Bad DM? Or am I just off base here? (Updated)

[TheFurith]

I suspect this to be long, so bear with me here for a moment. There's a lot of things that need mentioning and want to be as clear as possible.

Myself and a friend of mine joined a Pathfinder game that another friend of our was playing. Along with some other people we met one time. Possibly the DM, but not that I recall. I thought I'd give it a shot. Hadn't played it before. Mostly just 3.5 for about ten years or so. With a lot of house rules. Thought it'd be interesting to mix it up a bit

I get there and this DM is making my friend's character with his input. Nothing terribly unusual. Except that he ignored everything he said. Everything I said. Forgot to write some things in. And added 5+5+1 and got 21. That 1 was supposed to be a 2 as well. Honest mistake. Whatever. But the rest bugged me, as this guy was now not ever close to what he wanted to be.

He then lets me make my character. I don't know Pathfinder but for twenty or so minutes of looking at the player's guide at this point. But sure. I can just write whatever I like. Why? I have no idea. Other guy couldn't and that just makes no sense to me. But whatever, I'll roll with it. See where this goes.

I made a tank fighter. Two handed flail thing with some feats to make up for the lack of shield. Figured I'll be that nice guy for once and stand up front and protect people. Then I was told I'm actually on leave from jail and that we both are "hardened criminals". Well, so much for the nice part.

We are told we are on a mission to go to the same place as the rest of the party but "our mission is separate" from theirs. We are being paid 250,000 gold to burn down a library. We are level 5. We are not told to help these other guys out with theirs. There is no dialogue between party members on the boat ride with obligatory sea monster to the place.

Did I mention we are going to a city to fight seventy ton titans? If not, I am now.

Skip ahead a bit. I've begun to notice this guy thinks a longsword is a d10. He thinks my strength is not added to weapons damage. A few other things. Not sure if house rules because it wasn't discussed, or since it's a different system I might just be wrong. Rolling with it.

For the record, the guy is going straight by the book. He just plans to run it without knowing these things.

We are in a room with a trap. I know this because I didn't fail my abysmal perception check and just know this I guess. The alchemist is going to go mess with it and it looks big so I just leave the room. He doesn't die. Then we are all on the balcony. This is the conversation I have with the DM. "But I'm still on the stairs." "You are on the balcony now." "I am?" "Yes." "What about that door we didn't open?" "Would you like to roll a climb check to go up a floor and drop down a rope?" "What? Fine...."

I get up there and the wizard fails the climb. Apparently we are not allowed to try again. If not for passing their slight of hand check to tie that rope around them self they'd still be down there I think. Yes. Slight of hand. Why? I got nothin.

Now in this room there are four rats communicating among themselves and looking at us. We've been fighting giant rats. Of course. Well I figure I'll go mess up these rats before they come up with something to screw us over with. Since talking rats seem bad. Well no. Actually I'm going to walk into side room number 1 and fail my perception check. I'm not even going to guard the door, I'm going to loot a chest that the party has gathered around.

Now that I leave I'm going to kill the...no. I'm going to room number two. At this point I'm just irritated. I'm trying not to hijack this game by talking over this guy and holding everything up. Especially being that new guy. But I haven't done anything by my own will in like ten minutes and all I'm doing is failing endless perception rolls. Which are worth bonus xp by the way. So I'm feeling like I should be trying to make checks on things, while trying to not metagame for more xp. Not cool. I'll go with it, but I'm feeling like I'm playing a video game.

After this the rats run away. We fight some pushover drow. The alchemist bombs me. So much for "no PVP". But that's because the DM insisted on not using any grid for combat. Then insisted the bomb hit me. I do nothing because "no PVP". We find some like twelve foot couple hundred pound golden anime sword thing. The half elf fighter picks it up and is told they are heavily encumbered but can wield it. It does 5d12 per swing if you spend an entire round swearing at the sword beforehand. They take it with. This sword is never used and is never mentioned again. Ever. Not even the encumbrance.

Sparing the details we set up a distraction to get by a titan and we chose to call it for the end of the night. Why? Because a player was tired and it didn't make sense to leave them behind after we went through the effort to distract this thing. This is fine, it was late. It seemed like an okay place to stop anyway.

I talked with my friend about the way this guy was doing things and he seemed to agree. But it was hard to tell really. Like he did, but didn't want to. If that makes sense. Either way he talked to the DM for us. Since we didn't even know how the get ahold of the guy. Everything seemed cool.

The next game opens with somebody staying behind after we distracted the thing. Trade a few "is this guy serious?" glances around the table. Whatever.

We take a long very uneventful trip with a thousand checks and nothing terribly interesting. I wanted to explore around a bit inside. But you know. Seventy ton titans walking around. Except for that one way to go that seemed legit. So we took it. Two floors of nothing because everything is blocked. Unless I want to fight one of those. So no. Straight to the top and avoid everything.

We get to a part where I see my objective and jump off some like mile high tower to go to it. Because we found a pile of slow fall rings in a box and I could just do that. He tells me it's a twenty minute drop. I ask if I can just take off the ring to speed this up a bit. But it's another of those slight of hand checks to put my ring back on and I'm not doing a pass or die check if I can avoid it.

This is the part where it became glaringly obvious I have deviated from the plan.

The rest of the party who had just walked off before I could come up with a plan screwed up. Got noticed. Then ran back to the top to follow me. Well I was almost to the ground. The twenty minute fall. Remember? We reached the ground at the same time. I called BS. Because I was not going to stand around waiting to get stepped on while the fall for twenty minutes.

I headed to the library to hide and wait to light it up. You know, until they have done their thing and we need a distraction to get out. The party follows. Locks the giant door. Knocks over a bunch of titan sized suits of armor. Gives away our position. So I light the place up. Attacked a titanic librarian. Then escaped. Got all the way back to that boat. Remember the boat that left? Well it came back. We met our ranger there too. The one who didn't come with. Who had a job of his own. But sat there. "Screw this guy, I'll wait on the boat."

I get to the boat. My friend tells the captain they all died. The captain asks me and I tell him the ranger is heading up there but I have no idea about the others. My deus ex machina, I mean, my magic communicator ring that I can't take off lights up. This is the guy that sent me and the conversation goes the same way. Well the captain for whatever reason decides to leave now. So I get on the boat. I'm not being left. These guys blew me up, never spoke to me, and I'm a "hardened criminal".

In reality I'm expecting the DM to give me a reason to get back in there. Or let us just watch. I'm fine with just watching.

At the same time I whispered to my friend that we were about to be screwed over a titan stomped on the boat.

So I wake up in a cage. But I can just walk out of the cage. Yup. So we escape again. But we let out some elves and gnomes and stuff too. Why? Thought it was the right thing to do as a person who has already spent too much time in cages. Well my friend decides to tie up and take some of the gnomes with us. Why? Not even he knows. He's CN so whatever.

So we follow these other guys that think we can help them with something. But they tell us to wait there. At no point do they care or even mention objecting to this guy having tied up and keeping these gnomes. I decide to hide under a bridge. Knowing full well there was going to be something under there, but my character doesn't, so it made sense and I did it. A giant spider comes down. My friend throws the gnomes down in front of it and it takes them and goes away.

Where this was not what I'd have done, I'm not going to chase this thing up it's web to get back these gnomes I don't need. I'm lucky to be alive as it is and I am after all a "hardened criminal". Naturally a rat riding elf shows up and finds out what we did with the gnomes and now these people care. They were cool with us keeping them apparently, but they needed them for something and are now very offended.

Meanwhile every party member with a good alignment is torturing some guy.

We end up being refused a new boat from the magic ring man. Because the boat was 16,000 gold. So I guess this guy owes be a fleet of ships worth of gold but can't be bothered to send even one. So we walk and find an encampment. I think it's a terrible idea to go in there because we probably fed their gnomes to a spider but one way or another, I'm going in that camp. It doesn't even matter. I've told the guy next to me everything that was going to happen for the last hour of all of this. I am on the DM's train and there is no getting off it.

So I just walk toward it. Just to ensure I don't change my mind about walking in there magic ring man calls and sounds an alarm so everyone nearby knows we are there are they come out. I'm now a prisoner for the third time in a single day. I'm not disarmed so I'm just going to fight my way out and run. Well. No. I'm suddenly in chains and in a cell.

I have never done this. In every game I've ever played I've stuck around from beginning to end. Sick, tired, massive headache, didn't have time to grab some food, all of those in the case of tonight, whatever. If I make plans to do something I do it. Well I walked out. Since I've apparently got until morning until anything happens anyway. So I left and took a long walk and got some food.

I come back and hey look. The party is magically back together again. Even better, the rest of the party who were told we left them for dead sprang us from jail and we work for these guys now. I mean sure, they did leave me at the top of a tower, and sure they messed up my plan. But magic ring man told them I said to leave them. I did do that right? No? Well whatever, that happened.

I then had to convince this guy that cutting off my own ring finger is not a slight of hand check. Not that it mattered what check it was. I didn't care. I didn't care if he said I take a -10 on attack rolls and lose half my life until it heals. That was not happening again.

So skip forward a bit I was the only member of the party to succeed on a reflex save. So I died. That's a new one.

How you ask? Well apparently this world has "karma". As far as I can understand think Ravenloft, but CG. So you do mean things and bad things just happen to you. I'd once again like to point to those two words. HARDENED CRIMINAL. These two things are going to work amazingly well. Thanks DM. But hey, never mind that torture bit I mentioned. Those guys with the G next to their names seem to get a pass. They always do. The best part is it wasn't even my "karma" it was the alchemist's fault.

You see, apparently, the reflex save was basically to throw myself on a grenade to save the party. Or the world. Or something. I'm not actually sure. But I did it. I jumped in front of a giant lightning gem thing that I didn't even know was dangerous, thrown by a fairy? or something. Anyway. I was carrying a ton of alchemist's fire in a bag and this is a small room with everyone in it. This sounds like the sort of save you intentionally fail as I honestly probably caused more harm than good when I exploded.

So I'm dead and have an easy out. I've been told I get a resurrection for free. No exp loss. No level loss. All my stuff blew up. But that's it.

Does this seem worth continuing? I'm feeling like I'm being punished for not picking one of the prepackaged options. Or not mindlessly following whoever around. Or when the DM over looks something and then amends in at the expense of whoever is involved. It's seems to me that I'm just part of a story that is played out. It's done and I'm just along for the ride. Every four minutes I'm biting my tongue to not point out where something doesn't work some way. Because it doesn't. Or a skill doesn't do that. Because if you've read this far you know what I mean.

At one point I considered sitting in one spot and refusing to move just to see what sort of thing would drag me where he wanted me to go. Finishing my job and going home was clearly not what he really wanted. Escaping was clearly not what he wanted. He was going to let me do these things, but then screw me over for it because it didn't fit the story. But I wasn't going to disrupt or hijack the game.

I don't know how to fix this. Aside from myself everyone seems cool with how it's going, so I think I should bow out. I am dead after all. It seems to be either that, or sit down with this guy and have a very long talk. But if nobody else cares, what's the point?

Am I wrong here?

[The Insanity]

TL;DR?nkgmnosh

[Shnigda]

TL;DR
DM is railroading super-hard, punishing players for actions he enforced on them, doesn't know damage for weapons and doesn't know appropriate skill checks.
Should player leave group even though other players seem to be having fun?
Or should he speak to DM to ask what's going on?

[The Insanity]

Speak, then proceed based on how the converstion went.
I'd leave, but that's just me.

[Terazul]

Yeah I'd uhh, bow out. For those who are intimidated by large walls of text, things this guy was doing:


Blatant disregard/lack of rules knowledge; Doesn't think strength adds to weapon damage, can't add numbers well.
Conveniently moving characters around as he sees fit; "You are are on the balcony now". Decides characters are going to other rooms instead of initiating fights. Now you're looting a chest. What, you are fighting some rats? No, you're going into another room to make more checks. When characters question this, he bullies them with checks to get back to doing what he wants.
Speaking of checks, weird checks for things to do stuff: Sleight of Hand check to tie rope to climb. Sleight of Hand check to remove a ring from your own finger.
After enforcing "no PvP", while not fighting on a grid mind you, insists that the Alchemist just outright bombs him for no reason.
Doing a quest for a guy who is giving them 250,000 gp, but refuses to lend them a 16,000 gp boat. Weird. Probably because then they could leave.
Only party member to succeed on a Reflex save dies. The save was to throw yourself onto a grenade to save the party.
...Which is apparently the result of some imposed "karma" system. Keeping in mind the GM decided for himself that this character was a "hardened criminal."


Really just a bunch of blatant railroading and "you're captured again" kind of stuff, and also no real following of rules and making stuff up as he goes along. I'd run.

[Venico]

I'd honestly just bow out. You can deal with bad house rules but the super rail roading, forcing your character to act in certain ways, and punishing you for not following along? I guarantee you the next few sessions will not improve unless you sit down and talk to the DM.

One way or another though, you do need to do that. If you leave, tell him why you're leaving. Point out what is making it unplayable and hope one day he realizes how he can improve. If you stay, tell him how hard it's been for you to just follow along and not be able to play your own character and exercise your own free will.

Hope it works out one way or another brother. And I hope you cut that ring off because dear lord, that has to be some of the most contrived DM BS I've seen.

[noob]

I remember when I started being dm for the three first adventures it ended curiously(first(or second) one the player fought one lvl1 rogue with no stats above 10 and who had horribly low attack dice and the player had 18 to all stats but he lost because I did not hid the dices and so when I did the fight the opponent rogue had a critical strike and deal the maximum damage he could and it killed the player who otherwise would have survived and killed him in one turn(that rogue did not even had a sneak attack))
There was another who ended by the player getting out of an extra dimensional utopia where I succeed in convincing the player to sell vegetable until he found out he was not doing "adventurer stuff" then he finally convinced someone to send him to the place with flying fortresses(maybe something like acheron) but then he fell in the middle of a fight and he decided to join one side but then the battle stopped here.
Then I did made an adventure where there was too much battle(like 6 fights) and so it lasted for long then it ended by "The players help their god to defeat all the opponents gods and they have the help of the angels because having 75% of the gods teaming up to kill an innocent god of defense seemed unjust to the angels" this part had no battle it was just a description of this kind and then I said to the players they won they ended up being very happy of the adventure(I do not know why and I think that this adventure was really bad)
Then I made another adventure where players(not the same players) simply explored a curious plane(again they said they were happy of the adventure)
In the end I found that players liked more the latter adventures maybe it is that you get better at the gm role after some time of doing it.
I think that your gm looks like a beginner(like I am) and that he might get better.
I do not find you off base(I like to let players do anything they want the only case where I am annoyed is when a lawful good player says "I grab the nearest villager and I menace him" and other kind of sudden unpredictable violence(like "I punch my team mate") in those cases I say to that player that it seems out of place for a lawful good character)

[TheIronGolem]

I don't know how to fix this. Aside from myself everyone seems cool with how it's going, so I think I should bow out.

You don't fix it. This isn't an RPG you're in, it's Story Hour. Your instinct to bow out is right on the money.

[atemu1234]

Nuke him from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.

[Broken Crown]

Ordinarily I'd say "talk to the DM," but given how unreceptive he seems to be to any form of "audience participation" (and it's pretty clear here that you're the audience for this game, not a participant), I think it would be a waste of effort.

Walk out.

[Grooke]

I'm more shocked by the fact the other players enjoy this than by the DM's actions. Without a really huge reason to try and make things work, I'd just leave.

Getting things to a point where I would enjoy the game seems like it would require a great amount of effort.

[Karl Aegis]

TL;DR?nkgmnosh

John Stalvern waited. The lights above him blinked and sparked out of the air. There were demons in the base. He didn't see them, but had expected them now for years. His warnings to Cernel Joson were not listenend to and now it was too late. Far too late for now, anyway. John was a space marine for fourteen years. When he was young he watched the spaceships and he said to dad "I want to be on the ships daddy."
Dad said "No! You will BE KILL BY DEMONS"
There was a time when he believed him. Then as he got oldered he stopped. But now in the space station base of the UAC he knew there were demons.
"This is Joson" the radio crackered. "You must fight the demons!"
So John gotted his palsma rifle and blew up the wall.
"HE GOING TO KILL US" said the demons
"I will shoot at him" said the cyberdemon and he fired the rocket missiles. John plasmaed at him and tried to blew him up. But then the ceiling fell and they were trapped and not able to kill.
"No! I must kill the demons" he shouted
The radio said "No, John. You are the demons"
And then John was a zombie.

Yea, that's basically what happened.

[Aleolus]

It seems to me that this DM is suffering from what I like to call "Console Gamer Syndrome". it is a condition that normally affects new gamers, which I struggled with myself. My suggestion? Ask the DM if he would be willing to step back and be a player for a while, and run a proper game for their group. Start from the beginning, but whatever you do, DON'T point out the correct way to do things he has been doing wrong, just let him observe, and encourage everyone (read, HIM) to ask questions

[Sliver]

Console Game Syndrome? Sounds more like a Rail Shooter to me.

Perhaps the DM is really oblivious and doesn't realize that you wish to participate, but that is highly unlikely. I'd either leave or optimize slight of hand, because it sounds like that skill can do ANYTHING related to hand movement.

[Twurps]

I'm more shocked by the fact the other players enjoy this than by the DM's actions. Without a really huge reason to try and make things work, I'd just leave.

Not all players are equal. which brings me to:


You don't fix it. This isn't an RPG you're in, it's Story Hour. Your instinct to bow out is right on the money.

If everybody likes a 'story Hour' type of game, you're attempts to fix it might very wel ruin the fun for quite a few of them.

Are you having fun regardless, and/or have enough patience to give it a few more sessions? Then talk to your DM, explain what's bugging you, and how you would enjoy the game most. Be warned however: Going from 'story hour' to 'Full player autonomy over PC's' is a SLOW proces, requiring a lot from both the DM (rules familiarity, flexibility and prep time) and players. ('story hour' players might not be used to making autonomous decisions, and might infact make none... ever.)

If you don't have the patience, talk to your DM anyway before you bow out.

[paranoidbox]

I wouldn't even have lasted that long. I'm getting hives from just reading this. Kghghghh!

[Frostthehero]

Just build a pun pun. He said you could "write whatever you want". Take your revenge.

[Grooke]

Not all players are equal.

Just to clarify, I am not criticizing these players, I just find it hard to put myself in their place.


I agree you shouldn't even try to "fix" this game (as I said, "getting things to a point where I would enjoy myself") unless either:

Knowing the players, you believe they don't know of another way and would enjoy seeing it done differently.
The others want you to stick around and are willing to adapt for everyone to have fun.


In any case, it will take time and effort, hence the third condition: you have reason to do it as well.


edit:

Just build a pun pun. He said you could "write whatever you want". Take your revenge.

Pun-pun cannot beat a DM who says "you die", and certainly not whole table saying "you leave".

[ShaneMRoth]

It's like James Joyce and Doctor Seuss had a love child and it read the Dungeon Master's Guide after dropping acid.

I don't know if this is the worst DM I've ever heard of or the best DM I've ever heard of.

But I do know one thing.


...

We end up being refused a new boat from the magic ring man.

...

That is currently my favorite sentence in the entire English language.

If I ever start a band, I'm going to call it Magic Ring Man.

[archon_huskie]

How the OP games and how the OP's DM and Group games just doesn't gel.

Politely withdrawing is the best option here.

[Odin's Eyepatch]

I don't know how you managed to last so long in the first place! I've been lucky to have no terrible DMs yet, but I'm just trying to imagine a DM telling a character what to do... and it's painful!

If I want to kill those rats, I'll roll that d20, and nobody will tell me otherwise! :smallfurious:

He doesn't even seem to be doing it properly! A 'competent' terrible DM, would give the rats +40 deflection bonus, with random invisible undispellable walls of force that randomly blink in existence until the next room is ready for your arrival.

I would suggest doing an Old Man Henderson (No, seriously, don't). But if he is controlling your characters actions, then even that won't work.

In all seriousness, I would second the above suggestions. Talk to him calmly about what you find uncomfortable in his game, and explain that unless you can find some sort of entente, you will have to leave the game.

[P.F.]

This thread is certainly full of wtf.

Player: I try to examine the object more closely.
DM: Okay, make a reflex save.
Player: Does a 21 pass?
DM: Yes. You see that it's a grenade and successfully jump on it as it explodes, killing yourself.
Player: ...
DM: Karma, neh?
Player: ...
DM: And your character gets a free True Rez, no penalties whatsoever. Now, whose turn is next?

If you want to try another session, even if just to hang out with your one friend in a gaming-related context, I'd suggest you really ham it up. It sounds like "rules" and "game mechanics" are not the main focus of this game, so go for broke on the oddball magic items, improbable combat maneuvers, and running gags. Start encounters with the action, "I get kidnapped/captured/arrested/imprisoned!" Don't spring surprises on the DM because that's likely to make them simply not work. Instead, propose a variety of enhancements to your character and go with the first one he seems enthusiastic about. Bonus points if you can leave him with the impression that it was his idea, because it'll probably be at least twice as effective! Get yourself an in-character girlfriend, then complain about her constantly. Better yet, try to talk him into letting you take the BESMd20 flaw "Boy Magnet." The world is your oyster!

As long as you're having fun with your friend(s), go for it. Otherwise, probably try to hang out in some other context, or play in a different game.

[atemu1234]

Just to clarify, I am not criticizing these players, I just find it hard to put myself in their place.


I agree you shouldn't even try to "fix" this game (as I said, "getting things to a point where I would enjoy myself") unless either:

Knowing the players, you believe they don't know of another way and would enjoy seeing it done differently.
The others want you to stick around and are willing to adapt for everyone to have fun.


In any case, it will take time and effort, hence the third condition: you have reason to do it as well.


edit:


Pun-pun cannot beat a DM who says "you die", and certainly not whole table saying "you leave".

Depends how cheesily you read the Sarrukh's ability.

[jiriku]

Godawful game. Leave immediately and do not return. Find a better group to spend your time with. Life is too short.

[Crake]

I'm more shocked by the fact the other players enjoy this than by the DM's actions. Without a really huge reason to try and make things work, I'd just leave.

Getting things to a point where I would enjoy the game seems like it would require a great amount of effort.

I'd hesitate to say that they maybe just don't realise that there are different (read: better) ways to play dnd. I know after I had my first few DMs, I was rather amazed and their different ways of running, and I quickly decided on which style I liked best, but if this is their only DM, it's understandable that they simply may not realise there's a different way to run.

[SowZ]

This sounds like a horrible way to spend one evening a week. Find another group or else learn Latin.

[prufock]

No, your instinct is right here. If the DM insists on playing this way, I would bow out.

But first, I'd talk to the other players. Are they actually enjoying it? Why are you apparently the only one who sees the problems with this game?

[Mystral]

Sounds awesome, continue playing, just to see how deep this goes.

[ComaVision]

Congratulations on lasting more than one session, I'm not sure why you ever went back though.

[SowZ]

I mean, I love terrible movies. I might continue out of dread fascination and a different sort of entertainment than one usually gets out of roleplaying.

[Yael]

I've had this kind of situation before, thing is that the very first time I played 3.5 was with a friend of mine from highschool, and our DM was hard on homebrewing and alternate rules, being my first time I didn't know anything outside the player's handbook, but for other players he talked about variants as flaws and traits for extra feats (which I would've found interesting, because I was playing a human druid at the sunless citadel at a 13-man party raid). This friend of mine wanted to DM years after (I have been playing 3.5 for 4 year now), and we agreed, but he wanted to play around a Dark Souls-ish system where wealth and experience are the same pool, but he wanted to follow a storyline from the games, limiting our freedom of choice, also he was not that used to rules (such as underwater combat, polymorph rules and other things). We had a bad time because this friend of mine was having trouble using the rules (as he was always have been a player, I'm sure that he didn't read more than our first DM taught us), so we talked to him. I think I had it easier because I have know this guy from years now, but talking about things while not already playing is better off.

Now, really think about this. Are you having fun while not being controlled by God-above-Ao? If so, talk to the DM, if you are not having fun in any aspect of this run, and think it won't get better, just walk away and play with someone else.

[nedz]

Play an Illusionist and spam illusions all of the time
Don't do this for any real effect, just have fun changing the scenery in various ways
Be surreal and make sure to include plenty of non-sequetors and bunnies

[atemu1234]

Play an Illusionist and spam illusions all of the time
Don't do this for any real effect, just have fun changing the scenery in various ways
Be surreal and make sure to include plenty of non-sequetors and bunnies



Make it seem like a horrible acid trip.
I like lists.
Bacon
Bananas
Dolphin-free tuna
This turned into a shopping list

[ComaVision]

Dolphin-free tuna
This turned into a shopping list


Can I get Dolphin-full tuna?

[nedz]

Can I get Dolphin-full tuna?

No, no — what you want is a Dolphin Tree Tuba

[Karl Aegis]

No, no — what you want is a Dolphin Tree Tuba

That actually sounds like something I would want. Just need to figure out how to tune it...

[atemu1234]

That actually sounds like something I would want. Just need to figure out how to tune it...

Why, with a Dolphin Tree Tuba Tuner of course! We're just turning this into Dr. Suess now, aren't we?

[paranoidbox]

Why, with a Dolphin Tree Tuba Tuner of course! We're just turning this into Dr. Suess now, aren't we?

Don't forget, it has to be blurple. Otherwise it'll be all off key and wonky and no one likes a wonky DTT.

[ekarney]

First of all, props to you for handling it so well, I know how tempting it is to try and get revenge on a DM, as I once crowbarred an ECL 13 Minotaur into a game where the rest of the party was on average level 5. It's easy to forget theirs other players in the game who are innocent when conducting revenge plans, so good job!

My advice would be to bow out as well, though, if you're feeling charitable you could offer to run your own campaign.

Just a suggestion though.

[Karl Aegis]

I'm pretty sure you have to make tiny adjustments to minuscule parts of the tuba and don't need special equipment.

[Magma Armor0]

Before this thread derails in favor of delphinic arboreal brass instruments, I'd like to say that walking away does seem to be the correct option here. If you really, really want to stay, I suggest one of the following:

1. New character is a bard. Any time it's your turn, just say, "I'm inspiring!" and hit shuffle on your pcPod. This frees you up to do something useful with your attention, like learning Latin, or mastering the Dolphin Tree Tuba.

2. New character is an alchemist. Your out-of-game goal becomes to blow yourself up. If the DM is unwilling to let a character whose sole purpose is to kamikaze die, then you're definitely on a railroad track here.

3. New character develops an attachment to a PC or NPC. Refuse to go anywhere without him/her. Bonus points if they're of a different race. Extra bonus points if it's somebody's mount.

4. New character is a biographer, chronicling the adventures of a different party member. Go divine caster, and make all of your spells things like sanctuary, calm emotions, etc. Occasionally pause combat to interview enemies about their feelings on facing a hero of such obvious caliber.

5. Don't walk away, but stop playing. Just show up to the games with a notebook in hand, then report back to us after each session. This stuff is comedy GOLD!

[Ger. Bessa]

Why, with a Dolphin Tree Tuba Tuner of course! We're just turning this into Dr. Suess now, aren't we?

You may want that, but instead you play Orcus !

Jedipotter reference aside, I remember another thread where a bad DM (not Jedipotter) removed strength bonus on damage and refused to play with a grid. Can't find it again but it might be the same dude.

Maybe he just don't like that you're a problem player. After all you stated that you wanted to play a tank warrior, you rudisplorking optimizer, when he already wanted you to have a background to fit in this world. And even if you didn't know he wanted that, well you're not supposed to know every little rule, do you ? So he was justified to unleash karma on you.

I think that's great DMing, after all :
-He wants the characters to be roleplay based, not just races and classes.
-Starting at level 5 is a proof that he trust you.
-He lets crunch (alchemist) bring added value to the story. Man, that grenade was drama, and you were fricking heroic then.



PS : how can I write in blue on phone ?

[Sliver]

PS : how can I write in blue on phone ?

Depends on your phone browser, but usually the same as you would otherwise. You could also simply write the tags, as you don't have to write the color code... [color=blue][/*color] works as well. Without the * anyway.

[TheBrassDuke]

You may want that, but instead you play Orcus !

Jedipotter reference aside, I remember another thread where a bad DM (not Jedipotter) removed strength bonus on damage and refused to play with a grid. Can't find it again but it might be the same dude.

Maybe he just don't like that you're a problem player. After all you stated that you wanted to play a tank warrior, you rudisplorking optimizer, when he already wanted you to have a background to fit in this world. And even if you didn't know he wanted that, well you're not supposed to know every little rule, do you ? So he was justified to unleash karma on you.

I think that's great DMing, after all :
-He wants the characters to be roleplay based, not just races and classes.
-Starting at level 5 is a proof that he trust you.
-He lets crunch (alchemist) bring added value to the story. Man, that grenade was drama, and you were fricking heroic then.

Aand there you go!

[TheFurith]

Maybe he just don't like that you're a problem player. After all you stated that you wanted to play a tank warrior, you rudisplorking optimizer, when he already wanted you to have a background to fit in this world. And even if you didn't know he wanted that, well you're not supposed to know every little rule, do you ? So he was justified to unleash karma on you.

I think that's great DMing, after all :
-He wants the characters to be roleplay based, not just races and classes.
-Starting at level 5 is a proof that he trust you.
-He lets crunch (alchemist) bring added value to the story. Man, that grenade was drama, and you were fricking heroic then.

I'm not sure if this one is serious, but just in case I'll try to clear things up. My character is a human fighter. The tank part is combat expertise and shield of swings. I really hope that's not what you'd call some sort of overpowered optimization.

I'm not sure how much this guy actually cares for roleplay, as he stopped a roleplay once because it was taking up too much time, and/or not going in a direction he liked. Later that night half the table got up and said they were having an in character conversation on the other side of the room. I can't imagine why they'd do that. Can you?

Starting at level 5 means he trusts me? If so, what does having CR21 Elysian Titans as the standard enemies mean? Other than 409,000 xp per kill. And with our fancy titan slaying weapons we killed like half a dozen. Or how about that he is about one night from giving the party an earthshaker to drive? I'd never even heard of that thing until I googled it. It's some sort of doomsday mech thing from way back in the day. Seriously, check that thing out. It's on the cover of a book and it's the size of a mountain. It comes from a game that's game over if the thing even turns on.

Lastly. If you were in a 20x20 room with a bag of bombs, would you grab hold of a gem that shoots lightning to save the party? Factor in that you don't know this thing is a lightning shooting sentient gem and that you failed your perception check when you walked in the room so you didn't even see it. Also, I wasn't the only one to roll the save. What was the possible result of the whole party making the save? Do well all grab hold of it to save the party? How does that work?



4. New character is a biographer, chronicling the adventures of a different party member. Go divine caster, and make all of your spells things like sanctuary, calm emotions, etc. Occasionally pause combat to interview enemies about their feelings on facing a hero of such obvious caliber.

5. Don't walk away, but stop playing. Just show up to the games with a notebook in hand, then report back to us after each session. This stuff is comedy GOLD!

Those are tempting. But I'd rather not ruin the game if others are enjoying it. Though I guess 5 wouldn't be disruptive, as long as the DM didn't know what I was doing. I get this weird vibe from the guy like he might be a bit unstable.

[bean illus]

Player: I try to examine the object more closely.
DM: Okay, make a reflex save.
Player: Does a 21 pass?
DM: Yes. You see that it's a grenade and successfully jump on it as it explodes, killing yourself.
Player: ...
DM: Karma, neh?
Player: ...
DM: And your character gets a free True Rez, no penalties whatsoever. Now, whose turn is next?


ROFLMAO

Really, i would try to avoid confrontation or criticism of any type. It will get you nowhere, and possibly ruin a chance to be friends in some other scene.

What i might try, if you have the time, is just hang out one more night while trying to enjoy yourself vicariously through your other friends. Then... mention that you miss GMing and that you are inspired to run a SMALL adventure of low level characters. Then carefully and politely guide them through a session or two.

good luck.

[bean illus]

Before this thread derails in favor of delphinic arboreal brass instruments, I'd like to say that walking away does seem to be the correct option here. If you really, really want to stay, I suggest one of the following:

1. New character is a bard. Any time it's your turn, just say, "I'm inspiring!" and hit shuffle on your pcPod. This frees you up to do something useful with your attention, like learning Latin, or mastering the Dolphin Tree Tuba.OMG THAT'S FUNNY

2. New character is an alchemist. Your out-of-game goal becomes to blow yourself up. If the DM is unwilling to let a character whose sole purpose is to kamikaze die, then you're definitely on a railroad track here.LOLOLOLOLOL

3. New character develops an attachment to a PC or NPC. Refuse to go anywhere without him/her. Bonus points if they're of a different race. Extra bonus points if it's somebody's mount.ROFL

4. New character is a biographer, chronicling the adventures of a different party member. Go divine caster, and make all of your spells things like sanctuary, calm emotions, etc. Occasionally pause combat to interview enemies about their feelings on facing a hero of such obvious caliber. YOU'RE KILLIN' ME! I'M IN TEARS HERE!

5. Don't walk away, but stop playing. Just show up to the games with a notebook in hand, then report back to us after each session. This stuff is comedy GOLD!THIS ONE! THIS ONE! PLEEEEAASSEE ?

Could you post every week?

[Platymus Pus]

Those are tempting. But I'd rather not ruin the game if others are enjoying it. Though I guess 5 wouldn't be disruptive, as long as the DM didn't know what I was doing. I get this weird vibe from the guy like he might be a bit unstable.

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?23784-I-think-I-just-dealt-with-the-worst-gaming-session

[TheFurith]

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?23784-I-think-I-just-dealt-with-the-worst-gaming-session

That's a hell of a story, but I don't think it'd be that bad. Probably anyway. I'm told this guy was furious about how the game went though.

For the people who want me to continue the game purely to come back and talk about the events that's actually a very real possibility. Depending on how talking to this guy goes. Talked to a couple of the other players and they seem a bit more in agreement that I'd thought they were to begin with. As for the other two players I haven't talked to apparently this is only their second game ever, so they don't have a lot to compare this guy to.

[Segev]

The two you've talked to seemed more in agreement with what than you'd originally thought?

[TheFurith]

The two you've talked to seemed more in agreement with what than you'd originally thought?

The one friend of mine was in agreement from the start, but last night I talked to two other players and they hadn't really noticed the issue until I talked to them about it. After I pointed it out they noticed that it's been going on for quite a while for their own characters too. Where they'd decide to do something that suddenly would be stopped by something out of nowhere so the main plot could be sped along. Or when I pointed out people having to leave the table just to converse in character because this guy just wasn't interested in it.

They also couldn't come up with any answer at all for what would have happened had the whole party made the reflex save to save the party and take a ton of damage. Because that was a possible outcome.

[Tiktik Ironclaw]

I would like to say that everybody here is wrong! Bow out? Give up? Did Waffle House Millionaire give up when he made Old Man Henderson? Or what about when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Did the United States of Africa surrender to Jeff Stalin? NO! This railroad? DEAD! Neidermeyer? DEAD! The DM? BRAIN-DEAD!

[TheFurith]

Alright so for the second time, I just walked out of this game. I'm done. I'm out. We start off trying to talk about it, but that friend of mine that actually knows the DM decides not to say anything. Says the issues really don't concern him and he doesn't care. Wonderful start. So I tell the guy that I don't want to just be rolling dice for some npc and I want to actually play an rpg. He says fine. We will just be presented with what's going on and get to make our own decisions based on it. Sounds perfect.

Start off with leaving the place we were in. Looting some bodies that were still around. No rolls needed because why would you? Right?

Then they resurrect me and things just go downhill. Immediately. As if because I was alive again. I haven't done one thing. Suddenly we need to make a dc10 perception check to see that we are in a town. We already know we are in the town. We've been in the town. But most fail. One passes so somebody tries to notice if they saw they are in a town. Well that's a dc15 check. He passed. Now it's a dc25 diplomacy check to ask if she noticed. Three people are just confused and angry and another has a downright screwy look on their face.

I roll a swim check on the street. Why not, right? I said I wasn't going to do anything disruptive, but it was more constructive than the other thing I was thinking. I figure maybe this guy will get my point. No, this guy is clearly dumb as hell. Through a series of rolls I rob a bunch of people of 75g. I didn't actually notice their existence but I swam over there and did it anyway because this guy couldn't make sense if he tried.

How does he justify this. My friend complained about metagaming. Fair point. There was a lot of stuff that happened that only happened because people knew things they couldn't possibly know. Like the library disaster. Or things like the ranger operating a two man lift by himself because the plot demanded it. So now we became deft dumb and blind. We forgot how to speak common. I'm sure there was more but I left the room.

I'm not even trying to be nice about it. I've had a person pass out drunk at a game. Another sleep through a game. Had numerous people refuse to pay attention and spend the entire time on their phone keep asking for everything to be reexplained. But I have never had to put up with a person so hellbent on running a terrible game that any mention of a better way to do things, or dissatisfaction among players resulted in him making everything even more messed up.

I wish I'd have done what my friend had suggested the first time and just watched a game. I'd have never joined knowing the guy didn't even know how a longsword worked. I mean seriously. How does one decide to DM without even knowing that?

I don't even know if anyone else realized what was going on. When asked why everything was like this he just said it was how I wanted it. Like he can't even own up to the fact that he was just trying to make a point. Or that what he was lashing out against was my friends complaint. I imagine their game will continue without the two of us that left. I don't honestly know how any of these other people can deal with this guy, but whatever. I wish them well on that, and good luck.

As much as I enjoy the hobby I really seem to end up with some seriously terrible people. Just rarely seems worth the effort to do.

Is this a thing? Where you take your issues with a person into a game and not just talk to them? It's ridiculous.

Is it too much to ask for a couple of people who know how the game works, like to roleplay and actually take initiative, and aren't stupid?

[Karl Aegis]

Was their sink full of unrinsed dishes? That would explain a lot.

[Red Rubber Band]

... Suddenly we need to make a dc10 perception check to see that we are in a town. We already know we are in the town. We've been in the town. But most fail. One passes so somebody tries to notice if they saw they are in a town. Well that's a dc15 check. He passed. Now it's a dc25 diplomacy check to ask if she noticed. Three people are just confused and angry and another has a downright screwy look on their face.

I roll a swim check on the street. Why not, right? I said I wasn't going to do anything disruptive, but it was more constructive than the other thing I was thinking. I figure maybe this guy will get my point. No, this guy is clearly dumb as hell. Through a series of rolls I rob a bunch of people of 75g. I didn't actually notice their existence but I swam over there and did it anyway because this guy couldn't make sense if he tried.

This is amazing. I feel bad for you and your **** experience, but this is just absolute gold.

[Sliver]

When asked why everything was like this he just said it was how I wanted it.


http://i.imgur.com/LOicMJA.gif

[ShaneMRoth]

Is it too much to ask for a couple of people who know how the game works, like to roleplay and actually take initiative, and aren't stupid?

It's not your fault.
(http://turkeyglue.tumblr.com/post/31477513519/love-this-movie)

http://33.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mab2gzHeHb1qm339ko1_500.gif

[Odin's Eyepatch]

It's a shame that you couldn't ask the other players how it is going on, or how they felt about the whole fiasco. I would very much like to see their take on this crazy story as well. I wonder what beef the DM has against you to warrant such behaviour.


I roll a swim check on the street.

And that is just amazing! I think it sums up the whole session!

[paranoidbox]

I don't even know what happened there. It sounds like the strangest piece of storytelling in the world.

[Marlowe]

http://i.imgur.com/LYMEfnE.gif

[killem2]

You need to discuss this with the DM and if they are not able to take the feedback, find another group. it isn't that hard to be a dm.

[ZamielVanWeber]

You need to discuss this with the DM and if they are not able to take the feedback, find another group. it isn't that hard to be a dm.

It can be difficult, to be honest, but here is something I have run into:
People prefer a new DM who can admit his mistakes and limitations to an experienced one who cannot. If you just say "I'm new we are gonna keep this simple" people will tend to respond positively.

[P.F.]

You need to discuss this with the DM and if they are not able to take the feedback, find another group. it isn't that hard to be a dm.

That's what happened. He told the DM that he wanted to role-play his character instead of watching while the DM told him what his character was doing. Said that it wasn't just him that felt this way. Except when he actually said this, none of the other players really agreed, probably because they knew the DM would just throw a temper tantrum. Which is exactly what happened. But since it was only the OP who confronted him, everything was fine until that rez came through. Then the DM decided to punish the group by having them make increasingly absurd skill checks to stall the plot, because in his mind, that's the logical result of players being allowed to decide their characters' actions.

There's no talking to a DM like this. He wants it his way, and you can either do that or leave. Even the mildest possible feedback is an insult to his intelligence, an unfair criticism of his creativity, an affront to his manhood, and a rejection of him as a person. Which is sad, because this defensive attitude toward imagined personal attacks leads to REAL insults to his intelligence, VALID criticisms of his creativity, and ACTUAL rejection of him in the social setting.

However, I've been wrong before, and perhaps someone with greater diplomacy skills than I could make some headway in this situation, but it looks like the OP may not be that person either.

[bean illus]

He wants it his way, and you can either do that or leave. Even the mildest possible feedback is an insult to his intelligence, an unfair criticism of his creativity, an affront to his manhood, and a rejection of him as a person.
Which is sad, because this defensive attitude toward imagined personal attacks leads to REAL insults to his intelligence, VALID criticisms of his creativity, and ACTUAL rejection of him in the social setting.

I'm considering putting that in my sig. .in all my social media. lol

[SecretlyaFish]

I personally would take the biggest verbal dump on the DM, and tear apart any confidence etc that he had in his gaming session, let him know in no uncertain terms it was completely awful and the worst session you will ever be apart of in 10 lifetimes, and leave. Make sure you do this in private so he can't piggy back on the others for support.

[Tiktik Ironclaw]

Things like this make Acererak cringe and run crying to Cthulhu for support. My deepest sympathies, poor soul.

[goto124]

Sounds like OP had no idea what the heck was happening in that campaign full of unnecessary skill checks.

Yea, walk out. It doesn't even make sense now.

[TheFurith]

It's a shame that you couldn't ask the other players how it is going on, or how they felt about the whole fiasco. I would very much like to see their take on this crazy story as well. I wonder what beef the DM has against you to warrant such behaviour.



And that is just amazing! I think it sums up the whole session!

I would suspect that it just continued on as if I'd never played. It became quite apparent the only thing the other players actually cared about is that there was a game. If the guy couldn't work the basic mechanics and just told there were to go and what to do when they got there that was apparently fine with them. At least when he was around anyway.

As far as I could tell his issue with me was that he had a laid out plan for his games. So when he would start telling us what we could do, instead of just letting us figure something out. I often decided that I had a better way. For instance the library.

He thought it made most sense for me to climb up the eight hundred foot or so walls and try to cut down the chandelier. Which probably had five foot thick rope. My only weapons are a heavy flail, and a longsword that won't damage anything but a titan. Then I'd have to climb back down and out of the massive flaming room. Now I'm sure I could have done it because the plot demanded it happen. Either way, that plan was ridiculous. But I asked myself what my character would do. Which was just to light all the giant curtains on fire with my fire bombs. I actually had to argue with the guy about this because he couldn't figure out what sort of check it was to do that. So he decided lighting curtains on fire is a strength check.

I think he took this sort of thing as an insult that I didn't do what he wanted.

[TheFurith]

It can be difficult, to be honest, but here is something I have run into:
People prefer a new DM who can admit his mistakes and limitations to an experienced one who cannot. If you just say "I'm new we are gonna keep this simple" people will tend to respond positively.

I would have been more than willing to help this guy out. In fact that's the only reason I even bothered the first time when I mentioned anything. I thought maybe he just was new and didn't know all this stuff. I was new to Pathfinder myself so I wasn't even all that sure. He didn't even seem to want to discuss anything. It turns out he isn't new, and didn't want help. Guy should have just wrote himself a book. Or read the book for the game he's supposed to be running. One of those, not neither.


There's no talking to a DM like this. He wants it his way, and you can either do that or leave. Even the mildest possible feedback is an insult to his intelligence, an unfair criticism of his creativity, an affront to his manhood, and a rejection of him as a person. Which is sad, because this defensive attitude toward imagined personal attacks leads to REAL insults to his intelligence, VALID criticisms of his creativity, and ACTUAL rejection of him in the social setting.

Exactly. Could not have put that any better.


I personally would take the biggest verbal dump on the DM, and tear apart any confidence etc that he had in his gaming session, let him know in no uncertain terms it was completely awful and the worst session you will ever be apart of in 10 lifetimes, and leave. Make sure you do this in private so he can't piggy back on the others for support.

I thought about it. But as I previously mentioned he seemed a bit unstable and it wasn't my house, or his house we were playing in. Wouldn't have wanted anything to get broken just for the sake of making a point. A point that clearly nobody else thought was necessary to make.


Sounds like OP had no idea what the heck was happening in that campaign full of unnecessary skill checks.

Yea, walk out. It doesn't even make sense now.

I did walk out. I don't really think anyone knows whats going on with that. They're just following along and whatever happens they just go with. Anything to keep it going I guess.

[Sliver]

You know, I'm reminded of the story where the DM railroaded the players so hard, and most of them went along with it, because he already had the entire game, and outcomes, set in advance. Because of the first game he DMed. All games afterwards simply had to repeat it, like some sort of twisted play where only the cast might change.

For reference. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?363545-What-was-your-worst-DM-ever-This-thread-is-impervious-roll-to-disbelieve!/page16&p=18645465#post18645465)

Player input? What's that?

[Eldaran]

Honestly, reading your posts about this game TheFurith is almost sickening to me, I can't believe what kind of mad house you walked in to. I don't think you need to have played a tabletop RPG before to realize how bad this is. I think you made the right decision in getting the hell out of there, some people are literally just crazy, and not worth dealing with.

[nedz]

Yea, walk out. It doesn't even make sense now.

No no, he needs to swim out.

[TheFurith]

You know, I'm reminded of the story where the DM railroaded the players so hard, and most of them went along with it, because he already had the entire game, and outcomes, set in advance. Because of the first game he DMed. All games afterwards simply had to repeat it, like some sort of twisted play where only the cast might change.

For reference. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?363545-What-was-your-worst-DM-ever-This-thread-is-impervious-roll-to-disbelieve!/page16&p=18645465#post18645465)

Player input? What's that?

You know. That's something I didn't think to mention. He's actually run this game before. Not only has he ran it before, he's running at least one other game exactly like it with another group right now as well.

I'm not against having a world all drawn out and a story line in mind. But at the end of the day there's no telling what could happen in a game. Every person I know who plays when they talk about the games that made them like the game most they were the games that were just off the cuff. The plan was one thing but something happened and we just had to roll with it. Those were always the best because everyone at the table made that happen and played a part.

Sadly the only off the cuff things with this DM is when he's trying to foil the party's attempt to do something that's not in the plan. Or that karma nonsense.

[Sliver]

You know. That's something I didn't think to mention. He's actually run this game before. Not only has he ran it before, he's running at least one other game exactly like it with another group right now as well.

... This is amazing. Keeps getting better and better!

[bean illus]

I really wish you had rolled a heal check to stay, and a slight of hand to tell the stories here. Because this is one of the most entertaining threads that's been on this board in a while.

[Segev]

Oh dear.

I do believe we have a new meme: swimming to success.

Perhaps swim checks are the secret ritual to summon Orcus?

[MukkTB]

I personally would take the biggest verbal dump on the DM, and tear apart any confidence etc that he had in his gaming session, let him know in no uncertain terms it was completely awful and the worst session you will ever be apart of in 10 lifetimes, and leave. Make sure you do this in private so he can't piggy back on the others for support.

I don't see this being called for. This guy is an awful DM. Being an awful DM doesn't actually hurt anybody else. Its everyone's personal responsibility to themselves to know when to GTFO of a bad situation.

[Shnigda]

Perhaps this is all some elaborate dream sequence. If would explain why you can do weird stuff and the bits where you suddenly find yourself somewhere (like you're suddenly on the balcony) is just misremembering the dream. I applaud the DM for such inventive and original storytelling!

[nedz]

Perhaps this is all some elaborate dream sequence. If would explain why you can do weird stuff and the bits where you suddenly find yourself somewhere (like you're suddenly on the balcony) is just misremembering the dream. I applaud the DM for such inventive and original storytelling!

Well yes, it's a full on post-modernist game — with the expected unreliable narrator. Did anyone notice any strange mushrooms lying about perchance ?

[DaOldeWolf]

I roll a swim check on the street.

I imagine it went something like this.

http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20131231004254/onepiece/images/9/9d/Sui_Sui_no_Mi_Infobox.png

[TheFurith]

I really wish you had rolled a heal check to stay, and a slight of hand to tell the stories here. Because this is one of the most entertaining threads that's been on this board in a while.

That was actually the plan but it went so much worse than I thought it would. I was going to start a thread called "The misadventures of Jack" and continue this. But then the guy decided to not only do stupid things, but straight up ruin the game for everyone and try to make it my fault. So sadly that wasn't really an option. Well I guess I could have sat there, but I wasn't going to be the reason nobody else could enjoy the game, even if it wasn't my fault.

Really though I wish I could have just wrote about how awesome the game was and not have had any of this happen at all.


Perhaps this is all some elaborate dream sequence. If would explain why you can do weird stuff and the bits where you suddenly find yourself somewhere (like you're suddenly on the balcony) is just misremembering the dream. I applaud the DM for such inventive and original storytelling!

If I ever DM I'm stealing that. Just wanted to let you know. I just need something that would cause such a thing.


Well yes, it's a full on post-modernist game — with the expected unreliable narrator. Did anyone notice any strange mushrooms lying about perchance ?

There wasn't, no. There was actually a point where somebody had posted a picture of us playing on Facebook. Half the table including the DM were quite concerned that people from their church would see it and it had to be taken down quickly. So, I'd be willing to bet this guy was as sober as could be.

[ShaneMRoth]

The OPs' account sounds more like Call of Cthulhu as a LARP, complete with SAN checks.

And the OP made his SAN checks and fled the game in horror.

The poor souls who return to the game, having long ago failed SAN checks...

[ZamielVanWeber]

Oh dear.

I do believe we have a new meme: swimming to success.

Perhaps swim checks are the secret ritual to summon Orcus?

My swim check has no defense?

[KoDT69]

I roll a swim check on the street. Why not, right? I said I wasn't going to do anything disruptive, but it was more constructive than the other thing I was thinking. I figure maybe this guy will get my point. No, this guy is clearly dumb as hell. Through a series of rolls I rob a bunch of people of 75g. I didn't actually notice their existence but I swam over there and did it anyway because this guy couldn't make sense if he tried.

This is the most entertaining part! If only I had been there myself... :smallbiggrin:

[bean illus]

I think it's hysterical that numerous posters are using quotes from this thread in their sigs now.

Ahhh, i miss the good old days.... Any chance you can somehow get back in the game? I'll pay you to video this farce.

[Barbarian Horde]

The video below can be used to summarize player's reactions to the DM Decisions.
http://i.4cdn.org/wsg/1435245813939.webm

[ComaVision]

https://i.imgflip.com/nmg1w.jpg

[LordTamarack]

Heya people, i am he who roped up the gnomes.

Playing with this dm was just a bloody nightmare sure things are changed in pathfinder but i honestly had no idea what i was getting into also. i liked that there was a constant group... but as the furith said this dm was just wtf bad. the way he was making this story it just dident make any sense at all. sure giants were alright but he kept getting the scale of everything wrong for them, that and he forced us to make certain checks... im sure furith may have mentioned this but frekin sneak check.... i have never played a "sneaky" character in any other games iv played... thing i cant get over is sneaking past giants that was about 74 or so feet tall, pretty sure i could just walk past that without being noticed unless his ears are in his foot btw im not 100% sure on the mechanics of dnd highest i got in a game was about lvl 7 or 8 before it went to crap so i could be completely wrong on that. but from what iv noticed everything furith listed and scaleing issues...

Also figured the DM might start screwing us around so after waking up in jail decided to rope up some gnome npc's and sure enough there was another monster blocking our escape which was a spider, so put the gnomes to use just to see how far we could get from the extremely loud party... elf on rat ring turns on screaming while trying to pass a settlement then we got brought to another giant (elves worked for) which was apparently pissed that i "fed" the gnomes to a spider when i simply threw them at it... dm could of had the spider pass them but nope lol, so i had to do bluff checks to tell the giant the truth.... just one game of dnd i would like to get past atleast lvl 10, this group had potential but the dm, cant deal with multiple holes in a storybook mode game.

[TheFurith]

Heya people, i am he who roped up the gnomes.

Playing with this dm was just a bloody nightmare sure things are changed in pathfinder but i honestly had no idea what i was getting into also. i liked that there was a constant group... but as the furith said this dm was just wtf bad. the way he was making this story it just dident make any sense at all. sure giants were alright but he kept getting the scale of everything wrong for them, that and he forced us to make certain checks... im sure furith may have mentioned this but frekin sneak check.... i have never played a "sneaky" character in any other games iv played... thing i cant get over is sneaking past giants that was about 74 or so feet tall, pretty sure i could just walk past that without being noticed unless his ears are in his foot btw im not 100% sure on the mechanics of dnd highest i got in a game was about lvl 7 or 8 before it went to crap so i could be completely wrong on that. but from what iv noticed everything furith listed and scaleing issues...

Also figured the DM might start screwing us around so after waking up in jail decided to rope up some gnome npc's and sure enough there was another monster blocking our escape which was a spider, so put the gnomes to use just to see how far we could get from the extremely loud party... elf on rat ring turns on screaming while trying to pass a settlement then we got brought to another giant (elves worked for) which was apparently pissed that i "fed" the gnomes to a spider when i simply threw them at it... dm could of had the spider pass them but nope lol, so i had to do bluff checks to tell the giant the truth.... just one game of dnd i would like to get past atleast lvl 10, this group had potential but the dm, cant deal with multiple holes in a storybook mode game.

You don't remember that ranger you played? That time we hopped the wall and slit some throats with a series of really high rolls? Made everyone mad, but the dice fall how they do.

Anyway, whether we could sneak past them easy is one thing. But when three fighters, a cleric, a wizard, an alchemist, and a ranger are intended to go on a mission to sneak passed things, something doesn't seem right. Especially when they were all like dc15 checks. Which isn't how stealth even works, it's not a save, but whatever. Which is why I made the decision to go off and hide in the library. We didn't have a single time somebody didn't fail that check.

It should be noted that this DM was nearly requiring us all to take the stealthy feat, because he planned to have all these stealth checks. But, if I know what the game will be ahead of time, which I didn't really just the stealth, I don't pick things just because it'll give me an edge. Unless it made sense for the character and I'd have taken it anyway. And a fighter with a heavy flail in hand, and two more hanging of either side of his neck is just not stealthy. It's noisy. So I don't know why I'd have had any training to be stealthy. So I didn't.

[Segev]

A word of advice: don't be afraid to optimize your character concept for a game if you know something about the game will be important. It is really not worth being bad at a critical or oft-recurring aspect unless you're deliberately building your character to be bad at that thing. When a game has something happen that often, the only people who should be bad at it are those for whom their not being good at it is an important character trait used to give them more screen-time drama. If it is not something you want to use to make your character more central to the challenges of the game, buy up the necessary skills or powers to be able to do it competently.

You'll have more fun, frustrate yourself and others less, and it really will run more smoothly in the game.

[TheFurith]

A word of advice: don't be afraid to optimize your character concept for a game if you know something about the game will be important. It is really not worth being bad at a critical or oft-recurring aspect unless you're deliberately building your character to be bad at that thing. When a game has something happen that often, the only people who should be bad at it are those for whom their not being good at it is an important character trait used to give them more screen-time drama. If it is not something you want to use to make your character more central to the challenges of the game, buy up the necessary skills or powers to be able to do it competently.

You'll have more fun, frustrate yourself and others less, and it really will run more smoothly in the game.

So I should take skill focus in skills I don't have if it'll make me better at that particular game? Like in a typical game. Somebody in this one rolled a 1 on a stealth check and still didn't get noticed.

[nyjastul69]

Heya people, i am he who roped up the gnomes.

Playing with this dm was just a bloody nightmare sure things are changed in pathfinder but i honestly had no idea what i was getting into also. i liked that there was a constant group... but as the furith said this dm was just wtf bad. the way he was making this story it just dident make any sense at all. sure giants were alright but he kept getting the scale of everything wrong for them, that and he forced us to make certain checks... im sure furith may have mentioned this but frekin sneak check.... i have never played a "sneaky" character in any other games iv played... thing i cant get over is sneaking past giants that was about 74 or so feet tall, pretty sure i could just walk past that without being noticed unless his ears are in his foot btw im not 100% sure on the mechanics of dnd highest i got in a game was about lvl 7 or 8 before it went to crap so i could be completely wrong on that. but from what iv noticed everything furith listed and scaleing issues...

Also figured the DM might start screwing us around so after waking up in jail decided to rope up some gnome npc's and sure enough there was another monster blocking our escape which was a spider, so put the gnomes to use just to see how far we could get from the extremely loud party... elf on rat ring turns on screaming while trying to pass a settlement then we got brought to another giant (elves worked for) which was apparently pissed that i "fed" the gnomes to a spider when i simply threw them at it... dm could of had the spider pass them but nope lol, so i had to do bluff checks to tell the giant the truth.... just one game of dnd i would like to get past atleast lvl 10, this group had potential but the dm, cant deal with multiple holes in a storybook mode game.

I gotta chime in on this. This is some seriously poor DMing. I'm not always of the mindset that no gaming is better than bad gaming, but this may be that case. If you are enjoying the game, good for you. The both of you actually. I apologize for the schadenfreude.

[MesiDoomstalker]

So I should take skill focus in skills I don't have if it'll make me better at that particular game? Like in a typical game. Somebody in this one rolled a 1 on a stealth check and still didn't get noticed.

I think what he is saying, when your making your character for a game prior to the game starting (or your first session if the game is already started) and you know some aspect of the campaign will be prominent (Undead heavy game, stealth heavy game, political intrigue game, etc), then its not a bad idea to make a character who can excel in the aspect that you know will happen a lot. If you just have a general character and don't have any foreknowledge of the campaign, make it how you like.

[Segev]

So I should take skill focus in skills I don't have if it'll make me better at that particular game? Like in a typical game. Somebody in this one rolled a 1 on a stealth check and still didn't get noticed.


I think what he is saying, when your making your character for a game prior to the game starting (or your first session if the game is already started) and you know some aspect of the campaign will be prominent (Undead heavy game, stealth heavy game, political intrigue game, etc), then its not a bad idea to make a character who can excel in the aspect that you know will happen a lot. If you just have a general character and don't have any foreknowledge of the campaign, make it how you like.

More or less this, yes.

I've found that you can, just from knowing what the game system or setting is, generally get a feel for one or two things that WILL be important. In a D&D game, have a reliable means of contributing in combat and keeping yourself alive, for instance. In a L5R game, you will want the ability to make perception-type rolls, because whether it's a combat-heavy, exploration-heavy, or social-heavy game, noticing things is always going to be important to being able to participate in it adequately. (Or maybe that's just the GMs I've had for L5R.)

Really, just make sure that you're not deliberately handicapping yourself by NOT taking abilities you know you'll regularly regret not having.

Don't waste resources; just be aware when you recognize that something is such a good choice that you feel like you're weakening yourself by not taking it that it's okay to find an IC reason for your character to have it, rather than to "do without" for "roleplaying" reasons.

[TheFurith]

More or less this, yes.

I've found that you can, just from knowing what the game system or setting is, generally get a feel for one or two things that WILL be important. In a D&D game, have a reliable means of contributing in combat and keeping yourself alive, for instance. In a L5R game, you will want the ability to make perception-type rolls, because whether it's a combat-heavy, exploration-heavy, or social-heavy game, noticing things is always going to be important to being able to participate in it adequately. (Or maybe that's just the GMs I've had for L5R.)

Really, just make sure that you're not deliberately handicapping yourself by NOT taking abilities you know you'll regularly regret not having.

Don't waste resources; just be aware when you recognize that something is such a good choice that you feel like you're weakening yourself by not taking it that it's okay to find an IC reason for your character to have it, rather than to "do without" for "roleplaying" reasons.

Fair enough. Admittedly had I known more about my assigned back story, and also known the DM would allow us to put skill point anywhere with no restriction, for whatever reason. I'd have made a very different character.

As it stood though. Even with the feat I'd have been trying to make a dc15 a few dozen times with a total of +1 to it.

[nyjastul69]

Fair enough. Admittedly had I known more about my assigned back story, and also known the DM would allow us to put skill point anywhere with no restriction, for whatever reason. I'd have made a very different character.

As it stood though. Even with the feat I'd have been trying to make a dc15 a few dozen times with a total of +1 to it.

Assigned back story!?! This gets better and betterer. Good luck with your game.

[TheFurith]

Assigned back story!?! This gets better and betterer. Good luck with your game.

Game's over man, at least for me.

It pretty much went that I made my character, stood up and was told I'm in prison and that I'm a "hardened criminal". Which was later revealed to be because he couldn't figure out how to motive the players. I guess the 250,000g for the job didn't seem like enough motivation for a level 5. So I ended up having to just roll with that.