Geeky 3.5 D&D Maths Spreadsheet

[SirKazum]

Since Gemini476 asked back in the Dysfunctional Rules thread, I've decided to share with you guys a spreadsheet with some calculations, organized information and thoughts on 3.5 D&D. It's actually collated from a bunch of spreadsheets I've been idly working on in my spare time. I've got a bunch of other such spreadsheets for other editions of D&D as well :smallbiggrin:

Click here for the download page (https://worldlinecollapse.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=143)

The first tab is what Gemini476 asked about - my calculation of adventurer distribution in communities according to the DMG's community generation rules. Sadly, there's no breakdown by level - I distinctly remember doing that, but couldn't find it anywhere.

The second tab is one I particularly like, and consult a lot. It's a sortable list of all intelligent and semi-intelligent monsters in the SRD (which leaves some monsters from the MM out; I was using d20srd.org as a source), categorized by climate/terrain, alignment, such basic stats, but also by language and by a rough estimate of how civilized they are. It's meant to aid in world-building, so you have an idea what creatures live together and speak similar languages, etc., so you can design your world's cultures and how they interact.

The third tab is an attempted revision of WBL guidelines for NPCs. Take that as you will. The fourth tab is an estimate of how much would be a fair salary for a hired adventurer per level (with different tables for spellcasters), and the accompanying graph compares the different options that went into that design.

Yeah, I have way too much free time on my hands. My OD&D spreadsheet (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?428651-Geeky-OD-amp-D-Random-Generation-amp-Maths-Spreadsheet&p=19550332#post19550332) is even geekier... :smalltongue:

[Gemini476]

Wow, that's pretty neat! It really makes me want to go back to an extensive monster-CR-by-biome chart I was working on before, although that was enough of a chore that I don't think I'll do much with it.

One thing I will ask about, though, on account of that aforementioned chart - why do you have the Human biomes listed as "Any/Any"? As far as I was able to tell from the MM (which was mostly taking from the various templated humans since they're the only human statblocks), the stock D&D Humans have an assumed biome of "Temperate Plains". (cf. human vampire vs. the sample half-elf vampire, Lich, various Half-X templates, the various Planetouched that are fluff-wise descended from humans - however, note also the Human Commoner Zombie, which is "Any".)

[SirKazum]

Wow, that's pretty neat! It really makes me want to go back to an extensive monster-CR-by-biome chart I was working on before, although that was enough of a chore that I don't think I'll do much with it.

One thing I will ask about, though, on account of that aforementioned chart - why do you have the Human biomes listed as "Any/Any"? As far as I was able to tell from the MM (which was mostly taking from the various templated humans since they're the only human statblocks), the stock D&D Humans have an assumed biome of "Temperate Plains". (cf. human vampire vs. the sample half-elf vampire, Lich, various Half-X templates, the various Planetouched that are fluff-wise descended from humans - however, note also the Human Commoner Zombie, which is "Any".)

Thanks! As for the human biome, since there's no "Human" entry in the MM/SRD to use as a basis for the table, I went with "Any/Any" because that seemed to make more sense to me, as (both in real life and in any D&D world I can think of) you can find humans everywhere in the world. Sure, there are hints that point toward "Temperate Plains", such as the planetouched, but since there are already races with "Any/Any", such as wererats and doppelgangers (as well as rats, if you go into nonintelligent creatures), I figured humans are about as appropriate as it gets for that designation.

[Telok]

DMG page 137, paragraph 3, sentence 3: 90% to 93% of the population should be living in thorps, hamlets, and villages.

The random town generator puts half of all settlements as thorps, hamlets, and villages. This will skew things as the rural 90% has a higher incidence of adventuring classes than towns and cities do.

I have a similar spreadsheet for the rural areas that includes the npc classes. My reason for this is to figure out the porportion of the population that is commoners, first level commoners, spellcasters, spellcasters with 2nd+ level spells, Cure Light Wounds casters, and arcane casters. To me the ratio of casters to non-casters influences my worldbuilding more than just the numbers of adventuring classes, which means that I have to include adepts. In addition, assuming that npcs with aristocrat levels are the social upper classes from county squires on up gives me numbers for the local and regional nobs. The numbers for warriors give me information about the local law enforcement strength and capability.

By my numbers the rural adventuring class population is 7.6%, CLW casters is 2.8%, arcane casters is 1.7%, and first level commoners are 84.9%.

[SirKazum]

DMG page 137, paragraph 3, sentence 3: 90% to 93% of the population should be living in thorps, hamlets, and villages.

That may be what the book says, but it's not reflected by the generator. I'm just following the tables :smalltongue:


I have a similar spreadsheet for the rural areas that includes the npc classes. My reason for this is to figure out the porportion of the population that is commoners, first level commoners, spellcasters, spellcasters with 2nd+ level spells, Cure Light Wounds casters, and arcane casters. To me the ratio of casters to non-casters influences my worldbuilding more than just the numbers of adventuring classes, which means that I have to include adepts. In addition, assuming that npcs with aristocrat levels are the social upper classes from county squires on up gives me numbers for the local and regional nobs. The numbers for warriors give me information about the local law enforcement strength and capability.

By my numbers the rural adventuring class population is 7.6%, CLW casters is 2.8%, arcane casters is 1.7%, and first level commoners are 84.9%.

I believe I've seen your spreadsheet before. It's certainly much more detailed than mine, and probably much more useful too :smallsmile: Aside from a breakdown by level, breaking it down by NPC class and casters vs. non-casters are also useful analyses, yes. I do believe CLW is overrated, though... there are many other low-level spells that may have a much higher impact on society! Detect Thoughts and Create Food and Water come to mind, but I'm sure there are others (including 1st level). Anyway, any spellcaster class at all is probably going to impact society in a significant way.

EDIT: I went ahead and shared my OD&D spreadsheet (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?428651-Geeky-OD-amp-D-Random-Generation-amp-Maths-Spreadsheet&p=19550332#post19550332) as well, in the appropriate forum.

[Telok]

That may be what the book says, but it's not reflected by the generator. I'm just following the tables :smalltongue:

If you read the text that table is for the PCs stumbling across a random settlement in the wilderness. It's a throwback to the old hex crawling. Plus this is a new spreadsheet that uses a stats approach rather than a brute force data mining approach. My numbers should match the table's results anyways because I only did the rural communities (thorp, hamlet, village with ratios by the table). The towns and cities are twice to three times as much work to include.

The CLW number is pretty much an "able to cast first level divine spells" count. That covers Purify Food, Create Water, Comp Language, and Magic Weapon/Stone/Fang. The rural population isn't ~3% PC classes, it's ~3% "casts divine spells" out of ~7% PC classes.

I really do agree that magic will significantly change society. But the DMG rules create much more common low level magic than most people assume when world building. The typical RAW D&D world should appear closer to Eberron than to Greyhawk or the assumed faux-medival with a few spellcasters. Especially with an assumption that magic items never wear out or break unless they are intentionally destroyed.

[Yahzi]

I do believe CLW is overrated, though... there are many other low-level spells that may have a much higher impact on society! Detect Thoughts and Create Food and Water
I don't understand that.

Detect Thoughts isn't that important; in a feudal society, what the lord decides is the only justice anyone expects (between social conditioning, his CHA, and a few skill points, he can get the truth out most of the time anyway). The number of times you need to unmask a spy are pretty rare; usually, you're only interested in guilt or innocence, and as long as most people believe the lord is wise enough to just know who is innocent, they don't care that much about how he knows. I mean, most people put a lot of stock in our current system, and yet it's accuracy is not exactly inspiring. :smalltongue:

CLW, on the other hand, accomplishes things even modern society can't. Childbirth is still one of the leading causes of death for women, but with CLW the morality rate all but disappears. Add in Remove Disease and you have a medieval population that has less mortality than modern Chicago. The effect of these two spells on the population growth rate would itself radically change society. (On the other hand, monsters seem to eat an awful lot of people, so it balances out.) Its effect on the battlefield would also be astonishing: very few people die instantly, even on today's battlefields with bombs and IEDs. Most deaths are from bleeding out... and CLW stops that 100% of the time. Any army that won a battle and could treat their wounded would have vastly smaller casualty rates than historical examples describe. (Which is why nobody runs away in D&D... if you can just win, you can probably save all your wounded. Running away, however, means you'll all die.)

Create Food, however, is all but useless unless you are abusing the Magic Trap trick. If a 5th level caster has a choice between curing a fatal cancer or catering a meal for a dozen people... it's really not a choice. Create Water is even worse: people simply don't understand how much water industrial/agricultural processes use. A cleric's ability to make a few people not thirsty doesn't even matter; where is the water they cook with, wash with, or use in their jobs?

The only other spell that really, really breaks society is Commune, and that depends on how much info the gods know. Imagine pinning Pelor down on the mass of the Higgs Boson; one 9th lvl cleric could replace CERN.

Edit: Telok reminded me of one other issue: Continual Flame. Eventually societies would be drowning in these things because they are cheap and last forever. Few people appreciate just how much artificial lighting supported the industrial revolution. I take the prevalence of magic lights as explanation for why every town in the D&D world seems to have the technical skills of Late Renaissance Italy.