General Anime/Manga Discussion 14: Second Cour [Archive] - Page 2

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Fri

2015-10-13, 06:37 PM

But yeah, Madoka's selling point isn't actually "it's tragic."

I was really hyped when I first heard about it because of two things.

1.The soundtrack was by Kaijura Yuki, which is my favourite anime composer ever.
2.It's by Shaft, which is the studio with my favourite style ever.

Some people were also hyped because it's written by Urobutchi, who by at that point was still famous as the upcoming writer and his name was not treated like how people treat Michael Bay or Shyamalan these days.

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-13, 10:43 PM

But yeah, Madoka's selling point isn't actually "it's tragic."

Those are the "selling points" people have used to describe it to me every time, that they cried, that it was emotional, that it was kind of emotionally intense at times.

I suffer from depression, so no I'm not going to watch an anime just to be able to say I watched it. I value my own mental health over anime street cred.

To poke at the other half of the conversation, I personally don't care much about art style in something so long as it doesn't distract me or make it hard to tell what's going one.

Fri

2015-10-14, 01:53 AM

Those are the "selling points" people have used to describe it to me every time, that they cried, that it was emotional, that it was kind of emotionally intense at times.

I know, and in my opinion, they're missing the point. Here's a big spoiler (though the spoiler that makes another of my friend with the same problem with you watch it, and almost made my friend didn't watch it at all. Basically because everything she heard made her think it's a pointless tragedy manga, while it's actually not.).

It doesn't actually end in a tragedy. Sure, it doesn't exactly end in a big happily ever after ending, but it's more a bittersweet happy ending. Some people say the ending is tragic, but in my opinion they miss a big point of the ending. And actually, how it actually end in a somewhat uplifting note ruined the series for at least one person who wishes for it to end in a big tragedy. And also, this is the biggest complain about the movies, it completely ruined the theme of the series by making the ending tragic to give it sequel hook basically

VariSami

2015-10-14, 03:38 AM

Decided to give Concrete Revolutio another chance. At the beginning of the episode I was still quite cynical but the rest alleviated my doubt somewhat. I will probably see this one to the end, just to witness whether it can be pulled off successfully or if it fades to utter mediocrity.

The one-two-punch of Kikko and Fuurouta in a world full of less... naive designs was probably the biggest turn-off for me when I wrote the last message. Having witnessed one episode which was almost Samurai Flamenco at its lowest in terms of the milieu, the preview with a certain ghost kid just misled me to think the rest of the show would follow in a similar vein.

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-14, 04:07 AM

:smallsigh:

I don't really think it's a pointless tragedy thing, but I have made the judgement that I personally am not in a place where I can or should watch it. That's it really, this is not something I am willing to budge on since mental health>watching an anime, doesn't matter how good the anime is.

So now I'm going to wibble about the thing I'm currently watching from the nice list you all helped put together!

It was pretty refreshing in Hanayama when Hana said 'You're probably gaining weight from all the work we've been doing because muscles!" It's still very pretty, though it got a bit dramatic for the most recent one (after their first try at putting on a show).

Also kind of fun picking out things in it that are similar to K-on. I realized that the genre is in a way newish to me. I think other than Hikaru no Go and more recently Sound Euphonium I've not seen much of this sort of school based slice of life club thing (and well Hikaru no Go doesn't really counts does it?) Even being able to pick out what I guess are tropes, it's a pretty fun type of anime. I look forward to the one at the all boys school, both to see how it'll differ and to see if it'll share similarities with the ones featuring girls all over.

DoctorFaust

2015-10-14, 04:18 AM

That's it really, this is not something I am willing to budge on since mental health>watching an anime, doesn't matter how good the anime is.

As someone who also suffers from depression, bah, I say! Bah! :smalltongue:

I look forward to the one at the all boys school, both to see how it'll differ and to see if it'll share similarities with the ones featuring girls all over.

Since I can't remember entirely what all is on the list, are you talking about Nichibros? Because if not, you should totally watch Nichibros.

Fri

2015-10-14, 04:19 AM

There's actually some sort of K-On parody in the Daily Lives of Highschool Boys :smallbiggrin:

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-14, 02:51 PM

As someone who also suffers from depression, bah, I say! Bah! :smalltongue:

At least my "problem" isn't nearly as bad as it used to be, maybe someday I will feel comfortable watching it. :3

Since I can't remember entirely what all is on the list, are you talking about Nichibros? Because if not, you should totally watch Nichibros.

I had to dig up the list, and the boy focused slice of life school anime thing is Daily Lives of Highschool Boys

But I can also add Nichibros to it.

I guess for those curious here's what all is left on the list, and roughly the order that I received/added them.

Read or Die
Bodacious Space Pirates
Spice & Wolf
Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya
Love, Chuunbiyo & Other Delusions
Durarara!!
Time of Eve
Full Metal Alchemist
Kekkai Sensen
Haibane Remei
Minami-ke
Daily Lives of Highschool Boys
Nichibros

This isn't exactly the order we'll go in, we've skipped around a little bit. I usually find out if they are legally streamable just before we watch one, and also give the wiki page a quick skim if I haven't heard anything about it.

Lethologica

2015-10-14, 02:57 PM

I think other than Hikaru no Go and more recently Sound Euphonium I've not seen much of this sort of school based slice of life club thing (and well Hikaru no Go doesn't really counts does it?)
Hikaru no Go counts as whatever it wants to be, because it's Hikaru no Go.

http://images5.fanpop.com/image/photos/25800000/Hikaru-No-Go-hikaru-no-go-25831255-549-411.jpg

Closet_Skeleton

2015-10-14, 03:27 PM

Hikaru no Go is a hobby manga with enough sports elements that I just think of it as a sports manga.

Kato

2015-10-14, 03:55 PM

9So... I guess it's kind of early but any thoughts on Ironblooded Orphans yet?

I guess by now I've seen too many shows... Orga and Mika somewhat remind me of Simon and Kamina, though I guess Mika doing more of the work makes him more Eren's Mikasa...

Princess is... well, Relena with a dash of Laxus and a bit of whatshername from that other popular mecha last year... you know, the one with the super smart main. Gosh, I've already forgotten about anything about that show. But yeah, I really don't expect much from her yet, but this means she can mostly surprise me in a positive way.

Otherwise... I think it's actually kind of decent so far. Things look nice enough, yeah, it's AGAIN Mars vs Earth (seriously, you could think mecha writers think there already is a colony on mars or something) and we didn't get a lot of action yet but... eh, I'm curious enough.

Fri

2015-10-14, 04:30 PM

But I can also add Nichibros to it.

Nichibros is fan nickname of daily live of highschool boys :smalltongue:

Because there's a slice of life anime titled nichijou (which roughly mean daily life) so daily life of highschool boys is nichibros.

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-14, 04:45 PM

Nichibros is fan nickname of daily live of highschool boys :smalltongue:

Because there's a slice of life anime titled nichijou (which roughly mean daily life) so daily life of highschool boys is nichibros.

Ahhh ok, well thanks for letting me know! I won't have to come back later and be like "Guys? what the heck I can't even find this "nichibros" thing"

Lethologica

2015-10-14, 05:10 PM

Ahhh ok, well thanks for letting me know! I won't have to come back later and be like "Guys? what the heck I can't even find this "nichibros" thing"
Nichijou is also to be recommended, FWIW.

Hiro Protagonest

2015-10-14, 05:14 PM

Nichijou is also to be recommended, FWIW.

I am procrastinating on that.

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-14, 05:41 PM

ex cathedra

2015-10-14, 05:55 PM

i'd say that sports anime are typically most similar to shonen and action anime with sports substituted instead of, y'know, fighting or whatever else is used to convey action.

Lethologica

2015-10-14, 07:09 PM

Every sports anime plot ever: Unlikely but talented protagonist joins underdog team, they resolve to win a championship through the power of friendship, they discover their sports superpowers while fighting a bunch of other teams with their own superpowers, they lose the fall championship, this setback only makes them stronger, they go to the spring championship and are now friends with everyone they faced in the fall, the team that won the fall championship loses in a shocking upset to a new final boss team with ties to the protagonist's past, protagonist's team wins spring championship.

As far as good sports anime for people new to the genre, I've recommended Ping Pong The Animation before, and I'm going to recommend it again, because it's both excellent and short.

Hikaru no Go could have been a sports anime--Hikaru is a lot like a sports anime protagonist--but it's (a) obsessed with depicting Go in a realistic way and (b) ultimately a ghost story, both of which are good things IMO.

Hiro Protagonest

2015-10-14, 08:57 PM

Baby Steps seems like a pretty typical sports anime (in my completely inexperienced eyes, having never watched/read another sports anime/manga), but it's more slice-of-life. In fact, my main complaint with it is that the tennis matches take too long, they're getting in the way of the slice-of-life! >_> I don't think it's really shounen (except for that one match with Ide, and in that case the roles were reversed and the MC was the smart technical one).

HMS Invincible

2015-10-14, 09:30 PM

Lethologica

2015-10-15, 12:45 AM

Lol,I like how every sports anime sounds suspiciously like kuroko basketball. Try one outs. It's a baseball anime, but with an antihero protagonist.
I don't know if that's supposed to be a dig at my experience with sports anime, but KnB is far from the only source I'm working with. (One Outs is on my plan-to-watch, though.)

Sallera

2015-10-15, 04:46 AM

*scratches out "bros" and writes in "jou"*

I think Hikaru no Go is probably the closest thing to a sport anime I've watched.

Are sports anime like a subset of slice of life in most cases? Or are they usually more focused on the sport? ...Or does it depend on the anime. I've never really looked at them before cause I'm not that into watching sports...unless there are some for the more martial ones (fencing/kendo/archery/tankery apparently)

Lethologica's summary is pretty accurate. I don't like sports stories either, and as such, I'd also recommend Ping Pong if you want to see what a less tanky one looks like, as it's absolutely brilliant despite being a sports story rather than because of it.

Closet_Skeleton

2015-10-15, 05:14 AM

I've never really looked at them before cause I'm not that into watching sports...unless there are some for the more martial ones (fencing/kendo/archery/tankery apparently)

Bamboo Blade is a fun kendo anime. Very much a sports anime rather than a action series despite having lots of fencing and the heroine's skills being improbable. Most fencing anime on the other hand are action series with too much fighting outside of competitions and competitions that are implausibly like gladiatorial matches.

Hajime no Ippo is probably the best combat sports (boxing) series, but is super super long.

Hikaru no Go could have been a sports anime--Hikaru is a lot like a sports anime protagonist--but it's (a) obsessed with depicting Go in a realistic way and (b) ultimately a ghost story, both of which are good things IMO.

Plenty of sports anime are as realistic as Hikago. Abilities that are effectively super powers aren't necessary for the genre at all.
the ghost thing isn't that important to the end of the series, so its not 'ultimately' a ghost story in any way.

I don't think it's really shounen (except for that one match with Ide, and in that case the roles were reversed and the MC was the smart technical one).

Its in a shonen magazine, there's no other sensible definition of shonen. Manga don't really have demographics, the publications they're contained in do. This isn't a practical difference most of the time but is why using shonen as a genre in any sense is unhelpful.

kamikasei

2015-10-15, 05:30 AM

I think Hikaru no Go is probably the closest thing to a sport anime I've watched.
What, not Girls und Panzer? :P

By the way, I forget whether it was mentioned before, but looking at that list I note that Time of Eve is shorter than anything else - just six 20-30 minute episodes. You could fit it in to a "movie" timeslot rather than having to watch it as a series, if necessary (indeed, IIRC there is a movie-length edit available). Just something that may be relevant to deciding when to watch it.

Lethologica

2015-10-15, 01:34 PM

Plenty of sports anime are as realistic as Hikago. Abilities that are effectively super powers aren't necessary for the genre at all.
the ghost thing isn't that important to the end of the series, so its not 'ultimately' a ghost story in any way.
I don't mean the superpowers or lack thereof. Captain Tsubasa doesn't have superpowers and is a quintessential sports anime. But Hikaru no Go is a lot more interested in depicting all the ways Go is played in modern society than in the outcome of any particular competition (though it does take a break from that to zero in on the pro exam). The overall focus is different.

Huh? The anime is definitely a ghost story. That's why it ends when Hikaru comes to terms with Sai's disappearance and returns to the game, with the Hokuto Cup qualifiers as an afterthought that isn't even part of the series proper. The manga keeps things going a while longer with the Hokuto Cup as the climax, and I honestly think that was a mistake, but an argument can be made that it isn't really a ghost story.

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-15, 02:10 PM

What, not Girls und Panzer? :P

By the way, I forget whether it was mentioned before, but looking at that list I note that Time of Eve is shorter than anything else - just six 20-30 minute episodes. You could fit it in to a "movie" timeslot rather than having to watch it as a series, if necessary (indeed, IIRC there is a movie-length edit available). Just something that may be relevant to deciding when to watch it.

I kind of referenced it later though not directly, the guy said the same that Girls und Panzer was definitely probably a sports anime too when I was talking to him about the conversation here.

I don't think it's necessarily bad if sports anime tend to follow a similar pattern, it sounds like the easiest way to generate drama/story within the framework of sports. And it's kind of the same pattern for just about every American movie about sports other than like...The Sandlot.

I'll mark Time of Eve as movie sized if mashed together, we could watch it over the weekend sometime for a chance of pace.

I feel Hikaru no Go could be qualified as a ghost story, though not a typical one. I can't remember very much of it because I watched it quite a long time ago, but it was as much about the MC's interactions with the Ghost as the learning to play Go and becoming quite good at it independent of his Go master ghost friend right? It can certainly be both a ghost story and a sports/club anime.

In a way Hikaru no Go felt more earth compared to most anime for the most part to me, and that's kind of funny.

Closet_Skeleton

2015-10-17, 10:10 AM

Huh? The anime is definitely a ghost story. That's why it ends when Hikaru comes to terms with Sai's disappearance and returns to the game, with the Hokuto Cup qualifiers as an afterthought that isn't even part of the series proper. The manga keeps things going a while longer with the Hokuto Cup as the climax, and I honestly think that was a mistake, but an argument can be made that it isn't really a ghost story.

The extra episodes/specials finish most of the manga plot, so I don't count the end of the initial broadcast as the end of the anime.

I was merely taking issue with the word 'ultimate', not that it was a ghost story. I don't think the core of Hikaru no Go is the ghost story. Like most sports manga, its ultimately about growing up. The ghost is just one of the important characters.

If someone asked me 'recommend me a ghost story' I wouldn't immediately jump to think of Hikaru no Go. If someone asked for sports or growing up stories I might.

Fri

2015-10-17, 04:32 PM

Oh god, third episode of young black jack. Those two anti-war activist are the worst people ever, and that's not even hyperbole, that if the series doesn't make vietnam war proponents shoot puppies in the next couple of episodes, I'll accuse this series to be biased toward the government.

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-17, 09:19 PM

We finished Hanayamata the other day, and got started on Read or Die tonight.

And things sure did escalate quickly, which is good cause it was kind of a dull start.

DoctorFaust

2015-10-21, 02:55 PM

Damn. Iron-blooded Orphans got real fast. :smalleek:

GloatingSwine

2015-10-21, 03:34 PM

DoctorFaust

2015-10-21, 05:11 PM

Oh yeah. I mean it started out with its flag seriously planted in the Serious Business camp, and the signs are pretty clear that Mikazuki is a broken shell of a human being who other psychopaths would ask to steady on a bit..

I'm totally with you there. I just wasn't expecting it to get quite this dark.
Ari-*bang* (http://i.imgur.com/5X5uGey.jpg)
I will say, though, I'm really appreciating the attention to detail in the guns.

GloatingSwine

2015-10-22, 06:03 PM

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-22, 06:28 PM

While I was mildly skeptical of R.O.D the TV, I'm really enjoying it now, we watched episode 4 last night.

I especially like how it sometimes juxtaposes weird and sometimes crazy behavior with more "normal" seeming reactions.

Like when Anita does a spit take, and someone off screen doesn't let it pass without a "That's disgusting!"

I am starting to feel a bit antsy with it though even if I'm enjoying it. I suspect the plot might pick up in the next episode or two, or I hope it does anyway.

Yael

2015-10-23, 10:18 AM

Anyone with JoJo's Bizarre Adventure? I'm currently reading Part IV - Diamond is Unbreakable, and the first three parts are just too good.Thought I fear Old Jotaro being another Speedwagon, just as Joseph did :smallfrown:

kamikasei

2015-10-24, 08:57 AM

New Full Metal Panic! anime. (http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2015/10/24/new-full-metal-panic-anime-announced)
Jojo's Bizarre Adventure Part 4: Diamond is Unbreakable confirmed. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrTaVV0Hkng)

Welp.

Kato

2015-10-24, 12:11 PM

Well yeah, but the series has gone three episodes and we've already had child soldiers treated with contempt by their commanders and then sacrificed to allow said commanders to flee the battle.

This is not a happy little war...

Most wars are not happy. And Gundam has most often been a show depicting this well. But here... yeah, even without using the gore some other shows seem to feel is required they make a very good point about what happens when you force kids to be soldiers. I guess here and there the jokes clash a bit with the serious tone, but overall... whelp, that might turn out to be the darkest Gundam we've seen so far.

kamikasei

2015-10-24, 01:27 PM

And in other new show news (http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2015/10/24-1/sekk-boys-cast-broadcast-schedule-announced): the story of a quartet of classical statues trying to become idols. As in, they're inanimate marble statues. As in, they want to sing and dance. And they're surprisingly well-voiced.

This has been a weird day.

Fri

2015-10-25, 12:05 AM

The author must've been plastered when he wrote that

kamikasei

2015-10-27, 08:18 AM

The author must've been plastered when he wrote that
:smallannoyed:

So I binged my way through the Yamada-kun and the Seven Witches manga, up to the current chapter (179).
Sort of a mixed bag. My main impression is that Shiraishi got sidelined hard once they were officially a couple. Given that several new characters with a thing for Yamada were then introduced, I get the impression the artist wasn't happy to write a successful relationship and wanted to contrive reasons to keep writing awkward kids being terrible at flirting with each other. That kind of character stasis usually puts me off comedies, so I hope the manga overcomes it. It's nice that Yamada's been consistently faithful to Shiraishi rather than being a generic harem protagonist, but I actually like her character and would like to see more of her. And this isn't just because she was let down that he didn't use the Dominate power to give her any weird orders...

The other major issue I have with it is that the rules for the witches, and especially the seventh witch, have become vague enough that at this point it's basically just "strap in and go with the flow". Memory manipulation and memory erasure and some kind of automatic-forgetting field, and apparently an ability to wipe the whole school's memories, and all the bonus stuff with witch detection and tracking and... and two parallel groups of witches with only one (apparently) known to the student council, which undermines the idea that it's super important for them to have the witches under control... and I'm not sure they established at any point whether the time-travel ability affected the memories of the people it's used on, so that e.g. Shiraishi remembers Yamada appearing out of nowhere and disappearing after kissing her that one time, which is something you'd think it'd be important to confirm...

And yet for all its issues I'm still enjoying reading it. It's got heart, I guess. Heart and fanservice. Those can go a long way.

Let's just have more Shiraishi, and more Ito and Tsuaki too. And less Noa.

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-28, 01:24 AM

VariSami

2015-10-28, 04:38 AM

Okay. These are my guesses and I promise I have not read any of the source material so I am working with the first three episodes only. But I am currently going to have to say Dr Makata Shiki (13 years old) was pregnant when she was imprisoned and designed the system so that her child would have a chance to escape when ready. The ending of the episode hints at her losing her virginity, and the previous episode was pretty explicit about her trying to seduce the old man. As convoluted as this would be, it would explain how someone other than Dr Shiki could have been in the room to cut off her arms and legs despite the door not having been traversed by anyone.

On a more obvious note, whoever was in there came out with the doctor using the same platform but hiding underneath the gown. Everyone seems to be focusing on how strange the gown is but I would imagine such an obvious twist will be revealed by next episode. Likely it will also lead them to consider how small the person would have to be. A 15-year old would do well.

Besides the things mentioned above, there is also all that talk about Nishinosono's parents and Dr Makata having murdered hers. I think succession and parenthood are going to be major themes, and this would fit in with that. I have no idea how Shiki's younger sister and the male lead fit into all this, though. Unless the latter is simply an observer who is going to expose things without having been involved.

Rodin

2015-10-28, 05:47 AM

Please tell me this anime isn't about to go all Evangelion on me, between the sephirothic tables, the talk of ego, and remaking/saving the world I'm getting suspicious. (I think we're on episode 10? Where they go back to Hong Kong, and then the book collecting people kidnap Nenene)

A little bit. I remember the ultimate plan being mind-screwy enough that I didn't really like it as a plot driver, and weird enough that I don't actually remember what the overall plan was. However, it's definitely nowhere near as crazy as Eva, however, and from that description you're about to get into a fantastic set of episodes.

cobaltstarfire

2015-10-28, 01:50 PM

A little bit. I remember the ultimate plan being mind-screwy enough that I didn't really like it as a plot driver, and weird enough that I don't actually remember what the overall plan was. However, it's definitely nowhere near as crazy as Eva, however, and from that description you're about to get into a fantastic set of episodes.

That's good to know, Eva is something I should have never ever ever watched.

I guess it was just a popular thing back then, they're from about the same time.

On occasion I get some very old CLAMP like feels from ROD and I really like that, especially when Maggie is doing something with her familiars. I really love the familiar designs in general too. I don't like CLAMPS new stuff as much, so getting a bit of it from ROD is nice.

DoctorFaust

2015-10-29, 12:43 PM

Eeee! New Macross! (https://i.imgur.com/OTzWXUK.jpg)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUYSOueT554

Time for more love triangles, missile spam, and (hopefully) good J-Pop!

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-10-29, 12:59 PM

The author must've been plastered when he wrote that
I'd argue more for "stoned", myself.

Fri

2015-10-29, 01:01 PM

Eeee! New Macross! (https://i.imgur.com/OTzWXUK.jpg)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUYSOueT554

Time for more love triangles, missile spam, and (hopefully) good J-Pop!

*look at signature*

I might be into that.

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-10-29, 04:30 PM

kamikasei

2015-10-31, 12:56 PM

/Fanfare, drumroll (http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2015/10/31-1/sound-euphonium-theatrical-film-sequel-series-announced)

Closet_Skeleton

2015-11-02, 02:23 PM

I guess it was just a popular thing back then, they're from about the same time.

Not especially the same time. One is 1995-6 and the other is 2003-4.

The second half of Read or Die tv doesn't make much sense without the OVA but that's more in character back-stories than in actual plot, which more or less makes sense from a narrative point of view (the villain's actual plan is a little over-complicated but the plot is pretty much just 'stop the villain's plan').

In both cases any confusing elements are basically just noise that isn't that important to the real story structure which is mostly just character development.

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-02, 04:29 PM

Really? For some reason I thought Eva was younger than that, interesting.

I don't think the second half of the anime is that hard to follow, it's given us quite a few story dumps, and it's pretty much constantly giving little hints with dialogue and how people react to things. (we're to just after the giant paper airplane).

I'm guessing the story dump episodes with footage about the great men was from the OVA?

ex cathedra

2015-11-02, 06:13 PM

Also, didn't somebody do a "Let's Read Muv-Luv" a while back? They're Kickstarting an official translation now (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/muvluv/muv-luv-a-pretty-sweet-visual-novel-series?ref=%5Bfb1%5D)
first grisaia and clannad, now muv-luv? what a time to be alive.

/Fanfare, drumroll (http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2015/10/31-1/sound-euphonium-theatrical-film-sequel-series-announced)
that's pretty stellar but i'm concerned that if the show continues kumiko x reina won't be canon.

mallorean_thug

2015-11-02, 06:33 PM

that's pretty stellar but i'm concerned that if the show continues kumiko x reina won't be canon.

Here's a translated interview you might be interested in: https://ultimatemegax.wordpress.com/2015/09/27/sound-euphonium-roundtable-director-tatsuya-ishihara-series-director-naoko-yamada-author-ayano-takeda (https://ultimatemegax.wordpress.com/2015/09/27/sound-euphonium-roundtable-director-tatsuya-ishihara-series-director-naoko-yamada-author-ayano-takeda/)/

DoctorFaust

2015-11-02, 07:16 PM

that's pretty stellar but i'm concerned that if the show continues kumiko x reina won't be canon.

I can't say this with one hundred percent certainty, so do please take it with a grain of salt, but I do recall hearing from someone that has actually read the LNs that Kumiko does eventually start dating Shuichi.
That said, I would totally be down for Kumiko x Reina becoming canon. (http://i.imgur.com/jDc7tKp.jpg) I've not read the LNs, so I can't say for sure if it's the case there, but the writers of the anime gave them genuinely incredible onscreen chemistry.

ex cathedra

2015-11-02, 07:46 PM

I can't say this with one hundred percent certainty, so do please take it with a grain of salt, but I do recall hearing from someone that has actually read the LNs that Kumiko does eventually start dating Shuichi.
i'm aware of this; honestly, given the characterization and development that occurred in the first season, i wouldn't be concerned about if not for the spoiled comment.

Here's a translated interview you might be interested in: https://ultimatemegax.wordpress.com/2015/09/27/sound-euphonium-roundtable-director-tatsuya-ishihara-series-director-naoko-yamada-author-ayano-takeda (https://ultimatemegax.wordpress.com/2015/09/27/sound-euphonium-roundtable-director-tatsuya-ishihara-series-director-naoko-yamada-author-ayano-takeda/)/

that was pretty insightful, thanks a bunch.

DoctorFaust

2015-11-03, 03:39 AM

i'm aware of this; honestly, given the characterization and development that occurred in the first season, i wouldn't be concerned about if not for the spoiled comment.

Ah, sorry. I didn't know you already knew.

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-04, 04:38 PM

We finished up ROD The TV.

I feel like the ending was kind of weak, but overal it was a fun show to watch.

It tied up so neatly and perfectly that I kind of feel like the libraries plan did go through, it's just that the "rewrite" wasn't really as radical as would be expected. I think part of this feeling just comes from the last batch of episodes, leaving which left me wondering how accurately events were actually "narrated" to us. The guy says this thought on my part reminds him of total recall, which he had to explain because I've never seen it.

I do like how it was shown to us that at least the experiences of the sisters after meeting one another were true, making their "sisterhood" as real as ever, regardless of if they were tampered with prior to that or not.

Also, what's the deal with John Woo anyway? (the pigeon) I jokingly said he must be a part of Mr. Gentlemen lol, though really his presence throughout the series is a little weird. Though I'm also kind of fuzzy on the Libraries relations with Dokusensha, though it was explained it still doesn't quite fit together right to me so I may be misunderstanding it.

I think we're going to watch Daily Lives of Highschool Boys next!

Closet_Skeleton

2015-11-04, 06:24 PM

Dokusensha's backstory was heavily simplified from the novels which follow a radically different plot, that's probably why it isn't very clear.

Re-writing reality wasn't the British Library's plan, that's just Mr Gentleman's power and a side effect of attempting to reincarnate him. I think in the novels Mr Gentleman can control knowledge because he loves knowledge that much like how the Paper masters can control paper because of how much they love books or something like that, I have not read them. The British Library and Dokusensha also talk about trying to create a universal language which I believe is a reference to Gottfried Leibniz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Characteristica_universalis) (this is about as important to the actual plot as Judeo-Christianity is to NGE).

John Woo is just there because of the show's general obsession with Hong Kong cinema. The three sisters are named after actresses from a pair of Chinese Super Hero films and John Woo is a famous director obsessed with doves/pigeons.

Sith_Happens

2015-11-06, 11:20 PM

So a Princess: The Hopeful* play-by-post I joined is finally starting up soon and I realized that while I'm broadly familiar with the magical girl genre as an entity the only real experience I have with it is from Nanoha, Madoka, and Sailor Moon (Crystal; I only ever saw scattered episodes of the first anime back in the day and barely remember them).

Is Cardcaptor Sakura, Futari Wa Pretty Cure, Revolutionary Girl Utena, and Princess Tutu a good cross section to try and cram as much as I can of over the next week or so to make up for this deficit?

* Magical girls, New World of Darkness style. It works surprisingly well.

mallorean_thug

2015-11-07, 12:15 AM

Utena is really good and you should watch it, but it's not really what you're looking for right now.

There was a pretty good discussion on this entire topic a couple pages back.

I'm still working my way through Ojamajo Doremi (on ep 25 of Dokka~n now), and it's really fantastic, so I'd definitely recommend you watch at least the first three episodes of it while you're doing this crash course.

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-07, 01:08 AM

BWR

2015-11-07, 03:41 AM

Is Cardcaptor Sakura, Futari Wa Pretty Cure, Revolutionary Girl Utena, and Princess Tutu a good cross section to try and cram as much as I can of over the next week or so to make up for this deficit?

.

Can't say anything about PreCure or utena, but Princess Tutu is amazing (and has the best music you will find in any anime, though that's cheating). I really like Sakura, but it isn't flawless. There is a lot of filler in the first arc, but I generally found it to be cute and amusing enough that I didn't mind. The second arc was shorter and had more story progress per episode but was somehow more boring. Not enough that I ever considered dropping the show but enough that I felt slightly annoyed that they didn't get on with it. I haven't seen the movies yet so I can't comment on them.

Fri

2015-11-07, 04:21 AM

We were going to watch Daily Lives of Highschool Boys, but got waylaid by Food Wars.

We kept seeing it in the ads while watching ROD and wanted to know what the heck was going on and it's managed to hook us real good. We're already a little more than halfway through it, I guess it's just a super easy anime to watch. (also...makes me super hungry all the time..I mean any anime that has food in it does that, but this one is completely dedicated to food)

But we are definitely going to watch Daily Lives of Highschool Boys next!

As I mentioned before, Soma's last arc is really great and one of the best shonen sport anime I've watched, and I wish there's a second season.

Food manga/anime is actually one of a staple of the industry (ha ha, see what I did there?). Some that I remember are Mister Ajikko, the one I watched in my childhood and I think might be one of the pioneer, and Chuka Ichiban, which is set in 18-19th century china (I forgot). It's wuxia! Only instead of punching each other, they cook-off each others (It's actually pretty down to earth)!

Closet_Skeleton

2015-11-07, 05:14 AM

Is Cardcaptor Sakura, Futari Wa Pretty Cure, Revolutionary Girl Utena, and Princess Tutu a good cross section to try and cram as much as I can of over the next week or so to make up for this deficit?

I'm still working my way through Ojamajo Doremi (on ep 25 of Dokka~n now), and it's really fantastic, so I'd definitely recommend you watch at least the first three episodes of it while you're doing this crash course.

These shows tend to be pretty episodic, so if you just want a feel for the genre you can just watch a few episodes of as many different series as you can.

I'd go with Doremi/Pretty Cure/Sakura since those are actually aimed at the right age group. Another good one to look at is ShugoChara.

Princess Tutu is probably my favourite though, but its a bit plot heavy and shorter at 2-cour.

There is a lot of filler in the first arc

What's filler in plot heavy series is pretty much the main course in most children's series.

Kato

2015-11-07, 08:35 AM

As I mentioned before, Soma's last arc is really great and one of the best shonen sport anime I've watched, and I wish there's a second season.

Food manga/anime is actually one of a staple of the industry (ha ha, see what I did there?). Some that I remember are Mister Ajikko, the one I watched in my childhood and I think might be one of the pioneer, and Chuka Ichiban, which is set in 18-19th century china (I forgot). It's wuxia! Only instead of punching each other, they cook-off each others (It's actually pretty down to earth)!

I think there were rumors about a second season? Or am I just thinking of it being a 24 episode show already...
Also, not entirely sure but I think there aren't really enough new chapters yet to make another (double) season. Maybe they're waiting for that.

I have to admit, the only other food focus anime I'm aware of is Yakitate! but that IS hilarious, though not quite as delicious.

sidenote: Anyone seen Gundam Origin 2? I found it entertaining enough, though pretty weird at times... The best scenes by far remain Ramba's :smalltongue:

VariSami

2015-11-07, 09:02 AM

What, people are talking about food anime series without even one mention of Toriko? Toriko is basically Dragonball where everything is focused around making food and instead of said eponymous balls, people are trying to find the parts of a legend's full course. The entertainment value fluctuates and he first anime is damn long, and I have no idea when it will continue.

Prime32

2015-11-07, 09:18 AM

Personally I'm a fan of the manga Nobunaga no Chef. A Japanese chef gets sent back in time to the Sengoku period, losing a good chunk of his memory but none of his skill at cooking. As stories spread of a genius cook with vast knowledge of foreign cuisine, they attract the attention of Oda Nobunaga, who gives the protagonist a job as his personal chef.

Apparently there was a live-action adaptation but it was pretty bad.

Sith_Happens

2015-11-07, 06:05 PM

Utena is really good and you should watch it, but it's not really what you're looking for right now.

I guess I should specify that I do specifically want to dip my feet (back) into the darker and/or more mature twists on the genre for part of this, seeing as the game that this "research" is for in the first place is itself an example of such (though much less deconstructive than most).

There was a pretty good discussion on this entire topic a couple pages back.

I sort of have three pages to catch up on reading, so I guess I'll do that now.:smallwink::smallredface:

I'm still working my way through Ojamajo Doremi (on ep 25 of Dokka~n now), and it's really fantastic, so I'd definitely recommend you watch at least the first three episodes of it while you're doing this crash course.

I'd go with Doremi/Pretty Cure/Sakura since those are actually aimed at the right age group. Another good one to look at is ShugoChara.

Doremi is officially added to the list. Shugo Chara I saw the first episode or two of a while back and totally couldn't get into.

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-07, 06:56 PM

As I mentioned before, Soma's last arc is really great and one of the best shonen sport anime I've watched, and I wish there's a second season.

That's good to know, I'm getting a little bored of him pulling out wins and such with relative ease, even if it is cool how it showcases his history to improvisation and experimenting. Though the last few episodes at least had him in some sticky situations, and were quite interesting. (we left off at the end of the "hell camp") I would have never thought of it as a shonen sport anime though, but I guess it basically is only with cooking.

I think it's really an interesting anime for how it shows a lot of different people and ways of thinking you'll meet in a general art environment. I had to explain to the guy that people like the "god tongue" girl actually do exist in artistic serious real life settings, even if it doesn't really make any sense to deny something that is good simply because of a "low" origin. And it has a lot of themes about being able to improvise, and willing to make mistakes to learn and improve. I feel like it'd be the kind of anime I'd have someone watch to learn about approaching visual art in a round about way.

DoctorFaust

2015-11-07, 08:25 PM

I'm a little surprised by how much I'm liking Rakudai Kishi no Cavalry. Stella and Ikki are genuinely likable so far, the plot actually seems fairly well written, if generic, the supporting cast is interesting and have distinctive character designs, and it gives what is actually a valid reason for the MC being thought of as inferior. So, as far as Magical High School LN's go, this one is doing pretty well.

BWR

2015-11-08, 05:54 AM

Fri

2015-11-08, 06:14 AM

That's good to know, I'm getting a little bored of him pulling out wins and such with relative ease, even if it is cool how it showcases his history to improvisation and experimenting. Though the last few episodes at least had him in some sticky situations, and were quite interesting. (we left off at the end of the "hell camp") I would have never thought of it as a shonen sport anime though, but I guess it basically is only with cooking.

I think it's really an interesting anime for how it shows a lot of different people and ways of thinking you'll meet in a general art environment. I had to explain to the guy that people like the "god tongue" girl actually do exist in artistic serious real life settings, even if it doesn't really make any sense to deny something that is good simply because of a "low" origin. And it has a lot of themes about being able to improvise, and willing to make mistakes to learn and improve. I feel like it'd be the kind of anime I'd have someone watch to learn about approaching visual art in a round about way.

I won't sugarcoat it, early Soma is pretty boring, and it got some pretty out-of-place questionable fanservices. My friend also left it early because of that. But I always recommend people who have watched at least a bit of it to understand the premise and know at least some of the main characters, to watch the final arc (just skip the middle, especially the superfluous "soma going home" mini arc) because it's just that good.

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-11-08, 12:03 PM

Murr I got to the end of Soredemo Machi Wa Mawatteiru and now I'm playing the waiting game along with everyone else who reads it.

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-08, 05:43 PM

I won't sugarcoat it, early Soma is pretty boring, and it got some pretty out-of-place questionable fanservices. My friend also left it early because of that. But I always recommend people who have watched at least a bit of it to understand the premise and know at least some of the main characters, to watch the final arc (just skip the middle, especially the superfluous "soma going home" mini arc) because it's just that good.

I don't really mind the "fan service" since it's pretty equal opportunity about it, and so over the top and ridiculous all I can do is laugh at it. I think the only one that really bugged me was the early one with the squid dressed in peanut butter...

We actually were drawn in by the commercial juxtaposing the foodgasms with the cooking, though in the commercial it's not clear at all why they're naked and there's sparkles shooting everywhere, and we needed an answer.

There's another show in crunch rolls commercials I want to watch that seems to be magical boys? It looks really weird and offbeat, which is a thing that also tends to draw us in.

kamikasei

2015-11-08, 07:18 PM

There's another show in crunch rolls commercials I want to watch that seems to be magical boys? It looks really weird and offbeat, which is a thing that also tends to draw us in.
If you mean Cute High Earth Defense Club LOVE!, I recommend it. I started watching it for the novelty, but it turned out to be genuinely entertaining enough to keep me going. It feels like one of those parodies done by people with a lot of genuine affection for the genre, and avoids becoming a constant rehash of "lol it's magical girl stuff, but they're boys!" to generate humour on its own merits.

Love is over!

BWR

2015-11-09, 03:54 AM

If you mean Cute High Earth Defense Club LOVE!, I recommend it. I started watching it for the novelty, but it turned out to be genuinely entertaining enough to keep me going. It feels like one of those parodies done by people with a lot of genuine affection for the genre, and avoids becoming a constant rehash of "lol it's magical girl stuff, but they're boys!" to generate humour on its own merits.

Love is over!

I really like this one. Funny, and every episode was at least amusing, with a couple of very good ones in there. A second season is supposedly coming, even if the first season really was all you needed for the story they told.

Fri

2015-11-09, 04:44 AM

I don't really mind the "fan service" since it's pretty equal opportunity about it, and so over the top and ridiculous all I can do is laugh at it. I think the only one that really bugged me was the early one with the squid dressed in peanut butter...

We actually were drawn in by the commercial juxtaposing the foodgasms with the cooking, though in the commercial it's not clear at all why they're naked and there's sparkles shooting everywhere, and we needed an answer.

There's another show in crunch rolls commercials I want to watch that seems to be magical boys? It looks really weird and offbeat, which is a thing that also tends to draw us in.

Well, if you're interested, someone tried the recipe shown in the first episode, Soma style.

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--Iq-3bJ2B--/1505248372106148012.gif

http://anitay.kinja.com/food-wars-recipes-in-real-life-1-fake-pork-roast-1703359028

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-09, 10:29 AM

That's pretty cool that that one actually tastes nice....maybe we'll try it sometime. It may be one of the few pork things I can eat without getting ill. The pictures of them mimicking anime shots are pretty fun too.

I had heard that at least some of the recipes are available in the manga (and on further poking around that there's an official cook book).

Kato

2015-11-09, 11:03 AM

Well, if you're interested, someone tried the recipe shown in the first episode, Soma style.

http://anitay.kinja.com/food-wars-recipes-in-real-life-1-fake-pork-roast-1703359028

Well, thank you very much, now my keyboard is soaked. :smallsigh:

Just a few words on the still surprisingly decent Ironblooded Orphans: Bit of a backstory dump this week, but still decent enough character interactions. Apparently people live in a big chunk of the solar system now? Well, I guess we will not care about how long interplanatery travel takes but it's okay :smalltongue:

ex cathedra

2015-11-10, 01:13 AM

Closet_Skeleton

2015-11-10, 07:11 PM

Bonus points for the two getting together early on and not dragging it out the rest of the series.

I'm starting to get suspicious that it has a nonaggression pact with its identically premised sister show Asterisk War where they alternate which one of them is going to be interesting and watch-able this week. Whenever I get the idea that one of them is pure dross and I should just stick with one of them they switch round which one of them is close to being good.

If they were one show with just the good bits we might have got something as entertainingly naff as Strike the Blood (aka How not to run a World of Darkness game: the anime).

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-11-10, 08:06 PM

anyone looking forward to a second season of rokka no yuusha is probably in for a bad time (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/daily-briefs/2015-11-09/retailer-rokka-braves-of-the-six-flowers-standard-blu-rays-dvds-cancelled/.95193)
In a hilariously ironic twist, guess what ads I'm seeing on that site right now, next to the article?

EDIT: actually, forget guessing.
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e96/Curubethion/RokkaIrony.png

DoctorFaust

2015-11-11, 07:07 AM

If they were one show with just the good bits we might have got something as entertainingly naff as Strike the Blood (aka How not to run a World of Darkness game: the anime).

That sounds...interesting. Is there anything good about it, or is it just entertainingly bad?

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-11, 02:19 PM

So Cute High Earth Defense Club LOVE

It might be a little too rich for me, though we're going to give it a few more episodes.

We've also been watching Lovely Muco, usually just one every few days, cause more would be too much.

edit: We also started watching Daily Lives of Highschool Boys

It's very funny, there was much laughing. They remind me of middle schoolers with how weird and awkward they are.

BWR

2015-11-11, 04:50 PM

That sounds...interesting. Is there anything good about it, or is it just entertainingly bad?

Nothing good that I can remember. 'Entertainingly bad' is a good description. Rather predictable if you've seen that sort of thing before, with all the ridiculousness of, among other things, old people who inexplicably look like little girls, gratuitous panty shots, skinny kids wielding oversized weapons in implausible ways and a useless-yet-powerful protagonist we are for some reason supposed to root for and tsundere love interests.

DoctorFaust

2015-11-12, 05:43 AM

Nothing good that I can remember. 'Entertainingly bad' is a good description. Rather predictable if you've seen that sort of thing before, with all the ridiculousness of, among other things, old people who inexplicably look like little girls, gratuitous panty shots, skinny kids wielding oversized weapons in implausible ways and a useless-yet-powerful protagonist we are for some reason supposed to root for and tsundere love interests.

Hmm. I might give that a watch when I'm in the mood for a fluff series, then.

Oh, and they've announced the VAs for Deku and All Might in the Boku no Hero (http://i.imgur.com/lWSyGj5.jpg) Academia anime (http://i.imgur.com/TnPw78L.jpg). Apparently, it's going to be Daiki Yama****a (http://myanimelist.net/people/21971/Daiki_Yama****a) voicing Deku, and Kenta Miyake (http://myanimelist.net/people/720/Kenta_Miyake) voicing All Might.

Fri

2015-11-12, 08:53 AM

edit: We also started watching Daily Lives of Highschool Boys

It's very funny, there was much laughing. They remind me of middle schoolers with how weird and awkward they are.

Glad you like it. They also kinda remind me of myself in middle school. Or maybe my idealized memory of middle schoo. Not highschool though, because I'm a loner with no friend in highschool ;_;.

Sith_Happens

2015-11-13, 03:59 PM

Is it just me or do the main characters of Kill Me Baby look 100% like chibi versions of Fate Testarossa and Hayate Yagami with their eye colors swapped?

http://www.uk-anime.net/images/kill-me-baby.jpg
http://spf.fotolog.com/photo/63/11/29/haru_nanoha/1287190380674_f.jpg

Closet_Skeleton

2015-11-13, 05:09 PM

That sounds...interesting. Is there anything good about it, or is it just entertainingly bad?

The characters and harem bits are actually quite good as harem shows go. The plotting and the villains are all terrible.

Alent

2015-11-13, 05:38 PM

The characters and harem bits are actually quite good as harem shows go. The plotting and the villains are all terrible.

This pretty much describes my thoughts on it. The Strike the Blood setting is quite good compared to it's base plot. I actually liked the protagonist, because it was clear the entire time that his vampire powers were on loan and that he was being used as a proxy. Sadly, they never got around to firing that Chekhov's gun.

kamikasei

2015-11-15, 12:47 PM

Is it just me or do the main characters of Kill Me Baby look 100% like chibi versions of Fate Testarossa and Hayate Yagami with their eye colors swapped?
Firstly: you're right, I've always thought the blonde one looked Fate-ish, though I didn't know the other Kill Me Baby character to compare. The eye colours are actually different, though.

Secondly: Fate, that is not a safe way to hold a magic sword. Think of the children (with magic swords) watching!

Morph Bark

2015-11-15, 03:43 PM

A while back someone recommended Outbreak Company to me, and man was I disappointed. The first two episodes was typical juvenile otakubait comedy before the show really got off the ground, and then it was sorta nice for a while, although it never really ventured into the serious stuff that was constantly lurking underneath the surface. Not until all the way at the end, when the plot really picked up and got interesting, and then the final episode destroyed that pacing completely. To boot, the way that final episode went, realistically most of the main characters should have died (the entire building was on fire and the main guy was lying unconscious inside for several minutes), and the sound direction (which had been pretty good for most of the series) all of a sudden had become lacklustre, bland and ill-fitting.

Outbreak Company did do quite a few things right, particularly in the middle with regards to the relationships of Miusel the maid with the main guy and the Empress, and the main guy was pretty smart at several occasions. Sadly, he typically followed this up with something incredibly stupid, often something that he had told himself beforehand not to do anymore.

I followed it up with GATE: Jieitai Kanochi nite, Kaku Tatakaeri, and man, it was everything I had been missing in the plot and characters of Outbreak Company, but while keeping excellent sound direction and animation. It seems to me it accomplished everything it set out to do. The characters were believeable, the military action and politics well-done, and the link-between-worlds concept was more fleshed out. It did stand out rather that it portrays a lot of parties that the main characters don't belong to as dishonest, however. They're not card-carrying villains, and they all have understandable motives, but their methods make it clear that the audience is not supposed to root for them.

There's a bit of a will-they-won't-they going on between some of the characters, which one character's ex-wife even highlights at some point, but it's all really well done, and for a 12-episode series you often can't expect a lot more. Luckily, a second season is on its way come January.

DoctorFaust

2015-11-15, 06:12 PM

Continuing my fairly recent trend of unexpected enjoyment of romance stuff, I've been reading Kaichou wa Maid-sama and Tomo-chan wa Onna Ko lately, and I'm actually liking them quite a lot. I'll admit that I'm not particularly well read or watched in that genre, but they seem genuinely funny and well written. I really enjoy reading about Tomo and Misa (which I'll admit may be because I really enjoy flustered tomboys), Jun is entertainingly oblivious, Usui is a goddamn hilarious troll, there are actual confessions early on (even if neither of the people who are being confessed to actually believe it:smallmad:), and the supporting characters are, well, supporting.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure Usui in Maid-sama dresses up like Dio Brando at one point, so you should totally go check that out.

Sith_Happens

2015-11-15, 06:26 PM

Just started my magical girl crash course last night. Keroberos is best animal sidekick.:smallcool:

http://i.imgur.com/gkj7ikQ.jpg

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-16, 03:53 AM

Glad you like it. They also kinda remind me of myself in middle school. Or maybe my idealized memory of middle schoo. Not highschool though, because I'm a loner with no friend in highschool ;_;.

I have little to no memories of middle school personally, I was mostly basing their behavior on middle schoolers I worked with during student teaching, though the guy reminded me that 9th/10th graders (14-16 y/olds) can still be more goofy/awkward than not.

What's really striking me about the show so far now is that the dialogue feels really natural if that makes any sense, even when they're crushing the fourth wall into very fine particles of dust. I'm also oddly amused by most of the girls being some kind of terrifying/crazy.

Prime32

2015-11-16, 11:22 AM

A while back someone recommended Outbreak Company to me, and man was I disappointed. The first two episodes was typical juvenile otakubait comedy before the show really got off the ground, and then it was sorta nice for a while, although it never really ventured into the serious stuff that was constantly lurking underneath the surface.

[...]

I followed it up with GATE: Jieitai Kanochi nite, Kaku Tatakaeri, and man, it was everything I had been missing in the plot and characters of Outbreak Company, but while keeping excellent sound direction and animation. It seems to me it accomplished everything it set out to do. The characters were believeable, the military action and politics well-done, and the link-between-worlds concept was more fleshed out. It did stand out rather that it portrays a lot of parties that the main characters don't belong to as dishonest, however. They're not card-carrying villains, and they all have understandable motives, but their methods make it clear that the audience is not supposed to root for them.Eh... I'll have to disagree with you on that; out of the two I found Outbreak Company much more enjoyable. Bear in mind that I haven't watched all of the GATE anime, but I'm up to date on the manga:

GATE just has so many scenes that consist of the locals standing and gawping at how superior the Japanese people are, whether in skill or technology or morality or whatever (or of villains hearing reports of things Japanese people have done and saying "It's a trick! No one could be that amazing!"). IIRC there's a scene early on where three veteran warriors fight a rookie JSDF member in melee and get defeated in seconds.

Outbreak Company, meanwhile, goes out of its way to point out that the only reason Shinichi treats Myucel as an equal is because he's an outsider who wasn't brought up to fear elves (and in fact, has a positive stereotype of them thanks to fantasy stories). Both cultures have much they can learn from each other, but neither is better.

You say that GATE accomplished everything it set out to do. I'd argue that Outbreak Company was always intended to be a "juvenile otakubait comedy" and then brought in sociological stuff on top of that, whereas GATE was intended to be a serious military drama and then brought in otakubait (it has a loli named Loli, for crying out loud :smalltongue:).
I can't go into detail because of the board rules, but GATE's handling of real-world politics can also be... odd; while Outbreak Company only gives us a limited glimpse of what's going on in that front, I'd argue what we do see there is more realistic.

tensai_oni

2015-11-16, 12:33 PM

What's really striking me about the show so far now is that the dialogue feels really natural if that makes any sense, even when they're crushing the fourth wall into very fine particles of dust.

I know what you mean. It's one of the show's strongest points, and the only unrealistic part is that the characters always have perfect comedic timing (unless lack of comedic timing is the joke). But then it's a comedy show so it's expected.

I'm also oddly amused by most of the girls being some kind of terrifying/crazy.

That's because the show is written from the perspective of high school boys.

cobaltstarfire

2015-11-24, 04:41 PM

I'll give you that highschool girls are probably terrifying and confusing to highschool boys, but I don't think they go around planting double footed kicks on boys chests and other forms of violence. :smalltongue:

I'm really excited! Crunchyroll picked up Digimon Adventure Tri...and it'll be available to free users too!

Digimon Adventure alongside Pokemon is one of my first anime (With Escaflowne and Card Captor Sakura being my first foray into un-butchered subtitled works)

Digimon Adventure is an anime I really enjoy, I've liked most of the other Digimon series's, even Xros Wars (though not frontier). So this is very excited for me.

The guy isn't as gung ho, but that's because he hasn't seen digimon (and maybe he'll turn out to not like digimon at all).

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-11-24, 07:49 PM

Sith_Happens

2015-12-04, 12:59 AM

http://media.ign.com/games/image/article/738/738102/gaijin4koma_peersblog_1200684654.jpg
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/000/283/gaijin4koma2_peersblog_1200684608.jpg
EDIT: Wait a minute...

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/2MHIvAdB8Bs/maxresdefault.jpg

http://images.puella-magi.net/9/99/Tumblr_lk2ccuqv5G1qb7j0bo1_1280.jpg?20120314145147
Oh Shaft, you so silly.

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-04, 06:53 AM

Heartcatch and Madoka were made in the same year, so its unlikely either was copying each other.

Apart from pink they aren't that similar really. Get a lot of pink magical girls together and they'll only be somewhere in the middle of similarity.

Wait until you're 11 episodes into Heartcatch to judge. Heartcatch's problem for me is that its really strong when its strong but that's only just over 1/10 of the episodes. But I also like monster of the week shows and understand why people would not. I also liked Heartcatch more from the first episode and even after changing my mind on the series still think its a good first episode.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-05, 06:10 PM

Alent

2015-12-05, 06:29 PM

endoperez

2015-12-05, 07:43 PM

I have been reading way too much romance lately. I binged My Lovely Ghost Kana in less than 24 hours, I've been reading Kaichou wa Maid-sama as much as I have the time for between classes, I've been reading Akagami no Shirayukihime to prepare for the second season in January, and I started reading Your Lie in April just a few days ago. They're all so goddamn adorable (even if one does end pretty heartbreakingly) that I'm beginning to get a little annoyed with just how ruttin' cute I'm finding them all. I'm a man, dammit, I'm not supposed to like cute things! :smallmad:

That said, does anybody know any other good shoujo/romance manga to fuel my addiction? :smalltongue:

Living Game
Sweetness: ***
Tears: **
It's about people working in early 90s Tokyo where living space (and office space!) is limited and hard to come by. The main girl is only 15 when it starts out, but the story pans out over several years so it's not THAT weird (although it still is, a bit).

Emma / Victorian Romance Emma
Sweetness: ****
Tears: **
Kaoru Mori's art is amazing. In Emma, it's already good. In her series set in the steppes, Otoyomegatari, she illustrates the complexity of handcrafts in glorious detail. Like, a two-page scene about the complexity of wood-carving, or the details in embroidered clothing. Emma is the better romance story though, while Otoyomegatari is more about life in the steppes north of the Black Sea sometime in the 19th Century.

Orange Yane no Chiisana Ie
Sweetness: ****
Tears: *
Another story based around weird housing arrangements. The same house is sold to two single-parent families; hijinks ensue as the parents try to figure out what they are to their kids, and to each other.

Bitter Virgin
Sweetness: ****
Tears: *****
A romance story about learning to cope with loss. The female protagonist is left alone before the story starts, and the story actually handles the feelings of loss well.

Sasameki Koto
Sweetness: ****
Tears: ***
Two girls. One is openly a lesbian, and runs after various cute girls. The other is not a cute girl, so she hides her feelings and acts as the other's best friend and support.

Reimei no Arcana / Dawn of the Arcana
Sweetness: ***
Tears: ***
Romance with a plot! The romance gives way to fantasy kingdom politics and long-term planning, at times. I enjoyed it quite a bit.

Lovely Complex and REC I enjoyed more as anime.
I understand Maison Ikkoku is a classic, but it was dragging a bit so I ended up dropping it, but I intend to return to it at some point.
Spice and Wolf is fantastic story, but the romance in it isn't about falling madly in love; instead, it's about a slowly growing friendship. The manga hasn't gotten far enough to get to the romance, there.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-05, 08:59 PM

-snip-

Damn. :smalleek: That's a lot of manga. Just glancing it over, Emma and Orange seem like the ones I would be the most interested in, but I do appreciate the rest of the recommendations.

And actually, I just finished up Maid-Sama.

http://community.us.playstation.com/t5/image/serverpage/image-id/257423i450CA8BFA1A9D844/image-size/original?v=mpbl-1&px=-1
Ohmygodtheygetmarriedandit'ssocuteandIloveit

Fri

2015-12-05, 11:11 PM

cobaltstarfire

2015-12-05, 11:55 PM

We finished daily lives of highschool boys a little while ago, and went on to Spice and Wolf, finished that today (well what is freely available, we're trying to decide if we want to just buy the rest or subscribe to funimation for a little while).

I liked Spice and Wolf, it was cute, though I had a bit of trouble following the trade/economics parts sometimes, but since those things were mostly just a vehicle for interaction it doesn't matter. I really like the Opening Theme too, something about it is haunting and nice and things.

mallorean_thug

2015-12-06, 01:26 AM

Hihi.

I finally finished all of Ojamajo Doremi a little bit ago, and it really was fantastic. The last 11 or so episodes of Dokka~n did a fantastic job on capitalizing on the accumulated emotional weight of the series, with both of Mamoru Hosoda's guest episodes (40 and 49) being stand out master pieces. And then Naisho felt like a collection of the best stand alone episodes of the entire series.

I really can't wait until Sith Happens or closet skeleton to get around to giving it a try, because its now easily my favorite Magical Girls show (edging out Princess Tutu by just a little bit. Though its kind of hard to compare a short plot focused show to a sprawling 216 episode episodic show)

With that finished, I decided to start watching another Junichi Sato show; Kaleido Star. Its about a girl fulfilling her dream by joining an internationally famous circus called Kaleido Stage. So, its kind of a sports show about guts and hard work, but set in a fantastically colorful circus. With a completely inexplicable magical mascot character that's like some midget Phantom of the Opera that so far has mostly just given us a tarot reading every episode. It's been pretty great so far, 9 episodes in. Not good enough that I think anybody should rush out and start watching it, but good enough that I'll definitely stick with it till the end.

Separately, I've found a group of people to marathon shows with, and we've been mostly working through important shows I hadn't seen yet. But that list has gotten a lot shorter, so I was hoping you guys could help me out with that. I'm looking for 1 or 2 cour shows (13-26 episodes) with some focus on overarching events (I've found episodic shows aren't quite as enjoyable to watch 9 episodes at a time) that I haven't seen yet (So, nothing under "completed" on this list (http://myanimelist.net/animelist/mallorean_thug)).

To give you an idea of what I'm kind of looking for, so far this group has watched Space Battleship Yamato 2199, Fantastic Children, Infinite Ryvius, Samurai Champloo, Neon Genesis Evangelion (This was a rewatch to celebrate the new bluray release, and because one person hadn't seen it), Birdy the Might Decode S1 & S2, Berserk, Macross Do You Remember Love (movie night), and we're currently in the middle of Last Exile.

Any suggestions you might have would be appreciated, regardless of genre or target audience, even if they don't quite fit the criteria I put forward. At this point, a good show is a good show, and there's very few types of shows that I don't generally enjoy. Though, I'll definitely give you bonus points if you can come up with something that you can't jokingly summarize as "Sad people in space". Because it seems like a large amount of older shows I should get around to fit that description to a T. You'll also get mega bonus points if you manage to mention something I haven't heard of before.

kamikasei

2015-12-06, 06:04 AM

Also my friend swears for Bonnouji and.. there's another one but I forgot what it's called.
Horimiya?

Birdy the Might Decode S1 & S2
How is that? I've read a chunk of the manga and found it interesting, but clips I've seen make it look like the anime turned the fanservice way up.

BWR

2015-12-06, 06:45 AM

For something less serious, I find "Kaguya Want To Be Confessed" to be highly ridiculous and silly. It's a story about a girl and a guy who are totally into each others but both are first class tsundere, and consider love as war and those who confess first lose.

There's also "Tomo is a girl" which is the story about a tomboyish girl and her childhood friend who are into each others but are embarassed about it and their friends who are all pretty silly.

Those two are good, especially Tomo.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-06, 07:23 AM

Also my friend swears for Bonnouji and.. there's another one but I forgot what it's called. Bonnouji is basically a romance story without much high premise, but it's very funny and cute. I can't read it because it makes me sad about my lack of romance story ;_;.

For something less serious, I find "Kaguya Want To Be Confessed" to be highly ridiculous and silly. It's a story about a girl and a guy who are totally into each others but both are first class tsundere, and consider love as war and those who confess first lose.

There's also "Tomo is a girl" which is the story about a tomboyish girl and her childhood friend who are into each others but are embarassed about it and their friends who are all pretty silly.
I'm actually already reading Tomo-chan, but I'll be giving Kaguya and Bonnouji a look.

Any suggestions you might have would be appreciated, regardless of genre or target audience, even if they don't quite fit the criteria I put forward. At this point, a good show is a good show, and there's very few types of shows that I don't generally enjoy. Though, I'll definitely give you bonus points if you can come up with something that you can't jokingly summarize as "Sad people in space". Because it seems like a large amount of older shows I should get around to fit that description to a T. You'll also get mega bonus points if you manage to mention something I haven't heard of before.

I'd just like to throw in my two cents, and recommend Macross Frontier and Mobile Suit Gundam:The 08th MS Team.

Ibrinar

2015-12-06, 08:47 AM

Spice and Wolf is fantastic story, but the romance in it isn't about falling madly in love; instead, it's about a slowly growing friendship. The manga hasn't gotten far enough to get to the romance, there.

[small rant]I vastly prefer slowly growing closer instead of instant conditionless love. When the romance plot is "both are into each other but don't know yet" it's a tad boring imo, when it is "both are into each other, but there are obstacles to them being together" it can be more interesting but often it is clear that in the end it won't really stop them. I just prefer romance to be a bit more about their interactions. I guess "being awkward with each other because you don't know whether they return your feelings" is also an interaction but it shouldn't be the only one. I just want to see them actual positive interaction between them, I prefer couples to also work as friends so I like to see them actually talk like friends sometimes oh and being nice (and cute) to each other, it all being based on instant love just feels a bit weak.

[/rant]I just had a romance book reading phase and had some trouble finding relationships I really liked. Maybe it would be easier if I didn't mostly search for genre fiction (fantasy/urban fantasy/scifi+romance). Maybe I should read some more Jane Austen books I did like pride and prejudice. (Though that doesn't quite fit my small rant either.)

Edit: Bonnouji seems cute btw.

Sith_Happens

2015-12-06, 08:47 AM

Wait until you're 11 episodes into Heartcatch to judge. Heartcatch's problem for me is that its really strong when its strong but that's only just over 1/10 of the episodes. But I also like monster of the week shows and understand why people would not. I also liked Heartcatch more from the first episode and even after changing my mind on the series still think its a good first episode.

Well I'm eight episodes in currently and feel incredibly safe in deeming it 1000 times better than Futari wa by virtue of

1. Not feeling like I'm just watching the same episode over and over again.

2. The protagonists not being supremely incompetent fighters up until their finishing move.

I have been reading way too much romance lately. I binged My Lovely Ghost Kana in less than 24 hours, I've been reading Kaichou wa Maid-sama as much as I have the time for between classes, I've been reading Akagami no Shirayukihime to prepare for the second season in January, and I started reading Your Lie in April just a few days ago. They're all so goddamn adorable (even if one does end pretty heartbreakingly) that I'm beginning to get a little annoyed with just how ruttin' cute I'm finding them all. I'm a man, dammit, I'm not supposed to like cute things! :smallmad:

That said, does anybody know any other good shoujo/romance manga to fuel my addiction? :smalltongue:

It's not a manga but obligatory Spice and Wolf recommendation on the off chance you haven't read it already.

Fri

2015-12-06, 09:10 AM

Oh I remember something else, though might be a bit... plain for some people. It's more slice of life than romance I guess? Though romance is an important part of it

One of my personal favourite manga is a manga by Masami Yuuki of Patlabor fame, titled Vicious Horse! Ja Ja Uma. I don't know what's it called in english, since I used to collect it translated into my language.

It's about... It starts with a highschool guy from tokyo who got stranded in hokkaido in the middle of winter because his bike broke down and got saved by a girl from a horse farm. It then follows his daily life in the farm, starting by working to pay for his lodging for the winter, then working part time there in summer vacation, until at the end he works there full time. He starts as highschooler, and the manga cover years of his life, at least half decade, and at the end he's fully an adult. I start to read it in high school and for some reason I find myself relate to the mc so much, for reason I cant' understand why.

The story is set in a farm, and very much show a lot of horse-farm work in realistic and down-to-earth way, similar with how Patlabor has mecha as important part of it, but it's very much mainly a manga about human and their relationship with each others, also just as Patlabor.

And the horse farm's owner has 4 daughters with various personality, which pretty much looks like a set up for a harem manga. I know that a lot of people who start reading it thought that it's going to be a harem comedy, and got turned off by it, but it's very much not a harem comedy. The 4 daughters are characters in the manga, and that's it.

It's pretty low key, not something uproaringly hillarious or tense with action or make flutter with romantic feeling, but I like it. I don't know why. Maybe it's momentum because I start reading it in high school and it end around me finishing college, exactly as the MC's life? Dunno.

endoperez

2015-12-06, 11:58 AM

[small rant]I vastly prefer slowly growing closer instead of instant conditionless love.

I consider "falling in love" and "growing to love" different things. Both can make for a nice story, and the "falling in love" doesn't always need to be instant, conditionless love, but the romantic stories where a friendship deepens and grows are often much more interesting.

The thing is, the falling in love stories can be too tooth-achingly sweet to ignore. Even if they're not that good, objectively speaking, I know a few series like that which have made me squeal with joy.

Mx.Silver

2015-12-06, 04:27 PM

Any suggestions you might have would be appreciated, regardless of genre or target audience, even if they don't quite fit the criteria I put forward. At this point, a good show is a good show, and there's very few types of shows that I don't generally enjoy. Though, I'll definitely give you bonus points if you can come up with something that you can't jokingly summarize as "Sad people in space". Because it seems like a large amount of older shows I should get around to fit that description to a T. You'll also get mega bonus points if you manage to mention something I haven't heard of before.

If you haven't gotten around to Kurozuka yet, this would be as good a time as any. Fits your description pretty well, and, as I mentioned back in one of the earlier threads, is very pretty. It's actually been climbing-up my 'rewatch' list a fair bit since I saw it, as since then I've become aware of the series own adaptation history - specifically, it's an anime of a manga version of a novel that itself is a semi-reworking of a several hundred year old Noh play of the same name, which is itself based on an even older folk tale, while incorporating elements of a second similarly old legends that were adapted to Noh theatre.
That may seem like an unusual thing to change the appreciation of a series, but in this case it's actually semi-relevant to a couple of thematic points.
Even if you don't get that though, it is still very pretty.

Speaking of rewatches, a couple of months ago I introduced a friend to Blast of Tempest. Since it doesn't seem to be on your completed list, you should really consider giving it a look as it really holds-up. Although it's hard to explain what makes it as good as it is without spoiling things.

On the subject of things I've watched since I last posted in the thread: Michiko E Hatchin is amazing and I would very strongly suggest seeing it to anyone who hasn't (which I would imagine is quite a lot of people). It's a bit more episodic than the above two, but I think it's got more than enough style to make-up for that. I should probably write more about when I next do I 'things I've seen post'.

Oh, and also Erin. It's longer than what you're asking for (50 episodes) but given how you rate Dennou Coil and Princess Tutu I think you should really consider making time for it. Plus it's one of the series I tend to recommend a lot anyway, so leaving it off this list would just feel wrong :smalltongue:

In other news: it has been a long time since I've been in this thread.

mallorean_thug

2015-12-07, 01:15 AM

How is that? I've read a chunk of the manga and found it interesting, but clips I've seen make it look like the anime turned the fanservice way up.
It was really good, especially if you care about action sakuga. I mean, just (https://sakuga.yshi.org/post/show/16798/animated-debris-effects-fighting-ryo-timo-smoke-te) look (https://sakuga.yshi.org/post/show/9214/animated-effects-fighting-shingo_yama****a-tetsuwa) at (https://sakuga.yshi.org/post/show/16827/animated-effects-liquid-presumed-shingo_yama****a-) a (https://sakuga.yshi.org/post/show/15092/animated-background_animation-effects-explosions-f) couple (https://sakuga.yshi.org/post/show/16903/animated-background_animation-effects-fighting-smo) of these. Ryo-chimo (https://camonte.wordpress.com/2015/03/16/ryo-chimo/) brought a ton of his web-gen friends on board, and they absolutely nailed it out of the park.

Honestly, I think you'd enjoy it quite a bit, and its probably going to be my go-to recommendation for anybody looking for an action show for quite a while.

I'd say that the overall amount of fanservice is pretty low, and mostly limited to when Birdy is working her cover idol job. And loli Birdy in S2 could stand to put on a little more clothing, but I can't think of any spots where the camera sexualizes that. It's definitely not nearly as bad as Ryo-chimo's next show with a ton of really cool action cuts (https://sakuga.yshi.org/post/show/4191/animated-debris-effects-explosions-fighting-liquid) (Yozakura Quartet). /That one/ I can't recommend to people because of its ridiculous level of fanservice.

I'd just like to throw in my two cents, and recommend Macross Frontier and Mobile Suit Gundam:The 08th MS Team.

I actually already have plans to watch The 08th MS Team with a different group of people (currently we're watching 0080). And based on reactions to Do You Remember Love, Macross isn't going to fly. Thanks for the recs though!

If you haven't gotten around to Kurozuka yet, this would be as good a time as any. Fits your description pretty well, and, as I mentioned back in one of the earlier threads, is very pretty. It's actually been climbing-up my 'rewatch' list a fair bit since I saw it, as since then I've become aware of the series own adaptation history - specifically, it's an anime of a manga version of a novel that itself is a semi-reworking of a several hundred year old Noh play of the same name, which is itself based on an even older folk tale, while incorporating elements of a second similarly old legends that were adapted to Noh theatre.
That may seem like an unusual thing to change the appreciation of a series, but in this case it's actually semi-relevant to a couple of thematic points.
Even if you don't get that though, it is still very pretty.

Speaking of rewatches, a couple of months ago I introduced a friend to Blast of Tempest. Since it doesn't seem to be on your completed list, you should really consider giving it a look as it really holds-up. Although it's hard to explain what makes it as good as it is without spoiling things.

On the subject of things I've watched since I last posted in the thread: Michiko E Hatchin is amazing and I would very strongly suggest seeing it to anyone who hasn't (which I would imagine is quite a lot of people). It's a bit more episodic than the above two, but I think it's got more than enough style to make-up for that. I should probably write more about when I next do I 'things I've seen post'.

Oh, and also Erin. It's longer than what you're asking for (50 episodes) but given how you rate Dennou Coil and Princess Tutu I think you should really consider making time for it. Plus it's one of the series I tend to recommend a lot anyway, so leaving it off this list would just feel wrong :smalltongue:

In other news: it has been a long time since I've been in this thread.

I was actually considering Erin! I'm just always wary of trying to watch long shows with groups of people. But 50 episodes really isn't that bad. Probably my top consideration at the moment.

Michiko and Hatchin was something I actually suggested right after we finished Samurai Champloo with a somewhat facetious "Hey, do you guys want to watch that show again, but in South America this time?" The answer was "Something less episodic, please" So, maybe we'll get around to that a little bit later, but probably not next.

Blast of Tempest isn't really my kind of show, but given my friends' tastes, probably is a good suggestion. I'll keep it in mind.

And I had completely forgotten about Kurozuka again. Thanks for reminding me. I might be greedy and just watch that one by myself real quick.

Its always good to see you around. And don't worry, its not like I've been posting around here either! Not because I've been posting elsewhere, just more that I've found online discussion about my interests to be less and less fun, and just doing my interests more fun.

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-12-07, 01:37 AM

BTW, is it normal for manga to update fairly irregularly, or are there any sort of predictable schedules behind them? Because the first manga I followed was FMA, while Brotherhood was wrapping up, so I suspect that was an unprecedentedly fast release schedule. I ask because some time back, I finished all the back chapters of Soredemo Machi Wa Mawatteiru and found out it was an ongoing series, at least in theory. And apparently it's been a few months since it updated...

cobaltstarfire

2015-12-07, 01:22 PM

I suspect it depends on the author, and the publisher?

I've read some manga that seemed to update pretty regularly, but others that had problems and would go on hiatus or be running late. And some author inserts talk about how they're always working themselves to the bone to try to meet deadlines. So some publishers might be more lenient than others?

Hiro Protagonest

2015-12-07, 01:33 PM

For the manga I've read, One Piece has updated weekly, though with lots of small breaks recommended by Oda's doctor. Akatsuki No Yona has been updating at two chapters every two weeks. Pokemon Adventures only has a few magazine chapters every story arc and I have no idea about the creation process for the volumes.

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-07, 05:47 PM

Well I'm eight episodes in currently and feel incredibly safe in deeming it 1000 times better than Futari wa by virtue of

I have no stake in arguing with your opinions. The two shows have a completely different style of characterisation that makes any opinion difference largely one of taste. I personally rank them about the same after finishing both.

1. Not feeling like I'm just watching the same episode over and over again.

That will pass.

Watching one episode a week on average helped a lot. I'd probably have the same opinion if I watched them back to back, I definitely found myself speeding through Heartcatch a lot faster.

If you do get sick of Heartcatch, I'd recommend you finish it but skip episodes.

1-3 (intro)
7-9 (character development)
10 (plot)
13 (plot)
15 (skippable, but has a little Itsuki character development if you pretend Itsuki matters)
17 (plot)
18 (skippable, but has a fan favourite troubled teen of the week
19 (skippable, but the Desertrian fight was the most memorable to me)
20-24 (plot arc)
25-26 (skippable, but its an arc)
27 (backstory)
28-29 (memorable but skippable)
30 (character development but skippable if you care nothing about fairies)
31 (Yuri character development)
32-34 (major plot arc)
35-36 (school festival arc, sort of filler)
37-38 (major plot arc)
39 (essentially filler but not skippable because Erika)
40 (minor plot episode)
41-42 (pair of Yuri focused episodes)
44-49 (major plot arc)

Any episode not mentioned is skippable but not necessarily bad in any way, just didn't grab me as much as the equally skippable ones I listed.

Which is a lot more than I remember there being, so probably not worth it even though you can cut it down to about 24 episodes.

2. The protagonists not being supremely incompetent fighters up until their finishing move.

That changes a lot later on in Futari Wa, remains a problem throughout Heartcatch.

I'm a man, dammit, I'm not supposed to like cute things! :smallmad:

Your lie in April is a boys comic though. Its just hard to tell because it lacks the fanservice in most boy's romance comics.

If you can stand ridiculous fan-service situations Ichigo 100% is good. I stopped reading it for a year once because I cried too much, but that was back when I was young enough to be in the target audience.

I really can't wait until Sith Happens or closet skeleton to get around to giving it a try,

Which will be in 30 weeks unless I decide not to bother finishing or speed up in watching Max Heart (which would be a better show if it could make up its mind who was the main character or to actually be an ensemble like it should be).

On the subject of things I've watched since I last posted in the thread: Michiko E Hatchin is amazing and I would very strongly suggest seeing it to anyone who hasn't (which I would imagine is quite a lot of people).

I never finished it due to the fansubbing slowing to a crawl.

Sadly all I really remember is one episode where a second hand bookshop shared all its titles with one from Ergo Proxy.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-07, 06:45 PM

Okay, so, this is unconfirmed as of when I post this, but I've been seeing posts on a couple of different places alleging, and I would like to stress that word, that there is more Madoka coming. Whether movies or another season, I don't know, but apparently the concept movie that's going to be screened at the Madogatari exhibit is essentially a super "image board" (their word for it, not mine) for the next Madoka project.

■ニュータイプ2016年1月号より。インタビュー
From NewType January 2016; interview.

”コンセプトムービー”について
On the concept movie.

アニメの制作に入る前には、”イメージボード”と呼ばれる作品の雰囲気をつかむための
一枚絵を用意することがよくあるのですが、それと同じような位置づけのものを
今回はムービーで作ってみました。
Before entering production of an anime we usually prepare pictures called “image boards” to get a feel for the atmosphere of it, but in the same vein as before, we decided to try creating a movie instead.
[ie; they drew a picture of what they wanted when they were making the first series; and for the presumably impending production they did a short film instead for the same purpose]

言うなれば贅沢なイメージボード
Having said that, [there are now?] extravagant image boards

『こういうふうにつくる』という、現時点での作品の”核”のようなもの
映画でいうなら、限りなく”予告編”に近いものと言えます
“We’ll do it like this, [we/they] said, and it can be called the “core” of the piece at present, so we can say it’s a unlimited [open-ended?] preview for upcoming things.

・以前から”新作”のためのミーティングを重ねていた
From the previous [film], we’ve been meeting continuously on the topic of a “new production”

・MADOGATARI展は新作の情報を明かすいいタイミングだった
MADOGATARI was good timing to shed light on the new story.

・まどかがバレエを踊っているのもしっかりと新作の本編にあります
Madoka dancing ballet is firmly in this installation of the new story

・マミは三国志の関羽のような”戦いの神様”のイメージで新作ではさらに強くなる
Mami has grown even stronger in the new story, bearing an image reminiscent of Guān Yǔ from the Romance of the Three Kingdoms, like a war goddess.

・仁美やなぎさも新作で活躍します
Hitomi and Nagisa also play an active role in the new story

・コンセプトムービーだけで完結しているのではなく、ここから新しい「魔法少女まどかマギカ」が始まるんだ、ということが皆さんに伝わるといいなと思っています
This will not end with just the concept movie, from here on out, a new Puella Magi Madoka Magica begins, and we hope that this was communicated to everyone.

Sith_Happens

2015-12-07, 10:09 PM

http://www.reactionface.info/sites/default/files/imagecache/Node_Page/images/1314029520391.jpg

BTW, is it normal for manga to update fairly irregularly, or are there any sort of predictable schedules behind them? Because the first manga I followed was FMA, while Brotherhood was wrapping up, so I suspect that was an unprecedentedly fast release schedule. I ask because some time back, I finished all the back chapters of Soredemo Machi Wa Mawatteiru and found out it was an ongoing series, at least in theory. And apparently it's been a few months since it updated...

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/045/771/c49.png

Okay, so, this is unconfirmed as of when I post this, but I've been seeing posts on a couple of different places alleging, and I would like to stress that word, that there is more Madoka coming. Whether movies or another season, I don't know, but apparently the concept movie that's going to be screened at the Madogatari exhibit is essentially a super "image board" (their word for it, not mine) for the next Madoka project.

■ニュータイプ2016年1月号より。インタビュー
From NewType January 2016; interview.

”コンセプトムービー”について
On the concept movie.

アニメの制作に入る前には、”イメージボード”と呼ばれる作品の雰囲気をつかむための
一枚絵を用意することがよくあるのですが、それと同じような位置づけのものを
今回はムービーで作ってみました。
Before entering production of an anime we usually prepare pictures called “image boards” to get a feel for the atmosphere of it, but in the same vein as before, we decided to try creating a movie instead.
[ie; they drew a picture of what they wanted when they were making the first series; and for the presumably impending production they did a short film instead for the same purpose]

言うなれば贅沢なイメージボード
Having said that, [there are now?] extravagant image boards

『こういうふうにつくる』という、現時点での作品の”核”のようなもの
映画でいうなら、限りなく”予告編”に近いものと言えます
“We’ll do it like this, [we/they] said, and it can be called the “core” of the piece at present, so we can say it’s a unlimited [open-ended?] preview for upcoming things.

・以前から”新作”のためのミーティングを重ねていた
From the previous [film], we’ve been meeting continuously on the topic of a “new production”

・MADOGATARI展は新作の情報を明かすいいタイミングだった
MADOGATARI was good timing to shed light on the new story.

・まどかがバレエを踊っているのもしっかりと新作の本編にあります
Madoka dancing ballet is firmly in this installation of the new story

・マミは三国志の関羽のような”戦いの神様”のイメージで新作ではさらに強くなる
Mami has grown even stronger in the new story, bearing an image reminiscent of Guān Yǔ from the Romance of the Three Kingdoms, like a war goddess.

・仁美やなぎさも新作で活躍します
Hitomi and Nagisa also play an active role in the new story

・コンセプトムービーだけで完結しているのではなく、ここから新しい「魔法少女まどかマギカ」が始まるんだ、ということが皆さんに伝わるといいなと思っています
This will not end with just the concept movie, from here on out, a new Puella Magi Madoka Magica begins, and we hope that this was communicated to everyone.

...Consider me morbidly fascinated.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-08, 03:52 AM

...Consider me morbidly fascinated.

**** it, I'm genuinely excited about this. Rebellion wasn't great, but it did a really good job setting up for a continuation.
And if the screenshots I've seen are to be believed, we're going to be getting Tengen Toppa Gurren Mami, and potentially witch Madoka. And more Nagisa and Hitomi, which is never a bad thing in my opinion.

JCarter426

2015-12-08, 10:19 AM

Hi, everyone. I've fallen behind on anime this season due to work, and I've been caught in another situation. I could use some other opinions here.

So, my friend wants me to recommend him an anime. But this is not going to be one of those situations, not the usual kind. See, he's convinced that he doesn't like anime, despite never having seen any. And that's fine. I don't care. He doesn't have to like all the same things I do. It's unreasonable to write off an entire medium based on his misconceptions that are too ridiculous to repeat in public, and he enjoys other animation, including anime-inspired shows like Avatar and Korra, but that's fine. I don't care. I'm content to let him do whatever. But he's pretty insistent on getting a recommendation, I suspect, so he can point at it and say this is why he doesn't like anime. Now, I don't want any part in giving his unreasonable position any resemblance of credibility, nor do I want to force him to watch something he'll refuse to like, but he claims that he would be just as happy to end up enjoying it instead.

Essentially, he wants an anime that will challenge him to accept or reject the entire medium. I don't think that's fair to anyone involved, so as of yet I've refused to name names.

I've talked with another friend about the matter, and he went through more or less the same emotional process I did, from trying to pick a contender to deciding no recommendation is possible because he doesn't deserve to watch it with that flippant attitude, to being tempted to recommend something completely inappropriate out of spite (my other friend suggested Dokuro-chan).

I do know that if I were to give a proper recommendation, it would most likely be Haruhi, based on what I know of my friend's sci-fi inclinations and the series' relative lack certain anime tropes that I suspect would deter him. There are a number of others that I do believe he would enjoy if he were open to the idea, but my other friend concurred that Haruhi was the frontrunner. I'm still debating whether to say anything, though.

I have decided that, before I give any recommendation, my friend must agree to a list of terms that I believe would make the situation more reasonable. The first of which, and he has already agreed to this one, is that he must watch the entire series in full and not judge the whole series and anime in general on one episode. So, using Haruhi as an example, this would mean twenty something episodes and a movie (I'd let him skip most of Endless Eight). He's fine with that amount, but a hundred episodes might be another matter.

So, I'm open to suggestions both for other series and for other terms. Thanks in advance.

Sith_Happens

2015-12-08, 10:42 AM

**** it, I'm genuinely excited about this. Rebellion wasn't great, but it did a really good job setting up for a continuation.
And if the screenshots I've seen are to be believed, we're going to be getting Tengen Toppa Gurren Mami, and potentially witch Madoka. And more Nagisa and Hitomi, which is never a bad thing in my opinion.

*finds concept movie* (http://youtu.be/pR7n1ShhxxQ)

...Dangit, now I'm hyped too. CURSE YOU SHAFT!

(Speaking of which, did this thread really say nothing about the fact that someone made this (http://youtu.be/a1lmhs-ocIs) as an April Fools joke eight months ago? Because I just now discovered it and it's really well done.)

[Snip]

Cowboy Bebop dubbed. If that doesn't work nothing will.

Lethologica

2015-12-08, 10:49 AM

I...um...what? Haruhi is troperriffic, anime-wise. What is it that your friend claims to dislike about anime? And what's his background--has he, like, seen a Miyazaki movie ever?

Some intitial thoughts on anime that lack the stereotypical 'things that are annoying about anime':
-Tokyo Godfathers
-Baccano!
-Samurai Champloo
-Ghost in the Shell (movie is enough IMO, don't need to put him through the whole franchise)
-Ping Pong The Animation
-Ergo Proxy

mallorean_thug

2015-12-08, 12:08 PM

I would also anti-recommend Haruhi. Haruhi is a really great gateway show for people who /want/ to like anime. If your friend is going in wanting to hate anime, Haruhi is not going to change his mind. And the abusive Haruhi/Mikuru dynamic would reinforce his misconceptions because its awful, creepy, and brings down the rest of the show, even if you really like the rest of the show.

I think that the strongest "Show off why anime is great to somebody that has preconceived notions about it" works are (in order):

Hayao Miyazaki films (Porco Rosso, Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away, ect)
Isao Takahata films (The Tale of Princess Kaguya, Only Yesterday, Grave of the Fireflies, ect )
Satoshi Kon films (Millennium Actress, Perfect Blue, Paprika, ect)
Mamoru Hosoda films (The Girl Who Leapt Through Time, Wolf Children, Summer Wars ect)
Masaaki Yuasa works (Ping Pong the Animation, Mind Game, The Tatami Galaxy ect.)
Shinichiro Watanabe works (Cowboy Bebop, Kids on the Slope, Samurai Champloo ect.)
Hiroyuki Okiura films (Jin Roh: The Wolf Brigade, A Letter to Momo)
Mamoru Oishii films (Ghost in the Shell, The Sky Crawlers, ect.)

If you're specifically looking for a TV show rather than a movie, and would like the strongest recommendation possible, it has to be Ping Pong the Animation. Accept no substitutes.

Kato

2015-12-08, 01:31 PM

Cowboy Bebop dubbed. If that doesn't work nothing will.

Basically my first thought. It's straight up the closest thing to Western animation or just Western story telling with huge critical success. If he hates it out of spite, it's not your problem. If he enjoys it, maybe easy him into "more Japanese" things slowly.

Sallera

2015-12-08, 01:36 PM

While it's hard to argue with Ping Pong, I'm also of the opinion that if someone can sit through a season of Mushishi and still dislike anime by means of stereotypes, there's not much hope of convincing them.

Chimmon

2015-12-08, 01:49 PM

I think the most vital aspect of recommending an anime would be matching it up with his interests. If he likes Space Operas Cowboy Bebop would probably go over well, if he doesn't then it won't be something he'd be inclined to enjoy. Some examples of what types of genres he enjoys might be helpful.

Lethologica

2015-12-08, 01:57 PM

The only thing I would say about Bebop is that to a western SF fan it might feel like discount Firefly in the early going and make him feel bored. (On the other hand, if it feels like Firefly without the discount, that's a pretty strong recommendation.)

While it's hard to argue with Ping Pong, I'm also of the opinion that if someone can sit through a season of Mushishi and still dislike anime, there's not much hope of convincing them.
Certainly. I feel like Mushishi, Ping Pong, and GitS hit three different sweet spots. What are some anime we might add to cover the bases, so to speak? I might not add Haibane Renmei, for example, since it's sorta overlapping Mushishi in terms of what part of the anime spectrum it's showing; similarly for Lain and GitS. I was going to suggest Whisper of the Heart or Spice and Wolf, but I'm not well-versed in the romance genre, so I don't have a handle on what anime would be on par with the above and still avoid "anime stuff", for lack of a better term.

Alent

2015-12-08, 02:16 PM

Cowboy Bebop dubbed. If that doesn't work nothing will.

I second this, I would also suggest Robotech/Macross. With Robotech you might actually be able to trick him into thinking he's not watching an Anime as he may have already seen it as a kid. FMA:Brotherhood would also be a strong choice given how good of a story it is.

If it weren't so horribly dated at this point, given his like of Avatar, I'd almost be tempted to suggest Fushigi Yuugi. I think the age and pacing might be problematic, tho'.

If you're feeling particularly evil: Seto no Hanayome. It parodies so much he's bound to see something he likes.

BWR

2015-12-08, 02:38 PM

I hear so many good things about Ping Pong but I could barely make it through the first episode. Neither was I particularly impressed by the first 5 episodes of Cowboy Bebop (not bad, just not interesting).

I think Mushishi was all kinds of awesome, and I love the GitS series. Original movie or SAC really depends on whether someone wants to watch a movie or short episode for their first excursion into that 'verse. I would not use Innocence or SSS or Arise for an introduction.

Ibrinar

2015-12-08, 03:56 PM

Mushi-shi might be a great choice, after all it doesn't have many features that might annoy non-anime watchers in an anime and it is a great show. But of course that doesn't mean it fits everyones taste.

As others have said about Haruhi I wouldn't give it to someone who is prejudiced against animes (also the first non chronological episode is awful as first episode but it is the better viewing order imo.)

FMA has plenty anime tropes though someone who watches the last airbender shouldn't be that bothered by its anime tropes if he isn't determined to criticize it.

Or give up and give him something weird like Bobobo-bo Bo-bobo.

Seirei no Moribito or Last Exile are decent choices if one likes their respective genres.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-08, 04:02 PM

Bebop, Baccano, or FMA would be my recommendations as well. They're all all relatively western, have good dubs, and are frankly just damn good shows.

cobaltstarfire

2015-12-08, 04:19 PM

I'd be careful with Mushi-shi honestly.

it's amazing yeah, but it's really easy to imagine someone getting bored with it. Still seems solid.

I have this feeling that Spice and Wolf might not be quite right, but that's just a gut feeling.

I once met someone that told me that he thought Cowboy Bebop looked stupid, and that all anime is stupid and bad looking. Except Samurai X, he liked Samurai X. So who knows how things will turn out, I've only seen Kenshin and none of the movies, but it seems a really odd choice to like from someone who hates it all and thinks it all looks bad. People are weird and unpredictable I guess.

Ibrinar

2015-12-08, 05:24 PM

True Mushi-shi has no overarching story to keep someones interest, not flashy fights, no comedy to keep people entertained. I'm sure that it is boring to some. (The same goes for Haibane Renmei.)

About Spice and Wolf it is a nice show but it relies pretty much entirely on you liking the banter between the two. Oh it has it's economics and stuff but I don't think somebody who doesn't like their interaction will like the show all that much.

Baccano is great but also a bit weird so you should consider someones taste before recommending it. Well that goes for all shows of course but sometimes you can say "if the person likes the genre they will find this as least acceptable."

ex cathedra

2015-12-08, 09:47 PM

i'd second solid film recommendations; i'm more of a TV-format person, myself, but film is very digestible. if someone is set on not enjoying something, making them sit through the 11 hours it takes to finish many 2-cour anime isn't productive for anyone in involved.

mononoke-hime would be my rec

Arbane

2015-12-09, 03:42 AM

Am I the only person watching One-Punch Man?

https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/1901305_1013340515355723_8971382416011477855_n.jpg ?oh=84d5e99128daf40de0d95a6a20437af9&oe=56C6D098

Lethologica

2015-12-09, 03:47 AM

I'm keeping up with OPM, it's okay. They did more with the premise than I expected the first time I saw the manga popping up. There's still a lot of time it feels like One Joke Man, though.

Arbane

2015-12-09, 05:16 AM

There's still a lot of time it feels like One Joke Man, though.

Now that Saitama's got a supporting cast that aren't as overpowered as he is, it keeps it from getting stale. Someone over on RPGnet came up with a good description of it:

Yeah. To put it another way, Saitama's epic shonen story arc is about developing into a true hero from the other end. That is, not 'I need to train until my power levels are over nine thousand so I can beat the guy who wants to eat the sun!', but "I need to learn how to manage PR and not alienate my colleagues and friends who I technically outclass" and "I need to demonstrate my worth well enough so I can become an S-class superhero".

Instead of ever-more-increasing power, it's all about increasing his Association rankings, making friends, and being less of a ****.

Fri

2015-12-09, 07:04 AM

Mumen Rider ;_;

Also, it's amazes me that eventhough he's the most overpowered being in the setting, and he basically nothing can challenge him, we can still point Saitama is unquestionably heroic.

I can't really explain it well. Basically, you'd think that if nothing can challenge someone, it'd be hard to say that person is heroic. But not saitama. Eventhough his motivation is basically he want to have a good fight, he's also heroic to the core.

Also strangely, I just realized.

It's a common trope lately for some reason, a fantasy story where the mc is already the strongest character and/or at the highest level ever and nothing can reasonably challenge him. Example that I can think out of the top of my head, Log Horizon, Overlord, Mahouka, SAO after first arc, countless lightnovel-based manga (seriously, there's like a billion of those). Most of them kinda annoy me, but OPM is one example that doesn't.

Ibrinar

2015-12-09, 07:18 AM

Log Horizon? The MC is hardly the strongest in personal power iirc?

Fri

2015-12-09, 07:30 AM

Log Horizon? The MC is hardly the strongest in personal power iirc?

But he's still at max level and one of the strongest players already, and the story isn't about him trying to level up to get better power, so I place it in the same group.

Ibrinar

2015-12-09, 07:38 AM

But he's still at max level and one of the strongest players already, and the story isn't about him trying to level up to get better power, so I place it in the same group.

Ah true. Though I think that is an important difference I like stories where the MC is already formidable but there are others on a similiar level, but stories where the MC just outclasses everyone by far have to be handled a bit differently. (Either by it being comedy, by the MC having a weakness, by it being possible to challenge the MC with group tactics and people doing so, by it not really being about fighting etc. )

JCarter426

2015-12-09, 11:08 AM

Thanks for the replies, everyone. I have a lot to think about.

Cowboy Bebop was in fact my first anime. While it clearly worked on me, it's not very typical of anime so I've been hesitant in naming that one. Also, yes, there are some people who don't like Cowboy Bebop. It happens.

I have recommended Fullmetal Alchemist to him before (before he went on his anti-anime crusade) because it's quite similar to Avatar, but I ruled it out for this case due to its length. Also, and more especially with Brotherhood, it has a lot of those chibi comedy moments that I think he'd complain about, even though Avatar did the same thing.

Spice & Wolf is also one I recommend a lot, but not as a first anime. Once you get past the naked wolf girl, it's about romance and medieval. You really can't predict what impression that will have on anyone.

I'm not sure about Baccano! either. A lot of the characters are love them or hate them types, and the order of the narrative could be confusing for someone not paying attention.

Last Exile is one I had considered, but again it's not typical of most anime so I'm not sure.

I'd rather recommend TV than a film, firstly because I prefer TV and therefore have a wider pool to draw from, but also because therefilms anyway. He already agreed to watching a full series, and if it turns out he can't deal with it, then he deserves to be tortured a bit. :smallwink:

A lot of the other recommendations were great, and I'm still considering them in terms of their length and content, and his preferences. Unfortunately there are also a couple I myself have not seen, because I'm a very busy person when I'm not being a very lazy person (and sometimes when I am). But I wouldn't be opposed to dusting off my own list to widen the pool.

And yeah, I know Haruhi uses anime tropes too, but most of the time they're used for parody. So even though it calls moe by name, I'd consider it a more appropriate recommendation for the initiated than K-On!, for example, even though I am a fan of both. I was hoping if he saw them in that sort of environment he'd find them less off-putting. And I'm not trying to hide them things from him, either. I don't want to trick him into thinking anime is something that it isn't, because would leave him with an impression that isn't much better than the one he has now.

However:

Haruhi is a really great gateway show for people who /want/ to like anime. If your friend is going in wanting to hate anime, Haruhi is not going to change his mind.
This has been my concern exactly. Otherwise it would be a done deal. You like aliens and time travel and psychic powers, and you're looking for anime? Well, here you go. But it's not that simple.

If you could imagine his open-mindedness as a spectrum, Haruhi would be at one end, and at the other end would be anything that would at least make him realize that anime isn't whatever the hell he thinks it is. The first end is more ideal, more likely to leave a good impression on the open-minded, but it heavily depends on their willing participation. The problem is I can't read his mindset. So far he has acted... not open-minded, while claiming to be otherwise. So I'm not sure how far into the other end I have to dip.

What I may do is give him a variety of options, and then insist that he at least complete the one he prefers or despises the least. Or maybe give him two very different ones to complete. I'll have to confer with him before I proceed any further.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-09, 12:20 PM

everdeenkatniss

2015-12-09, 12:42 PM

I got a decent chunk of the way through. I forget why I stopped but I don't remember thinking it was awful. It seemed very slow from what I remember and had a bit too much of it explaining everything at times. I'll probably finish it at some point.

Alent

2015-12-09, 01:52 PM

Last Exile is one I had considered, but again it's not typical of most anime so I'm not sure.

I'd rather recommend TV than a film, firstly because I prefer TV and therefore have a wider pool to draw from, but also because therefilms anyway. He already agreed to watching a full series, and if it turns out he can't deal with it, then he deserves to be tortured a bit. :smallwink:

Yeah, I'd never recommend Last Exile as a gateway drug unless you're evil about it and cliffhanger your friend at a point he likes because "I don't have the rest of it" or something. Last Exile had a point near the 3/4 mark where the entire story melted down and became a textbook case of how not to write. Right up until that point? Absolutely brilliant. Past that point? It's all creepy flowers and mind control because the author was trying way too hard to be different.

In fact, too many anime that make it to their second cours crash and burn as a story somewhere in their second cour. It always seems to hit the promising ones the worst- My watched shows list is full of shows like Guilty Crown and Aldnoah Zero that I want to recommend, but can't because their endings were terrible.

Hmm... that made realize I missed a great recommendation- Hataraku Maou-sama! The story is solid, it doesn't have an end of season derail, the cast is good, the humor is amazing. It needs a second season badly.

Guin Saga might also make for an interesting watch depending on your friend's tastes. The world feels like it's pulled straight out of a Conan novel, the art style is a bit of an 80's throwback homage even though it wasn't produced that many years ago. One of my friends wasn't into Anime at the time, but loved Conan movies, saw me watching the show and started following it and raved about it for months.

Has nobody mentioned Trigun yet?

mallorean_thug

2015-12-09, 02:08 PM

I'm really enjoying OPM for the action cuts. And its one joke is pretty funny. The rest of the show is kind of eh, if only because "What does it mean to be a hero?" is feeling terribly played out at the moment, and OPM's specific spin on that hasn't really caught me.

That said, the action cuts make it well worth it, and anybody who isn't watching it really should.

Other current stuff:

Owarimonogatari: Sodachi Lost and Sodachi Riddle were both really good, up there with the best parts of Second Season. Shinobu Mail has been . . . just as uninteresting as Shinobu Time was and kind of disappointing. It was just announced that Koyomimonogatari is going to be airing as an ONA during Winter Season though, so it looks like the -monogatari train is going to keep chugging along until it hits the end of the tracks. I'm looking forward to it. I'm just sad that Aniplex isn't airing Kizu Part 1 in any US theaters. The wait for the BR release is going to be agonizing.

Gundam IBO: The first couple episodes were good, but I actually haven't been following this week to week and need to catch up. Worth it?

Osomatsu-san: It's been very hit or miss, with the first couple episodes being a lot of miss. Thankfully, it seems to have gotten more on target with the last couple episodes being solid hits. And the great colors, layouts, and faces have kept me going through the misses. It was actually announced mid-season that this is going to be a 2-cour show, so I'm looking forward to it carrying into Winter Season, which from a cursory glance looks pretty sparse.

The Perfect Insider: I'm pretty mixed on this one. Parts of it are great, I think the characters all work very well, and the character designs and direction both suit the show perfectly. But its muted colors, muted pacing, and not terribly mysterious main mystery (somebody here called it after ep3, as did I. It really feels like the entire story was written backwards from that "twist") haven't really made me feel very engaged, and I'd be hesitant to actually recommend it to anybody.

Noragami S2: I liked the first arc, but this second arc hasn't been quite up to par AND it feels like its going to end without actually addressing the mysteries its brought up. Meh.

Haikyu S2: Yachi was a great addition to the cast, and I really liked the episode focusing on her. Besides that, it feels like individual episodes are a little stronger than S1, but the overall structure is way less exciting. Like, training arcs are a thing, but we haven't had a single serious game yet. Fortunately, this is also continuing into Winter, so I'm sure I'll get my wishes then.

Oh, and if anybody else wanted to take a crack at giving me some recs as per Post 358 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20163065&postcount=358), I'd really appreciate it.

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-12-09, 02:32 PM

Y'know, I keep really wanting for OPM to randomly cross over with Samurai Flamenco because that would be amazing.

Sith_Happens

2015-12-09, 02:41 PM

Has nobody mentioned Trigun yet?

Ooh, that's a good one too. To mix things up a little though I'm going to suggest starting with the movie (Badlands Rumble) which is really good. Sure it takes place chronologically most of the way through the series, but it's set up in a way that you can still totally watch it as your first Trigun experience and know what's going on, and it doesn't even spoil anything either.

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-12-09, 03:47 PM

Ooh, that's a good one too. To mix things up a little though I'm going to suggest starting with the movie (Badlands Rumble) which is really good. Sure it takes place chronologically most of the way through the series, but it's set up in a way that you can still totally watch it as your first Trigun experience and know what's going on, and it doesn't even spoil anything either.
Well, technically it does reveal Wolfwood as a main character (and a non-antagonist), but that's a small thing only.

JCarter426

2015-12-09, 04:30 PM

Actually, I've just had another thought, dependent on why exactly your friend doesn't like anime. Because I was very much in the mindset that almost all anime was moe**** back when I really hadn't really watched anything but Miyazaki movies, and watching Fate/Zero on the recommendation of a friend quickly disabused me of this notion.
He knows about moe, but finding an anime with relatively little moe (or parodying it, as in Haruhi) isn't a problem. The problem is that frankly, he seems to be under the impression that all anime is both shounen and shoujo at the same time. I have no idea where he got that idea. Although, it kind makes me want to watch one that is.

But regarding Fate, I suppose that's not a bad choice... the only thing is I'm not sure about starting with Fate/Zero. I don't want to get into the whole Fate order debate, but that's not how I watched it, so I couldn't in good conscience suggest that order, because I really don't know if it would work. I started with the Fate/Stay Night anime, and I can't in good conscience recommend that either, so... :smalltongue:

Yeah, I'd never recommend Last Exile as a gateway drug unless you're evil about it and cliffhanger your friend at a point he likes because "I don't have the rest of it" or something. Last Exile had a point near the 3/4 mark where the entire story melted down and became a textbook case of how not to write. Right up until that point? Absolutely brilliant. Past that point? It's all creepy flowers and mind control because the author was trying way too hard to be different.
Well, I liked it. :smalltongue: I liked the world a lot more than the plot, though.

I've decided to give him a list based on all these suggestions and let him choose, and also let him decide if he's open-minded enough. I hope to be back with an update soon.

And in other news, I really envy you people watching One Punch Man. I had been looking forward to it, but then I was too busy to start it and haven't watched a second of it yet. Bah. :smalltongue:

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-12-09, 04:55 PM

But regarding Fate, I suppose that's not a bad choice... the only thing is I'm not sure about starting with Fate/Zero. I don't want to get into the whole Fate order debate, but that's not how I watched it, so I couldn't in good conscience suggest that order, because I really don't know if it would work. I started with the Fate/Stay Night anime, and I can't in good conscience recommend that either, so... :smalltongue:

You could always try Machete-style: watch season 1 of the Unlimited Blade Works adaptation, then watch Fate/Zero now that you have the background of the mage families and the allusions to the prior Grail War, and finish with season 2 of UBW to close out the story.

Steins;Gate talks plenty about anime character tropes and such, but actually steers away from the visual tropes. It also seems to avoid both shounen and shoujo, depending on your friend's definition as such; it's a conspiracy thriller with slices of weirdness and otaku culture. And time travel. Visually, it's really grounded, and would be a good candidate for an intro-to-anime show.

JCarter426

2015-12-09, 05:02 PM

Hiro Protagonest

2015-12-09, 05:24 PM

Well, technically it does reveal Wolfwood as a main character (and a non-antagonist), but that's a small thing only.
It's easy to forget that part of the early episodes is the question of is he really that good?

Eh, Unlimited Blade Works without the Fate route? Really, even if it's wrong, I would have to recommend what I did: Fate/Stay Night anime, Fate/Zero, Unlimited Blade Works... or just the visual novel, which I'm in the middle of at the moment. But the problem is the original Fate/Stay Night anime has issues.

Just watch UBW. It'll be better than sitting through any iteration of the Fate route.

Eldariel

2015-12-09, 05:27 PM

Eh, Unlimited Blade Works without the Fate route? Really, even if it's wrong, I would have to recommend what I did: Fate/Stay Night anime, Fate/Zero, Unlimited Blade Works... or just the visual novel, which I'm in the middle of at the moment. But the problem is the original Fate/Stay Night anime has issues.

Unlimited Blade Works anime explains things well enough, I find. Watching it as a standalone should be feasible. Hell, all the ridiculously long expositions are probably fairly fresh for someone new to the merchandise and it might actually work better as the first experience of the whole. I'd probably watch UBW > FZ myself at this point and just play VN if I wanted the whole story; the original anime is just kind of a mess and poorly spoils some things that would occur in the superior products but done in a better way (I count both the VN and the UBW anime as superior products here).

Lethologica

2015-12-09, 05:34 PM

I would anti-recommend Steins;Gate and original FSN for Annoying Anime Things (TM). Also, it's fine to say Haruhi parodies Annoying Anime Things (TM), but that's like recommending One Punch Man to someone who hates action shounen; in order to parody, you kinda have to do it a lot yourself.

Prime32

2015-12-09, 05:54 PM

Also strangely, I just realized.

It's a common trope lately for some reason, a fantasy story where the mc is already the strongest character and/or at the highest level ever and nothing can reasonably challenge him. Example that I can think out of the top of my head, Log Horizon, Overlord, Mahouka, SAO after first arc, countless lightnovel-based manga (seriously, there's like a billion of those). Most of them kinda annoy me, but OPM is one example that doesn't.Wasn't there was some anime where the writer talked about how the protagonist was going to start weak and grow in power over time, and was told "What you're describing is a shojo anime. Shonen audiences don't want to wait around for the protagonist to get powerful any more, they want them to be like that from the beginning"?

ex cathedra

2015-12-09, 06:22 PM

Oh, and if anybody else wanted to take a crack at giving me some recs as per Post 358 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20163065&postcount=358), I'd really appreciate it.

i considered it, but your completed list essentially doubles my own :smalltongue:
furthermore, the vast majority of things i've liked that you haven't seen are slice-of-life, and most are reasonably episodic.

that said, have you ever considered watching hanasaku iroha (http://myanimelist.net/anime/9289/Hanasaku_Iroha)? it's a great coming-of-age drama, but it also seems entirely unlike the shows you've been watching thusfar.

Mx.Silver

2015-12-09, 06:23 PM

I was actually considering Erin! I'm just always wary of trying to watch long shows with groups of people. But 50 episodes really isn't that bad. Probably my top consideration at the moment.

Michiko and Hatchin was something I actually suggested right after we finished Samurai Champloo with a somewhat facetious "Hey, do you guys want to watch that show again, but in South America this time?" The answer was "Something less episodic, please" So, maybe we'll get around to that a little bit later, but probably not next.

Blast of Tempest isn't really my kind of show, but given my friends' tastes, probably is a good suggestion. I'll keep it in mind.

And I had completely forgotten about Kurozuka again. Thanks for reminding me. I might be greedy and just watch that one by myself real quick.

I can't really blame you, as it's not exactly well-known. My Anime List doesn't even have a complete cast list, despite the voice cast being comprised mainly of reasonably established names.
Not really the most accessible of works, even before you get into the 'heavy references to things non-Japanese audiences are not going to know about' side of things (I only found out it was drawing from the Noh play it shares its name with when I happened to watch a youtube review of Throne of Blood that brought-up the play in question).

Its always good to see you around. And don't worry, its not like I've been posting around here either! Not because I've been posting elsewhere, just more that I've found online discussion about my interests to be less and less fun, and just doing my interests more fun.
I've been in a similar boat, to be honest (albeit one prompted by other factors).
Although this time around I've found myself stuck a slump of essentially spite watching a series, and not a particularly short one either, which has rather exacerbated the general disappointing side of the 'things I've been viewing'. I may post something about it once I've dragged myself through to the end of it.

I should probably just throw up a list of stuff I've seen. Might also mention some of the bad ones I ran into as well if there's something worth talking about in them.

Arbane

2015-12-09, 06:31 PM

As for anime recommendations - someone suggested Miyazaki movies, and while that's a good recommendation in general, I'd suggest Castle of Cagliostro, specifically. It's an oldie but a goodie.

Alent

2015-12-09, 07:12 PM

He knows about moe, but finding an anime with relatively little moe (or parodying it, as in Haruhi) isn't a problem. The problem is that frankly, he seems to be under the impression that all anime is both shounen and shoujo at the same time. I have no idea where he got that idea. Although, it kind makes me want to watch one that is.

You know, this suddenly makes me wonder if he saw and hated Sailor moon back in the day, then someone sales pitched Fushigi Yuugi to him, and he didn't like it, either, and he just decided those two series spoke for all of anime? :smallconfused:

On this note, I would be very surprised if he enjoyed Steins;Gate. I found that one to be very polarizing amongst my friends, and the ones who didn't enjoy it tend to be more strongly opinionated people in general.

Actually, a lot of those people really liked Claymore. Maybe include that one?

Well, I liked it. :smalltongue: I liked the world a lot more than the plot, though.

Don't misunderstand, I liked it, too. The world was phenomenal, the concept was pretty creative, the main characters had a good dynamic, everything was going amazingly... Then Dio's sister showed up. :smallsigh: It was still a good show, but I would expect someone who wanted to not like an anime to get bent out of shape over what she did to Dio and Lucciola.

On this note, have you seen The Recollections of a Certain Pilot (toaru Hikuushi e no tsuioku)? (the movie, not the TV series adapted off a different book from the same series.) It seems to draw some heavy inspiration from Last Exile, and is a really nice story in general.

ImperatorV

2015-12-10, 12:07 AM

Regarding the Fate discussion: I actually watched Fate/Zero before anything else, and after having some more experience with the series I wouldn't have had it another way. Plus, Fate/Zero has rider. That alone warrants a recommendation. Whether it's the best intro series I have no idea.

JCarter426

2015-12-10, 07:04 AM

You know, this suddenly makes me wonder if he saw and hated Sailor moon back in the day, then someone sales pitched Fushigi Yuugi to him, and he didn't like it, either, and he just decided those two series spoke for all of anime? :smallconfused:
Well, I know he hasn't watched Sailor Moon, and to my knowledge he has never seen any anime apart from a few clips a few clips I showed him that were taken completely out of context. Apart from me he knows a few people who he says are into anime, but as far as I can tell what they watch is limited to the really mainstream stuff that's well known outside of Japan. This led me to say on one occasion "I'm not really sure if she actually watches anime. No wonder you have no idea what it is either."

On this note, have you seen The Recollections of a Certain Pilot (toaru Hikuushi e no tsuioku)? (the movie, not the TV series adapted off a different book from the same series.) It seems to draw some heavy inspiration from Last Exile, and is a really nice story in general.
I haven't. I'll have to check it out.

And regarding Fate... I just realized that, assuming my friend does not renounce anime forever, that's probably a series he'd enjoy too, so I am going to have to figure out the proper order. But I'm leaving them off the list for now.

Sith_Happens

2015-12-10, 11:02 AM

Madoka concept movie with subtitles (turn on closed captioning). (http://youtu.be/HAPGAOXMAJQ)

[hype intensifies]

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-10, 11:08 AM

But he's still at max level and one of the strongest players already, and the story isn't about him trying to level up to get better power, so I place it in the same group.

He's not actually max level since there was an expansion, he's just not interested in all the extreme grinding he'd need to get stronger.

But then they added all those weaker characters who are concerned with levelling up.

Gundam IBO: The first couple episodes were good, but I actually haven't been following this week to week and need to catch up. Worth it?

If you like Gundam, the quality hasn't dropped and its got more involving the more we've found out about what's actually going on.

If you don't like Gundam, its too Gundam to convince you to like Gundam.

Last Exile had a point near the 3/4 mark where the entire story melted down and became a textbook case of how not to write. Right up until that point? Absolutely brilliant. Past that point? It's all creepy flowers and mind control because the author was trying way too hard to be different.

Can't really agree. Last Exile's ending is fine and thematically concludes the themes that were brought up earlier. A ton of bad stuff happening to the good guys at the beginning of the last act in a setting that was full of power imbalances and nasty stuff going on in the background is just normal writing.

Brainwashing one of the heroes into a villain is a cliche, its not the author trying to be different and it only happens to one character in a situation that makes sense. Dio never wanting to go near his Sister ever again had been set up as the key point of his character throughout his appearances in the show, not having that pay off would have been terrible writing.

Its not a tour de force of good writing either, but if you want to claim it committed any irredeemable narrative sins then the rules your using are inflexible and useless.

But the problem is the original Fate/Stay Night anime has issues.

All the fate anime have issues.

Plus, Fate/Zero has rider. That alone warrants a recommendation.

On the other hand, it has everyone whose not Rider.

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-12-10, 12:22 PM

On the other hand, it has everyone whose not Rider.
On the other other hand, it has Rider. Also Waver's character arc.

Blondie isn't bad either.

Mx.Silver

2015-12-10, 02:20 PM

Oh, and if anybody else wanted to take a crack at giving me some recs as per Post 358 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20163065&postcount=358), I'd really appreciate it.

Something I just noticed going back over your MAL page: Escalfowne isn't on it.
So assuming that wasn't just an oversight on your part, add that series to the recommendations. It's probably the best Fantasy series of 90s and even if it's not strictly in your wheelhouse, I would be surprised if it doesn't click with at someone in your group.
Also, afaik it's the series where Yoko Kano and Maaya Sakamoto (for whom it was also her first major VA role) first collaborated musically. So, there's that.

cobaltstarfire

2015-12-10, 03:49 PM

Escaflowne is great, I'm glad to see someone else who likes it. (seems most people just pretend it doesn't exist, but it's really solid...I guess that makes it underrated or something).

We started watching Bodacious Space Pirates a few days ago, and it's really interesting to me. I think the mother character is really pretty! (weird observation, but I very rarely see anime characters and think "wow they're really pretty!") Well overall I think I really like the style this one is drawn in too, and the ship designs are really neat.

We're only on episode two, but I'm pretty excited for it, we haven't watched any sci-fi things in a while which helps it to be extra exciting!

On the other side of things I'm making the guy watch Digimon Adventure so that I don't have to explain what's going on in Digimon Adventure Tri. Sadly only the Dub is available (I think this is mostly sad for me cause I hate the Dubs opening theme). Though the Digimon Adventure dub isn't very bad, I can remember the original Japanese being just as corny in its own way so it's about the same even if things are localized and such. I'm still having to fill him in on relative power level of various enemies, since the dub leaves the life stages out when it describes new digimon

Alent

2015-12-10, 03:51 PM

Can't really agree. Last Exile's ending is fine and thematically concludes the themes that were brought up earlier. A ton of bad stuff happening to the good guys at the beginning of the last act in a setting that was full of power imbalances and nasty stuff going on in the background is just normal writing.

Brainwashing one of the heroes into a villain is a cliche, its not the author trying to be different and it only happens to one character in a situation that makes sense. Dio never wanting to go near his Sister ever again had been set up as the key point of his character throughout his appearances in the show, not having that pay off would have been terrible writing.

Its not a tour de force of good writing either, but if you want to claim it committed any irredeemable narrative sins then the rules your using are inflexible and useless.

"You ruined it! :smalleek:" is the natural, expected, and proper reaction any time a story on track to be an 11 out of 10 suddenly drops to a 7 out of 10.

The most defining early scene of the conflict in Last Exile are of soldiers falling to their deaths because the Guild decided that a damaged but functional ship had been "lost", resulting in them pushing the eject button on the only thing keeping it afloat. The uncanny alley effect caused by the early 3DCG combined with the scene of soldiers panicking as their ship fell into the void made the scene all the more poignant. It portrays the horror of war and shows senseless murder in an amazingly powerful way all in one scene.

With the Guild solidly established as an antagonist by that one scene and the tone of the show firmly set by that battle, they didn't need an act 3 plot twist of an evil leader who leads by mindrape. They were actually more intimidating without a leader. Dio's sister could have been a strong personal antagonist to Alex and Dio "on the side" without needing to be main villain and without the tonal dissonance caused by the mind control and bizarre disintegration technology.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-10, 03:56 PM

JCarter426

2015-12-10, 04:22 PM

All the fate anime have issues.
I mean continuity issues, not content issues. :smalltongue: It's not an adaptation of any single path, so it's a rather terrible introduction to the series. And then there's the ending they chose.

Dio's sister could have been a strong personal antagonist to Alex and Dio "on the side" without needing to be main villain and without the tonal dissonance caused by the mind control and bizarre disintegration technology.
I don't know... said bizarre disintegration technology is a big part of the setting. The Guild has a monopoly on technology, but the Exiles are beyond even them, because their world is kind of crap and everybody forgot their origins.

mallorean_thug

2015-12-10, 05:48 PM

I just got done watching episode 12 of Bakemongatari, and I am genuinely disappointed in myself that I thought that there was nothing but fanservice and puns to it before I started watching it. I mean, there is a lot of that stuff, but there are some genuinely incredible moments in between them.

I'm a huge fan of the -monogatari series and NisiOisiN, but I'm going to warn you right now. None of the later stuff matches the highs of Bake (though a couple arcs in Second Season come close). While some of that can be attributed to the source material, a huge part of that comes down to the Director. Tatsuya Oishi was the director for Bake, but Nise onwards is all Yomoyuki Itamura who settled into a much tamer and less engaging visual style and rhythm. What happened to Oishi? Well, right after Bake finished airing, SHAFT announced that they'd adapt the prequel novel, Kizumonogatari, as a feature length movie, to be directed by Oishi . . . and that's basically all he's done for the last 4 years, outside of an episode or two in Monogatari Second Season, along with a couple of SHAFT's top animators (I'd give you names on that, but they've slipped my mind atm.)

So while I'm definitely enjoying Owarimonogatari, I'm far far more excited about the prospects of finally getting to see Kizumonogatari.

I would be super interested in any further thoughts you might have on the series.

DoctorFaust

2015-12-10, 07:44 PM

I'm a huge fan of the -monogatari series and NisiOisiN, but I'm going to warn you right now. None of the later stuff matches the highs of Bake (though a couple arcs in Second Season come close). While some of that can be attributed to the source material, a huge part of that comes down to the Director. Tatsuya Oishi was the director for Bake, but Nise onwards is all Yomoyuki Itamura who settled into a much tamer and less engaging visual style and rhythm. What happened to Oishi? Well, right after Bake finished airing, SHAFT announced that they'd adapt the prequel novel, Kizumonogatari, as a feature length movie, to be directed by Oishi . . . and that's basically all he's done for the last 4 years, outside of an episode or two in Monogatari Second Season, along with a couple of SHAFT's top animators (I'd give you names on that, but they've slipped my mind atm.)

So while I'm definitely enjoying Owarimonogatari, I'm far far more excited about the prospects of finally getting to see Kizumonogatari.

I would be super interested in any further thoughts you might have on the series.

I've only been watching an episode a week, so I can't really give my thoughts about specific arcs, but I do have a few thoughts on the series as a whole so far.

Firstly Fantastic sound direction. Great music, great VAs, and if I'm remembering correctly, pretty damn good foley. Goes a really long way to set the tone of the show, and I appreciate the fact that they're aren't just using cicadas to provide background noise all the damn time.

Second: The characters can be a little hit and miss, in my opinion. Like I said, I'm only 12 episodes into the first season of a multi-season show, but a few of the characters aren't particularly likable *coughHachikujicough* and besides 'Gahara, don't seem to have changed much during their arcs. I'm not sure why people keep telling me that I should be afraid of Nadeko, though.

Third: The animation, when there is any, is very well done. The director made very good use of limited movement and more abstracted backgrounds, and I can definitely see why this style has become the one SHAFT is most notable for. Not the biggest fan of the character designs for the most part, but Oshino's and the Rainy Devil's pretty damn good.

Fourth: The writing can also be a little hit and miss. When characters are just interacting normally, the dialogue is generally very good, but I don't like how quite a lot of the humor seems to be coming from Araragi overreacting to things. Episode 12's probably had the best so far, but episode 11 made me hate a character that hasn't even appeared onscreen, which, you know, is good thing in my book.

So, overall, a damn good show with some amazing visuals, even if it is one that seems to rely on being strange a little too much. Even if the rest of the series had been mediocre as all hell, it still would've been worth it for episode 12 alone. Especially the starry sky scene.

Oh, and Kanbaru is totally best girl. 'Gahara and Araragi's dynamic is great, don't get me wrong, but Kanbaru's perviness and energetic...ness? make her so damn fun to see onscreen.

Alent

2015-12-10, 08:11 PM

I don't know... said bizarre disintegration technology is a big part of the setting. The Guild has a monopoly on technology, but the Exiles are beyond even them, because their world is kind of crap and everybody forgot their origins.

Oh, I don't mean "all guild technology is inappropriate", it's "this one technology that appears once is inappropriate". For all intents and purposes, floater units aside, the Guild is still relatively within the limits of 21st century science- gunpowder, robotics, etc., and that one tech's removal wouldn't threaten that advantage... but it's presence does call into question why they're using gunpowder based weaponry on a space station with no supply of saltpeter when a suitable energy based weapon alternative is available. :smallconfused:

Edit: On an entirely different note, I'm excited, I finally managed to source a subtitled copy of the Lensman anime adaptation. :smallbiggrin: Haven't seen this since Sci-fi aired it forever ago. Wish the E.E. Smith estate would sign off on a DVD release. :smallfrown:

ex cathedra

2015-12-10, 08:58 PM

I've only been watching an episode a week, so I can't really give my thoughts about specific arcs, but I do have a few thoughts on the series as a whole so far.

Firstly Fantastic sound direction. Great music, great VAs, and if I'm remembering correctly, pretty damn good foley. Goes a really long way to set the tone of the show, and I appreciate the fact that they're aren't just using cicadas to provide background noise all the damn time..

Satoru Kosaki's work (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d38N9uR_Y0) on the monogatari series' score (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i96cnkCICys) is really dear to me.

Mx.Silver

2015-12-10, 10:27 PM

Escaflowne is great, I'm glad to see someone else who likes it. (seems most people just pretend it doesn't exist, but it's really solid...I guess that makes it underrated or something).
It is very much an under-appreciated series.
I've always suspected this had a lot to do with how rough a time it had in localisation, at least in the Anglosphere. Its English language dub is extremely bad, going the extra mile by significantly re-writing at least one of the side characters and creating new plot inconsistencies. Then the North America and UK broadcasting licence was picked-up by Fox Kids, who were of the opinion that it wouldn't sell well with the teenage boy demographic they wanted to market it towards. So they got rid of the old opening theme and then proceeded to start heavily editing and cutting the episodes to try and downplay that Hitomi was the protagonist, going so far as to cut the entire first episode from their broadcast run. IIRC they ended-up abandoning the broadcast run before the end anyway.

As a result, it never spread too far outside of those of us in the subs crowd, and so never got the level of attention received by some of its contemporaries.

We started watching Bodacious Space Pirates a few days ago, and it's really interesting to me. I think the mother character is really pretty! (weird observation, but I very rarely see anime characters and think "wow they're really pretty!") Well overall I think I really like the style this one is drawn in too, and the ship designs are really neat.

We're only on episode two, but I'm pretty excited for it, we haven't watched any sci-fi things in a while which helps it to be extra exciting!
Glad you're enjoying it. Also good that you like the space ships, because you will be spending a fair bit of time watching how they're crewed and piloted :smallwink:

cobaltstarfire

2015-12-10, 11:54 PM

It is very much an under-appreciated series.
I've always suspected this had a lot to do with how rough a time it had in localisation, at least in the Anglosphere. Its English language dub is extremely bad, going the extra mile by significantly re-writing at least one of the side characters and creating new plot inconsistencies. Then the North America and UK broadcasting licence was picked-up by Fox Kids, who were of the opinion that it wouldn't sell well with the teenage boy demographic they wanted to market it towards. So they got rid of the old opening theme and then proceeded to start heavily editing and cutting the episodes to try and downplay that Hitomi was the protagonist, going so far as to cut the entire first episode from their broadcast run. IIRC they ended-up abandoning the broadcast run before the end anyway.

As a result, it never spread too far outside of those of us in the subs crowd, and so never got the level of attention received by some of its contemporaries.

That's not too surprising to hear at all, I vaguely remember seeing a few of the dubbed version, but pretty swiftly got sucked up into subs since I had a friend with access to subbed things in general, and a family friend who was Japanese who sometimes gave me recordings of things off of Japanese TV. (Got to see Mewtwo strikes back uncut including the short about the other clones, along with wacky Japanese Commercials, couldn't understand much of what was being said, but it sure conveyed it's story and purpose really well inspite of that).

Thinking back to then, I'm glad that it was near the end of companies picking up anime and butchering or combining them in the name of western localization and such.

Escaflowne has a great soundtrack too, you can't say no to Yoko Kanno. Wasn't there a manga version of Escaflowne that was aimed more at a male audience? I know there's so many different versions of the story, but I've only seen the anime, and the movie...though I don't much like the movie.

Rodin

2015-12-11, 01:30 AM

cobaltstarfire

2015-12-11, 02:24 AM

I actually saw the movie first, and it soured me on the series enough that I never went out and watched it. I did at one point watch the first few episodes, and the tone difference is so great I coudln't believe it was the same series.

Looking around, seems like it would be difficult to (legally) track down. There's used copies available, but after a friend of mine wound up with a load of bootlegs that way once I've never trusted that option when it comes to DVDs.

There were several box sets that were released of the original, though they do look pretty hard to come by cause they're all out of print now. Supposedly Funimation bought the rights for the movie and TV series, but they haven't done anything with them as far as I can tell.

It's a little weird now to realize that what I was watching in highschool was very likely fan-subs on VHS.

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-11, 07:37 AM

"You ruined it! :smalleek:" is the natural, expected, and proper reaction any time a story on track to be an 11 out of 10 suddenly drops to a 7 out of 10.

If you're going to be unreasonable you're not going to convince anyone of the relevance of your hyperbolic conclusions.

Psychopathic hedonistic dictators are pretty standard villains in adventure stories and Last Exile never pretended to be anything but a standard adventure story with cool visuals. So basically your argument is just 'it was only a good show not a great show so it tricked me!'

With the Guild solidly established as an antagonist by that one scene and the tone of the show firmly set by that battle, they didn't need an act 3 plot twist of an evil leader who leads by mindrape. They were actually more intimidating without a leader.

If you prefer impersonal villains that's fair, but that doesn't mean you can call something that's clearly not a plot twist due to not contradicting any previous information a plot twist.

Rich parents mind rape their children in real life, as do autocratic regimes to their citizens, its not something I see as that fantastical. Last Exile just dresses it up differently, which is what the show has been treating every aspect of its narrative all along and is the main reason why people watch it.

Dio's sister could have been a strong personal antagonist to Alex and Dio "on the side" without needing to be main villain

Not really. Someone had to be leading an evil faction within Guild, otherwise you'd end up with 'everyone in Guild is evil' which would be counter to the message of the series. Sure they could have gone with 'the social structure of Guild makes it being good impossible' but this is an adventure series, not a Marxist parable on social engineering and business management.

Adding another villain who wasn't Dio's sister would just have been wasting set up. So you're just being angry about how the show squicked you out, which if the story was inept you wouldn't be effected by so strongly. Maybe the show was better when it was being subtle, but going from subtleness to in your face ness is just a normal narrative progression upping the tension. It means they're following textbooks, not that they're "a textbook of bad ideas".

Lots of stories make the mistake of ramping up the tension too high, but that's not a mistake in their narrative planning, just a case of inelegant execution.

tonal dissonance

I'm not sure you're using that term correctly.

I mean continuity issues, not content issues. :smalltongue: It's not an adaptation of any single path, so it's a rather terrible introduction to the series. And then there's the ending they chose.

I was just being snide. Mostly because I know a guy who hates the DEEN version despite never having watched it or read the novel just because he reads posts by fanboys on Tumbler/Reddit.

But if you're going to say 'it must adapt the novel exactly' then I have no sympathy, no sympathy at all.

All the paths in the novels themselves have continuity issues. The whole thing is full of plot holes if you treat it as three actual diverging stories rather than just 3 separate stories in different worlds.

but it's presence does call into question why they're using gunpowder based weaponry on a space station with no supply of saltpeter when a suitable energy based weapon alternative is available. :smallconfused:

Why use robotic tentacles and giant chainsaws when you have perfectly good guns?

If you're going to use that sort of logic you should have turned it off a 'flying iron clads'.

Arbane

2015-12-11, 02:50 PM

Escaflowne has a great soundtrack too, you can't say no to Yoko Kanno. Wasn't there a manga version of Escaflowne that was aimed more at a male audience? I know there's so many different versions of the story, but I've only seen the anime, and the movie...though I don't much like the movie.

IIRC, there were two different Escaflowne manga, neither of which was much like the anime.
(And thirding this recommendation - Escaflowne's a good show, possibly except for the eccentric art style.)

Sith_Happens

2015-12-11, 03:26 PM

(And thirding this recommendation - Escaflowne's a good show, possibly except for the eccentric art style.)

E.g.- noses that could easily be used as lethal stabbing weapons.

JCarter426

2015-12-12, 12:21 PM

I was just being snide. Mostly because I know a guy who hates the DEEN version despite never having watched it or read the novel just because he reads posts by fanboys on Tumbler/Reddit.

But if you're going to say 'it must adapt the novel exactly' then I have no sympathy, no sympathy at all.

All the paths in the novels themselves have continuity issues. The whole thing is full of plot holes if you treat it as three actual diverging stories rather than just 3 separate stories in different worlds.
The anime treated it as all one story, rather than three separate stories. That's exactly the problem here.

It doesn't have to adapt the visual novel exactly... but because it doesn't, it doesn't fit with the other adaptations that well. It's a loose adaptation of the whole visual novel rather than a more accurate adaptation of one of the paths, while the later adaptations more or less stick to each path. There is no accurate adaptation of the Fate path, the introduction in the visual novel, so it's hard to recommend the Fate/Stay Night anime as an introduction to the series. If you just want to watch the one Fate/Stay Night anime it's fine, but if you plan to watch it as part of a series, there are other factors to consider.

I mean, it's not a huge problem. As I said, that was what I watched first, and there weren't any disasters. I was just a little confused as to how to proceed afterwards. But knowing what I know, I still hesitate to recommend it to anyone else. Which is unfortunate because I thought they got a lot of things right. If you could cut out the content from the other paths, and replace that with some of the details that were glossed over, and make the ending just a bit less anticlimactic (although that's mostly down to the source material) then it would be a fine adaptation.

And on a completely unrelated matter, I just started watching Bakemonogatari as well. It's been on my list for years, so when I saw mention of it here I thought now is as good a time as any. And I'm liking it so far. I like non-traditional fantasy, and the visual style is really distinctive... not just the art, but the camera placement, the way CGI is used to make elements stand out, and then the abstract stuff. One of my favorite bits of those was with the typo of Araragi's name.

Prime32

2015-12-12, 03:57 PM

The anime treated it as all one story, rather than three separate stories. That's exactly the problem here.

It doesn't have to adapt the visual novel exactly... but because it doesn't, it doesn't fit with the other adaptations that well. It's a loose adaptation of the whole visual novel rather than a more accurate adaptation of one of the paths, while the later adaptations more or less stick to each path.Not... really? :smallconfused: It's an adaptation of the Fate route with a few minor scenes from UBW thrown in (e.g. "Shirou encounters Rider"), and some original content including a short arc with Caster that's inspired by both UBW and HF. And in terms of tone it's all Fate.

JCarter426

2015-12-12, 04:55 PM

Yeah, but that's kind of a problem because the later path adaptations have to either repeat that stuff or skip it even though it belongs in that path. Like I said, it's not a big problem, but I think that stuff would've been better off left out of the Fate route.

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-13, 03:18 PM

I don't see what's so anti-climatic about
killing the badguys in a way that requires previous character growth and then the heroine choosing a new different path due to character growth.

An anticlimax to me is where one of these things happen:

1. Most of the story threads are left hanging.
2. The conclusion is different to what was previously expected:
a) The problem is solved by a previously unimportant character and isn't tied into previous character development (deus ex machina)
b) The scope and tension drops dramatically
c) Completely new plot threads are introduced and solved instead of the solutions the story was building towards
d) The story shows that it clearly has nothing actually to say about the themes its brought up (which is different to the story asking a question and then admitting it doesn't have an answer which can still say a lot if its done well)
3. The general quality/budget drops

Missing an epilogue can't be an anti-climax because by definition epilogues come after climaxes.

ZaneShadow

2015-12-15, 02:17 PM

Somewhat late, but am I the only one that was really mad about how Rokka no Yuusha ended their first season?

Sallera

2015-12-16, 07:47 AM

DoctorFaust

2015-12-16, 12:41 PM

I've had quite a bit of free time over the past few days after finally finishing my goddamn engineering design project for the semester, so I finished up Bonnouji. The story was kinda cliche, and I didn't like how they kept time-skipping without giving any indication of it, but it was adorable and heartwarming, so I enjoyed the hell out of it.

Oh, and because I'm a massive, massive nerd, I'd like to share a picture I took a few days back.
http://i.imgur.com/KrggVQv.jpg

ex cathedra

2015-12-16, 12:55 PM

No, you were certainly not. The abrupt tonal shift was grating, the BGM for the last few minutes was awful by comparison, and I was basically wondering where the heck the person who directed the rest of the show had disappeared to. They'd have been better off just ending it with the last exchange with Flemy.

to be honest i'm all about the mystery genre but the fact that the entire first season of what was ostensibly an action/adventure anime turned into a locked room mystery was off-putting for many viewers in its own right

CarpeGuitarrem

2015-12-16, 02:22 PM

Oh, and because I'm a massive, massive nerd, I'd like to share a picture I took a few days back.
http://i.imgur.com/KrggVQv.jpg
You are an absolute nerd and that is amazing. :smallbiggrin:

Sith_Happens

2015-12-18, 11:09 PM

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/641/298/448.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/K2LS5CJ.gif
EDIT:
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/b7/a5/b5/b7a5b5d9a27386d1f9024c71f92584b4.jpg
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/288/653/844.jpg
SUNSHINE IS BEST PRECURE.

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-19, 06:13 AM

SUNSHINE IS BEST PRECURE.

In that episode, yes.

... I'm sorry.

Sith_Happens

2015-12-19, 02:27 PM

In that episode, yes.

... I'm sorry.

Define "next few," because I'm on 29 now and the Sunshine Train has yet to stop.:smallcool:

...Notwithstanding that Toei apparently couldn't be bothered to animate a whole three-person transformation sequence and just cut hers up with Blossom+Marine's instead and hoped no one would notice.:smallannoyed:

ex cathedra

2015-12-19, 05:19 PM

the owarimonogatari arc that (along with the season) wrapped up this week was pretty good, not to mention totally gorgeous; the art direction in the gaen-focused episodes was among the best i've seen since the first season.

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-19, 07:40 PM

Define "next few," because I'm on 29 now and the Sunshine Train has yet to stop.:smallcool:

I can't remember. Between her appearance and the final arc Cure Sunshine did nothing else I found memorable.

I only kind of vaguely recall her sort of jumping into a barrier/support roll for most of the combat scenes (sure she finishes the odd monster off but that just makes her interchangeable with the other two). Definately felt like "You've had your moment of awesome, now you have to ignore most of your martial arts skills so you don't get to overshadow your sempai".

I suppose the force fields are useful, but compared to Splash Star where everyone had force fields and flight as basic abilities just using force fields a fairy gives you seems lame. She doesn't even hit an enemy with a force field so hard it carves out a massive valley.

She's just kind of there for most of the rest of it. Does she even get a catchphrase?

Sith_Happens

2015-12-19, 08:35 PM

I can't remember. Between her appearance and the final arc Cure Sunshine did nothing else I found memorable.

You mean like
nearly taking out Sasorina? Because Blossom and Marine never even thought of trying that when it was just the two of them.

Does she even get a catchphrase?

Haven't heard it enough to remember it precisely yet, but it's something like "That darkness in your heart, I will purify it with my light!"

Quild

2015-12-21, 04:20 AM

Twelfth and last episode of One Punch Man really was impressive. I loved the whole thing, but that last episode... wow.

It's going to be a long wait for season 2, even with some OAV between:smallfrown:

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-22, 08:55 AM

You mean like
nearly taking out Sasorina? Because Blossom and Marine never even thought of trying that when it was just the two of them.

Don't remember.

But I got used to seasons where Sasorina would have been dead by episode 7. Its not like any of the generals are really a threat in Heartcatch apart from Dark Pretty Cure who doesn't do any of the general things. The idea that a late comer party member would even get to fight the first episode boss is kind of odd genre wise. But that's mainly due to me not having seen the other series where long lived generals are common.

Strategically, killing Sasorina doesn't make any sense. Desert Apostles creating Desertarians for Pretty Cure to purify is a net positive in this setting. Keeping wimpy generals like Sasorina around and farming them for Heart Seeds is just good tactics. Which is most of the problem with the Desert Apostles as villains in general. Pretty Cure would be useless at fixing anyone's problems or helping the heart tree if there was nobody around to create Desertarians.

If Itsuki and Eirika hadn't gotten possessed, they never would have had the character development to become Pretty Cure in the first place. This gets even worse later with an event I won't spoil even though you've probably already guessed its going to happen.

Which basically ends up meaning that if the bad guys hadn't created any Desertarians, earth would have been doomed. Nobody expects to be recommended a magical girl show for smart villains, but even in its genre Heartcatch's are dumb. When most villains accidentally give the heroes a power up its because they underestimate the hero's resolve, the Desert Apostles just do the same thing week after week knowing it only really helps the good guys.

In Furari wa, sending out generals also helps the good guys but only when a general dies and the bad guys have a time limit and limited resources that they have to risk. Splash Star and Yes! actually have proper Xanatos Gambits so their villain plans actually make sense.

Heartcatch's generals aren't badly developed, they just don't seem to have 6x the development of other series generals despite lasting for 6x as long. Killing off generals every 7 episodes isn't the deepest form of narrative progress but at least it feels like progress.

Its not like I don't like sunflower macross missiles or find it interesting when people like characters who aren't normally fan favourites, I just found the obvious directorial change between Sunshine's first appearance and the subsequent monster of the week episodes jarring.

Haven't heard it enough to remember it precisely yet, but it's something like "That darkness in your heart, I will purify it with my light!"

Which just has none of the idiosyncratic oddity that makes Blossom and Marine's ones memorable.

Sith_Happens

2015-12-23, 08:18 PM

Don't remember.

But I got used to seasons where Sasorina would have been dead by episode 7. Its not like any of the generals are really a threat in Heartcatch apart from Dark Pretty Cure who doesn't do any of the general things. The idea that a late comer party member would even get to fight the first episode boss is kind of odd genre wise. But that's mainly due to me not having seen the other series where long lived generals are common.

Strategically, killing Sasorina doesn't make any sense. Desert Apostles creating Desertarians for Pretty Cure to purify is a net positive in this setting. Keeping wimpy generals like Sasorina around and farming them for Heart Seeds is just good tactics. Which is most of the problem with the Desert Apostles as villains in general. Pretty Cure would be useless at fixing anyone's problems or helping the heart tree if there was nobody around to create Desertarians.

If Itsuki and Eirika hadn't gotten possessed, they never would have had the character development to become Pretty Cure in the first place. This gets even worse later with an event I won't spoil even though you've probably already guessed its going to happen.

Which basically ends up meaning that if the bad guys hadn't created any Desertarians, earth would have been doomed. Nobody expects to be recommended a magical girl show for smart villains, but even in its genre Heartcatch's are dumb. When most villains accidentally give the heroes a power up its because they underestimate the hero's resolve, the Desert Apostles just do the same thing week after week knowing it only really helps the good guys.

In Furari wa, sending out generals also helps the good guys but only when a general dies and the bad guys have a time limit and limited resources that they have to risk. Splash Star and Yes! actually have proper Xanatos Gambits so their villain plans actually make sense.

Heartcatch's generals aren't badly developed, they just don't seem to have 6x the development of other series generals despite lasting for 6x as long. Killing off generals every 7 episodes isn't the deepest form of narrative progress but at least it feels like progress.

Its not like I don't like sunflower macross missiles or find it interesting when people like characters who aren't normally fan favourites, I just found the obvious directorial change between Sunshine's first appearance and the subsequent monster of the week episodes jarring.

Given what a partial Tacting did to Sasorina I got the impression that a full one wouldn't have killed so much as magically turned her good somehow (something something Flower of the Heart).

As for whether the villains would have been better off doing nothing, in the first episode Cure Moonlight more or less says that the only way to kill the Great Heart Tree is by withering enough Flowers of the Heart. So it's sort of a damned-if-you-do-damned-if-you-don't situation; sure, every defeated Desertarian directly works against their cause, but if they don't keep trying it anyways they'll for sure never get what they want.

If you're looking for plot holes here the question is actually "Why does the Great Heart Tree need to have foliage when just the trunk and branches are sufficient to keep the world from becoming a desert," which at least as of episode 28 no one has answered.
EDIT:

O_O

*spits coffee*

Three words:

PRECURE SHINING FORTISSIMO

http://i.imgur.com/lA8E2DU.gif

(What can I say, I'm a sucker for new special attacks.:smallbiggrin:)

EDIT 2:

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/534229504273960962/jHpg6zqT_400x400.png

Closet_Skeleton

2015-12-24, 05:25 AM

If you're looking for plot holes here

Villains being stupid isn't a plot hole unless the villains are supposed to be smart.

There is a better no prize for why the villains aren't actually acting strategically, but I've reached the point where I can't discuss anything about this series without spoiler territory.

Most of the villains for the previous episodes are basically irrelevant to the actual villain's plan.

The series does more or less just get better from around episode 32.

Sith_Happens

2015-12-24, 06:56 PM

https://33.media.tumblr.com/ca4896daabd0121e341c633394eb2077/tumblr_n4bg6a1ZBc1rh04iio2_500.gif
EDIT: Why does nothing good ever seem to happen after school festivals!?

Sith_Happens

2015-12-27, 02:31 AM

Aaaaaaand done (except for the movie, but that can wait).

http://i1.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/007/762/337.gif

Ibrinar

2015-12-29, 05:38 AM

to be honest i'm all about the mystery genre but the fact that the entire first season of what was ostensibly an action/adventure anime turned into a locked room mystery was off-putting for many viewers in its own right

That is the only thing that made it an interesting show though, the first episodes, before it revealed what kind of show it actually is, weren't all that good. Good enough to give it a few episodes but not all that interesting. (Personally I'm not bothered by the ending. Not well executed maybe, but I think many people are bothered because they think a new seventh member resets everything and the other complaints are exaggerated by that.)

Thanqol

2016-01-01, 12:16 AM

Sith_Happens

2016-01-01, 07:10 AM

So I just blindly watched the first episode of Kill La Kill.

I feel like someone should have been filming me for a youtube reaction video or something. I don't know what I was expecting but it wasn't that.

I feel confident in saying that this perfectly describes literally everyone who watched it when it aired.

Morph Bark

2016-01-01, 07:32 AM

I've mostly been watching older anime rather than new ones from last year, but I've been sorta keeping up with One Punch Man and enjoying it quite a bit.

In the past weeks, I've watched a bit of Witch Hunter Robin, but none of the characters really resonated with me, so I dropped it after the second episode. Still, it's got a decent premise and the animation looks good, with especially the environment creating a nice atmosphere.

I've continued to crawl through Shigatsu wa Kimi no Uso (Your Lie In April). Since it's Slice of Life, I don't really feel like watching much of it in one go, but I'm really enjoying it, and I'm roughly halfway now.

Watched two episodes of Prison School, one the second dubbed. It's... it's something alright. I really like the delivery of the lines, turn something that might otherwise be a minor joke into a hammy dramatic moment, but the entire premise the concept is based on is way, wayyy too much.

Which now brings me to No Game No Life, which also has plenty of ecchi moments, but is less far beyond what I'd like to see, and delivers it much better than many anime do. I'm enjoying the cleverness and humour a lot, and the characters nearly all seem to be pretty interesting. Wish it used a bit more of the side characters though, even just by naming them. Seems a bit like wasted potential.

Eh, Unlimited Blade Works without the Fate route? Really, even if it's wrong, I would have to recommend what I did: Fate/Stay Night anime, Fate/Zero, Unlimited Blade Works... or just the visual novel, which I'm in the middle of at the moment. But the problem is the original Fate/Stay Night anime has issues.

While this discussion is from a while ago, I'd like to say that I started with Fate/Stay and got absolutely turned off by it. Most of the characters it focused on were really bland, and it wasn't well-paced. I hesitantly tried out Fate/Zero, and was drawn in immensely. Sure, some of the characters are cliche, but they were less bland than in Fate/Stay, and there were plenty of other characters with a lot of screentime that were very likeable.

Because Unlimited Blade Works is essentially a retread of much of Fate/Stay (from what I've heard), I've never bothered with it.

Eldariel

2016-01-01, 12:32 PM

Because Unlimited Blade Works is essentially a retread of much of Fate/Stay (from what I've heard), I've never bothered with it.

I wouldn't say that's fair. It's a different story, focuses on different characters (more specifically, the servants get more air-time) and things develop more naturally IMHO. Also, given it's just a superior product, I think it'd be a safe bet the reactions to the old FSN aren't a good predictor of your reactions to UBW. Give it a go; it's actually quite different. Shirou is a very different character between UBW and Fate (and the story has a different focus character-wise), and the small chunk of UBW that was included in the old FSN is really just a bastardization anyways.

Marqod

2016-01-01, 03:51 PM

What's everyone planning to check out in the upcoming season?

Personally, I'll be following GATE, which is back after a 1-season break, at the very least.
Schwarzesmarken will get at least a few episodes to see if they mess things up as badly as in the Total Eclipse anime, which was also set in the Muv-Luv setting, although at a different point in time.
Dagashi Kashi also seems decently interesting.

Beyond that, things seem a bit dull.

Going past the upcoming season, I'm already pretty interested in watching Macross Delta after seeing the preview of most of the first episode.
Looks like it's going to take some of the interesting aspects from AKB0048, another Kawamori project, plus some of that Macross 7 vibe with the singers properly being a part of the action.
Has anyone else here taken at look at it so far?

mallorean_thug

2016-01-01, 04:48 PM

I'm a couple days late, but the end of the year means its time for numbered lists.

Here's my top 10 anime tv shows that finished airing in 2015:

First, some honorable mentions: One Punch Man, Blood Battlefront Blockade, Parasyte, Noragami S2, Ore Monogatari, Knights of Sidonia S2

Death Parade
https://kayerzalee.files.wordpress.com/2015/04/deathparade11-1.png

When Death Parade was announced, I was cautiously excited. Death Billiards was a pretty great short when it aired, and the concept definitely had some promise for an episodic tv show. Really, the only problems it could have if it stuck to that formula was being a wee bit heavy handed, and possibly having a difficult time selling us on the presumable recurring character Decim, who was a bit of an emotionless enigma in the short.

As it turns out, the show enthusiastically plowed into both of those things, not really caring if it came off too melodramatic, and adding in an overarching story to try to develop its recurring characters. The former meant that it had enough self-confidence to successfully pull off some pretty ridiculous drama beats, but the latter is where the show stumbled for me and ended up this far down the list. While Chiyuki's personal story ended up working really well, in part due to the stand out figure skating scene in the penultimate episode, I never felt like there was any reason to care about any of the arbiter characters, their machinations and politics, or the setting, and the episodes spent on that could have definitely been better spent on another game or two.

Overall the show is strong enough that most people should probably give it an episode or two, and I could definitely see it ranking higher on other people's lists.

Your Lie in April
http://www.anigamers.com/uploads/entries/Kousei_20150412120155.jpg

What can I say, I'm a sap for very well executed melodramas, and shows with a focus on music. This one had both of those things!

Yeah, I can't really think of anything interesting to say here.

Garo Honoo no Kokuin
http://i0.wp.com/angryanimebitches.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/vlcsnap-2015-02-21-21h02m06s250.png

Another show that started in 2014 but ended this year, and contributed to how ridiculously good Winter season was this year. Garo never really attempted to be more than an animated but otherwise standard tokusatsu show (unlike, say, Samurai Flamenco last year), but it did so with such consistent style and confidence that I couldn't help but enjoy myself. And more amazingly, it made heavy use of CG in a way that never felt out of place or bugged me, and didn't even strictly limit itself to keeping all the impressive action scenes purely in CG, as exemplified by the scene from the above screenshot. Heap on top of that both of its great OPs, and a well developed cast of characters, and you have a show that people will hopefully put out there as a solid action show rec for years to come.

As far as the other Garo show that started airing this year . . . the less that is said about it, the better. If I was giving out a "Disappointment of the year" award, it would probably win it, despite the fierce competition on that front this year.

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure: Stardust Crusaders
https://res.cloudinary.com/the-news-hub/image/upload/q_60,f_auto/v1429335312/gowvxftt4eszmw2bxdti.jpg

Honestly, I thought that much of the first half of Stardust Crusaders really didn't live up to Battle Tendency, or even parts of Phantom Blood. Not because I disliked the stretched out episodic format, but because that format also lead to a lot of fights without interesting villains or high stakes. The conclusion of the show definitely remedied that. Dio and his trusted lieutenants were a far more interesting and formidable cast than what came before, and despite that, the show never lost its signature humor either.

I'm very much looking forward to Diamond is Unbreakable this coming year.

Prison School
https://res.cloudinary.com/the-news-hub/image/upload/q_60,f_auto/v1437501849/f2vmevdd7rha30rbnlrl.jpg
Honestly, the fact that I enjoyed this show this much is a bit of a surprise given my usual tastes, which don't normally include raunchy sex comedies. But I do enjoy shows that push the word ridiculous to its breaking point, and I especially enjoy shows that Mizushima directs (Girls und Panzer, Shirobako, ect), so given the reputation the manga has, I had to give it a chance. I'm glad I did.

Everything about this show is about taking ideas to their logical breaking point and beyond. Nothing is done in half measures, and the show is better for it. While it does slavishly recreate the manga, the comedic beats are well adapted to the change in pacing from switching formats, and the voice cast is well worth it, especially Hana and Gakuto.

I'm not sure whether I'd say that people should actually give this show a shot, but you should definitely know that, for what this show does, it does it perfectly. Maybe that's your cup of tea, maybe it isn't.

Gatchaman Crowds Insight
https://formeinfullbloom.files.wordpress.com/2015/08/hajimechinose3.png

Everybody here probably knows how much I love Kenji Nakamura's work. And the first season of Gatchaman Crowds was no exception. Its ending message was a wee bit optimistic, and it had the snafu around how the last episode aired, but the show overall was bright and colorful, but with meaning, purpose, and a message. Just how I like my anime. That said, I was kind of worried about how a second season would go. Like, sure I wanted more Gatchaman Crowds, but only if it was going to live up to the first season. Otherwise, I'd much rather Nakamura jump into another new, fresh idea.

Well, Insight not only managed to match the first season, but in some ways even surpass it. It used the first season's thoughts on the internet and society as a spring board to jump into a surprisingly nuanced political critique that I found far more convincing than Nakamura's last attempt ( in fact, I so strongly disagreed with his message in [C] that I don't think I can give the rest of the show a fair shake independent of it). And while I liked his understated approach towards Hajime in the first season, it definitely lead to a lot people misunderstanding her purpose in the show. This time, he approached her with all the subtlety of a sledgehammer, ensuring that nobody could mistake her for something she wasn't this time.

Really, my only complaint about the show was how it sidelined and ignored Rui this time around. Sure, this outing was Tsubasa's turn to be the protagonist, but of all the threads that were advanced from the first season, his definitely felt the most lackluster. It honestly reinforces my slightly negative feelings about the optimistic end of the first season, as it makes it seem that Nakamura really didn't have a good idea of "What next" and how his "solution" would really play out.

Either way, Gatchaman Crowds is definitely worth your time, and in a weaker year would definitely be a couple spots higher.

Owarimonogatari
http://i.imgur.com/jBbzbh5.jpg

It was more -monogatari . . .

Oh, I should probably say more than that.

Ougi Formula, Sodachi Riddle, and Sodachi Lost, but especially Sodachi Lost, were all up there with the absolute best arcs the franchise has to offer. Ougi is a fantastic villain, and while Second Season showed us how interesting it can be to take a break away from Ararararagi's viewpoint, coming back to him to finally give him some much needed character development is definitely the direction the show needed to head towards.

And with Koyomimonogatari airing as ONAs during winter season, its a direction we get to continue in right away.

Even better, Aniplex USA announced that Kizumonogatari will be making a run through US theatres starting in February, so I'll probably get a chance to see that too!

Its a good time to be a -monogatari fan, and I hope anybody else that hasn't joined us yet will give it a try.

Yuri Kuma Arashi
https://ramensoupreviews.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/yurikuma-watercolor.jpg

Even the worst Ikuhara show is much much better than most things. Yurikuma was hurt by its very short runtime as it struggled to get viewers invested in its characters from the beginning of the show, but when push came to shove towards the end, I found that I had grown to love its main cast of lilies and bears.

And that's honestly the only thing pulling the show down. Its symbolism worked, its presentation was phenomenal if slightly limited by production constraints, and it probably flat out had the best ending of anything that aired this year. Sure, its no Penguindrum or Utena, but that's an incredibly high standard to hold a show to. Everybody should watch this one. Gao Gao.

Sound! Euphonium
http://wrongeverytime.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/HorribleSubs-Hibike-Euphonium-08-720p.mkv_snapshot_20.22_2015.05.26_17.51.361.jpg

If there's any overarching story to my favorite shows this year, its that good directors continue to make great shows. Despite initially missing the buss on K-ON!, Naoko Yamada has easily made it onto my shortlist of directors to pay attention to (I don't think I ever squee'd in this thread, but her giving Koe no Kotachi the movie treatment was the best news of the entire year). And Euphonium is a large part of the reason why.

It just effortlessly captures so many of the small (and large!) details of adolescence and the struggles involved in finding and caring about the things your enjoy. I was in band throughout middle school and high school, so maybe part of my enjoyment was based in how much it reflected my own experiences, but Sound Euphonium managed to capture that essence in a way that many "sports" shows don't always find the time to, between their focus on training and on tournament drama.

I'll eagerly be awaiting the already announced second season, and hopefully anybody that dismissed this season as another "Cute girls doing cute things" show will reconsider in time to join me.

Shirobako
http://www.digitaljournal.com/img/4/5/4/4/9/2/i/2/3/1/o/Shirobako_EP_23_Screengrab_9.jpg

If you never heard the buzz around this show, I don't know what rock you've been hiding under for more than a year (and it definitely wasn't in this thread given our conversation topics about a year ago).

Shirobako was a great workplace drama that focused on the stress and struggle involved in the industry we all hold dear. It was a love letter to anime, and deeply committed to showing the love that creators everywhere pour into their craft. I really don't know what more I can say. Should I talk about how great Mizushima's self-caricature director was throughout the show, and how the storming of the publisher building at the end was the perfect capstone for his arc? Or the scene represented by screenshot above gave the perfect payoff for a certain other character? Or how Anno saved Christmas last year? Or how much fun the Bluray bonus episodes of the in-show shows were, and how the fact that the staff actually produced them was really really cool?

For me, just about everything about this show was perfect. And the amount that it helped pull back the curtain on anime production and elevate the conversations on that topic around the community was only icing on the cake. Please watch this show.

Wowow, that ended up being a lot of words. I think I've used up my daily allotment. I'd love to hear what everybody else's favorite shows were from last year. I /think/ that I managed to watch most of the good ones, but I do still intend to go back and finish Concrete Revolutio and Akatsuki no Yona when I get a chance, based on what I've heard here and elsewhere. Either way, while Summer and Fall ended up being a little weak, I think that I can say that the year overall was a pretty good one, and almost definitely better than last year IMO.

Here's to a great 2016 too!

DoctorFaust

2016-01-01, 05:01 PM

What's everyone planning to check out in the upcoming season?

Akagami no Shirayukihime, Dagashi Kashi, GATE, Akagami no Shirayukihime, Phantasy Star Online 2, Luck & Logic maybe, Schwarzesmarken, Akagami no Shirayukihime, Macross Delta, Mahou Shoujo Nanta Mou Ii Desu Kara.

Oh, and Akagami no Shirayukihime. Maybe even Akagami no Shirayukihime, if I can fit it in.

Has anyone else here taken at look at it so far?

Yes, and I did so in an entirely legal fashion. I don't have a lot of thoughts about it so far, since we've only gotten one episode, but I do like Freyja. Kind of reminds me of a combination of Ranka Lee and Momo Kisaragi. Also, two of the VF-31s and their pilots appeared to have the same color scheme as Alto and Ozma, but I might just be looking for similarities between Delta and Frontier. I am fairly certain that Hayate was wearing a fold quartz pendant, though.

And on an unrelated note, I'd be interested to hear people's thoughts about the Animator Expo shorts that have been released recently, especially ENDLESS NIGHT and Neon Genesis Impacts/

Kurenai Misuzu

2016-01-01, 05:09 PM

I was in band throughout middle school and high school, so maybe part of my enjoyment was based in how much it reflected my own experiences, but Sound Euphonium managed to capture that essence in a way that many "sports" shows don't always find the time to, between their focus on training and on tournament drama.

It isn't just the band experience it resonates with. The workings of the band and the eternal push and pull between passion and relaxing and to figure out what you even want and what you ought to do also captures what my student council experience in high school was like. I imagine it's the same for people who did high school sports or really any kind of formalized activity at that age. And beyond that, it just reflects the high school experience really well. Only thing that could make the mountain climb seem more like the stuff we got up to back then would be if they got drunk and/or high at the summit.

kamikasei

2016-01-01, 05:43 PM

What's everyone planning to check out in the upcoming season?
I'll be watching Dagashi Kashi unless it actively pisses me off at some point, and continuing with Iron-Blooded Orphans. I'll check out Macross Delta, and certainly give Sekkou Boys a go. I'd like to hope that Myriad Colours Phantom World will be good, based on the studio, and Dimension W has some points of interest, but both seem like I should wait and see what others have to say before trying them out. And a friend recommends both Kono Subarashii Sekai ni Shukufuku wo! and Boku Dake ga Inai Machi/ERASED, so I'll probably give at least one of them a shot. The availability of easy streaming will affect what I'm likeliest to watch. Mostly, though, barring surprises, it looks like a fairly quiet season, which is fine by me. I've got several shows from recent seasons and older that I want to catch up on.

cobaltstarfire

2016-01-01, 05:50 PM

I'm not in touch enough to know what's coming out soon! But I'm sure we'll end up looking at a few as we work on finishing up our list. (or in between trying to find it anyway...)

Speaking of which we finished Bodacious Space Pirates, and I'm very sad to see it go. It was just so fun , and I really liked the way the ships were designed and how space in general were handled. The sci-fi bits of it were also very enjoyable.

Of course over the holidays there's been a lot of shuffling around so we lost the list (again) I'm sure the poor old battered and food stained thing will reappear eventually and when it does I'll let you all know what we'll be trying next. :smallbiggrin:

mallorean_thug

2016-01-03, 04:43 PM

What's everyone planning to check out in the upcoming season?

GET HYPE tier:
Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu

Should be Good tier:
Boku Dake ga Inai Machi
Prince of Stride: Alternative

Might be Ok tier:
Myriad Colors Phantom World
Dimension W
Haruchika
Active Raid

Sequels
Koyomimonogatari
Teekyu 7
DRRR s2 part 3

Continuing from fall:
Osomatsu-san
Haikyu 2
Gundam IBO

I'm legitimately excited for Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu. Its been in production for quite a while, the source material is supposedly pretty good, the premise is something I find interesting especially because adult casts are something of a rarity in anime, and this PV (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFmChGw9x-A) looked great. Oh, and its being directed by Omata Shinichi, the talented ex-SHAFT guy that did Sankarea and new Rozen maiden, both shows that weren't that great but had excellent direction. This show also had an OVA that released back in March of last year that as far as I can find, never got translated (which is also when I started hearing great things about it). Maybe the new tv anime will spark some interest so I can finally watch that as well.

Boku Dake ga Inai Machi is another manga I've heard good things about, with an adult protagonist, a talented director I like (Itou Tomohiko), and an ok looking PV (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zu3ycfDuYmk). I'm less sure about it actually being good than the Rakugo show, especially because while I enjoy mysteries a great deal, they also have a lot of room to disappoint, something that's definitely on my mind after The Perfect Insider last season.

Prince of Stride: Alternative is an otome game adaption, which would be an instant turn off if it wasn't for the fact that its being directed by Ishizuka Atsuko (who, by now, everybody should know for her incredibly colorful directorial style seen in Hanayamata, Sakurasou, and No Game No Life) and the PV (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqZIIe7tLNA) shows it. Oh, also the series comp is being handled by Kishimoto Taku, who's also recently handled both seasons of Haikyu, Silver Spoon, and Usagi Drop, all excellent adaptions (he's also doing Boku Dake ga Inai Machi this season, so I guess that's another point in its favor). And I've been a bit of a sucker for sports shows recently, even though this is likely to be as much of a sports show as Free was.

Phantom World could be good. I mean, if nothing else, it has Kyoani's normal production values, with all their good action animators finally done done working on Kyoukai no Kanata stuff. PV (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-7T6qJsr2U). I'm just not sure if its a show I'm going to like, given my reaction to Kyoukai no Kanata. Hopefully it will be a lot closer to Chuunibyou's first season than anything else.

Dimension W could be interesting. PV (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mgq7hcFxkXM). Ok, so maybe only half the things in that pv were actually interesting. I'm at least giving it a chance anyways.

Haruchika is, depending on who you talk to, either PA Works trying to do Sound Euphonium, or PA Works trying to do Hyouka. Based on the PV (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wm_sS2ivLwI), both of those comparisons seem to be off the mark. If I'm worried about Boku Dake ga Inai Machi going down the path The Perfect Insider took last season, I'd be worried about this going down the path that Sakurako-san took last season. But, I'm compelled to give any of these mystery shows at least a look on the off chance they're good.

Active Raid sounds like the kind of show that I really liked when I was a bit younger. And Taniguchi Gorou is a great director . . . but he's only co-directing, and the PV (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRmY926Z_ik) really doesn't look that good to me. That said, its 1 of just 3 anime original, non-sequel shows that's airing this season, so I have to give it the benefit of the doubt.

With all of that, I probably have enough things to watch this season. There seems to be some buzz around Dagashi Kashi, but after I've looked into it a little bit, I can't seem to figure out why. Maybe somebody else could give me a sales pitch for it?

I'm also ignoring most of the shorts, because I'm both terrible at actually keeping up with short shows, and the first episode of them is such a small time commitment that I don't really need to research them first. I can just give them a try and then forget to keep up with them.

And I'll definitely watch Macross Delta when it airs, but a couple people here seem to be confused about that. Despite the early ep1 preview, the show isn't airing until spring season. So we have a little bit to wait on that.

Kato

2016-01-03, 04:50 PM

So... apparently OPM was the best rates tv series on imdb for a day or so. And by that I mean THE BEST RATED TV SERIES. I mean, it was fun to watch but... what? :smallconfused:

sidenote: Really need to watch more shows. Only managed to keep up with Yuru Yuri San last season and even Iron Blooded Orphans I fell behind on, even though I am generally interested. Partially due to a lack of time but also because... it seems I've gotten out of touch with what is airing and what is worth seeing :smallsigh: Guess I'll have to look for you guys recommendations more often.

Sallera

2016-01-03, 06:00 PM

Well, the non-sequel stuff looked a bit sparse this season, but I'll certainly give Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu, Boku Dake ga Inai Machi, and Haruchika a chance. Been kind of warming up to mysteries lately, at least when they've got solid casts and character interactions.

There seems to be some buzz around Dagashi Kashi, but after I've looked into it a little bit, I can't seem to figure out why.
Not sure about that one myself; looked into it a bit and the best I could tell from the PV was that there seems to be a chance of multiple snarky deadpan characters, which is my favourite type of comedy. Not exactly a glowing recommendation, though, that.

Edit: Oh, and I finally got around to finishing Crowds insight. Cor, that was even better than I expected; thanks for the recommendation.

ex cathedra

2016-01-03, 06:43 PM

What's everyone planning to check out in the upcoming season?

k i z u (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYPJoA9udJo)

akagami no shirayukihime is genuinely exciting. dimension w, boku dake ga inai machi, musaigen no phantom world, and haruchika are also tentatively on my list for a variety of reasons; i'm most interested in haruchika, honestly, if for no reason other than that p.a. work's good moments are really (http://myanimelist.net/anime/25835/Shirobako) really (http://myanimelist.net/anime/9289/Hanasaku_Iroha) good (http://myanimelist.net/anime/16067/Nagi_no_Asukara). i'm expecting something a lot closer to true tears or tari tari in terms of quality, though, which would be acceptable.

DoctorFaust

2016-01-03, 08:10 PM

There seems to be some buzz around Dagashi Kashi, but after I've looked into it a little bit, I can't seem to figure out why. Maybe somebody else could give me a sales pitch for it?

Well, I can't speak for anyone else, but the eyes were what got me interested. Specifically, the glorious, glorious Yandere (http://i0.wp.com/www.kitakubu.co/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/77f06e4b.png) eyes. (http://cafeconirst.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/05-447x336.png)

Also, can anyone more knowledgable on the subject tell me whether or not Kaiki Deishuu's theme from Nisemono is based off of In the Hall of the Mountain King?

kamikasei

2016-01-04, 03:33 PM

I'm legitimately excited for Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu. Its been in production for quite a while, the source material is supposedly pretty good, the premise is something I find interesting especially because adult casts are something of a rarity in anime, and this PV (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFmChGw9x-A) looked great. Oh, and its being directed by Omata Shinichi, the talented ex-SHAFT guy that did Sankarea and new Rozen maiden, both shows that weren't that great but had excellent direction. This show also had an OVA that released back in March of last year that as far as I can find, never got translated (which is also when I started hearing great things about it). Maybe the new tv anime will spark some interest so I can finally watch that as well.
I haven't heard a single thing about this. If you're that excited I might give it a shot.

There seems to be some buzz around Dagashi Kashi, but after I've looked into it a little bit, I can't seem to figure out why. Maybe somebody else could give me a sales pitch for it?
What DoctorFaust said, but mostly I'm operating on a recommendation from a friend. Who likes yanderes with weird eyes.

And I'll definitely watch Macross Delta when it airs, but a couple people here seem to be confused about that. Despite the early ep1 preview, the show isn't airing until spring season. So we have a little bit to wait on that.
Huh, looks like you're right. I think I was misled by a previous list which had it down under OVAs/specials. Maybe that was for the preview, or something.

And I forgot to mention this weird little thing (http://anilist.co/anime/21239/OjisantoMarshmallow) that looks to be of interest. Finally, a protagonist with an obsession we can all identify with!

ex cathedra

2016-01-04, 04:32 PM

did anyone watch all of subete ga f ni naru: the perfect insider last season? i threw it on my list at the beginning of the season for my typical post-season binge but since then i got the impression that it was received really poorly, and my backlog has grown large enough that i wouldn't mind skipping it if i wouldn't be missing out on much. the last experience (http://myanimelist.net/anime/28619/Ranpo_Kitan:_Game_of_Laplace) i had with watching a seasonal anime for nothing other than the mystery tag turned out to be a rather unfortunate affair.

Also, can anyone more knowledgable on the subject tell me whether or not Kaiki Deishuu's theme from Nisemono is based off of In the Hall of the Mountain King?

i assume that it's the case. it's both typical of the series to contain classical homages (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC8xkvb14rU) and typical of ItHotMK to portray ominous/insidious characters in popular culture.

Sallera

2016-01-04, 06:03 PM

Oh, I don't know. The central mystery as a mystery may have been somewhat mediocre, but I enjoyed it for the character interactions regardless. (And it had an excellent soundtrack.)

mallorean_thug

2016-01-04, 06:13 PM

Also, can anyone more knowledgable on the subject tell me whether or not Kaiki Deishuu's theme from Nisemono is based off of In the Hall of the Mountain King?

i assume that it's the case. it's both typical of the series to contain classical homages (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC8xkvb14rU) and typical of ItHotMK to portray ominous/insidious characters in popular culture.

I don't really think so. The similarities seem superficial to me. And the music for the toothbrush scene isn't really referencing anything either, its just a bog standard waltz.

i'm most interested in haruchika, honestly, if for no reason other than that p.a. work's good moments are really (http://myanimelist.net/anime/25835/Shirobako) really (http://myanimelist.net/anime/9289/Hanasaku_Iroha) good (http://myanimelist.net/anime/16067/Nagi_no_Asukara). i'm expecting something a lot closer to true tears or tari tari in terms of quality, though, which would be acceptable.

I'd manage expectations a little bit here. Haruchika is an adaption, while all the PA works you just cited are anime original, and the only one of those that it shares main creative staff with is Tari Tari (Same director). Like, the directors of Nagi no Asukara and True Tears might show up as episode directors, but its more likely that they've both been hard at work on their own unannounced projects.

That said, I want to be optimistic too! Its just incorrect to think of most studios as monolithic entities, especially given that PA Works best stuff was done with outside directors (Mizushima, Ando)

What you should definitely be looking forward to more is the project that Mizushima and Okada are working together on (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2015-12-28/girls-and-panzer-mizushima-anohana-okada-make-mayoiga-tv-anime/.97011) that's set to air Spring season.

did anyone watch all of subete ga f ni naru: the perfect insider last season? i threw it on my list at the beginning of the season for my typical post-season binge but since then i got the impression that it was received really poorly, and my backlog has grown large enough that i wouldn't mind skipping it if i wouldn't be missing out on much. the last experience (http://myanimelist.net/anime/28619/Ranpo_Kitan:_Game_of_Laplace) i had with watching a seasonal anime for nothing other than the mystery tag turned out to be a rather unfortunate affair.

While The Perfect Insider is miles better than Ranpo Kitan was, I still thought it was a disappointment in the end.

The story was rather wrapped up in details of the mystery, so when the reveal showed that everything was just as stupid as I was expecting, it kind of lost me. Which would have been a lot more forgivable if the character stuff was a little bit better done. While Moe (the female lead) felt rather fleshed out, both Dr. Magata and Prof. Saikawa never felt like actual people despite the amount of focus they got.

Part of this might have just been hype backlash though. The OP and the ED are among the best of the year, and everything about the production (except the washed out palette) said that it should be really good. Its probably still better than your average show, but because of how important endings are for mysteries and how endings stick with you, I'm sure that it will get bashed as awful for years to come. And I'll probably join in.

ex cathedra

2016-01-05, 01:20 AM

I'd manage expectations a little bit here. Haruchika is an adaption, while all the PA works you just cited are anime original, and the only one of those that it shares main creative staff with is Tari Tari (Same director). Like, the directors of Nagi no Asukara and True Tears might show up as episode directors, but its more likely that they've both been hard at work on their own unannounced projects.

That said, I want to be optimistic too! Its just incorrect to think of most studios as monolithic entities, especially given that PA Works best stuff was done with outside directors (Mizushima, Ando)

What you should definitely be looking forward to more is the project that Mizushima and Okada are working together on (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2015-12-28/girls-and-panzer-mizushima-anohana-okada-make-mayoiga-tv-anime/.97011) that's set to air Spring season.
'similar to tari tari' is already about where my expectations placed haruchika's quality, which is a pretty low bar. i'm hopeful and i think it could have potential, but, thankfully, none of my feelings resemble hype.

oh hey, thanks for the heads up re: mayoiga.

DoctorFaust

2016-01-05, 09:56 AM

I don't really think so. The similarities seem superficial to me. And the music for the toothbrush scene isn't really referencing anything either, its just a bog standard waltz.

I'm not really sure I would call the similarities "superficial" considering that they seem to share essentially the same note progression, though Imitation sounds like it's been shifted down a ways. And actually, on the subject of the toothbrush scene, can I just say one thing?

What the actual ****. Like, seriously, what the actual ****. Almost, almost, makes me want to not like Nisemono, this is so goddamn disturbing. And it takes up the entire goddamn episode! Genuinely, there are three redeeming things about this episode, and two of them are the OP and ED. And the other one is that Tsukihi was going to murder them for what they did!

*pantpantpant*

No, but really, this was genuinely, genuinely disturbing. And FFS Arararagi, you have literally said that the only people who fantasize about seducing their siblings are people without siblings, and now you're goddamn fantasizing about your giant little sister!

mallorean_thug

2016-01-05, 11:11 AM

Sith_Happens

2016-01-05, 11:36 AM

http://ci.memecdn.com/158/8817158.jpg
http://i64.tinypic.com/2rp2qdf.png

DoctorFaust

2016-01-05, 11:46 AM

Nisemonogatari is very much a low point for the series for various reasons.

It gives each arc too many episodes, which drags down the pacing.

While it had much more consistent animation than Bake ( which is a pretty easy feat given that Bake had two episodes air completely unfinished and aired the last arc almost 9 months later as ONAs), the highs aren't nearly as good, and the direction overall is the least interesting in the series (later stuff tends to split the difference and end up a little closer to Bake's style).

While it doesn't really have /more/ skeevy scenes than Bake, they stand out more and feel more egregious, both because the two main girls are Arararagi's sisters, and because having skeevy scenes for other characters felt like fanservice cameos.

And then the stuff it has to say just isn't quite as interesting as other arcs.

Kaiki's scenes, Hitagi's scenes, and Shinobu getting introduced all save it somewhat, and there's some later arcs that are just as weak, but yeah, it's a slog.

EDIT: The sheer over the top nature of the toothbrush scene made it work for me. Nadeko Snake was much much creepier, and some of Arararagi's stuff with Mayoi is just as bad.

I agree about the pacing, and about the amount of fanservice being less, but I really didn't notice much fanservice in the scenes with the other girls except Kanbaru, but that's because, well, she's Kanbaru, and possibly one or two scenes with Hanekawa that I don't really remember well.

Kaiki's scenes do bring something interesting philosophically to the table, Gahara is, well, Gahara, and Shinobu is fun to watch, especially when anything involving donuts happens. Her laugh is really annoying, though.

As for the toothbrush scene, it seemed far less over-the-top than the stuff with Mayoi, considering it seemed like it was being played completely straight whereas the stuff with Hachikuji was very much over the top and (I seem to recall) stated to be not serious on either parties part, and more or less intended to get reactions out of the other. Don't disagree about some of Nadeko.

http://i64.tinypic.com/2rp2qdf.png

I am totally stealing this, just to let you know.

EDIT: And now Araragi has pinned down and groped his smaller little sister after stripping her. I get the in-universe explanation of why Araragi did it, but really, did they have to do it in such a fanservice-y way? Especially the groping part.

ex cathedra

2016-01-05, 12:36 PM

i think that the toothbrush scene is superbly well-crafted comedy, but i can relate to the sensation of being too disturbed by something to enjoy it, so you do you.

tsuhiki's arc was fine at 4 episodes of length, but karen bee being 7 of the season's 11 episodes was a little egregious. nise was a high point in terms of music and OP quality, though.

Mx.Silver

2016-01-05, 05:15 PM

Well, might as well throw in my list of '(Reasonably) Good Stuff I have Watched Since I Last Made This Sort of List'

Michiko & Hatcin

I found out about this through a real life friend, who more or less opened a conversation with: "Have you watched Michiko and Hatchin? Go and watch Michiko & Hatchin.'
Having seen it, I fully understand the enthusiasm.

The first thing that strikes you about the series are the visuals. Not just the general art design and animation quality (which are both distinctly high calibre) but in the direction. There is a clear eye for detail throughout the series, and is capable for some very strong and subtle visual story-telling throughout. There are scenes which say more than entire conversation without a single line of dialogue
Subtlety seems an odd quality to highlight about a series which opens with someone gunning down a helicopter with a machine gun in the first episode and features multiple high-speed car chases, gun fights and, at one point, a sword duel (complete with swinging across a room from a hanging banner) yet when taking the series as a whole it cannot be overlooked. The way the characters gradually reveal themselves, their personalities and their insecurities; as much through actions as through words is exemplary.
One might expect the series' mixture of understated character and larger than life action and adventure to be a weakness, but if anything that contrast is one of the show's main strengths. A contrast reflected and embodied by Michiko's confidence in getting her happily-ever-after storybook ending the grim, unromantic realities of life in the endemically corrupt, crime-ridden, fictionalised Latin American country, the titular characters journey through.

As I said earlier upthread, if you haven't seen this series yet (and statistically you probably haven't) give it a shot if you ever get the opportunity.

Now and Then, Here and There

This is a series I should probably have found sooner than I did, as it turns out to be something of the critical darling. A status that I would say it entirely deserves, as it is both very good at what it does, and what it does is likely to lose a fair amount of the more general audience once they realise what that is. Which is unfortunate, because its subject matter is something that could definitely stand to be confronted more directly than it often is.

Now and Then, Here and There, does not say "War is hell." It gives you a nice window seat, makes sure you're refreshed and then slowly drives you through the inferno, making sure to give you a good long view of each layer as it goes.
While in the end it never quite reaches the level of bleak hopelessness it otherwise could have (and, it could be argued, perhaps should have) in its presentation of the self-perpetuating cycle of violence and pain, it is undeniably effective. Especially considering it does this without straying into 'gore porn' nor sacrificing character for melodramatic attempts at pathos.

It is not an easy watch, nor a comfortable one, but it is worthwhile.

Phantom: Requiem for the Phantom

This one is a bit of a mixed bag. I debated whether to put it in here at all, but it didn't feel right ignoring it, so here we are.

Visually slick (saving for the odd habit of throwing in shots which are upside down for now earthly discernable reason) with a soundtrack to match (including a near-perfect opening theme) which both complement its dark, stylised story, though a bit too obviously adapted from a visual novel for it's own good. Nonetheless, it manages to present an intriguing take on the 'badass super-assassin' premise; one which attempts to but a bullet through the head of the idea that this sort of character would be particularly 'badass'.
For all their murderous prowess, the titular Phantoms are utterly broken psychologically, hollow shells of people that. Fearless only because they lack the emotional strength to even consider they have any control over their existences at all - a fact that their handlers, too taken with the idea of having unstoppable living weapons at their disposal, are utterly blind towards.

The result is an interesting, if flawed, 12 episode story.
Which would be perfectly fine, except Requiem for the Phantom is 26 episodes long.

Over the remaining 14 episodes the series gradually goes downhill. Earlier themes and concepts are backed away from or less effectively rehashed, while attempts to have its cake and eat it too in regards to the killing machine cast, especially in the third act, eventually culminate in a protracted fight sequence so self-indulgently ridiculous it makes the rest of the series look positively grounded. Why yes, this is a Bee Train series, why do you ask? :smalltongue:

Still, when the series works there's enough meat to it to be worth a look. Just a shame about what happened to the earlier potential.

Planetes

There is more than a touch of the soap opera about Planetes. From the somewhat on the nose dialogue to the melodramatically heightened emotions that suffuse even the fairly minor character confrontations.
The inevitable-because-this-is-an-Ichiro-Okouchi-series diversions into the subject of terrorism, which do not exactly fit seamlessly into a workplace drama, do little to alleviate this. Nor do the various other 'Very High Stakes' interjections, most of which seem to be recovered from far more quickly than the presentation might suggest; again, something of a soap opera trait.

Yet despite this, there is a clear charm to Planetes. Like its protagonists, while it may not be particularly clever its heart is in the right place and it carries itself with such earnestness that you can't help but let yourself be dragged along. Its sheer enthusiasm for its subject, its unbridled exuberance for space development and exploration, is downright infectious, as exemplified by its opening which I would defy anyone to try and sit through without feeling any twinges of excitement.

While it's not something I can myself going back to, I can't say I regretted the time I spent with it.

Series I forgot to include on the previous list:

Bartender

I don't drink alcohol. As such I have limited experience of being in bars, and no real knowledge at all about the drinks in question.
Bartender is a series that spends a very considerable amount of time going into the mixing and history of drinks (even giving actual cocktail recipes at the end of each episode), is set almost entirely within a bar and affords the job of bartending a level of significance usually reserved in fiction for ancient orders of wizards.
In other words: not something that would generally fall within my wheelhouse. And yet, here it is.

To its credit, it understands how to tell the story of each episode's signature drink, both as a story in itself and as a complement to the story of whichever character is taking centre-stage in that episode. Meaning that would would otherwise be infodumps become part of the narrative in their own right

Bartender's main trick though is in the presentation. There's a curiously intimate quality to the series, one that feels like small-scale theatre as much as it does an animation series. Characters freely soliloquise and narrate, the members of its cast not featured in the episode's plot acting as a greek chorus to its events. The end result is a conversational, low-key, almost friendly atmosphere; not unlike that of the bar in which much of the series is set.
It's a style of approach that I honestly can't recall having seen anywhere else, and it's enough to elevate the series to a position of interest, even if the overall stories themselves are not particularly ground-breaking.

Gilgamesh

There is really no way of ignoring this: Gilgamesh is an ugly looking series. While its character designs aren't bad, even if they are somewhat unconventional, its animation budget was next to nothing. There are animation sequences where it is quite apparent that it's simply jumping between key frames, with no in-between work.
It's this fact more than anything, even the somewhat awkward finale, that kept it off the list last time around. It's also a bit of a hindrance in what is ostensibly a supernatural action series and as a consequence it spends considerably more time on scenes of characters talking to each other. There is one mitigating factor to this: Gilgamesh is very good at scenes of characters talking to each other.

Part of this is because, while its overall animation is poor, its actual cinematography is not. It knows what needs to be animated and why, even if it lacks the funds to fully pull this off.
The rest of this is account of the script work. While the overal plot has a fair few problems, its scene and character writing hold-up rather better. Tonally it's dark, its cast range from the flawed to the uncomfortably flawed to the downright unpleasant, yet despite this - and a few steps into fairly unwholesome territory - it avoids feeling forced. That it can keep as many of its quite large cast as realised as it does speaks its competence, as does its ability to lay groundwork for, foreshadow and then deliver on information in a way that is clear to the audience while still feeling natural to the narrative's flow.

Competence may seem like a faint thing to praise, but given the amount of series I've seen that don't manage to achieve it, it shouldn't be overlooked. Which is not to say Gilgamesh a writing masterpiece; the plotting leaves something to be desired, more so in the second half, and it ends-up juggling a few too many characters to really deliver on all of them. As for the previously mentioned ending, it's both somewhat abrupt and doesn't gel with the preceding episodes even if you are familiar enough with the epic of gilgamesh to appreciate what it's going for.

Still, it's an interesting enough series that if it weren't for the considerable weakness in the visual department I'd feel okay with recommending it. Unfortunately, that visual weakness is a lot to have to look past.

Not actually series:

Saint Oniisan

Saint Oniisan or Saint Young Men is a fairly relaxed but, nonetheless amusing, slice-of-life esque comedy, released in the form of an OVA and film. It centres on two young male co-workers who decide to take a holiday to Japan, a country to which neither of them have been before. The comedy stems from their general misadventures as they try to keep their cantankerous landlady happy, learn the true meaning of Christmas and generally act like massive tourists, all the while trying not to let anyone discover that they're Buddha and Jesus.

All in all, it's a pleasantly quirky high-concept comedy, that gets a good bit of mileage from its central conceit.

The Tale of Princess Kaguya

The Tale of Princess Kaguya is the best film to come out of Studio Ghibli in years. It is genuinely a thing of beauty, heartfelt, poignant and a testament to just how good hand-drawn animation can look. If it does turn out to be the last 'pure Ghibli' film I can't think of a more fitting last bow to the studio.

Next time: the Bad List returns, which I'm sure won't contain anything even slightly controversial. Yep, definitely nothing contentious whatsoever.

DoctorFaust

2016-01-05, 07:29 PM

nise was a high point in terms of music and OP quality, though.

Totally with you there. Marshmallow Justice, Platinum Disco, and whatever the ED by ClariS is called were damn good songs, even by the standards of normal songs and not anime OPs and EDs.

And continuing my Monogatari adventures, I have decided on a new name for Nekomonogatari: Black. "Goddamnit, Araragi: The Series". Because that's what I found myself saying just about every five minutes. I mean, honestly, just about every single things he does in Kuro is just about the worst that he could have possibly taken.
From going to his little little sister for advice on love, asking his giant little sister about love while she was topless, not ignoring his promise to Hanekawa and just going straight to the police about the abuse, training Shinobu with donuts, ****ing sniffing Hanekawa's desk, all the way up until he decided that getting himself killed by Hanekawa was the best way to relieve her stress.

Dumbass.

Saint Oniisan

Fun fact: there is actually a print from this series on display at the British Museum.

JCarter426

2016-01-05, 07:59 PM

As for the toothbrush scene, it seemed far less over-the-top than the stuff with Mayoi, considering it seemed like it was being played completely straight whereas the stuff with Hachikuji was very much over the top and (I seem to recall) stated to be not serious on either parties part, and more or less intended to get reactions out of the other.
I agree, except with one amendment: toothbrush scene wasn't any less over the top; the difference was that both parties were serious about it, while as you say the Araragi/Hachikuji interactions were anything but serious.

But if anything, I'd say the toothbrush scene makes everything else less creepy, because it made me realize the whole family is messed up; it's not just Araragi. And that's funnier.

Although, I must confess to the below as well:

http://ci.memecdn.com/158/8817158.jpg
http://i64.tinypic.com/2rp2qdf.png

From going to his little little sister for advice on love, asking his giant little sister about love while she was topless
Well, firstly, remember it's Tsukihi we're talking about. When else is he supposed to ask her? :smalltongue:

But really, it's not all that strange that he'd go to his sister for advice; at this point, his sisters are the only people he knows other than his parents that have ever dated anyone.

not ignoring his promise to Hanekawa and just going straight to the police about the abuse
Frankly, I can't blame him for this when it's a thing I've seen happen in reality.

DoctorFaust

2016-01-05, 08:09 PM

Well, firstly, remember it's Tsukihi we're talking about. When else is he supposed to ask her? :smalltongue:

But really, it's not all that strange that he'd go to his sister for advice; at this point, his sisters are the only people he knows other than his parents that have ever dated anyone.

Frankly, I can't blame him for this when it's a thing I've seen happen in reality.

Well, considering she had just tried to stab him in the head with a crowbar in an attempt to be a yandere, maybe why did she thought that stabbing someone in the head with a crowbar was an appropriate punishment for waking up later? Really, it was less that he did and more the situations in which he did.

And I know, but that doesn't make me any less angry about it. And sad. :smallmad: Sangry? Angrad?

mallorean_thug

2016-01-06, 02:37 PM

Next time: the Bad List returns, which I'm sure won't contain anything even slightly controversial. Yep, definitely nothing contentious whatsoever.
I'm definitely more curious about what you put on your "Bad list" after you put Phantom: Requiem for a Phantom on your good list.

Mx.Silver

2016-01-06, 09:30 PM

I'm definitely more curious about what you put on your "Bad list" after you put Phantom: Requiem for a Phantom on your good list.

Phantom's an odd one, I'll admit. Certainly one that makes me glad I stopped bothering assigning numerical scores to things :smalltongue:
A lot of why it's there is because its first act has a strong thematic through-line to it (which as I think has been established before is something that I value a lot). It also does give its audience some credit, and doesn't bother pretending any of its main cast of criminal syndicate members are 'the good guys'. That it pulls off a character like Claudia McCunnen reasonably well also gets it a few points.
Even the second act, while being fairly underwhelming, still has a few points of interest (unlike the third act, which is pretty much just bad from start to finish). Admittedly a fair bit of that is due to some of it's narrative missteps being the sort of decisions that would probably have made sense in a videogame but don't handle the transition very well - a topic I find interesting from a cross-media narrative analysis standpoint, but point remains.

Fundamentally though, it's there because it's got things in it that work well enough that they can still sustain a conversation several months after having seen it.

I do still expect it to be brought up a lot in the context of 'You put that on the good list but this on the bad?!' though (although maybe not, as going by its MAL page it seems to have been reasonably well received).

At least, I would if there was going to be anything on the 'bad' list that people here would take issue with. Which I'm sure couldn't possibly be the case.

Yeah...

Morph Bark

2016-01-07, 06:53 PM

Well, I can't speak for anyone else, but the eyes were what got me interested. Specifically, the glorious, glorious Yandere (http://i0.wp.com/www.kitakubu.co/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/77f06e4b.png) eyes. (http://cafeconirst.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/05-447x336.png)

Well at least now I know to avoid that series. Thanks!

Well, might as well throw in my list of '(Reasonably) Good Stuff I have Watched Since I Last Made This Sort of List'

Michiko & Hatcin

I found out about this through a real life friend, who more or less opened a conversation with: "Have you watched Michiko and Hatchin? Go and watch Michiko & Hatchin.'
Having seen it, I fully understand the enthusiasm.

The first thing that strikes you about the series are the visuals. Not just the general art design and animation quality (which are both distinctly high calibre) but in the direction. There is a clear eye for detail throughout the series, and is capable for some very strong and subtle visual story-telling throughout. There are scenes which say more than entire conversation without a single line of dialogue
Subtlety seems an odd quality to highlight about a series which opens with someone gunning down a helicopter with a machine gun in the first episode and features multiple high-speed car chases, gun fights and, at one point, a sword duel (complete with swinging across a room from a hanging banner) yet when taking the series as a whole it cannot be overlooked. The way the characters gradually reveal themselves, their personalities and their insecurities; as much through actions as through words is exemplary.
One might expect the series' mixture of understated character and larger than life action and adventure to be a weakness, but if anything that contrast is one of the show's main strengths. A contrast reflected and embodied by Michiko's confidence in getting her happily-ever-after storybook ending the grim, unromantic realities of life in the endemically corrupt, crime-ridden, fictionalised Latin American country, the titular characters journey through.

As I said earlier upthread, if you haven't seen this series yet (and statistically you probably haven't) give it a shot if you ever get the opportunity.

Can confirm that Michiko & Hatchin is a great series, even having only caught a few episodes of it here and there.

Nice to know that about Planetes, too, I'll give it a watch.

DoctorFaust

2016-01-07, 07:57 PM

Well at least now I know to avoid that series. Thanks!

Can I ask if it's the art style, the yandere-ness, or something else that turns you off of it? Because according to the people I've spoken to that have read the manga, no one's actually a yandere.

mallorean_thug

2016-01-07, 11:53 PM

Boku Dake ga Inai Machi/ ERASED has the best first episode of the season so far by quite a bit. I would recommend people give it a shot.

Everything else has been pretty meh so far, but I'll probably give Prince of Stride, Haruchika, Active Raid, and ~maybe Phantom World another episode, but the first episodes didn't make me terribly hopeful or excited about any of them (and would rank them in about that order). Prince of Stride slightly under-performed my expectations, but was still colorful and fun. Haruchika over-performed my expectations because they were kind of low, the male lead is actually interesting, and the female lead is kind of cute. Active Raid basically met my expectations, but they were rather low. I'm fine with the not serious atmosphere, but the CG didn't impress me, and I'm already bored with all the archetypes on display. And Phantom World's opening was better than Kyoukai no Kanata's, but it (expectedly) had 1000% more LN bull**** than I want in my animes.

Fri

2016-01-08, 08:52 AM

Can I ask if it's the art style, the yandere-ness, or something else that turns you off of it? Because according to the people I've spoken to that have read the manga, no one's actually a yandere.

It's actually one of the manga that I most follow this day (if that makes any sense.)

It's about an eccentric sweets-obsessed girl trying to convince a guy to inherit his father's sweet shop, because he's apparently actually a genius in sweets. But he just want to be a mangaka.

What you can expect: Ridiculous "sweets is serious business" stuffs, references to japanese sweets that I guess most westerners won't be familiar with, over the top reaction-based comedy. Also, cute girl with crazy eyes with gothic frilly dresses I guess.

Sallera

2016-01-08, 06:08 PM

Well, well. Some high-quality stuff among the season's chaff; I've been cherry-picking, but three out of five's still not bad. Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu had a very impressive first episode; I wasn't entirely sure what to expect out of it, but there's certainly no way in which it could be said to be a disappointment. The VAs, especially, are quite obviously having a ton of fun with this one, even outside the rakugo scenes, and the direction and visuals are both solid. Boku Dake ga Inai Machi looks quite neat as well; interesting characters, and the central mystery seems to have potential. Haruchika I suspect will succeed or fail on the strength of its characterization, but so far it's doing a good job of keeping me engaged.

Dagashi Kashi (what with the talk, I figured I'd at least look) wavered on the line between enjoyable and merely watchable throughout most of the episode, but for a straight comedy that's honestly better than I expected from a first episode. Probably won't keep me for the whole season, but I'll at least give it another chance. And Phantom World didn't even manage to hold my interest for a whole episode. Toss.

Morph Bark

2016-01-10, 10:33 AM

Can I ask if it's the art style, the yandere-ness, or something else that turns you off of it? Because according to the people I've spoken to that have read the manga, no one's actually a yandere.

The yandere-ness. No anime that I've seen with a yandere as a main or secondary character has ever really appealed to me, simply because a lot of them are just bad.

DoctorFaust

2016-01-10, 03:26 PM

The yandere-ness. No anime that I've seen with a yandere as a main or secondary character has ever really appealed to me, simply because a lot of them are just bad.

Well, if the show continues as it was in episode one, you probably don't need to worry about it. It's schtick basically seems to be that everybody except the MC believes they're in Shoukugeki no Souma, not a comedy, and there wasn't a yandere in sight.

However, speaking of yanderes...
https://i.imgur.com/bVjGETr.jpg
RED ALERT RED ALERT THIS IS NOT A DRILL. Goddamnit, Sengoku! How do you go that goddamn crazy after less than a day of godhood? Seriously, I don't think that even whats-her-face in Mirai Nikki became a Yandere as fast as you did.

JCarter426

2016-01-13, 01:42 AM

Aniplex has released the list of US screenings of Kizumonogatari Part 1 (http://kizumonogatari-usa.com/theater.html).

Unfortunately there's nothing near me on this one... and I don't think I feel up for a trip to New York.

mallorean_thug

2016-01-13, 02:07 AM

I'm fortunate enough to have an artsy theatre locally that always shows that kind of stuff, so I'll definitely be going. I've heard very good things about it, from people that have already gotten to see it.

ex cathedra

2016-01-14, 01:12 AM

I'm 230 miles out of the closest showing: Kansas City, MI. It's not out of the question, but it's unlikely I'll make it. The showtimes are pretty rough for me, but I'll mention it to a friend and consider it if he's down. I'm excited to see it either way.

Rodin

2016-01-17, 01:56 AM

Just finished Noragami Aragoto. Overall found it pretty excellent, and a big improvement over the first season thanks to a lot of the characters having matured.

I did, however, feel a bit lost on one particular plot point in the penultimate episode:

When Hiyori is trying to call Yato back from the Underworld, she at first refuses to try any other name because Yato is his name. This is reinforced by how happy he was to have a shrine with his name on it, and the very fact that the shrine works indicates that this is correct.

She then thinks back to the shrine and pulls "Yaboku" out of thin air, which turns out to be his real name.

So...how did she know that? The only thing I've been able to come up with is that it's an alternate reading of the characters that make up his name, which would allow the shrine to be technically correct and give Hiyori the hint she needs to guess it.

Is there something I'm missing, or is it as simple as that?

Also, after that cliffhanger they better give us a third season.