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BulletMagnet
2015-10-09, 09:42 PM
Hey guys,

Working with my DM to create a trickster bard archetype. I welcome your thoughts on the following:

College of Deception

Level 3 - Subtle Magic
You gain proficiency with Sleight of Hand and Deception. When you cast a spell, you may make a Sleight of Hand Check to ignore the somantic component of the spell. Additionally, you may make a deception check to hide the verbal component of the spell so it doesn't draw attention, or break stealth. The DC for these checks is 8 + 2x spell level. You may attempt both checks on a single spell.

Level 3 - Cunning Maneuvers
You know how to wreak chaos on a battlefield through cunning maneuvers. When you finish a long rest, You may select two cunning maneuvers, increasing to three at level 7 and four at level 15.You must qualify for any prerequisites, such as bard level. These maneuvers use 8+Proficiency Bonus + Charisma modifier as your DC.

Allied Distraction - Use an action on your turn to allow an ally within 5ft of a target to attack, adding bardic inspiration die to ally's attack roll. If the ally attacks, you incur no attacks of opportunity from the target during this turn.
Opportunistic Escape - When an ally makes an attack against an enemy within 5 ft of you, you may use your reaction to expend bardic die and add the result to your ally's attack. If the attack hits, you may move up to half-movement speed without incurring attacks of opportunity from the target
Come Get Some! - When you hit with a weapon attack, expend bardic inspiration to force the target to take a wisdom save vs your Cunning Maneuvers DC with a penalty to their saving throw equal to half the die roll (rounded up). On a failed save, the target must take a reaction to move up to half its movement speed taking the most direct path possible towards you, this movement provokes opportunity attacks as normal.
It Wasn't Me! - When you hit with a weapon attack, expend a bardic inspiration to force target to take a wisdom save with a penalty to their saving throw equal to half the die roll (rounded up). On a failed save, select another creature within 30 ft of you, any attack rolls the target makes that do not include the selected creature are made at a disadvantage.
Additional Distraction - When an enemy that you can see is hit by an attack, you use your reaction and spend a bardic die and subtract the result from the target's concentration check
Where Did He Go? (lvl 6)- When a target you can see is hit with an attack, use a reaction subtract bardic inspiration die from target's Perception until end of your next turn and attempt to hide
Can't Catch Me!!! (Lvl 6) - When you hit with a weapon attack, you may expend a bardic inspiration to half the movement of the target and add the reduced amount to the maximum movement of you and your allies until the end of your next turn. You may affect a number of allies up to the result of your roll.
Which one is he? (lvl 14) - When you or an ally is targeted by an attack, you may use your reaction to create two illusory duplicates of the target that last the number of rounds rolled on the die, or until destroyed. Treat these duplicates as per the Mirror Image spell.
Is that Real? (lvl 14) - As a bonus action you may expend one bardic inspiration die and turn one illusory object in a spell, cast by you or someone else, into reality for a number of rounds rolled on the die.


Level 6 - Underhanded Tactics
You gain the sneak attack ability of a rogue equal to half your bard level.

Level 14 - Insidious Ambush
You may remain hidden/invisible after casting illusion, or enchantment spells. While you are hidden from the target(s) of your illusion and enchantment spells, the target(s) has disadvantage on the first saving throw.

Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll
2015-10-10, 09:38 AM
Mmm, this is inspiring me to make up my own Bard College of Espionage, geared towards Bards-As-Spies, partially inspired by Lelianna of Dragon Age fame. I'm not sure if Cunning Maneuvers works for the strict Bards-As-Spies work...

I would, by the way, change the wording of Cunning Maneuvers. "After a long rest, you may select two Cunning Maneuvers, increasing to three at level 7 and to 4 at level 15."

BulletMagnet
2015-10-10, 10:59 AM
Thanks for the suggestion, I will make the change.

BulletMagnet
2015-10-10, 11:03 AM
Mmm, this is inspiring me to make up my own Bard College of Espionage, geared towards Bards-As-Spies, partially inspired by Lelianna of Dragon Age fame. I'm not sure if Cunning Maneuvers works for the strict Bards-As-Spies work...

I would, by the way, change the wording of Cunning Maneuvers. "After a long rest, you may select two Cunning Maneuvers, increasing to three at level 7 and to 4 at level 15."

As for the college of espionage, Id like to see it if you do make one. Would it be more skill oriented, around disguise and info gathering?

Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll
2015-10-12, 07:50 PM
I had another thought looking over this again; what if the bard had already taken Sleight of Hand and Deception at 1st level? Then they miss out on some bonuses from this class, making it less worth it. This penalizes people who wanted to have a sneaky bard right from the start and not wait until 3rd level.

BulletMagnet
2015-10-12, 10:23 PM
Hrmm, good point. What if we said if you have the skill already, you can choose one from the rogue list?


Also, I was trying to come up with a cool maneuver that makes use of sneak attack but for the party. What if there is a level 6 maneuver like tag team. Where you can expend a bardic inspiration after hitting a target to give the next attack to do bonus damage equal to your sneak attack + bardic die value rolled?

PotatoGolem
2015-10-13, 07:35 PM
The PHB handles redundant proficiency already: you just pick a new skill to be proficient in.

I don't really like giving them sneak attack. It's the rogue's main damage feature, and 5e has thus far shied away from 3.5-ish giving a class another class' features.

BulletMagnet
2015-10-13, 10:52 PM
The PHB handles redundant proficiency already: you just pick a new skill to be proficient in.

I don't really like giving them sneak attack. It's the rogue's main damage feature, and 5e has thus far shied away from 3.5-ish giving a class another class' features.

Well The level 6 ability for other bards gives more combat aggressiveness, either extra attack or possibly aggressive spells. I want this to have more of a rogue feel, so I thought a slower progression would be good. Another option is to just give him more damage in a little different of a way. How about this: whenever you use a cunning maneuver against a target, or attack a target that is within 5 ft of an ally, you do additional damage equal to your bardic die. Unlike sneak attack, you wont limit it to once a turn, but you do much less damage per hit. My only concern is that it doesnt scale nearly as well as extra attack. Or you could make it more flexible and have the added damage apply to spell rolls as well?