PDA

View Full Version : Oriental flavor campaign without Oriental Adventures



Lord Tataraus
2007-05-01, 05:02 PM
I don't have Oriental Adventures, nor am I able to get it. Never the less, I want to run an Oriental campaign. Basically, have Japanese, Indian, and Mongolian flavor all in a campaign world. I have access to the various Oriental classes from the Complete series. What other classes does OA have? and where might I find Oriental-themed stuff online (free)?

Edit: I forgot a question: How Oriental is OA, as in is it just Japanese flavor, Chinese, etc?

TheThan
2007-05-01, 05:59 PM
Oriental adventures have plenty of flavor from other cultures other than just Japanese. But its all mixed together so you’ll have to hunt and peck to pull out what bits and pieces belong to which culture. You don’t really need Oriental adventures to run an Asian campaign, but it does help, particularly with monsters. That’ll be the hardest thing to find.

Innis Cabal
2007-05-01, 06:00 PM
look at the almighty Wiki

I_Got_This_Name
2007-05-01, 06:42 PM
OA has the Samurai, Shaman (very different from the CD Spirit Shaman), and Sohei, plus the Shugenja (updated in CD, also made less setting-specific) and Wu Jen (CArc).

Flavor-wise, quite a bit of it is devoted to the Rokugan setting, which is very Japanese, but there's stuff for everything, and a page or two on world-building. I'd reccomend building your own world and doing your own research.

Also, there's no reason not to use the Tome of Battle here.

Matthew
2007-05-01, 10:29 PM
Hmmn. Oriental Adventures without Oriental Adventures....? Have you searched the Wizard's Website for related material?

Well, anyway, most Core Base Classes are portable (I would not advise using The Complete Warrior Samurai over the Fighter). Basically, if you want to make this more than D&D 'in funny hats', you are going to need to be familiar with your source material. An Oriental Campaign isn't an end unto itself, it's a different background. What kind of Oriental Campaign are you looking to run?

Latronis
2007-05-01, 10:33 PM
I used just research and the missus to create my oriental continent in my homebrew world, and the GURPS China book is worth a look.

Talya
2007-05-01, 10:43 PM
Tome of Battle is a very good idea for such a setting,.

Matthew
2007-05-01, 10:48 PM
How so, exactly?

Tellah
2007-05-01, 11:29 PM
ToB is good for any setting; it doesn't particularly have anything more to do with Indian, Japanese or Mongolian myths than any other book, though.

Tellahs' Guide to Making an Orientalist Campaign:
Make a Fighter and call him a samurai. Make a Wizard and call him an onmyoji. Send them to Baator and call it Di Yu. Show them a spectre and call it enenra. Your fighting instructor is called your si fu, sabunim, or sensei. Dungeon crawling proceeds as usual.

Tellah's Guide to Making an Asian-themed Campaign Setting:
Read books. Read books about Shinto, about the Chinese Imperial system, about the dancing priestesses of Krishna, about life in a Yurt on the Mongolian steppes. Then do it yourself. D&D rulebooks will only get in your way.

I_Got_This_Name
2007-05-01, 11:53 PM
ToB is good for any setting; it doesn't particularly have anything more to do with Indian, Japanese or Mongolian myths than any other book, though.
It has a little note in the front explaining what the supernatural martial arts and wire-fu stuff is doing in a standard setting. You don't need to make that argument to put it in an oriental setting.

It's good everywhere, but the only excuse to keep it out of an East Asian setting is that you don't have it and can't afford it.

Viscount Einstrauss
2007-05-02, 12:18 AM
Making a Japanese setting is easy- give everyone gravity-defying hair and goofy names, arm them with weapons that are either completely ridiculous or way too big, have everyone make dramatic pauses and be unusually sensitive about even the idea of themselves being in a committed relationship, and then make sure the big bad guy has several bizarre henchmen, though only one actually has to be effective at anything other then comic relief or adventure padding.

Latronis
2007-05-02, 12:33 AM
How so, exactly?

ToB = Wuxia

Matthew
2007-05-02, 07:18 AM
Wuxia is not synonymous with Oriental Adventures. That's just one genre.

Ruik
2007-05-02, 08:16 AM
Making a Japanese setting is easy- give everyone gravity-defying hair and goofy names, arm them with weapons that are either completely ridiculous or way too big, have everyone make dramatic pauses and be unusually sensitive about even the idea of themselves being in a committed relationship, and then make sure the big bad guy has several bizarre henchmen, though only one actually has to be effective at anything other then comic relief or adventure padding.Pure gold...

...As for the setting, many of the RAW classes can be addapted for an oriental/asian themed game, but OA does have some nice fluff and monsters.

Latronis
2007-05-02, 09:19 AM
Matthew seems to be synonymous with not reading though

Matthew
2007-05-02, 09:24 AM
Tome of Battle is a very good idea for such a setting,.

How so, exactly?

ToB = Wuxia

Matthew seems to be synonymous with not reading though
Please explain?

Latronis
2007-05-02, 09:28 AM
yes because one popular aspect mentioned obviously means that the sum of it

[/sarcasm]

Matthew
2007-05-02, 09:38 AM
What? Tome of Battle is good for many things (Wuxia included), but why should it be thought particularly good for a generic Oriental styled game on account of its ability to model Wuxia? That makes no sense at all. Please try to be civil with your replies, insults and sarcasm are not really answers.

Latronis
2007-05-02, 09:59 AM
What? Tome of Battle is good for many things (Wuxia included), but why should it be thought particularly good for a generic Oriental styled game on account of its ability to model Wuxia? That makes no sense at all. Please try to be civil with your replies, insults and sarcasm are not really answers.

yea sorry i put a 15yr old girl in hospital tonight, i'm a little out of sorts.

but why should it be thought particularly good for a generic Oriental styled game on account of its ability to model Wuxia? That makes no sense at all.

It makes perfect sense, it is invariably going to come up in an oriental styled world. They won't all be imperial court intrigue games. Even then it comes up.

It's makes as much as sense to include it as a world (we arnt talking a specific game) as it does not too because it emulates only one aspect well.

Tellah
2007-05-02, 10:06 AM
Matthew has a darn good point. If I may expand upon it, Wuxia is not a necessary an element in modeling historical Asian cultures, nor in modeling Asian legends. If Lord Tataurus wants to run a game based on the Tokugawa campaigns, or Mongolian raids into China, or the Iron Age Mahajanapadas of India, then a system of martial arts maneuvers isn't strictly required. I love the book, probably as much as anyone, but it doesn't model anything I think of when I think of real Asian cultures.

If, on the other hand, Lord Tataurus is looking to run an Orientalist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orientalism_%28book%29) campaign, based more in Western perceptions of Asia than on historical fact--nothing wrong with that, I've done it myself--then I agree that Tome of Battle is a good fit.

Knight_Of_Twilight
2007-05-02, 10:15 AM
Core, TOB whatever, all can work if you change the flavor.

For an epic game, I made a character using the TOB who was inspired by Master Asia from G Gundam. All I did was change the name of the styles and the moves. Whoop-dee-do. You guys are making this way harder on yourself then you need too.

My suggestion? Watch a lot of movies/tv shows/cartoons whatever that match what you want to do. The rest is just renaming. :P

Matthew
2007-05-02, 10:21 AM
yea sorry i put a 15yr old girl in hospital tonight, i'm a little out of sorts.
Okay, I am sorry to hear that. I hope everything works out.


It makes perfect sense, it is invariably going to come up in an oriental styled world. They won't all be imperial court intrigue games. Even then it comes up.

It's makes as much as sense to include it as a world (we arnt talking a specific game) as it does not too because it emulates only one aspect well.
Right, I can see where you're coming from with this. Tellah has pretty much said everything I was going to say in response. It does all come down to expectations. I wouldn't, by default, expect Wuxia or Tome of Battle in an Oriental themed Campaign, but I would if it was an Oriental Campaign based on Wuxia films or inspired by Jet-Li, Atsumi, Anime/Manga or something similar (and nothing wrong with that sort of game either). I would be a bit confused if they appeared in a campaign inspired by Akira Kurosawa's 'Samurai Drama' work, though.

Latronis
2007-05-02, 10:36 AM
And Wuxia wasn't all that was mentioned so why attack it?

Tellah
2007-05-02, 11:03 AM
And Wuxia wasn't all that was mentioned so why attack it?

I'm not attacking Wuxia; I'm pointing out that Asian culture has produced more than martial arts films and anime, and you don't need a set of rules emulating martial arts to explore other aspects of Asian culture.

Latronis
2007-05-02, 12:00 PM
seems rather pointless since noone was arguing that's all there was

Matthew
2007-05-02, 12:26 PM
And Wuxia wasn't all that was mentioned so why attack it?
I don't think anyone was attacking Wuxia. I was questioning the generic usefulness of Tome of Battle for an Oriental Adventures Campaign. The Original Poster didn't seem to be asking about Martial Arts flavour:


I don't have Oriental Adventures, nor am I able to get it. Never the less, I want to run an Oriental campaign. Basically, have Japanese, Indian, and Mongolian flavor all in a campaign world. I have access to the various Oriental classes from the Complete series. What other classes does OA have? and where might I find Oriental-themed stuff online (free)?

Edit: I forgot a question: How Oriental is OA, as in is it just Japanese flavor, Chinese, etc?
Hence my question as to why Tome of Battle should be considered useful without reference to the type of Oriental Campaign being proposed. Tome of Battle allows for over the top Martial Arts action, but has virtually nothing to do with an Oriental Campaign unless you are actually running an Oriental Themed Over the Top Martial Arts Campaign. Hercules: The Legendary Journeys, Xena: Warrior Princess and 300 themed Greek Campaigns would work well with Tome of Battle, but I wouldn't necessarily recommend Tome of Battle for an Ancient Greek Campaign on that basis.

Latronis
2007-05-02, 12:52 PM
well if you're going to be like that, there's no point recommending anything, because it might not be intending to run something that uses it.

Matthew
2007-05-02, 01:00 PM
Well, it does rather depend on the campaign he is looking to run, which is why we requested more information as to what type of Oriental Campaign. This question is as broad as, "Hey, I want to run an Occidental Campaign, using French, English, German and Hungarian flavour. Any suggestions?"

Just saying, yeah Tome of Battle, isn't really good enough. However, saying "Well, it depends on what kind of Oriental Campaign you are looking to run. If you want it to be like Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, Hero or Atsumi then I would definitely recommend Tome of Battle, as it presents several interesting Base Classes and play options with mechanics that will support and reinforce an over the top Martial Arts experience. I would also recommend the following films, books and RPG resources to build a campaign flavour..." etc..

Latronis
2007-05-02, 01:33 PM
It was a suggesstion made by someone, I later added a justification for.

It's as valid as anything when theres so little information for the OP to look and and potentially discard at his whim

Matthew
2007-05-02, 01:46 PM
Sure, I know, but the suggestion implied that it would be good for any Oriental Style Campaign:


Tome of Battle is a very good idea for such a setting.

...which is what I was contesting.

What I was primarily interested in was what particularly about Tome of Battle Talya thought would make it particularly suitable for an Oriental Campaign over an Occidental one. Tome of Battle is good for a Wuxia Campaign, as I agreed, but it would not fit all types of Oriental Campaigns, which was why I questioned this line of reasoning.

Latronis
2007-05-02, 01:56 PM
Guess he\she\it\they\splunge just assumed orient= ninja\samurai and\or kungfu.

Incidentally i only use it (ToB) in the 'oriental' part of my homebrew world.

But on the otherhand, is heavy in intrigue games.

Matthew
2007-05-02, 01:59 PM
Indeed, that seems to be the case, and that is why I questioned the reasoning behind it. Orientalism is fine, so long as you recognise it and are comfortable with it.

Latronis
2007-05-02, 02:23 PM
Well to be fair its a little more then that, seeing as they portray that themselves. :P

I wish i could remember the name of this movie i saw a few years ago, t'was insane. Dueling with chainsaws on bamboo ladders, tieing ropes to shotguns to fire them around corners.

Fairly big namehero in hong kong but not real well known elsewhere, can't remember his name either.

Matthew
2007-05-02, 03:57 PM
Orientalism certainly cuts both ways, yes! Plenty of super Martial Arts Movies of Oriental provenance attest to that. Same thing is true of the Katana myth, it's not like the Japanese media seeks to discourage exaggerated tales of its prowess! It all depends what we are seeking to model, which we don't really know, since the Original Poster, Lord Tartarus, hasn't returned to the Thread yet... not sure he'll be too amused at this derailing, but who knows, maybe he'll find it of some interest...

So, in the spirit of helping Lord Tartarus:

I don't have Oriental Adventures, nor am I able to get it.
Unfortunate. I assume this is a financial issue, otherwise I would advise you to pick it up at your earliest opportunity.

Never the less, I want to run an Oriental campaign.
A laudable goal and perfectly possible.

Basically, have Japanese, Indian, and Mongolian flavor all in a campaign world.
Quite a mix. Do you want them mixed together or are you talking about 'top down' World Building? If the latter, I strongly recommend developing a small portion of the Campaign World first with a strong theme. You can find a Web Enhancement for an Oriental Campaign on the Wizards Site here: Oriental Adventures - The Mahasarpa Campaign (Web Enhancement) (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20011019a). There is also an excerpt from Oriental Adventures, The Hopping Vampire (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20011005a).
Here are some Wizards Oriental Adventures Articles:
Bards of the Orient (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/bk/20030613a)
The Legacy of Aramitama Yurei (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031021x)
Samakar (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cc/20021121a)
Old Editions Downloads (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/downloads) also conatins some real gems for use with Oriental Adventures. The mechanics are (A)D&D, but the fluff is all Oriental. There are three Oriental Adventures up for grabs, as well as The Horde (Mongols) Boxed Set.

I have access to the various Oriental classes from the Complete series.
As said, some of these are better than others. Mostly, you can just use the normal Base Classes and tweak the flavour.

What other classes does OA have?
There are five Base Classes in Oriental Adventures - Samurai, Wu-Jen, Shaman, Shugenja and Sohei. There are quite a number of Prestige Classes (25+). For more information see here: Oriental Adventures (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/882440000)


and where might I find Oriental-themed stuff online (free)?

Wikipedia? All over the web really, it depends what you are looking for.You could try Ejmas (http://ejmas.com/), there are certainly some interesting articles there or for more general (and less scholarly) information you could try The Age of the Samurai (http://www.taots.co.uk/)


Edit: I forgot a question: How Oriental is OA, as in is it just Japanese flavor, Chinese, etc?

Oriental Adventures is a hodge podge of Oriental Culture, but it would not be misleading to say that the main focus is on Japan. Chinese Culture is so much more diverse and less avaialble that it is understandably easier to focus on Japan.

Lord Tataraus
2007-05-03, 09:41 AM
Sorry for the late post. First of all, thanks Matthew that looks very useful (I'll check the links tonight). First of all, I am using ToB and using Warblades as samurai. I'm making my own world with similiar geography the real-world orient with seven regions representing different real-world cultures and geography.
The real-world regions I'm using are: India, Southeast Asia, Tibet and the Himalayas, Eastern China and Korea, Mongolia, Japan, and the Asian Pacific Islands (i.e. Indonesia and the Philippines). I'm using research for most of my information and have great sources for flavor and some races. However, the I do need hep finding stats for monsters. I figure I can tweak MM dragons and the Rakshasa fits into the india region. I plan on using a giant of some sort for the Yeti and various demons, ogres, and giants for Oni. Dopes anyone have suggestions for various Kami?

Latronis
2007-05-03, 02:41 PM
Sorry for the late post. First of all, thanks Matthew that looks very useful (I'll check the links tonight). First of all, I am using ToB and using Warblades as samurai. I'm making my own world with similiar geography the real-world orient with seven regions representing different real-world cultures and geography.
The real-world regions I'm using are: India, Southeast Asia, Tibet and the Himalayas, Eastern China and Korea, Mongolia, Japan, and the Asian Pacific Islands (i.e. Indonesia and the Philippines). I'm using research for most of my information and have great sources for flavor and some races. However, the I do need hep finding stats for monsters. I figure I can tweak MM dragons and the Rakshasa fits into the india region. I plan on using a giant of some sort for the Yeti and various demons, ogres, and giants for Oni. Dopes anyone have suggestions for various Kami?

The rakshasa name fits the indian region, the rakshasa stats don't fit for an indian rakshasa overly well.

For Kami im sure there's probably a few celestials that fit well enough, or templates added to other things, that's easy enough to find something that fits, if you spin the fluff enough. Or just do what i do and make crap up, and compare it to what exists for an idea of power.

Tellah
2007-05-03, 03:01 PM
Kami in my Japanese-flavored campaign setting are simply gods, with domains, favored weapons and portfolios. A sample:


Inari
God of rice. Kitsune are used as messengers.
Alignment: CG
Domains: Gluttony, Healing, Community
Favored Weapon: Nunchaku

Sarutahiko
God of earth, married to Uzume.
Alignment: LG
Domains: Earth, Strength, Dwarf
Favored Weapon: Pick

Douso-jin
God of roads, village boundaries.
Alignment: CN
Domains: Travel, Liberation, Protection
Favored Weapon: Hammer


Many Japanese obake can be used without adaptation:

Yurei: formed when the soul (reikon) does not receive proper funeral, or if murdered. Only someone of great psychological and emotional strength. White clothing, unnaturally long black hair. Hands dangle lifelessly, no legs or feet. Have two floating flames (Hitodama). [ghost]
Amanojaku: small demon that provokes a person's darkest desires.
[I]Akkorokamui: giant red octopus [giant octopus]
Akuma: personification of evil; demon. [demons]
Tsukumogami: any object reaching it's 100th birthday becomes animate [animated object]
Enenra: monster made of smoke [spectre]
Genbu: Giant black tortoise/snake of the north [dragon turtle]
Byakko: White tiger of the west [celestial tiger]
Hibagon: bigfoot [hill giant]
Jorogumo: spider woman [drider]
Kodama: spirit living in a tree [dryad]
Shishi: lion-dog temple guardians [celestial lion]
Nukekubi: humanoid monsters whose heads detach at night [varguille]

TheThan
2007-05-03, 03:05 PM
Since I never pass up a chance to promote my own work, you might want to look at these Gnomes (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11438&highlight=gnomes)

These are Pacific Islander barbarian gnomes I designed for a campaign world. Feel free to use them if you like ‘em. In fact I’m probably going to use them in my oriental world too. I’ve also got Arab flavored desert dwarves too, in case you want some mid-east flavor.

I believe there are a few more oriental flavored races that have been homebrewed in the playground here too but that’ll take some time to dig them up.

Mr Croup
2007-05-03, 03:17 PM
Kami in my Japanese-flavored campaign setting are simply gods, with domains, favored weapons and portfolios.

While this would work for certain kami, it doesn't really translate well for the "common" kami, like spirits of individual trees, stones, rivers, etc.

Matthew
2007-05-03, 05:28 PM
Sorry for the late post. First of all, thanks Matthew that looks very useful (I'll check the links tonight).

No problem, there's not much Oriental Adventures material on the Wizards Site, but what there is might prove useful.


First of all, I am using ToB and using Warblades as samurai.

Hmmn. There are a couple of potential problems that you might need to address when doing this. The War Blade doesn't get Proficiency with Heavy Armour (which may or may not be a problem, depending on what kind of Armour your Samurai conventionally wear), Ranged Weapons (a significant problem if your Samurai ever wants to use the traditional weapon of the Samurai - the Yumi), nor is the Ride Skill a Class Skill (unfortunate if you want your Samurai to be a skilled Horse Men). These problems can solved via House Rules or Multi Classing, but I thought I had better make you aware of them. I would advise making the War Blade a special type of Samurai.


I'm making my own world with similiar geography the real-world orient with seven regions representing different real-world cultures and geography.
The real-world regions I'm using are: India, Southeast Asia, Tibet and the Himalayas, Eastern China and Korea, Mongolia, Japan, and the Asian Pacific Islands (i.e. Indonesia and the Philippines).

Sounds like a lot of work. Where are you basing the campaign? Is it going to range over all of these lands?


I'm using research for most of my information and have great sources for flavor and some races.

Best way, in my opinion. Have you ever played Cosmology of Kyoto (http://free-game-downloads.mosw.com/abandonware/pc/adventure/games_c/cosmology_of_kyoto.html)? It is a really interesting resource, if you have the patience to explore it! [Cosmology of Kyoto (Wikipedia article) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmology_of_Kyoto)]


However, the I do need hep finding stats for monsters. I figure I can tweak MM dragons and the Rakshasa fits into the india region. I plan on using a giant of some sort for the Yeti and various demons, ogres, and giants for Oni.

Yeah, this is the area that a copy of Oriental Adventures would have most benefited. There were something like 75 new entries. All the same, you can easily adapt a number of Default Core Monsters and the Homebrew Board here is a great place to find appropriate Monsters. Vorpal Tribble has some sort of custom Monster Builder Thread going, which you might find useful. Ogre Magi were originally modelled on Oni (but these are more accurately Demons and Devils).


Does anyone have suggestions for various Kami?

Well, now you're asking... Kami is basically a word that encompasses a huge number of possibilities (not just Deities, but pretty much all 'spirits', as I understand it, which would translate into Western mythology as including Dryads, Nereids and such). Still, check out Wikipedia for some notable Kami (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kami).

TheThan
2007-05-03, 06:48 PM
I just watched Master of the flying Guillotine and the tail end of Karate bull fighter, today.

Dareon
2007-05-03, 08:57 PM
Mostly what you'll need to change is flavor. About everything in the PHB, DMG, and Monster Manual has a name you can call it in an Orient campaign. Some of it would take a little stretching, though.

The biggest change that should probably be made is to the Cleric. The crusading priest is usually represented by Fighters or Monks with Knowledge (Religion), but to use the Cleric, you may wish to drop his armor proficiency and instead give him the Monk's AC bonus and Wis-to-AC. Alternatively, you could replace Cleric with this class (http://www.wakinglands.com/htm_files/classes_priest.htm), which is used in the Oriental-flavored campaign I'm currently in.

Otherwise, I'll reiterate the urge to do your own research on Oriental styles, culture, and whatnot, as well as the recommendation of Tome of Battle. The default flavor of ToB fits well for a wuxia action feel. White Raven even works for a more Three Kingdoms-style tactical focus. For court intrigue, of course, Tome of Battle helps little.

Dervag
2007-05-03, 09:34 PM
Tellahs' Guide to Making an Orientalist Campaign:...[Play ordinary D&D with the names changed around...

Tellah's Guide to Making an Asian-themed Campaign Setting:
Read books... Then do it yourself. D&D rulebooks will only get in your way.

This makes a little more sense after one looks up the definition of "orientalist." I know it made more sense to me.


Making a Japanese setting is easy- give everyone gravity-defying hair and goofy names, arm them with weapons that are either completely ridiculous or way too big, have everyone make dramatic pauses and be unusually sensitive about even the idea of themselves being in a committed relationship, and then make sure the big bad guy has several bizarre henchmen, though only one actually has to be effective at anything other then comic relief or adventure padding.That makes an anime setting. However, this is not necessarily a Japanese setting, any more than a campaign set in the world of Looney Tunes would be an American setting.

As for Wuxia, it might be that it should be one element of the setting without being all elements of the setting, especially if the campaign is supposed to sample components of many different East Asian cultures. The martial-arts-trained monk with preternatural abilities obtained through meditation is as much a staple of some Eastern cultures as the paladin is of some Western cultures.


While this would work for certain kami, it doesn't really translate well for the "common" kami, like spirits of individual trees, stones, rivers, etc.Well, the obvious thing to do for the spirits of trees and bodies of water is to use a modified form of the preexisting D&D creatures meant to be the spirits of trees and bodies of water- dryads and nymphs. Or elemental beings of some kind.

D&D has a large number of different creatures that could plausibly act as 'spirits' of some place or thing; all you have to do is find the stat block.

Tellah
2007-05-03, 09:53 PM
While this would work for certain kami, it doesn't really translate well for the "common" kami, like spirits of individual trees, stones, rivers, etc.

Yeah, for that you want Dryads, elementals, Will-o-wisps, and other such things. Posting the complete bestiary I worked up would be thread-flooding to say the least, but I've found a place in Shinto for most of the iconic D&D monsters and a D&D monster for most of the iconic obake of Shinto.

Unfortunately, beholders are by far my favorite monsters, and I can't find any place for them in Japanese myth whatsoever.:smallfrown:

EvilElitest
2007-05-03, 09:57 PM
well if you're going to be like that, there's no point recommending anything, because it might not be intending to run something that uses it.

Don't be foolish

An orentail setting, we would need books to descripe the culture that we are featured in. If i never heard of a Samurai, then how do i find out? TOB is nice, but has little to do with a champain settings, any more than TOM does
Now taht the OP as said that he is using TOB, all is well and good, but TOB is not inheritnly orenentail any more than CD


from,
EE

Dervag
2007-05-04, 12:27 AM
Unfortunately, beholders are by far my favorite monsters, and I can't find any place for them in Japanese myth whatsoever.:smallfrown:Yes, but that's because they don't fit into anybody's mythology; TSR invented them.

They'll fit as gracefully into Japan as they do into ancient Greece or the Middle East or medieval Europe.

Viscount Einstrauss
2007-05-04, 12:32 AM
It was a joke, Dervag. I can tell the difference between an animated flick and the real world :P

Latronis
2007-05-04, 01:07 AM
Don't be foolish

An orentail setting, we would need books to descripe the culture that we are featured in. If i never heard of a Samurai, then how do i find out? TOB is nice, but has little to do with a champain settings, any more than TOM does
Now taht the OP as said that he is using TOB, all is well and good, but TOB is not inheritnly orenentail any more than CD


from,
EE

Noone was arguing its 'inherent orientalism' just it's possible suitability for an oriental campaign.

If you've never heard of Samurai then it doesn't mean much anyway fictional and historical samurai can be quite different and it depends more how historically accurate a campaign it is going be.

And since at this stage it doesn't seem to be going to be a strictly historically accurate campaign world, I'd recommend to the OP reading the Ramayana for inspiration of the indian location. It is at it's heart a morality tale and is heavy in ancient vedic beliefs and mythology. And its a far more entertaining read then a dry historical research :smallbiggrin: It's a particular focus on the human vs asuras (daemons) So you can get a pretty decent grasp on beliefs and behaviour of the good, the bad, the honourable and the ugly of ancient hindus.

Though potentially a little too ancient it being near 3000yr old now, not that i think that'll matter much for the OP

Lord Tataraus
2007-05-04, 05:55 AM
First of all, I do realize that flaovr needs to be tweaked and that is one of the first things I did, Warblade is the basic class for the samurai, I will use modified versions for the different types of samurai and I am thinking of a Knight with manuevers for the mounted samurai. Here is a allowed class list if it helps:

Barbarian
Beguiler
Crusader
Dragon Shaman
Dragonfire Adept
Druid
Duskblade
Incarnate
Knight
Monk
Ninja
Paladin
Ranger
Scout
Shugenja
Spirit Shaman
Soulborn
Swordsage
Totemist
Warblade
Wu Jen
By the way, one of my players asked if there are any "traditional" undead. I keep thinking there might have been a couple vampires but I'm not sure.

EvilElitest
2007-05-04, 06:12 AM
Noone was arguing its 'inherent orientalism' just it's possible suitability for an oriental campaign.

If you've never heard of Samurai then it doesn't mean much anyway fictional and historical samurai can be quite different and it depends more how historically accurate a campaign it is going be.

And since at this stage it doesn't seem to be going to be a strictly historically accurate campaign world, I'd recommend to the OP reading the Ramayana for inspiration of the indian location. It is at it's heart a morality tale and is heavy in ancient vedic beliefs and mythology. And its a far more entertaining read then a dry historical research :smallbiggrin: It's a particular focus on the human vs asuras (daemons) So you can get a pretty decent grasp on beliefs and behaviour of the good, the bad, the honourable and the ugly of ancient hindus.

Though potentially a little too ancient it being near 3000yr old now, not that i think that'll matter much for the OP

Yes it is possibly suited for an oriental champain, but no more than TOM
from,
EE

Tellah
2007-05-04, 09:42 AM
By the way, one of my players asked if there are any "traditional" undead. I keep thinking there might have been a couple vampires but I'm not sure.

Oh yes. Oh, good heavens yes. Japanese obake are almost all just different varieties of ghosts, so all the incorporeal undead are useful. Vampires are a bit of a Western idea, but Japanese myths do have a sort of zombie. The onmyoji who animates them controls them with a small piece of paper attached to the forehead bearing a simple command.

elliott20
2007-05-04, 10:08 AM
incidentally, if you're looking for the Chinese variant, they're called "Jiang Shi", or literally "Stiff Corpses". The way they've been portrayed shows that they are not like the shambling undead you see in most D&D campaigns, but rather they hop around and try to bite people that way.

Latronis
2007-05-04, 12:11 PM
Knight?

that's an interesting idea... I can see just about all of it fitting too except the shield bonuses. You going to keep that?

Matthew
2007-05-04, 04:25 PM
incidentally, if you're looking for the Chinese variant, they're called "Jiang Shi", or literally "Stiff Corpses". The way they've been portrayed shows that they are not like the shambling undead you see in most D&D campaigns, but rather they hop around and try to bite people that way.
Heh, I saw some sort of Wuxia film with the 'hopping dead' in it a few months back, I think it was called The Vampire Hunters (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0303970/).

Knight?

that's an interesting idea... I can see just about all of it fitting too except the shield bonuses. You going to keep that?
Yeah, I think he is tweaking the mechanics of some of the Base Classes.

The Vorpal Tribble
2007-05-05, 09:06 AM
Can use any of my oriental-type monsters if you like:

Cricketman (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11317)
Gamecock (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2519985&postcount=3)
Light of the Ancestors (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10745)
Peafowl (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2519921&postcount=1)
Spitfire Cockerel (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11033)

Epiphanis
2007-05-06, 07:45 AM
I can't really point to free online stuff, but I can point out some interesting resources that didn't get a lot of attention.

A great underrated resource is AEG's Cathay: Jewel of the East, a sourcebook for the Swashbuckling Adventures line of products. I find it interesting on several levels; its created by the same company that made Legend of the 5 Rings, the most popular Asian-flavored RPG, but creates a different milieu based on the same inspirational material. It didn't mesh at all with the rest of the 7th Sea/Swashbuckling Adventures line, but it provides very interesting setting fluff in its own right with some d20 crunch mechanics thrown in (the crunch is not top rate and will probably require some tinkering, though).

Cathay is also well-suited to the pan-Asian objectives of Lord Tartaraus, in that it incorporates analogues to Mongolian barbarians, India, Burma, Nepal, Korea, and Japan as well as Han-dominated China.

Green Ronin published Jade Dragons and Hungry Ghosts, a very nice d20 monster book. Several monsters therein have made their way into my non-Oriental campaign, including the Shiko Me devil and Hidari Constructs.

Avalanche Press' Jade and Steel also addresses the subject matter. You can get a downloadable PDF of it from DriveThruRPG for less than $7. I looked through it and was thoroughly unimpressed, but it might have some utility.

Iron_Mouse
2007-05-06, 08:26 AM
For kami, I suggest taking a look at the Spirit of the Land in MM2. From what I know, it comes pretty close.

elliott20
2007-05-06, 10:50 AM
For the most part though, I think you can probably find a place for all the monsters in your Oriental game, since most of them just needs a flavor change.

The only one that might need some large scale changing would be dragons, I think.

Lord Tataraus
2007-05-06, 03:21 PM
Thanks a lot guys, I'm finishing up the setting, the Spirit of the Land is perfect (thanks Iron Mouse). My research is almost complete, its down to fine details and the geography of the world. I do have lists of modified monsters, it seemed to work well and by basing the setting off the orient while not being completely accurate, I could squeeze in some interesting monsters and races. And thanks for all the links and resources, especially Tellah.

TheThan
2007-05-06, 07:43 PM
No problem, in fact I’m going to look into using some of the info in this thread myself to finish up my oriental campaign setting as well.