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View Full Version : The War Mind, Secretly Proto-Tome of Battle?



Sagetim
2015-07-25, 07:03 PM
In the description of the last ability of the War Mind from the complete psionics handbook, it reads a lot like the fluff that would be used for describing a maneuver. So, with that in mind, I think rebuilding the War Mind as a psionic/initiator class might make more sense than it's 3.5 incarnation as a class that punishes psionic characters for daring to take levels of it.

With that in mind, I would alter the class as follows:

Maneuvers:
The War Mind has an initiator level equal to their War Mind level + 1/2 other class levels+ any other initiator levels. They gain a particular subset of maneuvers from this prestige class rather than advancing their knowledge in any of the nine disciplines. The War Mind may recover one War Mind maneuver as a full round action spent meditating on the Talariic Texts. Meditating on the Texts in such a faction acts as a total defense action.

Chain of Personal Superiority (Boost)- Unlike other Boosts, this one may be activated as a free action. It grants the user a +2 insight bonus to Strength and Constitution while activated and the benefit remains active for 1 round per initiator level. When total initiator level reaches 9, the insight bonus granted by this maneuver increases to +4.

Chain of Defensive Posture (Boost)- Unlike other Boosts, this one may be activated as a free action. It grants the user a +2 insight bonus to Armor Class while activated and the benefits last for 1 round per initiator level. When total initiator level reaches 10, the insight bonus granted by this maneuver increases to +4

Chain of Overwhelming Force (Boost)- Unlike other Boosts, this one may be activated as a free action. When activated, it modifies the next attack the initiator makes, increasing damage dealt by 10d6. If the attack misses, this boost is still expended.

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So, my question for discussion is: Does this make sense to people? Would it be balanced to rework the limited per day abilities of the War Mind as special maneuvers? Would you be willing to play a War Mind with this kind of fix in place? And so on.

Edit: Apparently the original title of this thread counted as hate speech somehow. So I have edited the title to maintain it's original intent, minus a reference to how many people refer to the tome of battle classes.

Extra Anchovies
2015-07-25, 07:25 PM
So, they have three boosts, but they don't gain slots to ready those maneuvers in, and none of the boosts act like boosts? That's really confusing. Why not just make Chain of Personal Superiority, Chain of Defensive Posture, and Chain of Overwhelming Force usable 1/encounter each instead of having per-day limits? You could even go so far as to make Chain of Personal Superiority and Chain of Defensive Posture always-on abilities. It would be a nice buff to the class, and helps it enable interesting and effective martial builds.

War Mind, by the way, is not a PrC for psionic characters. It's best when entered from another martial class.

Pluto!
2015-07-25, 10:22 PM
War Mind is fine - it's a full BA class that gives melee characters everything they need via PsyWar powers, plus other strong abilities in Pseudo-Rage and Super-Cleave, with very easy prerequisites (some skill points and a psionic race OR psionic class dip OR one feat slot).

If you're working the class features into the maneuver system to make them more elegant, they shouldn't have weird action cost exceptions; that's counterproductive.

Edit:Relevant (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?177574-3-5-The-War-Mind-Revised-Class-ToB-Psionics-(PEACH))

Sagetim
2015-07-25, 10:28 PM
Oh, right, they need readied slots for that too, hm? I think reworking them as 1/encounter abilities would probably make the most sense then, since the per day limits and durations that they have normally seem to imply that you're going to be able to use it in most of your fights per day anyway (assuming the average 4 encounters per day). I just figured that the capstone ability with it's normal limit of once per day was a little odd when you look back on it considering all of what tome of battle characters can do.

It's also that the fluff on the prestige class seems to fit with the idea that some esoteric guy in the past wrote the texts that the prestige class mentions as a combination of psychic abilities and initiator maneuvers. And yes, I noticed that the class is best entered by someone who has no manifesting at all, despite the description of the prestige class stating that it was most often used by Psychic Warriors (who don't get to continue their own power progression) and Soulknives (who don't progress their mind blade at all).

Psyren
2015-07-26, 01:21 AM
War Mind combos well with initiator classes thanks to Sweeping Strike, which lets you apply every single-target maneuver you use to two squares.

As far as advancing initiators and granting maneuvers, I'll leave that to more knowledgeable folks to determine the impact.

Sagetim
2015-07-26, 09:44 PM
After looking over the war mind presented in the other thread, I don't think I would give it normal maneuver and stance progression. I Would have it's power point reserve stack normally, which the one presented in the other thread oddly chose to proclaim was overlapping. I think the class is busy enough as it is, with full bab progression, psychic warrior powers, and unique class abilities. If you shoved maneuvers into that as well, I think it would need some balancing factor, like reducing the bab. And that doesn't make much sense to me.

The main reason I was trying to figure out how to make the abilities operate more like maneuvers was because the fluff for War Mind seemed to fit with the fluff for tome of battle. And especially the capstone ability seemed like it would be a strike or boost of some kind.

So, to continue some semblance of a discussion: Do you think these abilities would work better as they are written, as special abilities usable once per encounter, or as special maneuvers that the prc provides slots for but forces you to have prepared? To clarify, the third option would make the abilities function as boosts, and use swift actions rather than free actions.