Magus build question regarding Monstrous Physique (also Spell Perfection)

[cavander]

Hi, new here, but long time player/viewer.

I'm playing through a campaign as a Magus in Pathfinder, and I have a couple questions.

I'm a strength Magus Tiefling and plan on going the Monstrous Physique route.

Looking over my plan, I have the idea of taking Spell Perfection on Shocking Grasp with Quicken and Intensified (Magical Lineaged).

While in a 4-Armed Gargoyle form, and doing a full-attack Spell Combat (hasted), does this work the way I think it does:

Full-Attack:
1 Normal Scimitar attack
2 Claw attacks from gargoyle (2 open, 1 is empty for spell combat, 1 has scimitar)
1 Bite Attack
1 Gore Attack
Cast Spell with Spell Combat and normal action (Shocking Grasp)
- Free Scimitar Attack with Spellstriked Shocking Grasp
Cast Quickend Shocking Grasp as Swift action
- Free Scimitar attack with Spellstriked Shocking Grasp
1 Scimitar attack (hasted)

If that doesn't work, what specifically doesn't work, and why? Because that's how I'm reading it.

Thanks!

[Psyren]

You can't use your Bite or Gore with Spell Combat, nor can you use both your claws and your scimitar (you must choose one or the other.)


To use this ability, the magus must have one hand free (even if the spell being cast does not have somatic components), while wielding a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other hand. As a full-round action, he can make all of his attacks with his melee weapon at a –2 penalty and can also cast any spell from the magus spell list with a casting time of 1 standard action (any attack roll made as part of this spell also takes this penalty).

Your bite is not a weapon that is wielded in your other hand; neither is your gore. One of your claws can be, but you have to choose whether to use the claw or scimitar, not both.

You can take the Natural Spell Combat (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/magus/magus-arcana/paizo---magus-arcana/natural-spell-combat-ex) arcana to be able to use your bite and gore with spell combat, as well as to use one of your claws in conjunction with your scimitar, but you must take this arcana once for each natural attack you want to add to the spell combat routine.

[cavander]

Ok, that makes sense.

So, then if I take Natural Spell attack, do I get ALL my weapon attacks, PLUS the Spell Combat spell and attack, PLUS the natural attack I choose?

I'm trying to figure out the best way to play that and make it all work.

Thanks.

[Psyren]

So, then if I take Natural Spell attack, do I get ALL my weapon attacks, PLUS the Spell Combat spell and attack, PLUS the natural attack I choose?

Yes. Just remember you will need a separate instance of Natural Spell Combat for each natural attack you select to use them with Spell Combat. In addition, any natural attacks you include become secondary attacks if you combine them with your scimitar, so you're looking at -5 to each one before the Spell Combat penalties, or -2 before penalties if you take Multiattack.

(You can always full-attack without Spell Combat of course, once you're buffed up and in position.)

[cavander]

Yes. Just remember you will need a separate instance of Natural Spell Combat for each natural attack you select to use them with Spell Combat. In addition, any natural attacks you include become secondary attacks if you combine them with your scimitar, so you're looking at -5 to each one before the Spell Combat penalties, or -2 before penalties if you take Multiattack.

(You can always full-attack without Spell Combat of course, once you're buffed up and in position.)

Ok, thanks that's really helpful.

And on the combining weapon attacks with natural attacks, I'd get all my weapon iterative attacks, and then my natural attacks right?

For example a level 15 magus spell combating with Natural Spell Combat declaring claws, in the 4-armed gargoyle form with haste gets:

+11/+6/+1 scimitar attacks
Spell combat spell (using one claw)
Free scimitar attack from spell strike
Claw attack at -5
Claw attack at -5
Scimitar weapon attack (from haste)

For a total of 5 scimitar attacks, 2 claw attacks, and one spell. Correct?

Thanks.

[Psyren]

Correct, but don't forget:

1) The two "bonus" scimitar attacks (spellstrike and haste) are at your highest iterative.
2) All of the attacks you listed take an additional -2 for spell combat.

So the final routine is:

Scimitar: +9/+9/+9/+4/-1
Claw 1: Holding scimitar, no attack
Claw 2: Casting spell, no attack
Claw 3: -7 (-4 with Multiattack) + 11 = +4 (+7 with MA)
Claw 4: -7 (-4 with Multiattack) + 11 = +4 (+7 with MA)

[cavander]

Awesome! Most helpful, thank you very much!

[Kurald Galain]

1) The two "bonus" scimitar attacks (spellstrike and haste) are at your highest iterative.
2) All of the attacks you listed take an additional -2 for spell combat.

3) Start with a swift action to enchant your scimitar (e.g. +3 and Keen on all your scimitar), and
4) Instead of Shocking Grasp, try Frostbite (to add 1d6+15 to all your hits) or when facing undead, Chill Touch.

[Arc_knight25]

Just going to mention that the Frostbite damage is non lethal cold at 1d6+CL.

And has as many charges as CL. Also it fatigues the target with no save so long as they have non lethal damage from the on them.

So at level 4 for example will be 1d6+4 non lethal cold damage and will have 4 charges, so 4 hits will drain the spell.

[cavander]

What's the major difference between lethal and non-lethal damage? Obviously the lethality of it, but, mechanically how does that play out? Are lethal and non-lethal tracked separately? If a creature gets to 0 HP through non-lethal, what happens? Seems like Frostbite is amazing, but I'm thrown off by the non-lethal.

[Kurald Galain]

What's the major difference between lethal and non-lethal damage? Obviously the lethality of it, but, mechanically how does that play out?

Yes, they're tracked separately, and if your lethal + nonlethal damage exceeds your HP total, you pass out. Note that this may be an advantage in some fights, as it leaves you an enemy alive to question.

Healing spells heal both at the same time, and are thus twice as effective on someone who has taken NL damage; that said, in-combat healing is not a good strategy anyway, so this tends to be irrelevant.

Undead are, rather obviously, immune to NL damage, hence you use the spell Chill Touch against them instead. Elementals are also immune, then again they are immune to lots of things; elementals are a pain. Perhaps surprisingly, not many other critters are immune to NL.

Overall, yes, it's very effective in most fights. Not in all fights, just in most.