Kineticist Fix Discussion

[wintersjackson]

I'm sure I'm not the only one who loved the sound of the Kineticist, only to be very let down by the class. Even though I'm only planning on using the class for an npc anyway, I'd still be insulted to use this as-is.
So, here are my starting ideas...

Buffer refills automatically, is 3x the size
Full attack bonus
Infusion specialisation applies to blasts and wild talents (but you only get it half as often)

Kinetic Chirurgeon only loses access to Form infusions instead of all infusions, and can increase the cost of the Talent to base 3 from 5th level to double the effect of the Talent, and triple it from 11th level for a base of 5(though reduced by 2 by the specialisation.

[Extra Anchovies]

Auto-refills on the buffer is pretty much necessary, but I think tripling its size is a bit much. The way I see it, the Kineticist should be able to fill up their Elemental Overflow at the start of the day by putting points into Elemental Defense, and then survive the rest of the day only spending burn when things get really hairy.

I agree about the attack bonus.

Getting infusion specialization on utility wild talents doesn't make much sense to me. The utility talent that cost burn have reasons to cost burn - they last all day, they provide healing (and you can distribute the burn to the target), they emulate powerful effects (Tsunami), or they're panic buttons (From the Ashes).

My personal fixlist right now is that they get a version of devastating infusion that allows for energy-damage attacks (which ignore SR but aren't touch attacks) and applies bonus damage from Elemental Overflow, along with Blast Training and Flurry of Devastation. The size of the Internal Buffer is also equal to their Elemental Overflow cap, and it refills every day.

[khadgar567]

double the damage so in 20th level instead of 10d6 they gain 20d6 like warlock's blast

[Serafina]

The Kineticist basically has three problems:
- Accuracy due to lack of full BAB
- Inability to full attack, which causes a lot of scaling problems and bad interactions with a lot of damage-boosting effects.
- Burn



First, I do actually like burn. Taking nonlethal damage is risky because it can put you out of the fight, but it's also nice because you'll only fall unconscious instead of dying.


Now, the obvious buff is Full BAB. That alone would already make the class much better, since it'd solve the accuracy-issues of physical blasts.
And since we're already at it, there's no reason not to boost the HD. In fact, full BAB classes always have at least a D10. Making it a D12 would basically entirely negate the drawback of Burn.
And while we're at it, give them Improved Unarmed Strike and Weapon Finesse. Not major buffs - the first is a stylistic choice for certain builds, the latter is just a feat tax.


Personally, I'd get rid of Gather Energy and Internal Buffer.
Gather Energy heavily incentivizes you to "turret", which is often boring.
The Internal Buffer is too small anyway, we might as well think of something new.

Of course, we'd need something to compensate for that. Actually, the issue with Burn right now is that it scales really really weirdly - either you use stuff that doesn't cost any, or you run out really quickly and reduce yourself to roughly half HP.

We basically have three sources of Burn:
- Permanent, day-long upgrades. Some from Utility Talents, mostly from Defensive talents. Those are pretty good investments of Burn generally.
- Damage-options. Damaging yourself to damage the enemy more. The idea is great, but it doesn't really work all that well in practice.
- Adding non-damaging infusions. In-between in regards to usefulness.

It's the latter three that cause the most issues. If Burn is necessary to do useful stuff (such as good damage), then you'll quickly run out with the current system. If Burn is not necessary to do that, then it's entirely pointless and might as well be removed.

The solution? Burn for Infusions is kept. Burn for everything else is removed, or rather spent from a Constitution-dependent pool.
Burn from Infusions, Composite Blast and Metakinesis is changed. You no longer gather unhealable nonlethal damage. Instead, you add up the Burn you accept in each round and if you're hit, you take the normal amount of nonlethal damage if you fail a Concentration-check (DC 10+damage taken+amount of burn). Burn resets each round.



Now, what to do about Full-Attacking? Just adding the option with current blast-damage would cause some pretty high DPR with full BAB. But reducing Blast-damage would cause issues with all the infusions that cause area damage.
The Elemental Annihilator takes the approach of fixing the damage of the Blast. However, that damage scales pretty badly. We already have scaling full-attackable Blasts though, Kinetic Blade and Kinetic Fist. Let's take Inspiration from the latter and just alter Kinetic Blade and Flurry of Blasts. They now Deal 1D6+(1D6/6 levels) damage.


Last but not least, Physical Blasts vs. Energy Blasts is messed up balance-wise. The former has much worse accuracy, the latter is easily shut down by energy resistance and immunity. Simply making every blast into a physical one changes that - and then Infusions that allow for touch-attacks at the cost of Burn.


So, a summary of the changes:
- Full BAB.
- D12 HD
- Give Improved Unarmed Strike and Weapon Finesse.
- Give them Knowledge (Planes), because seriously.
- Remove Gather Power, Internal Buffer, Infusion Specialization and Elemental Overflow.
- Remove Burn from all Wild Talents, including Defense Wild Talents. Gain an Elemental Power Pool equal to (Con Mod + 1/2 Kineticist level). Each Wild Talent that used Burn now draws from that Pool, which recharges daily.
- Burn now works differently.
When unleashing the elements, you let dangerous energies flow through your body. If you are not careful, the strain can knock you out. Whenever you use an Infusion or Metakinetic Talent that uses Burn, add it's Burn cost to your total Burn. If you take damage while holding Burn, you must make a Concentration-check (DC=10+damage taken+current burn). If you fail, you take 1 point of nonlethal damage per character level per point of Burn. If you are immune to non-lethal damage or have an ability that alters how non-lethal damage affects you, you instead take half that amount of lethal damage. You reset your Burn at the beginning of your turn.
All references to "when you accept Burn" remain.
- All Blasts are now physical blasts. Fire Blast gets a second Blast, "Combustion Blast" that deals Bludgeoning Damage.
- Add a new Substance Infusion:
Assosciated Blasts: Blue Flame, Cold, Electricity, Fire Cost: 2 Burn
You unleash a pure ray of energy instead of your normal elemental blast. A Kinetic Blast modified by this Infusion attacks the targets touch AC instead of it's normal armor class.
- Change Kinetic Blade, Kinetic Whip and Flurry of Blasts. Also, give Kinetic Blade and Flurry of Blasts to each Kineticist for free
You either create a light or one-handed melee weapon out of pure energy or elemental matter, or you infuse a melee weapon held by you with that energy. You can use this form infusion as part of an attack action, a charge action or a full attack action. Since it's part of another action, using this wild talent doesn't provoke attacks of opportunity. If you form a blade, it deals 1D6+Constitution modifier points damage, if you use a weapon use that damage. In either case, you add 1D6 points of damage per 3 dice of your Kinetic Blast damage (minimum 1). This effect ceases at the end of your turn.

You unleash a flurry of elemental attacks. This is a full-attack action, allowing you to make ranged attacks with your Kinetic Blast. When used like this, your blast deals 1D6+Constitution points of modifier damage, plus an additional 1D6 points per 3 dice of your Kinetic Blasts Damage.
- Remove the need for a free hand from Kinetic Blast. Add in the following: "If you are holding a magic weapon, you can add it's enhancement bonus and special abilities to your Kinetic Blast. You can only add the effects of one weapon to your Blast. While many Kineticists do not use weapons, they can also benefit from a Amulet of Mighty Fists. Some even have items that can not normally be used as weapons enchanted with magical weapon properties, which can then be used with their Kinetic Blast if held in one hand".

[Serafina]

Under that system, you obviously have to alter the Archetypes. But then again, most of them are pretty bad anyway:

Blood Kineticist can stay as it is.
Elemental Annihilator is redundant - but then again, the idea of "remove utility, add damage" is TERRIBLE anyway.

Elemental Ascetic has merit, so here we go:
-Remove armor proficiency, obviously. Burn-free Kinetic Fist instead.
- Keep Elemental Flurry, but use the Unchained Monk Flurry.
- Give scaling unarmed damage like a Monk, in place of the first-level Infusion.
- Keep Wisdom instead of Con.
- Don't remove Elemental Defense! Instead, give the AC bonus at 5th level in place of Metakinesis (Empower). Give Evasion at 9th level in place of Metakinesis (Maximize). Give a Style Strike at 13th level in place of Metakinesis (Quicken), and Improved Evasion at 17th level in place of Metakinesis (Twice). I realize that that stuff comes pretty late, but Metakinesis is a neat slot to fit these things in. If you're not hung up on equal-level replacements, it could all come online two levels earlier or so. Alternatively, DO replace the Elemental Defense - but give it back at level 5, so that you get AC-bonus first and Defense later.


Kinetic Chirugeon is neat too, and needs a fix anyway:
- Replace the 1st-level Infusion with Kinetic Healer. Simple and easy. You can also use it (Wisdom) times per day without using points from your Elemental Power pool.
- From 5th-level, you can select Mercies in place of Infusions, instead of losing Infusions entirely.
- Instead of Metakinesis (Empower), you heal an additional 1D6 damage with Kinetic Healer. This increases to 2 dice at 11th level and to three dice at 17th level.
- Instead of Metakinesis (Maximize), you can use Breath of Life
- Instead of Metakinesis (Quicken), you can use Kinetic Healer as a Swift action (including on allies).
- Instead of Metakinesis (Twice), you can heal all allies within 30 feet of you with Kinetic Healer.

Overwhelming Soul is redundant under the system, though I suppose one could make a Charisma-based Kineticist if one wanted to.

[wintersjackson]

Ooh, what if gather power boosted blast damage instead? I see the turret argument, but I kinda like the concept. Say, an extra hit die+1 for every 5 levels at move action, and an extra hit die+1 per 4 levels as a full-round action.

Also, can anyone think of a re-design of the elemental overflow that actually fits the class design? even if it is, all things considered, a pretty minor boost, I like the idea. Maybe just give the benefits as a flat boost each turn after they used a Kineticist ability?

[Kurald Galain]

I'm also rather fond of the concept of gathering power, not so much of the current execution.

In particular, I'd like gathering for a full round and the next to become a viable tactical option, as a high-risk high-reward move.

[ChaoticSky]

As a alternative, the solution my group arrived at was the introduction of a Feat that lowers the Burn cost of everything by one. Sure it costs you a feat, but it makes the entire class surprisingly more functional. Alot of common infusions become free, better stuff (including composites) become free with a move-Gather, and you can mix infusions and/or composite with a full gather. Infusion Specialization progression becomes ahead of the curve instead of behind it. Supercharge likewise suddenly scales better, and Composite Spec makes them free (which works for a character whos that high a level). While still allowing Burn if you truely want to push it to the max and do something ****ing amazing (which imo is a better use of the burn mechanic).

I like Sera's idea, but if your GM gets iffy about reworking classes entirely, this method makes the Kin way more competitive.

[Milo v3]

I was just planning on increasing to full BAB, turning the damage from d6's to d10's, and grant psychic sensitivity as a bonus feat.

[Vhaidara]

I actually disagree with Sera's fix. I like the way that Burn drains off of everything.

My fix is
Full BAB
d12 HD
Bonus combat Feat at 1, 4, 7, 10, 13, 16, 19
Addition to Elemental Overflow: For every 3 Burn you have, reduce all Substance Infusion, Form Infusion, and Metakinesis Burn costs by 1

Give all elements a physical and an energy blast, and you get both at level 1