Teaching Kobolds how to human

[Kane0]

Hey all, long story short we have some kobolds moving into our new town and we need to make sure they acclimate properly.

Now they all speak draconic, and 3 of us in the party does plus 2 NPCs, one of which wants no part of this. So language barrier is the first problem that we need to solve.
Secondly is all the cultural things, we need to make sure they learn about work/trade, social customs and acceptable behaviour. My character is one of the draconic speakers and coincidentally also one of the characters that is advocating the whole idea of letting them live with us demi-humans rather than killing them or turning them away (again).

So what I need is a solid list of things we need to cover so they don't end up getting themselves killed by a mob of angry villagers or drawing the ire of the party more than they already have.

So far my list of things to-teach is:
- Where they can live, and what can be expected to be provided compared to what they have to earn.
- The basics of ownership, and what is and isn't theirs.
- The basics of gold and economy, working and trading. We will provide options for work including farming, fishing, manual labor, guard duty at later stages if things go well.
- Where they can go and what they can do for necessities, like pointing out where they can buy food and where they can work for gold.
- Basic social customs and gestures, starting from nodding and shaking of heads, handshakes, the middle finger, etc.
- Where and when aggression is permittted. Self defense and defense of their homes, no walking around town with weapons, nonlethal unless your life is at risk, etc.
- The basics of crime and punishment, what they are permitted and not permitted to do, as well as the consequences if they break those rules. Fairness will be enforced.
- Who they can contact if an issue arises (the party or town guard, plus the one other NPC that can speak Draconic who will be employed as either a translator or teacher of draconic.)
- They are expected to learn a bit of common, and the townsfolk are expected to pick up a little draconic to ease transition.

And I know i've missed things, so that's why i'm here. No doubt whatever I miss will end up a big deal that we will have to smooth over at a later time, so any additions to make our lives easier would be appreciated!

[Keltest]

So, kobolds are not nearly as barbaric as you seem to be portraying them (I apologize if you aren't saying theyre barbaric). While the language barrier is a problem, if you can solve that and the logistical problems of where they physically live, the people of the town are likely to be far more problematic than the kobolds, who generally wont pick a fair fight if they can avoid it even when they have reason to want to fight the people. It needs to be made clear to the townsfolk that these kobolds are here to be peaceful and productive, not to attack them and sacrifice their children.

[Oberon Kenobi]

Difficult to know what the cultural differences are without knowing about the kobolds' home culture; kobolds tend to be portrayed very differently in different settings, more so than goblins and orcs anyway.

I think it's a bit of a mistake to assume they know as little as you seem to be assuming. I would think they had a role in whatever society they were in before, and that said society (however small it might have been) was functioning, no? What did they do before deciding to move in with humans? They're of perfectly reasonable intelligence, and can probably translate a lot of what they grew up with into this new culture.

Specific example, they might not need to learn a commoner job like farming or manual labor if they were, say, hunters or guards back home. The hesitation to have them be town guards is understandable–aside from being cautious about letting strangers walk around with weapons and a position of authority, that's one job where you definitely want the language barrier not to be an issue. But they could certainly be hunters and trappers if they have the skills for it.

In general, a residency with typical townsfolk will do a lot more good than trying to break things down into categories like you might find in a guidebook. Let them live in a welcoming household where they can follow people around and see how the town life works, as well as picking up the language. Assuming you have at least one Draconic speaker who is willing to be part of that household–and a household that's willing to take the kobolds in in the first place.

Edit: all that said, it's super cool that your party is not only avoiding the murderhobo tropes but actively following through on helping the kobolds with this journey they're undertaking.

[Red Fel]

Although Kobolds are depicted differently from setting to setting, and from edition to edition, there are a few constants to their culture and personalities, and you need to be aware of them if you want to "civilize" your Kobolds.

Kobolds are communal. This is extremely important. Kobold society is extremely community-oriented, with everyone serving a role and everyone contributing to the group. This can make them extremely easy to integrate into a receptive society - once the outside community has accepted the Kobolds, the Kobolds can redefine their community to include the outside community. The end result is a strong sense of loyalty and support which will quickly endear the Kobolds to their new hosts; their elderly will take care of children, their adults will toil endlessly for the community's benefit; and their (many, many) children will scamper exuberantly, to the delight of their non-Kobold peers. All good things. The challenge is getting both communities - Kobold and non-Kobold - to accept one another. The rest becomes only a matter of time. Kobolds are followers. That is, Kobolds naturally tend to ally themselves with powerful, intimidating beings, generally in a servile position. This is most commonly seen as the symbiosis between Dragons and their Kobold minions. This is in part due to the Kobolds' vulnerable nature - they're weak and in need of protection - and in part due to their simplicity - they're natural workers, and need leadership. If the outside community can show similar strength, and give the Kobolds a similar sense of direction and duty, they'll have vast numbers of loyal followers. Kobolds are industrious. Their defining trait is their trapmaking - which is valuable for any community seeking to defend itself - but they go beyond that. In 3.5, for instance, they are also powerfully sorcerous, and ardent teachers and storytellers. They will fit readily into a community that needs hard workers, be it craftsmen, arcanists, or simply caretakers for the children of the community. The danger, of course, is that they will raise non-Kobold children in their care as they would Kobold children, which could make for some fairly odd personalities. Kobolds are numerous. They are the vermin of the humanoid races. They breed in large numbers, in part because their individual survival rate is low, in part because their usual chosen neighbors (e.g. Dragons) are voracious or cruel, and in part because their chosen professions (e.g. mining and trapmaking) are not known for their safety. On the one hand, for a community welcoming a Kobold population, this means a vast number of ready workers; on the other, it means a massive drain on resources, particularly space. And while Kobolds are accustomed to a near-total lack of privacy, their hosts probably aren't so comfortable with the idea. Numbers will likely be your biggest hurdle, after the basic racial tensions.
The best way to introduce Kobold immigrants into a non-Kobold community, then, is to cover your bases.

Make sure that the local populace is aware of the benefits cohabitation with Kobolds can bring. Kobolds are skilled miners, craftsmen, and trapmakers, and these talents can make a village very rich, and very secure. By the same token, make sure that the Kobolds are aware of the benefits of affiliating themselves with their non-Kobold neighbors. Kobolds aren't well-received among other races, and having allies willing to stand beside them and vouch for them can go a long way into making the world a little safer for Kobolds. Get the Kobolds their own place to homestead. This is vital. If some Kobolds decide to live in town with their neighbors, that's wonderful, because regular exposure leads to a certain degree of acceptance. But dumping an entire and still-growing Kobold population will lead to crowding and discontentment, as well as a drain on local resources. Giving the Kobolds their own space gives them a sense of security in the possession of their own land and homes, while keeping them relatively self-sufficient and preventing a drain on local resources. Organize ambassadors. Kobolds, like any race, are not monolithic, and there will be those among them well-suited to the task. Finding a Kobold or two to assist in various local businesses, such as carpentry, smithing, or architecture will go a long way towards making the little folk feel welcome in the community; giving a few of their elderly jobs tending to children will allow an entire generation to grow up seeing the softer side of the scaled folk. Make sure one or two of them have representation in the local assembly, so that both Kobold and non-Kobold can come to understand one another. Similarly, encourage a few local folk to visit the Kobold settlement from time to time, to see how they're acclimating and behave in a neighborly fashion. The sooner the Kobolds feel that their neighbors are part of the extended Kobold community, the sooner both will truly benefit from the partnership.

[JellyPooga]

I think it's a bit of a mistake to assume they know as little as you seem to be assuming. I would think they had a role in whatever society they were in before, and that said society (however small it might have been) was functioning, no? What did they do before deciding to move in with humans? They're of perfectly reasonable intelligence, and can probably translate a lot of what they grew up with into this new culture.

I was going to say it, but you beat me to the punch!


In general, a residency with typical townsfolk will do a lot more good than trying to break things down into categories like you might find in a guidebook. Let them live in a welcoming household where they can follow people around and see how the town life works, as well as picking up the language. Assuming you have at least one Draconic speaker who is willing to be part of that household–and a household that's willing to take the kobolds in in the first place.

This, I think, is an awesome idea. Putting them aside, in a "Kobold Quarter" (or similar) and expecting them to integrate with society the way you'd like them to, is only likely to engender rumour, fear and eventually, hatred on both sides of the table. By putting them within the existing population, you're not only on the road to dispelling any preconceptions the two peoples have, but will accelerate the rate at which they will acclimate (kobold and townsfolk alike); from learning the language to accepting cultural "norms".


Edit: all that said, it's super cool that your party is not only avoiding the murderhobo tropes but actively following through on helping the kobolds with this journey they're undertaking.

Well said and well played :smallwink:

edit: also, what Red Fel said.

[Geddy2112]

Secondly is all the cultural things, we need to make sure they learn about work/trade, social customs and acceptable behaviour. My character is one of the draconic speakers and coincidentally also one of the characters that is advocating the whole idea of letting them live with us demi-humans rather than killing them or turning them away (again).

- Where they can live, and what can be expected to be provided compared to what they have to earn.
- The basics of ownership, and what is and isn't theirs.
- The basics of gold and economy, working and trading. We will provide options for work including farming, fishing, manual labor, guard duty at later stages if things go well.
- Where they can go and what they can do for necessities, like pointing out where they can buy food and where they can work for gold.
- Basic social customs and gestures, starting from nodding and shaking of heads, handshakes, the middle finger, etc.
- Who they can contact if an issue arises (the party or town guard, plus the one other NPC that can speak Draconic who will be employed as either a translator or teacher of draconic.)
- They are expected to learn a bit of common, and the townsfolk are expected to pick up a little draconic to ease transition.
- The basics of crime and punishment, what they are permitted and not permitted to do, as well as the consequences if they break those rules. Fairness will be enforced.

This is important, but as others have pointed out, Kobolds do have society and are generally lawful creatures. This means that once explained, Kobolds will have little trouble grasping these concepts. Kobolds love structure and hierarchy, and while these details will be different, they are structure and hierarchy. Kobolds are not overly intelligent or wise, but they are also not overly foolish or stupid, so this process won't be overly easy, nor overly difficult.



- Where and when aggression is permitted. Self defense and defense of their homes, no walking around town with weapons, nonlethal unless your life is at risk, etc.
This is going to be the hard part, as Kobolds are generally evil. Not resorting to violence or exploiting sentient life are fairly alien concepts to a Kobold. Most live in a dog eat dog(dragon eat kobold) world where might makes right and when you rule you rule with an iron fist. Fear of the town guard may keep them in line, but you don't want them thinking they can up and seize power with a violent and forceful coup. They need to be able to express their grievances and problems in civil, nonviolent ways. They need to understand that life is important, and that in this society(unless it just happens to be an evil village) that respecting and helping others is a good and proper thing. This is the big hurdle in integration.

[veti]

Three words: demographic time bomb. Red Fel sort-of touched on this, but it's something you're going to have to at least think about. So your town of 5000 humans/demi-humans accepts a community of 50 kobolds. Sure, why not, plenty of room, park your tail right there li'l scaly buddy.

But depending (http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Kobold#Reproduction) who (http://wiki.avlis.org/Kobold#Personality) you listen to, a single female kobold can lay and hatch a dozen eggs a year, and the young grow up in 10 years or less...

Which means that a decade down the line, what started as a 1% minority population has become the majority. And what will happen then? Well, that's going to be a very serious test of the extent to which they've accepted and internalised your values and ideals - because if they've maintained their distinctive koboldish culture and outlook, at that point everyone else - in this town, and its neighbours - is going to be in considerable trouble.

Kobold demographics might work differently in your world - I don't know. (Do you?) But if I were one of the established local population, I would want a lot of reassurance against this outcome.

[dream]

Wait, wha?:smallconfused:

"Kobolds are lawful"? Since when? Last time I looked at the Monster Manual, they were evil (and not Lawful Evil).

They will breed, commit small crimes, breed, cause real problems, breed, and attack all other humanoids. It is their nature.

Kill 'em all. And stop talking to your experience points :smallbiggrin:

[Oberon Kenobi]

"Kobolds are lawful"? Since when? Last time I looked at the Monster Manual, they were evil (and not Lawful Evil). Aaawkward... (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/kobold.htm) (Also this isn't one of the DnD subforums anyway, so alignment might not even be a thing in whatever system OP is using)

And I'll just ignore the rest of that. :P

[Coidzor]

Alright, so first thing's first. You gotta figure out how they're preparing their food so you know what their frame of reference is.

Once you have that, it's a pretty straightforward job to find an analogous process and then introduce a more refined, efficient method and/or tool. Then once you've expanded into basic culinary skills such as how to handle a contemporary kitchen's heating tasks, then you can start going over proper slaughtering and butchering techniques for getting the optimal cuts of meat out of the carcass and making them ready for the kitchen.

Once you get that done, it really shouldn't be that tricky for them to cook all the humans they need to.

Probably less trouble in the long run if you teach them how to eat cows, pigs, and goats, though.

[dream]

Lol:smallbiggrin:

I'm really stunned here. This is satire. Has to be.

[Kane0]

-Snip-

Well they arent barbaric, but they are decidedly uncivilized. They come from a tribal system of hunter-gatherers living in caves and subjected to a dragon's rule.
They're also gullible and currently not in the good books in town. Another town's leader that doesn't think very highly of us promised them that they could live in his town if they killed us to prove their strength.
You raise a good point though, 12 kobolds won't last long even in a passive aggressive town. Luckily we have an orc already running the town orphanage so we have a good case for enforcing fairness for both sides with not-so-normal residents. Also luckily they didn't manage to kill anyone in their attack.


-Snip-
I gather a solid knowledge roll would help, but that won't be for another week.
Tis better to assume they know too little, than to assume they know too much.
Good idea though, we could always use more hunters and craftsmen.
I intend to have my character and/or one of the PCs that knows draconic be with them in a household for a few months, to ensure the smoothest transition and also their safety.
And thank you! Usually that would have been exactly what happens but in this case we actually recognised them from prior dealings, a lot of creatures are not inherently/irredeemably evil in our game (much to some player's chagrin)


-Snip-
1. Good point, we will have to make sure they are included as much as possible. Good thing the yearly games are coming up this month.
2. The PCs are actually the local leaders, so thats fortuitous. Hopefully they aren't too much of a handful to keep in line.
3. We do have a mine that we could offer them work in, as well as hunting, crafts and most other professions. Hopefully the variety will help.
4. Hmm, that may prove an issue in a few years game-time. We could artificially replicate their mortality rates somehow (Genophage!), but that's a very slippery slope. Probably still better than sending them to their deaths in purposely hazardous working conditions though.

- They will definitely be getting their own 'custom-made' housing, probably a warren style collection of homes to blend what they are familiar with and why they are here in the first place.
- We will also be popularizing this as much as we can. The more people on board the better.
- One is already obviously smarter than the rest (and has a name), so he will likely be the 'spokesman'


-Snip-
I'm hoping their evil tendancies originate from nurture rather than nature. If we take out all the things that require them to be violent by providing safety, then fingers crossed it will reduce their tendency to resort to it. Playing up their focus on community will really help.


-Snip-
Okay, I'm looking more closely into the Bestow Curse: Genophage solution now.


-Snip-
Well we know they are omnivorous, and we do have a great many farms right now. Cooking may well be something that we need to teach, along with sanitation.

Thank you all, please keep it up!

[dream]

Kane0, what game system are you using btw? Might bring additional insights from posters.

[Kane0]

Pathfinder Kingmaker, but the way the DM is running it we can't rely on what the monster manual says as being true.

[Mastikator]

Schools, their kids need schools. They can't be civilized without education, with basic education they'll understand the value of civilization and the point of stuff like property rights, self determination, freedom of speech, divine rights of dragons to eat virgins and the importance of adventurers murderkilling kobolds for dat sweet sweet exp.

[Red Fel]

Schools, their kids need schools. They can't be civilized without education, with basic education they'll understand the value of civilization and the point of stuff like property rights, self determination, freedom of speech, divine rights of dragons to eat virgins and the importance of adventurers murderkilling kobolds for dat sweet sweet exp.

The challenge here is the structure of Kobold society. No Kobold is going to let the community's children - the future generation - be removed from the care and protection of the community. Nor will they abstain from teaching the little buggers about Kobold values and tradition. Consider the fact that, even when a Kobold community serves a Dragon, they don't allow the infinitely older, wiser being to raise their offspring; they do it themselves. Threatening that structure could prove fatal to Kobold/non-Kobold relations. And attempting to do that from the outset, when the Kobolds have only barely begun to trust their neighbors, would be disastrous.

Rather, the trick is to educate the educators. The elder Kobolds will likely remain set in their ways, but there will likely be several younger adults who are being groomed for the roles of caretaker and educator. Reach out to them. Teach them. Make them envious of what non-Kobold life has to offer, make them appreciate non-Kobold values.

And then, as they raise the next generation of Kobolds, they will pepper their teachings about community and industry with lessons about the wonders of their neighbors. They will intersperse stories about the Great and Tricky Kurtulmak with the tale of the founding of the village in which they now live. They will pause their lesson about the Kobold value of enduring suffering to remind the young that it's okay to ask your non-Kobold neighbors for help and support, and to offer it in return.

And when, ten years out, these young are considered adults, and several among them are being groomed for the same roles, their teachings about their neighbors' values will be more prominent. And so on. Kobold generations are much shorter than non-Kobold ones, and change can come more quickly as a result.

[BoardPep]

I think equality is imporant. A strange, unfair kind of equality.

For the first year or more, it's probably important that the humans and kobalds work together in equal numbers whenever possible. This might give the illusion that you are being "fair", but what this is actually doing is slowly getting rid of the bias of both cultures towards the other.

If you always involve the kobalds, let them farm, let them mine, let them take guard duty, they will feel like a part of the community.

And if you always make sure that humans are present while the kobalds do these things, the rest of the humans should not have any fear of being "betrayed" by the kobalds. They will feel safe that the kobalds aren't "taking over" parts of the town. Like if suddenly there were only kobold guards, I could imagine a lot of humans would be uneasy.

Plus by intermixing them in every profession, it's likely they will make friends. This will help greatly when any sort of racial misunderstanding arises, and one likely will at some point.