PDA

View Full Version : Player Help [Pathfinder] Mr. Mittens, Beastmorph Alchemist (character creation help)



AmbientRaven
2015-06-28, 09:13 AM
Hi Folks,

I have had a few posts the past few days about what to play. I have narrowed it down to a mutagen alchemist.

The group is
Synthist Summoner, Alchemist (Skill Based), Rogue (Social Build), Druid (an archetype that loses animal shape and gains traps and better weapon skills)

Character creation rules
No Hybrid classes, 15pt buy, 1 trait, 1 campaign trait, 2nd Level start

This is my character

A cat turned into a humanoid form by an alchemist’s potion. He randomly changes between cat and human. He experiments with potions, trying to find the one that will return him to his cat form. He sees humanoids as servants, and calls them thus. He very much has cat like attitudes. He seems to understand a lot more than he should, and has come to the conclusion that he has imbibed several concoctions that were fed to the experimental animals, as well as a mixture of several potions that mixed on the floor. This has given him higher intelligence, wit, and knowledge of things he has no place in knowing. He has spent some time with other two-legs and a brief bit of time with a weretiger community. This has taught him basic skills of using a weapon and other related skills.
He is on a quest to find the alchemist whose potion he drank so that he can be returned to his higher form.
He will be a bit of a jerk, call any two-legged race the “servants”, and be very fastidious about how clean his fur is. He is also very vain.
Class design leaves lots of options open for development, random fun and class options. Can potentially go Master Chymist as the split personality thing would work great with human form vs cat form, with each form developing its own personality. GM would have to house rule that the split personality works on human/cat as opposed to mutagen/non mutagen. He will only be in hybrid cat form before or after taking mutagen until he randomly changes back.
May change to catfolk race and drop the shifting between human and cat



A former experiment from a powerful Recuran Imperial Alchemist whom lived in the wilds due to being cursed with lycanthropy by a rival. Within his lab he kept many forms of animals, including mice, rats, lizards, snakes, monkeys, goblins, kobolds, birds, a few peasants and, his pet cat, Mr. Mittens. He was experimenting upon the animals, trying to find a way to reverse his lycanthropy.
One night the Alchemists lab was raided by an unknown group. The Alchemist never returned. In his desperation Mr. Mittens decided to eat a few of the rats, a bird or two and a lizard. He also drank from some of the strange water the Alchemist gave to the experimental animals.
Mr. Mittens had some peculiar dreams that night. He dreamed he walked on two legs, like a servant, sometimes even turning into a servant!
When he awoke from his two-week hibernation he was changed. His dreams had come true, he had risen like a two legs, becoming a lesser life form! He spent time looking through the lab, curious as only a cat could be, and found he could understand the scratching the servant made.
He realised that not only could he understand the scratching’s, but he knew what they meant.
He spent the next few weeks experimenting with the formulas of the Servant to try and un-do whatever it was he had consumed. During this time he found he randomly changed into a true-servant and his hybrid form. This worried him, for he had no wish to be a servant. None of the formulas he found related to his changed. He was Outraged. It was then Mr. Mittens decided he would have to travel to the outside world, so that he could find The Servant, and get him to undo what he had done. He set forth, moving amongst communities, learning the basics of interactions between the servant peoples, was well as rudimentary weapon skills. He didn’t stay for long, often leaving due to disagreements with locals.

Mr. Mittens
Class: Beastmorph/Vivisectionist Alchemist
Race: Accidental Experiment (Fanglord Skinchanger)
Stats: 14 16 12 14 08 09 (can swap to 15 int 14 str as well)
Skills: 2 Use Magic Device, 2 Craft (Alchemy), 4 Perception, 2 Knowledge (Nature), 2 Survival, 2 Sleight of Hand, 2 Acrobatics
Class Skills: Alchemy, Brew Potion, Mutagen, Throw Anything, Discovery, Sneak Attack
Saves: +4 fot, +6 Ref, +0 Will
Trait: Reactionary, Campaign
Discovery: Feral Mutagen OR Tumour Familiar OR Tentacle
Extracts Known: Deathwatch, enlarge creature, shield, cure light wounds, Long arm, heightened awareness
Feat: Improved initiative or Additional Trait

Items 90.7/230 gold spent
Studded Leather 25gp
2x Spring Loaded Wrist Sheath 5gp
6x iron vial 5sp
2x Dagger 4gp
Longspear 5gp
Sickle 6gp
20 sheets rice paper 1sp
5 sheets parchment (10sp)
Stationary 1gp
Hollowed Pommel (Dagger 1) 5gp
String/Twine 1cp
5 Fishing Hooks 5sp
Bell 1gp
Chalk 1cp
Flint & Steel 1gp
backpack 2gp
bandolier 5gp
2 Waterskin 2gp
Waterproof Bag 5 sp
2 belt pouch 2gp
10 Vials 10gp
Blanket 5sp
Small Steel Mirror 10gp
Bedroll 1sp
Artisan Tools 5gp
Alchemist Book


Questions
Discovery: I am torn between Tentacle (second tail; GM ruled it counts as a natural weapon, so I would have 2x Claw, 1x Tentacle or 1x Sickle/Spear 1x Bite 1x Tentacle); Tumour Familiar (“Snake”(Greenskin scorpion); or Feral Mutagen. What should be the order I take these? (2nd, 4th, 6th)
Trait: I am unsure between Reactionary and Adopted(tusked). Initiative is strong, but so is a natural bite attack (even at -5).
Feat: Improved Imitative or Additional Traits (Reactionary or Tusked depending on which I pick as my main trait and what other?)
Gold: What else should I spend my gold on? A few alchemical items may be flavourful
Agile: I read somewhere that if i have agile enchanted cestus it makes my natural attacks use dex for damage, and weapon finesse makes it dex to hit. Is this true?
damage, and weapon finesse makes it dex to hit. Is this true?
Weapons: Sickle, Longspear and 2x Dagger seems a god mix. Daggers are more for RP purposes as medieval times most people carried a dagger. Someone recommended Cestus to me though.
Race: Catfolk seems almost strictly better, gaining me +10ft on charges, 1-2 interesting feats and always on natural claws. Would it be better to just go catfolk?
As I progress: Is it worth staying 20 Alchemist, dipping 2 Way of Many Styles Monk, or going Master Chymist 3.


Thank you for any feedback on this build :)

grarrrg
2015-06-28, 11:51 PM
Discovery: I am torn between Tentacle (second tail; GM ruled it counts as a natural weapon, so I would have 2x Claw, 1x Tentacle or 1x Sickle/Spear 1x Bite 1x Tentacle); Tumour Familiar (“Snake”(Greenskin scorpion); or Feral Mutagen. What should be the order I take these? (2nd, 4th, 6th)
Trait: I am unsure between Reactionary and Adopted(tusked). Initiative is strong, but so is a natural bite attack (even at -5).

Longer term I'd say go Feral Mutagen, and skip getting Tusked. Going "all in" Primary Naturals is usually a better payoff (although if your DM allows 'bite stacking' like he would on the Claws, then Tusked is back on the table).

Short term you may or may not be better off using a Manufactured Weapon until you get all your ducks in a row. Remember if you mix Manufactured and Naturals that ALL of your Naturals become Secondary and take a -5 to-hit penalty, and only get 1/2 STR to damage. So higher levels ditching Manufactured would probably be best.


Tumor Familiar + Protector archetype (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/familiar/familiar-archetypes/protector-familiar-archetype) = Free HP battery.
At 5th level, as long as you are touching your Familiar you can freely redirect half of the damage you would take to your Familiar instead.
Tumor Familiars gain Fast Healing 5 as long as they are touching you.
Just leave the sucker attached and PROFIT!


Agile: I read somewhere that if i have agile enchanted cestus it makes my natural attacks use dex for damage, and weapon finesse makes it dex to hit. Is this true?
damage, and weapon finesse makes it dex to hit. Is this true?

I'm not sure where you got the Cestus nonsense from. At best the Cestus would modify your Unarmed Strikes, but not your Naturals.
For that you'd want an Amulet of Mighty Fists (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/a-b/amulet-of-mighty-fists), which would benefit ALL of your Natural Attacks.


Race: Catfolk seems almost strictly better, gaining me +10ft on charges, 1-2 interesting feats and always on natural claws. Would it be better to just go catfolk?

I'm not all that impressed with the Fanglord for this build. The Naturals you get overlap with Feral Mutagen, and the 'beast mode' stat bonus is to CHA of all things. Some of the other Skinwalkers would be better mechanically, but don't match the flavor you're going for.
Catfolk seems the better option to me. Beastmorph already provides Pounce, so you don't need that, but Nimble Striker (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/racial-feats/nimble-striker-combat-catfolk) + Lunge (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/lunge-combat---final) is worth a look, granting ALL of your Naturals Reach can be nice.


As I progress: Is it worth staying 20 Alchemist, dipping 2 Way of Many Styles Monk, or going Master Chymist 3.

This partly depends on if you expect the game to last until level 20, and how much you value Grand Discoveries.

But for my money, on a front-line Alchemist you can not go wrong with a dip in Master Chymist. 2/day "preperation free" uses of Mutagen is very worth it. You may want to delay taking Master Chymist 2 for a while so you can qualify for better Advanced Mutagens, but the 1st level is a must have at level 8 (also try to sweet talk your DM into letting Chymist stack for the Sneak Dice from Vivisectionist, as you don't have a Bombs feature anymore).

AmbientRaven
2015-06-29, 04:34 AM
Longer term I'd say go Feral Mutagen, and skip getting Tusked. Going "all in" Primary Naturals is usually a better payoff (although if your DM allows 'bite stacking' like he would on the Claws, then Tusked is back on the table).

Short term you may or may not be better off using a Manufactured Weapon until you get all your ducks in a row. Remember if you mix Manufactured and Naturals that ALL of your Naturals become Secondary and take a -5 to-hit penalty, and only get 1/2 STR to damage. So higher levels ditching Manufactured would probably be best.

I'll ask about the bite stacking.
If I take feral mutagen, is it better to drop a manufactured weapon and just use natural?



Tumor Familiar + Protector archetype (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/familiar/familiar-archetypes/protector-familiar-archetype) = Free HP battery.
At 5th level, as long as you are touching your Familiar you can freely redirect half of the damage you would take to your Familiar instead.
Tumor Familiars gain Fast Healing 5 as long as they are touching you.
Just leave the sucker attached and PROFIT!

How do familiar archtypes work? I have never seen that mentioned before!


I'm not sure where you got the Cestus nonsense from. At best the Cestus would modify your Unarmed Strikes, but not your Naturals.
For that you'd want an Amulet of Mighty Fists (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/a-b/amulet-of-mighty-fists), which would benefit ALL of your Natural Attacks.

That makes more sense. Was something someone mentioend on a thread I was reading, I thought it seemed odd.


I'm not all that impressed with the Fanglord for this build. The Naturals you get overlap with Feral Mutagen, and the 'beast mode' stat bonus is to CHA of all things. Some of the other Skinwalkers would be better mechanically, but don't match the flavor you're going for.
Catfolk seems the better option to me. Beastmorph already provides Pounce, so you don't need that, but Nimble Striker (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/racial-feats/nimble-striker-combat-catfolk) + Lunge (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/lunge-combat---final) is worth a look, granting ALL of your Naturals Reach can be nice.

The GM agreed, he ruled out skinchangers after initially ok'ing it, so Catfolk it is now


This partly depends on if you expect the game to last until level 20, and how much you value Grand Discoveries.

But for my money, on a front-line Alchemist you can not go wrong with a dip in Master Chymist. 2/day "preperation free" uses of Mutagen is very worth it. You may want to delay taking Master Chymist 2 for a while so you can qualify for better Advanced Mutagens, but the 1st level is a must have at level 8 (also try to sweet talk your DM into letting Chymist stack for the Sneak Dice from Vivisectionist, as you don't have a Bombs feature anymore).

Thanks for that!

Thanks for the feedback!

grarrrg
2015-06-29, 08:14 PM
If I take feral mutagen, is it better to drop a manufactured weapon and just use natural?

The main issue with Feral Mutagen is the Mutagen part.
Taking 1 hour of down time for every use can be time consuming (depending on the campaign).
So you may not always be able to depend on having all of your Naturals available. Keeping a good Weapon or 2 on hand would be...handy...

If/When you get to level 8 and take the first level of Master Chymist, that gives you 2 prep-free uses of Mutagen, and you can resort to all Naturals all the time.


How do familiar archtypes work? I have never seen that mentioned before!

Mostly the same as Class archetypes.
They swap out certain features, in exchange for different features.
And the Protector one is pretty much tailor made for (ab)use with Tumor Familiars.