Durkula's Tactics

[bookguy]

I'd like to have a tactical discussion about the Roy versus Durkula battle. Obviously, there are several possible factors outside of the combatants' control, but I want to know what they will do without outside interference. Roy will keep swinging his sword (he doesn't really have anything else to do) with whatever degree of Power Attack he thinks is best. Durkula has a nearly full slate of spells along with many vampire abilities. He gets to pick one thing per round (before the combat, we only saw him cast one spell today). Here are his actions during combat:

1. some sort of buff spell (probably)
2. vampire gaze domination
3. hold person
4. some damaging spell

Based on this progression, I think Durkula will continue to cast damaging spells if he is at all strategically adept. There is no point to casting a damage spell on a single target if you are going to cast save-or-lose spells on that same target later in the fight. If Durkula used strategy to determine his fourth spell, he must have decided that Roy's Willpower and Fortitude saves were too high for him to try to win the battle in one move, so he will instead try to win using damage.

Thoughts?

[Quartz]

Roy has a spell-disrupting manoeuver; does Durkula know that? If so, he might just try to go for energy-draining attacks.

[DeliaP]

I'd like to have a tactical discussion about the Roy versus Durkula battle. Obviously, there are several possible factors outside of the combatants' control, but I want to know what they will do without outside interference. Roy will keep swinging his sword (he doesn't really have anything else to do) with whatever degree of Power Attack he thinks is best. Durkula has a nearly full slate of spells along with many vampire abilities. He gets to pick one thing per round (before the combat, we only saw him cast one spell today). Here are his actions during combat:

1. some sort of buff spell (probably)
2. vampire gaze domination
3. hold person
4. some damaging spell

Based on this progression, I think Durkula will continue to cast damaging spells if he is at all strategically adept. There is no point to casting a damage spell on a single target if you are going to cast save-or-lose spells on that same target later in the fight. If Durkula used strategy to determine his fourth spell, he must have decided that Roy's Willpower and Fortitude saves were too high for him to try to win the battle in one move, so he will instead try to win using damage.

Thoughts?

Durkula has used up a couple of spells against Belkar already (Silence, whatever is going in in Panel 9 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0996.html)?) Also, has he learned Protection from Daylight yet? If so, he'd probably use up two spell slots on that!

If the damaging spell were destruction (which many have guessed) then it was actually a save-or-die spell he was attempting. Durkula switching from a Will to a Fort save based spell is interesting though. Even with Roy's unusually high Will save, you'd think Roy's Fort save will be better. It would seem to imply Durkula doesn't have lots of high-level Will based save-or-lose spells available. (Or the Giant just doesn't want the high drama ruined by a boring made-my-save, made-my-save etc. melee)

If Durkula has a Harm saved (and why wouldn't he??) he's going to have to choose whether to heal himself or hurt Roy. If he does choose to hurt Roy, he really ought to follow it up with guaranteed direct damage spell right away.

[Darth Paul]

I'm wondering how advantageous a shapechange might be at this time.

It not only heals some damage for Durkula, but leaves Roy facing a large Dire Wolf with enhanced strength and also inherent spell ability (unless vampires can't cast in that form, but I believe they can... and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong on any of these details).

Does anyone have those monster stats handy?

[Lexible]

It seems to me, that if Durkula doesn't actually care strategically about defeating Roy, then his best move would be to spider climb (as 3.x vampires have, and which Durkula exhibited while clinging to Bloodfeast the Extreminator) up to the ceiling, and stand there upside down until the demigods return... possibly taunting Durkon and/or Roy all the while.

No muss. No fuss.

Simple. Neat.

[goodpeople25]

I'm wondering how advantageous a shapechange might be at this time.

It not only heals some damage for Durkula, but leaves Roy facing a large Dire Wolf with enhanced strength and also inherent spell ability (unless vampires can't cast in that form, but I believe they can... and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong on any of these details).

Does anyone have those monster stats handy?
From my understanding it is that durkula's alternate form (not shape-change sorry it is good to be precise with D&D rules) he would lose his dominate and slam attacks, but would retain full spellcasting ability on the condition that his alternate form can't use spells with verbal or somatic components unless the creature form can which i don't believe dire/bats or dire/wolves can (well somatic anyway the comic seems to say that verbal will work with lizard V) which to my knowledge limits durkala's spells options immensely unless durkula has (which i don't think he has been shown to have)and perpared still spells (and possibly silent spell) which he has to perpare before hand as still spells anyway. Though i think an alternate form could still be an useful it just it would not have many/if at all viable spell options but still would have other advantages.

[Mike Havran]

Durkula has fast healing and energy drain slam attack, so he should just smack Roy into soulless husk. The spider climb is also an alternative.

[Quartz]

Durkula has fast healing and energy drain slam attack, so he should just smack Roy into soulless husk.

We saw that that worked well for Malack against Durkon and Belkar.

[Alchemist_Fire]

Roy has a spell-disrupting manoeuver; does Durkula know that? If so, he might just try to go for energy-draining attacks.

In Girard's Pyramid, Durkon and Malack went through a different tunnel than Roy;they never saw the illusion in which Roy successfully used that feat outside of heaven.

[Ehcks]

In Girard's Pyramid, Durkon and Malack went through a different tunnel than Roy;they never saw the illusion in which Roy successfully used that feat outside of heaven.

Did he, though? That was while they were under the effect of the illusion that makes you see what you want to see.

[Don Ohnic]

Did he not use the spell-disrupting feat against Miron?
(http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0928.html)
Durkula may have noticed.

[Chronos]

Did he, though? That was while they were under the effect of the illusion that makes you see what you want to see.
Yes, which is exactly what Alchemist_Fire said.

[Morquard]

Durkon is Roys best friend, it wouldn't be too far fetched if Roy actually told him about the feat. Or the entire order.

He might even have practiced it with Durkon for all we know.

[Quartz]

In Girard's Pyramid, Durkon and Malack went through a different tunnel than Roy;they never saw the illusion in which Roy successfully used that feat outside of heaven.

But did he talk about it to Durkon before that? Shortly after he was resurrected he mentioned it to Haley.

[dtilque]

Durkula has used up a couple of spells against Belkar already (Silence, whatever is going in in Panel 9 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0996.html)?)

Panel 9 there was just Belkar failing a saving throw against the pain from the PfE Clasp. So he stumbled.


Also, has he learned Protection from Daylight yet? If so, he'd probably use up two spell slots on that!.

My guess is that he has and also the Instant Vampire spell. And that would be three PfD spells. He would have used one on himself in the morning. So spells used so far, assuming he didn't use any that are in the staff:

3 Protection from Daylight
2 Instant Vampire
1 Silence
1 unknown buff
1 Hold Person
1 unknown damage
1 Summon Proxy

total: 10

The problem with figuring how many spells of each level he has left is that we don't know the levels of most of these spells.

[King of Nowhere]

i think this thread should be merged with www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?437293-Roy-vs-Durkula.
it deals basically with the same thing

[goodpeople25]

Durkon is Roys best friend, it wouldn't be too far fetched if Roy actually told him about the feat. Or the entire order.

He might even have practiced it with Durkon for all we know.
Well he was discussing tactics (presumably for Xykon) with Durkon during strip #672 right before an at least a day long (i believe) boat trip which is a great time to mention it. Actually i think Roy did mention it since he mentions readying an action to disrupt in panel 6 not sure what else that could mean besides his feat. Now sure he could have not gone into details about the feat but that seems a bit out of character for Roy.

[dtilque]

i think this thread should be merged with www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?437293-Roy-vs-Durkula.
it deals basically with the same thing
Tell the moderators, not us. We can't do it.


Well he was discussing tactics (presumably for Xykon) with Durkon during strip #972 right before an at least a day long (i believe) boat trip which is a great time to mention it. Actually i think Roy did mention it since he mentions readying an action to disrupt in panel 6 not sure what else that could mean besides his feat. Now sure he could have not gone into details about the feat but that seems a bit out of character for Roy.

The "disrupt" could be refering to the spell Disruption, which was intended to be used the first time they fought Xykon (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0104.html). (BTW, that discussion of tactics was in strip 672 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0672.html), not 972.) Hard to say for sure which one he means.

[Nightcanon]

Durkula is a bad guy. He's actually obliged by the Laws of Narrative Convention to spend to spend too much time monologing, taunting the good guy without realising that the good guy is using the time to do something more useful, and generally grandstanding on the assumption that he's already won, in this case because he thinks he's just killing time before Priests of the demigods arrive to swing the vote his way.