Finer Points of Battlemastery (part 2)

[HidesHisEyes]

So I recently made a thread with a similar name about a very specific rules question concerning battlemasters. Now I'd like to ask a much broader question:

What general advice, strategies, tactics, tricks and tips do you have for someone playing a battlemaster fighter? What do you think are the best maneuvers? Which ones do you think should be avoided? How do you use the ones you pick to best effect?

I have seen a few similar threads and some decent guides but I'd like to know what the giantitp folk have to offer.

It's occurred to me that if you have Sentinel you should really only ever use Trip Attack with an opportunity attack. They can't get up on the same turn because of Sentinel and they are guaranteed to be prone for a full round, so this tactic maximises the amount of time you and your friends can spend kicking the crap out of them with advantage.

[Goodberry]

First of all, Love the name. Morrowind is my favourite game of all time.

As to your question, I personally love Disarming Attack. It can force the enemy to drop any item, not just a weapon. Our group has used it to make bad guys drop weapons, magic items, potions(with a readied action), and even to make a Roper drop one of our party members(is a PC an item? I don't know, but our DM allowed it).

Aside from that, Goading Attack can be really good if the PC is out of reach, or if approaching him would put the enemy in harm's way. Commander's Strike can allow a Rogue to get a second Sneak Attack on a turn, which is very nice. And Precision Attack is just a nice thing to have in your back pocket for when a miss would completely screw your plan.

Also, if you're planning on taking any levels in Rogue, Feinting Attack is a must for when you can't get Sneak Attack any other way.

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

Trip Attack and Menacing Attack are, in general, quite good. Trip gets better if you have other melee buddies, and Menacing is more "tanky," especially if you have squishies behind you.

Just like a Paladin, you might want to keep some juice in reserve in case you crit. It's not as great as a smite crit, but rolling something like 4d10+mods can feel pretty good.

Polearm Master + Sentinel + Trip: First, you get the standard PM+Sentinel bennies: You OA someone who tries to enter or leave your reach, and reduce their movement to 0. With BM, you can make them fall over, and they have no movement to get back up. On your turn, you walk over and enjoy your free advantage as you clobber the poor schmuck. Push works well here too, if you can push them into a bad area.

For when you don't have the available ASIs for Sentinel, Polearm Master + Menacing Attack does the trick pretty well, as a creature frightened of you can't approach you.

Disarming Strike works at its best if you or someone else can pick up the dropped item before the enemy gets to go. Coordinate with teammates for best effect. This works especially well for plot-related items.

A lot of people like Commander's Strike, but it is only good if two conditions hold:
1. You have someone else in the group whose single attack is superior to your single attack.
2. You have no better use for your bonus action and superiority die.
So if by some miracle you don't have a bonus action attack and you have a particularly brave melee rogue fighting alongside you (perhaps you have Sentinel), Commander's Strike is good. Otherwise, I wouldn't take it.

Definitely take: Menacing, Trip
Solid: Riposte, Precise, Pushing, Distracting
Situational: Disarming, Maneuvering, Evasive Footwork
Too Situational: Sweeping, Goading, Feinting, Lunging, Commander's, Rally, Parry

[Vogonjeltz]

So I recently made a thread with a similar name about a very specific rules question concerning battlemasters. Now I'd like to ask a much broader question:

What general advice, strategies, tactics, tricks and tips do you have for someone playing a battlemaster fighter? What do you think are the best maneuvers? Which ones do you think should be avoided? How do you use the ones you pick to best effect?

I have seen a few similar threads and some decent guides but I'd like to know what the giantitp folk have to offer.

It's occurred to me that if you have Sentinel you should really only ever use Trip Attack with an opportunity attack. They can't get up on the same turn because of Sentinel and they are guaranteed to be prone for a full round, so this tactic maximises the amount of time you and your friends can spend kicking the crap out of them with advantage.

First off, I would advise you that every maneuver has potential to be very good given the correct circumstances, but not every maneuver is ideal for every Battlemaster. It really depends on what your anticipated playstyle will be, what weapons you plan on using, and who your allies are.

In general, I selected maneuvers based on: The benefit provided, the saving throw they required, the action they require, and how they proc.

So, in my case, with the Martial Adept feat I picked Menacing Attack (Wisdom save), Disarming (Strength save, minimizes the threat of an opportunity attack), Trip (str save and provides advantage for allies/further attacks), Parry (reaction if they hit), and Riposte (reaction if they miss).

Situationally, Menacing Attack is good for keeping enemies distant or away from allies (use it on ranged attacks), Disarming in tandem with the free interact with an object to kick the weapon behind me or off a ledge, and Parry/Riposte are great both for what they do and because I always have an option (hit or miss) when an enemy attacks me.


A lot of people like Commander's Strike, but it is only good if two conditions hold:
1. You have someone else in the group whose single attack is superior to your single attack.
2. You have no better use for your bonus action and superiority die.
So if by some miracle you don't have a bonus action attack and you have a particularly brave melee rogue fighting alongside you (perhaps you have Sentinel), Commander's Strike is good. Otherwise, I wouldn't take it.

I'd add to this any situation where you need to deal damage to an enemy but it's out of the question that you can reach them yourself. For example, if you were restrained by a net, you might order another player (who doesn't have disadvantage on their attack) to cut the netting.

There is of course also the rare situation where a Champion who can crit more often will have a greater opportunity to double the superiority damage dice.

[Citan]

Hi OP, Hi all!
First, I'd like to stress this part of the previous post:
First off, I would advise you that every maneuver has potential to be very good given the correct circumstances, but not every maneuver is ideal for every Battlemaster. It really depends on what your anticipated playstyle will be, what weapons you plan on using, and who your allies are.
Seems like the best recommendation ever. :)
To follow in this state of mind, I'll give you just a few examples of where this or that Manoeuver is good.

a) I play a front-liner with a Rogue or Paladin. >> Commander's Strike to give him a chance to deal burst damage (Rogue can still use the SA even if he landed it before, because this is another turn).

b) I play a ranged warrior or a sturdy tank: Goading Attack is nice to protect allies by drawing fire on me (especially good on ranged attacks).

c) For whatever reason (running away, rushing it to save an ally), I have to go through a band of enemies, inevitably provoking OA that may have a chance to hit me. >> Evasive Footwork can give me a fair chance to avoid damage (although this one is more situational than others, since depend on usual chance to hit of enemies and what you roll. Would be much better with a minima of 2-3 but well...).

d) I want to hit an enemy but know that closing into its reach would be dangerous > Lunging Strike is here (best on a multiclass build with burst damage such as Paladin or Rogue though, otherwise it's too situational -or it means you burn several dice on one Attack-).

Basically, nearly any Manoeuver can be a solid choice depending on your playstyle. The only one I find really "meh" in any case is the Sweeping attack, because the damage dealt to the second creature feels miserable: decent for lvl3 BM, ridiculous from lvl 5 onwards... As a DM, I could houserule some way of scaling damage similarly to cantrip is a player was interested.

If you have no precise idea, I'd suggest you to take one Manoeuver of each category: offense (increase your chance to hit or effect), defense (mobility, evasion, defense), utility (push/prone/move/disarm) and the 4th as you like.
When in doubt, Precision Attack and Riposte are usually good choices.