[3.PF] Wizard BBEG in need of help

[The Vagabond]

Greetings. I am Kiirbund Galaalrin, Wizard 20, Archmage 5- Creator of a world.

I created this world from the shattered shell of an old world- A old, broken apart world, full of dangers- I tamed it, and reshaped it in my own image, however, there have been... Issues.

In this world, there are some I forgot. How, I do not know- I am an impeccable Wizard, you see. As such, I am faced with something far more dangerous than I had imagined- Warriors outside my comprehension. These people are very, very dangerous, the Forgotten, because they cannot be targeted by spells. If were to scry on them, I would see a corpse, but not the person I sought. If I tried to make a spell that would kill every one of them, I would kill their corpses, but not their living bodies. I can't touch them, directly, and any attempt to scry on them indirectly leads to how te world WOULD be if they didn't exist. They don't trigger contingencies, either, or traps whose triggering mechanisms rely on magic. I can target them with rays, I can touch them, I can throw a fireball at them, but I cannot physically target them with spells that I just point to. In addition, they seem to be able to just rip magic apart with their bare hands. They only are able to be targeted by people when they desire to be.

I'm afraid I'm not particularly well equipped to deal with them, and am not a particularly good optimizer, as such, I would like to request for people to offer some assistance in dealing with these troublemakers. I do not have access to materials outside of this plane- This includes Conjuration (Calling) spells, and other wizards- The highest level of this world appears to be level 6 for non-forgotten.

We draw our power from the Pathfinder Archives of Nethys, however, I can call upon the might of various Wizard of the Coast Tomes- However, I fear what that might entail- When I unleash a tome, I unleash it to all of the beings in this world, and they can now draw upon it's power in tandem. This includes the Forgotten. Many forgotten have keener minds than I, and I fear how readily they can abuse the tomes, should I unleash them upon the world. As it is, I have managed to keep the power level down by destroying those who I fear might pose a risk against me.

So, you Giants in this Playground- What advice can you provide me to defeat the Forgotten?

TL:DR: My BBEG will face enemies immune to direct magic attacks and divination spells. How would you guys optimize him to destroy enemies immune to direct magic?

[rockdeworld]

In short, you're an epic-level wizard in an campaign without the ELH, and your enemies are DM Fiat-immune to all your spells. Do you have any mythic levels? Where does Archmage come from, and if it's 3.5, what are your abilities from it?

For playstyle tips that suit your exact situation, as well as suggestions on spells, read this guide: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xjPIOH8F8a0l74BdDF7Q23nCfZ-YX68Xr6JmmtznMw4/edit

Some quick suggestions:
-Form a band of adventurers, use Polymorph Any Object on each of them to turn them into powerful creatures with class levels and equipment, and use Astral Projection to make copies of all your bodies so you can adventure without fear of dying.
-Summon a Nalfeshnee with Summon Monster IX to lock down opponents with grappling and its Unholy Nimbus (not a spell, so presumably the Forgotten aren't immune to it).
-Have a Clone of yourself (and copy of your spellbook) and only ever fight through a Projected Image to make death almost impossible
-Ask your DM to give you a break and don't let the Forgotten use magic. Spells are the most powerful thing in the game, and if they can use them but are DM fiat immune to yours, it's going to be a horribly 1-sided game that ends up with you doing exactly what the DM says to win on the DM railroad, or dead.

[The Vagabond]

In short, you're an epic-level wizard in an campaign without the ELH, and your enemies are DM Fiat-immune to all your spells. Do you have any mythic levels? Where does Archmage come from, and if it's 3.5, what are your abilities from it?

For playstyle tips that suit your exact situation, as well as suggestions on spells, read this guide: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xjPIOH8F8a0l74BdDF7Q23nCfZ-YX68Xr6JmmtznMw4/edit

Some quick suggestions:
-Form a band of adventurers, use Polymorph Any Object on each of them to turn them into powerful creatures with class levels and equipment, and use Astral Projection to make copies of all your bodies so you can adventure without fear of dying.
-Summon a Nalfeshnee with Summon Monster IX to lock down opponents with grappling and its Unholy Nimbus (not a spell, so presumably the Forgotten aren't immune to it).
-Have a Clone of yourself (and copy of your spellbook) and only ever fight through a Projected Image to make death almost impossible
-Ask your DM to give you a break and don't let the Forgotten use magic. Spells are the most powerful thing in the game, and if they can use them but are DM fiat immune to yours, it's going to be a horribly 1-sided game that ends up with you doing exactly what the DM says to win on the DM railroad, or dead.
Indeed- Not quite compatible with my world. Though, however, I will be the primary villain of the campaign, and thus, assistance would be preffered. And yes, I do have mythic tiers- Six, in fact.

And, a mild correction- while they are immune to most of my scrying, they are not immune to ALL of my spells. Effect spells, Spells that create stuff, and ray spells all affect them normally. However, if it's simply a Target spell, then it has no effect. I can only fight via indirect methods.

Either way, thank you for the advice- However, the primary issue is finding trustworthy adventurers- Do you have any recommendations on how to create ones?
That's rather brilliant in regular combat method- The full potential of them are there.

I'm afraid he shall not permit them to use magic- Though, however, magic among the forgotten is rare- Usually limited to a forgotten of royal descent- I BELIEVE I killed most of them, but I can never be too careful.

[AvatarVecna]

No direct, targeted effects. Hrm...blasting could do it, although blasting is suboptimal even before you factor in immunities and resistances (which the Forgotten may very well possess). As another possibility, chain-summoning is always a powerful option; if you get enough metamagic abuse, you can get 4d2+20 creatures out of a single summoning spell (from the list of the spell two levels lower, but still); that's a lot of creatures. Combine that with a couple area effect buffs (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0427.html), and you have a sizeable and powerful fighting force ready to tear the action economy a new

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

At your level, creating the Emerald Legion (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?101587-D-amp-D-3-5-The-Emerald-Legion-Mass-Producing-Ikea-Tarrasques) should be within your means.

[rockdeworld]

Blasting is a direct, targeted effect, but I agree with summoning. Chain summoning won't work in PF sadly, as the chain spell feat was nerfed hard.

The Emerald Legion is likewise not PF-legal.


Indeed- Not quite compatible with my world. Though, however, I will be the primary villain of the campaign, and thus, assistance would be preffered. And yes, I do have mythic tiers- Six, in fact.

And, a mild correction- while they are immune to most of my scrying, they are not immune to ALL of my spells. Effect spells, Spells that create stuff, and ray spells all affect them normally. However, if it's simply a Target spell, then it has no effect. I can only fight via indirect methods.

Either way, thank you for the advice- However, the primary issue is finding trustworthy adventurers- Do you have any recommendations on how to create ones?
Yes, Dominate Monster, recast once every few weeks, for loyal minions. You could even keep their real bodies together and close to you for easy recasting while their Astral bodies are out doing your will. And don't stop at 4 horsemen either - at least a round dozen. Additionally: You can never have enough Simulacrums of Efreetis (free wishes) and Solars (free wishes and half-power muscle). Simulacrums of powerful monsters are good too - how about The Mantis God, Cthulhu, or Pazuzu?

What to spend wishes on? How about more simulacrums?

And of course, the Archmage levels are mythic. Chalk that up to my inexperience with the mythic system. I suppose you have Longevity and Mythic Spellcasting, and Mythic Sustenance is good too (though casting Polymorph Any Object on yourself twice to permanently become an elemental accomplishes the same thing, if you're into that). But do you have Wild Arcana? The ability to cast any spell on the fly is quite strong.

The information about Forgotten spell vulnerabilities is good though. I was thinking you'd have to resort to opening Gates to the elemental plane of overflowing lava and trapping them under it, but being vulnerable to effect spells, creation spells, and ray spells opens a huge selection.

For example:
-When facing a Forgotten spellcaster, Mythic Antimagic Field to shut-down whatever schools of spell they use (if you have that info), then Empowered Enervation/Orb Of The Void/Scourge of the Horsemen to drain their spellcasting ability.
-Prismatic Wall/Sphere shuts down anyone trying to approach you, and with the sphere you can just roll over them.
-Open a Gate to the Positive/Negative Energy plane and have a summoned creature bull-rush them through, then close the Gate.
-Put them in a pit, toss in an open Decanter of Endless Water (on full blast), then cover the pit with a Telekinetic/Resilient Sphere. Or open a Gate to The Abyss and wait for demons to drag them into it.
-For practical self-defense, Cosmic Ray and Scintillating Pattern can debuff an entire group of enemies.
-Symbols of Insanity/Death/Strife all over.
-Vortex/Tsunami in water, or Scouring Winds in land/air.

Naturally, you'll want the standard buffs too: Foresight, Protection from Spells, Spell Turning, Globe of Invulnerability, any spell that can be made permanent, equipment that gives every immunity possible.

A big one: Create Demiplane, for a home base where you yourself stay, preferably made of something very harmful to outsiders but which you're immune to, like Water Dominant when you don't breathe.

[AvatarVecna]

Blasting is a direct, targeted effect, but I agree with summoning. Chain summoning won't work in PF sadly, as the chain spell feat was nerfed hard.

When I referred to chain summoning, I wasn't referring to the Chain Spell metamagic feat (partially because that doesn't really apply to summoning spells, since it affects spells that target a single creature, not spells whose affect is a single creature). I was more referring to combining Empower Spell, Maximize Spell, Twin Spell, and Repeat Spell on the same summoning spell, which gets you 4d2+20 creatures with a single casting, but even 1d2+5 (since Twin and Repeat aren't PF stuff) is still a decent squad of summoned creatures, especially after buffing...and even then, Twin and Repeat might be available (since 3.5 stuff is allowed); did PF replace those as well? Also, in total fairness, Chain Spell was ridiculously overpowered in 3.5; it needed a nerf.

The rest of your post, I have no problem with.

[rockdeworld]

On a side note: how to be a classy BBEG:
1. Have an open invitation for powerful or high-level adventurers to come to your mansion (step 0.5: have a mansion)
2. Serve feasts daily by having your Solar simulacrums cast Heroes Feast.
3. Offer them glory, cash, and nigh-immortality for their employment, contingent on them passing a screening (some sort of obstacle course you design yourself)
(3.5 Make cash by using an Efreeti's Wishes to duplicate Wall of Iron and sell the iron)
4. Those that accept and pass the screening get Astral Projection, cash, and do whatever jobs you need done. Also their portait in the mansion, in the "Hall of Heroes" or the like.

[The Vagabond]

Yeah- mentioned above, but I'm limited to this plane. That means no planar binding solars and Jenies.

[Demidos]

Well coming from a 3.5 knowledge of spells...

Timestop:
Round 1: Summon monster 9 (preferably to summon various immune to con damage/poison), quickened stinking cloud
Round 2: Chained freedom of movement (targeting undead), quickened evard's black tentacles
Round 3: Cloudkill, Quickened Stinking cloud
Round 4: solid fog, quickened wall of stone
Round 5: forcecage, quickened EvilMonologueDespiteTheFactTheyCan'tHearYou

You can maximize or empower the time stop if you want, or just ignore a few of the redundant spells. The undead summoned should be form

[5ColouredWalker]

"Friend, I often see people in poor positions and needing to rely on brute force. The question however becomes how strapped are you for time and cash? And how many friends (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/leadership---final) can you call on?

If you can, I would suggest reaching out to any buddies you have and trying to find a skilled Sorcerer who's blood's tainted by the undead, offering him access to resources in exchange for acting as a lieutenant. You and he can both create more powerful but free willed undead or find creatures such as vampires which he could dominate. Likewise, if you could steal some automatons and had access to a sorcerer with an inherent nack with machines (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/bloodlines/bloodlines-from-paizo/impossible-sorcerer). If you can find one with both talents (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/sorcerer/archetypes/paizo---sorcerer-archetypes/crossblooded), such is grand.

If however, you rather keep lesser minions on hand, there is a type cauldron (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/c-d/cauldron-of-the-dead) which can be used recursively to create groups of undead under the control of handlers. For when you make the sky black with arrows, you're bound to hit something aye?"

If however, you're flush with funds, you could higher a group of skilled Golemcrafting Assistants (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/cooperative-crafting) and turn out your own horde of Automata, however remember to tailor them to your needs. (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/building-and-modifying-constructs)Sometimes lesser constructs suitably reinforced with modifications can out-perform lesser golems. And as always, those that can repair others are endlessly useful (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/constructs/clockwork/clockwork-servant). Oh, and if you're stretched for parts but have plenty of ritual materials, I've heard that properly handled trash golems (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/constructs/golem/golem-junk) can be quite useful."


Short Version-
Leadership: Sorcerer [Impossible/Undead Bloodline, Or both and Crossblood], Proceed to have him dominate large numbers of undead/constructs for your army. You may wish to dominate him.
Cauldron of the Dead means you can have a bunch of low level soldiers supported by up to 12 HD of skeletons/zombies at the same cost as regular undead, plus the cauldron's cost.
If you have the money, grab some constructs. If you have the time, Craft them, characters with Cooperative Crafting will help, but they'd have to be at least 7th level to be able to have all the feats [I think.].
Clockwork Servents are good if you go the golem rout, as they can repair survives for free. If your foes cant use magic, Junk Golems are particularly good, as they can become swarms which also facilitates their fast healing, you may want to advance their HD to increase their swarm damage though.

[rockdeworld]

Yeah- mentioned above, but I'm limited to this plane. That means no planar binding solars and Jenies.
The thing is, you don't have to planar bind them. Unless your DM ruled Plane Shift and Astral Projection don't work as intended, you can just travel to their plane and make copies of them.