Oni: Sorry, can we reschedule?
Brother Oni: It's too damn hot here to concentrate and I'm too sleepy to wait any longer for you."

Got home at 6pm to this. Not blaming you, just putting out our full communication. Feeling a little burned by Clarkson. :(

When works for you? I can probably do... Sunday would be best for me at this point, I think?

Ah, you came home about a quarter of an hour after I went to bed. Sorry, I misread your availability as BST so I was hanging around from 21:00-23:00 BST, wondering where you were.

Sunday sounds good - any particular time?

[Silfir]

You wouldn't believe how often I forget that 5+5 is actually the same as 5+5 :smalltongue:



I know the dice roller is accurate, but while perhaps anecdotal I don't think I'm exaggerating. Certainly in the Rookie League, I have had perhaps one Perfect Defence to half a dozen Blitz!, and in the games I've watched the pattern seems to be the same.

Honestly, I'm not arguing that it's unfair or unbalanced or anything, just perhaps that the table could be better prioritized. A Blitz! is a VERY good result, but that it statistically happens more often then a Get The Ref! result - which is still good, but far more situational and requires more tactical awareness of behalf of both players - does not seem wise. :smallsmile:

And while I think about it, the Changing Weather table could use a bit of a change - I'm very sure that the most common result by a long shot is Perfect Weather changing into Perfect Weather, which kind of defeats the point. It's a fairly easy caveat to state that the weather MUST change, so reroll it if it stays the same, surely?



I broadly agree, but there has been more than one occasion where I've been in a very tight game, looking down the barrel of a 1 or 2 Turn Touchdown from my opponent, only for the crowd to make the save for me. I want to see it rarely, certainly, but never? Perhaps not. :smallsmile:

I think Perfect Weather being so common on the weather table serves the pretty important purpose of making sure that the majority of any given match tends to actually take place in Perfect Weather, since the other weathers have a fairly huge and at times lopsided impact on the match. The kickoff table also completely lacks a "Nothing happens" option - Perfect Weather changing into Perfect Weather kind of fills that niche. (Though not really - the extra square of scatter can be quite important.)

I'll echo Qwaz and blame confirmation bias on the Blitz! rolls - I don't think you really remember which of the other results happen after the match. Blitz! is impossible not to notice, because it gives a full turn to your opponent when you were expecting to play yourself, and that gives you up to four minutes in which to cook up a nice and sizzling rage. Perfect Defense has half that effect (and anyway a lot of the time I find I only make small adjustments and don't nearly use the full two minutes.) Pitch Invasion sticks in memory, too, because of all those stunned players heavily affecting the following turns. But while I remember Pitch Invasion happen in matches I've played, I honestly can't remember a single case of Get the Ref!, even though both are equally likely - and I'm fairly convinced that's because Get the Ref! only changes a number on the right hand side of the screen, and many teams don't really foul all that much.

What all this boils down to is that anecdotal evidence is useless as useless can be.

(I'm quite fine with Blitz! being more common than Get the Ref!, to be honest, because while Blitz! can help whichever team is kicking at the time, Get the Ref! in any given match will benefit one side more than the other - whichever is the side that has cheap players to foul with and is likely to develop a numbers advantage over time. Similar is true for some of the weathers.)

[Qwaz]

Hi Gnoman, we're down to the last 3 days* when I'll be available for the game:

Tonight, not sure when I'll be on but probably from 9pm (BST) onwards

Tomorrow I am not in the office and so can play anytime

Thursday 4:30 (BST) onwards

Any chance you can tell me a specific time which would be good for you and I'll make it?

*there is a chance I'll be on sunday night but it depends when I get back as I'm away this weekend. It's likely to be late.

*Emphasis mine.

I should be around tonight so if it's going ahead please give a shout in thread coz i'd like to watch if possible.

[Luzahn]

Luzahn, when are you able to play our match?

I'm free for Friday and most of this weekend, just send me a message whenever you're available! :smallsmile:

[Silfir]

Ivellius and I agreed to try to find time to play Okami Ye Faithful vs. Papa N's Storytime Crew sometime on Sunday. The time window is somewhat narrow; he'll have to play in early afternoon for it to be before midnight for me, though I might have Monday off and just stay up late. If you're really keen on watching the game, look for it starting at 8 pm GMT.

(Saturday was apparently not doable because of some kind of regional holiday.)

[Devmaar]

Champions of Dread vs. Something Ratten in the State of Den. will be kicking off in the next few minutes.

[Manticoran]

Well, I'm off work today for the weekend, and my plans for tonight fell through. So I'll be available this evening and maybe tomorrow evening too actually.

[Neon Knight]

Something Ratten. in Denmark 1 - 2 Champions of Dread.

Not a long match report for this one; it was a classic, nearly by the book 2-1 grind. In the first half, I kicked to him and slowly screened him down the pitch. A messed up dodge on the very last turn left a corridor open for him to score; that Tackle is a real headache. 2nd half, my drive, I score in two turns. He received the ball the next drive and I screened him slowly down the pitch. This time, AV7 and attrition had finally taken their toll, and I didn't have enough pieces to both try and screen a potential handoff to get around my blockade and also keep the blockade whole. I chose to reinforce my line, and the hobgoblin walked over for the handoff to another hobgoblin, who promptly flubbed it. The game was saved from a tie by a Bull Centaur catching the fly ball and running it in to score.

Well played to Devmaar. For the most part, it was the most straightforward and normal game of Bloodbowl I've seen in a while.

[Devmaar]

Champions of Dread vs. Something Ratten in the State of Den. will be kicking off in the next few minutes.

2-1 to the Chaos Dwarves. It was looking bad at half time, 1-0 up and kicking with no rats off the pitch. But a quick Skaven touchdown followed by the Dwarves finally starting to spill blood allowed the ball to be carried within lunging distance of the endzone. The game finished with a turn-16 failed handoff scattering to a Bull Centaur who made the catch and ran in the touchdown for the win.

Thanks for the game Neon Knight, well played

[LeSwordfish]

I forgot to mention that Maetherion's team beat the Skulls 1-0 a couple of days ago. A good game - lizardmen are scary! I took too long to pick up on the "dogpile the skinks" strategy and it showed, with a series of the sneaky little buggers breaking the ball from my cage and running away with it near the end of the first half- even dedicated efforts to beat up those that remained within arms reach - a few had the misfortune to be charged by two tomb guardians - got no injuries and few knockdowns. In the second half things went little better, and the only thing preventing another goal was a turnover in the final turn as one of Maetherion's Saurus failed to completely kick in the head of my newest star, Audrey Hipbone.

Matt Le Ankh - one of my beloved Tomb Guardians With Guard - is returning next game, so here's hoping for better luck then.

[Wraith]

I very much wanted to spectate the Ratten/Dread match, but for some reason the game refused to let me connect. I'm wondering if it's a regional issue - the game has been reluctant to let me play with Devmaar in the past - but hopefully it'll resolve itself before another match is played. :smallannoyed:

[Qwaz]

I Wanted to spectate the Ratten/Dread match, but for some reason the game refused to let me connect. :smallannoyed:

Tried & ditto.

[Silfir]

That makes three of us!

I think it has to do with Devmaar's connection issues. We've tried to resolve them before, but as far as I remember it would always end up with me having to challenge him to get a match started. The solution probably has to do with Devmaar adopting a static IP and opening all the ports required by the game through port forwarding or some other act of wizardry.

[Brother Oni]

Well, I'm off work today for the weekend, and my plans for tonight fell through. So I'll be available this evening and maybe tomorrow evening too actually.

I've got something on early evening Friday, but I should be back about 19:00 GMT. I may not be available (or sober) on Saturday, and I'm free all Sunday until about 23:00 GMT.

[Devmaar]

That makes three of us!

I think it has to do with Devmaar's connection issues. We've tried to resolve them before, but as far as I remember it would always end up with me having to challenge him to get a match started. The solution probably has to do with Devmaar adopting a static IP and opening all the ports required by the game through port forwarding or some other act of wizardry.

It's probably this. I think I still have this wizardry done though, way back when I first posted here and tried to play Silfir we couldn't connect at all. Now I can play it just sometimes requires a few attempts...

I didn't realise it could affect spectators though, although I often have difficulty correcting to dictate myself...

[Wraith]

I've left Steam-based messages with both Froish and Luzahn, since they're next on my respective Rookie and Legacy hit lists. If both, or either, of you could get in touch then we'll organise a match some time.

Especially Luzahn - the deadline for our match is tomorrow (July 4th) so barring a short deadline extension in honour of the day we need to get a move on as I believe he's in the USA and thus might be preoccupied. :smallsmile:


The solution probably has to do with Devmaar adopting a static IP and opening all the ports required by the game through port forwarding or some other act of wizardry.

:smallconfused:

Umm.... Maybe he could.... try.... reversing the polarity? dammit i hate computers sometimes.....

[Brother Oni]

:smallconfused:

Umm.... Maybe he could.... try.... reversing the polarity? dammit i hate computers sometimes.....

As I understand it and using poor analogies, suppose Devmaar went a restaurant (logged in to his ISP). He would wait to be seated, get given an available table number (assigned a dynamic IP) and his food (data) would be served to that table number. If Devmaar was a regular, he could reserve a particular table number from the restaurant instead (request a static IP).
Now suppose there was a particularly dense waiter (Blood Bowl network code), who can't read the table numbers but recognises Devmaar on sight. Our waiter has trouble finding Devmaar when he's at a random table, but can find him when he's at the same reserved table.

I'll have to use a different analogy for port forwarding: suppose Devmaar's computer was a factory with lots of doors (ports). In order to even out entry/exit of stuff from the factory (network traffic) to stop bottlenecks, every line in the factory (program) are assigned their individual doors. Sometimes these doors are blocked by the overly strict building security (firewall) who stop legitimate deliveries and shipping if the paperwork isn't completed down to the last dotted i and crossed t, so rather than deal with them and their stupidly by-the-book Security manager, you extend your entrances out past the site boundary where the jobsworth guards don't bother to patrol (port forwarding).

Does that help at all?

[Tasroth]

I've left Steam-based messages with both Froish and Luzahn, since they're next on my respective Rookie and Legacy hit lists. If both, or either, of you could get in touch then we'll organise a match some time.

Especially Luzahn - the deadline for our match is tomorrow (July 4th) so barring a short deadline extension in honour of the day we need to get a move on as I believe he's in the USA and thus might be preoccupied. :smallsmile:

I have been meaning to nudge people about the Legacy League. As far as I know, Thufir and Froish have been in contact and are playing at the weekend. Since it's the last week before the playoffs, the remaining matches can affect playoff contention, and our US players may be busy, I was thinking of extending the deadline into Sunday if necessary but I can't really offer much more than that.

[Qwertystop]

I'm free for Friday and most of this weekend, just send me a message whenever you're available! :smallsmile:

I'm on and ready. You appear to not be on Steam at the moment.

[Brother Oni]

Manticoran, I'm available for the next four hours or so from time of this posting to play our game. You don't seem to be responding on Steam, so just adding this here to make sure it gets seen somewhere.

Edit:

Spartans of Khorne 0: Ms.Dot's Nurse Academy 1

Despite a good start with the Spartans holding the orcs back (and nearly stealing the ball at one point), things went completely pearshaped on the first block of the second half with the Bloodthirster falling into a Frenzy trap. It only got cemented with a failed Spartan hand off and Manticoran leisurely scored on turn 16 while making sure to put the boot in a couple of times (including a turn 15 foul on the Bloodthirster, despite a number of Spartan permanent injuries and a death already).

On the plus side, I can't fail to get my third reroll as I only need 10k after saving 5 games for it.
On the down side, I now need to start saving up for replacement players.

[Manticoran]

1-0 to the Academy. A Khorne Blitz on the first half made me scared as hell for a second, until the Bloodthirster rolled Wild Animal. Chaos reigned for the first half of the game, with neither player able to get to get anywhere useful, but the Bloodthirster getting 2-3 Orcs out of the game, and a foul on the Bloodthirster at the end of the first half blew the Khorne Apoth with a Badly Hurt. Second half started with the Bloodthirster frenzying into a pile of Orcs and rolling Attacker Down/Push, giving the Orcs a quick advantage. With more Guard, more Block, and more Strength on the field, Oni made it surprisingly difficult to get a turn 16 score.

[Wraith]

Does that help at all?

:smallbiggrin: I think I might just have overstated my ignorance of the subject slightly, but it was very kind of you to go to all that effort sir. :smallwink:


On the down side, I now need to start saving up for replacement players.

On the one hand, it's nice to see a team as lame (MV busted, I mean!) as the Hammersjurg Destroyers for a change.... :smalltongue: But even so, it doesn't look that bad at all. You still have all your positional players, anything else is a bonus and you won't even have as Loner in your next match by the looks of things. Chin up, and all :smallsmile:

[LCP]

Grimnir's Grudgebringers 3 - 0 A Communist Party. Still bruised from last week's encounter with the Academy, the Grudgebringers roared back into grudge-settling form with two very tense defensive touchdowns in the first half (helped by their old friend Both Down) and then a slow but thoroughly punchy walk up the pitch in the second. Still they refrained from murdering any of Careem's players which for them is best behaviour.

Thanks Careem Soda for the game.

dwarfboowwllllllllllll...

EDIT: GRUNGNI BE PRAISED I'VE GOT AN AG4 DWARF.

YOU'D BETTER NOT DROP THE PICK-UP NOW ROREK.

[Devmaar]

EDIT: GRUNGNI BE PRAISED I'VE GOT AN AG4 DWARF.

YOU'D BETTER NOT DROP THE PICK-UP NOW ROREK.

Wraith, we failed :smallfrown:

[Wraith]

That's fine. It's fine. No really. Fine. Just.... Fine. sonnovabeesh!

After all, if *I* don't get to keep a Level 3 Runner for more than a couple of games, no-one gets to. it's 4 days/games until the Network plays the Grudgebringers. I'm sure that I can pick up an awful lot of Dirty Players in 4 games. :smallamused:

[Brother Oni]

On the one hand, it's nice to see a team as lame (MV busted, I mean!) as the Hammersjurg Destroyers for a change.... :smalltongue: But even so, it doesn't look that bad at all. You still have all your positional players, anything else is a bonus and you won't even have as Loner in your next match by the looks of things. Chin up, and all :smallsmile:

I think you saw my roster before you validated that match, as Manticoran killed one of my Heralds. To add insult to injury, it was the Herald that managed to scrape some SPP together. :smallsigh:

I also took the opportunity to fire a rookie MA busted Pit Fighter, so now I'm down to 10 available players again. On the plus side, I've now found my dedicated ball carrier with a AG4 Pit fighter. :smallbiggrin:

[LCP]

After all, if *I* don't get to keep a Level 3 Runner for more than a couple of games, no-one gets to. it's 4 days/games until the Network plays the Grudgebringers. I'm sure that I can pick up an awful lot of Dirty Players in 4 games. :smallamused:

A casualty-off with a bunch of elves, is it? *cracks knuckles* That suits the Grudgebringers just fine :smallbiggrin:

[Qwertystop]

My game with Luzahn is over, lost as usual.

[Wraith]

I think you saw my roster before you validated that match, as Manticoran killed one of my Heralds.

....Oh. Sorry. I thought I counted 4, I must have glanced too quickly. Still, at least you have 288 names left to chose from, I'm pretty much clawing at the bottom of the barrel for my guys! :smallwink:

[EDIT:] I tell a lie - Silfir very kindly offered me "Horror the Explorer", so I'm good for.... one more game, or so? :smallbiggrin:


A casualty-off with a bunch of elves, is it? *cracks knuckles* That suits the Grudgebringers just fine :smallbiggrin:

It sounds nice, doesn't it? Well, you might be in for a hard lesson - I've just finished playing Ironbeards vs. Daggers with Luzahn, and I caused more injuries with a Fireball in one turn than I did in the rest of the game with my whole team. :smallfrown:
I'd like to say that I was thoroughly screwed over by the 12-player glitch forcing me to keep my Deathroller on the pitch when Kicking (which I prefer not to do), but I can't even do that because HE caused the other injury! :smallfurious::smalltongue:

[Brother Oni]

....Oh. Sorry. I thought I counted 4, I must have glanced too quickly. Still, at least you have 288 names left to chose from, I'm pretty much clawing at the bottom of the barrel for my guys! :smallwink:

I can only find the names of 33 of the 300 and I've already used 14 of those.

Having a quick look at the list of old Cartoon Network shows...

Samurai Jason (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jason_Voorhees)
Grim & Evil seems tailor made.
Dexter's Mad Laboratory
Hi Hi Puffy AmiYumi is horror enough (I had the misfortune of catching one episode). You could try Hi Hi Puffy Tomie (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomie)Sadako (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadako_Yamamura)
Space Ghost is another tailor made one.
Generator Rawhead Rex
Murder Time

I'll see if I can come up with some more.

[LeSwordfish]

Mona the Vampire? Or does it have to be specifically Cartoon Network?