What does a Mind Flayer look like as a child?

[Ghost Nappa]

I am building a dungeon and I want to make a recurring villainous character. I decided that a mind flayer would be perfect: an evil interloper from another dimension/plane seeking to extend its own power and authority in a world where there aren't any real threats to its power and that is soon going to blossom with people.

But, I want to introduce this character very early and a Mind Flayer straight out of the book is way too hard for Level 1 or 2 characters. So I decided to make it a child and go for a villainous Superman / Dragon Ball kind of story where the adults send the child off to an "easy to conquer" place far away so that it would come into its power over time before rejoining its peers as an adult.

The scenario I have planned is an encounter/puzzle:

as the players attempt to leave a room they have just cleared only for weird things to start to happen. The walls of the tunnel start making sound like there's a waterfall behind it (but the walls still feel and look like rock), and the door they entered makes a loud unnatural sound as it slams shut. The players trip as they try to turn around and see what's happening. When they stand up, they see that the laces of their shoes have been tied together (an invisible pixie was testing them) but they don't see anything. They only hear the nervous flapping of wings and a weird sound that sounds like it might come from a mouth (the invisible mind flayer child). I'm still considering ideas for what constitutes "solving the puzzle" / ending the encounter, but at the moment I'm concerned with the mind flayer child's abilities because I don't want him to be stronger than any one of the players but strong enough to eat the pixie if left to its devices.

[CNagy]

If I recall correctly, Mind Flayer young are larva that eat a host's brain and then mutate the body into that of a Mind Flayer.

[JoeJ]

There was a 2e guide to mind flayers and their society. You can get it here (http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17448/Monstrous-Arcana-The-Illithiad-2e?it=1).

Unfortunately, mind flayers don't really have children in the normal sense of the word. They produce thousands of little tadpole-like things that prey on each other and are eaten in turn by the elder brain. The few that survive are implanted into humanoids where they devour the host's brain to take control of the body, then transform into a full grown mind flayer, although one that still needs some education.

[Naanomi]

Yeah they start out as tadpoles living in the elder brain pool,that when they get big enough they get implanted in a humanoid host and become illithid. If they get big enough before implanting they become ultralithid instead. If implanted in something else they become other illithid variants. If left too long without being implanted they crawl out and become Neolithids

[Shining Wrath]

The tadpoles won't work for this story.

Maybe what you want is a Mind Flayer that was forced through a portal into the game setting, and lost almost all of its powers passing through the portal, and is slowly regaining them as it adapts.

[Naanomi]

Some species don't work well with symbiotes, if you really wanted 'weaker illithid' you could make a colony that were forced by circumstances to use svirfneblin or some other race you decide is 'incompatible' and created unfortunately weaker illithid as a result

[Regitnui]

Some species don't work well with symbiotes, if you really wanted 'weaker illithid' you could make a colony that were forced by circumstances to use svirfneblin or some other race you decide is 'incompatible' and created unfortunately weaker illithid as a result

Mind flayers, despite their appearance, are aberrations. Their life cycle by no means resembles ours. Look at the beholder, for example; at some point during their lives, a "womb" behind their tongue starts to swell, eventually pushing the tongue from their mouth. When it's large enough, the beholder hacks this organ up, bites it off and leaves the miniature beholders within to emerge. Any that do not look sufficiently like their parent are killed, and the rest chased off. In short, run from a beholder with its tongue sticking out.

"Substandard host" or "physics-sick" is probably the best you'll get if you want a 'juvenile' illithid.

EDIT: Though I suppose if you were twisted enough, you could use a mind flayer who's stolen a child's body instead of an adult's. The hive could have tried it as an 'experiment', and now the miniature mind flayer is just trying to impress the others and be allowed back in.

[Osrogue]

You could do a newly implanted person. One who isn't fully transformed into a mindflayer.

Points if it is a NPC the players are familiar with.

[Naanomi]

You could do a newly implanted person. One who isn't fully transformed into a mindflayer.

Points if it is a NPC the players are familiar with.
That's a good angle, the process takes a variable amount of time and takes longer if they are going to be an ultralithid

[erradin]

Eugh, tadpoles. An idea occurs though- perhaps the mind-flayer is an experimental one that can jump hosts? The story could be about it searching for the right host to achieve ultimate power, and running into incompatabilities or unexpected power failures as the host bodies react badly. Maybe it even tries magical beasts and the like in an attempt to end up with its powers as well as the normal ones it has.

[Traab]

Eugh, tadpoles. An idea occurs though- perhaps the mind-flayer is an experimental one that can jump hosts? The story could be about it searching for the right host to achieve ultimate power, and running into incompatabilities or unexpected power failures as the host bodies react badly. Maybe it even tries magical beasts and the like in an attempt to end up with its powers as well as the normal ones it has.

That could be interesting. You could have a dungeon full of odd variants of various creatures. Weld on a few random illithid physical characteristics, and/or powers and you have illithid/owl hybrids and other random creatures. And since its a long overarching story, it would be easy to stock the dungeon with weak or failure cross attempts and as they level up they find its latest lair with better tries at ultimate host bodies. And all the while the rising big bad himself is getting stronger by assimilating various abilities. By the time you are done you have a dungeon full of dragonthids or illiholders and the big bad is an illithasque.

[Naanomi]

Dragon illithid are called Brainstealer Dragons
Beholder illithid are called mindwitness
Svirfneblin illithid are called mozgriken
Lizard men illithid are called tzakandi
Chuul illithid are called uchuulon
Roper illithid are called urophion
Unintelligent animal illithid are called illithidae

Neogi illithid have no name but are extremely intelligent even by both their races' standards

There has never been a successful aboleth illithid, they tend to explode in city-ending psionic energy blasts

[Kane0]

When I read the title i thought of a tiny bundle of tentacles with a pair of eyes...

[Capac Amaru]

It looks like a smaller mind flayer, with a proportionally larger head, wearing a little hat with a propeller on top.

[Blas_de_Lezo]

Au contraire than people thinks, little mind flayers are rather cute when babies. Something like this: :smallbiggrin:

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/flurZv2fi8I/maxresdefault.jpg

[Kane0]

Lol yep, thats pretty close to what i pictured. Its even the right color.

It feeds via facehugs or something

[Malifice]

I love the implanted child angle.

Preferably a child the PCs know.

[Regitnui]

There has never been a successful aboleth illithid, they tend to explode in city-ending psionic energy blasts

There's your plot; illithidae and failed hosts left in the trail of this body-hopping illithid who intends to merge with an aboleth. The aboleth calls upon the players to get rid of this ambitious little creature before it blows them both to smithereens.

[Rusty Killinger]

So, two random references popped into my head while reading the original post. The first is the slimy, tentacle covered, but oddly adorable baby that Agent J delivers in the first Men in Black movie. The second are the gene-stealer cults from Warhammer 40k, which are groups of genetically and psychically controlled slaves that worship disgusting monster/human hybrid babies. The Tyrannids use them to set up invasions and destroy whole worlds.

If I was running a game I could have some peasants find a poor lost baby mind flayer. The baby couldn't do much physically, but it could charm very effectively till it controlled a whole village. Anyone who made their save, or found out too much would naturally be murdered. I would also give it some sort of "cry" ability (because what else to babies do). Some sort of piercing scream with a wisdom save and a debuff. The crying would also bring any of it's adopted parents within a mile running in a desperate violent frenzy.

I feel like there's also a way to work Little Shop of Horrors in there.

[goto124]

Unfortunately, mind flayers don't really have children in the normal sense of the word. They produce thousands of little tadpole-like things that prey on each other and are eaten in turn by the elder brain. The few that survive are implanted into humanoids where they devour the host's brain to take control of the body, then transform into a full grown mind flayer, although one that still needs some education.

♫ Nature is beautiful ♫

[JoeJ]

♫ Nature is beautiful ♫

Nothing about mind flayers counts as nature.

[Asmotherion]

If I recall correctly, Mind Flayer young are larva that eat a host's brain and then mutate the body into that of a Mind Flayer.

true that. If you ever play Neverwinter Online, and get to the high levels (57-60), there is a whole quest about this. It's actually very nicelly done, giving all the lore first hand :3

Just wanted to mention it. If you're not into MMOs, it's worth your wile to wach it on youtube. :)

[Inevitability]

3.5 had also half-illithids; non-humans who got implanted anyway and only partially transformed. They have tentacles and a weak mind blast, but not all of a true illithids fearsome powers.

[KorvinStarmast]

What does a Mind Flayer look like as a child?

Calamari.

[Ghost Nappa]

Thanks for the responses guys. I appreciate it.
I want to start of by saying that I chose Mind Flayers for three reasons:
1) This is taking place in what I call for a lack of a better word "Genesis" time. There are no great civilizations or towns. We're in pre-history and this scenario is likely to be either the third or fourth "social interaction" the PCs are having period. As a result, many of the monstrous mutated humanoids that exist as a result of mind flayers' experimentation don't exist and I wanted a way to explain their introduction at a larger level.

2) I don't remember where I saw or read it, but someone was explaining the psionics systems as a sort of "non-core" fantasy element; that "by default," fantasy doesn't include psionics and it isn't until you start deviating from core fantasy that it starts showing up. The explanation included things like mind flayers as alien invaders and I thought that they would work as a good source of designated antagonists in a setting that at the moment does not have ancient dragons, liches, and other evils. Like the White Witch in The Magician's Nephew, a single outsider is entering a young world and is capable of monopolizing resources to control the future in their favor.

3) I needed something that was obviously evil at a meta-level but still not threatening to the players themselves, and I couldn't really find anything that suited both that role and made sense in the world so far. I don't want to make demons or devils until they come about as a result of hubris of the players. There's a lot of weak monsters but I need them to continue to be a threat later on and the only multi-stage bad guy in that sense are dragons, and I have a different plan in mind for them. I didn't want the recurring villain to be charming because I don't want to go into vampire and succubus mind control charming stuff so early.



If I recall correctly, Mind Flayer young are larva that eat a host's brain and then mutate the body into that of a Mind Flayer.


There was a 2e guide to mind flayers and their society. You can get it here (http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17448/Monstrous-Arcana-The-Illithiad-2e?it=1).

Unfortunately, mind flayers don't really have children in the normal sense of the word. They produce thousands of little tadpole-like things that prey on each other and are eaten in turn by the elder brain. The few that survive are implanted into humanoids where they devour the host's brain to take control of the body, then transform into a full grown mind flayer, although one that still needs some education.


The tadpoles won't work for this story.

Maybe what you want is a Mind Flayer that was forced through a portal into the game setting, and lost almost all of its powers passing through the portal, and is slowly regaining them as it adapts.


Mind flayers, despite their appearance, are aberrations. Their life cycle by no means resembles ours. Look at the beholder, for example; at some point during their lives, a "womb" behind their tongue starts to swell, eventually pushing the tongue from their mouth. When it's large enough, the beholder hacks this organ up, bites it off and leaves the miniature beholders within to emerge. Any that do not look sufficiently like their parent are killed, and the rest chased off. In short, run from a beholder with its tongue sticking out.

"Substandard host" or "physics-sick" is probably the best you'll get if you want a 'juvenile' illithid.

EDIT: Though I suppose if you were twisted enough, you could use a mind flayer who's stolen a child's body instead of an adult's. The hive could have tried it as an 'experiment', and now the miniature mind flayer is just trying to impress the others and be allowed back in.

I just watched an episode of Voyager that featured immature Borg children freaking out because they didn't know what to do. Would something like a kobold or a gnome work? Is there a way to template illithids?



That could be interesting. You could have a dungeon full of odd variants of various creatures. Weld on a few random illithid physical characteristics, and/or powers and you have illithid/owl hybrids and other random creatures. And since its a long overarching story, it would be easy to stock the dungeon with weak or failure cross attempts and as they level up they find its latest lair with better tries at ultimate host bodies. And all the while the rising big bad himself is getting stronger by assimilating various abilities. By the time you are done you have a dungeon full of dragonthids or illiholders and the big bad is an illithasque.

I have already finished the dungeon's layout and planned most of the encounters and this isn't that hard to incorporate, I think. The one that features the illithid child right is supposed to be the immature flayer trying to capture and experiment on the pixie.


So, two random references popped into my head while reading the original post. The first is the slimy, tentacle covered, but oddly adorable baby that Agent J delivers in the first Men in Black movie. The second are the gene-stealer cults from Warhammer 40k, which are groups of genetically and psychically controlled slaves that worship disgusting monster/human hybrid babies. The Tyrannids use them to set up invasions and destroy whole worlds.

If I was running a game I could have some peasants find a poor lost baby mind flayer. The baby couldn't do much physically, but it could charm very effectively till it c
ontrolled a whole village. Anyone who made their save, or found out too much would naturally be murdered. I would also give it some sort of "cry" ability (because what else to babies do). Some sort of piercing scream with a wisdom save and a debuff. The crying would also bring any of it's adopted parents within a mile running in a desperate violent frenzy.

I feel like there's also a way to work Little Shop of Horrors in there.

Unfortunately, I haven't seen MiB, Little Shop OR Warhammer in enough detail to feel comfortable drawing from them. Additionally, there aren't any villages or even towns yet and introducing them at this stage would hurt more than it would help.


true that. If you ever play Neverwinter Online, and get to the high levels (57-60), there is a whole quest about this. It's actually very nicely done, giving all the lore first hand :3

Just wanted to mention it. If you're not into MMOs, it's worth your wile to wach it on youtube. :)

I would love to give it a try, but my laptop is proving to be less and less of a suitable gaming platform and I've had to cheat a bit with its hardware to keep it going. I don't think I have the patience to go that far in Neverwinter without friends. I'll probably take the Youtube option, but thanks for point out it exists. I would have never known that otherwise.



Thanks so much for the help guys.
Still a bit curious on what abilities, attacks, and things I should remove from it so it's not going to absolutely destroy anything in a 5 mile radius. Because it needs to suck on offense for some time.

[Daishain]

I don't remember where I saw or read it, but someone was explaining the psionics systems as a sort of "non-core" fantasy element; that "by default," fantasy doesn't include psionics and it isn't until you start deviating from core fantasy that it starts showing up.
A bit off topic, but this only remains true if you consider only D&D lore and its various offshoots to be core fantasy. I love D&D lore, and I can understand that sentiment, but it is not the be all end all of fantasy.

Most types of fantasy won't call it psionics (the term itself is more closely associated with scifi), but mental magic of that type is far more common in fantasy media than the Vancian casting that makes up D&D's normal magic system. In other words, whoever said that needs to do a fact check.



With all of that said, D&D is treating psionics and psionic creatures as a byproduct of the far realms. So in this case, yes, alien invaders is exactly what you're dealing with.

[Ghost Nappa]

With all of that said, D&D is treating psionics and psionic creatures as a byproduct of the far realms.

This is closer to the sentiment that what I conveyed. Sorry.

[Regitnui]

A gnome is a substandard host, so could result in a weaker illithid. The illithids prefer medium-sized hosts since their 'transformation' turns most of the body into neural tissues. Humans, Elves, and their immediate relatives offer a good balance of manageability and development potential. Most other races are too small or too rare to justify using them as hosts.

[JackPhoenix]

I want to start of by saying that I chose Mind Flayers for three reasons:
1) This is taking place in what I call for a lack of a better word "Genesis" time. There are no great civilizations or towns. We're in pre-history and this scenario is likely to be either the third or fourth "social interaction" the PCs are having period. As a result, many of the monstrous mutated humanoids that exist as a result of mind flayers' experimentation don't exist and I wanted a way to explain their introduction at a larger level.

It's your setting and all that, but 3.5e canon actually had the Mind Flayers come from the far future, escaping back in time to save their empire from the end of the universe. Aboleth filled the "older the anything else" Lovecraftian trope, and were freaked by the powerful Illithid race appearing from nowhere. In fact, Flayer's sudden appearance stopped even Blood War for a time before devils and demons understood what just happened. And there was a possibility that Illithids are the future evolution of humanity, with their time jump causing a closed time loop where Illithid experimentation on humans was what will cause them to exist in the first place...

[Regitnui]

Aboleth filled the "older the anything else" Lovecraftian trope, and were freaked by the powerful Illithid race appearing from nowhere.

That was one of my favourite parts of 3.5 monster lore; the aboleths remember where the gods came from and how the Material Plane formed from elemental chaos, but they don't remember the illithids, and it petrifies them with fear. Was the Blood War thing in Lords of Madness? I don't remember it being there (oh crap!)

[KorvinStarmast]

It's your setting and all that, but 3.5e canon actually had the Mind Flayers come from the far future, escaping back in time to save their empire from the end of the universe. Aboleth filled the "older the anything else" Lovecraftian trope, and were freaked by the powerful Illithid race appearing from nowhere. In fact, Flayer's sudden appearance stopped even Blood War for a time before devils and demons understood what just happened. And there was a possibility that Illithids are the future evolution of humanity, with their time jump causing a closed time loop where Illithid experimentation on humans was what will cause them to exist in the first place...
The original Mind Flayer was presented on page 2 of the first ever Strategic Review(Spring 1975), before rules on Psionics were firmed up for the Eldritch Wizardry supplement to OD&D.

Grognard Moment Arrives: They were a real bugger to encounter, due in part to the varying impact of their Mind Blast on a party with intelligence scores all over the map.

Excerpts
The Mind Flayer: Magical Resistance 90% AC 5 Hit Dice 8+3

... a super-intelligent, man-shaped creature with four tentacles ...If a tentacle hits it will then penetrate to the brain, draw it forth, and the monster will devour it ... take one to four turns for the tentacle to reach the brain, at which time the victim is dead. (KS note: 1d4 turns before your brain is his breakfast).

(KS Note: 6"range in OD&D meant 60' underground and 60 yards above ground.).

... Their major weapon ... Mind Blast ... wave of PSI force with a 6”" directional range and a radius of 5’'. All within the radius must save as indicated or will suffer the result shown: (snip the table)

Magic users add +1 to their saving throws, and clerics add +2.
A Helm of Telepathy adds a +4 to saving throws, and when such saves are made the attacking Mind Flayer is stunned for 3 turns.

The table ranged from low to high intelligence, with the outcome of a missed save varying from death (low intel) to Feeblemind or permanent insanity.

[Oerlaf]

What about SJ'S Chibithulhu? It seems that it could fit very well in the role.

http://www.worldofmunchkin.com/plush/megachibi/

[Malifice]

http://pre09.deviantart.net/aae1/th/pre/i/2012/102/a/4/rlyeh_by_crankbot-d4vwjq4.jpg

[Regitnui]

http://pre09.deviantart.net/aae1/th/pre/i/2012/102/a/4/rlyeh_by_crankbot-d4vwjq4.jpg

I know Ii read too much bogleech when Cthulu stroking a dolphin seems appropriate.

[Avigor]

Rule 1: The DM can do whatever the *bleep* he wants.

That said, I'd vote for an implanted child that grows over time and stunts the illithid's early development, but I will admit that the different species, can't remember their name, which is basically a mass of tentacles which can possess people and prefer to take magic users, might be interesting as well... I know they were in lords of madness but their name escapes me and I'm afb

[Regitnui]

Rule 1: The DM can do whatever the *bleep* he wants.

That said, I'd vote for an implanted child that grows over time and stunts the illithid's early development, but I will admit that the different species, can't remember their name, which is basically a mass of tentacles which can possess people and prefer to take magic users, might be interesting as well... I know they were in lords of madness but their name escapes me and I'm afb

The flesh wearers are also known as Tsochar. They're non-sentient individual 'threads' who come together to create a twenty- to thirty-strong sentient mass about the size of a small halfling.

[JackPhoenix]

That was one of my favourite parts of 3.5 monster lore; the aboleths remember where the gods came from and how the Material Plane formed from elemental chaos, but they don't remember the illithids, and it petrifies them with fear. Was the Blood War thing in Lords of Madness? I don't remember it being there (oh crap!)

I'm not sure, it's been years, but I don't think it was in LoM either...maybe one of the fiendish codices, or from Afroakuma's planar questions threads, or even some 4e fluff (maybe, I haven't played 4e much, but I've read some books)