question regarding back pack weight allowed

[ariad]

Hi guys,

I have one of my players who is a bit of a book freak and on the payers of 5fh edition it's ritten that you can put your sleeping bag or a rope outside of a back pack to carry it, he is argumenting that this would not count on the weight allowed from the back pack since i't not in it...

My point in this is that if it does not count on the weight of the backpack it counts on the total weight allowed.

What do you guys think?

[Daishain]

If it is hanging on the backpack, it is putting strain on it, just like the items inside. If you're going to be counting such things, it would add to both the total weight of the backpack and the limits of what it can carry.

That stated, do you have reason to be counting such things? Unless running a survival scenario or something of the sort, most DMs don't make their players count every pound of junk they have, and only declare a weight/volume problem when things start getting ridiculous. 'I stuff everything in the armory in my pack!' 'how?'

The same sort of thing goes for rations, arrows, and other such consumables. Obtaining or even making arrows is not a huge challenge in most campaigns. and scrounging for food is quite simple. So once again, most DMs are going to wave it off, at least up to the point the party is fighting against things not using bows in a desert with little food, recoverable supplies, or materials suitable for fletching. Doing otherwise is just extra unnecessary book keeping for both the DM and the players.

[Xetheral]

Also, the backpack in the PHB is ludicrously small. Counting things on the outside against its limits make it practically non-functional. See here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=19287959&postcount=5) for more info.

[Ninja_Prawn]

That stated, do you have reason to be counting such things? Unless running a survival scenario or something of the sort, most DMs don't make their players count every pound of junk they have, and only declare a weight/volume problem when things start getting ridiculous. 'I stuff everything in the armory in my pack!' 'how?'

I agree.

And for what it's worth, I consider the weight limit on the backpack to be a roundabout measure of its internal capacity, not its breaking point. So, 30 lbs of rations fills about 1 cubic foot, but I say you can still strap a rope, bedroll / tent and weapon / instrument to the outside.

[arrowstorm]

Have him wear a backpack, then climb on the side.

[ariad]

Normally I don't go into these details but one of my characters has 6 strenght so the weight might just be an issu later on better to get the air streight right away... in this game I want to make it a little more real espescially when it comes down to carrying treasure... thanks for the input guys.

[Mellack]

I would total up all the weight for the character limit, but do not stress on the backpack weight limit. They are already screwed up, as some of the prepared adventurer packs contain more than the listed backpack can hold. If it is causing you too much trouble to keep calculating, be nice and give them a bag of holding.

[Daishain]

I agree.

And for what it's worth, I consider the weight limit on the backpack to be a roundabout measure of its internal capacity, not its breaking point. So, 30 lbs of rations fills about 1 cubic foot, but I say you can still strap a rope, bedroll / tent and weapon / instrument to the outside.
Treating it that way, the internal capacity would vary anywhere between around 3 ft^3 (lead) to 400 ft^3 (air) depending on what is loaded. Much easier to assume they meant a breaking point.

[KorvinStarmast]

Hi guys,

I have one of my players who is a bit of a book freak and on the payers of 5fh edition it's ritten that you can put your sleeping bag or a rope outside of a back pack to carry it, he is argumenting that this would not count on the weight allowed from the back pack since i't not in it...

My point in this is that if it does not count on the weight of the backpack it counts on the total weight allowed.

What do you guys think?
I think that stuffing a sleeping bag into a mundane back pack does not make it weightless.

Your player needs a reality check.

The total weight he is carrying increases, and the stress/strain on the straps have to account for that weight.

PS: in the old Boy Scouts of America Handbook, circa 1970, there was a fantastic illustration of a correctly packed Yucca Pack (the standard cloth back pack) that showed the bed roll attached to the rings on the back pack with the rope you were supposed to carry.

If you look at this 1950's era picture (http://images.guff.com/gallery/image/boyscout-6) you see the back pack without the bed roll. But you do see the metal rings on the left side of the back pack ... they were matched with 4 on the other side. What it looked like properly rigged was that the fold over flap was raised up and the bed roll rolled up in a thin cylinder. It was shaped into an inverted square U. You then used the rope to secure it, and folded the flap over and secure that.

Sorry for that digression, but some memories never go away. If I can find a .pdf of the 7th edition, which looks exactly like the one I had in 1970-72, I'll try to post that picture.

[djreynolds]

Have him wear a backpack, then climb on the side.

Exactly. Have him stand on a scale with a backpack and weigh himself. And then have him stand on a scale with the same backpack and 50 yards of rope. There should be a difference in the weight.

And if that doesn't do it, have him get in the " front lean and rest position " and begin without and with the rope.

And if that doesn't do it.... Give him directions to a dark alley........

[GiantOctopodes]

That stated, do you have reason to be counting such things? Unless running a survival scenario or something of the sort, most DMs don't make their players count every pound of junk they have, and only declare a weight/volume problem when things start getting ridiculous. 'I stuff everything in the armory in my pack!' 'how?'


As always I'll caution against the use of "most", as we have no way of knowing the practices of the majority of DMs. "Many" DMs don't make their players etc. works fine.

Beyond the nitpicking, this very fact itself is why one of the first (non) magical items I'll construct for the Barbarian / Fighter / Paladin of the party is the following:

Flexible intermediate bulk container: This ginormous reinforced burlap sack can hold up to 125 cubic feet of material (5' x 5' x 5') and can hold up to 1000 lbs.

[Thrudd]

Hi guys,

I have one of my players who is a bit of a book freak and on the payers of 5fh edition it's ritten that you can put your sleeping bag or a rope outside of a back pack to carry it, he is argumenting that this would not count on the weight allowed from the back pack since i't not in it...

My point in this is that if it does not count on the weight of the backpack it counts on the total weight allowed.

What do you guys think?

You may need two different stats for the pack: 1, decide its volume. 2, decide the weight it can hold before the straps or material breaks. Of course the bedroll adds to the stress on the backpack straps if it is attached to the backpack, and counts towards the character's carry limit. It does not take up interior volume.