Where is Thog? *SPOILERS*

[CardboardPizzas]

Come on, I can't be the only one wondering this. Thog was crushed by rocks, but there must be some chance that he's still alive. The Giant would have shown his dead body under the rocks if he was, but I can't see anyone wanting to rescue him except from maybe Sabine, or perhaps, in a surprise re-entry, Hilgya or Pompey. Do you think he's alive, and if so, who rescued him or did he escape on his own?

[Brendanicus]

I suspect everyone's favorite Half-Orc will become of the Western Resistance sub-plot, whenever that gets visited. Having him encounter the Order again seems unlikely unless Sabine somehow visits them first. Even then, she would only go after the Order if ordered to by her IFCC superiors.

Honestly, it's a 50/50 split as to where he will show up next.

[KillianHawkeye]

The answer is... we don't know.

Although considering how the Linear Guild imploded, I'm not sure his ultimate fate is even relevant anymore. As you pointed out, there isn't really anyone left who would want to save Thog, much less any reason for him to ever come across the OOTS again.

Even Sabine, the only Linear Guild member who we're certain is still around and has the connections and motivation to possibly do anything, is more interested in getting revenge against Tarquin (another character whose role in the story may be more or less finished) than going after the gates or interfering with the Order again. She could appear whenever the IFCC comes back into the story, but I personally don't believe she cares about any of that at all at this point.

I'm of the opinion that Thog was tough enough to survive having a ton of rocks fall on him, and also that you never assume someone is dead without seeing the body. But alive or dead, I don't really see him coming back at this point, except perhaps in some sort of cameo appearance.

[CardboardPizzas]

The answer is... we don't know.

Although considering how the Linear Guild imploded, I'm not sure his ultimate fate is even relevant anymore. As you pointed out, there isn't really anyone left who would want to save Thog, much less any reason for him to ever come across the OOTS again.

Even Sabine, the only Linear Guild member who we're certain is still around and has the connections and motivation to possibly do anything, is more interested in getting revenge against Tarquin (another character whose role in the story may be more or less finished) than going after the gates or interfering with the Order again. She could appear whenever the IFCC comes back into the story, but I personally don't believe she cares about any of that at all at this point.

I'm of the opinion that Thog was tough enough to survive having a ton of rocks fall on him, and also that you never assume someone is dead without seeing the body. But alive or dead, I don't really see him coming back at this point, except perhaps in some sort of cameo appearance.

But if Sabine wanted revenge on Tarquin, Thog would be useful, as he is easily manipulatable and knows that Sabine has a connection with Nale. Then, if she told him Nale was killed by Tarquin, he'd probably go on a barbarian rampage like when Elan told him that the prison bars ate Nale's breadcrumbs and punched a clown. As for where he would fit in with the Order, I don't know. Maybe it would have something to do with Thog looking for 'not-nale' to get some kind of closure, but it's unlikely.

[Bird]

My guess is that Thog's dead. Since the Giant hinted (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=15364378&postcount=36) that Nale might not be lawful, my theory is that the two of them are in for a reunion in the CE afterlife.

[Hazetar]

Here you go:
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0813.html

Panel three should explain everything to you.

The fate of Thog is unknown at this moment. But I remember some speculations on forum that in this (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0918.html) strip Thog is somewhere in the pile of dead beings of Lee inbox. If that is true - I do not know.

I think Thog will return at the very end of the comic. It would be a pleasant supprise. Maybe as additional happy aspect of the ending? Yep. That would be good. An seriously injured Thog that got recovered. Everyone would felt pity towards him and happiness because he got alive.

[Peelee]

Eh, I kind of feel like that was the end of Thog's time in the comic. What else is there for him to do, really? I could be surprised, but I'm not expecting him back.

[Kish]

The Giant would have shown his dead body under the rocks if he was,
If, and only if, Rich had wanted to immediately establish "Yes, Thog is dead." If he had, it would have telegraphed "This book is the end of the Linear Guild."

The only thing less likely than Thog having gone to the Nine Hells as a Lawful Evil soul, is Thog turning out to still be alive and it being part of a happy ending. Charming and childlike or not we're still talking about a brutal spree killer.

[Keltest]

Here you go:
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0813.html

Panel three should explain everything to you.

The fate of Thog is unknown at this moment. But I remember some speculations on forum that in this (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0918.html) strip Thog is somewhere in the pile of dead beings of Lee inbox. If that is true - I do not know.

I think Thog will return at the very end of the comic. It would be a pleasant supprise. Maybe as additional happy aspect of the ending? Yep. That would be good. An seriously injured Thog that got recovered. Everyone would felt pity towards him and happiness because he got alive.

While there is an orc or half-orc in the pile. he is definitely not thog, as he has a beard.

[Kantaki]

I suspect everyone's favorite Half-Orc will become of the Western Resistance sub-plot, whenever that gets visited.

I'm pretty sure Therkla won't show up again. Her part of the story ended with her.:smalltongue::smallbiggrin:

As for Thog, I doubt we will see him again. Outside of Prequels o course. Even if he somehow survived the Arena collapsing over him Tarquin did not intend to let him live. While Sabine might still show up when the story focuses on the Fiends or possibly as a part of the resistance the Western Continent felt very much like a end for Nale and the Linear Guild and Thogs only role was as Nales muscle. And since even Nale viewed him as expendable who would have any interest in freeing him or bringing him back?

Aunt Edith says: Re Keltest: I can see atleast two other (half-)orcs in that pile. It's still possible that one of them is Thog.

[Cool Trash]

He couldn't have been in Lee's pile: he's a devil, Lawful Evil, and by every interpretation up to and including his class Thog couldn't have been Lawful Evil.

If Nale was just fooling himself into thinking he was Lawful Evil, which I'd easily agree with, he'd be Neutral Evil, not chaotic; Remember, "it's all about whether people knew that he was the victor". That's textbook ******* alignment. That said, there are portions of Dnd hell(Carceri, I think) where both Chaotic and Neutral Evils may reside.

Getting back to the matter at hand, I could see Tarquin deciding, now that he's lost a good deal of favor with his team (if a third of them haven't been killed by the snarl) and he has no partner to back him up, recruiting Thog for his level despite him being a loose cannon. I imagine the next time we see him, Tarquin won't be particularly stable; the way he views the world has fundamentally failed him, and from what we've been told, outside of being trope-saavy he has no idea how to run a country.

Honestly, I see him teaming up with Thog through a kind of degeneartive arc, making the same mistakes that Nale did and doing everything he can to service his own ego and make the story all about him, now that his son has completely blown him off for more important matters.

[Peelee]

I'm pretty sure Therkla won't show up again. Her part of the story ended with her.:smalltongue::smallbiggrin:

https://media.giphy.com/media/b9aScKLxdv0Y0/giphy.gif

Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

[dancrilis]

I am not convinced that the Linear Guild are out of the story yet - I think that depends on if the Inter-Fiend Cooperation Commission need them are not, remember Sabine was originally sent to serve Nale as he had serious potential they might have no interest in letting that potential go to waste.

If the commission needs them present they will likely be present - and if they the team might be Nale, Sabine, Zz'dtri and Thog.

[littlebum2002]

Tarquin has wanted to kill Thog from the very beginning, and the only reason he didn't do so was because the audience loved him. Now he has a great excuse just to off him. I think Thog is a goner.

However, we still have that very suspicious hint that Rich gave about Nale's alignment that never came to anything, and that strikes me as odd. I have the feeling this means that Nale, while not coming back from the dead (due to other comments from Rich about how that ruins narratives) is probably in the Chaotic Evil afterlife with Sabine and Thog planning revenge not on the Order but on his father.

[Hazetar]

If, and only if, Rich had wanted to immediately establish "Yes, Thog is dead." If he had, it would have telegraphed "This book is the end of the Linear Guild."

The only thing less likely than Thog having gone to the Nine Hells as a Lawful Evil soul, is Thog turning out to still be alive and it being part of a happy ending. Charming and childlike or not we're still talking about a brutal spree killer.

Maybe I poorly expressed my thoughts. I'm sorry for that. I understand that Thog as a character is a villan that killed a lot of pepole and he is evil. I know that even so strong character like Thog could not survived what happen during his duel with Roy but it would be a nice if our half-orc somehow managed to get out from that pile of rocks.

As for the part with Lee Inbox - I just pointed out that for the sake of argument. I never said if that is true and after which was previously explained - it is highly unlikely if Thog ended up there.

As the story starts to end the enemies of OOTS falls. Maybe it was final moment of Thog?

[Bulldog Psion]

Well, I sincerely doubt that we've seen the end of Sabine and the Directors in the story.

When Sabine returns to the Prime Material Plane, I'd suspect that she may locate Thog as the sole surviving Linear Guild member other than herself, assuming that he's still alive.

So, I'd say -- next Sabine sighting is probably the last chance for another Thog sighting. If he doesn't show up then, he's permanently dead already. That's just my opinion/guesswork, of course.

[theasl]

side note: I don't really think you need to mark threads for spoilers, just assume everyone posting has read the entire webcomic (excluding book material).

[Jay R]

Until the Empire of Blood digs out the rubble, and Rich chooses to show the result in a panel, Thog is neither alive nor dead. He exists in a quantum superposition of both states.

:thog:: THOG NOW SCHRÖDINGER'S ORC!

[ti'esar]

I used to be in the "Thog is dead and it just wasn't shown clearly so the Giant wouldn't prematurely give away that this arc was the Linear Guild's last hurrah" camp. But - and I do realize there are flaws in this reasoning - there have been so many chances for the Giant to confirm him as dead that have been passed over that I'm now strongly leaning towards assuming Thog is still alive. (Or at least mobile, he might be undead.)

[Porthos]

Too many people have returned that were thought to be long gone from the story by some for me to catagorically reject the idea of Thog ever returning.

Mind, I'm not giving it great odds. But I think it is fairly certain we'll see Sabine again. If so, there's a natural hook right there.

[Gift Jeraff]

However Thog is going to return--alive, undead, in the afterlofe, a 1-panel gag confirming his death, or what have you--is obviously meant to be a surprise, given the continued ambiguity in forum posts and the book commentary long after Nale's death.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Considering the Giant likes to play his card so close to the vest they're actually inside his shirt, I doubt he'll ever say anything about Thog. If it turns out he needs him 300 strips down the road, he's alive. If he never needs his presence, Thog's dead.

[AvatarVecna]

But if Sabine wanted revenge on Tarquin, Thog would be useful, as he is easily manipulatable and knows that Sabine has a connection with Nale. Then, if she told him Nale was killed by Tarquin, he'd probably go on a barbarian rampage like when Elan told him that the prison bars ate Nale's breadcrumbs and punched a clown. As for where he would fit in with the Order, I don't know. Maybe it would have something to do with Thog looking for 'not-nale' to get some kind of closure, but it's unlikely.

That may all be true, but the point the poster above you was trying to make is that, whether Thog is dead or not, his part in the primary OotS story is almost assuredly over. It's possible that Sabine and Thog will join Ian Starshine's ongoing rebellion against Tarkin. It's possible that Sabine, Thog, and Nale will meet up in the CE afterlife and continue having a merry old time together. It's possible that Tarkin will manipulate Thog into being his lieutenant. But most importantly, it doesn't really matter what happens in next in Thog's life story, because this is not the story of Thog, but of the Order of the Stick.

One oft-quoted line in this story is "The end of what, son? The story? There is no end, there's just the point where storytellers stop talking". Just because a story finishes without resolving every side-character's plotline doesn't mean those plotlines had no purpose: by having tangential parts of the story continue beyond the main story, it makes the world feel more real: the fact of the matter is, just because we're following the OotS members, and we'll never see Thog again, doesn't mean his story doesn't continue, just that it continues elsewhere. By leaving plot threads like that open, it makes the world seem more real; as a side-benefit, it leaves the author wiggle room in case they want to write sequels or supplements involving those stories, as well as letting fanfic writers have the freedom to imagine stuff going on behind the scenes. But because those side-stories aren't essential to telling the main story, and working them into the main character's perspective would be forced and contrived, it's better to leave them out.

The exact details of how Merope Gaunt slowly came into her magic after her relatives were arrested would make for an interesting story in its own regards, complete with a twist ending that she turned out to be just as twisted inside as her family; it would make for a great tragic story, but knowing all the details isn't essential for telling the story of how Harry Potter came to defeat Voldemort. The story of how Cedric Diggory became a Hufflepuff so well-liked and magically capable that he was selected for the Tri-Wizard tournament despite some stiff competition would make for an amazing story in and of itself...but that's not necessary to the plot of Harry Potter. Knowing who Galen Marek's mother is, how she married a Jedi despite the Jedi Order having issues with Jedi marrying, why she wasn't with her husband/lover and their son on Kashyyyk, and why her husband/lover and their son were on Kashyyyk in the first place isn't important to the story of Galen Marek.

We don't currently know Thog's final fate. And unless it becomes vital to the plot of the main story, we don't really need to know.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

At this point, I think the odds are against his return, but not straight up impossible. I do think that if he returns it will not be in the same capacity (i.e. as a main antagonist of the order), but rather as part of the Western Comtinent plot.

[LeSwordfish]

I'm surprised nobody's predicting what i'm predicting: Sabine and Thog will turn up at the last minute on the side of the Order and proceed to kick some ass - Sabine's already been helping Vaarsuvius.

Put it this way, the idea that the giant would simply leave those elements of the Linear Guild hanging is really wierd to me. Sabine is tied to the Fiends, right? We've still got the end of their plot to get to. If Sabine is back, why not Thog?

[Storm_Of_Snow]

I'm surprised nobody's predicting what i'm predicting: Sabine and Thog will turn up at the last minute on the side of the Order and proceed to kick some ass - Sabine's already been helping Vaarsuvius.

Put it this way, the idea that the giant would simply leave those elements of the Linear Guild hanging is really wierd to me. Sabine is tied to the Fiends, right? We've still got the end of their plot to get to. If Sabine is back, why not Thog?
Equally, why can't Sabine come back on her own? As said before, if he's needed in the story, Thog will come back. Otherwise, it's immaterial - maybe we'll get a wrap up at the end showing us either him walking around or his grave, maybe it'll only be relevant if The Giant does a new story in the OOTS verse, or maybe it'll just be left hanging.

After all, it's not like other plot thread haven't been left hanging, some of which are likely to come back, others less so - for example, the death of the Azure City resistance ended that story line, but there's still all the prisoners that saw O-Chul standing up to Redcloak.

There's also whatever Roy wanted Roy's Archon to do (in #664).

[D.One]

Dead or alive, Tarquin has (had) him (or his body), so, if he is to reappear (a big IF in itself), I believe the reappearance will have some conection to T or, at least, will show how the one who brought him (possibly Sabine) rescued him from the empire of Blood.

That said, Thog's role is mostly done. He was a physical threat, mainly against Roy, and Roy defeated him, solo, so I believe another appearance will be almost a cameo, just to show he's still around.

[Keltest]

I'm surprised nobody's predicting what i'm predicting: Sabine and Thog will turn up at the last minute on the side of the Order and proceed to kick some ass - Sabine's already been helping Vaarsuvius.

Put it this way, the idea that the giant would simply leave those elements of the Linear Guild hanging is really wierd to me. Sabine is tied to the Fiends, right? We've still got the end of their plot to get to. If Sabine is back, why not Thog?

Much like Belkar, Thog teeters between asset and liability at the best of times. While he is very competent at raw destruction, asking him to do something else (for example, wait) has historically been dangerous ground. Since its unlikely Sabine would make a return for the purpose of mass destruction, I don't think its likely she would bring Thog with her unless there were other factors involved.

[LeSwordfish]

Perhaps Sabine rescues Thog from Tarquin's dungeon the day before heading to fight Team Evil. Perhaps Nayl's death is enough to motivate Thog. Perhaps she uses her fiendly powers to get an infinite supply of fudge ripple.

Okay, well look at it another way: I think that leaving thog's fate unknown would be so stunningly narratively unsatisfying that if the giant is doing it, he's doing it deliberately for a good (as yet unknown) reason because otherwise it's the clumsiest thing he's done in a decade of plotting.

Tarquin's fate might remain unknown because that's the point of his ending. To suggest that the giant is capable of making such a colossal narrative mistake a few hundred strips before spearing the same mistake as "no closure" is almost a bit insulting.

[Kish]

I have never known anyone who used the "You're calling Rich a bad writer by saying he didn't do what I would do" argument to be right yet.

And that's from people who didn't somehow get the impression that Tarquin, Tarquin, was speaking as Rich's mouthpiece in Tarquin's fundamental narrative disagreement with Elan.

[falsedot]

Okay, well look at it another way: I think that leaving thog's fate unknown .

Uh why is it unknown. Yes we didnt see yhe body but that doesnt mean that we should expect that he is dead. What should Rich do, make sure that everyone is disintegrated (and keep reminding us that he hates true res)? I dont see why it is not reasonable to expect that the reader will assume the character is dead, much less why it is naratively unsatisfying; in fact, I find the alternative extremelu cliched and annoyinf

[Keltest]

Uh why is it unknown. Yes we didnt see yhe body but that doesnt mean that we should expect that he is dead. What should Rich do, make sure that everyone is disintegrated (and keep reminding us that he hates true res)? I dont see why it is not reasonable to expect that the reader will assume the character is dead, much less why it is naratively unsatisfying; in fact, I find the alternative extremelu cliched and annoyinf

Certainly his fate is not ambiguous enough that it would be a writing flaw. If he doesn't show up again for the rest of the story, its because he was killed. If he does show up, its because something happened to make him not dead, whether that be resurrection of just surviving.

Once the narrative is over, it will make it abundantly clear which one we are suppose to think, either way.

[Peelee]

Perhaps Sabine rescues Thog from Tarquin's dungeon the day before heading to fight Team Evil. Perhaps Nayl's death is enough to motivate Thog. Perhaps she uses her fiendly powers to get an infinite supply of fudge ripple.

Okay, well look at it another way: I think that leaving thog's fate unknown would be so stunningly narratively unsatisfying that if the giant is doing it, he's doing it deliberately for a good (as yet unknown) reason because otherwise it's the clumsiest thing he's done in a decade of plotting.

Tarquin's fate might remain unknown because that's the point of his ending. To suggest that the giant is capable of making such a colossal narrative mistake a few hundred strips before spearing the same mistake as "no closure" is almost a bit insulting.

Why? Thog was nothing without Nale; for instance, he was the people's champion in the arena, and seemed pretty cool with that. He could have done that for years, and never thought about the Order, had Roy not been dumped in front of him. Nale is now gone. What purpose would Thog have to return? Roy defeated him in pretty epic combat, the linear guild is dismantled, and the road to Xykon remains. Plenty of closure, as far as I'm concerned. Whether or not The Giant agrees remains to be seen.

[D.One]

Why? Thog was nothing without Nale; for instance, he was the people's champion in the arena, and seemed pretty cool with that. He could have done that for years, and never thought about the Order, had Roy not been dumped in front of him. Nale is now gone. What purpose would Thog have to return? Roy defeated him in pretty epic combat, the linear guild is dismantled, and the road to Xykon remains. Plenty of closure, as far as I'm concerned. Whether or not The Giant agrees remains to be seen.

Agreed. Thog already had his closure. He's got in touch with his inner and outer greeness (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0392.html).:smallwink:

[MilesBeyond]

I'm 90% sure he's dead, just because I kinda got the impression that Rich was annoyed with the way that no matter how blatantly evil Thog was, the readers still loved him.

[runeghost]

I think that he's dead, and in the Lower Planes. There, plot-wise, he's waiting for Belkar's inevitable death so that he can team up with Nale, Belkar, Sabine (and probably some other dead character) to form another faction or party involved in trying to save the world from the Snarl and/or the fiends' evil plan.

[BannedInSchool]

Thog with Thog now.

[Bulldog Psion]

I think that he's dead, and in the Lower Planes. There, plot-wise, he's waiting for Belkar's inevitable death so that he can team up with Nale, Belkar, Sabine (and probably some other dead character) to form another faction or party involved in trying to save the world from the Snarl and/or the fiends' evil plan.

Though highly improbable, you've almost made me want the comic to throw in a "Team Dead" group to thwart the Directors' plans, now. Though I have a sneaking suspicion that souls in the evil afterlife are completely helpless.

[Storm_Of_Snow]

Though highly improbable, you've almost made me want the comic to throw in a "Team Dead" group to thwart the Directors' plans, now.
Surely they'd be the Order of the Stiff. :smallamused:

[AvatarVecna]

Surely they'd be the Order of the Stiff. :smallamused:

So wishing that this forum had a +1 feature or something.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

He's a villain, the hero's treat him as dead and forget about him but we never get to see the body. He's definitely coming back in some capacity, probably to great surprise of Elan because "the heroes are always surprised when that happens".

Now, he could actually be dead but still have a role as an undead creature or a spirit or something, the uncertainty about his death only assures he is coming back, not how. Having said that, he could appear anywhere at any time, he seems to be willing to smash stuff for just about anyone who comes along and tells him what to do. He could be used by Tarquin, Sabine or yes, even Nale from beyond the grave somehow (although I wouldn't actually expect Nale to be back, that's much more of a longshot). He could even stumble into the plot on his own, or join yet another person (Redcloak? The umbrella monster?)

The Order of the Stick is in general good at being unpredictable, at least to me, but the Giant also seems to be having a lot of fun with some particular tropes, my money is squarely on "we'll see him again".

[An Enemy Spy]

At the very end, Xykon will dramatically pull off his mask, revealing that he was Thog the whole time! The clues are there if you read closely.

[Bulldog Psion]

Surely they'd be the Order of the Stiff. :smallamused:

I bow before your superior puncrafting. :smallcool:

[Peelee]

He's a villain, the hero's treat him as dead and forget about him but we never get to see the body. He's definitely coming back in some capacity, probably to great surprise of Elan because "the heroes are always surprised when that happens".

Is it safe to assume you're still waiting for Grand Moff Tarkin to re-appear in the upcoming Star Wars films?

[dancrilis]

I always did like Grand Moff Tarkin - Peter Cushing possible the best part of A New Hope, he brought a cold professionalism that his role needed which really brough the entire movie to a higher level, and his lack of personal action I think is something that a lot of more recent movies could benefit from in films.

Still while I do worry the new film will not do Peter Cushing justice (although so far I am satisfied with how disney has handed the character) I think Tarkin has a good chance of appearing in Rogue One.

On Thog, there are rumors of another book coming out that is not focused on the main characters - many peg it as a Nale prequel story, however another idea that I (and possibly) have would that that a fall of Tarquin story might occur, Thog might fit better in that story than the remaining Oots storyline.

[Jay R]

At the very end, Xykon will dramatically pull off his mask, revealing that he was Thog the whole time! The clues are there if you read closely.

It's not really that obvious until you figure out Vaarsuvius's gender and what the Monster in the Darkness really is. Then, yeah, it becomes pretty clear.

[Onyavar]

In case of Miko, the Giant made it clear only a long while later that she wasn't ever coming back - just because her fan base was so annoyed with every update in which "everyone's favorite paladin" didn't make her reappearance. Sure, she's dead, but that's no problem. ALL important characters are ALWAYS resurrected in this setting. It's no wonder why Rich finds the assumption so frustrating!

Thog is just the same. At the current point, he has served his entire purpose, so his current state isn't important. Having him around would only become necessary if there is a plot point that can only be addressed by having him back in the story. At the current state of the story, I can't even remotely see Thog as an interesting person in the story - only in very contrived scenarios. He's gone from the story for around two years now, and not with a "dun-dun-dunh" either.
Storywise, he's a loose thread - showing him alive/undead/as construct would create new questions and complications. Showing/declaring him dead would serve no purpose other than making him a martyr for all his deluded fans.

My guess is he's dead, Jim. If that's correct, Rich would be foolish to blurt it out, though:
As long as the question is unanswered, it's right another open plot point open for us to speculate. Like the nine sides, the MitD identity, the circumstances and possibility of Hilgya/Redcloak's niece/Serini showing up soon, the various prophecies, Roy's task for his archon... to name a few.

[Keltest]

In case of Miko, the Giant made it clear only a long while later that she wasn't ever coming back - just because her fan base was so annoyed with every update in which "everyone's favorite paladin" didn't make her reappearance. Sure, she's dead, but that's no problem. ALL important characters are ALWAYS resurrected in this setting. It's no wonder why Rich finds the assumption so frustrating!

Thog is just the same. At the current point, he has served his entire purpose, so his current state isn't important. Having him around would only become necessary if there is a plot point that can only be addressed by having him back in the story. At the current state of the story, I can't even remotely see Thog as an interesting person in the story - only in very contrived scenarios. He's gone from the story for around two years now, and not with a "dun-dun-dunh" either.
Storywise, he's a loose thread - showing him alive/undead/as construct would create new questions and complications. Showing/declaring him dead would serve no purpose other than making him a martyr for all his deluded fans.

My guess is he's dead, Jim. If that's correct, Rich would be foolish to blurt it out, though:
As long as the question is unanswered, it's right another open plot point open for us to speculate. Like the nine sides, the MitD identity, the circumstances and possibility of Hilgya/Redcloak's niece/Serini showing up soon, the various prophecies, Roy's task for his archon... to name a few.

I disagree. Were wrapping up plot points left and right. Its one thing to leave some obviously open, because the story isn't over yet, but its working on it, and leaving them all completely ambiguous is rather pointless since he wont be able to explore them anyway.

[Onyavar]

I disagree. We're wrapping up plot points left and right. Its one thing to leave some obviously open, because the story isn't over yet, but its working on it, and leaving them all completely ambiguous is rather pointless since he wont be able to explore them anyway.

Well, the Giant doesn't need to explore them. Not answering every plot point in excruciating detail is part of many good stories. All it takes is to finish book 7 without any trace of Thog.

As far as I'm concerned, the death match against Roy was Thog's individual wrap-up. Reheating him as opponent makes little sense - except for pointless conflict, which is what the IFCC is all about. Still, I'd call it booooring.

[Keltest]

Well, the Giant doesn't need to explore them. Not answering every plot point in excruciating detail is part of many good stories. All it takes is to finish book 7 without any trace of Thog.

As far as I'm concerned, the death match against Roy was Thog's individual wrap-up. Reheating him as opponent makes little sense - except for pointless conflict, which is what the IFCC is all about. Still, I'd call it booooring.

Right, which is why theres no reason for him to not shut down the speculation about it if he feels like it.

[Peelee]

While i agree that i feel perfect closure on Thog, and the battle with Roy was his send-off, i don't feel like we should be using real time as a metric by which things should happen; the story, even in webcomic format with a paced, page-by-page release schedule, it's meant to be read both by individual strip-at-a-time (currently) and also all-at-once (when finished). When i get my wife to read through it, assuming i do so when all is said and done, she won't have experienced two years between Thog's death and the current strip. Hell, it'd be impressive if she experienced two hours between them. The time difference while writing shouldn't (and likely won't) affect the story.

[ti'esar]

Honestly, all the stuff about what a perfect sendoff for Thog the arena battle was is one of the main reasons I'm no longer certain he's dead. I used to think the same thing about it, but in hindsight that's basically saying that Rich can't possibly do better - an argument that has rarely proven true in the past.

[Keltest]

Honestly, all the stuff about what a perfect sendoff for Thog the arena battle was is one of the main reasons I'm no longer certain he's dead. I used to think the same thing about it, but in hindsight that's basically saying that Rich can't possibly do better - an argument that has rarely proven true in the past.

I don't know about that. Whether or not he could conceivably write a better send off, whether or not he should is definitely in question. If a character regularly departs in a dramatic and seemingly final manner, it seriously undermines all past and future scenes of that sort.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Is it safe to assume you're still waiting for Grand Moff Tarkin to re-appear in the upcoming Star Wars films?

Not quite the same thing, an older officer stuck in a massive exploding space station VS a character known for his strength and constitution being hit by physical damage. The amount of time passed, both in real life and the fictional universe, is also bigger in Star Wars.

There are three things I can say against my own case. The first one is that yes, it would be a good send off, I don't know where the character goes from here. The second one is that it's simply more impressive to bury Thog completely beneath the pile so deep that when they talk about it later he hasn't been found yet than to show his head with X's in his eyes sticking out of the pile. The third would be that the comic wasn't completely planned out in advanced, it's good to have some open options, things that could come back just in case they're needed.

Still, it's textbook "didn't find the body", it even gets stressed in the text that they don't know if he's dead (which is noticeably different from it never coming up). The giant just seems like someone who has way too much fun with clichéd overused tropes like that, applied in all the best ways, to create such an opportunity while he could easily have chosen another path, and then not use it. Compare it to Windstaff and Pompey, they get a bit of limelight to say they're done, and Miko dies onscreen and comes to peace with it. They could all be brought back, but their ending goes out of its way to point at "nah", rather than at "dun dun dun".

I've been wrong before, I just disagree with the majority on this one, my money 'says we'll see him again.

[Keltest]

Not quite the same thing, an older officer stuck in a massive exploding space station VS a character known for his strength and constitution being hit by physical damage. The amount of time passed, both in real life and the fictional universe, is also bigger in Star Wars.

There are three things I can say against my own case. The first one is that yes, it would be a good send off, I don't know where the character goes from here. The second one is that it's simply more impressive to bury Thog completely beneath the pile so deep that when they talk about it later he hasn't been found yet than to show his head with X's in his eyes sticking out of the pile. The third would be that the comic wasn't completely planned out in advanced, it's good to have some open options, things that could come back just in case they're needed.

Still, it's textbook "didn't find the body", it even gets stressed in the text that they don't know if he's dead (which is noticeably different from it never coming up). The giant just seems like someone who has way too much fun with clichéd overused tropes like that, applied in all the best ways, to create such an opportunity while he could easily have chosen another path, and then not use it. Compare it to Windstaff and Pompey, they get a bit of limelight to say they're done, and Miko dies onscreen and comes to peace with it. They could all be brought back, but their ending goes out of its way to point at "nah", rather than at "dun dun dun".

I've been wrong before, I just disagree with the majority on this one, my money 'says we'll see him again.

To what end though? Sure he's hilarious, but he never had his own plot; he was always a sidekick to Nale and a foil to Roy. Now that Nale is dead and Roy overcame his foil, what would be the point of bringing him back?

[Peelee]

Also, even if he were confirmed dead, he could potentially come back. Like they said in Thank You For Smoking, "thats an easy fix. One line of dialogue; 'thank god for the whatever device.'" Or, in this case, "thank god that cleric was a big fan." If he were to return, it wouldn't really matter much whether or not he's shown as dying - and it would actually be more of a surprise of he did die, since our would be more unexpected but still plausible. Yeah, it'd all be easier if he really died to start with, but not necessary.

And, to reiterate, the biggest question is, "what reason would he have to return?" Crystal coming back for revenge on Haley at least helped tie up some loose threads from the Thieve's Guild. Thog doesnt even have that going for him.

[Kish]

Ah, but which god would be getting thanked?

(In the established surviving OotS pantheons, is there a god particularly fond of mindless slaughter? I'm rusty on the relevant mythology.)

[Peelee]

Ah, but which god would be getting thanked?

(In the established surviving OotS pantheons, is there a god particularly fond of mindless slaughter? I'm rusty on the relevant mythology.)

Well, if I'm the one what gets to choose, then me. Otherwise, that's one of those pesky "details" things i tend not to worry about.

Nothing wrong with a healthy ego....

[dps]

To what end though? Sure he's hilarious, but he never had his own plot; he was always a sidekick to Nale and a foil to Roy. Now that Nale is dead and Roy overcame his foil, what would be the point of bringing him back?

Adventuring in the sequel with "not-Nale". :smallbiggrin:

Seriously, while I think it's likely that he's dead, if we do see him again, I expect him to be hooked up with the Amon-Zura/Ian/Ganji/Enor bunch.

[RagingHalfling]

Nah. Thogs dead. Rich wrapped up the whole linear guild arc.
Or did he?! Duhn duhn duuuuuuhn!!!!!

[Kish]

Let the record state that Peelee approves of mindless slaughter.

[Peelee]

Let the record state that Peelee approves of mindless slaughter.

Under the condition that I get deific powers. Seriously, you leave that part out, like, every time.

[Tiktik Ironclaw]

I think a lot of people here have got it all wrong. Because, logically, if someone weighs as much as a duck...
Joking, of course, but I see things happening like this: Sabine shows up with Thog and Zz'dtri in tow, all three wanted vengeance for Nale. The OOTS tell them to take a hike, so they meet up with the Western Resistance. THEN things get weird. Zz'dtri's handler, who collected him while he was playing dead between the OOTS's escape and the EOS arriving, allies the drow to the Resistance, and together they conquer both the Vector Legion and those racist, oppressive elves! Thoughts?

[Psyren]

My personal prediction is that Thog will show up again and whack Tarquin, probably in the middle of a triumphant monologue over the Tyrinaria Resistance Front or whatever their names are. It would be hilarious, anticlimactic, and most importantly, the absolute last way Tarquin would want to die ever.

[Peelee]

While the People's Champion overcoming his lowly gladiator status and toppling the ruler would a be very Tarquin-esque way to lose.... it's having an evil, mass-murdering psychopath rule the country really better than the evil, mass-murdering psychopath who is also Elan's father?

[Kantaki]

If I had to choose between the two I would take the one that can be kept under control with icecream.

[ti'esar]

It's not like they'd have to leave him in charge, either. (Not that I think this is likely to happen).

[Brendanicus]

My personal prediction is that Thog will show up again and whack Tarquin, probably in the middle of a triumphant monologue over the Tyrinaria Resistance Front or whatever their names are. It would be hilarious, anticlimactic, and most importantly, the absolute last way Tarquin would want to die ever.Out of all the fan theories, predictions, and what-ifs I've ever read, this one is by far the best. I really, really hope that this happens.

You know what types of villain get ganked mid-speech? The unimportant kind! Considering Tarquin's ego, that would be a far worse death than anything short of death by flumph.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

That would be funny...

I also like this one though:


while I think it's likely that he's dead, if we do see him again, I expect him to be hooked up with the Amon-Zura/Ian/Ganji/Enor bunch.

It's not a redemption story, in that we've seen how oblivious Thog is to any kind of moral conundrum and we wouldn't have it any other way, but I could see him being pretty happy fighting giant armies for a living.

On the other hand, they have a strong dumb half dragon. What (story wise) do they need another heavy hitter for?

Of course, there's no reason why both these predictions couldn't come through...

[CardboardPizzas]

My theory is that Sabine either got permission from the IFCC or went rogue, then went and dug Thog out from underneath the rubble. Thog seems to have very high strength, as shown when he destroys the prison bars, so I see no reason he should have survived. Then I would imagine that she told Thog that Nale was dead in order to make him follow her and be loyal to her with the promise ice cream with sprinkles. Then, my theory is that after the Order are done at the Godsmoot, the linear guild will go there and kill everyone because they can't tell whether or not she's a demon or devil (yes I know The Giant and the comics have confirmed that she's a demon), because by some weird coincidence absolutely nobody prepared Smite Evil or because the clerics of Thor were powerless to call miracles because they decided to bring back the ThorPrayer® machine and gave eachother colon tumors. Then they will find a 17th level cleric, who Haley states can resurrect Nale without his body, and pry diamonds off lots of valuable items the clerics had. The chosen cleric who was left alive would cast the spell, Nale would return and they'd all go and get revenge on Tarquin, because, let's face it, Nale would probably hate Tarquin enough for killing him to cast away his urge to kill Elan altogether.

[Peelee]

Thog seems to have very high strength, as shown when he destroys the prison bars, so I see no reason he should have survived.

Strength is not Constitution. In the world of Dungeon and Dragon, Con is what dictates health/vitality, while Strength dictates... strength.

[CardboardPizzas]

Strength is not Constitution. In the world of Dungeon and Dragon, Con is what dictates health/vitality, while Strength dictates... strength.

Yeah, sorry. I'm kind of still figuring out DnD, I haven't got it just yet.

[Peelee]

Yeah, sorry. I'm kind of still figuring out DnD, I haven't got it just yet.

No worries. Also, do keep in mind that even though the comic is based on D&D (specifically 3.3 edition) rules, The Giant is not absolutely bound by said rules. Also, while we have no known lower limit for Thog's Con score, it's likely to be high as well.

My rebuttal was a witty, suave, and good-looking way of saying that, while your hypothesis is possible, the odds (in my opinion) are against it.

[Kish]

My theory is that Sabine either got permission from the IFCC or went rogue, then went and dug Thog out from underneath the rubble. Thog seems to have very high strength, as shown when he destroys the prison bars, so I see no reason he should have survived. Then I would imagine that she told Thog that Nale was dead in order to make him follow her and be loyal to her with the promise ice cream with sprinkles. Then, my theory is that after the Order are done at the Godsmoot, the linear guild will go there and kill everyone because they can't tell whether or not she's a demon or devil (yes I know The Giant and the comics have confirmed that she's a demon), because by some weird coincidence absolutely nobody prepared Smite Evil or because the clerics of Thor were powerless to call miracles because they decided to bring back the ThorPrayer® machine and gave eachother colon tumors. Then they will find a 17th level cleric, who Haley states can resurrect Nale without his body, and pry diamonds off lots of valuable items the clerics had. The chosen cleric who was left alive would cast the spell, Nale would return and they'd all go and get revenge on Tarquin, because, let's face it, Nale would probably hate Tarquin enough for killing him to cast away his urge to kill Elan altogether.
That all sounds very...unrelated to the Order. Unless you're suggesting it would eventually be narrated over the course of a single strip, rather than being shown on-panel.

[dancrilis]

... based on D&D (specifically 3.3 edition) rules ...

I will admit a fondness for DnD 3.3 for the story elements it allowed and it was a good blend of 3.0 and 3.5 - although the more balanced 3.26 was arguably better overall.

[Peelee]

I will admit a fondness for DnD 3.3 for the story elements it allowed and it was a good blend of 3.0 and 3.5 - although the more balanced 3.26 was arguably better overall.

Ya know, this response was so good I'm not even gonna fix that.

[BannedInSchool]

I could have done without the continuing minor revisions of 3.14 though.

[Peelee]

I could have done without the continuing minor revisions of 3.14 though.

At least they were all different. 3.33 just kept on releasing one after another.

[D.One]

At least they were all different. 3.33 just kept on releasing one after another.

And to math fans, like myself, we had the 3.14159265359 Edition, that was praised by its well rounded calculations...:smallbiggrin:

[littlebum2002]

Well, since we all know that the 4.0 edition ruined D&D forever, then the 3.99999 edition was clearly the best.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

And that's the one they call Pathfinder, right? :smallwink:

[falsedot]

I still reminisce the golden age of 1.618...

[kivzirrum]

This thread derailment is easily the most beautiful I've ever seen.

[littlebum2002]

And that's the one they call Pathfinder, right? :smallwink:

No, Pathfinder is version 3.5.1

[Lvl 2 Expert]

My least favorite version was 3.1/3 by the way. Too repetitive.

[Jasdoif]

Well, since we all know that the 4.0 edition ruined D&D forever, then the 3.99999 edition was clearly the best.Personally, I think 6 will be perfect.

[Snails]

Logically speaking, there is no necessity for Thog to reappear.

I am 99% certain that Tarquin will make his own play at the final Gate. It is quite likely that Tarquin will find Thog as useful fodder to distract Roy or flush out his quarry. Unfortunately for Tarquin, Thog can seem easier to manipulate than he really is -- especially if you do not have a Chaotic streak (Elan, Nale) who "gets" him.

Tangent: As for dear of Grand Moff Tarkin...

I found the interplay of Tarkin and Vader to be delicious -- it really set them up to both be menacing in their particular way. Furthermore, my pet theory is that the Death Star was specifically built to squash disloyal Imperial fleets, not silly little rebellions, thus the peculiar oversights in the design. So it is highly plausible that Vader is there on the Emperor's orders to keep an eye on Tarkin, and Vader is happy to be there because Tarkin is a potential ally to kill the Emperor by means of the Death Star.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Personally, I think 6 will be perfect.

It will be twice the game 3 ever was!

[Snails]

My least favorite version was 3.1/3 by the way. Too repetitive.

At least you are being rational about it.

[Psyren]

Personally, I think 6 will be perfect.


It will be twice the game 3 ever was!

Which means we should all be REALLY excited for 7e. :smallbiggrin:

[littlebum2002]

Which means we should all be REALLY excited for 7e. :smallbiggrin:

No. 7 is going to be the game that finally ruins D&D for everyone. Until 8 comes along and makes it better again.

[BannedInSchool]

I thought there was a 3i version, but it was all a dream.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

No. 7 is going to be the game that finally ruins D&D for everyone. Until 8 comes along and makes it better again.

I think it will take until G64 until things are really perfect.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Well, at least Wizards of the Coast is still better at numbering their versions than Microsoft, that would just make things way too confusing.

[Kish]

Since they changed their minds about calling D&D 5ed "D&D Next," anyway.

[ti'esar]

Since they changed their minds about calling D&D 5ed "D&D Next," anyway.

I've never really understood what was up with that, honestly. The usual reason I've heard for fictional series abandoning numbered sequels in favor of random titles is that high installment numbers supposedly drive off new audience members. But did anyone seriously think that people would be reluctant to play D&D Fifth Edition because they hadn't done the first four?

[Kish]

I think they may have entertained the conceit that titling it D&D Next would unite their split playerbase and enable them to sell books to all the 3.x players who didn't buy 4ed books and the 4ed players who didn't want a new edition.

[BannedInSchool]

Better than calling it "D&D Troglodyte" or "D&D Unicorn". Ooh, or they could take a long view and name versions "Antepenultimate D&D" then "Penultimate D&D" to drive people into a frenzy for "ULTIMATE D&D!!!!". :smallbiggrin: Same problem with "Next" after that though. What's next? No, after that. D&D Third Base! I need drugs.

[Keltest]

Better than calling it "D&D Troglodyte" or "D&D Unicorn". Ooh, or they could take a long view and name versions "Antepenultimate D&D" then "Penultimate D&D" to drive people into a frenzy for "ULTIMATE D&D!!!!". :smallbiggrin: Same problem with "Next" after that though. What's next? No, after that. D&D Third Base! I need drugs.

D&D Rebooted of course!

[Lvl 2 Expert]

D&D Forever.


To be replaced by a hastily made slightly improved version of the previous edition two years after its introduction.