Need help with a Thrallherd Build

[5w337x7007h]

I've been trying to get some straight answers, but everyone keeps redirecting me to guides n' stuff, and it's leaving me confused.

I'm building a Thrallherd;
Race: Blue
Class: Psion 5/ Thrallherd 6
Stats: Str 8, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 20, Wis 14, Cha 10

I'm looking for advice on if my stats need redistributing. What feats could I use to maximize my effect, but still leave room to deal with the inevitable "immune to mind-affecting" issue. I'm really not sure where to go with this build except to dominate and move on.

Should I treat the build like an Enchantment specialist, and focus on psionic and metapsionic feats that boost the save DCs? Are there metapsionic feats that allow for the unintelligent undead to be affected, like thranodic and thanatopic metamagic?

[AvatarVecna]

One of the great things about being a Thrallherd is that you don't have to personally be able to deal with every threat that comes up; that's what you've got minions for. Build a Mystic Theurge minion with the express purpose of destroying the undead.

[5w337x7007h]

This is true! But I'm still confused on feats, equipment, stats, and a few other things. I'd appreciate the help if you guys are actually interested.

Point to be made, I'm not interested in taking the fun out of the campaign for my fellow players. I'm looking to have fun and that happens to involve promoting my cause. I am a Thrallherd, and I seek a sanctuary for my followers. A place in which we can freely practice and perform as a collective mind.

I'm looking at feats like, Master's Voice, Endowed Mind, Master's Refuge, and other things that would help overcome strong minds. I'd rather not have someone ruin my entire plan because they can break away from my mind control. I think I've got 9 feats total.

[Sagetim]

If Thrallherd's basic abilities still function like they did in 3.5, then you don't need to deal with every threat that comes along the way, you can stuff believer's down it's throat and run away. Then get new believers within 24 hours. Alternatively, you keep murdering your thralls until you get a cleric thrall that can handle undead.

As long as thrallherd double counts for it's leadership score the way it does in 3.5, you're fine with 10 charisma. 20 int is a fine investment, and will serve you well as a psion. What kind of Psion are you going to be, though? Egotist, Shaper, Nomad, Kineticist, Telepath, The other one Seer, Generalist? It will affect what powers you'll be able to pick as powers known and which skills start out as class skills. I haven't looked at the pathfinder thrallherd in particular, but as far as I know it doesn't outright require Telepath.

After looking over Thrallherd, it's freaking great in pathfinder. It has an expended leadership score list, which will come into play when you have a charisma modifier, or as you gain non-thrallherd levels after you cap it at 15. You don't need a charisma modifier unless you want to be able to make use of that expanded list before you hit 16-20, and even then you would need a helluva charisma mod to reach those numbers before you cap out thrallherd anyway.

So it comes down to: what do you want to do as a psion? You're already going to be one manifester level down from Thrallherd 1, and you're going to be another manifester level down when you cap out thrallherd. In exchange for that you'll have potent Thralls that will get replaced if any of them fall in your service, and a pile of minions that are fanatically devoted to you. Given that your character is a Blue, this means that your starting believers and thralls are probably going to be goblins, orcs, ogres, and so on. But as they die off, you'll pick up a more eclectic mixture of individuals, maybe even people with class levels depending on what your DM supplies you with.

With a blue you can dump your favored class bonuses from leveling psion into a solid +1 to save dc's vs your mind effects, and then when you hit 6 in psion that can become a +2. This will synergize well with the powers and cost reductions that thrallherd provides with Mind Control and what have you.

Also, given that you can have your believers working for you, with enough followers you could have a mobile functional economy unto itself. And because they all believe in your character as a cult leader/godlikefigure, you can have them work their asses off to make money for your character, then funnel that money into crafting psionic items. Because of the lack of xp costs for pathfinder crafting, you could use this to build a number of psionic items, or even Scribe Psionic Tattoos on all of your followers so they have an option of last resort. You would need to figure out a means of feeding your followers if you're going to take all of their income, and probably a means of housing them, but as a 10th level manifester you can probably accomplish these things with judicious use of...I think it was Modify Matter and Sustenance? Laying your hands upon your followers at each day to keep them sustained would be a great cult leader trick and might be possible through a custom pair of gloves that manifest Sustenance on touch.

[5w337x7007h]

1 - Psionic Talent, Improved Initiative, Endowed Mind
3 - Psionic Meditation
5 - Persistant Power, Inquisitor
7 - Master's Voice
9 - Metapsionic Mastery (Mind Control)
11 - Craft Staff (For Psicrowns)
13 - Scribe Tattoo
15 - Master's Refuge

This is as far as I've gotten. Also, I'm not sure how to take care of unwanted victims of my mind control though. Maybe ritual sacrifice?

Also, my Thrallherd level at 11 would be a 17. It states that I count my points as Character levels (11) + Charisma modifier (0) + Thrallherd levels (6) = 17. If I'm reading the Thrallherd build correctly, as well, I can also use Mind Control at a reduced number of points equal to my Thrallherd level, meaning I pay 1 pp to use Mind Control at full effect, currently.

[Sagetim]

1 - Psionic Talent, Improved Initiative, Endowed Mind
3 - Psionic Meditation
5 - Persistant Power, Inquisitor
7 - Master's Voice
9 - Metapsionic Mastery (Mind Control)
11 - Craft Staff (For Psicrowns)
13 - Scribe Tattoo
15 - Master's Refuge

This is as far as I've gotten. Also, I'm not sure how to take care of unwanted victims of my mind control though. Maybe ritual sacrifice?

Also, my Thrallherd level at 11 would be a 17. It states that I count my points as Character levels (11) + Charisma modifier (0) + Thrallherd levels (6) = 17.

Well, pathfinder doesn't have the book of vile darkness sacrifice chart as far as I know. Even so, there's probably creative ways to get rid of mind control subjects that you aren't keeping around to enthrall or something. This is where playing a Shaper might come in handy, because you could crystallize a mind controlled target and keep them around as a statue until you need to use them for something. Then, with enough torture and mental manipulation you might be able to maneuver them into qualifying as a person who would respond to the psionic call for a Thrall. This would enable you to capture potent beings, put them on ice when you don't want to keep spending the power points to refresh mind control on them, then freeze them out and manipulate them until they are seeking guidance and willing to become one of your thralls. Great way to have control over who responds to your thrall call when you need to replace one of your thralls.

You'll probably want a way to dispel Crystallize if you go with this plan though, so you may need a means of bolstering your manifester level temporarily to pump your dispel higher than the manifester level you used for Crystallize.

[5w337x7007h]

I'm having a serious problem here, I don't mean to be rude, but Pathfinder Psionics isn't the same as D&D Psionics. The Pathfinder conversion for the Thrallherd has these set requirements;

Skills: Diplomacy 4 ranks, Knowledge (psionics) 5 ranks.
Feat: Inquisitor or Skill Focus (Diplomacy).
Psionics: Manifester level 5th and must be able to link minds together, whether via mindlink, mind control, or a collective. (The book itself says Collective, PFSRD says worldthought network)

So my Class choices are Psion (Telepath), Tactician, or Vitalist.

I've got a majority of the character built now, but I'm missing Equipment and powers. I'm requesting assistance because I'm new to Psionics and I'd appreciate help in this build.

Race- Blue
Class- Psion 5 Telepath(mindbender)/Thrallherd 6
Stats- Str 8, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 20, Wis 14, Cha 10
Feats(9)-
01- Psionic Talent, Improved Initiative, Endowed Mind
03- Psionic Meditation
05- Persistant Power, Inquisitor
07- Master's Voice
09- Metapsionic Mastery (Mind Control)
11- Twin Power

Again, the Psionics from 3.5 aren't exactly the same as the Psionics for Pathfinder. There are enough differences to cause a translation issue. All I've found is that if I want to be a Psion, I have to take the Telepath discipline.

[Sagetim]

I'm having a serious problem here, I don't mean to be rude, but Pathfinder Psionics isn't the same as D&D Psionics. The Pathfinder conversion for the Thrallherd has these set requirements;

Skills: Diplomacy 4 ranks, Knowledge (psionics) 5 ranks.
Feat: Inquisitor or Skill Focus (Diplomacy).
Psionics: Manifester level 5th and must be able to link minds together, whether via mindlink, mind control, or a collective. (The book itself says Collective, PFSRD says worldthought network)

So my Class choices are Psion (Telepath), Tactician, or Vitalist.

I've got a majority of the character built now, but I'm missing Equipment and powers. I'm requesting assistance because I'm new to Psionics and I'd appreciate help in this build.

Race- Blue
Class- Psion 5 Telepath(mindbender)/Thrallherd 6
Stats- Str 8, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 20, Wis 14, Cha 10
Feats(9)-
01- Psionic Talent, Improved Initiative, Endowed Mind
03- Psionic Meditation
05- Persistant Power, Inquisitor
07- Master's Voice
09- Metapsionic Mastery (Mind Control)
11- Twin Power

Again, the Psionics from 3.5 aren't exactly the same as the Psionics for Pathfinder. There are enough differences to cause a translation issue. All I've found is that if I want to be a Psion, I have to take the Telepath discipline.

Well, with the Expanded Knowledge feat you can pick up Mindlink at level 3. Because of the way Pathfinder does skills, you can get the ranks in Diplomacy without penalty, you just don't get the +3 for it being a class skill if you're a different flavor of Psion. Knowledge (Psionics) is a class skill for all flavors of psion. Though getting Inquisitor or Skill Focus (Diplomacy) is going to eat up one of your feats. If you go with not-a-telepath that would eat up a second feat (probably your level 3 feat, so you could qualify for Thrallherd ASAP).

Also, Persistent Power is 'try again, I hope you fail', instead of 'bump duration to 24 hours'. It's a really great feat for mind control type powers, because you're going to be fishing for the target to fail their save. To me, this means that this feat shouldn't be x'd out. Twin Power, by comparison, is expensive (6 power points more). So if you were going to bump any feat to a later acquisition I would go for that.

Since you don't have to play through the mid levels of the build, you can move some of your feats around if you want to play something other than a telepath. Also, it looks like Psionic Talent gives you...a little bitty extra number of power points per day? It doesn't look like it is a prerequisite for anything, so you could swap that out for Inquisitor at level 1, and pick up Expanded Knowledge (Mindlink) as a 5th level feat. You would need to wait until 5 in thrallherd to get mind control, which you would get for free as a prestige class ability, which just means you would swap metapsionic mastery (mind control) with twin power as your 11th level feat.
--------------------------------------------

I'm not sure how much money you'll start with, so I'll give general suggestions from the psionic gear list. Also bear in mind that you have no arcane failure chance, so if you can get armor with no check penalty, you can enchant that armor and wear it without any real penalty even if you don't have light armor proficiency or what have you.

Equipment that is going to be useful: Int boosting equipment will help you raise your power points per day and dc's because you're running a psion.

Headbands of Intelligence give an added benefit in pathfinder, for each +2 int it gives you a skill that you become trained in to maximum ranks while wearing the headband. So when it's created a +2 int headband has a skill chosen by the creator that anyone wearing it gets the benefit of maximum ranks in. A +4 int band gets 2 skills, and a +6 has 3 skills.

A Torc of Power Preservation is expensive at 36k, but it can be worth it as a higher level item to own. It lowers the cost of each power you manifest by 1. That builds up. It can't reduce the cost to 0, but it seems like a nice item to have IF you've already gotten your other gear set up. Worth looking back on later (and after you've been playing your psion for a while so you can gauge how effective it might actually be).

A Crystal Mask of Languages or Mind Armor could be handy. Mind Armor would give you a +4 insight bonus on will saves, which could help out with resisting other people trying to mind control you (or what have you) while the 5 extra languages provided by the mask of languages could be very handy for when you (probably eventually) pick up believers that don't speak normal languages. As an alternate to these two- Eyes of Power Leech, Vampiric could be very handy for recharging your power points if you regularly encounter targets that you could drain for power points. Or...you know, if you have at least one high level psionic believer that you could drain using them. The Vampiric ones cost about 20k though, so it would probably be a significant investment for starting gear.

A Psionatrix of Telepathy is going to net you a +1 enhancement bonus to all your telepathy powers. A solid investment at 8k, just bear in mind that you can't wear both it and an Amulet of Natural Armor. You may be able to get a custom item made to combine these abilities, but it's going to be expensive. An alternate thing to do might be to have both items separately and switch them out depending on your need at the time (and there is probably a power somewhere that gives a natural armor bonus, if you want to go that route instead).

On the Natural Armor shtick though, the Skin of the Defender gives a +4 natural armor bonus while worn, and because it's a psychoactive skin it fits over your everything. It doesn't use a slot. Downsides include costing 32k.

General suggestions would include picking up a ring of protection +1 (or better), armor with an enhancement bonus of +2 or better, a headband of int of +4 or 6, depending on what you could afford. a, or a few, bags of holding depending on how much they weigh and how many you can carry.

[5w337x7007h]

In the instance of Psionic Talent, I get that as a bonus feat for being a Blue. It's supposed to be Wild Talent, but if I choose a Psionic class, it becomes Psionic Talent. Which is a free feat.

My gold is going to be 83,000 or more, depending on how My GM and I decide to make things work. If possible I'm going to keep my current character as a thrall for my Thrallherd. She's a utili-caster and very good at her job.

Back to the items; +4 headband of vast intelligence 16000, Psionatrix of Telepathy 8000, Ring of Protection +2 8000, ring of natural armor +2 8000, Cloak of Resistance +4 16000, Portable Hole 20,000. That'd leave me with 7000g.

[Sagetim]

In the instance of Psionic Talent, I get that as a bonus feat for being a Blue. It's supposed to be Wild Talent, but if I choose a Psionic class, it becomes Psionic Talent. Which is a free feat.

My gold is going to be 83,000 or more, depending on how My GM and I decide to make things work. If possible I'm going to keep my current character as a thrall for my Thrallherd. She's a utili-caster and very good at her job.

Back to the items; +4 headband of vast intelligence 16000, Psionatrix of Telepathy 8000, Ring of Protection +2 8000, ring of natural armor +2 8000, Cloak of Resistance +4 16000, Portable Hole 20,000. That'd leave me with 7000g.

Does natural armor come in ring form? I thought it was an amulet. Well, if you can get it in ring, then...you know, great.

I would dump 4k of that into +2 light armor of some kind. My suggestion would be a +2 Mithral Shirt (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-armor/specific-magic-armor/mithral-shirt). +6 ac, no armor check penalty, and only 10 pounds. For the low low price of 5100 gold. That leaves you with around 1900 gold, which you can easily afford some other things with. A wagon, some oxen to pull it, and some other small things would probably help you pay for food and lodging for your believers while you're on the move. And when you settle you can start deploying them to make a living to pay for their own damn food or what have you.

Also: Oh, well, free feat is free feat. Nevermind then.

[5w337x7007h]

Yeah, funny thing about magical items is that their gold value stays the same as long as they take up a body slot. Ever wonder why the Ring of Protection +1-5 and the Amulet of Nat Armor +1-5 cost the same? Both use the same equation; AC Bonus^2 x 2000g. So I doubt changing body slot it takes up would make a difference, unless it became slotless, like an ioun stone.

EDIT: I see what you're saying about taking Expanded Knowledge, so that I can learn mind link, which lets me qualify for Thrallherd, while also allowing me be a Psionic Metacreative. Big question though, how do I go about effectively building my character as a Shaper 5/Thrallherd 6?

[Sagetim]

Yeah, funny thing about magical items is that their gold value stays the same as long as they take up a body slot. Ever wonder why the Ring of Protection +1-5 and the Amulet of Nat Armor +1-5 cost the same? Both use the same equation; AC Bonus^2 x 2000g. So I doubt changing body slot it takes up would make a difference, unless it became slotless, like an ioun stone.

Mindlink can be taken early, it's a power, not a feat. Empathic Connection and Mind Control are powers as well and they're just added to my available powers. I'm taking Metapsionic Mastery (Mind Control), so I can use multiple metapsionic feats without expending my focus. Also, what would you suggest in place of Twin Power, if I'm going to take it later on anyways.

The point of taking mindlink as a feat would be to allow you to be a shaper or other psion flavor. Which would let you take modify matter and greater modify matter (shaper list powers) without having to spend feats for them. And the point of those on a thrallherd would be to help you get set up wherever you happen to be settling with your believers (making weapons, armor, housing quickly and easily).

Since you're going telepath, I would suggest picking up modify matter as a feat at 9. If nothing else, it would let you ensure that all your believers are set up with masterwork gear for cheap. That would bump metamastery to 11, and twin to either 13 or 15. At 13 or 15 you could pick up greater modify matter via expanded knowledge. And since you'll have been in play for a while and had a chance to use (or not) modify matter, you can determine if you want to pick up it's big brother for more efficient setting up of things.

By then you can also determine if you're going to have the downtime to make judicious use of crafting feats. Scribe Tattoo could be useful for setting each of your followers up with at least one one shot power that they could use in an emergency situation (or for massed fire if you're trying to take out something big). Using Modify Matter yourself could also allow for making money yourself by doing made to order suits of armor for people, art pieces, sculptures, and so on. Depending on the setting you might need to disguise your Blue nature when you do these things, but...*shrug* that's a bridge to cross when you get to it.

[Sagetim]

Sagetim, If I go with Metacreativity, I could effectively use the same feats? I want to go for a Mad Hatter kind of style, but I'm not sure if metacreativity is the way to go for that.

Let's check the theory out. In the end, you're going to be the only playing the build, so if you want to go telepathy, go telepathy. I'm just a big fan of shaping and the metacreativity powers.

01- Psionic Talent, Improved Initiative, Endowed Mind
03- Psionic Meditation
05- Persistant Power, Inquisitor
07- Master's Voice
09- Metapsionic Mastery (Mind Control)
11- Twin Power

Psionic Talent is free racial
Improved Init is first level feat
Endowed Mind is psion bonus feat at 1
Psionic Meditation is at 3
Persistent Power is bonus 5th for psion
Inquisitor is 5th level
Master's Voice is 7th
Metapsionic is 9th
Twin power is 11th

So we can't trade out Psionic Talent. Improved Init is helpful for everyone, but if you want to go Shaper you'll probably have to bump it and replace it with Inquisitor. Endowed Mind sticks around as your first level bonus psion feat. You'll need to pick up expanded knowledge at some point for mind link, it just has to be before the first level of thrallherd. So you can keep Psionic Meditation as a third level feat. Bonus feat at psion 5 will be Persistent Power, and your 5th level feat will be Expanded Knowledge (Mindlink). Then 7 will still be Master's Voice, but since you won't be able to pick up Mind Control as a power until you get it for free as a class ability, Metapsionic Mastery gets bumped up to level 11. Twin power can fit in your 9 slot if you want it there. Alternatively, you could pick up any first to 4th level non shaper/general psion power that you want and leave twin power for later.

This leaves you with most of the feats you wanted (though not with improved initiative) and it enables you to pick up some of the very nice shaper powers. Concealing Amorpha Greater would net you a 50% miss chance for anyone attacking you. Astral Construct for on demand brutes. Modify Matter and Greater for Fabricate Shenanigans...and apparently Genesis is a 6th level Shaper power now...that's kind of awesome. At higher level, Astral Seed gives you a way around death without having to rely on a god to be willing to okay a raise dead or resurrection. Quintessence is a handy 4th level power for...shenanigans. Ectoplasmic Cocoon can be handy, as can it's Mass version, especially against big things with not so great reflex saves.

By comparison, if you stick with Telepath you have access to the Telepathy powers. There are good Telepathy powers, so I don't want to leave you with the impression that Telepathy powers are all bad or something...I just like shaper more. That said, Empathic Connection is a charm, Read Thoughts is spiffy mind reading. Aversion can be useful if you can find a way to hide the fact that you used it, because you can make guards unwilling to stay near their posts, or give them an aversion to going near your base of operations and what have you. Brain lock is okay? It would be better if you could find a way to keep it from collapsing only a round after you stop concentrating. Battlesense can get expensive if you want to use the buffs for it, but it's got mass targeting potential. As far as I'm aware, you don't generally get mass targeting potential. Crisis of Breath is useful for nonlethal takedowns. Though I'm not sure if you would need to do that. Empathic Transfer Hostile has some impressive potential, enough that you might want to pick it up with an expanded knowledge feat if you go Shaper. Of course, you don't Want to be stuck in a position where it would be useful, but...it could be very useful in a pinch. Falsify Senses is useful for tricking people, especially because it skips past Trueseeing on the technicality that you're not making an illusion, you're directly changing the target's senses. Alienation is...Damn...that is just...mean. Augment it and hope for multiple failures and you may well turn an encounter into a mess as enemies start murdering each other. Modify Memory is...well, it's a thing. It seems like it would take a lot of time and effort to use it, and because of it's duration of permanent it's subject to dispelling (and don't quote me on this, but I think if it has a permanent duration it would show up under detect magic or detect psionics or some such). Metaconcert is uniquely suited to making use of believers that happen to be psionic, And if you have a psionic thrall(s) you can use them in it as well. If nothing else, you can use it with your believers to get the maximum saving throw bonus before a big fight. The downsides include that your believers are probably not going to be very high level at all, and a 1 minute manifesting time to get it up and running. Crisis of Life gives people heart attacks, and that's cool. Crisis of life has a hit die cap, and that's not cool. Especially because it's hit die cap doesn't scale well with how many power points you're spending on it. It starts at 13 with a cap of 11, and the cap only goes up by 1 per point spent. This means that at level 20, spending 20 points on it, you can't use it to instantly kill someone who is the same level, only to deal some damage. Also the damage doesn't scale. Mind Seed is...evil, as far as I'm concerned. It could be really handy, but if you really want it, you could pick it up via expanded knowledge at 17 or 19. Also, limited to targets of your size or smaller, as a blue that means small or smaller. Mind Probe is useful, especially with it's sleeping target clause. You could set up an inn, or a safe haven like location, put people up for a night for free, and mind probe them while they sleep in exchange for the safe place to sleep and the free food.

So yeah. Play whatever flavor of psion you're going to have fun with. Shaper just opens up some economic options.

[5w337x7007h]

Considering how my GM is treating his little goblin character, I think I'll be fine. As for the adjustment, I'm going to modify my gear selection as such;
+4 headband of vast intelligence 16000, Psionatrix of Telepathy 8000, Ring of Protection +2 8000, ring of natural armor +2 8000, Cloak of Resistance +4 16000, Portable Hole 20000, +2 Mithral Shirt 5100

Total cost = 81100

That'd leave me with 1900g, which I can use to buy a wagon, a horse, some miscellaneous gear, and tools for my followers so they can build up their own wagons in a sort of wagon train.

[Sagetim]

Considering how my GM is treating his little goblin character, I think I'll be fine. As for the adjustment, I'm going to modify my gear selection as such;
+4 headband of vast intelligence 16000, Psionatrix of Telepathy 8000, Ring of Protection +2 8000, ring of natural armor +2 8000, Cloak of Resistance +4 16000, Portable Hole 20000, +2 Mithral Shirt 5100

Total cost = 81100

That'd leave me with 1900g, which I can use to buy a wagon, a horse, some miscellaneous gear, and tools for my followers so they can build up their own wagons in a sort of wagon train.

With Modify Matter and Craft Carpentry you could help whip those wagons up faster and cheaper, I would think. But yeah, I think your gear is good to go and should serve you well. Good luck with your thrallherding.

[5w337x7007h]

Thanks, and hopefully I can deal with the horde of ogres, hill giants, and stone giants. Because I really want to just Dominate the **** out of this place. Really wishing, however, that the Illithids weren't intellectual property of WotC.

[Sagetim]

Well, it's probably not that hard to convert them to Pathfinder. I would use the psionic version of them as a starting point (I think it has 7 inherent levels of telepath, even). But, you know...like, 9 hit dice and a +5 ecl is really unforgiving for ECL.

[5w337x7007h]

Yeah. Sounds like more of a pain that it's worth. Oh! With Modify Matter, could I effectively turn coal into diamonds? They're effectively the same, except that diamonds have gone under extreme heat and pressure for a long period of time.

[Sagetim]

Yeah. Sounds like more of a pain that it's worth. Oh! With Modify Matter, could I effectively turn coal into diamonds? They're effectively the same, except that diamonds have gone under extreme heat and pressure for a long period of time.

I would say yes, if you could do the craft alchemy check necessary for it (and probably set the dc at 30 or 40, to keep it from being a common trick among fabricators). But that's really up to your DM. I generally assume that Modify Matter/Fabricate can let you do things like that, or combining iron ore and coal/charcoal/wood to get steel.

Even if the DM says no to such things, it's still useful for getting stuff built faster.

[5w337x7007h]

Modify Matter:
You convert material of one sort into a product that is of the same material. Creatures or psionic items cannot be created or transmuted by this effect. The quality of items made by this power is commensurate with the quality of material used as the basis for the new fabrication. If you work with a mineral, the target is reduced to 1 cubic foot per level instead of 10 cubic feet.

Commensurate - Definition:
corresponding in amount, magnitude, or degree.

I'm hoping you're right with that one, but the ability itself is amazingly destructive too. I could basically turn part of a building into a bunch of balls made of the same material, and have the building collapse because balls aren't very good support structures.

The spell is fun, but it's not very good in combat if you're doing anything more than 10 cubic feet. Sometimes Pathfinder confuses me. I keep thinking 10 foot cubes, like mage's magnificent mansion, as opposed to 10 cubic feet, which are vastly different in volume.

[Sagetim]

Modify Matter:
You convert material of one sort into a product that is of the same material. Creatures or psionic items cannot be created or transmuted by this effect. The quality of items made by this power is commensurate with the quality of material used as the basis for the new fabrication. If you work with a mineral, the target is reduced to 1 cubic foot per level instead of 10 cubic feet.

Commensurate - Definition:
corresponding in amount, magnitude, or degree.

I'm hoping you're right with that one, but the ability itself is amazingly destructive too. I could basically turn part of a building into a bunch of balls made of the same material, and have the building collapse because balls aren't very good support structures.

The spell is fun, but it's not very good in combat if you're doing anything more than 10 cubic feet. Sometimes Pathfinder confuses me. I keep thinking 10 foot cubes, like mage's magnificent mansion, as opposed to 10 cubic feet, which are vastly different in volume.

Yeah, when I first encountered the fabricate spell in the 3.0 player's handbook I had to play with the math a lot to get a good handle on the difference. Just remember that the chest plate of a full plate isn't really all that thick, and it's reasonable to assume that you would only need to count the volume that the finished product occupies, rather than the empty space that might be included in it. After all, you're fabricating the raw materials into a new shape/form, not targeting the air. Well, unless you're fabricating air into something. But I think that goes beyond the scope of dnd knowledges and into the land of 'real world chemistry that we shouldn't be applying in dnd'.

[5w337x7007h]

Tell that to the Alchemists in Pathfinder. Ohh ohh!! What about Craft Architecture instead.