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View Full Version : Optimization Elemental Weirds - how to acquire them?



Segev
2015-06-16, 10:27 PM
Elemental Weirds are amongst the most potent of potential minions when it comes to lists of cool abilities to exploit. However, the most straight-forward means of acquiring such a minion seems to be Greater Planar Binding, for which one would have to wait until 15th level at the very least (barring shenanigans). While doubtless intentional, and good for balance to keep it to at least that late, I am curious if anybody has ideas for how one could build towards having such minions as early as possible. I'd like to exclude the Candle of Invocation, as I've already thought of it and it's too build-independent (even a commoner could do it).

While we're at it, coming up with the best way to build a minion-based ultra-caster, not because of numbers of minions, but because of how he selects them for key abilities. (I suppose in a way this is a pokemaster, though I'm looking for it being played a little less like a joke and more like a powerful mage who just happens to rely on mystic servants.)

Anyway, this isn't for a specific concept, so feel free to ignore my prior imprecation if it amuses you.

Crake
2015-06-16, 10:31 PM
Planar bind an efreeti, wish for a scroll of greater planar binding, use the greater planar binding scroll to bind a weird?

Snowbluff
2015-06-16, 10:47 PM
Mirror Mephit -> Simulacrum SLA?

Venger
2015-06-16, 10:55 PM
Mirror Mephit -> Simulacrum SLA?

they only have 15HD, so that'd work. you still need to find one though. shapechange alway works, or polymorph if you're something like a winterhaunt of Iborighu to do it a little sooner.

WhamBamSam
2015-06-17, 01:17 AM
Elementals are spirits, so it could be done with Spirit Binding as a Wu Jen (or someone else who gets hold of the Spirit Binding line via chicanery).

jiriku
2015-06-17, 01:53 AM
You have two tasks here. The first is to get a copy of the spell, the second is to cast it.

To cast the spell is the more difficult task.
(1) A wizard 5/red wizard 5 can heighten any prepared spell to 8th level and then swap it to greater planar binding using rary's arcane conversion. Other prestige classes with access to circle magic can do the same.
(2) Any wizard with a lucky roll can cast it from a scroll by making a caster level check. Optimizing caster level checks is its own topic.
(3) A character with a reasonable Use Magic Device check can UMD the scroll. This opens the door to other classes like warlock and artificer accessing the spell.

Obtaining the spell is less difficult.
(1) In many campaign worlds, people sell scrolls of these things.
(2) An artificer or warlock can fake it long enough to scribe a scroll of it.
(3) Any wizard capable of casting 9th level spells who is attuned to a tome of ancient lore can prepare it without knowing it, then scribe the prepared copy into a spellbook. From there, it's an easy spellcraft check to create copies in additional spellbooks. I should mention that the aforementioned red wizard finds it trivially easy to heighten spells to 9th level to meet this requirement.

Segev
2015-06-17, 09:18 AM
Hm. Interesting approaches. Sounds like, barring "buy a one-shot and hope your UMD/CL is good enough," this is at earliest a 10th level thing. Still probably a big leap in power at that stage, especially if you can find a way to get it to travel with you (and double especially if you happen to be facing elementals). The item-based versions are at big risk from the ability to pit their SR 25 against your trap, so you'll want the special diagram that does away with that option.

A 10th level character having to go to ritualistic lengths to achieve this is a good thing; nice and dramatic. It's the kind of thing heroes might try to stop a villain from succeeding at, lest he gain a massive leap in power well beyond his current level.