Which of them should be the most powerful NPC in any campaign setting?

[Dr TPK]

According to their positions and titles, can you rank these five men/women in order so that in your opinion the #1 should be the most powerful one and the 5th should be the weakest one. The setting can be any pseudo-Medieval setting. Imagine vanilla fantasy... Please note that classes, levels, races etc. are not mentioned here. You just have to go with titles and positions and give me your opinion. I just want to know that how the balance of power should go, by default, in your campaign setting(s).

1. The highest-ranking general of the largest army in the world.
2. The captain of the world's most powerful monarch's personal bodyguard.
3. The most powerful assassin in the world.
4. The most expensive full-time mercenary captain of the known world.
5. The best known full-time combat instructor in the world (whether magical, mundane, or a combination).

"Power" in this case is a relative term which you can perceive in any way you wish. You can imagine that who would be last man standing if forced to fight each other in a closed arena.

[Extra Anchovies]

The assassin, the general, and the mercenary captain are all probably casters of some sort, so they're on top. Combat instructor could be martial or caster, so he'll at least be above the captain of the guard, who was probably chosen in part because he's big and tough and is thus probably a noncaster.

1. General
2. Assassin
3. Mercenary
4. Instructor
5. Guard

[dascarletm]

Man, this really depends on the focus of the game narrative, but I would rank them as such.
1.instructor (most skilled but perhaps 2-3rd most powerful)
2.bodyguard
3.assassin
4. Mercenary
5. General

[Inevitability]

Highest-ranking general will be smart, but not necessarily strong. I'm pretty sure Napoleon wouldn't have been able to take your average 3rd-level fighter in a fair fight.

Captain of the bodyguard should be strong enough to give assassins trouble, but in the end most of his job is passively watching over his king.

Most powerful assassin probably has killed a fair amount of people, and as a result knows a wide range of combat techniques. On top of that, he's powerful enough to avoid getting caught.

Full-time mercenary captain has to be good, otherwise people wouldn't hire him. He is the most expensive one, after all.

Combat instructor, again, is directly dependent on his combat skills to live. Fairly strong at least.

In the end, I'd rank them like this:

1. Assassin
2. Mercenary captain
3. Combat instructor
4. Bodyguard
5. General

[QuickLyRaiNbow]

According to their positions and titles, can you rank these five men/women in order so that in your opinion the #1 should be the most powerful one and the 5th should be the weakest one. The setting can be any pseudo-Medieval setting. Imagine vanilla fantasy... Please note that classes, levels, races etc. are not mentioned here. You just have to go with titles and positions and give me your opinion. I just want to know that how the balance of power should go, by default, in your campaign setting(s).

1. The highest-ranking general of the largest army in the world.
2. The captain of the world's most powerful monarch's personal bodyguard.
3. The most powerful assassin in the world.
4. The most expensive full-time mercenary captain of the known world.
5. The best known full-time combat instructor in the world (whether magical, mundane, or a combination).

"Power" in this case is a relative term which you can perceive in any way you wish. You can imagine that who would be last man standing if forced to fight each other in a closed arena.

Captain
Mercenary
Assassin
Instructor
General

The general is about making decisions and inspiring followers. His personal strength is probably insignificant compared to his usage of Leadership and his ability to direct large groups. He's a Marshal/Bard/Exemplar with Leadership. The instructor wouldn't be teaching if he could be doing. The top 3 are pretty interchangable.

[ComaVision]

1. Assassin - General - Mercenary - Bodyguard
5. Instructor

I would assume all of the ranks I listed at 1 would be exceptionally powerful, the height of mortals in the campaign setting.

EDIT: The responses just seem to accentuate that this is extremely subjective. Certainly, any of these characters could have attained their rank by extreme intelligence and tactical savvy rather than any combat ability.

[Nashira]

The assassin, the general, and the mercenary captain are all probably casters of some sort, so they're on top. Combat instructor could be martial or caster, so he'll at least be above the captain of the guard, who was probably chosen in part because he's big and tough and is thus probably a noncaster.

1. General
2. Assassin
3. Mercenary
4. Instructor
5. Guard

This, if the assassin has a guild or something to back him up because resources are so necessary, otherwise switch assassin and mercenary.

[Honest Tiefling]

My personal order would be:

1. Instructor
2. Assassin
3. Guard
4. Mercenary
5. General

Through this has less to do with what would make sense, and what would be hilarious/useful in a DnD game. Inept armies can be tools in the right hands for player characters, depending on their skill set, after all.

[Deadline]

1. Assassin (assuming he personally takes regular contracts on difficult targets and is successful)
2. Mercenary captain (assuming he is personally in frequent combat against challenging foes. Just being expensive doesn't tell you anything about his capabilities, that's a fallacious assumption many folks are making)
3. Combat instructor (assuming he is training skilled fighters, not simple self defense type stuff, and engages regularly in sparring against skilled fighters)
4. Bodyguard
5. General (assuming he is not doing much in the way of personal fighting)

I generally agree with Dire Stirge, but wanted to explain a couple of my assumptions. I might put the General before the Bodyguard, depending on how much actual combat the general personally engages in. At the end of the day, there's no real substitute for real-world experience.

Edit - I modified some positions to point out my assumptions.

[Grek]

Assassin
Instructor
Mercenary
Bodyguard
General

The Assassin presumably kills people regularly, and the combat Instructor at least fights every day. So obviously they go to the top of the list. Next would be the Mercenary (if he is expensive, he must be good enough to justify that cost), then either the Bodyguard or the General. I put Bodyguard slightly in front, simply on the basis that "highest-ranking" and "largest army" don't actually tell you a lot about personal combat skill.

But personally, I have to ask... Why is the King not on this list?

[Honest Tiefling]

But personally, I have to ask... Why is the King not on this list?

When your parents have shared the same last name for a few generations, you don't tend to get many class levels easily.

[Flickerdart]

1. The highest-ranking general of the largest army in the world.
2. The captain of the world's most powerful monarch's personal bodyguard.
3. The most powerful assassin in the world.
4. The most expensive full-time mercenary captain of the known world.
5. The best known full-time combat instructor in the world (whether magical, mundane, or a combination).

Becoming a high-ranked general doesn't actually require much in the way of personal skill - one can be a brilliant strategist and have no other virtues, simply good at sucking up to authority, or just an aristocrat/noble who got the position by default. Charles II, Emperor of Spain was technically the commander in chief of the nation's troops, but also severely inbred and ineffectual in every respect. He would also have many advisors and delegate his authority and power. So him I would place far below the others.

The mercenary captain doesn't have the aristocratic excuse, but he still has everything else to deal with. He is second weakest.

The combat instructor could have once been powerful, but is likely very old and thus weak. He can be third in power.

The captain of the most powerful monarch is probably very strong indeed, but even powerful monarchs are limited. It is possible that a weaker monarch has as his loyal subject a more poweful man, whom the powerful monarch cannot buy, coerce, or otherwise recruit no matter what. Still, the captain would be very skilled. Let's put him second.

The assassin - as a fantasy assassin - would be a lot more powerful than actual assassins were. He would be able to walk past the armies and the guards and end whomever he damn well pleased, and then make sure that their soul could not be returned to life. So he, I would say, is the strongest.

[dascarletm]

The way I go about it is: If you were writing a novel, and these characters fought, which power ranking would be most interesting. for example, the assassin vs bodyguard.

The assassin is usually straight up weaker, but can defeat the bodyguard if given an opportunity to surprise them. Otherwise, being sneaky isn't really required for them.

[Flickerdart]

The assassin is usually straight up weaker, but can defeat the bodyguard if given an opportunity to surprise them. Otherwise, being sneaky isn't really required for them.
That's not necessarily true. The assassin could be stronger than the bodyguard in an arena, but prefer stealth for any number of reasons. He could be cowardly and prefer backstabs. He could be trying to avoid harming people other than his target. He could be trying to avoid witnesses in order to frame the death as an accident, judgment from the gods, etc. He could have a healthy respect for the action economy and not want to take on an entire castle single-handed. He could be a cleric of the God of Sleep, and consider it disrespectful to wake people from his lord's embrace.

[LoyalPaladin]

1. Bodyguard: This guy should be able to hold of anything. He guards the most powerful monarch in the world. If anyone else is more powerful, this monarch should be buying them.

2. General: This guy has seen it all and live to tell the tale. He commands armies and thus should demand respect from anyone he comes across.

3. Instructor: Two and three are interchangeable based on a single fact. Just how skilled is this instructor? If he trained the general, perhaps he should be two. If he is just a master roshi sort of guy, keep him at three.

4. Assassin: Sure, they make money. But assassin's aren't personally funded by a monarch, given one of the largest positions of power, or the wise trainer of legend. I get the appeal of a really strong dark and brooding person, but is it really necessary? Again?

5. Mercenary: This guy should be close behind the assassin. He doesn't get the same level of funding as the guard, he doesn't command as large a force as the general, he isn't a well versed as the instructor, but he shouldn't be miles behind the assassin. He should, however, be less suave and conniving. Which sets him back.

Anyways, that's my 2cp.

[dascarletm]

That's not necessarily true. The assassin could be stronger than the bodyguard in an arena, but prefer stealth for any number of reasons. He could be cowardly and prefer backstabs. He could be trying to avoid harming people other than his target. He could be trying to avoid witnesses in order to frame the death as an accident, judgment from the gods, etc. He could have a healthy respect for the action economy and not want to take on an entire castle single-handed. He could be a cleric of the God of Sleep, and consider it disrespectful to wake people from his lord's embrace.

Very true, he could be more powerful, but it kind of removes the tension if the assassin can just kill the most badass guards in a one on one fight. This is why I enjoy stealth games like thief over assassins creed. But that's just my opinion

[Draco_Lord]

1. The highest-ranking general of the largest army in the world.
2. The captain of the world's most powerful monarch's personal bodyguard.
3. The most powerful assassin in the world.
4. The most expensive full-time mercenary captain of the known world.
5. The best known full-time combat instructor in the world (whether magical, mundane, or a combination).

Everyone has been pretty hard on the general, so I am going to take the opposite route. A medieval general is not just about being good at tactics, though that definitely is a part of it. It is also about inspiring troupes, leading men, and controlling a battle field. There are two types of generals who do this; those that lead from the back, and those that lead from the front. Everyone has assumed this is a general that leads from the back. A general that leads from the front is a king among warriors. He fights the hardest. He has to understand the flow of battle. He has to stand firm, for he if crumbles the battle is lost. He is also a target, putting him in the greatest danger of enemy soldiers ganging up on him. He would probably be a career soldier as well, having spent most of his life in some kind of battle, army, or something to that effect.
All together this creates someone who has dedicated himself to fighting battles, and is as willing to stand and fight against impossible odds, and push himself to win.

A personal guard is going to be strong. He must be, or someone's cousin, if he wants to keep his job. He would be someone who has probably made a name for himself with personal deeds, dueling, slaying monsters, something like that. It means he is probably very suited to a gladiator kind of arena, and to this battle.

The assassin I would argue would actually be one of the weaker in this setting. Simply because an assassin's number one goal is to never fight their opponent. They are masters of stealth, poison, slight of hand, and generally illusion. Using their skills to strike when not scene. If put in an arena, I suspect you could not draw out their full power, and they would have a hard time if targeted by any of the other contestants.

Mercenary Captain is probably similar to a general. But where a general has discipline a mercenary captain has charisma. He keeps his men together because they believe that he can make them money, more exactly. And that I think makes a different. A mercenary group is hired to bolster a force, add to an army, and rarely to be an army. As such they are usually not where they most strategic part of the battle is held, unless their skills are known to greatly surpass regular troops, most generals would want men they know they can trust, not those whose trust they bought, to fight there. So while they see battle, the general would have seen harder parts of it.

The great instructor. This is a toss up. There are two kinds of instructors. Those that teach because they know. And those who teach because they can. Especially when it comes to physical activities, the kind of person who can teach you how to hold a sword may not be the best to hold it themselves. Think a Boxer's second, they usually couldn't stand in the ring themselves, but they can give some of the best advice. If it is that, then they loss. Now if they are someone who can, that usually means they are done with that life. They have moved onto teaching, because of age, injury, what have you. Now it is a question of does their experience overcome the others skills? And how rusty have they become, making kids swing swords.

Ultimately I have assumed none of them are serious casters, as they muddies the whole thing a lot more. But I think the General will come out on top, assuming he is the front line type. He has experience, he would still be seeing battle, and be in shape. The assassin would finish near the end, unless someone targets him early, and might win simply by avoiding battle. The rest would battle it out, but it would be close.

[Draco_Lord]

That's not necessarily true. The assassin could be stronger than the bodyguard in an arena, but prefer stealth for any number of reasons. He could be cowardly and prefer backstabs. He could be trying to avoid harming people other than his target. He could be trying to avoid witnesses in order to frame the death as an accident, judgment from the gods, etc. He could have a healthy respect for the action economy and not want to take on an entire castle single-handed. He could be a cleric of the God of Sleep, and consider it disrespectful to wake people from his lord's embrace.

Ah, but I would argue that lack of confrontation would make him weaker. He doesn't test himself, he uses stealth, and that can hurt him when he must fight head on.

[SangoProduction]

For the purposes of the comparison, I will assume magic = non-factor, because magic is magic and magic is broken.
But, for all intents and purposes, it depends on what you consider is power.

A general would have functionally infinite number of men who would bar you from actual fights with him, and then a personal set of guards. And, depending on your level, he might even have a few tricks up his sleeve, for when he can no longer run. He's the quintessential final boss.

Captain of Personal Guard: They would have great political strength, on top of infinite funds, and are likely going to be higher "level" than just about anybody (Except the PCs, if that's how you run you games), or he's out of a job - a monarch isn't going to put up with the second best, when they *are* the best.. He can definitely probably go toe to toe with a party, especially with his own crew as well. If you are playing it off like he's the actual power behind the throne, while the ruler is just a dummy, then he's also great final boss material. (Hell, Order of the Stick shows that real well.)

The assassin though...I'd be cautious. If you mean he owns his assassin's guild, and it's ruled by skill, then yeah...he's be pretty damned powerful. But, guess where their power comes from? Not being seen. Guess what would be stupid to play against? Someone you "can't" see. (ie. if you play it as roll play, and just give him massive bonuses). And in straight up fights, rogues, or assassins (the class) are not going to beat a decently built fighter of the same level, and certainly not a group of them without a group of his own.
Of course, if you mean powerful as in they could have the most sway over the party (perhaps they are assassins that work for this one), then yes, it has great potential power. Again, it would be difficult to make it final boss material though.

Mercenary: same deal as the guard. In fact, the exact same.

Instructor...yeah, same thing as the general. He's the brains of the operation, not the brawn, but could have tricks up his sleeves.

So, in order of what I would personally make my final boss in my campaigns, it would be

1: General/ Instructor
2: Guard / Mercenary
3: Assassin.

[Sagetim]

According to their positions and titles, can you rank these five men/women in order so that in your opinion the #1 should be the most powerful one and the 5th should be the weakest one. The setting can be any pseudo-Medieval setting. Imagine vanilla fantasy... Please note that classes, levels, races etc. are not mentioned here. You just have to go with titles and positions and give me your opinion. I just want to know that how the balance of power should go, by default, in your campaign setting(s).

1. The highest-ranking general of the largest army in the world.
2. The captain of the world's most powerful monarch's personal bodyguard.
3. The most powerful assassin in the world.
4. The most expensive full-time mercenary captain of the known world.
5. The best known full-time combat instructor in the world (whether magical, mundane, or a combination).

"Power" in this case is a relative term which you can perceive in any way you wish. You can imagine that who would be last man standing if forced to fight each other in a closed arena.

Politically speaking, it would go:
1) General
2) Bodyguard Captain
3) Combat Instructor
4) Mercenary Captain
5) Assassin

However, there are some qualifiers here. The Bodyguard trumps the general when it comes to matters of the monarch's safety. The Combat instructor is assumed to be in the military hierarchy under the general or the bodyguard, if he is a free lancer then he is equal or less than the mercenary captain. The merc is a merc, he doesn't get political power unless he conquers a kingdom and manages to install himself as king or something. And if he's doing his job right, then the Assassin isn't even on a list of political power, he's killing people and taken money from a very carefully picked list of clients who know how to shut the hell up.

If we're talking combat power, then I'd say it goes:
General with his army (as a general without his army isn't really a general)
Merc Captain- he has a band of mercenaries along with his own personal prowess. If he's the most expensive in the world, it implies that he can compete with all the adventuring companies and still be considered worth it.
Assassin- the most powerful individual in the world, at least as far as this list is concerned.
The Captain of the kings bodyguards- has the king's bodyguards along with him, but there's no guarantee that he's any good, just that he has the job. Similarly, no guarantee that his gear is any good.
The Insturctor- you can get a lot of milage out of skill spamming. He doesn't need to be high level to have the highest Profession (Combat Instructor) skill in the land. Especially if he has a magic item to back it up.

[Yahzi]

Assuming an arena duel:

1. Guard - standup fighting is what he does
2. Mercenary - has to be good to impress his men
3. Instructor - he trained the first two
4. Assassin - smart assassins only attack from ambush; why would they even know how to duel?
5. General - he's no push-over, but he's probably old and his job is less about fighting than thinking

[Bucky]

1. General - because he can call down an army on you, and that trumps physical might.
2. Mercenary - As the general, but with more physical might and a smaller army.
3. Bodyguard - whose job description is to be just slightly more powerful than the best assassin.
4. Assassin - Needs to be scary.
5. Combat Instructor - Does not need to be scary.

[FabulousFizban]

the answer is always Leroy Brown, baddest man in the whole damn town.

[Threadnaught]

All of them, they're all the same person. :smallcool:

[Brookshw]

the answer is always Leroy Brown, baddest man in the whole damn town.

This made me smile :smallbiggrin:

[Telonius]

According to their positions and titles, can you rank these five men/women in order so that in your opinion the #1 should be the most powerful one and the 5th should be the weakest one. The setting can be any pseudo-Medieval setting. Imagine vanilla fantasy... Please note that classes, levels, races etc. are not mentioned here. You just have to go with titles and positions and give me your opinion. I just want to know that how the balance of power should go, by default, in your campaign setting(s).

1. The highest-ranking general of the largest army in the world.
2. The captain of the world's most powerful monarch's personal bodyguard.
3. The most powerful assassin in the world.
4. The most expensive full-time mercenary captain of the known world.
5. The best known full-time combat instructor in the world (whether magical, mundane, or a combination).

"Power" in this case is a relative term which you can perceive in any way you wish. You can imagine that who would be last man standing if forced to fight each other in a closed arena.

Assuming that a single person doesn't occupy more than one of those positions, and that none of them are actually the BBEG:

1. General
2. Captain of the Bodyguard
3. Tie between Assassin and Instructor. (Ideally they'll be arch-enemies of each other).
5. Mercenary

[Flickerdart]

Very true, he could be more powerful, but it kind of removes the tension if the assassin can just kill the most badass guards in a one on one fight. This is why I enjoy stealth games like thief over assassins creed. But that's just my opinion
It doesn't remove the tension at all - half of the reasons I listed would require even a super-strong assassin to not be seen.

[Threadnaught]

Very true, he could be more powerful, but it kind of removes the tension if the assassin can just kill the most badass guards in a one on one fight. This is why I enjoy stealth games like thief over assassins creed. But that's just my opinion

I suggest you don't play the Metal Gear series. Solid Snake and Naked Snake/Big Boss are competent combatants, each capable of taking on scores of enemy soldiers and there are points where each is supposed to take on the most badass guard in the area, the boss fights.

[The Insanity]

Depends on the setting and the DM.

[Hrugner]

Tippy verse?

1. The best known full-time combat instructor in the world (whether magical, mundane, or a combination).

combat every day with opponents of increasing power
2. The most powerful assassin in the world.

solo player, probably good friends with the DM, stinks of homebrew. Also it says powerful on the label
3. The most expensive full-time mercenary captain of the known world.

hirelings are priced to their level, this dude must be powerful to be expensive
4. The highest-ranking general of the largest army in the world.

he's probably old, and inherited or bought the rank
5. The captain of the world's most powerful monarch's personal bodyguard.

should rarely see combat and is mostly for show to get Warf tossed by the big bad

[Dr TPK]

Mentioning "Tippy verse" killed the thread :-D

The results, which I haven't counted yet because some votes are extremely unclear, would be interesting when you consider the following:
The #1 rank in Forgotten Realms would go to Artemis Entreri (assassin). There are other more powerful in the Realms than him, but they don't fit any description.
The #1 rank in Greyhawk would also go to the assassin, in this case to Warduke. Others, such as Robilar, don't match any of the other categories.

It's interesting...

[Aquillion]

This isn't something that has a concrete answer; it depends entirely on the needs of your story.


1. The highest-ranking general of the largest army in the world.

This gives us no real information on their personal power -- they could be a mighty adventurer, or have nothing but NPC class levels. How much political power they have would also vary; if your world has a huge empire and the general of its army is functionally its dictator, then they'll have a lot more power than if they're just the general of a particularly big democratic city-state.

2. The captain of the world's most powerful monarch's personal bodyguard.

Again, it varies a lot. They could be a legendary hero, or just a particularly skilled warrior.

3. The most powerful assassin in the world.

Probably a powerful magic user -- but if they're too powerful, why are they working as an assassin? What about the god of assassins -- do they count as an assassin? If so, they probably occupy this role (and beat everyone else.)

4. The most expensive full-time mercenary captain of the known world.

See above. They could, in theory, be something like a demon prince who works for souls, or a mercenary wizard who uses shadesteel golems for their company; it's just too vague without knowing the details of the setting.

5. The best known full-time combat instructor in the world (whether magical, mundane, or a combination).

This is too vague to answer. The best-known combat instructor in the world could be a retired hero; by your description, they could even be a level 20 wizard.