[Class] The Marked; Wielders of the Outside.

[Xuldarinar]

(Abandoned)

[Ethereal Gears]

Not much to comment on as yet; mechanically, the few things you have written out look cool. Both beyond morality and beyond definition are neat abilities; I think the latter could come earlier than capstone-level, though. I just wanted to drop by to say I really like the concept of this class and am looking forward to seeing where you take this. The idea of gaining powers to mess up divine casters and outsiders with alignment subtypes (or however you distinguish those outsiders that "serve gods" from those who don't) via the blasphemy mark path is super-awesome. I've always wanted to play an angry anti-theist!

Cheers,
- Gears

[Xuldarinar]

Thank you. As I think of things I'll put them down. I love the concept, hence why it is there, but I wish I had more concrete ideas I can apply. A burst of inspiration that made it infinitely closer to completion.

[Ethereal Gears]

Heh. I'm often the same way when I create classes. I get a really fun or wacky idea ("A fungus mage! Of course!") but then it's easy to get stuck when no clearly conceptualized mechanics pop up. My weirdo shadow class the shadewright actually came out of a purely mechanical idea ("I want someone who can cast shadow conjuration like a summoner casts the summon monster line"), and then I built all the flavor and fluff around that.

Anyway, I believe in this concept, so I hope you get that burst of inspiration. If I come up with anything I think could be helpful, I'll let you know!

Cheers,
- Gears

[Qwertystop]

I've had ideas like that, too - my Sleepwalker, currently a PrC for Invocation-users, started out as a base class that went through a few iterations of not having a clue where to go beyond the basic themes, then trying to go there anyway and ending up with a mess. Don't be afraid to change it to a PrC - I could see it working for Binders, perhaps, or Warlocks, or as something with skill/feat prereqs that doesn't require any particular base class.

It actually seems similar to an idea I had a few hours ago, except mine was even less defined. Was thinking of mannerisms, up popped the narration phrase "toying with an undefined." Sounded interesting, to leave it blank and yet have it right there on their hands.

Another thing that might provide inspiration: A class posted on here a while back called the "Missingno". (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?337909-The-Missingno-(No-really-it-s-serious-PEACH)) Name could use some work, and some of the core mechanics make the class nearly unplayably MAD in my limited attempts to get them no work - not enough actual combat ability, but the abilities they do have scale on Dex and Int, but what they have that could be used in combat pushes them away from fighting at range... Still, some of the specific abilities could be useful for inspiration. It was the sort of thing that I read and really wished could work.

[Aergoth]

This begs to take an aberration inspired path at some point.
Also, mechanically the effects of not having an alignment might do with some explanation.
The easiest way to write the sidebar would simply be that any spell or effect that is dependant on alignment, good or ill cannot have an alignment based effect on one of the Marked.
eg: for the purposes of the spell Holy Word, the Marked is either treated as good or having more HD than the caster.

[Xuldarinar]

Added: descriptions to Beyond Morality and Beyond Definition that specify what it means to lack an alignment or a creature type.


Deciding on frequency of abilities that draw from the paths. 1/level, 1/2 levels, or 1/3 levels.
Resource is set, so abilities will generally draw a point or two to use. Level - Wisdom modifier.
Abilities are, entirely up in the air though the general concept for a few paths is there.

[inuyasha]

Hey man, I'm excited to see this class get some more stuff added to it! One concern I have with it as it stands though is how does beyond definition affect racial hit dice

Also I think that the saves should be fortitude and will because the body and mind are sort of beyond mortal definition, the toxins and diseases of mortal men shouldn't be a problem to someone like the Marked, and will because their minds are already sort of altered through their source of power, and it's hard to fix them or alter them more.

[Xuldarinar]

Hey man, I'm excited to see this class get some more stuff added to it! One concern I have with it as it stands though is how does beyond definition affect racial hit dice

Also I think that the saves should be fortitude and will because the body and mind are sort of beyond mortal definition, the toxins and diseases of mortal men shouldn't be a problem to someone like the Marked, and will because their minds are already sort of altered through their source of power, and it's hard to fix them or alter them more.


Beyond definition will need to be elaborated on later on, at least what it means to remove creature type from one's character sheet. I'd like to be a bit further into the development of the class though before I grow concerned with that aspect.
I've taken your advice for saves, and a good Will save will make up for the Unusual focus for ability scores, given the Less Wisdom the better.


Edit: Im throwing away this class. Not the concept, oh no.. i've a more elegant approach in mind. But I am throwing this class away.