Is there a deity for good-aligned monsters and redeemed ex-bad guys?

[Dr TPK]

To be honest, there are A LOT of deities in D&D... I'm not the greatest of experts in that field, so let me be lazy and ask you:
Do you happen to know any deities in any campaign world that is a patron of good-aligned monsters (regardless of their race!) or redeemed people and creatures? I know that the Drow, for instance, have this sort of deity, but I'd like it to be for all monsters.

Like for instance a Lawful Good Ogre Mage and a Neutral Good Satyr would get together and think of a deity that would represent them the best. What would be the conclusion, without being campaign specific?

[Bronk]

There's Lurue from the Forgotten Realms: Good demigod unicorn with a portfolio of intelligent, nonhumanoid creatures and talking beasts.

[Dr TPK]

There's Lurue from the Forgotten Realms: Good demigod unicorn with a portfolio of intelligent, nonhumanoid creatures and talking beasts.

Thank you! Any more?

[zimmerwald1915]

Thank you! Any more?
Supposedly this is Sarenrae's schtick in Pathfinder. It tends not to work out that way much in practice though.

[Andezzar]

I don't think there is any specific deity for redeemed "bad guys" but many good deities would allow such followers. The greater the deity's influence and power is, the more likely it will be to accept followers of many races including monstrous ones IMHO.

[Pex]

I don't know of any deities that are specifically for this idea, but I can think of a few that would be appropriate for the worshippers and sponsor their cause to take up the portfolio.

Bahamut
Ilmater
Osiris
Palladine

[Andezzar]

Yeah those, and I don't think even St. Cuthbert/Helm and similar deities would spurn sincerely repentant characters that now use their powers for justice. Once you are no longer limited to a deity for redeemed monsters, a lot of option open.

What is your goal, Rai_skari? Why do you want several good aligned "monsters" to worship the same deity?

[Dr TPK]

Yeah those, and I don't think even St. Cuthbert/Helm and similar deities would spurn sincerely repentant characters that now use their powers for justice. Once you are no longer limited to a deity for redeemed monsters, a lot of option open.

What is your goal, Rai_skari? Why do you want several good aligned "monsters" to worship the same deity?

Having a deity specifically for good-aligned monsters would make it easier for my players to make monster PCs.

[Andezzar]

How so? No character needs to be religious, much less monsters. If you want such characters in your group just let the idea drop that even an alignment entry of always evil does not mean that all members of that species are evil. Statistically insignificant numbers of non-evil members do exist as per the rules. Having a deity specifically for good aligned monsters may seem more like a restriction than an encouragement.

Another way to introduce such characters is to have them as NPCs.

[Bronk]

Having a deity specifically for good-aligned monsters would make it easier for my players to make monster PCs.

Is this one less thing for them to squabble over, or would this be what brings them together?

[Dr TPK]

How so? No character needs to be religious, much less monsters. If you want such characters in your group just let the idea drop that even an alignment entry of always evil does not mean that all members of that species are evil. Statistically insignificant numbers of non-evil members do exist as per the rules. Having a deity specifically for good aligned monsters may seem more like a restriction than an encouragement.

Another way to introduce such characters is to have them as NPCs.

The situation is pretty bad at the moment: I've made the campaign world intolerant to monster races and the players don't want to play them. I can only improve the situation, really.


Is this one less thing for them to squabble over, or would this be what brings them together?

I didn't understand, sorry. PCs don't squabble over anything. It's just that the idea of having monster PCs has been dead for a long time.

[Gnaeus]

That sounds a lot like Eilistraee. She mostly does redeemed drow, but redemption and harmony between races that are normally hostile is kind of her bag.

[SangoProduction]

Simple solution: make your campaigns more friendly towards monstrous races.

Hell, in my 4e campaign, the players own a guild in a large trade center town which serves all species who can pay and follow the rules.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Rai_skari
Do you happen to know any deities in any campaign world that is a patron of good-aligned monsters (regardless of their race!) or redeemed people and creatures?

As mentioned, Lurue and Sarenrae would both be excellent candidates. Sarenrae is specifically the deity of redemption and forgiveness, bringing the evil to recognition of their wrongs and offering a path of renewal.

Lurue is less concerned with forgiveness per se, but she is the patroness of intelligent nonhumanoids and given to helping those in need. A Neutral Good satyr would automatically fall under her protection, being a nonhumanoid and a forest creature to boot; and the Lawful Good ogre mage would likely be tolerated, if not entirely embraced, though mainly because Lurue is Chaotic Good and her followers, in many cases, are well-meaning flakes.

Of the two, Sarenrae seems a closer match, since she's so closely tied to redemption, and there's nothing in her dogma that limits her forgiveness to humanoids alone.

[Bronk]

I didn't understand, sorry. PCs don't squabble over anything. It's just that the idea of having monster PCs has been dead for a long time.

Sorry, I meant in character, story wise, this might be what brings them together as a party.

[AngelOfFaith]

Lurue is also referred to as Valarian in the Book of Exalted Deeds. There is a small description on page 26. There is even a neat prestige class associated with him in that book - they ride unicorns and all. I wonder how odd it would be to play as a unicorn mount for a NPC... or for a PC I guess.

[atemu1234]

I don't know of any deities that are specifically for this idea, but I can think of a few that would be appropriate for the worshippers and sponsor their cause to take up the portfolio.

Bahamut
Ilmater
Osiris
Palladine

What would happen if a red dragon redeemed himself and started worshipping Bahamut?

[rmnimoc]

What would happen if a red dragon redeemed himself and started worshipping Bahamut?

Bahamut would cover him in glitter and insist that he was secretly a metallic dragon all along.

[Jowgen]

What would happen if a red dragon redeemed himself and started worshipping Bahamut?

It is questionable whether chromatic dragons can be redeemed. BoVD says they can't becuase they're creatures of "consummate, irredeemable evil". BoED says there they "might not be entirely beyond salvation, but there is truly only the barest glimmer of hope". I personally hold that only things with the Evil subtype are truly irredeemable (until that subtype is somehow removed, that is).

[Andezzar]

I personally hold that only things with the Evil subtype are truly irredeemable (until that subtype is somehow removed, that is).And Eludecia (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fc/20050824a) proves that this isn't true by RAW.

[Bronk]

It is questionable whether chromatic dragons can be redeemed. BoVD says they can't becuase they're creatures of "consummate, irredeemable evil". BoED says there they "might not be entirely beyond salvation, but there is truly only the barest glimmer of hope". I personally hold that only things with the Evil subtype are truly irredeemable (until that subtype is somehow removed, that is).

There are a few places where this comes up in the rules. One is in MM2, where it says that the crystal dragons will sometimes bring up white dragons to be less evil (I forget the exact wording). Another is in the Forgotten Realms backstory, where the elves of Myth Drannor brought up a non-evil red dragon named Garnet. Eventually it flew over the city and fulfilled the exit conditions for some powerful trapped evil outsiders, which was that a chromatic dragon who 'never knew malice' would fly overhead. (It seems like a bit of an oversight not to warn people of that...)

[Pex]

Bahamut would cover him in glitter and insist that he was secretly a metallic dragon all along.

That would be a lie, something Bahamut would not could not do. Bahamut could transform the red dragon into gold, if only to protect it from Tiamat's wrath because she would be p***ed off. However, it is also proper not to so that the world knows it's possible an evil dragon can be redeemed and not show fear against Tiamat. Its fear aura would be transformed into a calm aura, like a paladin.

[Inevitability]

I personally hold that only things with the Evil subtype are truly irredeemable (until that subtype is somehow removed, that is).

Succubi with unlikely class choices aside, wouldn't it be weird if Evil [Good] Outsiders were a thing but Good [Evil] Outsiders weren't? In my opinion, nothing is truly irredeemable/incorruptible, no matter how Evil or Good it is.

[Taveena]

Succubi with unlikely class choices aside, wouldn't it be weird if Evil [Good] Outsiders were a thing but Good [Evil] Outsiders weren't? In my opinion, nothing is truly irredeemable/incorruptible, no matter how Evil or Good it is.

It's not just an opinion. Even outside Eludecia, we've got Falls-From-Grace as a LN Succubus, almost just as far removed as Eludecia is.

Always Evil means 'always BORN evil'. Everyone has the potential for redemption - see page 305 of the Monster Manual. Beholders are Always Evil because they were born with the racial memories of hatred and cruelty. Succubi are Always Evil because they are literally formed from Cosmic Evil.

But both are free-willed, and - while it's unlikely, because their natural environments harshly punish Good acts - they can become Good. NOTHING is literally Always Evil. Only mindless to int 2 creatures are incapable of alignment change, and they cannot have alignment as such (Zombies and Skeletons being in direct contradiction of the rules of alignment.) Creatures with alignment subtypes are the exception to this, but the MOMENT you hit int 3 and get that cosmic ability to discern right from wrong, you can redeem yourself. Or fall.