Dex-based paladin build

[Tafkam Hokie]

New to 5e here (but been playing every edition since the 70's), and running a paladin as my first character. Going with a paladin of Zilchus, so it is a bit unconventional...basically a holy warrior for good, honest capitalism and a hefty grudge against those who try to cheat economics.

My biggest question for the boards is do you really lose anything by going Dex-based instead of Str-based?

Our group decided to roll our stats and I got 17, 14, 13, 11, 10, 10. I chose to go with the human variant to bump the 17 and the 13 and take the defensive duelist feat. Final stats are

S10 D18 C14 I10 W11 Ch14

So with an 18 Dex, studded leather, and a shield, I have the same AC18 as chain and shield (with a 1/round boost to 20 from my feat).

After one gaming session, I kinda like the swashbuckling paladin. Lay on Hands works on hangovers :smallbiggrin:

Anything I need to know going forward about running Dex-based paladins?

Our group is pretty strong for dishing out damage, so I'm focusing more on a 4e defender-like role.

[Fighting_Ferret]

Nope, that's a totally viable build. Your AC will be limited to 19 with non-magical armor and I'm guessing you use rapiers which will limit you to a 1d8+dex mod + dueling style (+2) for damage plus all those lovely smites. You should be fine. You will want to work on your CHA score, as you will receive a lot of benefits from it being high.

[Tafkam Hokie]

Nope, that's a totally viable build. Your AC will be limited to 19 with non-magical armor and I'm guessing you use rapiers which will limit you to a 1d8+dex mod + dueling style (+2) for damage plus all those lovely smites. You should be fine. You will want to work on your CHA score, as you will receive a lot of benefits from it being high.

Yes, CHA bumps are very high on my priority list. Frankly, I was looking at the Protection fighting style over Dueling one. Again, dishing damage isn't my primary concern. We've got a rogue and a great weapon fighter who can hit like a truck (plus a sorcerer, ranger, and warlock too...big party), so my job is more to keep them alive than to drive the pain-train myself. The idea of forcing enemies to focus on the highest AC in the party instead of killing the squishies seems like it will get me much further than +2 to damage ever will.

[MadBear]

When I played a paladin I ended up grabbing Sentinel to help out my allies, which made the protection style worse in most situations. Being able to get an extra attack/(attack+smite) usually saved my buddies butt far more then disadvantage would have in most situations. It got the the point it was so under utilized that me and the DM agreed to let me choose a different fighting style since I went 5-6 sessions in a row without using it.

[Mjolnirbear]

It is a very very fun character. However you will have problems with Athletics checks, and similarly with the Shield Master Feat. This means you will be better at escaping control effects and less able to initiate things like shoves and grapples.

Consider Mariner fighting style for more swashbuckling goodness and DM options such as Climb Onto Bigger Creature or using the Mark action.

Sentinel will help ensure bad guys stick to you and not to your squishies.

Remember you can Smite on your enemy's turn with reactions and Opportunity Attacks.

[Tafkam Hokie]

Hadn't seen the Sentinel feat (I've probably read maybe 10% of the PHB so far). That one looks perfect. I guess the question is, do I dump Defensive Duelist for Sentinel (DM is allowing some freedom to re-tool your character since we are all new at this)? If not, it would be 8th level until I was able to get it...gotta bump Cha at 4th.

Yeah, Athletics is a problem. But it is less of a problem than Stealth would be if I went Str-based.

[MadBear]

Hadn't seen the Sentinel feat (I've probably read maybe 10% of the PHB so far). That one looks perfect. I guess the question is, do I dump Defensive Duelist for Sentinel (DM is allowing some freedom to re-tool your character since we are all new at this)? If not, it would be 8th level until I was able to get it...gotta bump Cha at 4th.

Yeah, Athletics is a problem. But it is less of a problem than Stealth would be if I went Str-based.

That's up to you. I've found the Paladin to be stout enough to not need more defensive tool. But it's a personal preference really.

[charcoalninja]

Also as a dex build don't overlook the potential of dual wielding for smite nova doom. Getting that extra attack is another smite out the door which is amazing with smite's ability to crit fish. Keep swinging, when your main or offhand crits, pop a smite!

[HidesHisEyes]

Sounds like fun. I also thought a heavy crossbow-wielding paladin of vengeance would be pretty awesome. Smite only works with melee attacks right? So probably not a particularly powerful character, but a grizzled hunter-of-evil-doers with a gigantic crossbow? Cool as hell.

[charcoalninja]

Sounds like fun. I also thought a heavy crossbow-wielding paladin of vengeance would be pretty awesome. Smite only works with melee attacks right? So probably not a particularly powerful character, but a grizzled hunter-of-evil-doers with a gigantic crossbow? Cool as hell.

Smite only works on Melee and Thrown so you're better off going Javelins for ranged.

[dragsvart]

having played a dex paladin I can say it works well, especially with medium armor master and a shield and rapier. you can sneak, you can heal, you can take hits, and you can give them.

[Malifice]

I second retooling defensive duelist for sentinel and picking up duelling style.

Will make you a ton more sticky.

[Louro]

...you're better off going Javelins for ranged.

The use of ranged weapons beneaths paladins dignity as horizontal flying does for wizards.

[Sindeloke]

Smite only works on Melee and Thrown so you're better off going Javelins for ranged.

"Thrown" is actually a matter of some debate. I wouldn't play a paladin unless I was sure my DM reads the rules that way. Still, the 100% guaranteed RAW pure melee shield-and-rapier paladin is very strong, even if you can't smite at range.

If your DM is flexible, though, I'd ask for one of the two following tweaks:

- Ask if you can get TWF style as your paladin style, and carry a bandolier of bottomless throwing daggers alongside your rapier for a good rougish feel

- Ask if you can get Archery as your paladin style and use smites with projectile weapons as long as you're within short range (this is strong at very low levels but by midlevels you can't catch up to the sharpshooter/crossbow expert BM fighter even with it, so it's not a huge balance concern)

Or, consider Sentinel and dual-wield a rapier/whip combo, for a powerful defend/control build whose high Dex makes up for the loss of a shield.

[Louro]

"Thrown" is actually a matter of some debate. I wouldn't play a paladin unless I was sure my DM reads the rules that way.
Sooooo wrong.
I wouldn't play a paladin unless I was sure I will enjoy it. And I'm not talking about mechanics.

[HarrisonF]

"Thrown" is actually a matter of some debate. I wouldn't play a paladin unless I was sure my DM reads the rules that way. Still, the 100% guaranteed RAW pure melee shield-and-rapier paladin is very strong, even if you can't smite at range.


While you can't use smite, several of the smite spells do work with ranged, banishing and blinding smite both work with all ranged attacks. Ensnaring strike for ancients does as well.

[djreynolds]

Grab entertainer and get acrobatics and deception. Acrobatic will enable you to keep from getting shoved. And you can capitalize on your Dex based paladin by entertaining. Nothing wrong with protection. Nothing wrong with dexterity, leather armor, and shield. That's cool. Now you cannot multiclass, but who cares. Paladins are the one class that does not need any help. Protection is great style if you have a rogue you're setting up, and you can allow him to dual wield and not worry about disengaging with his bonus action because you can force disadvantage here and there. Plus you've given the paladin the one option he truly needs, a "ranged" presence. Now you have more options at your disposal. Spells, melee, and arrows.

But half-elf is an option. Yes you do lose a feat, but you get closer to 20 in dex and charisma faster. Sentinel is awesome, just read that thread about all the trouble is can cause and now you're smiting with it. Sentinel will give you extra attacks here and there. Duelist is +2 damage, and that's good but stopping that smack down for 30 points of damage on the rouge and saving his bonus reaction is priceless. Protection has its place. Defense, its +1. All the time. All three are good. Too bad versatile weapons, aside from quarterstaff (unsure, maybe just monks) can't be finessed.

Would like to see the final build. I like to steal, I mean incorporate your ideas