Fun uses for the Stubborn Nail?

[Oberon Kenobi]

Starting at a higher level and got a bit of gold you don't really know what to do with? The Stubborn Nail (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/r-z/stubborn-nail) costs 100 gp, and seems ripe for all kinds of imaginative uses.

Two I thought of immediately when I found it were

1) Prank the wizard by pushing it through their spellbook.

2) Take two of 'em and put 'em through the lich's eyes; undead are non-living material!

What about you fine folks, any fun ideas? :smalltongue:

[Venger]

use it to glue your weapon to your gauntlet so it can't be sundered.

[Balmas]

-Impromptu armor spikes.
-Never lose your deposit to poster pin holes ever again.
-If you're really sneaky, pin an opponent's sword inside its sheath before combat starts.
-Instant spiked club.

[Necroticplague]

Anyone else wonder if the +2 to door break DC can be stacked to make a nigh-indestructible door?

[Psyren]

I'm more interested in the lock function - can a rogue who fails to open the lock no matter what he tries notice that this thing is the cause? Say, if you shove it into the other side of the door? He may not even know he has to do the strength check to get it out in the first place.

GM: "No matter what you do with your lockpicks, the door fails to open."
Rogue: "I take 20!"
GM: "Nope."
Rogue: "But I have a +40 Disable Dev-
GM: "Nope."

[SangoProduction]

I'm more interested in the lock function - can a rogue who fails to open the lock no matter what he tries notice that this thing is the cause? Say, if you shove it into the other side of the door? He may not even know he has to do the strength check to get it out in the first place.

GM: "No matter what you do with your lockpicks, the door fails to open."
Rogue: "I take 20!"
GM: "Nope."
Rogue: "But I have a +40 Disable Dev-
GM: "Nope."

Way I read it, it's like sticking something in the lock, and it not moving. A rogue, especially one skilled enough in Disable Device to have +40 would be able to notice it. It might be impossible to pull it out, since it's on the other side, but he'd notice it either way.

[Psyren]

Way I read it, it's like sticking something in the lock, and it not moving. A rogue, especially one skilled enough in Disable Device to have +40 would be able to notice it. It might be impossible to pull it out, since it's on the other side, but he'd notice it either way.

I'd agree - except nothing says you have to push it into a visible part of the lock, like the keyhole. Since it can be implanted into solid objects, you can insert it into a metal part of the lock from the other side of the door, making it impossible to notice unless the rogue can see through solid objects.

For example, if the lock looked like this:

http://www.pro-handyman.com/Portals/52840/images/door%20knob.jpg

And you pressed it in vertically from the other side of the door, the rogue would have no way of knowing why the lock is so difficult to open.

It wouldn't really be fair, and it's pretty easy to defeat if they brought a barbarian along, but it could stymie a rogue who didn't plan for such a contingency.

[SangoProduction]

I'd agree - except nothing says you have to push it into a visible part of the lock, like the keyhole. Since it can be implanted into solid objects, you can insert it into a metal part of the lock from the other side of the door, making it impossible to notice unless the rogue can see through solid objects.

And you pressed it in vertically from the other side of the door, the rogue would have no way of knowing why the lock is so difficult to open.

It wouldn't really be fair, and it's pretty easy to defeat if they brought a barbarian along, but it could stymie a rogue who didn't plan for such a contingency.

I didn't say they'd know "why" exactly, but they'd know its impossibility. If they had any experience with magic (as they likely did), then the most logical conclusion he'd make is it's magically locked. Keeping it mundane, I'd imagine it'd seem a lot like a jammed mechanism. And the more skilled one is at something, the more they can rule out / make logical assumptions about, until it's just "A wizard did it, move on". Then after seeing the nail, they'd be able later to recognize symptoms of a locked jammed with it (especially at that bonus).

[Psyren]

I didn't say they'd know "why" exactly, but they'd know its impossibility. If they had any experience with magic (as they likely did), then the most logical conclusion he'd make is it's magically locked. Keeping it mundane, I'd imagine it'd seem a lot like a jammed mechanism.

Sure - but magical locks (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/arcane-lock) in Pathfinder can still be disabled, it's just harder. This thing is a hard "no."

Of course, the rogue character may have experience with these things even if the player doesn't, so I'd allow a knowledge check here myself.

[SangoProduction]

Sure - but magical locks (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/arcane-lock) in Pathfinder can still be disabled, it's just harder. This thing is a hard "no."

Of course, the rogue character may have experience with these things even if the player doesn't, so I'd allow a knowledge check here myself.

I did make an edit right as you commented, here it is
EDIT: And the more skilled one is at something, the more they can rule out / make logical assumptions about, until it's just "A wizard did it, move on". Then after seeing the nail, they'd be able to later recognize symptoms of a locked jammed with it (especially at that bonus).

And I wasn't talking about Magic Lock specifically, I was talking magic (aka A wizard did it).

I mean, skill in something is at least to some extent knowledge about it and how it works. You can't be "skilled" at football without knowing about it. Same with cooking. You might not need to dig down extremely deep, like knowing the chemical reactions or *why* ingredients taste good together, but you'd have to know that they do, if you are good at cooking.

[Psyren]

Indeed, I agree. If the player's is roleplaying a character that knows his stuff when it comes to locks, it would be a weird kind of... reverse-metagaming to not give them a clue that something is magically preventing them from opening that lock.

[Extra Anchovies]

On the topic of rogues - give a stubborn nail to the party sneak and tell them it's a magical lockpick :smallbiggrin:


I'd agree - except nothing says you have to push it into a visible part of the lock, like the keyhole. Since it can be implanted into solid objects, you can insert it into a metal part of the lock from the other side of the door, making it impossible to notice unless the rogue can see through solid objects.

For example, if the lock looked like this:

http://www.pro-handyman.com/Portals/52840/images/door%20knob.jpg

And you pressed it in vertically from the other side of the door, the rogue would have no way of knowing why the lock is so difficult to open.

It wouldn't really be fair, and it's pretty easy to defeat if they brought a barbarian along, but it could stymie a rogue who didn't plan for such a contingency.

That's a pretty hilarious image, a rogue struggling with one of those handles.

[Oberon Kenobi]

At the point where the obstacle is a 100 gp magical item spent specifically to foil lockpicking in a manner that can't be seen, somebody in the chain of effect is really just being kind of a turd. :P

That said, I'd also allow a Knowledge check–and/or an "activate blindly" UMD check to jiggle the door and get the thing to fall out the other side.

...Actually, no, I'd just roll it into the Disable Device check; bypassing supposedly-foolproof obstacles of arcane artifice is kinda the Rogue's thing. If Trapfinding lets you recognize and disarm a Symbol of Death without setting it off, a jammed-up lock should be a cakewalk, verisimilitude be damned. :smallcool:

On the topic of rogues - give a stubborn nail to the party sneak and tell them it's a magical lockpick :smallbiggrin:"Turnabout's fair play. That's what you get for putting all your points in Bluff and none in Sense Motive." :smalltongue:

[SangoProduction]

On the topic of rogues - give a stubborn nail to the party sneak and tell them it's a magical lockpick :smallbiggrin:



That's a pretty hilarious image, a rogue struggling with one of those handles.

lol, hillarious. Just got to refluff it so it looks like a lock pick, and boom. The reverse lock pick of doom. :-)

[Socratov]

Indeed, I agree. If the player's is roleplaying a character that knows his stuff when it comes to locks, it would be a weird kind of... reverse-metagaming to not give them a clue that something is magically preventing them from opening that lock.

I'd screw them over completely by disabling the doorknob/handle and not the lock itself. No way to trace it and you can tell the rogue: you did pick the lock, but the handle still won't turn. But then again, I'm sometimes accused of being evil...