Monster of the Masses, Come Join In!

[The Vorpal Tribble]

The completed Monster of the Masses!


Plexmotes

Size and Type: Fine Construct (incorporeal, swarm)
Hit Dice: 13d10+13 (84 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: Fly 60 ft. (perfect), burrow 40 ft.
Armor Class: 37 (+1 deflection, +2 dex, +5 fractal, +11 insight, +8 size), touch 37, flat-footed 35; or 41 (+2 dex, +5 fractal, +11 insight, +5 natural, +8 size), touch 36, flat-footed 39
Base Attack/Grapple: +9/-
Attack: Swarm (3d6)
Full Attack: Swarm (3d6)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./0 ft.
Special Attacks: Distraction, fractal maze, numbing cloud
Special Qualities: Construct traits, darkvision 60 ft., incorporeal traits, low-light vision, respect for beauty, restructuring form, shifting manipulation
Saves: Fort +4, Ref +6, Will +15
Abilities: Str 20 (- against non-incorporeal), Dex 15, Con -, Int 18, Wis 32, Cha 2
Skills: Bluff +4, Diplomacy +12, Hide +18, Listen +27, Spot +27, Survival +27, Use Magic Device +12
Feats: Ability Focus (Fractal Maze), Dodge, Improved Toughness, Lifesense (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Lifesense,LM)(B), Open Minded, Skill Focus (bluff)
Environment: Any
Organization: Swarm
Challenge Rating: 11
Treasure: None
Alignment: Lawful Neutral
Advancement: -
Level Adjustment: -

Dizzying small orbs of fluff fly through the air. Intrigued, you reach out to touch one, only to find that what you thought was fluff is actually a prickly substance. As if angered by your audacity, a great cloud of them gather around you and begin orbiting your body like tiny satellites. Initially, you find no method to their madness, but slowly you realize that there is a distinct pattern within their dance. Disoriented, you feel the world spin around you and it feels as though your stomach has been turned inside out. As you open your eyes, you are relieved to see the freaky, flying balls are gone, but to your horror, so is the place you were just in...

Combat
A plexmote swarm attempts to surround those that attacks them, trapping them within...

Distraction (Ex): Any living creature vulnerable to the swarm’s damage that begins its turn with a swarm in its square is nauseated for 1 round; a Fortitude save (DC 16) negates the effect. Spellcasting or concentrating on spells within the area of a swarm requires a Concentration check (DC 20 + spell level). Using skills that involve patience and concentration requires a DC 20 Concentration check.

Fractal Maze (Sp): As a full round action the swarm may shift and align in fantastic, ever-repeating patterns. Anyone within the swarm at the end of their turn must succeed on a DC 22 Reflex save or disappear into the swirling patterns as the Maze spell. The swarm cannot move while it uses its fractal maze, and receives no Dexterity bonus to AC. Any creature or object that enters and can fit within the swarm's space during this period is automatically affected, no save.

The swarm may uncombine as another full round action, releasing anything that entered. Living creatures are Dazed for one round after release. The save DC is Dexterity-based and includes a +4 racial bonus.

Numbing Cloud (Ex): By altering and bending the light that passes through individual members of the swarm, the construct makes it difficult for observers to process sensory information passing through the construct's extent. This creates an effect similar to a Solid Fog in each square it occupies. This transition requires a full round action to complete and while so transformed the swarm's speed is reduced to 5 feet per round. Unlike a normal solid fog this effect does not impede the movement of creatures within it, however it does impede the use of all ranged attacks including magical rays and the like, which can not pass through the swarm though they can still target the swarm itself.

Further, the strange and shifting pattern of the swarm in this form is capable of breaking both mundane and magical linkages. Any attempt at real time communication with a person inside the swarm automatically fails, even if it is telepathic. Even reading requires a full round action when within the swarm, and the reader has a 50% chance of misreading and misunderstanding the document they examine.

Additionally, the swarm acts as an anti-magic field against magical effects that grant the caster ongoing control of a subject or require continued mental effort on the part of a caster to control or direct the effect.

Respect for Beauty:
Perhaps because of the chaos of its own form, the Plexmote is awed by more perfect forms elsewhere. The plexmote takes damage as though a swarm of small creatures from any weapon with a +10 total bonus or better. Creatures with a CHA score above 18 that have not taken aggressive action against the plexmotes are unaffected by the swarm. They will neither be targeted by its special abilities, nor do they suffer ill-effects or damage from being within the swarm. Creatures with a Charisma score above 25 actually attract the plexmotes, and they may treat any part of the swarm that co-occupies their square as though it were corporeal.

Restructuring Form (Ex):
As a move action that provokes attacks of opportunity, a plexmote may change the formation of individual constructs in order to best utilize the number of constructs remaining. In effect, this heals the plexmote of 3d10 damage; as well as granting it 3d6 temporary hit points. This can only be used once per round, and only if the plexmote has been damaged since the last use of Restructuring Form.

Shifting Manipulation (Ex):
The plexmote can subvert the magical energies of hostile creatures through sheer presence of mind. Whenever the plexmote is subject to a harmful spell, the caster must make a caster level check against DC 20 in order to avoid the effect being changed to center around the caster. The save DC is Intelligence-based.

[jindra34]

I like small things... so i vote for size=Fine

[Fax Celestis]

There aren't enough Fine creatures. That's my vote.

[Spiryt]

I think that Medium creature gives funniest/most interesting posibilities.

[Kellus]

Fine seems a little small. I'll vote for Diminutive.

[Raven T.]

Vicious Tiny critter.

[Neek]

We're going for tiny.

[Khoran]

Gargantuan! It's got the most intimidating name :P

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

I vote large.

[Assasinater]

Medium - Let's save the strangeness and fun for the better parts.

[Generic PC]

Dimunitive. If we choose fine, we will get overcome by stupidly weak creatures...this way, we can still have a powerful monster.

[Single Shot Zombie]

I like the sound of a monster that can kill someone just by being inhaled into his body!

Fine it is.

[Jack Mann]

I vote for variable.

[Nebulious]

Let's go for fine. This could be interesting.

[DracoDei]

I vote Fine... seems like it would produce more interesting results... this thing IS going to be silly IMHO I think since it will literally be designed by comity.

[InaVegt]

Fine should be fine, agree with me lest I give you a fine.

[Lòkki Gallansbayne]

Another one on the Fine bandwagon here. :smallbiggrin:

[Magi_Ring_O]

Tiny!

Fine is for flies.

[Bearofbadnews]

I'll go with large. I'd like to make a large playable race.

(or a fine one I suppose, but that doesn't need help right now)

[Penguinizer]

I'll stick with fine here :P

I wonder, I wonder if I could make a monster without actually having a phb or anything.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

I wonder, I wonder if I could make a monster without actually having a phb or anything.
Ta-Da! The Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master's Guide, Monster Manual 3.5 and Expanded Psionics Handbook...
http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/home.html

[Green Bean]

Fine all the way. That way, it'll describe both the monster's size and the monster itself. :smallwink:

[Draken]

I vote for Fine. It's the best size to make Swarms.

Swarms cam be deadlyer than anything.

[Captain van der Decken]

Interesting idea.

I vote fine too. Changed my mind. I vote large.

[Corncracker]

I'll say Fine.

Though No Swarms, I want a Fine undead myself.

[Realms of Chaos]

Fine. Definitely.

[Ranis]

I'll be the nonconformist. Gargantuan!

[purple gelatinous cube o' Doom]

I vote for huge

[Pronounceable]

Fine is too fine, I vote dimunitive.

[Angafirith]

Fine sounds good to me.

[JoshuaZ]

Fine also. Not enough fine creatures and one could so some really fun things with it (such as a fine undead or an incorporeal fine creature).

[RationalGoblin]

Colossal.

What? There isn't very many of those things!

[ringsnake]

I suppose you could say "You so Fine!"

I'm not a big fan of such a small creature, so I vote small.

Sounds to me like you should just call it at fine at this point and move on...

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Alright, fine by a landslide. Up next, Type and subtype if any.

[Fax Celestis]

I vote Vermin (Shapechanger).

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

Outsider (Chaotic, Evil, Extraplanar)

[Raven T.]

Magical Beast (Fire or Earth) gets my vote.

[Generic PC]

Fey(Air, Fire) . That is all

[Ranis]

Electricity elemental subtype.

[Icewalker]

I'll second Fax's Vermin (shapechanger), but add Swarm to it. Or is that part of size technically?

[belboz]

I want a Fine undead myself.

I like this idea. Undead!

But, y'know, I like the swarm idea too...I think I'll vote for the Swarm subtype, in addition.

Swarm of fine undead FTW.

[Khoran]

Fey(Air, Fire) . That is all

Second'd. Maybe with Swarm thrown in there.

[Raven T.]

I like this idea. Undead!

But, y'know, I like the swarm idea too...I think I'll vote for the Swarm subtype, in addition.

Swarm of fine undead FTW.

I can see it now...zombie flies... *rolls his eyes some*:smalltongue:

[Captain van der Decken]

Okay.. swarm anything, then.

Edit: Maybe Abberation(swarm).

[Job]

Fey (incorporeal):smallsmile:,

Count this as a vote for fey, regardless of subtype.

[DracoDei]

Abberation, Swarm

[Simius]

Outsider (lawful)

There's far too few of that.

Edit: swarm might be added as a possibility. A swarm of fine outsiders from Mechanus with Hivemind. That'd be nice.

[Spiryt]

Giant( maybe air?)

You know in Giant's description there is only that they USUALLY are at lest large size.

And creature that is physically for example hill giant, but weight 50 g would be great :smallbiggrin:

[Bearofbadnews]

Monstrous Humanoid (Shapechanger)

[jindra34]

I vote subtype=Good

[XtheYeti]

I vote for extraplaner undead, if thats posible...if not then just undead

[Dryad]

A playable fine vermin shapechanger... That one has mý vote! Ooo, ooo!

[Draken]

-Undead (Swarm)

-Aberration (Swarm)

These two the best, sure to creep your players out of any dungeon.

[Shiny, Bearer of the Pokystick]

Vermin (Good, Shapechanger).

[purple gelatinous cube o' Doom]

I vote magical beast.

[Pronounceable]

Construct swarm. I love constructs, the more the merrier.

[Jack Mann]

Aberration [air, swarm]

[Inyssius Tor]

Construct [Swarm, Shapechanging, Incorporeal].

Also, this is an awesome idea. If it works out, we can't stop at just one.

EDIT: aargh, I change my posts too much.

[HomerHT]

Fey (Incorporeal)

Come on, it has awesomeness written all over it.

And what's the deal with swarms? Yeesh! :smalltongue:

[Umbral Chicken]

Fey (Incorporeal)

Come on, it has awesomeness written all over it.

Agreed, another vote for Fey(incorporeal)

[The_Snark]

Construct or abberation. Swarm subtype is good, too.

[Angafirith]

I'm going with Dragon [Swarm] for this one.

[aaron_the_cow]

Okay.. swarm anything, then.

Edit: Maybe Abberation(swarm).

I 2nd!
little ozes eating you alive, Yay!

[belboz]

I 2nd!
little ozes eating you alive, Yay!

That'd be an ooze swarm, not an aberration swarm.

And *cough* there's a fine ooze [swarm] up in the Monster Competition right now.

[knightsaline]

just for something different,

Deathless with Archon subtype

[deadseashoals]

Construct (Extraplanar, Lawful, Swarm)

[Attilargh]

Outsider (Incorporeal, Swarm, Lawful, Evil)

Incorporeal Devil bees from Hell!

[B!shop]

Construct (living)

Pixie-size warforged-like armies! :belkar:

[Meynolds]

Contruct [Swarm, Shapechanger] gets my vote.

[ringsnake]

Undead (Swarm) gets my vote. I don't want it to be construct because though cool they'd just end up getting pigeonholed as nanites.

Undead army ants, creepy!

[jindra34]

to all those saying swarm: All swarms in the Monster Manual are actually large creatures... make your own assumptions from there.

[Ankhor]

Construct (incorporeal).

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Construct (incorporeal).
Now THATS one I've never heard of before. I'm going to put my vote in for that.

[Simius]

to all those saying swarm: All swarms in the Monster Manual are actually large creatures... make your own assumptions from there.

I beg to differ: linkie (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/swarm.htm#batSwarm)

[The Vorpal Tribble]

I beg to differ: linkie (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/swarm.htm#batSwarm)
I think he was just toying with folks :smallwink:

Or at least I hope so considering how every swarm in any official Wizards book is Tiny or smaller. Its kinda in the rules of swarms.

[Lòkki Gallansbayne]

Undead (Incorporeal, Swarm)

Just think of the immunities. :smallbiggrin:

If you can figure out what the hell it would entail, Construct (Incorporeal, Swarm) would be even more awesometacular as then it wouldn't be as vulnerable to those pesky Clerics.

[Rejakor]

My vote goes out to Fey [ Incorporeal, Swarm, Construct, Lawful, Extraplanar ].

Swarm of Mechanical Pixies!

[Rnett]

Ooze (swarm) I can imagine a group of conscious bactierium sacrificing themselves down the throats of adventurers to make em sick.

[jindra34]

I think he was just toying with folks :smallwink:

Or at least I hope so considering how every swarm in any official Wizards book is Tiny or smaller. Its kinda in the rules of swarms.

Actually i was thinking of the size rules... hmm...

[Rnett]

Undead (Incorporeal, Swarm)

Just think of the immunities. :smallbiggrin:

If you can figure out what the hell it would entail, Construct (Incorporeal, Swarm) would be even more awesometacular as then it wouldn't be as vulnerable to those pesky Clerics.

A lot of tiny, deceased nanobot souls?

[SmileyX]

OHOH Construct(incorporeal) for the win!! I love constructs..... or dump the incorporeal and make it a swarm and allow them to meld togethor into bigger constructs....... yay for Transformers lol. However ill officially go for Construct(incorporeal) lol.

[InaVegt]

Conctruct (incorporeal)

If this happens this beasty might just become difficult (Nearly impossible to hit, lots of immunities)

[Icewalker]

Well I haven't counted it, but I read em and it looks like it is leaning towards

Swarm
Incorporeal
Construct
Shapechanger

Plus a little Vermin and Undead.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

I'll be tallying it up after the alotted time in a couple days.

[Inyssius Tor]

Out of curiosity, how is that going to work?

The most popular type, and any subtypes that get more than (some percentage) of the votes?

[Draken]

Out of curiosity, how is that going to work?

The most popular type, and any subtypes that get more than (some percentage) of the votes?

I don't see any other way that would make sense.

[alchemyprime]

Just of my personal prefernce, I'd like the idea of a Construct with the swarm subtype, though incorporeal sounds cool, shapechanger would bring up too many jokes.

One thing that could be fun is the concept that the entire swarm is a hive mind of even smaller critters, and they are incorporeal because they are smaller than the peices of the PCs.

[Gralamin]

Construct (Incorporeal)
No contest.

[Draken]

Well, a swarm of so tiny machines that they just can be considered incorporeal, and that can fuse thenselves to become larger engines of destruction...

I like it.:belkar:

[Aramil Liadon]

Well, a swarm of so tiny machines that they just can be considered incorporeal, and that can fuse themselves to become larger engines of destruction...

I like it.:belkar:

Done. Swarm ---> mech ---> swarm? Yes please.

[Nomrom]

Construct (Incorporeal, Swarm) sounds like a pretty interesting idea to me.

[roadkiller]

Ooze (Incorporial, Swarm)

I was quite tempted to add in something silly like (Shapechanger) or (Angel), but that would've been just weird.

[onxy9600]

I was waiting for the swarm of fine pixie like liches.... but sounds like an energy mass for the incorprial construct (like a Wil-o-wisp and may appear at first as such) made by a mad gnome and wizard.

"As you wander through the dungeon you see a light, like a lamp, bobing down the corridor... Upon closer inspection it looks like a Wil-O-Wisp... Roll for suprise as the Wisp explodes into one hundred much smaller spheres and attacks."

:mitd:

[Dartonus]

undead (Chaotic, Evil, extraplanar, fire, incorporeal, augmented abberation, shapechanger, and swarm)

Practically invincible.

[jindra34]

sounds like an energy mass for the incorprial construct (like a Wil-o-wisp and may appear at first as such) made by a mad gnome and wizard.

"As you wander through the dungeon you see a light, like a lamp, bobing down the corridor... Upon closer inspection it looks like a Wil-O-Wisp... Roll for suprise as the Wisp explodes into one hundred much smaller spheres and attacks."

:mitd:

Hey finally a swarm i can get behind i vote Construct(swarm, good)

[Penguinizer]

Tiny machine swarm.

[Inyssius Tor]

I think I'll give this a

*bump*

since the Type deadline is coming on fast, and all.

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

Construct (Incorporeal, Swarm) sounds like a pretty interesting idea to me.

I may have to change my vote to agree with this one.

[XBobbis]

I vote Construct (Incorporeal)

[The Demented One]

I'll vote Aberration (Swarm)

[Poppatomus]

Construct (Incorporeal, Swarm) sounds like a pretty interesting idea to me.

my vote is this one

[Corncracker]

Undead, Don't care about the Sub type

[Leon]

Plant (swarm)

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Alright, we now have a Fine Construct (incorporeal, swarm).

Up next is Hit Dice. I'll only give 3 days to vote for this.

[jindra34]

15 hit dice

[purple gelatinous cube o' Doom]

let's go with 30 HD. (let's make this bad boy an epic monster)

[Ranis]

20HD. Yar.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

It's amazing how predictable this was...

[jindra34]

It's amazing how predictable this was...

What do you mean?
and for this section i would average the votes and round... the likely hood of two votes being the same is diminishing rapidly

[Hoorex]

8 HD... It's the best option, obviously.

[Eldmor]

13 HD. Later on, add a few [Luck] feats. It'll be so random, yet control chance. :smalltongue:

[Attilargh]

Five, for then it would be an appropriate match for Einstein.

[Aramil Liadon]

Yes! Five, I say!

[DracoDei]

The insightful analysis has convinced me... 13 HD.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

What do you mean?
The immediate call for epics :smallsigh:

[Poppatomus]

I'd say whatever CR your thinking, pick 2-3 HD less than you'd normally expect. A swarm of incorporeal constructs seems like it should be harder to hit then it is tough to take down.

[Fax Celestis]

Ten HD is my vote.

[Captain van der Decken]

10 hd, I say.

[Penguinizer]

Hmm, I like a nice 13.

[Simius]

13 HD
*filler*

[Rnett]

5 for Einstein! (even if I don't get the reference.)

[Spiryt]

10 HD is good i think.

Just read swarm, incorporeal and construct descriptions and it's clear that it anyway will be haaaard to bite.

[Poppatomus]

I'm gonna vote 10 as well. Do we really need so long (three days right?) to decide HD. It's not like there's much to debate.

[Attilargh]

5 for Einstein! (even if I don't get the reference.)
Einstein can be statted as a fifth level Expert. I admit that I did not consider the CR properly before posting, but 5 is a nice number anyway.

[Green Bean]

10 HD. With the swarm, construct and ethereal traits this guy's going to be hard enough.

[Smiley_]

Assuming that you have 11 Hit Points per 2 Hit Dice, 5 is out of the question. that would be 28 hit points, killable by a standard issue fireball. I would say 10 or 15 hit dice to allow for a bit of meat, but no more than that. The thing is incorporeal and a swarm, making damaging it difficult.

[XBobbis]

I say 10, but DMs can hit die advance it.

[Ankhor]

I'd say 8, then allow for advancement to make gribblier versions.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

I'm gonna vote 10 as well. Do we really need so long (three days right?) to decide HD. It's not like there's much to debate.
Its not a matter of debate, and it takes only a miniscule ammount of time more to type 'Construct' than '15 HD'.

Its just the time alotted to folks popping in.

I'm only shortening it because it doesn't really matter as much as size or type.

[Inyssius Tor]

Five! (Because, come on, seventh-level campaigns are a lot more common and balanced than fifteenth-level ones.)

[aaron_the_cow]

13
:biggrin:

[Nomrom]

It appears that the number thirteen is doing well, so I will join with them.

[Meynolds]

3.14159265358979...

[aaron_the_cow]

3.14159265358979...

har har har har har :smallannoyed:

[Icewalker]

I'd say 10, with advancement.

[Meynolds]

har har har har har :smallannoyed:

How about log(10000000000000)?

I really shouldn't study for math tests right before coming on these boards.

[Draken]

15 HD

We must consider that most constructs (and most monsters btw) have far more hit die than they have CR.

[Icewalker]

You can't really pick one or the other. Gotta vote. Could just average them out at 12-13.

You know, don't swarms usually have low HD?

[The_Snark]

Yeah, they do. Incorporeal construct swarm... that's a lot of immunities.

9 HD.

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

The insightful analysis has convinced me... 13 HD.

I also vote 13.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

You know, don't swarms usually have low HD?
Not at all.

Hellwasp Swarm (MM 3.5) - CR 8
Locust Swarm, Bloodfiend (FF) - CR 8
Shimmerling Swarm (MM III) - CR 8
Golem Swarm (MM III) - CR 9
Scarab Beetle Swarm (FF) - CR 10
Sunfly Swarm (BoED) - CR 10
Cranium Rat, Greater Pack (FF) - CR 11
Brood Keeper Larva Swarm (MM III) - CR 12
Cinder Swarm (MM III) - CR 13
Abyssal Ant Swarm (FF) - CR 16
Locust Swarm, Bronze (BoED) - CR 17
Deathraven Swarm (BoED) - CR 20

[Gralamin]

1d20
Thats my choice, as long as its not 1. If it is 1, it defaults to 6.

edit: Gah?

Well lets make it 6 then.

[Icewalker]

Huh, thought they usually ranged from 4-8ish. Well, I'm liking the idea of a 13-15 HD swarm of fine incorporeal constructs. Funtime.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Huh, thought they usually ranged from 4-8ish.
I'd say they generally tie, though most animal swarms are low. If its not an animal then its likely higher.

[Job]

Woot, my subtype made the final cut.

I’m thinking 5 HD.

[Khoran]

42588!

Serriously though, 13 Hit Dice.

[belboz]

10 is my vote. As other people have pointed out, incorporeal + construct probably means CR > HD anyway.

[Angafirith]

I'm going to go with 5 on this one.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Btw, though I might give a nod to the Monster Competition that is run monthly. It has ended for this month, but voting has been going on for a time. If you would, take a few minutes to read over the entries and post your votes.

Monster Competition IX: The Birds and the Bees Voting Thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44877)

[HyramGraff]

I'll say 13 HD.

[Pronounceable]

Doesn't really matter, constructs can easily be advanced. 3 HD seems good enough.

And yay for construct swarm.

[Korias]

5 HD. A Nice, round number. Were going for something strange, right?

[The Demented One]

Fine creatures don't get a lot of HD...I vote 1.

[aaron_the_cow]

Fine creatures don't get a lot of HD...I vote 1.

its a swarm though...

[Umbral Chicken]

5 hit dice

[Draken]

its a swarm though...

Maybe he wants to give 1 HD to every member of the swarm, what would give us... 1000 HD?

[jindra34]

Maybe he wants to give 1 HD to every member of the swarm, what would give us... 1000 HD?
nope 100,000HD...

[Captain van der Decken]

Depends if it's flying or not.

[jindra34]

Depends if it's flying or not.

not for swarms of fine creatures....

[Captain van der Decken]

Oh, that's right.


Fine Swarms consist of 10,000 creatures, whether they are flying or not.

So 10,000 HD.

[Bearofbadnews]

I vote for 10 HD.

Not that a 10,000 HD encounter isn't tempting... :smallconfused:

[Call Me Siggy]

3 HD. Ignore the invisible text for your own safety.

[The Demented One]

When I said 1 HD, I meant one HD. A swarm of nano-whatsits just isn't that tough, no matter how many of them there are.

[EndlessEnnui]

I'll cast my lot in for 13. Aiming for a good, mid-range challenge. Swarms have that nasty vulnerability to area effects that makes me want to err on the side of more rather than less HD.

[thehothead]

I vote 5 as well

[The_Snark]

I'll go for 6.

[Captain van der Decken]

When I said 1 HD, I meant one HD. A swarm of nano-whatsits just isn't that tough, no matter how many of them there are.

A swarm of spiders has 2 HD, and I'd expect the construct thingies to be tougher than them.

[Leon]

3 HD.

Seconded


Ignore the invisible text for your own safety x2.

[jindra34]

SO VT whats the verdict?

[FoeHammer]

13 HD Baby!!:smallbiggrin:

[jindra34]

13 HD Baby!!:smallbiggrin:

Voting is over dude... and if you were saying the result i would wait for VT.

[Captain van der Decken]

Voting is over dude...

Well, not until VT says so, really.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

13 HD wins by a hair!

Ok, because the rest is hard to do without ability scores, lets choose those.

Strength
Constitution
Dexterity
Intelligence
Wisdom
Charisma

Note: Being incorporeal, a creature only has strength score against other incorporeal creature.

[Captain van der Decken]

Str and Con have to be -, right?

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Str and Con have to be -, right?
Strength can be anything, but yes, - Con. Meant to mention that.

[Khoran]

A quick reminder: Constructs have no Con Score, and rarely do they have an Int Score.

I'll post some stats later, I just wanted to give that reminder to everyone.

[Captain van der Decken]

Strength can be anything, but yes, - Con. Meant to mention that.

It's incorporeal, though. I thought they had a null strength. I could probably be wrong though.


*checks SRD*


It has no Strength score

[The Vorpal Tribble]

They can have a strength score against other incorporeal creatures though.

It might be listed thusly: Strength 5 (- against non-incorporeal)

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

Str 5
Dex 20
Con -
Int 30
Wis 13
Cha 19

[Lòkki Gallansbayne]

Yeah, incorporeal creatures have no Strength score and constructs have no Constitution scores.

I dunno what scores I'm gonna vote for, I'll have to think about it. I'm thinking high DEX and CHA though. Just to make it insanely hard to hit (Incorporeal creatures get CHA to AC as a deflection bonus, so even Touch Attacks will have trouble getting through). Low-to-middling INT, though. I mean it's probably got some sort of hive mind type dealy going on, but it's probably programmed with fairly basic instructions. I dunno why, but the number 6 springs to mind.

Yeah.

INT 6.

EDIT: yaaaay simu'd on the whole STR/CON dealy.

[Captain van der Decken]

Ah. :smalltongue: Fair enough.

Okay,


Stength 6
Dex 18
Wis 11
Cha 1
Int -

[The Vorpal Tribble]

<<Attention>>

Against other incorporeal creatures an incorporeal creature does in fact have a strength score.

I point to the Ghost template from the MM 3.5 and Spirit Animal template from Frostburn for proof.

That'll be all :smallwink:

[Poppatomus]

Since it's already a fairly counter intuitive monster:

Strength 4 (- against incorporeal)
Dex 8 (fairly dispersed and not well coordinated)
Wis 18 (so many different eyes, ears and approaches)
Con -
Int 10 (not too smart, not too dumb)
Cha 20 (intrinsicly beautiful, in an ephemeral way, and wise enough to use that when interacting with the enivronment)


EDIT: added explanations, like the idea.

[Reinboom]

Str 6
Dex 18
Con —
Wis 32
Int 6
Cha 12

Creatures who notice everything are scary.

[Attilargh]

Str 2
Dex 10
Con -
Wis 15
Int 23
Cha 18

"Talk yourself out of this one, son!"

...There is no special formula I should be aware of, right?

[Call Me Siggy]

STR 20 (A swarm doesn't have to be all that weak...I would like to see a massive cloud of floating, hard-hitting mini construct ghosts.)
DEX 15 (Should be pretty mobile and fast, it is a swarm after all.)
INT 18 (Smart=deadly.)
I'm with SweetRein on WIS 32. This thing will be deadly...
CHA 2 (What sort of personality will an incorproeal swarm have? None, that's what.)

[jindra34]

STR 20 (A swarm doesn't have to be all that weak...I would like to see a massive cloud of floating, hard-hitting mini construct ghosts.)
DEX 15 (Should be pretty mobile and fast, it is a swarm after all.)
INT 18 (Smart=deadly.)
I'm with SweetRein on WIS 32. This thing will be deadly...
CHA 2 (What sort of personality will an incorproeal swarm have? None, that's what.)

seconded...

[Call Me Siggy]

seconded...

Second time I've been seconded in this thread. :smalltongue:

Looking at those stats, I'd be tempted to backtrack a bit and give it the Extraplanar and Lawful subtypes, make it some sort of Inevitable constructed from the souls of those who have died of the crime it punishes...

[Draken]

Str is pretty useless for a swarm, since it's basic attack is based solely on the HD. So I say... 6 (- against corporeal)

Dex must be hight, and we should give dex related skills, like ranged touch attacks (Eletrical discharge whohay!). I vote 22.

Con -, nothing to declare.

Int, dunno. Maybe 13.

Wis, I vote... 15.

Cha, if it has hight numbers on the others, should be quite aware of itself, so I vote 14.

Str 6
Dex 22
Con -
Int 13
Wis 15
Cha 14

[Khoran]

Str: 18-20. While it can't hurt things in the physical realm with, I'd imagine a swarm of mini constructs would be excellent and crushing the incoporial Form.
Dex; 12. I'd imagine a pack of constructs would be a little harder to maneuver then a swarm of normal creatures.
Con: -
Int: 0*-2. For whatever reason, I always picture both constructs and swarms as either having a low to non-existant intelligence swam. So now I'm thinking Hivemind Constructs, and it just feels like they shouldn't even have an int score, or an incredibly small one.
Wis: I'm liking that 32 Wis thing. It sees all and such.
Cha: 0-1. No personality, none.

[Captain van der Decken]

Looking at those stats, I'd be tempted to backtrack a bit and give it the Extraplanar and Lawful subtypes, make it some sort of Inevitable constructed from the souls of those who have died of the crime it punishes...

Oooh, I like that. Can we do that? Please?

[Gralamin]

Str: 18-20. While it can't hurt things in the physical realm with, I'd imagine a swarm of mini constructs would be excellent and crushing the incoporial Form.
Dex; 12. I'd imagine a pack of constructs would be a little harder to maneuver then a swarm of normal creatures.
Con: -
Int: 0*-2. For whatever reason, I always picture both constructs and swarms as either having a low to non-existant intelligence swam. So now I'm thinking Hivemind Constructs, and it just feels like they shouldn't even have an int score, or an incredibly small one.
Wis: I'm liking that 32 Wis thing. It sees all and such.
Cha: 0-1. No personality, none.

Str 20 - It would demolish other incorporeals
Dex 10 - Constructs tend to have less dexterity then most other things.
Con -
Int 10 - Give it a hive mind
Wis 32 - Sees all sounds fun
Cha 1 - Personality of a brick wall.

[Draken]

Oooh, I like that. Can we do that? Please?

Maybe at the end everyone could get the base creature and submit a "personal version" after it we could make a whole new group of constructs, like the Golems.

"The Nano Swarms"

Ok, I'm not good with naming =P

----------------------------

Dex 10 - Constructs tend to have less dexterity then most other things.


You must consider that most constructs are also Huge and made of heavy materials, look at the Mithral Golem, it's probably faster than most rogues.

[Icewalker]

All about a really smart nanobot swarm. Possible plane travel powers.

Str 12
Dex 14
Con -
Int 25
Wis 1
Cha 15

I'd also like to say that I really don't see ghosts. Construct ghosts doesn't seem like it really makes sense. I'm thinking super incorporealifying technology. Cept then it's high tech, which doesn't fit with dnd...

Also, Hivemind.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Oooh, I like that. Can we do that? Please?
The Mass has already spoken, sorry :smallwink:

However, once we do have the stats everyone can do a write up of the theme and we can vote for which one of those.

[Call Me Siggy]

Maybe at the end everyone could get the base creature and submit a "personal version" after it we could make a whole new group of constructs, like the Golems.

"The Nano Swarms"

Ok, I'm not good with naming =P

----------------------------


You must consider that most constructs are also Huge and made of heavy materials, look at the Mithral Golem, it's probably faster than most rogues.

Hmm. If it's an inevitable, it'll end in -ut, so...

...No idea. <_<

Although the idea of the crime itself has come to me...It patrols the Ethereal Plane, punishing those who use it for misdeeds. Can you imagine a thief ethereal jaunting into a house, only to be stopped by a swarm of golems angrily condemning it?

Yeah, that works. Possibly give it some 1/day ability that allows it to break those silver threads and confine them to the Ethereal Plane.

EDIT:Ah, well. A hope is a hope. Guess it can still be an Inevitable, perhaps made in a factory-outpost in the Material Plane, giving it easier access to the Ethereal...OK, commencing write-up mode for whenever the crunch is settled.

[Korias]

STR 20 (A swarm doesn't have to be all that weak...I would like to see a massive cloud of floating, hard-hitting mini construct ghosts.)
DEX 15 (Should be pretty mobile and fast, it is a swarm after all.)
INT 18 (Smart=deadly.)
I'm with SweetRein on WIS 32. This thing will be deadly...
CHA 2 (What sort of personality will an incorproeal swarm have? None, that's what.)

Seconded. For the Truth!

Str 20, Dex 15, Int 18, Wis 32, Cha 2.

Edit: Since 3 other people agree, I will have to say...

Fifthed.

[Meynolds]

Str 20
Con -
Dex 12
Int - 20
Wis - 30
Cha - 2

[belboz]

Str 3 (- against corporeal)
Dex 20
Con -
Int 6 (hive mind)
Wis 25
Cha 10

[FoeHammer]

STR 20 (A swarm doesn't have to be all that weak...I would like to see a massive cloud of floating, hard-hitting mini construct ghosts.)
DEX 15 (Should be pretty mobile and fast, it is a swarm after all.)
INT 18 (Smart=deadly.)
I'm with SweetRein on WIS 32. This thing will be deadly...
CHA 2 (What sort of personality will an incorproeal swarm have? None, that's what.)

seconded...

thirded...

[Green Bean]

STR 20 (A swarm doesn't have to be all that weak...I would like to see a massive cloud of floating, hard-hitting mini construct ghosts.)
DEX 15 (Should be pretty mobile and fast, it is a swarm after all.)
INT 18 (Smart=deadly.)
I'm with SweetRein on WIS 32. This thing will be deadly...
CHA 2 (What sort of personality will an incorproeal swarm have? None, that's what.)

thirded...

Fourthed...

[Simius]

Strength: 4
Dexterity: 16
Constitution: -
Intellegence: 10 (give it Hivemind)
Wisdom: 13
Charisma: 23

How will the final result of these votes be decided? Perhaps take the avarage of all votes for each ability?

[aaron_the_cow]

Str 2
Dex 25
Con -
Int 11
Wis 10
Cha 10



(give it Hivemind)


I second!

[deadfalcon]

Str 14
Dex 30
Con -
Int 6 (hive mind)
Wis 10
Cha 10

[pyrefiend]

Str 4
Dex 18
Con -
Int 12 (hive mind)
Wis 18
Cha 30

[Generic PC]

STR 20 (A swarm doesn't have to be all that weak...I would like to see a massive cloud of floating, hard-hitting mini construct ghosts.)
DEX 15 (Should be pretty mobile and fast, it is a swarm after all.)
INT 18 (Smart=deadly.)
I'm with SweetRein on WIS 32. This thing will be deadly...
CHA 2 (What sort of personality will an incorproeal swarm have? None, that's what.)

basically like this, but i would say Cha score is higher. a Vermin Lord gets Cha for having swarms nearby, under his command, so swarms must have something in Cha, even incorporeal constructs
so Cha 12

[Khaldan]

STR 18(super strong nano monkey bots!)
DEX 12 (constructs arent that dextrous)
INT 10 (hivemind)
WIS 32(it sees ALL!)
CHA 1 (it IS a moving brick wall :smallsmile:)

[Angafirith]

Str 20
Dex 15
Con -
Wis 2
Int 15
Cha 3

Strong, agile, and knowledgeable while not particularly bright or charismatic.

[SmileyX]

Str-20(i like the crushing other incorporeal creatures idea)
Dex-16
Int-24(give them big INT with hivemind, that would be fun:smallbiggrin: )
Wis-32(i agree with seeing all)
Cha-24(give each bit of the swarm a personality for fun weirdness :smallbiggrin: )

[Helgraf]

Str 20 (- vs corporeal)
Dex 15
Con -
Int 18
Wis 32
Cha 02

[HyramGraff]

Str 20
Dex 20
Con -
Int 14
Wis 28
Cha 6

[Lòkki Gallansbayne]

Might as well post what I think for the other stats while I'm here.

High strength I think. If it was a corporeal construct swarm I could imagine all of the little minibots working in unison to exert huge forces, so logically an incorporeal thing would be able to do the same to other incorporeals.

STR 20.

I also imagine these little guys to be able to rapidly re-arrange themselves into completely arbitary patterns like some sort of intelligent fluid, so high DEX as well.

DEX 28.

I'm going to go with the flow on the wisdom score, I like the idea of these guys being insanely perceptive.

WIS 32.

And no logical justification for the charisma stat, I just want this thing to have an awesome deflection bonus. :D

CHA 24.

That gives 10 base + 9 dodge + 7 deflection + 8 size = 34 naked unbuffed AC. All of which counts against touch attacks. Not too shabby. :smallbiggrin:

[DarkCorax]

Str 20
Dex 15
Int 6 (Hivemind)
Wis 32
Cha 2

[Draken]

People, we must remember that, when stating a swarm, the stats are for the individuals that make it.

So you are making 10.000 nanobots with 20 Str. The Str for a swarm counts only for its cargo capacity, and this incorporeal swarm is not going to find many heavy incorporeal things to lift (unless we give it some habilitie to lift corporeal things, dunno).

And also, Str, doens't affect the swarm attacks, remember that.

[Call Me Siggy]

People, we must remember that, when stating a swarm, the stats are for the individuals that make it.

So you are making 10.000 nanobots with 20 Str. The Str for a swarm counts only for its cargo capacity, and this incorporeal swarm is not going to find many heavy incorporeal things to lift (unless we give it some habilitie to lift corporeal things, dunno).

And also, Str, doens't affect the swarm attacks, remember that.

...And? The monster might be able to lift corporeal things, might not. Either way, the point of this (From what I can see) is to make something unique and interesting, even if weak. It's probably not going to turn out too weak or strong in the end, because we have so many people on this that know a good deal about game balance.

[Draken]

Ok, but i feel sorry for the guy who is going to calculate the cargo capacity.

[Call Me Siggy]

Indeed. >.>

EDIT:Then again, how do we know that this thing will carry a lot of stuff? Considering constructs usually have their weapons built in...

[Draken]

VT made those lil' crabs of At World's End, they could carry a ship.

These fellas can, dunno get a rock (or in the case, a mountain) and trow at the target.

The point is. How? I'm thinking about Eletricty, magnets, kinda, artificial gravity.

[Call Me Siggy]

I guess you'll have to submit a write-up of your own then.

Wait a second...

What if...

This...with levels in Hulking Hurler?

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

Str 15: Not to strong, not too weak
Dex 20
Int 10
Wis 32
Cha 5

[FoeHammer]

Might as well post what I think for the other stats while I'm here.

High strength I think. If it was a corporeal construct swarm I could imagine all of the little minibots working in unison to exert huge forces, so logically an incorporeal thing would be able to do the same to other incorporeals.

STR 20.

I also imagine these little guys to be able to rapidly re-arrange themselves into completely arbitary patterns like some sort of intelligent fluid, so high DEX as well.

DEX 28.

I'm going to go with the flow on the wisdom score, I like the idea of these guys being insanely perceptive.

WIS 32.

And no logical justification for the charisma stat, I just want this thing to have an awesome deflection bonus. :D

CHA 24.

That gives 10 base + 9 dodge + 7 deflection + 8 size = 34 naked unbuffed AC. All of which counts against touch attacks. Not too shabby. :smallbiggrin:

What about Int?:smallconfused:

[Icewalker]

Sometimes constructs are mindless and have no int. Although that can't really be counted as a 0 for averaging or we wouldn't get it...

count for yes/no int, and if yes average I guess. I think that he wasn't voting for it at all though.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Ok, added up the ability votes and posted the results on the first post. Seems we're going to have a strong, smart, highly observant swarm with the personality of gravel.

Up next is speed (and maneuverability if it can fly).

Speed Types

Burrow
Climb
Land
Fly
- Perfect
- Good
- Average
- Poor
- Clumsy

[aaron_the_cow]

Burrow-none
Climb-none
Land-none
Fly-30 80- Perfect
Swim-none

[Lòkki Gallansbayne]

What about Int?:smallconfused: I voted for INT separately earlier in the thread.

I am sad that low CHA won. But... but... the AC bonuses. The AC bonuses... :smallfrown:

Oh well, no use crying over spilt milk. The masses have spoken.

Move 60ft, Fly 60ft (perfect). There's no running away. :smallbiggrin:

I gave it perfect maneuverability as I figure these things can hover, which requires at least good movement, plus there's something so much more sinister about something with almost completely unrestricted movement.

[Poppatomus]

Land 40 ft (8 squares), fly 80ft (clumsy), burrow 40



I figure these things should be swift in keeping with the purposefulness of a construct. Also makes them a bit more fearsome when they can move quickly from place to place. I think the swarm should have flight, if only because a group of flying incorporeal robots seems more natural than 10,000 tiny machines crawling on top of each other. Still, I feel it should be clumsy, reflecting the relative difficulty of keeping the these individual machines together.

As a rules question, can't incorporeal creatures pass through objects at will already? Does that invalidate burrow and swim speeds?

EDIT: After clarification of the burrowing rule. Also, given the complexity of something that is incorporeal and burrows, I agree it would need a special ability to at least explain how it worked. If it has some other mechanism to move underground, I would just remove the burrow speed.

[HyramGraff]

I'm imagining these things as having only wings.
Burrow None
Climb None
Land None
Fly 60ft (Perfect)
Swim None

All movement is treated as flying. As the swarm in incorporeal, it is able to move through objects at will.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Forgot to remove swim.

However, as for burrow...


"An incorporeal creature can enter or pass through solid objects, but must remain adjacent to the object’s exterior, and so cannot pass entirely through an object whose space is larger than its own."

However, not quite sure how they would burrow when they pass right through.

If a large number chooses burrow then we'll have to give it a special ability.


All movement is treated as flying. As the swarm in incorporeal, it is able to move through objects at will
Not necessarily, Spirit Animals only have the movement modes of the normal creatures they resemble. So these might be the same in a fashion.

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

I say it's only movement is perfect flight, with a speed of 60 feet.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

I second Krimm

[thehothead]

I third Krimm

[Icewalker]

Yeah. Fly, 60 ft. Perfect.

I'd add burrow 40 ft on top of that.

[Call Me Siggy]

Fourthing Krimm.

[Fualkner Asiniti]

I...erm... support Krimm.

[Krimm_Blackleaf]

That's right! Dance, my puppets!

[Poppatomus]

That's right! Dance, my puppets!

One day Krimm, one day we'll make our saves.

[HyramGraff]

All movement is treated as flying. As the swarm in incorporeal, it is able to move through objects at will

Not necessarily, Spirit Animals only have the movement modes of the normal creatures they resemble. So these might be the same in a fashion.

Actually, I was voting for that. Sorry that wasn't clear.

[Meynolds]

Fly (Perfect) 80ft (16 squares); Burrow 40ft (8 squares)

[jaqueses]

Fly 80ft (perfect), burrow 40ft.

[Draken]

My vote goes for Fly 60 feet (Perfect)

All other movements are rather pointless, for it is incorporeal, and it isen't a model that -whatever spirit animal does-

[belboz]

Fly 60' (perfect), burrow 60', swim 60'. No land or climb speed.

An incorporeal creature could earth glide like a Xorn.

[Simius]

I think it shouldn't fly. It should roll over the floor on tiny little wheels!

Land speed: 50 ft.

edit: we'll have to watch out that this won't become too much like MM3's Shredstorm. We want to make something unique, right?

[Callix]

It's incorporeal... fly 60ft (perfect) is the only one that makes sense... at least I think so.

[Attilargh]

I vote Krimm.

Darn my poor Will save to Heck.

[Lòkki Gallansbayne]

Bah, I voted for Fly 60ft (perfect) before it was cool. :smalltongue:

[Green Bean]

Fly 60ft (perfect)

C'mon. All the cool kids are doing it. :smallwink:

[Simius]

awww, no tiny incorporeal toy cars? It seems Krimm has allready won. :smallwink:

[Pronounceable]

Fly 60 ft, perfect. It's (almost) official folks.

[Inyssius Tor]

... Fly 60 (perfect), burrow 40.

[FoeHammer]

Fly 60' (perfect), burrow 60', swim 60'. No land or climb speed.

An incorporeal creature could earth glide like a Xorn.

Once again the mighty second rears its head:smallwink:

EDIT: Are we goinmg to submit this to the MitP II project (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38986) once we are done?