Magical damage or not magical damage?

[stenver]

So lets look at some damages. Its confusing to me wether they should be considered magical or not?

For example - death knight:
Longsword. MeleeWeaponAttack:+11 to hit, reach 5ft., one target. Hit:9 (1d8 + 5) slashing damage, or 10 (1d10 + 5) slashing damage if used with two hands, plus 18 (4d8) necrotic damage.

Is the slashing damage non-magical and necrotic damage magical?

Cone of cold:
A creature takes 8d8 cold damage on a failed save

So it it all magical, since it is a spell? Or is it non-magical because it doesnt say it is magical?

Blade barrier:
On a failed save, the creature takes 6d10 slashing damage.

Nothing says it is magical, but the damage is from a spell, which is magic by definition. So is the damage type magical?

I would also reference this thread:
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?432162-Are-dragon-breath-attacks-magical-Is-Mind-Blast-and-Devour-intellect-spell-casting

[JackPhoenix]

Outside slashing, piercing and bludgeoning, it doesn't matter if the attack is magical or not. AFAIK unless it specifies that the S/P/B attack is magical, it isn't, regardless of source (I may be wrong on the second one)

[MadGrady]

Considering the advice from the developers there at the end of the linked thread, I would say that the damage from Blade Barriar and Cone of Cold would be damage since it is damage as a result of spell-casting (this also just makes sense imho - I cast a spell, it hurts you, damage was magical in nature).

The death knight in this instance is the strange one - perhaps need a bit more info. Is the sword enchanted? Iif so - I believe all of the damage is magical - see monster entries where they say resistant/immune to B/P/S damage from non-magical sources/weapons.

I guess the question is - what is the source of the necrotic damage - is it a cleric like ability (such as divine strike - in which case it isn't "magical" just necrotic from a divine source)

[Aetol]

Is "magical damage" even a notion that exist ? I only recall ever seeing phrasings like "<type> damage from (non)magical source".

EDIT : "magical damage" (exact term) never appears in the MM.
On the other hands, some creatures have traits like "the <creature>'s weapon attacks are magical". The death knight doesn't have that, so the physical damage from his sword should be nonmagical. And arguably so is the necrotic damage.

[R.Shackleford]

I've always ran my games (4e) where magic and non-magic damage was the same. The difference is BPS or Elemental. More like in Final Fantasy. This stops the issue of magical fire versus real fire versus summoned fire...

Magic/Masterwork (can be either way, fluff is the only difference) could always bypass resistances to BPS or Elemental damage but never immunity.

All damage is damage, just different types of damage.

[Coidzor]

Is "magical damage" even a notion that exist ? I only recall ever seeing phrasings like "<type> damage from (non)magical source".

AFAIK, it's only a few places, like resistance to nonmagical weapons where the idea comes up. So if a creature said Death Knight was attacking had resistance to non-magical weapons, then the necrotic damage wouldn't be resisted but the slashing damage would. But if it were a Death Knight with a magic weapon or the ability to counts its wielded weapons as magical, then that slashing damage would no longer be resisted.

[Sigreid]

I think it's pretty obvious. Necrotic damage is necrotic type. Cone of Cold is Cold damage. The sword attacks are with a normal sword, and do not count as a magic weapon unless you choose to equip him with a magic sword, which the party will use after the beat down.

Edit: Blade barrier is magic, being a spell and all.

[stenver]

Things would be a lot easier if I didnt have the armor of invulnerability on my players. However, they do have one and the description says:


ARMOR OF INVULNERABILITY
Armor (plate), legendary (requires attunement)
You have resistance to nonmagical damage while you wear this armor. Additionally, you can use an action to make yourself immune to nonmagical damage for 10 minutes or until you are no longer wearing the armor. Once this special action is used, it can't be used again until the next dawn.


If it would only say "nonmagical slashing, bludgeoning and piercing", then the answer would be simple. However, it says all non magical damage. Im having a hard time defining what is magical damage and what is now. Linking the thread above about dragon breath (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?432162-Are-dragon-breath-attacks-magical-Is-Mind-Blast-and-Devour-intellect-spell-casting), it came out that the dragon breath is NOT magical. A lot of the times, the creatures do some special damage type(like death knight), but nowhere does it say it is magical.

Currently it seems to me, I should just rule one way or another as I see fit.

[Aetol]

Things would be a lot easier if I didnt have the armor of invulnerability on my players. However, they do have one and the description says:


If it would only say "nonmagical slashing, bludgeoning and piercing", then the answer would be simple. However, it says all non magical damage. Im having a hard time defining what is magical damage and what is now. Linking the thread above about dragon breath (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?432162-Are-dragon-breath-attacks-magical-Is-Mind-Blast-and-Devour-intellect-spell-casting), it came out that the dragon breath is NOT magical. A lot of the times, the creatures do some special damage type(like death knight), but nowhere does it say it is magical.

Currently it seems to me, I should just rule one way or another as I see fit.

I suppose a more proper phrasing would be "damage from nonmagical sources". That could be B/P/S damage from nonmagical weapons ; bludgeoning damage from falling ; fire damage from a regular fire ; and so on. And it looks like supernatural abilities (like a dragon's breath or, apparently, a death knight's attack) are not considered magical sources.

A possible fluff explanation might be that spells (and weapon enchantments) are designed to penetrate some forms or resistance, while supernatural abilities, while magical in nature (again, from a fluff standpoint) cannot.

[Randomthom]

AFB at the moment but I always understood it thus;

"Magic Damage" is any damage that is in some-way magical in nature.
Therefore a magically enchanted weapon is magic.
Spells, spell-like abilities and supernatural abilities are magic but extraordinary abilities are not (can't remember if 5e still distinguishes all these sources of ability).
Summoned creatures are not inherently magical (however their spells, spell-like abilities and supernatural abilities are) unless their entry specifically states that their attacks are treated like a magic weapon.

In the absence of a clear answer, compare the spell to other defensive spells of the same level and adjudicate accordingly.