Asimar and Tiefling offspring?

[Th3N3xtGuy]

What would come from a full Asimar(Outsider) and Tiefling(Outsider) tapping the midnight still. A regular race? Anyone else thought about this stuff or just me? I wonder if Nephalem are a listed creature.

[torrasque666]

You see, when a Tiefling and an Aasimar love each other very much... eh.... MARLOWE!

[Shoat]

Nephalem is (usually) the offspring of straight-up angels and straight-up demons.
Aasimar and Tieflings are (usually) of very thin blood (at least a few generations have passed since the mingling of outsider and mortal), so lorewise they shouldn't produce Nephalem.

As for their end-product: I know of no direct pre-made race for the mix of the two (since it certainly is not as common as half-elf or half-orc or similar stuff).
My usual rule for that case is to take the statistics of the mother's race and make some fluffy (mechanically unimpactful) adjustments to introduce some of the father's race's feel to the offspring.

Another possibility is to look at the two races (each of them being "mostly human with a bit of celestial/fiendish heritage") and have the outsider traits cancel each other out - but that's the most boring answer.

[Marlowe]

http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo121/Joncharlesspencer/a1.jpg
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Lily's even lampshaded and lamented the improbability of two siblings both turning out with Tiefling traits, as happened with her and Sarissa.

[(Un)Inspired]

It would be an Aasling.

Duh.

[Th3N3xtGuy]

It would be an Aasling.

Duh.

I like the way you think hahaha

[Th3N3xtGuy]

http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo121/Joncharlesspencer/a1.jpg
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http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo121/Joncharlesspencer/a8.jpg

Lily's even lampshaded and lamented the improbability of two siblings both turning out with Tiefling traits, as happened with her and Sarissa.

Nice! ....

[Th3N3xtGuy]

Nephalem is (usually) the offspring of straight-up angels and straight-up demons.
Aasimar and Tieflings are (usually) of very thin blood (at least a few generations have passed since the mingling of outsider and mortal), so lorewise they shouldn't produce Nephalem.

As for their end-product: I know of no direct pre-made race for the mix of the two (since it certainly is not as common as half-elf or half-orc or similar stuff).
My usual rule for that case is to take the statistics of the mother's race and make some fluffy (mechanically unimpactful) adjustments to introduce some of the father's race's feel to the offspring.

Another possibility is to look at the two races (each of them being "mostly human with a bit of celestial/fiendish heritage") and have the outsider traits cancel each other out - but that's the most boring answer.

Oh on the nephalem I knew it was straight up angels&demons(okay movie). I just was wondering if its a official creature.

[Milo v3]

At the very least in golarion, the child would specifically not be Human. But if you're not playing in golarion who knows.


Nephalem is (usually) the offspring of straight-up angels and straight-up demons.
Or.... Angels and Humans. Which is what they actually were in the bible..... I have no idea why people started to think that demons were involved at all.

[Psyren]

You would make a Punnet Square and then roll 1d4.

[Shoat]

Or.... Angels and Humans. Which is what they actually were in the bible..... I have no idea why people started to think that demons were involved at all.

In this universe, Angel+Human is already known under a different name. Because that'd be either half-celestial or aasimar.

The bible is not the only fictional work that involves nephalem.
Being the first work to invent (or popularize) a concept does not mean it's the 'correct' depiction - just as not all orcs and elves are like their lord of the rings depictions, not all angels/demons/etc. have to be from biblic fiction.

[Marlowe]

You would make a Punnet Square and then roll 1d4.

That would be for Half-Fiend/Half-Celestial, surely?

[Milo v3]

just as not all elves are like their lord of the rings depictions, not all angels/demons/etc. have to be from the bible.

Said as if tolkien made elves.

Yes, there can be divergences, but it's still very weird for me to imagine the jump that was needed to make Angel + Human = Nephilim change to Angel + Demon = Nephilim.

[Gale]

The mixing of holy and demonic energy causes a rift in the space time continuum and both the aasimar and tiefling are forever lost in the void.
At least that's my theory, anyways.

[Marlowe]

http://i.imgur.com/ybxek5b.jpg

[Brookshw]

http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo121/Joncharlesspencer/a1.jpg
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Lily's even lampshaded and lamented the improbability of two siblings both turning out with Tiefling traits, as happened with her and Sarissa.

Do you have a gallery of these posted somewhere?

[Taveena]

Aasimar and Tieflings, while a very, very common result of a half-outsider breeding with a humanoid (thus resulting in further diluted blood) are an even MORE common result of a throwback to an outsider ancestor. In all likelihood an aasimar and a tiefling's babbyspawn would be Human, just because there wasn't enough Demon or Angel in there to do anything. (And, say, a Fey-ri and an Aasimar would result in a half-elf, and so on)

Now, a half-fiend and a half-celestial boning - that's a different story. Which I don't have the ending for.

[Milo v3]

Maybe it'll be twins. One aasimar, the other tiefling?

[Taveena]

IIRC if a half-fiend breeds with another half-fiend it'll result in a baby half-fiend...
Maybe you end up with a generic Half-Outsider who's... material plane native?

[Marlowe]

Do you have a gallery of these posted somewhere?

There's a thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?422242-Planetouched-play-D-amp-D-Old-material) in Arts & Crafts for the ones that actually make some sense out of thread context. I should go find Sissy's first appearance.

Oh yeah.
http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo121/Joncharlesspencer/leather5.jpg
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[The Viscount]

I love the Planetouched adventures.

There is a Celestial-Fiendish crossbreed in 3.5, the Concordant Killer from MMIV.

[Taveena]

That's super neat. Maybe a half-celestial/half-fiend child would end up as a half-concordant killer?

[Honest Tiefling]

I feel as if the possibility of them being completely incompatible should be brought up, but then again, dragons and nymphs can somehow mate with everything. Not to mention, multiple attempts might be necessary if the two planetouched are not terribly compatible with one another.

Perhaps the child would most likely be human (the most likely progeny of either planetouched anyway), with a small chance of being born to whichever planetouched heritage is stronger. The two bloodlines could duke it out in the womb and everything.

[Segev]

I vote for using the class to reflect one of the parents: an Aasimar Warlock or a Tiefling Favored Soul.

[Flickerdart]

I would say you flip a coin, and it ends up taking after just one of the parents race-wise. Its features would be mixed, though - so it could have really, really pretty horns.

[Malimar]

In my games, I've got a continuum that I use (with the ranking based loosely on LA):

full race (e.g., Hound Archon, Succubus)
half-race (e.g., Half-Celestial template, Half-Fiend template)
major bloodline (e.g., Major Celestial bloodline, Major Demon bloodline)
-ish template (e.g. Celestial template, Fiendish template)
intermediate bloodline (e.g., Intermediate Celestial bloodline, Intermediate Demon bloodline)
Planetouched (e.g., Aasimar, Tiefling)
minor bloodline (e.g. Minor Celestial bloodline, Minor Demon bloodline)
heritage feats (e.g., Celestial Heritage feat chain, Fiendish Heritage feat chain)

Diluting your blood generally puts your children one further down on the list.

So, at my table, the child of a Tiefling and an Aasimar would be a Tiefling with the Minor Celestial bloodline or an Aasimar with the Minor Demon (or Devil) bloodline, or just possibly a Human with both Minor Celestial and Minor Demon (or Devil) bloodlines. Which is perhaps rather less interesting than one would hope, but at least it's a bit more interesting than "they cancel out and result in a regular Human" or "they're simply incompatible and no breeding between these two is possible".

[illyahr]

There's a thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?422242-Planetouched-play-D-amp-D-Old-material) in Arts & Crafts for the ones that actually make some sense out of thread context. I should go find Sissy's first appearance.

Great. Now I'll have to sit and read through all this awesomeness. Thanks for that, guys. I was supposed to go to lunch. It's Friday and everything. :smalltongue:

[ShurikVch]

It will depend on mother's alignment:
If Good - Half-Celestial Tiefling;
If Evil - Aasimar Half-Fiend

[Honest Tiefling]

It will depend on mother's alignment:
If Good - Half-Celestial Tiefling;
If Evil - Aasimar Half-Fiend

If you could get half outsiders from mere aasimar and tieflings, one would think that someone, somewhere, is rounding up planetouched and tossing them into taverns with cheap alcohol.

[SimonMoon6]

Said as if tolkien made elves.

Well, it's not as if the Bible was the origin of demons either.

But I would say tiefling + aasimar = the most powerful, dangerous race ever.


Humans!


Something should be done about those guys.

[Malimar]

But I would say tiefling + aasimar = the most powerful, dangerous race ever.


Humans!


Something should be done about those guys.

Relevant link is relevant (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4RuB3gT8t0).

[atemu1234]

I once homebrewed a Planetouched whose ancestry was mixed between fiends and celestials. Shall I track it down and post it?

[Flickerdart]

It will depend on mother's alignment:
If Good - Half-Celestial Tiefling;
If Evil - Aasimar Half-Fiend
Half-Celestial and Half-Fiend are both much more Outsider than Aasimar or Tiefling. How would mixing bloodlines add in more Outsider?

[atemu1234]

Well, I found the stats.

Dikastii are a race born of contradiction. Born of a strange bloodline, a mixture of Celestial and Fiendish blood, they are incredibly rare beings that crop up from time to time in family trees, seemingly without regard to race. They can be born from time to time through the rare union of an Aasimar and a Tiefling, but as these races are almost as rare as a Dikastii in and of themselves, and the fertility of such a union next to impossible, Dikastii are more likely to be born of completely mundane parentage.
Dikastii often look like normal members of their species, but with unnatural blue-gray eyes, without pupils or iris. Those that are mammalian will have gray or pale skin tones.

+2 Int, +2 Wis: Dikastii are beings of great wisdom and intellect; in isolated communities, they often become respected advisors. In civilizations of increased size, they often become generals or scholars.
Base Land speed is 30 ft.
Outsider (Native).
Spell-like Abilities: 1/day: Zone of Truth. Caster level is equal to hit dice, save DCs are Wisdom-based.
Darkvision 60 ft.
Favoured Class: Cleric.
Level Adjustment: +1.

[ShurikVch]

Half-Celestial and Half-Fiend are both much more Outsider than Aasimar or Tiefling. How would mixing bloodlines add in more Outsider?Game don't have such thing as "more Outsider" - either you are Outsider, or not.

[Flickerdart]

Game don't have such thing as "more Outsider" - either you are Outsider, or not.
Yes, it does. Read the description of planetouched:


Planetouched is a general word to describe someone who can trace his or her bloodline back to an outsider, usually a fiend or celestial.

The effects of having a supernatural being in one’s heritage last for many generations. Although not as dramatically altered as a half-celestial or a half-fiend, planetouched still retain some special qualities.

The two planetouched varieties described here are the most common. Aasimars are humans with some trace of celestial blood in their veins, and tieflings have some fiendishness in their family tree.

It literally says that planetouched are less outsidery than half-outsiders because their outsider blood is too diluted.

[ShurikVch]

Yes, it does. Read the description of planetouched:

It literally says that planetouched are less outsidery than half-outsiders because their outsider blood is too diluted.Doesn't matter: Outsider (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#outsiderType) type says they are Outsiders
Fluff text don't impact it

[Flickerdart]

Doesn't matter: Outsider (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#outsiderType) type says they are Outsiders
Fluff text don't impact it
They are outsider type, yes. But they are not as pure-blooded as half-outsiders are, so breeding them together will not produce a half-outsider of any kind.

[Jormengand]

Doesn't matter: Outsider (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#outsiderType) type says they are Outsiders
Fluff text don't impact it

This is largely a fluff discussion, assuming you can't find any RAW on the matter.

[illyahr]

Planetouched have the [Native] subtype, don't they? That, by definition, makes them less Outsider than other Outsiders. In fact, you could call them on insider outsiderism. :smalltongue:

[ShurikVch]

They are outsider type, yes. But they are not as pure-blooded as half-outsiders are, so breeding them together will not produce a half-outsider of any kind.Outsider is a creature of Outsider type - nothing more, nothing less
Type is a status thing: either you have it, or not

Also, description from your reply #36 is just a version; somewhere else it was said - exact origin of Planetouched is unknown


This is largely a fluff discussion, assuming you can't find any RAW on the matter.Wasn't a fluff always "whatever floats your boat" (assuming we aren't speaking about some very specific setting)?


Planetouched have the [Native] subtype, don't they? That, by definition, makes them less Outsider than other Outsiders. In fact, you could call them on insider outsiderism. :smalltongue:Templates are don't discriminate; Half-Fiend (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/halfFiend.htm) have Smite Good SA - how often you see it on full Fiends?

[Flickerdart]

Outsider is a creature of Outsider type - nothing more, nothing less
Type is a status thing: either you have it, or not
Creature type is not relevant to this at all. Not even a little bit.



Also, description from your reply #36 is just a version; somewhere else it was said - exact origin of Planetouched is unknown

Citation needed.



Wasn't a fluff always "whatever floats your boat" (assuming we aren't speaking about some very specific setting)?

Just because things can be refluffed doesn't mean there's not a default fluff. In the books, Greyhawk is the default setting.

[Taveena]

In this context, we are presumably talking about the consistent rules between the official published D&D settings. Planescape is the default setting for D&D (with a focus on Greyhawk) but outsiders function near-identically in Faerun and similarly enough in Eberron that we have a consistent framework. In that framework, Native Outsiders come in two flavors - those whose blood is diluted enough they don't have a connection to their ancestral plane, and those who are Outsiders who are actually representative OF the material plane (like one kind of genie, I believe.)

The origin of Planetouched is the infusion of a humanoid with Outsider blood - there are two Lawful planetouched (one implicitly descended from Inevitables) and one Chaotic planetouched. The most common way to do that is to have sex with an outsider. The child of that union will be a half-fiend or celestial. Further down the line it could be a Planetouched or another half-Outsider in terms of actual stats - it depends on how much of the various ancestry expresses itself (genetics is random, after all, even bull**** fantasy genetics). Non-humanoids cannot produce Planetouched and instead result in second-generation half-fiends or normal examples of the species.

[SwordChucks]

I'm going to go a different direction and say they produce a full-blooded slaad. Based purely on the amount of chaos the question has caused.

More seriously I'd think a homebrew race with a mix of the features of the outsiders involved and for the most part human racials. Maybe they'd have tiny horns and vestigial wings?

[Renen]

http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo121/Joncharlesspencer/a1.jpg
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http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo121/Joncharlesspencer/a7.jpg
http://i368.photobucket.com/albums/oo121/Joncharlesspencer/a8.jpg

Lily's even lampshaded and lamented the improbability of two siblings both turning out with Tiefling traits, as happened with her and Sarissa.

Thats just gold. When people say lol on the Internet they rarely actually laugh out loud. This made me do so.

[atemu1234]

I'm going to go a different direction and say they produce a full-blooded slaad. Based purely on the amount of chaos the question has caused.

More seriously I'd think a homebrew race with a mix of the features of the outsiders involved and for the most part human racials. Maybe they'd have tiny horns and vestigial wings?

What, was mine not good enough?

[illyahr]

Templates are don't discriminate; Half-Fiend (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/halfFiend.htm) have Smite Good SA - how often you see it on full Fiends?

What does that have to do with creature type? Native Outsiders are from the Material plane. Since they are not from "outside" they are less Outsider than others.

Waitaminute...why are half-celestial and half-fiend humanoids Native Outsiders but celestial and fiendish creatures, who have only a trace amount of Outsiderness, Extraplanar Humanoids?

If you had a crazy eugenics program, you could make a Celestial Tiefling. That would make the creature an Outsider (Native, Extraplanar).

[ShurikVch]

Creature type is not relevant to this at all. Not even a little bit.Don't you understand: there is literally no single other way to explain "What is an Outsider?", than "Creature with Outsider type".
In that case "fluff" and "crunch" are saying absolutely the same thing

Citation needed.It was from one 3.0 Dragon article; it said outsider ancestry not the only possible source of planetouched, and pointed other possibilities:
1) Planetouched are "marked by deities"
2) They are always were this way, from the very ancient times; they aren't related to extraplanar outsiders, it's just a superstition
3) They are metahumanoids (X-gene! :smallsmile:)

Just because things can be refluffed doesn't mean there's not a default fluff. In the books, Greyhawk is the default setting.And how many of planetouched are, exactly, reside in Oerth? :smallconfused:


More seriously I'd think a homebrew race with a mix of the features of the outsiders involved and for the most part human racials.I suggest to take Savage Progressions (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a) for Aasimar and Tiefling, and gestalt them

[Flickerdart]

Don't you understand: there is literally no single other way to explain "What is an Outsider?", than "Creature with Outsider type".
In that case "fluff" and "crunch" are saying absolutely the same thing

It's too bad that "what is an outsider" is not a question anybody asked.



It was from one 3.0 Dragon article; it said outsider ancestry not the only possible source of planetouched, and pointed other possibilities:
1) Planetouched are "marked by deities"
2) They are always were this way, from the very ancient times; they aren't related to extraplanar outsiders, it's just a superstition
3) They are metahumanoids (X-gene! :smallsmile:)
3.0 is overridden by 3.5 - and Monster Manual is the primary source, while Dragon is not. Planetouched are outsider descendants, period.



And how many of planetouched are, exactly, reside in Oerth? :smallconfused:
How many humans? How many elves? How many svirfneblins?

[dascarletm]

It's too bad that "what is an outsider" is not a question anybody asked.


Oh Flickerdart, you always make me chuckle. :smallbiggrin:

[ShurikVch]

It's too bad that "what is an outsider" is not a question anybody asked.Yes; but you say Planetouched are not Outsiders, despite it's right there, in the "Size/Type:" line

3.0 is overridden by 3.5 - and Monster Manual is the primary source, while Dragon is not. Planetouched are outsider descendants, period.OK.
Then go, explain to me existence of Chaonds and Zenythries.

They can't be from Good Planes - Good Planes produce Aasimars;
They can't be from Evil Planes - Evil Planes produce Tieflings;
They can't be from the Far Realm - Far Realm produce Diaboli;
They can't be from Outlands - Outlands are not chaotic or lawful;
(Same about all Inner Planes, Transitive Planes, and Material Plane);

So, out of all existing Planes, we got only Limbo and Mechanus?
But Slaadi and Chaos Beasts are reproduce by infection, and Mechanus is populated by Constructs. So, who exactly begot(/given birth to) children who later become ancestors of Chaonds and Zenythries?


How many humans? How many elves? How many svirfneblins?Dunno about the first two, but Oerth have zero Svirfneblins, and almost the same amount of Planetouched :smalltongue:

[Honest Tiefling]

To be fair, both Aasimar and Tieflings can arise from people who have had contact with the planes or outsiders...Not just that type of contact. However, by the logic presented, we could theoretically have a tiefling give birth to Orcus. I mean...He's got an outsider type, right?

[atemu1234]

To be fair, both Aasimar and Tieflings can arise from people who have had contact with the planes or outsiders...Not just that type of contact.

You better start running, I heard the fourth kind is a butt thing...

[Eox]

My vote is regular human. Turns out celestial and fiendish traits overwrite exact opposite parts of someone's DNA, so you either give birth to a disparate glob of metaphysical energy or an average joe with weird parents.

On second thought, are there any homebrew Aeon-touched?