View Full Version : Help with Shapeshifting variant Druid crunch

2007-05-05, 07:01 PM
I'd like to ask for help to see if I got the numbers right for calculating the attacks of the forms of my character. He's a dwarven L10 druid with the PHB II Shapeshifting Alternative class feature.

He's got a Strength of 14, a base attack bonus of +9/4 and BAB +7. For AC, Dex is +2.

So for each form I list what I think it's the correct formula for its stats. Tell me if there's anything wrong.

Predator form: Mountain Cat
STR 18 (+4); WIS 20
Bite +13 (1d6+6 dmg)
AC 16 (Flat Footed 14, Touch 12)
Speed 50 ft.

Aerial Form: Eagle
STR 16 (+3); WIS 20
Talon +12 (1d6+5 dmg),
Reflex +6
AC 14 (Flat Footed 12, Touch 12)
Flight (40 ft., good maneuverability))
+Flyby Attack

Ferocious Slayer form: Brown Bear
STR 22 (+6); WIS 20
Bite +14 (1d8+8 dmg)
2x Claw: +9 (1d6+8 dmg)
AC 19 (Flat Footed 17, Touch 11)
Speed 40 ft. LARGE (-1 AC & attack)
+Imp. Critical Bite & Claws

Also, when you have multiple natural attacks, you have a primary attack and other attacks at -5 if you don't have multiattack. Can't you actually choose to make a single attack with any of them at the full bonus, instead of just with the primary natural weapon? I mean, it makes sense, and besides you'd be probably making less damage, so it's not taking advantage. I ask it from a roleplaying standpoint. Makes sense.

2007-05-05, 07:04 PM
Only the primary natural attack gets the primary attack bonus. Secondary attacks, whether or not you use the primary attack, are still made at -5. In cases like the half-fiend, they can use their primary bite as an additional secondary attack when using a weapon.

2007-05-05, 07:51 PM
So as per RAW if my character shapeshifted as a bear chooses to make a single attack with one claw he has to make it at -5? Just curious. I don't know what's the basis used to decide which is the primary attack (other than it's a single one I guess).

2007-05-05, 07:54 PM
Yes, a single attack with a secondary weapon is still at -5.

Some monsters have claw/claw/bite instead of bite/claw/claw, that is 2 claws as primary and bite as secondary. It comes down to how the person creating the monster felt it would fight, I think.

2007-05-05, 08:17 PM
The multiattack feat reduces the penalty for attacking with secondary weapons to -2. It's of arguable use to shapeshifters however as most of their good forms only have one type of attack.

2007-05-06, 12:10 AM
Well, here it would be useful to me, as the best form I have has bite/2 claws. I went for Augmented Summoning instead, but might take it anyway, as it's my main combat form.

The next two forms, Forest Avenger (some type of big plant, like a treant) and Elemental Fury (a big elemental-like creature) have 2 primary slam attacks. Does this means that in a Standard action attack I use both? Or just one, and both in the full attack? And in any case, being both attacks primary, do both get the maximum attack bonus?
If not, Multiattack would be useful even then.

2007-05-06, 12:42 AM
Yep, you only get both slams in the full attack, but they count as primary attacks. Multiattack really only helps ferocious slayer form.

2007-05-06, 12:52 AM
Maybe I'll still use it by level 12-14...Then it would make sense to get Multiattack instead of Augmented Summoning then. I'm getting a big kick out of summoning in my party. But then again, I'm the versatile character. I'm multi role all the way. Except skills. And to be honest I couldn't think of a single feat that made a big difference to take at level 9. So I went for Augm. Summoning.