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View Full Version : Rules Q&A Dread Necro Feature Interaction



Naez
2015-08-10, 11:09 PM
The Dread Necromancer class states that at level 20 they undergo a transformation into a lich. And they also have a class feature called Undead Mastery that gives any undead they create bonuses.

My question is this: Since they turn themselves into a lich do they gain the bonuses of Undead Mastery?

Exact wording follows

All undead creatures created by a dread necromancer who has reached 8th level or higher gain a +4 enhancement bonus to Strength and Dexterity and 2 additional hit points per Hit Die.
In addition, when a dread necromancer uses the animate dead spell to create undead, she can control 4 + her Charisma bonus HD worth of undead creatures per class level (rather than the 4 HD per level normally granted by the spell).
Similarly, when a dread necromancer casts the control undead spell, the spell targets up to (2 + her Cha bonus) HD/level of undead creatures, rather than the 2 HD/level normally granted by the spell.

When a dread necromancer attains 20th level, she undergoes a hideous transformation and becomes a lich. Her type changes to undead, and she gains all the traits of the undead (see page 317 of the Monster Manual). She no longer has a Constitution score, all her existing Hit Dice become d12s, and she must reroll her hit points. A dread necromancer need not pay experience points or gold to create her phylactery.
A dread necromancer who is not humanoid does not gain this class feature.

rockdeworld
2015-08-11, 12:11 AM
I think the exact wording makes it clear that the Dread Necro did not create themselves as a lich, so no.

Crake
2015-08-11, 12:36 AM
I think the exact wording makes it clear that the Dread Necro did not create themselves as a lich, so no.

well, if they didn't create themselves, then who created them as liches?

rockdeworld
2015-08-11, 12:40 AM
well, if they didn't create themselves, then who created them as liches?

https://i.imgur.com/ndxvVz0.png

Asking "who" may be inappropriate as it could be a "what" or simply "the fundamental laws of the universe." The answer is not clear by RAW.

Michael7123
2015-08-11, 12:48 AM
If I was a DM, I would not allow it becuase I highly doubt that's what the rules intended.

Stricktly RAW... I think you could make the case to allow it. But, as said above, it's not clear.

atemu1234
2015-08-11, 01:19 AM
well, if they didn't create themselves, then who created them as liches?

By looking at Heroes of Horror, James Wyatt.