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acid_ninja
2015-09-12, 08:13 PM
After recently reading the old Planescape campaign setting for the first time (yeah, I know), the thing I loved most about it was the slang. It was so evocative and flavorful and really captured the feel of the setting and breathed life into it.

Trying to figure out how to "Speak Fantasy" is tough for me. The fact is, that we don't really know how people spoke in the medieval world that most D&D takes place in. We often think of it as Shakespearean but Willy was writing poetry, not trying to recreate the way people actually spoke in his day. This brings up the problem (especially for DMs) of how to choose language that gives your character interactions versimilitude. What does your character call the person serving the beer? Barkeep? My good man? Barman? Dude?

I find that having your world have distinct slang and patterns of speech can do a lot for immersion for some gamers but having everyone do crazy accents can take some people out of it. Personally, I really like updating the dialogue to be a little more 19th-century sounding rather than going full pre-industrial.

What do you think, playground? How do you approach this, as a DM or player? Got any good stories or ideas?

I've put a few ideas below. Let me know if you have anything else and I'll include it.


The Planescape campaign setting (as noted above)
The Gentlemen Bastards Sequence by Scott Lynch (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Lynch#The_Gentleman_Bastard_Sequence)
This (https://archive.org/details/cu31924026564504) dictionary of actual Thieves' Cant
This (http://www.artofmanliness.com/2010/03/10/manly-slang-from-the-19th-century/) list of 19th century manly slang - looking at you, rangers
The Phoenix Guards (http://www.amazon.com/The-Phoenix-Gu.../dp/0765319659) - If you want to hear Dumas tell a fantasy story

Temperjoke
2015-09-12, 08:29 PM
Well, for how your character would speak, it would depend on your character. Townspeople, for example, often times tend to speak more clearly than individuals from more rural settings, with nobles speaking even better. If they're speaking their native tongue, there wouldn't be an accent. On the other hand, someone speaking a non-native tongue still might not have an accent if they've been speaking the non-native language for a long time. Dwarves would speak Common flawlessly if they've been around humans for a decade or two.

Personally, if I feel I can pull off an accent, I will endeavor to do so. If I notice someone forgot to use their accent when speaking in character, I politely ignore it and continue with the story.

acid_ninja
2015-09-12, 08:36 PM
I'm not talking accents, so much as vocabulary. Little things like characters would 'loose' a bow, not 'fire' it because 'fire=shoot' only came around after gunpowder was invented.

J-H
2015-09-12, 08:45 PM
Firefly did this really well.

Temperjoke
2015-09-12, 08:47 PM
I'm not talking accents, so much as vocabulary. Little things like characters would 'loose' a bow, not 'fire' it because 'fire=shoot' only came around after gunpowder was invented.

Ah, but there are fire spells that shoot, such as fire bolt.

goto124
2015-09-12, 09:17 PM
Reserve 'fire' for communities that use those spells. There are cultures/villages/whatnot that don't use magic (in that manner), and still mostly use non-magical bows.

acid_ninja
2015-09-12, 09:39 PM
Firefly did this really well.

Definitely. I think that's going to be my 'peasant dialect'.

JoeJ
2015-09-12, 09:56 PM
There's plenty of actual Medieval literature you can read to get a sense for how people spoke. You could start with Malory's Le Morte d'Arthur, then look at Canterbury Tales, Sir Gawain and the Green Knight, Piers Ploughman, and many other works. It's not perfect - the idea of writing a conversation exactly as it would be spoken wasn't a part of literature yet. But since this is a game and not historical linguistic scholarship, it should get you close enough to be fun.

wasgreg
2015-09-12, 10:36 PM
Read some of Alexandre Dumas' works if you want a more ~affected~ speech pattern. Perhaps for royalty, or swashbucklers :) Half the fun of his novels are the manner he speaks to his readers.

acid_ninja
2015-09-12, 10:44 PM
I just feel that really 'medieval sounding' dialogue makes it harder to feel that the character is a real person. I'm aiming for something that feels different but accessible.

MaxWilson
2015-09-12, 11:25 PM
Read some of Alexandre Dumas' works if you want a more ~affected~ speech pattern. Perhaps for royalty, or swashbucklers :) Half the fun of his novels are the manner he speaks to his readers.

And if you enjoy that, you might as well read a fantasy pastiche of the same:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Phoenix-Guards-Steven-Brust/dp/0765319659

The turgid dialogue of the narrator and the characters is one of the great joys of the novel.

acid_ninja
2015-09-12, 11:56 PM
Really enjoyed that. I love the the sequel is called "500 Years After".

acid_ninja
2015-09-12, 11:58 PM
And if you enjoy that, you might as well read a fantasy pastiche of the same:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Phoenix-Guards-Steven-Brust/dp/0765319659

The turgid dialogue of the narrator and the characters is one of the great joys of the novel.

Added to the list

Logosloki
2015-09-13, 02:24 AM
After recently reading the old Planescape campaign setting for the first time (yeah, I know), the thing I loved most about it was the slang. It was so evocative and flavorful and really captured the feel of the setting and breathed life into it.

Trying to figure out how to "Speak Fantasy" is tough for me. The fact is, that we don't really know how people spoke in the medieval world that most D&D takes place in. We often think of it as Shakespearean but Willy was writing poetry, not trying to recreate the way people actually spoke in his day. This brings up the problem (especially for DMs) of how to choose language that gives your character interactions versimilitude. What does your character call the person serving the beer? Barkeep? My good man? Barman? Dude?

I find that having your world have distinct slang and patterns of speech can do a lot for immersion for some gamers but having everyone do crazy accents can take some people out of it. Personally, I really like updating the dialogue to be a little more 19th-century sounding rather than going full pre-industrial.

What do you think, playground? How do you approach this, as a DM or player? Got any good stories or ideas?

I've put a few ideas below. Let me know if you have anything else and I'll include it.


The Planescape campaign setting (as noted above)
The Gentlemen Bastards Sequence by Scott Lynch (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Lynch#The_Gentleman_Bastard_Sequence)
This (https://archive.org/details/cu31924026564504) dictionary of actual Thieves' Cant
This (http://www.artofmanliness.com/2010/03/10/manly-slang-from-the-19th-century/) list of 19th century manly slang - looking at you, rangers
The Phoenix Guards (http://www.amazon.com/The-Phoenix-Gu.../dp/0765319659) - If you want to hear Dumas tell a fantasy story


If you want the best, there is always Cockney Rhyming Slang. Can't get anymore more english than a thick accent and an indecipherable cant to those not in the know. The only shame is that second person is seen pretentious in English, else moving to the more intimate Thou instead you and so on would be the best.

Regitnui
2015-09-13, 02:52 AM
I try to flavour my speech rather than change my.speech pattern. Having an appropriate vocabulary is all good and well, but falls flat if your DM and fellow players just stare atat you blankly. For example, I had a 4e Changeling Swordmage who's favorite exclamation was "Avandra's bountiful tits!" and variations thereof. A dwarf swears "Bloody rockfalls!". An accent and acting goes further to making a character distinct than vocabulary, I think.

MrConsideration
2015-09-13, 05:31 AM
It's not Medieval, but a lot of Tudor-era criminal slang has come down to us and can be found on the Web. A 'prigger of prancers' is a horse-thief, for example, and definitely the name of the next tavern my players end up in! There's a list available here. (https://midtudormanor.wordpress.com/criminal-slang/)

If you think of one phrase or idiom for every important NPC it should help - the Dwarven ruler might swear by his ancestor's spit, for example.

I think communicating attitudes gives more verisimilitude than speech patterns. We know a fair bit about the attitudes of aristocrats through Medieval Europe, for example:

Aristocrats are self-evidently better than peasants; the very idea of a serf matching an aristocrat in any arena of princely virtue is unthinkable. Aristocrats know that war is ultimately good - giving the warrior-classes a chance to show their valour. The idea of some wandering murder-hobo villein asking for an audience with His Grace is genuinely insulting.

I think giving a clear picture of the world is more important than having an 'accurate' vocabulary for your NPCs, so avoid too much hammy use of weird medieval words.

ericp65
2015-09-13, 11:23 PM
One approach is to decide what historical Earth era corresponds to the era in your game world, and use vocabulary and expressions accordingly. A group I used to game in decided that a given Earth year's number is equivalent to a Faerunian year's number, plus about 220 years. So, the Faerunian year 1372 DR, for example, would be the same as 1592 C.E. on Earth. This issue became most important for me when I began writing dialogue for the BG2 NPC mod I'm developing. As BG2 begins in the Faerunian year 1368 DR, I chose to pattern the character's speech after Early Middle English.

That stated, in gaming groups, I've never encountered an instance in which the players attempted to alter their speech, except to omit "modern" slang. We always took it as a given that the game personalities spoke differently than we did to get the same points across, and were never bothered by it.

Now that I think on it more, it would be interesting to have the players and DM speak more the way they figure the characters and NPCs would speak, so this is a cool concept :)

Regitnui
2015-09-14, 03:04 AM
One approach is to decide what historical Earth era corresponds to the era in your game world, and use vocabulary and expressions accordingly. A group I used to game in decided that a given Earth year's number is equivalent to a Faerunian year's number, plus about 220 years. So, the Faerunian year 1372 DR, for example, would be the same as 1592 C.E. on Earth. This issue became most important for me when I began writing dialogue for the BG2 NPC mod I'm developing. As BG2 begins in the Faerunian year 1368 DR, I chose to pattern the character's speech after Early Middle English.

The main problem is that a lot of the change in language over the past century, English especially, has been driven by the exponential increase in technology after the two World Wars*. So for your method, the language stays pretty much static after Faerunian year 1780 (Since we'd be living in FY1795). Not to say it's a bad method, but it's not exactly foolproof either.

*ASIDE: Something which I feel Eberron does rather well, as a world caught between WWI and WWII with magic instead of technology.

acid_ninja
2015-09-14, 05:39 AM
One approach is to decide what historical Earth era corresponds to the era in your game world, and use vocabulary and expressions accordingly. A group I used to game in decided that a given Earth year's number is equivalent to a Faerunian year's number, plus about 220 years. So, the Faerunian year 1372 DR, for example, would be the same as 1592 C.E. on Earth. This issue became most important for me when I began writing dialogue for the BG2 NPC mod I'm developing. As BG2 begins in the Faerunian year 1368 DR, I chose to pattern the character's speech after Early Middle English.

That stated, in gaming groups, I've never encountered an instance in which the players attempted to alter their speech, except to omit "modern" slang. We always took it as a given that the game personalities spoke differently than we did to get the same points across, and were never bothered by it.

Now that I think on it more, it would be interesting to have the players and DM speak more the way they figure the characters and NPCs would speak, so this is a cool concept :)

I'm looking for ways to create a dialect or slang that :

a) helps make the setting come alive (ie reflects the world in which the characters live)
b) is close enough to the way my players speak naturally that they won't feel self-conscious

Given that Middle English is a distinct language from modern english (see here) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE0MtENfOMU), I'm not sure that Middle English is the way forward (but it might be in your game), but I love that you see the potential in the idea. That's the trick: making it modern enough to adopt easily but archaic enough to make it sound foreign and real.

Also, glad to see MrConsideration weigh in. Love your "Let's read" and quite enjoyed your blog.

Shining Wrath
2015-09-14, 05:58 AM
I usually don't do accents. I do vary my vocabulary, though; peasants tend to use fewer and smaller words.

I've been doing Lost Mines of Phandalin with my daughter, and she captured the Nothic, and has had several conversations with it trying to understand it. The Nothic is very smart but crazy, so it changes subjects in the middle of a sentence and so on.

NNescio
2015-09-14, 06:19 AM
One approach is to decide what historical Earth era corresponds to the era in your game world, and use vocabulary and expressions accordingly. A group I used to game in decided that a given Earth year's number is equivalent to a Faerunian year's number, plus about 220 years. So, the Faerunian year 1372 DR, for example, would be the same as 1592 C.E. on Earth. This issue became most important for me when I began writing dialogue for the BG2 NPC mod I'm developing. As BG2 begins in the Faerunian year 1368 DR, I chose to pattern the character's speech after Early Middle English.

I think you meant Early Modern English, AKA Shakespearean (the later variants), AKA King James Bible English. The one with all the thous and thees, and what most people would mistakenly think is "Old English" (which is in fact, older).

Early Modern English range from the 15th to 17th century. 15th century Early Modern English can still be hard to understand for modern speakers. Example:


SIR GAWAINE rode more than a pace, and Gaheris his brother that rode with him instead of a squire to do him service. So as they rode they saw two knights fight on horseback passing sore, so Sir Gawaine and his brother rode betwixt them, and asked them for what cause they fought so. The one knight answered and said, We fight for a simple matter, for we two be two brethren born and begotten of one man and of one woman. Alas, said Sir Gawaine, why do ye so? Sir, said the elder, there came a white hart this way this day, and many hounds chased him, and a white brachet was alway next him, and we understood it was adventure made for the high feast of King Arthur, and therefore I would have gone after to have won me worship; and here my younger brother said he would go after the hart, for he was better knight than I: and for this cause we fell at debate, and so we thought to prove which of us both was better knight. This is a simple cause, said Sir Gawaine; uncouth men ye should debate withal, and not brother with brother; therefore but if you will do by my counsel I will have ado with you, that is ye shall yield you unto me, and that ye go unto King Arthur and yield you unto his grace. Sir knight, said the two brethren, we are forfoughten and much blood have we lost through our wilfulness, and therefore we would be loath to have ado with you. Then do as I will have you, said Sir Gawaine. We will agree to fulfil your will; but by whom shall we say that we be thither sent? Ye may say, By the knight that followeth the quest of the hart that was white. Now what is your name? said Gawaine. Sorlouse of the Forest, said the elder. And my name is, said the younger, Brian of the Forest. And so they departed and went to the king's court, and Sir Gawaine on his quest.

Early Middle English range from 12th to 14th century, and is nearly incomprehensible to modern speakers. Unless everyone on your table is an English major, you might as well be speaking Norse to them. Example:


Ich še bidde for šan ilche hlauerd še še iscop me to helpe. šat alswo šu hauest ȝegunnen ⁊ šane grundwall ileid. Of šese hali mihtes šat tu hes forš bringe ⁊ me hes tęche. foršan hie bieš me swiše unbecnawe for še maniȝe unšeawes še ic mid me to longe 55 habbe ihafd. Ac nu ic hes wile leten. ⁊ mid godes fultume of hem ȝeswiken. And min ȝežanc to šine lore healden. For šare hali mihte še cariteš is icleped ic še beseche ⁊ bidde šat tu šese halwende lore on write sette. for šan ic am michel ženchinde šar hwile še ic on šese wrecche lichame am wuniende. ⁊ ofte forȝete šat me god; węre 60 te healden. and ec sum ošer saule hit wile helpen.

Yeah, incomprehensible to most people.

On a relevant note, I usually hate it when most people attempt Early Modern English, because it usually means using thous and thees when inappropriate (it's a familiar form of "you", like du in German and tu in French). Also gratuitous -(e)st -(e)th endings to verbs even when they shouldn't belong there (-[e]st is 2nd person while -[e]th is 3rd person, so they never belong to a 1st person verb).

It's kinda like German, really (Compare "have/hast/hath" with "habe/hast/hat").

Also, geez, don't forget about thous used in the accusative (for objects) and thees used for subjects. Gah.

acid_ninja
2015-09-14, 06:21 AM
Also, the silent 'e' is pronounced and is everywhere.

Tenmujiin
2015-09-14, 08:15 AM
My group tends to speak about 3/4 modern English and about 1/4 modern English with changes to match our character's personality/accent/slang. The characters most likely wouldn't be speaking English in the first place (especially if they aren't speaking common) so it always seemed pointless to try and speak with a older English dialect.

Edit: I'm probably the most or second most role-playing orientated member of the group and care by far the most about game world consistency.

KorvinStarmast
2015-09-14, 08:44 AM
takes place in. We often think of it as Shakespearean but Willy was writing poetry,
He also wrote plays. That's a different style of language than verse.

Beleriphon
2015-09-14, 10:50 AM
He also wrote plays. That's a different style of language than verse.

More importantly Shakespeare was iambic pentameter, and it rhymed. Nobody in their right mind would have actually spoken the way Hamlet or King Lear do as a matter of course. Spoken Early Modern English would be perfectly understandable to anybody that speaks English currently, although phrases and expressions would likely be issues.

LVOD
2015-09-14, 12:34 PM
Ive been using both accents and vocabulary as well. They really do bring everything together.

For accents, i generally assign each common race something real-world based so its easy to replicate.
Dwarves are scottish, elves are british proper, etc.

Then you throw in modifications: small characters have a more flighty speach pattern, orcs are very gutteral and direct, elves speak very smoothly with very little inflection.

Lastly, come up with a handfull of slang. Make them something youll get a lot of mileage out of (guy, money, friend, enemy, etc).
Maybe dwarves refer to friendly males as "beards" or invent new words. With new words, i usually just modify an existing word with similar meaning. Then you still hear the real word hidden in there and naturally make the association (maybe "critter" becomes "kitter").

then you just have to make sure you use lots of ye-olde speech.

LVOD
2015-09-14, 12:39 PM
I guess i kinda got off track there. My point was that you can make it your own. You dont need to worry too much about historical accuracy or pseudo-realism.

Garimeth
2015-09-14, 01:00 PM
I do this a lot in my world building, and my group thinks I do a fairly good job you may or may not. I have a rough system for how I do it, WARNING POSSIBLE OFFENSIVE MATERIAL AHEAD!

The most obvious slang that comes to mind are curses, slurs, alternate meanings, shorthand, and words borrowed from other languages. Looking at a good example from RL people say things like "Jesus Christ" or "God D*mmit!" or even "Go to Hell" those are all based off of religion, so in your game world that is a good first place to turn, one of the other posters mentioned using "Avandra's Bountiful Tits!" great example! So just before the game think out a couple of those kinds of phrases. Play off of your cosmology and important things/people in the setting.

"By Moradin's beard!"

"YOU did that? Pelor's (Or 'the king's) Arse" (to express incredulity or shock)

-Slurs are pretty easy in a fantasy setting and I don't really feel like I need to go into them, but again the key is planning them ahead of time.

Alternate meaning: for example, the word "cool" or that someone is "hot" it actually makes no sense at all, but we all say it, and understand when others say it also. Just come up with some stuff like this for your setting. It will sound weird at first, then people will get used to it. This is one of the things planescape did REALLY well. Its kind of setting dependent, so hard for me to give direct advice on. In my setting the dwarven funerary rites involve them mummifying their dead and entombing them underground. This is significant because in my setting all dead who have not been consecrated rise as undead at certain times of the year, causing most cultures to cremate their dead, dwarves are an exception. Additionally, they believe that when they die they metaphysically return to the earth so they refer to death both literally (the metaphysics) and figuratively (entombment) as "returning to the stone". So that's something my dwarves say. I have LOTS of little things like this in my setting and its the main source of my slang.

Next, shorthand. I mostly use this as nicknames for locations. I tend to come up with nicknames for regions, wards and neighborhoods, slums, rulers, factions, and occupations.

Lastly, words from other languages. Just make up some words and say they are the elven or dwarven word for X, particularly foods, beverages, and luxury items.

Regitnui
2015-09-14, 02:49 PM
one of the other posters mentioned using "Avandra's Bountiful Tits!" great example!

Thanks!

I also use conlangs, like Skyrim's Dovahzul (the Dragon Shouts) as bases. Mokru ven akraad lan tek! is a typical example of overheard Draconic in one of my games. I also try to keep the tone consistent, using hard consonants and snarled vowels in Draconic, short syllables for dwarven, and long, soft sounds when I'm pretending at Elvish. For other human languages, or goblinoid, I tend to go for gibberish drawing from scraps and mispronounced English: "Oi, wa sook yur ousada hier?" to mean "Hey, what are you outsiders looking for here?"

Garimeth
2015-09-14, 03:02 PM
Thanks!

I also use conlangs, like Skyrim's Dovahzul (the Dragon Shouts) as bases. Mokru ven akraad lan tek! is a typical example of overheard Draconic in one of my games. I also try to keep the tone consistent, using hard consonants and snarled vowels in Draconic, short syllables for dwarven, and long, soft sounds when I'm pretending at Elvish. For other human languages, or goblinoid, I tend to go for gibberish drawing from scraps and mispronounced English: "Oi, wa sook yur ousada hier?" to mean "Hey, what are you outsiders looking for here?"

I very rarely do full phrases like that, mostly because I'm lazy, but also because I tend to just either translate it or say that the individual is unintelligible because the players don't speak XXX. I tend to treat common like American English and think of what typical words we have borrowed from other languages.

Comet
2015-09-14, 03:05 PM
To be a bit of a contrarian, I really like having everyone in my games of D&D talk like we would in our everyday life. I feel that D&D, in particular, is often so soft and clean when it comes to examining any kind of medieval lifestyle that the player characters end up being very modern in their outlook on life. Here men and women of very different ethnicities and social standings come together to engage in exciting but ultimately sportslike combat, armed with bags of holding and sunrods and means of magical communication and other quality of life improvements.

For an excellent example of this, check out Fel's Five. This D&D comic shows exactly that, a world where the heroes adventure through a very modern fantasy world. And they talk like us, pretty much. Order of the Stick, too, come to think of it.

I feel like Dungeons & Dragons is almost like its own genre, if you just look at the rulebooks and Forgotten Realms and Eberron and such. Modern sensibilities in a world of swords and magic is in some way even more exotic than thees and thous in a world of castles and hamlets.

Susano-wo
2015-09-14, 06:50 PM
First, I gotta be pedantic about thou. People use it incorrectly, but it is not a familiar form of "thee," it is the singular, second person pronoun, whereas thee is the plural second person pronoun, which were merged into you for both at some point. (or rather, i suppose it could be possible that it became a fmiliar form, but it was later than its usage in the King James Bible (sorry--I know its kinda of off topic :smallredface:)

As evidence (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/thou)

As for my characters, I generally use speech patterns that I think sound good, without trying to medieval it up (caveat, I do use some faux medieval patterns for nobility/very formal people), though I try to avoid anachronisms (no dudes, no mentioning of people that do no exist in that universe, etc). As far as slang goes, I think its just a matter of adding these things into the dialogue in natural ways, as well as using it in descriptions. If your setting has a slang for, say, elves, introduce elves on occasion using that slang. This can be especially nice to color descriptions given to characters with certain mindsets. Someone doesn't like gnomes? describe the gnome that just left the building as a Mushroom Farmer or something.:smallbiggrin:

NNescio
2015-09-14, 09:48 PM
First, I gotta be pedantic about thou. People use it incorrectly, but it is not a familiar form of "thee," it is the singular, second person pronoun, whereas thee is the plural second person pronoun, which were merged into you for both at some point. (or rather, i suppose it could be possible that it became a fmiliar form, but it was later than its usage in the King James Bible (sorry--I know its kinda of off topic :smallredface:)

As evidence (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/thou)

I'm sorry, but you're quite wrong, even according to the link you posted.


pronoun, sing., nom. thou; possessive thy or thine; objective thee; pl., nom. you or ye; possessive your or yours; objective you or ye.

Thou is a 2nd person singular pronoun in the nominative case (subject), used for 'familiar' people, or people below your social station (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T%E2%80%93V_distinction#English). The Christian God was addressed as "thou" because people consider themselves to have a personal relationship with him.

Also some people would switch to "thou" when they get pissed off (Anime viewers, this use is somewhat similar to when a Japanese speaker switches to "kisama" or some other 'pronoun').

Thee is the same, but in the oblique case (object, which is a combination of accusative and dative cases, plus some uses of the genitive case). It is used both for direct and indirect objects.

Compare "Thou art a strange fellow." (from King Lear, Act 2 Scene 2) with "Have at thee, coward!" (from Romeo and Juliet, Act 1, Scene 1). The first sentence uses "thou" because it is the subject, while the second one uses "thee" because it is the (indirect) object.

Thine and Thy are used to indicate possession. It is used before nouns starting with a vowel sound ("thine eyes", "thine hour"). Thy is used instead before nouns starting with consonant sounds ("thy sons"). Here, they function as possessive adjectives.

When used as a possessive pronoun (e.g. "This is mine"), thine is always used, not thy.

Again, compare this with German: Thou/Thee/Thee/Thine vs Du/Dich/Dir/Dein. Note the similarity in pronunciation.

In Early Modern English, You or Ye can function both as the formal 2nd person singular pronoun, or the general 2nd person plural pronoun (for both formal and informal). Ye tends to show up more often together with "thou", however.

The oblique case of You or Ye* is You (never Ye). The possessive adjective is your. The possessive pronoun is yours.

(*Do not confuse Ye with The, which can be written as že and sometimes look identical due to the font used. "Ye Olde" should actually be "The Olde".)

Note that the above are true only for Early Modern English. Old English and Early Middle English do not have the Thou/You informal/formal distinction. Thu (not thou) is used for the 2nd person singular, and Ye is the 2nd person plural. You is the object form of Ye. This distinction became lost in Early Modern English, where you was increasingly used as the plural subject, and also as a polite form of address for unfamiliar people, or people above the speaker's social station. That's how "you" ended up as the singular.

Later on the use of "you" became so increasingly common that it hedged out nearly all uses of "ye" and "thou", which is what we now have in our current era Modern English. A few number of regional dialects (most in England, usually Oop North or over at West Country) still use thou (or some variant), however.

TL;DR: Thee was never plural.

Susano-wo
2015-09-14, 10:19 PM
:smallredface:
wow. I gotta admit, I glossed over the other cases once i confirmed the Thou case..huh, I've been taught wrong all my life :smallredface:
Thanks for setting me straight though. A little embarrassment is a small price to pay :smallbiggrin:

Vogonjeltz
2015-09-15, 04:22 PM
I'm not talking accents, so much as vocabulary. Little things like characters would 'loose' a bow, not 'fire' it because 'fire=shoot' only came around after gunpowder was invented.

As a thought experiment, try thinking of how your character would describe activities, write out the sentence you're thinking of, then go back and scrub any words that are anachronistic or euphemisms that only make sense with other context. The fire example is quite good as it comes from literally applying fire to black powder to make the weapon work (the same way letting loose of the bowstring and arrow shoots the arrow).

If you really want to make your character stand out, select some verbs and adjectives they routinely use, verbal tics, and try to insert them for color commentary.