Campaign Thought: No Magic

[ThermalSlapShot]

The world is a dark and depressing place. The gods have blocked the plane off from all others (and no one knows why).

You are now alone. The entire world is alone.

First to go was divine magic and then the last drops of arcane magic dried up.

++++

Classes Available: Barbarian (Beserker), Fighter (Battle Master), Fighter (Champion), Rogue (Assassin), Rogue (Thief), and Monk (Open Hand).

All PCs at first level gain the feat Healer or Inspiring Leader. Magic feats that give new Spells don't exist but feats that are able to be applied to racial abilities can exist.

The only magic a PC will have access to is from racial abilities. (Probably will change all references to per long rest to per short rest)

Monsters will have their magic but for the most part magic will be gone. Cockatrice and Medusa will still be able to turn someone into stone and a Nothic can still use Weird Insight. Although new undead and mummies can't be raised via normal means... Any undead or mummies already around when the plane was blocked off can still be around.

Magic items will be rare, these will be relics from the past and at most each player will find one permanent magic item. Consumable magic items will be rare but not as much as permanent items.

+++

My question for the playground.

I need a world to build around, or at least a map of a country that I can fluff up.

Is there a place to find generic maps?

Also, I'm sure I'm missing something, do you have any suggestions for a campaign such as this?

[ChubbyRain]

In previous editions, specifically 3e, I would say that this wouldn't work.

However since non-casters do have decent options at low level and they are all somewhat balanced with each other as they level this could actually work.

Look into the UA spell-less ranger, that should give players another option and open up some class features that you would normally lose out on in this situation.


Edit:

Not UA, just an article.

https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/modifying-classes

[LordVonDerp]

You forgot totem barbarian.

[LordVonDerp]

Oh, and what about spell-less ranger and swashbuckler rogue?

[Chaosvii7]

You forgot totem barbarian.

I think he excluded it because of their ability to cast a few spells as rituals. That said, he can just get rid of those features - as magical as they are they aren't linchpins to the archetypes.

Also I'd go so far as to make a spell-less Paladin so that there's still a fair representation of divine influence in the world - just because there's no magic doesn't mean that people don't worship gods, and it's probably most doable to make a laissez-faire Paladin(save the fact that you delete Oath of The Ancients).

[LordVonDerp]

I think he excluded it because of their ability to cast a few spells as rituals. That said, he can just get rid of those features - as magical as they are they aren't linchpins to the archetypes.
.

Wait, really? I never noticed.

[Naanomi]

Without a way to magically remove exhaustion the berserker is going to be in a rough spot...

I'd go with this party:
- battle master focused on tanking, sentinel and Polearm type
-assassin social character/ranged sniper
-thief 'healer', doesn't dump int, learns investigation and maybe a knowledge skill or two
-monk acts as 'caster', lots of monk effects are good when no magic to replicate them sooner; focus on wisdom skills; everyone else will likely not have them significantly

[ThermalSlapShot]

In previous editions, specifically 3e, I would say that this wouldn't work.

However since non-casters do have decent options at low level and they are all somewhat balanced with each other as they level this could actually work.

Look into the UA spell-less ranger, that should give players another option and open up some class features that you would normally lose out on in this situation.


Edit:

Not UA, just an article.

https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/modifying-classes

Yeah spell less Ranger will be allowed.


I think he excluded it because of their ability to cast a few spells as rituals. That said, he can just get rid of those features - as magical as they are they aren't linchpins to the archetypes.

Also I'd go so far as to make a spell-less Paladin so that there's still a fair representation of divine influence in the world - just because there's no magic doesn't mean that people don't worship gods, and it's probably most doable to make a laissez-faire Paladin(save the fact that you delete Oath of The Ancients).

Yup, the totem barbarian is to magical for this. I would have to strike out different parts and add in other options and just a clean sweep ban works easiest.

Isn't a spell less paladin is really just a Acolyte Fighter? That's how I see it at least. Probably would pick up Inspiring Leader as the free Feat.

Edit Below

@Nanomi

I recall seeing a Beserker homebrew idea on these forums a while ago where beserking removes hit dice instead of giving exhaustion.

I'll use that variant.

[dafrca]

We tried this once and it ended in a major crash. I admit we were using 3.5 though so maybe 5 will work better.

I will say this much, we took all magic away from everything because when the monsters still have magic it becomes very powerful when the PCs can't counter it at all.

As for generic maps, I would say go look up just about any world map and just re-label the names.

Good Luck ! :smallsmile:

[ThermalSlapShot]

We tried this once and it ended in a major crash. I admit we were using 3.5 though so maybe 5 will work better.

I will say this much, we took all magic away from everything because when the monsters still have magic it becomes very powerful when the PCs can't counter it at all.

As for generic maps, I would say go look up just about any world map and just re-label the names.

Good Luck ! :smallsmile:

3e assumed magic a part of its base mechanic, 5e does not. I'm hoping this works out.

I'm thinking of using some Final Fantasy maps but don't want it to be so cliche lol

Also, thanks everyone!

[Elbeyon]

This would be the best edition to try this yet. Try to watch out for monsters that take half damage unless the source is magical. They'd become much stronger under these rules. That and conditions imposed onto them.

[ThermalSlapShot]

This would be the best addition to try this yet. Try to watch out for monsters that take half damage unless the source is magical. They'd become much stronger under these rules.

Yup, I would either run them as is to give a harder encounter or just remove it.

[SharkForce]

another thing to watch out for is monsters that inflict permanent or long-term status effects. the party won't have the magic to remove those effects, which can cause some pretty major problems.

[ThermalSlapShot]

another thing to watch out for is monsters that inflict permanent or long-term status effects. the party won't have the magic to remove those effects, which can cause some pretty major problems.

Already got that covered.

Society will either have found natural ways to cure things (poultice) or the players will need to go on a quest to get a cure.

[SharkForce]

Already got that covered.

Society will either have found natural ways to cure things (poultice) or the players will need to go on a quest to get a cure.

*shrug* suit yourself. just saying, going on a quest to remove a curse once is interesting. going on a quest to remove a curse for the fifth time because of a monster that keeps showing up in a random encounter? not so interesting.

or, in other words, it's fine to use those monsters, but you should plan when you use them carefully; they really shouldn't be part of any meaningless fights, because as much as that makes sense, it will lead to the party getting sidetracked with no resulting benefit.

[1Forge]

My question for the playground.

I need a world to build around, or at least a map of a country that I can fluff up.

Is there a place to find generic maps?

Also, I'm sure I'm missing something, do you have any suggestions for a campaign such as this?

I recommend donjon world maker : https://donjon.bin.sh/fantasy/world/ creates entire continents for you (they're randomly generated) the only issue these might have is they lable some cities for you (like "jafrons deamon lich keep" or something like that)

And campaign-wise I love the idea (I tried something like this (only arcane magic was lost) but my party got super ticked at me and now we are still playing high magic campaigns) but whats the quest set? are they restoring magic, purging magical blights, or something else? (If i was you I would emphasize the populations begruging of magical creatures, then introduce them to an individual (make them a fey or celestial someone magical) who survived the magic-blight that they have to take somewhere to either A restore magic or B send it all away including monsters)

Also this feels kinda like lord of the rings, where magic began to fade as humanity grew stronger and how eventually it all left or dried up.

[Zevox]

I guess the only thing I have to say is that I'd make sure your players are cool with the idea first. This may just be me, but I look at that list of available classes and think that if my DM told me that was all I could choose for our next campaign, I'd have a hard time picking one, because they're basically all of the classes I'm least interested in playing. I guess I'm just the sort who likes having at least some magic in his characters, but yeah, I'd never play a Barbarian, and the only reasons I'd normally consider playing Fighter, Rogue, or Monk would be for the Eldritch Knight, Arcane Trickster, or Four Elements versions - or to multiclass with, perhaps.

I suppose there's every possibility you just don't have anyone like me in that regard in your group, but perhaps it bears mentioning, just in case.

[Steampunkette]

Add psionics.

[squab]

Not quite what you're doing, but when I read through the classes I wondered about a low magic world where an eldritch knight with the ritual casting feat was close to the pinnacle of magical achievement. Not 100% gone but very rare and no full casters around. Ban full casters, rangers/paladins get 1/3 casting.

Since I'm biased towards playing a caster, this is the most magic-free world I'd want to play.

[CNagy]

Monks become rock stars in a suddenly magic-less world. Even if you restrict it to Open Hand monks, Ki-empowered Striking is now the last reliable method of killing things that are otherwise very difficult to kill. Expect a massive rise in monastery popularity. Outright immunity to disease and poison becomes very valuable in this world without clerical cures.

Oh, and don't count out the dead just yet! Unlife always finds a way; there may not be any necromancers or death cults with the juju to create new undead, but the few species of self-propagating undead can start to pose a major problem since the balance of power has shifted somewhat in their favor.

[ThermalSlapShot]

I recommend donjon world maker : https://donjon.bin.sh/fantasy/world/ creates entire continents for you (they're randomly generated) the only issue these might have is they lable some cities for you (like "jafrons deamon lich keep" or something like that)

And campaign-wise I love the idea (I tried something like this (only arcane magic was lost) but my party got super ticked at me and now we are still playing high magic campaigns) but whats the quest set? are they restoring magic, purging magical blights, or something else? (If i was you I would emphasize the populations begruging of magical creatures, then introduce them to an individual (make them a fey or celestial someone magical) who survived the magic-blight that they have to take somewhere to either A restore magic or B send it all away including monsters)

Also this feels kinda like lord of the rings, where magic began to fade as humanity grew stronger and how eventually it all left or dried up.
Ooo, thanks! I'll take a look at that as soon as I can.

The comparison to LotR makes me not want to do this any more... People in that setting really can't do much except move and hit stuff... Like... I'll need a way to make sure the characters themselves aren't so casual.

I'm changing the fluff background now, maybe instead of magic being taken away there just wasn't magic to begin with or... I don't know right now but if my fluff is anything like LotR I'll just figure something else out.


I guess the only thing I have to say is that I'd make sure your players are cool with the idea first. This may just be me, but I look at that list of available classes and think that if my DM told me that was all I could choose for our next campaign, I'd have a hard time picking one, because they're basically all of the classes I'm least interested in playing. I guess I'm just the sort who likes having at least some magic in his characters, but yeah, I'd never play a Barbarian, and the only reasons I'd normally consider playing Fighter, Rogue, or Monk would be for the Eldritch Knight, Arcane Trickster, or Four Elements versions - or to multiclass with, perhaps.

I suppose there's every possibility you just don't have anyone like me in that regard in your group, but perhaps it bears mentioning, just in case.

Yup, but my group tends to pull weird stuff all the time so this wouldn't be anything out of the blue.


Add psionics.

No, this isn't Dark Sun, the planet is alive and working well. There just isn't any connection to the gods/hell/whatever else. Plus I rather not replace "magic" with "not magic" and need to homebrew a fee classes.


Not quite what you're doing, but when I read through the classes I wondered about a low magic world where an eldritch knight with the ritual casting feat was close to the pinnacle of magical achievement. Not 100% gone but very rare and no full casters around. Ban full casters, rangers/paladins get 1/3 casting.

Since I'm biased towards playing a caster, this is the most magic-free world I'd want to play.

I love playing me some casters too. However it's good to expand and do different things.

This is one of the reason I suspect people don't understand why people want martials to be balanced or that there is an unbalanced aspect to the game at all (maybe not you specifically). Some people just don't want to play anything but casters/partial casters and don't get how the game causes problems like 3e in regards to the quadratic wizard linear fighter.

Balance isn't the reason this campaign is made though.


Monks become rock stars in a suddenly magic-less world. Even if you restrict it to Open Hand monks, Ki-empowered Striking is now the last reliable method of killing things that are otherwise very difficult to kill. Expect a massive rise in monastery popularity. Outright immunity to disease and poison becomes very valuable in this world without clerical cures.

Oh, and don't count out the dead just yet! Unlife always finds a way; there may not be any necromancers or death cults with the juju to create new undead, but the few species of self-propagating undead can start to pose a major problem since the balance of power has shifted somewhat in their favor.

Oh certainly and that is kind of how I like it. But just because the world won't have clerics doesn't mean they won't have other medicine or ways to deal with stuff.

Yeah new undead can't be raised via magic but undead already made that can repopulate are around somewhere. It can lead to an Ultron incident where you need to take out ever last copy or else you have the problem all over again.

This can also allow me to make certain monsters be "one of a kind" and once that threat is taken out there aren't more waiting around the corner. In many D&D games if you take out the head Vampire well... There can be another head Vampire down the street. Not a big fan of multiple head honcho monsters of the same type.

[Zevox]

The comparison to LotR makes me not want to do this any more... People in that setting really can't do much except move and hit stuff... Like... I'll need a way to make sure the characters themselves aren't so casual.

I'm changing the fluff background now, maybe instead of magic being taken away there just wasn't magic to begin with or... I don't know right now but if my fluff is anything like LotR I'll just figure something else out.
It's not. Magic in LotR is simply primarily the domain of Elves and the gods, and some creatures directly empowered by those gods (such as Dragons). Few Humans ever do anything truly magical, and those that do are mostly themselves descendants of Elves (and one particular goddess). If it can be said that magic was "leaving the world" in LotR, it's only because the Elves were; and the fall of Sauron, Saruman, and some of the more powerful supernatural creatures remaining in Middle-Earth (i.e. Smaug, the Balrog of Moria), plus the departure of Gandalf meant that many of the last major remnants of non-Elven supernatural power were gone by the end of that story as well.

[ImSAMazing]

The world is a dark and depressing place. The gods have blocked the plane off from all others (and no one knows why).

You are now alone. The entire world is alone.

First to go was divine magic and then the last drops of arcane magic dried up.

++++

Classes Available: Barbarian (Beserker), Fighter (Battle Master), Fighter (Champion), Rogue (Assassin), Rogue (Thief), and Monk (Open Hand).

All PCs at first level gain the feat Healer or Inspiring Leader. Magic feats that give new Spells don't exist but feats that are able to be applied to racial abilities can exist.

The only magic a PC will have access to is from racial abilities. (Probably will change all references to per long rest to per short rest)

Monsters will have their magic but for the most part magic will be gone. Cockatrice and Medusa will still be able to turn someone into stone and a Nothic can still use Weird Insight. Although new undead and mummies can't be raised via normal means... Any undead or mummies already around when the plane was blocked off can still be around.

Magic items will be rare, these will be relics from the past and at most each player will find one permanent magic item. Consumable magic items will be rare but not as much as permanent items.

+++

My question for the playground.

I need a world to build around, or at least a map of a country that I can fluff up.

Is there a place to find generic maps?

Also, I'm sure I'm missing something, do you have any suggestions for a campaign such as this?

Interesting. You can use Google.com(an very unknown site) for campaigns, but it's really interesting.

[ThermalSlapShot]

Interesting. You can use Google.com(an very unknown site) for campaigns, but it's really interesting.

.... Really?

I wasn't asking for campaign information but generic map making and idea for what I described.

I'm not sure why you think I don't know what Google is, or why I would need information on other campaigns, but thanks I'll keep Google in mind when I look for other campaigns.

[KorvinStarmast]

With the magic "blocked off" there is no animating force left to keep the undead operating.

FWIW.

[ThermalSlapShot]

With the magic "blocked off" there is no animating force left to keep the undead operating.

FWIW.

Eh, residual magic keeps them going, think of how constructs work and stuff.

[Elbeyon]

What about new undead? Are undead now a dying type of creature that is going to fade into the void?

[ThermalSlapShot]

What about new undead? Are undead now a dying type of creature that is going to fade into the void?

Most undead are not repopulating such as zombies, however undead such as vampires and maybe wights can still repopulate. Mostly a case by case scenario.

There may not be any normal undead, might just say that Blights (really love Blights) are the only undead outside of specific boss type characters.

[KorvinStarmast]

Eh, residual magic keeps them going, think of how constructs work and stuff. OK, I see where that could fit, haven't messed much with constructs other than HAL. :smallbiggrin:

OffTopic: we had a Traveler campaign ages ago where we discovered that the arch villain we were trying to stop was a version of HAL from 2001. Good fun, that was. We sure chased a lot of meat based systems in the process.

[sudowned]

Eh, residual magic keeps them going, think of how constructs work and stuff.

So there's residual magic that powers undead, but non-divine, non-planar arcane magic doesn't work? Feels a little odd.

Though I can imagine awful cabals of reverse-Necromancers who set packs of self-renewing undead on towns, and then round up all the new undead to extract residual magic out of them. Creepy and awesome.

[JNAProductions]

So there's residual magic that powers undead, but non-divine, non-planar arcane magic doesn't work? Feels a little odd.

Though I can imagine awful cabals of reverse-Necromancers who set packs of self-renewing undead on towns, and then round up all the new undead to extract residual magic out of them. Creepy and awesome.

Can I steal this idea? Because that's just an awesome idea on all kinds of levels.

[ThermalSlapShot]

So there's residual magic that powers undead, but non-divine, non-planar arcane magic doesn't work? Feels a little odd.

Though I can imagine awful cabals of reverse-Necromancers who set packs of self-renewing undead on towns, and then round up all the new undead to extract residual magic out of them. Creepy and awesome.

Magic items, golems, and constructs all will still exist. In this same vein so will certain undead.

Unlife finds a way?

Really I'm OK with just Blights being the only undead and having it be more biological plant repopulation that happen to be undead too.

[Talcan]

If you're into anime, this idea has a very Sword Art Online feel to it. Well minus the stuck in a video game aspect. I really like the idea behind this. Perhaps you can look online and take some of the "floor" plans from SAO?

[ThermalSlapShot]

If you're into anime, this idea has a very Sword Art Online feel to it. Well minus the stuck in a video game aspect. I really like the idea behind this. Perhaps you can look online and take some of the "floor" plans from SAO?

Hmmm, never heard of that anime, I'll check it out.

[JNAProductions]

It's... Eh. It's not the best anime, but the first half isn't too bad. (Just watch out for chickification.)

The second half, though, is bad.

A bit more on topic, is it possible to ritual cast? Get thirty or forty people with a bit of magic, and if they all work hard enough, an hour later cast some minor spell like Mending?

[ThermalSlapShot]

It's... Eh. It's not the best anime, but the first half isn't too bad. (Just watch out for chickification.)

The second half, though, is bad.

A bit more on topic, is it possible to ritual cast? Get thirty or forty people with a bit of magic, and if they all work hard enough, an hour later cast some minor spell like Mending?

Nope, no rituals or Spells. The weave and deities are gone.

The racial spells are the only exception. Kinda like the difference in 3e between Su, Spells, and Spell Like Abilities. Racial magic is more biological than magical.

[Steampunkette]

Dark Sun has Magic. It's actually a really big and important feature of the setting with a lot of social and environmental considerations to it's use.

That said, not wanting to add Psionics because it fills a similar role is understandable.

[ThermalSlapShot]

Dark Sun has Magic. It's actually a really big and important feature of the setting with a lot of social and environmental considerations to it's use.

That said, not wanting to add Psionics because it fills a similar role is understandable.

Yeah and Dark Sun is fantastic, however, there is just no need for magic or psionics for what I want the campaign to be.

[ImSAMazing]

.... Really?

I wasn't asking for campaign information but generic map making and idea for what I described.

I'm not sure why you think I don't know what Google is, or why I would need information on other campaigns, but thanks I'll keep Google in mind when I look for other campaigns.

Well, first, about Google was a joke... Second, you can use google for maps/idea's.

[mr_odd]

My first experience with D&D was in a 3.5 no magic campaign. It was awesome.