Warforged barbarian help

[Theodred theOld]

Building a warforged killing machine. So far I have sorc 1/ fighter 2/ lion spirit totem barbarian 5. Feat are mithral body, power attack, leap attack, improved init. and extra rage. The sorcerer level allows for self-repair , wand usage and possible abjurant champ levels later and fighter is obvious. Anything I may have overlooked or neglected?

[Draconium]

Warforged Juggernaut. It's a PrC that is available to Warforged exclusively, and is amazing. More immunities, armor spikes, extra damage while charging. But you need Adamantine Body for it.

[Theodred theOld]

Warforged Juggernaut. It's a PrC that is available to Warforged exclusively, and is amazing. More immunities, armor spikes, extra damage while charging. But you need Adamantine Body for it.
I looked at that but I wanna stay light-ish with the armor so I can avoid a high penalty to jump checks for leap attack. To that end I spent a good chunk of my wbl on enchanting my body +2 and I took shield as my other first lvl spell besides repair light damage.

[Troacctid]

If you want self-repair, (Cloistered) Cleric is better than Sorcerer. It gives you Lesser Vigor, which is a more efficient healing spell, and you get two domains, which can offer you some pretty nice domain powers. (Including Magic domain if you want access to Sorcerer/Wizard wands, and Time domain to free up that feat slot you spent on Improved Initiative.) Furthermore, since the spells are divine, you don't have to worry about the arcane spell failure from your composite plating.

[Theodred theOld]

Hmmm. I suppose the d8 hd would be nice.

[Sagetim]

Cloistered Cleric is the light armor wearing, d6 hit die having, paper-thin cleric that hangs out in towers and reads all day. They also get a poor bab and some other downsides for running a combat brute with them.

The d8 cleric is the vanilla cleric, a mixture of man at arms and priest that gets to be a full caster in heavy armor and so on.

That said, repair light damage is something you wouldn't have to share with your party members. While if you have even just that one level of cleric they are going to expect you to share your healing with the rest of the party.

Don't warforged get a cha penalty? it seems subpar to go sorcerer, bearing that in mind. So wizard would probably fit better for your stats (since warforged don't get an int penalty). It will also synergize better with abjurant champion, leaving you just one level of casting advancement away from having fourth level spells by the time you finish the prc, as opposed to having exactly one level 3 spell that only just became available.

I think that warforged favored class is Fighter, isn't it? So if that's the case, you would be suffering from multiclassing xp penalties for having barbarian and wizard so many levels apart.

I would also second the warforged juggernaut prc. It may require you to go Adamantine Body, but it's got some really great class abilities for being a melee monster.

Don't forget to pick up twilight as an enchantment on your body to lower your arcane failure chance. Because that's going to be a thing for you. If you don't go warforged juggernaut, you could bring arcane failure down in other ways too: The Spellsword prestige class would offer some helpful reduction to arcane failure percentage, And I'm pretty sure there are some feats that also let you bring down arcane failure percentage (I just don't remember their names off hand. But that's what feat indexes are for).

But seriously: going cleric is going to result in two annoying things- you'll have to pray to a god for your spells and you will need to act in according to that faith. And your party members are probably going to expect you to share those healing spells. Unless they happen to also be running warforged, they won't expect you to share repair spells (even as a wizard).

[Venger]

Cloistered Cleric is the light armor wearing, d6 hit die having, paper-thin cleric that hangs out in towers and reads all day. They also get a poor bab and some other downsides for running a combat brute with them.
no those're actually all the disadvantages. lower HD, poor BA. everything else is bonuses: 6 skill points, an expanded list, extra spells, and another domain (that you can transmute into knowledge devotion or change via substitute domain or heretic of the faith) it's an incredibly sweet deal.


That said, repair light damage is something you wouldn't have to share with your party members. While if you have even just that one level of cleric they are going to expect you to share your healing with the rest of the party.

healbot cleric is... not how you should play cleric, or expect one to be played. besides, even if your party thinks that way, they couldn't expect that from someone with just a 1 lvl dip.


Don't warforged get a cha penalty? it seems subpar to go sorcerer, bearing that in mind. So wizard would probably fit better for your stats (since warforged don't get an int penalty). It will also synergize better with abjurant champion, leaving you just one level of casting advancement away from having fourth level spells by the time you finish the prc, as opposed to having exactly one level 3 spell that only just became available.
they do, so it would be a poor idea.


I think that warforged favored class is Fighter, isn't it? So if that's the case, you would be suffering from multiclassing xp penalties for having barbarian and wizard so many levels apart.
right again, but no one actually enforces multiclass xp because they are awful.


I would also second the warforged juggernaut prc. It may require you to go Adamantine Body, but it's got some really great class abilities for being a melee monster.
wfj is great, but OP tragically doesn't like it for some reason.

Theodred theOld, your objection of worrying about the ACP doesn't actually add up. if you're planning to be a brute, your strength will be good enough on its own to offset the meagre -4 you get from adamantine body. since you don't care about skills at all, you can max out jump and invest in maybe some items, or dip/splash warblade to nab leaping dragon stance or buy some boots of striding and springing or whatever.

all wfjs use leap attack (being uberchargers), so they're not at all incapable of it.


Don't forget to pick up twilight as an enchantment on your body to lower your arcane failure chance. Because that's going to be a thing for you. If you don't go warforged juggernaut, you could bring arcane failure down in other ways too: The Spellsword prestige class would offer some helpful reduction to arcane failure percentage, And I'm pretty sure there are some feats that also let you bring down arcane failure percentage (I just don't remember their names off hand. But that's what feat indexes are for).
adamantine gives 35%. it's a poor idea to go with arcane without a way to ignore ASF entirely. thistledown feycraft etc is possible but in practical play it's unlikely for a DM to allow.


But seriously: going cleric is going to result in two annoying things- you'll have to pray to a god for your spells and you will need to act in according to that faith. And your party members are probably going to expect you to share those healing spells. Unless they happen to also be running warforged, they won't expect you to share repair spells (even as a wizard).

he will have to do neither of those things because if he's rolling warforged, he's presumably playing in an eberron game. gods don't actually exist in eberron, so you just get spells through the placebo effect. regardless of setting, clerics don't have a code of conduct, so they can't just sudenly fall like pallies.

if his party members get grabby with his lesser vigor, he can just carry a wand. one of the many things a cloistered cleric dip is good for.

[Theodred theOld]

I want nothing to do with traditional healing or vigor. That's what our cleric is for. While I recognize that sorcerer is perhaps suboptimal in terms of ability scores, it hits the mark in terms of spells/day. I also like the idea of using cantrips as built in features of a robot.

[marphod]

he will have to do neither of those things because if he's rolling warforged, he's presumably playing in an eberron game. gods don't actually exist in eberron, so you just get spells through the placebo effect. regardless of setting, clerics don't have a code of conduct, so they can't just sudenly fall like pallies.

*blink* Do you have a source for that? That's news to me.

(Stupid Abjurant Champion requiring Arcane spells. Lest I'd suggest Artificer for a single level dip for a warforged.)

If you're worried about the ACP, and are only getting a handful of arcane caster levels, rods of Still Spell are your friend.

Seriously, though. Warforged Juggernaught. You give up consumable magic items (sorta) for amazing charge abilities, All the immunities you could ever want, d12 hit dice, full BAB, and it blends well with shock trooper. What more could you want for an ubercharger?

At 8th level, your Strength is going to be at least 20 (16+2 levels +2 item). You max out Jump to 11 ranks. Pick up a Docent boots of Striding and Springing putting your move back at 30. That's a +16 to jump. Pick up the Leaping martial Stance or the feat that lets you take 10 on jump checks, and you'll be doing fine. Plus, there's the insanity of finding a way to research Enlarge Construct or cast Alter Self.

[Venger]

*blink* Do you have a source for that? That's news to me.

The first words of the first section of the intro to "faiths of eberron," the splat dealing with religion in eberron:


The gods of Eberron do not actively involve themselves in
the world as gods of other settings do. They are distant—if they exist at all. A commune spell contacts outsiders such as angels, not the gods themselves. Clerics gain their spells from their own faith, not from divine intervention.


(Stupid Abjurant Champion requiring Arcane spells. Lest I'd suggest Artificer for a single level dip for a warforged.)
You know what allows infusions to get you in? Spellcarved soldier. check that class out if you're interested in "spells as built-in features of a robot" since that's what its basic schtick is. plus it's full ba and has very good chassis/features.


Seriously, though. Warforged Juggernaught. You give up consumable magic items (sorta) for amazing charge abilities, All the immunities you could ever want, d12 hit dice, full BAB, and it blends well with shock trooper. What more could you want for an ubercharger?
no one ever uses potions anyway. just use scrolls/wands like a normal person. wfj is not full ba. it's average.


At 8th level, your Strength is going to be at least 20 (16+2 levels +2 item). You max out Jump to 11 ranks. Pick up a Docent boots of Striding and Springing putting your move back at 30. That's a +16 to jump. Pick up the Leaping martial Stance or the feat that lets you take 10 on jump checks, and you'll be doing fine. Plus, there's the insanity of finding a way to research Enlarge Construct or cast Alter Self.

yeah, like I said, you'll be able to jump great. ACP won't hinder you at all.

what feat lets you take 10 on jump checks?

[Troacctid]

If you specifically don't want Vigor for whatever reason, you could go Urban Druid and get spontaneous Repair Light Damage as a divine spell, so no arcane spell failure. Also a bigger HD and an urban companion and stuff. Or go regular Druid—the Spontaneous Healing variant works normally on Warforged and even hits an AoE.

[Sagetim]

I want nothing to do with traditional healing or vigor. That's what our cleric is for. While I recognize that sorcerer is perhaps suboptimal in terms of ability scores, it hits the mark in terms of spells/day. I also like the idea of using cantrips as built in features of a robot.

Sorcerer does have better spells per day, there's not really getting around that without using magic items. Now, you might wonder what I mean by that: Pearls of Power. They might get a bit costly for 2nd and 3rd level spells (which would be about the limit of what you would get by the end of your leveling career anyway). But first level pearls of power are cheap.

A pearl of power lets you restore a spell you have cast as a standard action. So while it's not perfect for an action economy where you need to spam spells out as fast as possible...I'm under the impression that you wouldn't want to be in that kind of situation anyway. So how do we make some pearls of power more useful to a wizard than a sorcerer? Well, first off, the wizard could prep a different spell in each slot, then after they've expended it return that spell with a pearl of power. The sorcerer could do much the same, but there's a key difference: The wizard's spellbook could allow them to prep different spells in all of their slots every single day. With 1 level in sorcerer, you never get enough sorcerer levels to replace any of your spells. Ever. So if you mess up your sorcerer spells known, you have no built in means of correcting. If it turns out that magic missile, or shield, or repair light damage just aren't as useful as you thought, you can't replace any of them as a sorcerer.

But if you have like, two or three pearls of power, you can spam the spell you use repeatedly about as often as a sorcerer would have been able to cast them, and still have your other spells ready to go. Admittedly, a sorcerer could use pearls of power to get spell slots back too, I just think they are of a greater benefit to the utility factor of a wizard.

I think the main downside for you is that you won't get unlimited cantrips, because that's a pathfinder thing instead of a 3.5 thing. And there's no way to get more cantrips per day in 3.5 that I can think of.

I haven't looked spellcarved soldier over in a long time (and it's too late to do so right now) but as I recall it's a pretty solid class.

Also of note: Warforged are not Ebberon exclusive, they were printed up in one of the monster manuals (3?) and thus can potentially show up in any setting. Ebberon is the only printed campaign setting that I'm aware of that has them included and accounted for in it's rules and history and so on though.

[Venger]

Sorcerer does have better spells per day, there's not really getting around that without using magic items. Now, you might wonder what I mean by that: Pearls of Power. They might get a bit costly for 2nd and 3rd level spells (which would be about the limit of what you would get by the end of your leveling career anyway). But first level pearls of power are cheap.

A pearl of power lets you restore a spell you have cast as a standard action. So while it's not perfect for an action economy where you need to spam spells out as fast as possible...I'm under the impression that you wouldn't want to be in that kind of situation anyway. So how do we make some pearls of power more useful to a wizard than a sorcerer? Well, first off, the wizard could prep a different spell in each slot, then after they've expended it return that spell with a pearl of power. The sorcerer could do much the same, but there's a key difference: The wizard's spellbook could allow them to prep different spells in all of their slots every single day. With 1 level in sorcerer, you never get enough sorcerer levels to replace any of your spells. Ever. So if you mess up your sorcerer spells known, you have no built in means of correcting. If it turns out that magic missile, or shield, or repair light damage just aren't as useful as you thought, you can't replace any of them as a sorcerer.

But if you have like, two or three pearls of power, you can spam the spell you use repeatedly about as often as a sorcerer would have been able to cast them, and still have your other spells ready to go. Admittedly, a sorcerer could use pearls of power to get spell slots back too, I just think they are of a greater benefit to the utility factor of a wizard.

All true, but due to the cha hit you're taking from rolling wf, you'd be better off with wizard re: spells per day, especially if you use pearls of power.


I haven't looked spellcarved soldier over in a long time (and it's too late to do so right now) but as I recall it's a pretty solid class.
it's a wonderful class. it's in races of eberron.


Also of note: Warforged are not Ebberon exclusive, they were printed up in one of the monster manuals (3?) and thus can potentially show up in any setting. Ebberon is the only printed campaign setting that I'm aware of that has them included and accounted for in it's rules and history and so on though.
warforged are eberron exclusive. they were reprinted in mm3 after their initial printing in the eberron campaign setting, same as changeling and other eberron monsters. you certainly could use them in any setting since they're so awesome, but none of the published fluff has warforged outside of eberron, and porting them to FR would take a little work since their history is so solidly tied to the great war, moreso than anything else in eberron.

[Elycium]

Building a warforged killing machine. So far I have sorc 1/ fighter 2/ lion spirit totem barbarian 5. Feat are mithral body, power attack, leap attack, improved init. and extra rage. The sorcerer level allows for self-repair , wand usage and possible abjurant champ levels later and fighter is obvious. Anything I may have overlooked or neglected?

If you are going for a killing charger, I would suggest that you change extra rage for Improved bullrush and then Shoock Trooper when you get the chance. Pretty effective stuff if you combine it with power attack and leap attack.


On an not so related note, I was wondering... guys there is a way to get a Large warforged?

[torrasque666]

If you are going for a killing charger, I would suggest that you change extra rage for Improved bullrush and then Shoock Trooper when you get the chance. Pretty effective stuff if you combine it with power attack and leap attack.


On an not so related note, I was wondering... guys there is a way to get a Large warforged?
My favorite way is a Phylactory of Change from the Arms and Equipment guide. 1/day Polymorph with an indefinite duration (so you can change forms 1/day or just sit in a form forever) and take a Warforged Charger. Note: If you can start out at a high enough level to have afforded this, drop your physical stats since you'll get those replaced.

[marphod]

The first words of the first section of the intro to "faiths of eberron," the splat dealing with religion in eberron:

There's a bit of a different twist on faith from 'May not exist, get power from faith' (and thus from the intervention of lower powers or planes) and 'placebo effect'.




You know what allows infusions to get you in? Spellcarved soldier. check that class out if you're interested in "spells as built-in features of a robot" since that's what its basic schtick is. plus it's full ba and has very good chassis/features.


I forgotted. It is an awesome class.

It does require Silver Tracery, though, which is far from ideal, and doesn't advance casting.

(OTOH, the 4th level ability? Equivalent to 2 Epic Level Feats. The 5th level is probably a pass, though.)



no one ever uses potions anyway. just use scrolls/wands like a normal person. wfj is not full ba. it's average.

*blink* You right. it has medium BAB. Why on earth does it have medium BAB?

---

No one ever WANTS to use potions. At low level, you may not have options. At high level, you might find some.



what feat lets you take 10 on jump checks?


I think I keep confusing Leap of the Heavens (PHB2), which stops the doubling of DCs from a standing jump, with taking 10. In many cases, they are effectively equivalent.
(Martial Stance: Leaping Dragon Stance (Tiger Claw). Also does the same.)

(My current Thursday-night game's PC has take 10 from a class, and Leap of the Heavens, and I keep screwing up which effect is from which.)

[LooseCannoneer]

Shaper Psion will give you a wider variety in healing options with Psionic Repair Damage.

Aren't you at all worried about multiclassing xp penalties?

[emeraldstreak]

mad foam rager is always good

add iron hear surge for even more fun

[Venger]

There's a bit of a different twist on faith from 'May not exist, get power from faith' (and thus from the intervention of lower powers or planes) and 'placebo effect'.
You say potato...

fair enough. I just meant "the existence of the gods is ambiguous and not 100% factually true, like on oerth"



I forgotted. It is an awesome class.

It does require Silver Tracery, though, which is far from ideal, and doesn't advance casting.

(OTOH, the 4th level ability? Equivalent to 2 Epic Level Feats. The 5th level is probably a pass, though.)
Yah. Well, it's a pretty good trade for that 4th level. just don't take all 5 levels.


*blink* You right. it has medium BAB. Why on earth does it have medium BAB?
yyyyyyeah. because melee can't have things.



No one ever WANTS to use potions. At low level, you may not have options. At high level, you might find some.
they are pretty common as vendor trash if you use an online treasure generator, so that's a fair point. it'd be kind of a jerk move for your dm to go out of his way to give you stuff you can't use if he's doing it by hand. if you have any choice, scrolls or oils are probably a better option, especially if you do go with a cloistered cleric dip.



I think I keep confusing Leap of the Heavens (PHB2), which stops the doubling of DCs from a standing jump, with taking 10. In many cases, they are effectively equivalent.
(Martial Stance: Leaping Dragon Stance (Tiger Claw). Also does the same.)
That's what I figured happened, but I didn't want to be presumptuous.


(My current Thursday-night game's PC has take 10 from a class, and Leap of the Heavens, and I keep screwing up which effect is from which.)
oh, ok. is he a ninja spy or a thief-acrobat or something?


Shaper Psion will give you a wider variety in healing options with Psionic Repair Damage.

Aren't you at all worried about multiclassing xp penalties?
no one actually uses multiclassing, so it's possible his group just ignores them.

[torrasque666]

*blink* You right. it has medium BAB. Why on earth does it have medium BAB?
yyyyyyeah. because melee can't have things.


Probably because the whole thing of the class it's becoming more construct-like and constructs have medium BAB.

[Ferronach]

You could always skip the sorc levels for Paladin (to Lord of Blades - the WF demigod dude).
A paladin's lay on hands bypasses the WF anti-heal deal iirc.
I also seem to recal an ACF for wf paladins that gives repair instead of lay on hands or some such nonsense.

AFB right now sadly...

[Venger]

You could always skip the sorc levels for Paladin (to Lord of Blades - the WF demigod dude).
A paladin's lay on hands bypasses the WF anti-heal deal iirc.
I also seem to recal an ACF for wf paladins that gives repair instead of lay on hands or some such nonsense.

AFB right now sadly...

only spells from the (healing) subschool deal half healing to warforged, so vanilla lay on hands works on you normally.

alone, its repair damage ability is straight-up worse than normal, so there's no reason to take it.

it's not an acf, but a racial substitution level. it's the second level of warforged paladin.

the reason it's worth considering is if you dumped cha (since you have a racial penalty to it) it lets you swap divine grace for con to will saves, which is pretty great, so it's a good trade overall since your lay on hands is mostly for you.

[Ferronach]

only spells from the (healing) subschool deal half healing to warforged, so vanilla lay on hands works on you normally.

alone, its repair damage ability is straight-up worse than normal, so there's no reason to take it.

it's not an acf, but a racial substitution level. it's the second level of warforged paladin.

the reason it's worth considering is if you dumped cha (since you have a racial penalty to it) it lets you swap divine grace for con to will saves, which is pretty great, so it's a good trade overall since your lay on hands is mostly for you.

Thanks ;) I hate being away from book and only remembering parts of things.