Hiding, your opnion on this one

[djreynolds]

Hey gals and guys,

I've been reading a lot of posts on hiding. I just rolled a rogue, and his scores rock. And I want to see just how much fun I can have with him.

So I was watching "Last of the Mohicans" with Wes Studi and Lewis. I bring it up, really as a reference we can all use and look at. If you haven't seen the movie, sit down with your girlfriend or boyfriend because they'll like it to.

So the scene is near the beginning of the movie wear Magwa, Studi, is about to shoot Nathaniel, Lewis. Lewis, the obvious better shot, sees this and aims in.

For the sake of this discussion Lewis is a ranger and Studi is a rogue.

Magwa will get his shot off first and miss. Nathaniel has him in sights and is about to fire, but because of the smoke produce by the firearm of Magwa, when the smoke clears all we see is the rustling leaves of the tree.

Now, IMO, as a novice to hiding, Magwa uses his movement after missing. Nathaniel cannot even track Magwa's movement, though he has a clue that Magwa returned to the forest and could track him with a general direction at least.

Now I know that bows don't leave smoke clouds when fired and that rogues get only one bonus action. So he cannot disengage, or use fast hands and hide, right?

So let's say, Magwa has fast hands, missed his shot, used his bonus action to throw a smoke bomb and his unused movement to escape. So in game terms, perhaps this was a surprise round and Nathaniel does not get to act.

So can Magwa be considered hidden at the start of the next round. Nathaniel has an idea of where he went, and is obviously on alert, but not a sure idea. And Magwa had to waste his bonus action with his fast hands, for a distraction. So he couldn't have hidden at the end of that surprise round, correct.

So next round commences, is Magwa hidden or can he hide now? Or does Nathaniel have the bead on him, no matter what?

[Malifice]

If your enemy cant see you 'clearly enough' you can attempt to go into hiding.

Smoke could certainly fulfill that requirement for mine.

[djreynolds]

If your enemy cant see you 'clearly enough' you can attempt to go into hiding.

Smoke could certainly fulfill that requirement for mine.

So, Magwa could then hide on the next round immediately following his escape because the distraction broke or was enough to just to stop Nathaniel from firing or even tracking him. And obviously in this case the woods would provide additional concealment, and if Nathaniel was even sure he could've fired or given chase and didn't, so we could assume Magwa successfully hid.

[NewbieDMaster]

So next round commences, is Magwa hidden or can he hide now? Or does Nathaniel have the bead on him, no matter what?

Magwa is not hidden, but he does have full cover, assuming he moved into a position within the trees that completely blocks line of sight to Nathaniel.
By RAW, Nathaniel still knows exactly where Magwa is, as Magwa is not hidden, but he cannot see him.
If Magwa beats Nathaniel's initiative, then he can use his bonus action to hide on his turn, before Nathaniel gets a turn, and by RAW, Nathaniel still knows where Magwa was standing in the trees when he hid. If Magwa doesn't move after hiding, then Nathaniel should be able to find him pretty easily. I would rule that because Nathaniel didn't get a turn before Magwa hid however, that Nathaniel doesn't know where he is because it feels more fun that way.
If Nathaniel beat Magwa's initiative, then he would know exactly where Magwa is, and could move to an advantageous position and attack him.

[djreynolds]

Magwa is not hidden, but he does have full cover, assuming he moved into a position within the trees that completely blocks line of sight to Nathaniel.
By RAW, Nathaniel still knows exactly where Magwa is, as Magwa is not hidden, but he cannot see him.
If Magwa beats Nathaniel's initiative, then he can use his bonus action to hide on his turn, before Nathaniel gets a turn, and by RAW, Nathaniel still knows where Magwa was standing in the trees when he hid. If Magwa doesn't move after hiding, then Nathaniel should be able to find him pretty easily. I would rule that because Nathaniel didn't get a turn before Magwa hid however, that Nathaniel doesn't know where he is because it feels more fun that way.
If Nathaniel beat Magwa's initiative, then he would know exactly where Magwa is, and could move to an advantageous position and attack him.

And thus is why Nathaniel didn't pursue Magwa. So Magwa in-order to hide had to have won initiative after the initial surprise round.

Now can Magwa forsake his attack on his turn, dash and hide as a bonus action?